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AW: Looping (what else!) questions..Human Prepared Piano!

Hi Alex,
using two identical mics will not minimize what I here called crosstalk (yes, I was referring to pickup of the sound from the P.A.).
The way PZMs work is they do not pickup the sound that is "in the air", rather they pick up the sound incident on an interface between two media. Putting them on the lid will also make them pick up much of the sound coming from the P.A. (but as Andy already pointed out, with non-rock-music playback levels, this may not be that much of a problem), while putting them onto the soundboard will reduce that effect. And most of the PZMs available are omnis (or rather half-omnis), meaning the reproduction of very low frequencies is better most of the time (which may not be an issue, simply because I doubt that a typical P.A. will reproduce 20 or even 40 Hz properly).
Btw, I have been using SM57s once one a grand piano, which will give a very "rock piano"-ish sound. Perhaps you should simpy try the microphones you have in different configurations on the baby grands (performing your material) and see how you like it.

Von: nymnut123@gmail.com [mailto:nymnut123@gmail.com] Im Auftrag von Alex Graham
Gesendet: Donnerstag, 21. Februar 2008 17:01
An: Loopers-Delight@loopers-delight.com
Betreff: Re: Looping (what else!) questions..Human Prepared Piano!

Hey all, thanks for the responses, much appreciated :)


With using the two identical mics, how does that minimize crosstalk? (Which I assume is referring to the pickup of the sound that is playing back?)
As for picking up the fundamentals, I guess I'll just have to try different things and see how they sound..

The PZMs- do you mean literally ON the soundboard under the strings? The only reference I can find on the web to using PZMs is placing one or two on the open lid (which makes sense and seems like it might work.) I'm not sure if anyone I know has some, but I can try.

Andy- 100-200 in US dollars, sorry! And yes I wouldn't need to amplify the actual playing, just the recorded loops...so I will certainly try placing the condenser in a few spots...the only problem is I can't have access to the full grand until the performance!! Maybe once...but I can play around on the baby grands in the practice rooms.


On Thu, Feb 21, 2008 at 5:33 AM, Rainer Thelonius Balthasar Straschill <rs@moinlabs.de> wrote:
Hi Alex,
whow, you got yourself into a challenging situation here...
Concert grands have a range which produces fundamentals from 16-something up  to more than 4000 Hz. So generally, these low frequencies will be a problem for your P.A., your microphone and possibly your audio interface as well. So I sure hope your composition can live without the fundamentals of the lower one and a half octaves being properly reproduced...
Any microphony which is meant to minimize crosstalk from the P.A. will consist of (at least) two (identical) microphones. The general approaches I'm aware of which also have good properties regarding minimized crosstalk include:
         * two microphones below the soundboard (one on the left, one on the right)
         * two microphones above the soundboard.

In direct comparison, the "below" approach tends to have a more "round" sound. The huge disadvantage for your application is that you loose any detail of percussive effects happening inside the piano (e.g. the transients of somebody plucking a string or something), and I believe that these are an important part of your composition.
With the mics from above, a problem in your case is that they might get in the way of the performer when she's playing inside the piano.
Generally, I wouldn't see a good way to do this with the microphones at your disposal. Do you see a chance that you could borrow a pair of half-omni PZMs to be placed on top of the piano's soundboard? With that, you don't have the problem that they get in the way of the performer too much, pickup of sound from the P.A. is minimized, and as they are (half-)omnis, low-end reproduction is usually far better compared to cardioids and the like.
I hope you will be recording the performance (another tricky part...)

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Betreff: Looping (what else!) questions..Human Prepared Piano!
Gesendet: Do, 21. Feb 2008
Von: Alex Graham

Hey all-

I'm currently working on a piece that I hope to have performed at a student composition concert at my University-

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