From ???@??? Sun Feb 01 21:57:23 1998 >From kflint Sun Feb 1 00:09:32 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xyuT3-0000Gr-00; Sun, 1 Feb 1998 00:09:29 -0800 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sun, 1 Feb 1998 03:06:37 -0500 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: David Myers Subject: Back in the Saddle Again Resent-Message-ID: <"bAV0gD.A.QC.s0C10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2638 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sun, 1 Feb 1998 00:09:29 -0800 X-UIDL: cef709ec85dc3d7c527ddfdb459c9ab0 Cripes, annihilist wouldn't let me in since Dec. 13th; my ISP just figured out how to fix the problem, whatever it was. Anyway, hope no one will mind my playing catchup a bit, posting about some older stuff, etc. What was really curious is that the day I was cut off was when I posted the following: ------------------------------------------ Robert at the Bottom Line Saturday night; saw the early show. I don't think even the people at TC Electronic or Eventide would have been pleased--this is all that can be done with 20 grand worth of gear? I kept wanting to shout, "OK, Bob, now HIT IT!". (Wouldn't have been out of place: LOTS of people were shouting.) It was like he was waiting for the right moment to break loose, but never did and never intended to--or didn't know how. I well realize that when you make a goof in a looping situation you are in deep trouble, but his timidity was appalling; 5 minutes of what we heard would have been impressive, but he more or less just let it limp along for two hours. I love everything Crimson has done, and the "Let The Power Fall"-type Frippertronics are kind of minimalist masterpieces, but listen to what somebody like Paul Dresher did on "Liquid and Stellar Music" many years ago and you begin to see that Fripp really doesn't have much to offer. Nor do I sense that he is even aware of Dresher, Terry Riley, etc.--or perhaps any work outside rock or the rock fringe. It seems that he believes he's doing something unprecedented. What he's doing that IS different is presenting a rather inept sort of ambient music to crowds which are largely unfamiliar with even Eno's "Discreet Music" (which this show was uncannily reminicent of), and pissing them off. I think 90% of this crowd expected "Red", and if I were one of them I'd be screaming, too. But I think this is part of what Robert wants to do: mess with people. He will call it "inviting them to expand their horizons" or some such thing, but it seems to me that it's mostly just self-indulgence. Yeah, the inevitable flashbulb went off--and so did Bob. He returned, but without the promised "Q & A" period afterward. I would have asked, "can we go now?". A technical speculation. Since all Fripp's sounds are synthesized (on this occasion he played two short phrases which just MIGHT have been actual guitar sounds), couldn't one forego the pricy TC audio looping and just feed MIDI info from the guitar into a looping sequencer? Then even more radical sound alterations would of course be possible (not to mention structural gymnastics), though the gee-whiz factor involved with a 6-foot-high rack of gear would be lost.... -------------------------------------------- BTW, I wanted to put in my .02 regarding a desert island looper's list: 1) Paul Dresher "Liquid and Stellar Music" 2) Terry Riley "A Rainbow in Curved Air" or "Descending Moonshine Dervishes" 3) Robert's "Let The Power Fall" or "Evening Star" w/ Eno 4) David Torn "Tripping Over God" (anyone have a copy of "What Means Solid" they'd like to sell?) 5) I agree that Sylvian's "Gone to Earth" is full of great looping-mostly Robert's doing, I think.... Also, I must say that you guys who can tolerate "Door X" must have a screw loose. What the hell was David thinking? Did you ever hear the albums on which even Herbie Hancock decided to sing? Please! -------------------------------------------- More BTW: I just ordered more RAM to max out my Echoplex and discovered an interesting phenomenon. Several of the memory companies asked me, "what is it for?", and in one case I told them. They said, we sell so-and-so for samplers and music equipment--bottom line, the very same 30-pin SIMMs as for a Mac SE30, etc., but a jacked-up price. Reason? I dunno--maybe they've had music people return RAM more often? Anyway, if you get this question concerning 30 pin SIMMs, just tell 'em it's for a Mac Classic or something. A place called Mohawk Memory sold me 4 meg SIMMs for $14 each. -David Myers From ???@??? Sun Feb 01 21:57:54 1998 >From kflint Sun Feb 1 04:54:34 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xyyuu-0006DT-00; Sun, 1 Feb 1998 04:54:32 -0800 Date: Sun, 1 Feb 1998 07:50:44 -0500 From: Michael Peters Subject: new Markus Reuter CD Sender: Michael Peters To: "'INTERNET:Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com'" Message-ID: <199802010751_MC2-3172-865B@compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Disposition: inline Resent-Message-ID: <"QX6CBB.A.opF.HAH10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2639 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sun, 1 Feb 1998 04:54:32 -0800 X-UIDL: 4354a8b50975926a405dab9657892c34 If you enjoy listening to ambient music in the tradition of Eno, Sylvian, or Fripp, you will love Markus Reuter's first solo CD 'Taster'. (Markus is one of the few masters and teachers of the 8-string Warr Guitar. He is also known for his complex compositions and virtuoso playing with the Europa String Choir.) 'Taster' contains seven long ambient pieces recorded at a live concert. Markus played his Warr Guitar, using a guitar synthesizer and two unsynchronized loop delays for a technique he calls 'orchestral soundscaping'. The result is a collection of utterly fascinating atmospheres - crystal-clear minimalism, vast, slow spaces, completely void of new-age pathos, but nonetheless extremely evocative and full of this rare thing that is so difficult to achieve or describe - magic. Check out Markus' homepage at http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/mpeters/markus.htm -Michael Peters From ???@??? Sun Feb 01 21:57:55 1998 >From kflint Sun Feb 1 07:11:54 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xz13o-0006d1-00; Sun, 1 Feb 1998 07:11:52 -0800 Message-Id: <98Feb1.100726est.18818@thicket.arbortext.com> Date: Sun, 1 Feb 1998 10:04:16 -0500 From: David White Reply-To: dwhite@arbortext.com Organization: Arbortext Inc. X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (WinNT; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Another NAMM Report References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"1w1xKC.A.wBG.1AJ10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2640 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sun, 1 Feb 1998 07:11:52 -0800 X-UIDL: ecf8e16c1eee2c8e4a476809156f34d8 Dpcoffin@aol.com wrote: > [snip] > > The New E-Bow has an octave-up switch... > What? E-Bows set up a magnetic field which excites the string. It's the string length and taughtness that controls the pitch not the magnetic field. Or am I missing something? dAve From ???@??? Sun Feb 01 21:57:56 1998 >From kflint Sun Feb 1 08:31:30 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xz2Iq-0002sh-00; Sun, 1 Feb 1998 08:31:28 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: SIMMs for Plex Message-ID: <19980201.112658.4951.0.DOINA@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 1.38 X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 0-8 From: doina@juno.com (paparuda o o) Date: Sun, 01 Feb 1998 11:28:19 EST Resent-Message-ID: <"_PUnAC.A.OZC.zKK10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2641 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sun, 1 Feb 1998 08:31:28 -0800 X-UIDL: c8f16162e87c4bb3dc4a9f42f2887d63 David Myers wrote: << ...A place called Mohawk Memory sold me 4 meg SIMMs for $14 each.>> Where is "Mohawk Memory"? thanks !, Paparuda _____________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] From ???@??? Sun Feb 01 21:58:00 1998 >From kflint Sun Feb 1 09:01:39 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xz2m1-0004fk-00; Sun, 1 Feb 1998 09:01:37 -0800 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <19980201.112658.4951.0.DOINA@juno.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sun, 1 Feb 1998 11:58:32 -0500 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: David Myers Subject: Re: SIMMs for Plex Resent-Message-ID: <"56IqrC.A.PKE.YnK10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2642 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sun, 1 Feb 1998 09:01:37 -0800 X-UIDL: 4bbf8d9ed40fece473afb61eeeda30fd >David Myers wrote: ><< ...A place called Mohawk Memory sold me 4 meg >SIMMs for $14 each.>> > > >Where is "Mohawk Memory"? >thanks !, Paparuda > >_____________________________________________________________________ >You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. >Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com >Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] www.mohawkmem.com or 1 (800) 986-6429. David From ???@??? Sun Feb 01 21:58:02 1998 >From kflint Sun Feb 1 11:04:01 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xz4gR-0004bD-00; Sun, 1 Feb 1998 11:03:59 -0800 From: Dpcoffin@aol.com Message-ID: <1503899.34d4c664@aol.com> Date: Sun, 1 Feb 1998 14:00:49 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Re: Another NAMM Report Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 84 Resent-Message-ID: <"L_2a0.A.fBE.uZM10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2643 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sun, 1 Feb 1998 11:03:59 -0800 X-UIDL: 51137c29622c40a82377747fdf8f0f15 In a message dated 2/1/98 10:11:10 AM, dAve wrote: >> The New E-Bow has an octave-up switch... >> > >What? E-Bows set up a magnetic field which excites the string. It's the string >length and taughtness that controls the pitch not the magnetic field. Or am I >missing something? Well, I guess you're missing a copy of Heet Sound's "Next Generation EBow" flyer and the riveting experience of hearing the new EBow in person....and, OK, they call it "a gruesome harmonic position just a switch away," but essentially it's an octave-up switch. You can take it up with them at 213-687-9946 and hear a demo at 213-625-3269. dpc From ???@??? Sun Feb 01 21:58:03 1998 >From kflint Sun Feb 1 12:20:45 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xz5sf-0001WC-00; Sun, 1 Feb 1998 12:20:41 -0800 Message-ID: <34D4D843.737C@isrv.com> Date: Sun, 01 Feb 1998 15:17:07 -0500 From: Glenn Greenway X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Introduction and question Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"Jeu7wD.A.HGB.ghN10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2644 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sun, 1 Feb 1998 12:20:41 -0800 X-UIDL: 592ada617e91476009704a3847cfc9c2 Hello Everyone: I happened on to this list via a jamman link and am so happy to have found you. I thought I was a lone loopist in the wilderness but am pleased to have discoved otherwise. I play guitar and started looping with an old Digitech digital delay stompbox using it as a pumped up metronome. Later I got a Jamman and began to discover the real world of looping. Now I'm just about to take the Jamman out and begin gigging solo, setting up loops and guitaring ontop. However, I've got a question and this seems like the perfect place to ask: I don't know what kinda of mixer to buy. Right now I've got just the Jamman but would like to add another looper and a multieffects unit in the near future. However I'm really having a hard time understanding what I need in terms of signal routing. I think I need at least three prefader effect sends; Can auxillary sends be used for this? What the heck is a four bus mixer anyway? Or Alt 3/4? I guess I'm pretty technically challenged but really have to figure this out. Does anyone care to make a recomendation? I'll be plugging a microphone and a couple of guitar signals into the front. It's got to be small, inexpensive, and suitable for gigging. Thanks for taking the time to read this overlong query and for any advice anyone may offer. Nice meeting everyone. I'll be around. GLenn Greenway From ???@??? Sun Feb 01 21:58:08 1998 >From kflint Sun Feb 1 13:06:43 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xz6bB-0004mE-00; Sun, 1 Feb 1998 13:06:41 -0800 From: PMimlitsch@aol.com Message-ID: <3e23a6b9.34d4e31b@aol.com> Date: Sun, 1 Feb 1998 16:03:21 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Introduction and question Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 85 Resent-Message-ID: <"crQnmB.A.XOE.DNO10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2645 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sun, 1 Feb 1998 13:06:41 -0800 X-UIDL: 52bd5ce95d8e82b93ae91326146e8f02 In a message dated 2/1/98 3:19:50 PM, you wrote: <> Can't beat the Mackie1202vlz. My current loop rac set up is 2 Jmen (1-32sec./1 8sec.), 1 rds 8000 Time Machine, 1 Vortex, and 1 Mackie 1202vlz. The Mackie handles all the signal permutations that I need (or can think of anyway). - Paul From ???@??? Sun Feb 01 21:58:10 1998 >From kflint Sun Feb 1 14:03:44 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xz7UL-00010J-00; Sun, 1 Feb 1998 14:03:41 -0800 Message-ID: <34D4F059.B01A55D3@mail.clt.bellsouth.net> Date: Sun, 01 Feb 1998 16:59:54 -0500 From: "Samuel D. Burns" Reply-To: usonian@bellsouth.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.02 [en]C-DIAL (Win95; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Mackies and Loopers References: <3e23a6b9.34d4e31b@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"pGHQlB.A.wr.fCP10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2646 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sun, 1 Feb 1998 14:03:41 -0800 X-UIDL: 1467e271d13db59eedfea0b2e689cf8e I agree...I also use this Mackie...amazing sound quality improvement over other mixers...I did not realize what a difference it would make. I use it with JamMan, K2000s, DJ70, Barrett electronic violin, EMU Ultra Proteus, Pinnacle, and EMU ESI 32...for minimalist/foundsound/looping compositions. Incidentally, I was losing at Scrabble a few weeks ago when my opponent said that "loopers" was a word. I challenged, and lost. Check the dictionary...it may surprise you what a "looper" is according to Webster. I'lloopatyoulaterlaterlater PMimlitsch@aol.com wrote: > In a message dated 2/1/98 3:19:50 PM, you wrote: > > < question and this seems like the perfect place to ask: I don't know what > kinda of mixer to buy.>> > > Can't beat the Mackie1202vlz. My current loop rac set up is 2 Jmen > (1-32sec./1 8sec.), 1 rds 8000 Time Machine, 1 Vortex, and 1 Mackie 1202vlz. > The Mackie handles all the signal permutations that I need (or can think of > anyway). - Paul From ???@??? Sun Feb 01 21:58:14 1998 >From kflint Sun Feb 1 15:07:20 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xz8Tt-0005rM-00; Sun, 1 Feb 1998 15:07:17 -0800 Date: Sun, 1 Feb 1998 18:03:44 -0500 (EST) From: VanEyck To: usonian@bellsouth.net cc: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Mackies and Loopers In-Reply-To: <34D4F059.B01A55D3@mail.clt.bellsouth.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Resent-Message-ID: <"mSUWUD.A.oOF.H-P10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2647 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sun, 1 Feb 1998 15:07:17 -0800 X-UIDL: 3b4f7594c5bf516e52d9b0d4aecd18f9 On a slightly different note, does anyone have an opinion RE Soundcraft boards vs. Mackie? Thanks, TREVOR. > I agree...I also use this Mackie...amazing sound quality improvement over other > mixers...I did not realize what a difference it would make. From ???@??? Sun Feb 01 21:58:28 1998 >From kflint Sun Feb 1 18:58:31 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzC5b-0006zF-00; Sun, 1 Feb 1998 18:58:27 -0800 From: Marzzz@aol.com Message-ID: <5c02b82.34d53519@aol.com> Date: Sun, 1 Feb 1998 21:53:11 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Another NAMM Report Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 82 Resent-Message-ID: <"OTHSKB.A.dSG.zWT10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2648 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sun, 1 Feb 1998 18:58:27 -0800 X-UIDL: fc7e09802846c4150ca600e74da27ef0 In a message dated 2/1/98 1:03:15 PM, Dpcoffin wrote: >Well, I guess you're missing a copy of Heet Sound's "Next Generation EBow" >flyer and the riveting experience of hearing the new EBow in person....and, >OK, they call it "a gruesome harmonic position just a switch away," but >essentially it's an octave-up switch. You can take it up with them at >213-687-9946 and hear a demo at 213-625-3269. Ok, so what are the differences between the old EBow and the new one? I am just about to order one, does the new one sound different? I have heard the original EBows had a more mellow tone, the current ones more "harsh" or overdriven. Please elaborate!!! Marshall From ???@??? Sun Feb 01 21:58:29 1998 >From kflint Sun Feb 1 19:47:58 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzCrT-0002Sa-00; Sun, 1 Feb 1998 19:47:55 -0800 X-Sender: ejmd@pop.erols.com Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <5c02b82.34d53519@aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sun, 1 Feb 1998 22:53:39 -0500 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Ed Drake Subject: Different EBows was Re: Another NAMM Report Resent-Message-ID: <"xDeA0C.A.J-B.nEU10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2649 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sun, 1 Feb 1998 19:47:55 -0800 X-UIDL: 23e20cf77020a4151a2eaaf1c276204b >Ok, so what are the differences between the old EBow and the new one? I am >just about to order one, does the new one sound different? I have heard the >original EBows had a more mellow tone, the current ones more "harsh" or >overdriven. Please elaborate!!! > >Marshall As far as I know there are 3 previous generations of EBow, not including this new "octave up"one, which are distinguishable by physical characteristics as well as sonic ones. The original ones were the chrome ones, which I've never tried but I hear were the mellowest in drive and weakest in sensitivity (starting the string vibrating). These are very hard to find and I don't have any idea what the price would be if you did. The 2nd generation EBows (my first) were distinguished by being made of black plastic with a red EBow logo. These had more drive and a higher sensitivity. The most recently available EBow (3rd gen) are also black plastic but with a white logo on the outside. These have about the same drive as the red EBows but have even more sensitivity. I have a red and a white model. This sensitivity difference between the two is noticeable, as I use one a lot with an acoustic electric steel string guitar, and the white one starts the string vibrating much more quickly than the red without having to hammer the left hand notes down as hard. I don't know if this new "octave up" one is even available yet, as I know often at NAMM, companies demo new gear and take orders for it but you don't actually see it for sale for a while. Does any one know when it will be available and what the price will be and are there any other differences other than the "octave up"? Ed From ???@??? Sun Feb 01 21:58:31 1998 >From kflint Sun Feb 1 20:53:03 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzDsS-0006nL-00; Sun, 1 Feb 1998 20:53:00 -0800 From: Dpcoffin@aol.com Message-ID: <341fe98e.34d54f6c@aol.com> Date: Sun, 1 Feb 1998 23:45:30 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Re: Another NAMM Report Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 84 Resent-Message-ID: <"8n__D.A.1BG.nBV10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2650 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sun, 1 Feb 1998 20:53:00 -0800 X-UIDL: f285365f1a9f2949d57e6e4c3e7d3894 In a message dated 2/1/98 9:57:37 PM, you wrote: > I have heard the >original EBows had a more mellow tone, the current ones more "harsh" or >overdriven. Please elaborate!!! Sorry, Marshall. I can't say...the guy was only showing the new one (sounded great to me), but their lit does say the new one has "improved" tone in normal mode, a sure sign that fans of the old one will complain! The new one is NOT shipping yet apparently (the flier said "Don't buy now---wait!), so I guess you could still get the old model wherever it was in stock...they're cheap--get two! dpc From ???@??? Sun Feb 01 21:58:33 1998 >From kflint Sun Feb 1 21:20:03 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzEIb-00016j-00; Sun, 1 Feb 1998 21:20:01 -0800 From: Texture444@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Sun, 1 Feb 1998 23:53:57 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Re: Re: Another NAMM Report Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 84 Resent-Message-ID: <"6HP1GB.A.cv.UbV10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2652 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sun, 1 Feb 1998 21:20:01 -0800 X-UIDL: 8f191c92451bcc3cb2de934da33d510b me, i've got an "octave" ebow; got it last february, kinda beta: no switch: all octave: purty cool, yo..... dt From ???@??? Sun Feb 01 21:58:32 1998 >From kflint Sun Feb 1 21:04:17 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzE3L-0007ko-00; Sun, 1 Feb 1998 21:04:15 -0800 From: Dpcoffin@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Sun, 1 Feb 1998 23:59:34 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Different EBows was Re: Another NAMM Report Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 84 Resent-Message-ID: <"Z5wPQC.A.j6G.HMV10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2651 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sun, 1 Feb 1998 21:04:15 -0800 X-UIDL: 686ff3fed9a09c08b8822f2c97f143f9 In a message dated 2/1/98 10:46:45 PM, Ed wrote: >Does any one know when it will be >available and what the price will be and are there any other differences >other than the "octave up"? Here's a direct quote from the Heet NAMM flier: "Next generation EBow--Now you have two settings (that's twice as many as before): an improved regular sound and a gruesome harmonic position just a switch away. The harmonic bow has been enjoyed by a few select bozos over the last few years and they unanimously proclaim it to be way cool and worth the money (they got them free). Now, everybody can get it in a slick new package [white]. Please don't run out and buy one, though. We need some time to catch up. Have a heart- please delay your EBow purchase. DON'T BUY EBOWS----In summary, there's a new EBow but you can't have it yet, Meanwhile. feel free to visit our stale unchanging web site [www.ebow.com]." You can e-mail 'em at info@ebow.com phone 213-625-1944, fax 213-625-1944, demo 213-625-3269 dpc From ???@??? Sun Feb 01 21:58:34 1998 >From kflint Sun Feb 1 21:36:59 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzEYy-0002nr-00; Sun, 1 Feb 1998 21:36:56 -0800 Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 00:33:14 -0500 (EST) From: Goddess X-Sender: Thefates@viking.cris.com To: loopers-delight@annihilist.com Subject: CATACLISM!!! Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Resent-Message-ID: <"fxMCD.A.8PC.kqV10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2653 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sun, 1 Feb 1998 21:36:56 -0800 X-UIDL: 88645c37ca5609ebfe5969419d6b04fd Hi all, unfortunately, I won't be ablt to reply to anyone for a few days as I've had a major system catastrophy! I'm writing this on a unix shell but I won't be doing that this week at all as it's annoyingly slow to deal with. I must reinstall win95 so I'll let you all know when I'm back... thanks, smiles, Corynne From ???@??? Sun Feb 01 21:58:35 1998 >From kflint Sun Feb 1 21:41:53 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzEdg-0003Nt-00; Sun, 1 Feb 1998 21:41:48 -0800 Message-ID: <34D55E4A.C92AACD9@mailbox.syr.edu> Date: Mon, 02 Feb 1998 00:48:57 -0500 From: mark sottilaro Reply-To: msottila@mailbox.syr.edu Organization: metaliminal X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.01 (Macintosh; I; PPC) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Location. X-Priority: 3 (Normal) References: <34D4D843.737C@isrv.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"5rEuTC.A.ctC.kuV10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2654 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sun, 1 Feb 1998 21:41:48 -0800 X-UIDL: 8bc67a4a03ae952417c94741d3f6b6ba Hey Loopers. Every once and a while I wonder if I'm near anyone on this list. Do you think we could all give an email with a location to the list? That way we could all get an idea of what kind of dispersion there is among us. I'm living in Syracuse NY at the moment. Later, Mark Sottilaro From ???@??? Mon Feb 02 00:24:27 1998 >From kflint Sun Feb 1 21:55:18 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzEqi-0004IG-00; Sun, 1 Feb 1998 21:55:16 -0800 Message-ID: <34D561E3.3F5DEBFB@mailbox.syr.edu> Date: Mon, 02 Feb 1998 01:04:18 -0500 From: mark sottilaro Reply-To: msottila@mailbox.syr.edu Organization: metaliminal X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.01 (Macintosh; I; PPC) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: CATACLISM!!! X-Priority: 3 (Normal) References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"N8vyrD.A.SzD.z8V10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2655 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sun, 1 Feb 1998 21:55:16 -0800 X-UIDL: 03b48c21d84e281af3ce08b946627eed Good news for all you poor soles that have to deal with Bills excuse for an operating system: Later this Febuary the Macintosh operating system vers. 9 will be available for Power PC machines as well as Pentiums. Good luck with the Win95 installation, I've been struggeling with my roommates PC for the last 2 weeks and ever since she tried to install some internet software she can't get Windows 95 to run in anything but a "safe mode" (translation: almost nothing works) Funny, when I got internet access, I installed some software, plugged in some numbers and started surfing... I will give my little Mac a kiss before I put it to bed tonight. Good luck. Corynne. We're praying for ya. Mark From ???@??? Mon Feb 02 09:29:14 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 2 02:47:55 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzJPq-0005NL-00; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 02:47:50 -0800 X-Sender: kflint@pop.slip.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <34D3AC38.AD3A1B41@earthlink.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 01:03:03 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Kim Flint Subject: Re: Any Hot News? / where was Boomerang? Resent-Message-ID: <"pmQ6EC.A.p8D.rIa10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2660 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 02:47:50 -0800 X-UIDL: 4120408a146559757fb97b046210dcbc At 3:57 PM -0700 1/31/98, William Moyer wrote: >Hey you insider NAMM goers, What's the news? I'm especially >wondering if the Boomerang folks are there, and if they've finished the >new software chip? Are there any new choices for us loopy folks? Sorry >, if I sound over anxious, but I am . >Thanks, Bill Well, I didn't see Boomerang at the show. I was all over it, and they're not in the directory, so presumably they weren't there. Motley? Where were you? I didn't see them last year, either. Could be they don't get enough out of it to be worth the cost. It cost me a small fortune just to be *present* at this show (among the reasons why I'm peeved that it was held in the downtown LA convention center, where there are hardly any hotel rooms....). Exhibiting ain't cheap..... kim ______________________________________________________________________ Kim Flint | Looper's Delight kflint@annihilist.com | http://www.annihilist.com/loop/loop.html http://www.annihilist.com/ | Loopers-Delight-request@annihilist.com From ???@??? Mon Feb 02 09:29:15 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 2 02:48:10 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzJQ4-0005Ou-00; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 02:48:04 -0800 X-Sender: kflint@pop.slip.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <1503899.34d4c664@aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 01:20:49 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Kim Flint Subject: Re: Re: Another NAMM Report Resent-Message-ID: <"b8xh7.A.B9D.tIa10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2661 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 02:48:04 -0800 X-UIDL: 6656906064914eb3e1ed648d8032a094 At 2:00 PM -0500 2/1/98, Dpcoffin@aol.com wrote: >In a message dated 2/1/98 10:11:10 AM, dAve wrote: > >>> The New E-Bow has an octave-up switch... >>> >> >>What? E-Bows set up a magnetic field which excites the string. It's the >string >>length and taughtness that controls the pitch not the magnetic field. Or am I >>missing something? I would guess it's like the the Fernandes Sustainer, which has an octave switch. (and a higher harmonics switch, which is my favorite). In the octave position, the magnetic field from the sustainer thing is oscillating an octave up from the fundamental of the string. (or emphasizing that frequency, anyway.) This causes the positive feedback loop to happen with the 2nd harmonic oscillation on the string instead of the fundamental, and that's what you hear sustaining. Like when you pluck a string and tap it at the 12th fret to get the harmonic. Basically you cause the fundamentaly to die out fast, leaving the 2nd harmonic. kim ______________________________________________________________________ Kim Flint | Looper's Delight kflint@annihilist.com | http://www.annihilist.com/loop/loop.html http://www.annihilist.com/ | Loopers-Delight-request@annihilist.com From ???@??? Mon Feb 02 09:29:16 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 2 02:48:51 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzJQg-0005TQ-00; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 02:48:42 -0800 X-Sender: kflint@pop.slip.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <34D4F059.B01A55D3@mail.clt.bellsouth.net> References: <3e23a6b9.34d4e31b@aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 01:31:19 -0800 To: usonian@bellsouth.net, Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Kim Flint Subject: Re: Mackies and Loopers Resent-Message-ID: <"nc7dAD.A.l_D.6Ia10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2662 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 02:48:42 -0800 X-UIDL: 4008c676f11ebec0f84044325958d07e At 4:59 PM -0500 2/1/98, Samuel D. Burns wrote: >Incidentally, I was losing at Scrabble a few weeks ago when my opponent >said that >"loopers" was a word. I challenged, and lost. Check the dictionary...it may >surprise you what a "looper" is according to Webster. It took me a while to figure out why I was getting spam from pesticide and agricultural equipment manufacturers after I started this thing, but was really quite amused when I figured it out...;-) kim ______________________________________________________________________ Kim Flint | Looper's Delight kflint@annihilist.com | http://www.annihilist.com/loop/loop.html http://www.annihilist.com/ | Loopers-Delight-request@annihilist.com From ???@??? Mon Feb 02 09:29:15 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 2 02:48:30 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzJQK-0005Qp-00; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 02:48:20 -0800 X-Sender: kflint@pop.slip.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 01:42:55 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Kim Flint Subject: Re: Back in the Saddle Again Resent-Message-ID: <"cGGwMB.A.h_D.5Ia10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2663 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 02:48:20 -0800 X-UIDL: c596d43c6482641972c607858f3ffe44 David Meyers wrote: >Cripes, annihilist wouldn't let me in since Dec. 13th; my ISP just figured >out how to fix the problem, whatever it was. very glad this is fixed! My ISP claims to have made some changes as well, I guess something worked. >BTW, I wanted to put in my .02 regarding a desert island looper's list: > >1) Paul Dresher "Liquid and Stellar Music" I was quite amused to find that Paul and I both have a very special fondness for Ministry. He says he likes to play their cd's while setting up for performances, and listens to them quite a bit. "The Mind is a Terrible Thing to Taste" would be one of my favorite loop albums ever. I'm praying for a Paul Dresher/Al Jourgensen collaboration..... >More BTW: I just ordered more RAM to max out my Echoplex and discovered an >interesting phenomenon. Several of the memory companies asked me, "what is >it for?", and in one case I told them. They said, we sell so-and-so for >samplers and music equipment--bottom line, the very same 30-pin SIMMs as >for a Mac SE30, etc., but a jacked-up price. Reason? I dunno--maybe >they've had music people return RAM more often? Try: "gee, musicians are actually dumb enough to believe that their sound will be affected by the simms they use! Let's unload these expensive ones that nobody else will buy." kim ______________________________________________________________________ Kim Flint | Looper's Delight kflint@annihilist.com | http://www.annihilist.com/loop/loop.html http://www.annihilist.com/ | Loopers-Delight-request@annihilist.com From ???@??? Mon Feb 02 02:39:13 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 2 02:10:32 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzIpj-0002Ky-00; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 02:10:31 -0800 Message-ID: <34D59B82.443DFE08@bellsouth.net> Date: Mon, 02 Feb 1998 05:10:10 -0500 From: Jeff Duke Reply-To: jmar@bellsouth.net Organization: Tec Bab Labs X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: msottila@mailbox.syr.edu CC: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Location. References: <34D4D843.737C@isrv.com> <34D55E4A.C92AACD9@mailbox.syr.edu> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"9GlBFB.A.JBC.dsZ10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2658 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 02:10:31 -0800 X-UIDL: 4803f8d2eb37e35645d846579c5a18a3 I'm in Conyers,Georgia,ya'll.And I sure 'nuff want that ebow.drool. Jeff mark sottilaro wrote: > Hey Loopers. > > Every once and a while I wonder if I'm near anyone on this list. Do you think > we could all give an email with a location to the list? That way we could all > get an idea of what kind of dispersion there is among us. > > I'm living in Syracuse NY at the moment. > > Later, > > Mark Sottilaro From ???@??? Mon Feb 02 09:29:17 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 2 02:48:56 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzJQn-0005UP-00; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 02:48:49 -0800 X-Sender: kflint@pop.slip.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 02:10:20 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Kim Flint Subject: Re: Another NAMM Report Resent-Message-ID: <"vz6lOD.A.RAE.8Ia10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2664 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 02:48:49 -0800 X-UIDL: e33fb343233a0c592ea13325bcfddade At 8:06 PM -0500 1/31/98, Dpcoffin@aol.com wrote: >2. The Signature 284 All tube Class A Stereo Guitar Amplifier, optimized for didn't listen to this one, but a fellow on a guitar tone obsessed list I follow described it as "a transistor radio with the batteries going dead." Presumably that's a bad thing. Why Lexicon is trying to produce all tube guitar amps is a bit baffling...... >When asked about looping, my contact claimed that theyâd been >kicking>themselves over dropping the Jamman, since they started getting >big orders>shortly thereafter, and would ãdefinitelyä be back in the >looping game ãsoon.ä I guess that's why they've done nothing with Bob Sellon's JamMan upgrades? >Electro-Harmonix guy told me that the 16-sec delay was still in the works, >and>would be ãexactly the same...ä exactly the same, except "this time it won't break down ever." Which of course, means it won't be "exactly" the same. The vintage market will undoubtedly find some way to prove that there is still a reason to pay $1200 for the old one. >tc electronicâs FireworX multifx looked extremely powerful, like a >second-gen>G-Force that even includes a MIDI-addressable mono synth, has >programmable>ãinsertä capabilities--like an fx loop using either the >digital or analog i/o>that youâre not already using, as far as I can >figure--programmable feedback>loops, modulatable modulators (including a >kind of mini sequencer called>ãfreeformä), and you can divide up the dsp >horsepower any way you want, using>multiple blocks of any algorithms that >use less than 50% of the resources. The>front-panel block buttons include >Dynamic, Filters, Formant, Distort, Vocode,>Synth, Pitch, Chorus, Delay, >Reverb, Pan, and EQ...and there are ring mod,>noise, and reverse delay >options, altho the delay times didnât appear to be>any longer than on the >G-Force (well under 2 sec). This thing is extremely cool! Pricey, but definitely a sound designer's dream toy. >Roland had some neat stuff (a 24-bit 8-in, 16-out version of the VS-880 >with a>bigger screen, a super phrase sampler that caches directly to a >zip drive for>about 26 minutes of stereo sampling and used 2 simultaneous >Dimension Beam>controllers to modulate fx or control audio....), but >nothing new on the>guitar front. The VG-8 is still in the catalog, tho... The roland SP-808 groovesampler is my vote for the coolest thing I saw at the show. Oriented towards remixing, but full of cool sounding features. However, roland has a knack for making stuff that is incredible at first glance but problematic and disappointing in practical use. (MC-303, GR-30, etc....) So, I'll wait for the jury to come back on this one. >Believe me, it was PAINful to have to leave the show before I saw more! Believe me, it was PAINFUL to stay there long. The damn LA convention center is very spread out and has too many different levels. After a few days of walking for miles, my legs and feet were killing me! kim ______________________________________________________________________ Kim Flint | Looper's Delight kflint@annihilist.com | http://www.annihilist.com/loop/loop.html http://www.annihilist.com/ | Loopers-Delight-request@annihilist.com From ???@??? Mon Feb 02 02:39:16 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 2 02:15:34 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzIua-0002j2-00; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 02:15:32 -0800 Message-ID: <34D59C92.45F42D3D@bellsouth.net> Date: Mon, 02 Feb 1998 05:14:42 -0500 From: Jeff Duke Reply-To: jmar@bellsouth.net Organization: Tec Bab Labs X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: malhomme@infobiogen.fr CC: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: box from old ages References: <34D5A5A3.33BA@infobiogen.fr> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"5kE4iB.A.iXC.-wZ10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2659 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 02:15:32 -0800 X-UIDL: 5f3613ed0bbc7c5887b1c3548aa6088f hey ya'll,I just got a super-fuzz from unicord and a Kay wahwah for a buck ea. at a yard sale and they work.what a deal! jeff Malhomme Olivier wrote: > besides old boss en ibanez stomboxes, I have a Mu-Tron bi-phase and a > E-H microsynthesizer... > > Olivier Malhomme From ???@??? Mon Feb 02 09:30:10 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 2 08:52:26 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzP6S-0000sf-00; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 08:52:12 -0800 Message-Id: <199802021632.IAA19135142@scv1.apple.com> Subject: Re: The new ebows Date: Mon, 2 Feb 98 10:33:11 -0000 x-sender: hartne.t@mail.apple.com x-mailer: Claris Emailer 1.1 From: "T.W. Hartnett" To: "Looper's Delight" Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Resent-Message-ID: <"fsCnrC.A.a-G.ndf10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2683 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 08:52:12 -0800 X-UIDL: 455b84e3e5becc8354724ddf38dd8829 >Anybody ever have on of the old, metal chassis Ebows? I just can't get >mine to sound as good a Daniel Ash's (it must be the gear, right? >Right?) They weren't metal, they were chrome colored. Slightly bigger than the current ones, and a phenomenal pain in the ass. Or maybe it was just the two that I ran into. They had a built-in battery-saver feature, which mean that they would switch themselves off whenever it decided that it wasn't being used, which always seemed to coincide with when you were using the damn thing. They were a lot more difficult to use, but worked on the same principle. You probably need to get one of those H&H solid-state amps like Ash always uses. They sound real, uh, unique. Travis From ???@??? Mon Feb 02 09:29:51 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 2 07:35:13 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzNts-0000Kr-00; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 07:35:08 -0800 Message-ID: <34D5A1C4.10AD@nyfac.com> Date: Mon, 02 Feb 1998 10:36:52 +0000 From: tbajus Reply-To: nyfac2@nyfac.com X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (WinNT; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: The new ebows References: <1503899.34d4c664@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"eX1E2B.A.MLH.7ae10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2676 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 07:35:08 -0800 X-UIDL: f175a5848f73ac0e65fbdd726f218cbf Fortunately for me, I am ready to get a new Ebow (having almost distroyed my third one)... Anybody ever have on of the old, metal chassis Ebows? I just can't get mine to sound as good a Daniel Ash's (it must be the gear, right? Right?) Trevor From ???@??? Mon Feb 02 09:29:51 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 2 07:39:04 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzNxU-0000oj-00; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 07:38:52 -0800 Message-ID: <34D5A246.461@nyfac.com> Date: Mon, 02 Feb 1998 10:39:02 +0000 From: tbajus Reply-To: nyfac2@nyfac.com X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (WinNT; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Mackies and Loopers References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"EvTp1C.A.XG.9ce10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2677 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 07:38:52 -0800 X-UIDL: e604a69d9d0657d5b0fd27c2aea285a1 VanEyck wrote: > > On a slightly different note, does anyone have an opinion RE > Soundcraft boards vs. Mackie? > > Thanks, > TREVOR. > > > I agree...I also use this Mackie...amazing sound quality improvement over other > > mixers...I did not realize what a difference it would make. I have heard that the Soundcraft boards are a bit noisier, but significantly warmer. I have an old 1202 and a 1604, and I have always found them to be a bit sterile. Trevor Bajus From ???@??? Mon Feb 02 09:29:53 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 2 07:43:18 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzO1k-0001MR-00; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 07:43:16 -0800 Message-ID: <34D5A346.4F9B@nyfac.com> Date: Mon, 02 Feb 1998 10:43:18 +0000 From: tbajus Reply-To: nyfac2@nyfac.com X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (WinNT; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Another NAMM Report References: <3.0.1.16.19980202105930.301fc8f0@rank-serv.elec.gla.ac.uk> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"Gg-5CC.A.Jn.Dhe10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2678 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 07:43:16 -0800 X-UIDL: 6f3d9afbc9a5f1b2aaa3d21992a48c91 It would be nice if they would make one that could drive 2 or three strings at a time. I have not yet felt the need to go out and buy a fernandez just for this, but my irresponcibility is legendary. Trevor B From ???@??? Mon Feb 02 02:39:12 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 2 01:57:11 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzIco-0001ef-00; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 01:57:10 -0800 Message-ID: <34D5A5A3.33BA@infobiogen.fr> Date: Mon, 02 Feb 1998 10:53:25 +0000 From: Malhomme Olivier Reply-To: malhomme@infobiogen.fr Organization: I P L X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 [fr] (Macintosh; I; PPC) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: box from old ages References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"bovhtB.A.wWB.wfZ10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2657 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 01:57:10 -0800 X-UIDL: ee28e6c29b4b249f87b23639bb7dd79a besides old boss en ibanez stomboxes, I have a Mu-Tron bi-phase and a E-H microsynthesizer... Olivier Malhomme From ???@??? Mon Feb 02 09:30:23 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 2 09:25:33 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzPcg-00052Y-00; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 09:25:30 -0800 Message-Id: <199802021706.JAA18578@scv4.apple.com> Subject: Sustainer retrofit Date: Mon, 2 Feb 98 11:07:19 -0000 x-sender: hartne.t@mail.apple.com x-mailer: Claris Emailer 1.1 From: "T.W. Hartnett" To: "Looper's Delight" Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Resent-Message-ID: <"-8_1AC.A.nSD._6f10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2685 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 09:25:30 -0800 X-UIDL: fa292e8157df46bfe571bb96195373db ><<>1) Is the Fernandes or any other sustainer available as a retro-fit? > >Yes, but Fernandez charge a wallet-smasking 272UK for it ($400)!!!>> >Interesting...I asked the guy at the Fernandes NAMM booth about retro-fits >and he said absolutely not, too complicated getting the thing set up >correctly and since it interacts with the bridge pickup, they couldn't >guarentee that it would work well with all other pickups. The Sustainiac system is available as a retrofit, but it also goes for about $400. You send them your pickguard and pickups, they wire everything up and send it back, or you can send them the whole guitar. Travis Hartnett From ???@??? Mon Feb 02 12:44:56 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 2 09:29:01 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzPfi-0005Qt-00; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 09:28:38 -0800 Message-Id: <199802021707.JAA19402036@scv1.apple.com> Subject: Re: Location. Date: Mon, 2 Feb 98 11:08:28 -0000 x-sender: hartne.t@mail.apple.com x-mailer: Claris Emailer 1.1 From: "T.W. Hartnett" To: "Looper's Delight" Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Resent-Message-ID: <"nvUW5B.A.ymD.c9f10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2686 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 09:28:38 -0800 X-UIDL: 96b5693416286c48b12be7ad9adf238b >> Every once and a while I wonder if I'm near anyone on this list. Do you >think >> we could all give an email with a location to the list? That way we could >all >> get an idea of what kind of dispersion there is among us. If you look at the Looper's Delight homepage, most people have included their location in the Loopers of the World section. Travis Hartnett Austin, TX From ???@??? Mon Feb 02 12:44:58 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 2 09:30:48 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzPhj-0005g2-00; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 09:30:43 -0800 Message-Id: <199802021708.JAA17854@scv4.apple.com> Subject: Re: Back in the Saddle Again Date: Mon, 2 Feb 98 11:09:26 -0000 x-sender: hartne.t@mail.apple.com x-mailer: Claris Emailer 1.1 From: "T.W. Hartnett" To: "Looper's Delight" Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Resent-Message-ID: <"nNxjtB.A.xtD.W-f10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2687 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 09:30:43 -0800 X-UIDL: 4a4b1e33d1e932052bf01e252d11707e >Robert at the Bottom Line Saturday night; saw the early show. I don't >think even the people at TC Electronic or Eventide would have been >pleased--this is all that can be done with 20 grand worth of gear? I kept >wanting to shout, "OK, Bob, now HIT IT!". (Wouldn't have been out of >place: LOTS of people were shouting.) It was like he was waiting for the >right moment to break loose, but never did and never intended to--or didn't >know how. Yeah, that's probably it. >It seems that he believes he's doing >something unprecedented. What he's doing that IS different is presenting a >rather inept sort of ambient music to crowds which are largely unfamiliar >with even Eno's "Discreet Music" (which this show was uncannily reminicent >of), and pissing them off. I think 90% of this crowd expected "Red", and >if I were one of them I'd be screaming, too. But I think this is part of >what Robert wants to do: mess with people. He will call it "inviting them >to expand their horizons" or some such thing, but it seems to me that it's >mostly just self-indulgence. I know what you mean--I hate it when artists indulge themselves instead of indulging me. >Also, I must say that you guys who can tolerate "Door X" must have a screw >loose. What the hell was David thinking? Did you ever hear the albums on >which even Herbie Hancock decided to sing? Please! The nerve. And remember when Miles stopped playing bebop? It was all downhill after that. Travis Hartnett From ???@??? Mon Feb 02 09:29:26 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 2 05:10:32 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzLdu-0004Lv-00; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 05:10:30 -0800 Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 08:07:44 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <199802021307.IAA12152@marconi.concentric.net> X-Sender: hideo@pop3.concentric.net X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Tom Lambrecht Subject: Re: Mackis cusomer service--was: Mackies and Loopers (also used gear by Net) Resent-Message-ID: <"02Tk3.A.g0D.nUc10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2665 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 05:10:30 -0800 X-UIDL: 21d69f2e43053a869f5f307bf5a0996e Trevor: I don't specifically have an opinion about Soundcraftsman mixers,but this thread prompts me to share a recent experience I had with Mackie . . . bought one of the M1200 power amps over the Web for a great price--arrived nestled in an SKB two space, both in excellent shape--plugged it in . . . green power light and nothing else---no FAN, no CRANK :( contacted the seller who was mortified and assured me that it worked the last time he had it powered up--he had FedX CODed it to me and picked up most of the freight and I sincerely believed he wasn't pulling a fast one ( had that difficult-to-describe GOOD VIBE about this seller--who turned out to be a fellow hobbyist user who designs custom ORGANIC MOLECULES) . He offered to return my cashier's check and to pay for return freight for the amp OR to pay for the freight to ship to Mackie for warranty (amp was less than 9 months into a 3 year transferrrable warranty) I opted for the latter--he volunteered to hold the check till all was resolved without going into ALL the details, Mackie's customer service was among the VERY BEST I have ever encountered ANYWHERE, ANYTIME. Someone from the Service Department who I had called to get an RA # (and see if I could get it serviced locally) late Friday afternoon was gone for the weekend--I left a message in his voice mail, making a mental note to call back on Monday to harangue-----He apparently retrieved his messages while HANGGLIDING or whatever these NW types do and had one of his subordinates call me back about three hours later at about 6PM PDT??!!! FRIDAY !!!!! (REMEMBER--this is about a non-revenue generating, pain in the ass, repair on a second-party warranty) I made two more calls while the amp was in the que--(word of explanation--you ship air to the Warranty Department--your piece goes to hte head of the line--turns over in two days and they NEXT DAY Air it back to you--if you send it Ground (which I did) it goes in the que (mine took two weeks and they Two Day Air it back to you)--both calls were returned by the appropriate people withhin hours Got the amp back worked perfectly, but no indication on hte invoice of what was wrong--called warranty and left a message--guy called me back in two hours--told me a limiter circuit component was replaced and without making a big deal of it, let me knoww that they went ahead and upped the internal fuse to 20A and upgraded another circuit to current production spec. Brothers and Sisters--I hate to type so you can tell how this experience has moved me--I'm not a "BUY USA" cheerleader-tyoe but these guys are ON THE BALL and being a toy lover, I've had to deal with alot of companies that were NOT--I won't name names . . . but most recently . . . IBM, Dell, White-Westinghouse (I've been looping the noisy compressor for that pleasing grungy INDUSTRIAL sound) But, I digress--MIXERWISE--picked up a used 1202VLZ (while the amp was commuting to the NW) which has blown me away with it's quiet operation, smooth pots and GOBS of GAIN on the first four channels (it cleared up a low output hum problem from an old Roland Juno 6--since when does adding more cables and another device IMPROVE the sound ;) and extremely flexible routing (incidentally hold out for the VLZ) there is a reason why the BIG BOYS use these things drone on~~~~~~~~~Tom PS Trevor--thanks for the offer to send the scans of the manuals for the much ballyhooed Time Machine Loopers page--I'll let you know as soon as I figure out who can/will pprocess this stuff into the finished jewel. At 06:03 PM 2/1/98 -0500, you wrote: > > On a slightly different note, does anyone have an opinion RE >Soundcraft boards vs. Mackie? > > Thanks, > TREVOR. > >> I agree...I also use this Mackie...amazing sound quality improvement over other >> mixers...I did not realize what a difference it would make. > > > > Tom Lambrecht hideo@concentric.net From ???@??? Mon Feb 02 09:29:31 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 2 05:27:41 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzLuU-0005hM-00; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 05:27:38 -0800 Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 08:22:55 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <199802021322.IAA14349@marconi.concentric.net> X-Sender: hideo@pop3.concentric.net X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Tom Lambrecht Subject: Re: Mackie product literature --was: Mackies and Loopers Resent-Message-ID: <"co9f5D.A.BzE.zic10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2666 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 05:27:38 -0800 X-UIDL: eef67b56e7a1fe92d36c28a52aaf5805 Oh, by the way--i can spell--both "customer" and "Mackie" . . .just seeing if anyone reads these things Another thing I just thought of for those who are mixer shopping is their free totally EXCELLENT catalog (dude) which is more informative than some manufacturors owner's manuals I learned a lot about mixing cables, input levels and effects routing when I got one not to mention why their mixers are a litlle more $ and why alot of people try to copy their designs . . . call 800.898.3211 Oh, and their owners manuals are a picture of clarity, without being stuffy--actually humorous in stretches--NONE of these incomprehensible, labored translations, e.g. "for bestest sound clearness, traffic wires ending in XLR outlets give lasting shiny mix, Imperialist,round-eye . . ." No, Mackie DID NOT put me up to this--Yes, I wuv Mackie Tom Tom Lambrecht hideo@concentric.net From ???@??? Mon Feb 02 09:29:33 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 2 05:31:55 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzLyX-0006Db-00; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 05:31:49 -0800 Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 08:25:27 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <199802021325.IAA14750@marconi.concentric.net> X-Sender: hideo@pop3.concentric.net X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Tom Lambrecht Subject: Re: Different EBows was Re: Another NAMM Report Resent-Message-ID: <"TGk67C.A.jGF.Qlc10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2668 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 05:31:49 -0800 X-UIDL: d13290ba282c0c5abb7c6802f123f9a4 How about an E-Bow or clone that actually works on bass ??? field activated<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< Tom At 10:53 PM 2/1/98 -0500, you wrote: > >>Ok, so what are the differences between the old EBow and the new one? I am >>just about to order one, does the new one sound different? I have heard the >>original EBows had a more mellow tone, the current ones more "harsh" or >>overdriven. Please elaborate!!! >> >>Marshall > >As far as I know there are 3 previous generations of EBow, not including >this new "octave up"one, which are distinguishable by physical >characteristics as well as sonic ones. The original ones were the chrome >ones, which I've never tried but I hear were the mellowest in drive and >weakest in sensitivity (starting the string vibrating). These are very hard >to find and I don't have any idea what the price would be if you did. The >2nd generation EBows (my first) were distinguished by being made of black >plastic with a red EBow logo. These had more drive and a higher >sensitivity. The most recently available EBow (3rd gen) are also black >plastic but with a white logo on the outside. These have about the same >drive as the red EBows but have even more sensitivity. I have a red and a >white model. This sensitivity difference between the two is noticeable, as >I use one a lot with an acoustic electric steel string guitar, and the >white one starts the string vibrating much more quickly than the red >without having to hammer the left hand notes down as hard. > >I don't know if this new "octave up" one is even available yet, as I know >often at NAMM, companies demo new gear and take orders for it but you don't >actually see it for sale for a while. Does any one know when it will be >available and what the price will be and are there any other differences >other than the "octave up"? > >Ed > > > > > Tom Lambrecht hideo@concentric.net From ???@??? Mon Feb 02 09:29:36 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 2 05:44:02 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzMAL-0007Bc-00; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 05:44:01 -0800 Message-ID: <001001bd2fe0$3b3bda80$70da6f83@pt205.wolfson.cam.ac.uk> From: "Peter Thompson" To: Subject: Fernandes Sustainer Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 13:41:12 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Resent-Message-ID: <"im35O.A.reG.-zc10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2669 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 05:44:01 -0800 X-UIDL: 5e9ac38f700446a2931c7678e4223d52 Hello all, two q's: 1) Is the Fernandes or any other sustainer available as a retro-fit? 2) Does anyone know how Michael Brook's Infinite Guitar works? Cheers Pete From ???@??? Mon Feb 02 09:29:37 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 2 06:11:55 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzMbJ-0000qq-00; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 06:11:53 -0800 From: cdeupree@interagp.com (Caleb Deupree) To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: desert island disk: Jesus Blood Never Failed Me Yet Reply-to: cdeupree@interagp.com Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 09:03:16 -0500 Message-ID: <19980202140316125.AAA92@LARCH.interagp.com> Resent-Message-ID: <"Yv2HcD.A.ti.OOd10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2670 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 06:11:53 -0800 X-UIDL: 40dfcfed1e295a59a2908febbf5e0f13 This weekend I listened to Gavin Bryars masterpiece 'Jesus Blood Never Failed Me Yet', which never fails to affect me emotionally. It occurred to me that, even though it's not the traditional looping music (i.e., no live interaction or modification of the loop), it does have a loop at its heart. For those unfamiliar with the piece, it is built around a loop of a tramp singing one verse of an old hymn, and Bryars adds several layers of orchestral accompaniment. The piece was first released on Brian Eno's Obscure label twenty years ago, but for the CD release on Philip Glass's Point Music, Bryars extended the piece with more flavors of orchestra. And as it turned out, Tom Waits was a big fan of the piece, so Waits sings along with the tramp at the end. Waits is in top form, some of his best work ever. Plus, how many orchestral looping pieces are there? From ???@??? Mon Feb 02 09:29:32 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 2 05:28:39 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzLvO-0005oO-00; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 05:28:34 -0800 Message-ID: <34D5D668.7407@infobiogen.fr> Date: Mon, 02 Feb 1998 14:21:28 +0000 From: Malhomme Olivier Reply-To: malhomme@infobiogen.fr Organization: I P L X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 [fr] (Macintosh; I; PPC) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Loopers-Delight-d Digest V98 #27 References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"YvCXR.A.e2E.Mjc10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2667 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 05:28:34 -0800 X-UIDL: fd694096fed47b025618b1c316e58b62 To add a little more, the famous fernades sustainer uses also the same magnetic field excitation system, and you can switch on it form root/octave up/ fifth above the octave up (12th). So;;; >> The New E-Bow has an octave-up switch... >> > >What? E-Bows set up a magnetic field which excites the string. It's the string >length and taughtness that controls the pitch not the magnetic field. Or am I >missing something? Well, I guess you're missing a copy of Heet Sound's "Next Generation EBow" flyer and the riveting experience of hearing the new EBow in person....and, OK, they call it "a gruesome harmonic position just a switch away," but essentially it's an octave-up switch. You can take it up with them at 213-687-9946 and hear a demo at 213-625-3269. dpc From ???@??? Mon Feb 02 09:29:42 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 2 07:03:32 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzNPE-0004VZ-00; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 07:03:28 -0800 Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 09:58:46 -0500 (EST) From: Monkici@aol.com Message-ID: <980202095845_576314003@mrin51.mx> To: loopers-delight@annihilist.com Subject: mackie? vs. soundcraft... Resent-Message-ID: <"wxd90D.A.E0D.k9d10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2671 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 07:03:28 -0800 X-UIDL: 4403c677951a59f3fbe678f6d6de86b7 hello all, sorry to jump in on a converstion, but in regard to the mackie vs soundcraft thing: mackies are cheap, quiet and they have excellent customer support. i highly reccomend them for settings where size, reliability and money are concerns. they should be commended for great products. But, they just don't sound as good as your average soundcraft ( not the new plastic boards, either). i have owned and used lots of mackie gear and have no complaints other than that the mic pre's sound thin. period. i dare you to A/B them with any old soundcraft or MCI or API console. sorry, but i mostly produce records for a living and think we shouldn't confuse reliability, price and customer service (all very important) with plain good sound. of course it is entirely subjective, but i've yet to hear otherwise from anyone who has checked it out. peace, r. From ???@??? Mon Feb 02 09:29:44 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 2 07:13:53 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzNZG-0005dt-00; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 07:13:50 -0800 Sender: camao@camsg001.camb.scee.sony.co.uk Message-ID: <34D5E1DA.8581BD7D@scee.sony.co.uk> Date: Mon, 02 Feb 1998 15:10:18 +0000 From: Os X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (X11; I; IRIX 6.2 IP22) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com" Subject: zoom effects units/vocoding Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"lDwth.A.69E.6He10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2673 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 07:13:50 -0800 X-UIDL: 3bcce79bd586bd0a0394703f0f2034b0 Anyone have any experience of the Zoom 1201 and/or 1204 effects units? Anyone ever combined looping with vocoding? I'm wondering what would happen if you vocoded a loop with itself, somehow.... -- Os os@millennium.co.uk http://webworlds.net/os/ From ???@??? Mon Feb 02 09:29:45 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 2 07:19:03 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzNeF-0006Fv-00; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 07:18:59 -0800 Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 15:15:15 +0000 (GMT) From: Peter Thompson X-Sender: pt205@blue.csi.cam.ac.uk To: Caleb Deupree cc: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: desert island disk: Jesus Blood Never Failed Me Yet In-Reply-To: <19980202140316125.AAA92@LARCH.interagp.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Resent-Message-ID: <"adWJC.A.4eF.TMe10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2674 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 07:18:59 -0800 X-UIDL: dc584e1e51e22a534480fc365f353c35 > > Plus, how many orchestral looping pieces are there? > > > I suppose I am stretching the definition of looping to an extreme here, but the repetition of a musical figure or harmonic progression is a standard device in classical, if not orchestral music. Think of Bach's Chaconne in D minor, Pachelbel's Canon, Ravel's Bolero etc. There is a piece for solo lute by John Dowland (ca 1600) which consists of a repeated descending chromatic scale around which he weaves various harmonic and melodic threads. If only he'd had a JamMan.... Peter Thompson From ???@??? Mon Feb 02 09:29:48 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 2 07:26:28 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzNlQ-00077r-00; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 07:26:24 -0800 Message-Id: <9802028864.AA886432864@chadbourne.com> X-Mailer: ccMail Link to SMTP R8.11.00.3 Date: Mon, 02 Feb 98 10:18:36 -0500 From: To: Subject: Re: test MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Description: "cc:Mail Note Part" Resent-Message-ID: <"iYvNgB.A.qSG.PTe10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2675 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 07:26:24 -0800 X-UIDL: 1ec72ae2a1e886b15acb28b429179125 ______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________ Subject: test Author: at -fabrik/internet Date: 01/30/98 07:14 PM test From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 00:14:49 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 2 16:44:16 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzWTF-0001AF-00; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 16:44:13 -0800 From: niyame@bellatlantic.net Message-ID: <34D5EA51.E167C663@bellatlantic.net> Date: Mon, 02 Feb 1998 16:46:26 +0100 Reply-To: niyame@bellatlantic.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.01 (Macintosh; I; PPC) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: location X-Priority: 3 (Normal) References: <19980202172633.23808.qmail@omni1.voicenet.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; x-mac-type="54455854"; x-mac-creator="4D4F5353" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"81NjyD.A.lAH.-Wm10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2729 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 16:44:13 -0800 X-UIDL: 0ea2740eb4da956c646f5c59a00b38fb greetings....floyd..... i am from center city...philly.....old city......near the Liberty Bell. niyame elliot From ???@??? Mon Feb 02 09:29:57 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 2 07:59:09 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzOH1-0002vV-00; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 07:59:03 -0800 Message-Id: <199802021557.IAA18745@hyper.dimensional.com> From: "Scott Bullerwell" To: Subject: Re: mackie? vs. soundcraft... Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 08:51:39 -0700 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"gNUejB.A.sKC.Ywe10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2680 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 07:59:03 -0800 X-UIDL: 1cf164e79b4279d855b0b7ec078a4adf This summer, I convinced Chapman Stick artist Steve Hahn (http://www.deepchocolate.com) that he needed a new mixer to replace his antique Tascam. We tried out a borrowed Mackie (very good, but not as much bang for your buck as...), my Carvin (a really good value, but I'm gonna be replacing it with...) and finally a Behringer 2642. With the Behringer it was like the clouds parted and the light came shining down. Initially I was skeptical because they're made in China, but after six months of reliable use in the studio and on the road Steve's a believer (and I'm off the hook)--plus, we opened it up and the boards, traces, wave soldering, point soldering, wiring harnesses, etc. are gorgeous. Not a cold joint or dodgy-looking component to be found. I looked into a few others: Spirit and Peavey, to be precise. Yuk. Flimsy, scratchy sounding faders. How's it sound? Transparent. He's using it with an ADAT-XT, and mixdowns to DAT made via the 2642 sound pristine. The quality of the discrete preamps is supa-fine, the EQ section is sweet and subtle, and the power supply is rugged and isolated from the board (and thus your rack should you choose to rackmount it. Most all of the 1/4" connections are balanced (and all of the XLR conns are, of course), so you can do some long distance runaround and not worry about the electric motor in the fog machine makin' line noise. The local deal on it was 550 bones (USD). Scott Bullerwell tanelorn@dimensional.com Boulder, Colorado, USA From ???@??? Mon Feb 02 09:30:06 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 2 08:43:42 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzOyA-0007c7-00; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 08:43:38 -0800 Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 11:34:34 -0500 (EST) From: VanEyck To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Fernandes Sustainer In-Reply-To: <3.0.1.16.19980202164117.18c7219a@rank-serv.elec.gla.ac.uk> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Resent-Message-ID: <"Gmc_YD.A.lJG.UXf10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2681 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 08:43:38 -0800 X-UIDL: 855236c9f7f1285d7438f2ec18a6c0d5 You may not believe this but a friend of mine who has used Daniel Lanois infinite guitar (given to him by Michael Brook), noted that there is a huge cavity shaved out of the back of the guitar that holds: are you ready for this? A modified Electro Harmonix Memory Man. Best, TREVOR. VanEyck@interlog.com On Mon, 2 Feb 1998, Michael P. Hughes, Ph.D. wrote: > >1) Is the Fernandes or any other sustainer available as a retro-fit? > > Yes, but Fernandez charge a wallet-smasking 272UK for it ($400)!!! > I'm currently trying to build one myself, as soon as I get the cash for the > pickup together.... > > >2) Does anyone know how Michael Brook's Infinite Guitar works? > > Yes, but it's a secret! ;b > > But really, I'm not sure if it's anything more than a sustainer -type > system with a bit more control over the cct via a footswitch. > > Michael > > > From ???@??? Mon Feb 02 09:30:07 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 2 08:47:26 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzP1m-0000HN-00; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 08:47:22 -0800 Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 11:36:40 -0500 (EST) From: Dpcoffin@aol.com Message-ID: <980202113640_372078400@mrin53> To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Re: Fernandes Sustainer Resent-Message-ID: <"DKfULC.A.wcG.mZf10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2682 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 08:47:22 -0800 X-UIDL: 5576223e5337375efc446ce359a8f8c9 <<>1) Is the Fernandes or any other sustainer available as a retro-fit? Yes, but Fernandez charge a wallet-smasking 272UK for it ($400)!!!>> Interesting...I asked the guy at the Fernandes NAMM booth about retro-fits and he said absolutely not, too complicated getting the thing set up correctly and since it interacts with the bridge pickup, they couldn't guarentee that it would work well with all other pickups. dpc From ???@??? Mon Feb 02 09:30:12 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 2 09:05:24 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzPJ9-0002XT-00; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 09:05:19 -0800 Message-Id: <98Feb2.115812est.18832@thicket.arbortext.com> Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 11:55:14 -0500 From: David White Reply-To: dwhite@arbortext.com Organization: Arbortext Inc. X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (WinNT; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Location. References: <34D4D843.737C@isrv.com> <34D55E4A.C92AACD9@mailbox.syr.edu> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"03Kwq.A.L1B.xuf10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2684 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 09:05:19 -0800 X-UIDL: cd6153e8d5169d745fb3e37159c70cf4 Ann Arbor, MI Dave White Tortoise Studio Productions mark sottilaro wrote: > Hey Loopers. > > Every once and a while I wonder if I'm near anyone on this list. Do you think > we could all give an email with a location to the list? That way we could all > get an idea of what kind of dispersion there is among us. > > I'm living in Syracuse NY at the moment. > > Later, > > Mark Sottilaro From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 00:14:17 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 2 14:04:40 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzTyi-000379-00; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 14:04:32 -0800 Message-ID: <2148EC143F29D1118BE000805FC13CD014CC15@migarexch01.maritz.com> From: "Liebig, Steuart A." To: "'Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com'" Subject: RE: TEST 29 Jan Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 11:12:55 -0600 X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) Resent-Message-ID: <"T_6mSB.A.uUB.dAk10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2717 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 14:04:32 -0800 X-UIDL: d97f087c5378bde5deee6e82a9e72541 > ---------- > From: David Myers > Reply To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com > Sent: Friday, January 30, 1998 10:18 PM > To: LiebigSA@maritz.com > Subject: TEST 29 Jan > > TEST 29 Jan > > > From ???@??? Mon Feb 02 12:44:58 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 2 09:33:14 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzPjx-0005wy-00; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 09:33:01 -0800 X-Sender: darcyc@srvr5.engin.umich.edu Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <98Feb2.115812est.18832@thicket.arbortext.com> References: <34D4D843.737C@isrv.com> <34D55E4A.C92AACD9@mailbox.syr.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 12:20:41 -0500 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Darcy Clark Subject: Re: Location. Resent-Message-ID: <"pktbZC.A.ZGE.KBg10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2688 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 09:33:01 -0800 X-UIDL: 7a61edfbc9dc6ac10672305636f9ac39 Ann Arbor, MI here also ! only been looping for about 6 months, but loving my jamman/vortex combo ;) Darcy Clark University of Michigan --------------------- >Ann Arbor, MI > >Dave White >Tortoise Studio Productions > >mark sottilaro wrote: > >> Hey Loopers. >> >> Every once and a while I wonder if I'm near anyone on this list. Do you >>think >> we could all give an email with a location to the list? That way we >>could all >> get an idea of what kind of dispersion there is among us. >> >> I'm living in Syracuse NY at the moment. >> >> Later, >> >> Mark Sottilaro Darcy Clark +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Materials Science and Engineering Department University of Michigan Ann Arbor, MI, 48109-2136 USA +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Room 2130, Dow Building Phone (734) 764 3377 Fax (734) 763 4788 E-mail darcyc@engin.umich.edu http://msewww.engin.umich.edu/mse250 http://msewww.engin.umich.edu/people/darcyc/ http://mseadmin.engin.umich.edu:591/ http://www-personal.engin.umich.edu/~darcyc/ +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ From ???@??? Mon Feb 02 12:45:06 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 2 10:17:05 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzQQV-0003kW-00; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 10:16:59 -0800 X-Sender: dmgraph@bway.net (Unverified) Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <199802021322.IAA14349@marconi.concentric.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 12:24:32 -0500 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: David Myers Subject: Re: Mackie product literature --was: Mackies and Loopers Resent-Message-ID: <"dGnsLD.A.cvB.Sog10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2694 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 10:16:59 -0800 X-UIDL: 1f69d0ce13ccfc5f93b6f0b06bef368d >Oh, and their owners manuals are a picture of clarity, without being >stuffy--actually humorous in stretches--NONE of these incomprehensible, >labored translations, e.g. "for bestest sound clearness, traffic wires >ending in XLR outlets give lasting shiny mix, Imperialist,round-eye . . ." > >No, Mackie DID NOT put me up to this--Yes, I wuv Mackie > >Tom >Tom Lambrecht hideo@concentric.net And when was the last time you got a manual that gave detailed instructions for doing mods on the unit to more accurately address your particular needs?! I also wuv my 1202 VLZ. I wondered if two effects sends would fulfill my deepest desires, but this puppy allows so many routing alternatives that I don't think I'll ever come up short. Support these guys. David Myers From ???@??? Mon Feb 02 12:45:07 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 2 10:17:11 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzQQd-0003lI-00; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 10:17:07 -0800 X-Sender: dmgraph@bway.net (Unverified) Message-Id: In-Reply-To: References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 12:24:32 -0500 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: David Myers Subject: Re: SIMMs Resent-Message-ID: <"lyLLVD.A.AwB.Wog10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2695 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 10:17:07 -0800 X-UIDL: def6cfa6ec0ada44ba5e775b1c271c7f >>More BTW: I just ordered more RAM to max out my Echoplex and discovered an >>interesting phenomenon. Several of the memory companies asked me, "what is >>it for?", and in one case I told them. They said, we sell so-and-so for >>samplers and music equipment--bottom line, the very same 30-pin SIMMs as >>for a Mac SE30, etc., but a jacked-up price. Reason? I dunno--maybe >>they've had music people return RAM more often? > >Try: "gee, musicians are actually dumb enough to believe that their sound >will be affected by the simms they use! Let's unload these expensive ones >that nobody else will buy." > >kim Kim: No doubt this is at play often, but my actual scenario was even weirder. The girl on the line actually admitted to me that they were selling the SAME SIMMs to computer people for $15, but as sampler memory the price was $25. SAME SIMMs. Wow. From ???@??? Mon Feb 02 12:44:59 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 2 09:44:05 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzPuZ-0007Kc-00; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 09:43:59 -0800 Date: 2 Feb 1998 17:26:33 -0000 Message-ID: <19980202172633.23808.qmail@omni1.voicenet.com> From: floyd@voicenet.com To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: location Resent-Message-ID: <"lCuI2.A.cqF.0Ng10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2689 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 09:43:59 -0800 X-UIDL: 2ded1dd70affbfdc13fe06a133e69a32 > Hey Loopers. > > Every once and a while I wonder if I'm near anyone on this list. > Do you think we could all give an email with a location to the list? > Valley Forge, PA. That's about 20 miles outside of Philadelphia, where George Washington and the Continental Army hid from the British not too long ago. From ???@??? Mon Feb 02 12:45:12 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 2 10:50:06 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzQwX-0000Dj-00; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 10:50:05 -0800 Message-Id: <215C1D5A0FFDD011B3CC00805FC18C291F6B8D@NTSRV2.LEXICON.COM> From: "Hogan, Greg (Exchange)" To: "'Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com'" Subject: RE: Re[2]: Selling stuff over the internet Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 12:34:39 -0500 X-Priority: 3 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) Content-Type: text/plain Resent-Message-ID: <"B3Dd_D.A.DUG.-Lh10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2699 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 10:50:05 -0800 X-UIDL: ed77de6e8662c1b3b82d417f77085c23 Dear Sean, It seems like your machine is confused. Try resetting it as follows:Warning! This will erase user registers and replace them with the presets. Power the unit on while holding the REGISTER/PRESET and A/B buttons. When the display reads "d" release these buttons. Press the REGISTER/PRESET button once. Turn the REGISTER/PRESET knob to 13, display reads "OC". Press the REGISTER/PRESET button once, display reads "PA". Press the REGISTER/PRESET button again. Turn the REGISTER/PRESET KNOB to 10, display reads "09". Press the REGISTER/PRESET button. Please let me know if you have any questions or if there is anything that I can do for you. Best regards, Greg Hogan Lexicon Customer Service Phone +781-280-0372 FAX +781-280-0499 > ---------- > From: buzzard@world.std.com[SMTP:buzzard@world.std.com] > Reply To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com > Sent: Friday, January 30, 1998 7:36 PM > To: GHogan@lexicon.com > Subject: Re: Re[2]: Selling stuff over the internet > > [buying used through the mail] > >Never have I had a bad piece of gear. > > Obviously this is anecdotal. Some people > won't get burned and some people will. > > I appear to have gotten burned with my > Vortex. It's possible that this problem > has only recently developed, but I'm quite > sure I'd never bothered trying this before. > > I finally (four months after buying it!) > decided to give its morphing capabilities > a work out--until now I just morphed between > existing patches. (And mostly I didn't > morph at all because I use it as a post-loop > processor.) > > So I was going to morph between a patch > and "itself" (a variant of itself), so I > copied the patch from an A register to > a B register. > > Lo and behold, I have discovered that this > Vortex flakes out on exactly this operation > (goodness knows this doesn't make any sense > as either a hardware problem or a software > problem, as far as I can see). If a patch > is copied from A to B, it comes out entirely > messed up (and non-musical) in B--generally > either extremely muted and in (apparent) mono, > or loud and horribly (digitally?) clipped, > generally in a different way in L & R channels, > or it self-oscillates in some way producing > very loud randomly squiggling unmusical noise. > Sometimes, switching away to another patch and > then back changes the mode of the behavior. > Powering the Vortex down and back up doesn't > make any difference. > > Copying from B to A does not exhibit this problem, > I believe. I'm not sure how exhaustive my > testing was at the time. Hmm, I'm not even > sure I ever copied from one B to another B. > > Anyway, obviously, for Vortex and Jamman > you've got to buy used. Caveat emptor, I > suppose. > > Sean Barrett > From ???@??? Mon Feb 02 12:45:00 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 2 09:55:44 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzQ5t-00012x-00; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 09:55:41 -0800 Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 09:37:13 -0800 Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Chris Chovit Subject: FS: Vortex & Ibanez delay Resent-Message-ID: <"YohP3C.A.uLH.wZg10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2690 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 09:55:41 -0800 X-UIDL: 4f283807049bbec8782ec3e520b708ca Here's some gear for sale: Lexicon Vortex: xlnt cond. w/ footswitch, cable, p/s & manual Ibanez DM-1000 digital delay, ~1 sec max delay time I'll take offers for ~ 1 week - chris From ???@??? Mon Feb 02 12:45:01 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 2 10:01:13 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzQB4-0001jv-00; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 10:01:02 -0800 Message-ID: From: "Ott, John" To: "'Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com'" Subject: RE:Fernandes guy at NAMM Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 11:49:51 -0600 X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) Resent-Message-ID: <"AV19SC.A.jc.Qeg10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2691 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 10:01:02 -0800 X-UIDL: 87a7ddedd96390813d6361a76db05379 >>>>quote>>> > From: Dpcoffin@aol.com > Reply To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com > Sent: Monday, February 2, 1998 4:42 PM > To: John_Ott@ATK.COM > Subject: Re: Re: Fernandes Sustainer > > <<>1) Is the Fernandes or any other sustainer available as a > retro-fit? > > Yes, but Fernandez charge a wallet-smasking 272UK for it ($400)!!!>> > Interesting...I asked the guy at the Fernandes NAMM booth about > retro-fits > and he said absolutely not, too complicated getting the thing set up > correctly and since it interacts with the bridge pickup, they couldn't > guarentee that it would work well with all other pickups. > dpc >>>>> end quote >>>> I think the Fernandes guy is clueless. I have a catalog from Fernandes that has the sustainer in it. Reeves Gabriel had one put in a Parker Nitefly, But had Ken Parker give him a body that was not fully milled. The standard Nitefly body is too thin to hold the sustainer. How do these sustainer sound? I've heard from guys that have tried some and said the pickup sound was not good. I notice that both Fripp and Gabriel don't use the sustainers for sound but use a Roland GK-2 pickup into a GR synth or VG-8 to get sounds. later John From ???@??? Mon Feb 02 12:45:03 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 2 10:15:31 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzQOy-0003YX-00; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 10:15:24 -0800 Message-ID: <000701bd3004$4d41c400$70da6f83@pt205.wolfson.cam.ac.uk> From: "Peter Thompson" To: Subject: Re: RE:Fernandes guy at NAMM Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 17:59:26 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Resent-Message-ID: <"EuINvC.A.fjB.6mg10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2692 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 10:15:24 -0800 X-UIDL: 87c7e618e7cadc247ab3acd084ddee86 I notice that > both Fripp and Gabriel don't use the sustainers for sound but > use a Roland GK-2 pickup into a GR synth or VG-8 to get > sounds. > > > later > John > > Robert Fripp is now using a Sustainer-equipped Fernandes Les Paul and has been at least since I saw King Crimson in London a couple of years ago. Pete From ???@??? Mon Feb 02 12:45:05 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 2 10:16:58 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzQQN-0003jU-00; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 10:16:51 -0800 From: Ahanning@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 13:00:25 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Different EBows Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 16-bit for Windows sub 38 Resent-Message-ID: <"WyjH3C.A.ssB._ng10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2693 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 10:16:51 -0800 X-UIDL: 64057bec5754e7f357099551dd7c017a Rumour has it they were going to be bringing about an Ebow kinda thing aimed at acoustic guitars sometime this year. Anyone else know anything about this? Alex From ???@??? Mon Feb 02 12:45:07 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 2 10:23:06 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzQWJ-0004V2-00; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 10:22:59 -0800 Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 11:08:20 -0700 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: dtapia@unoco.edu (Douglas Tapia) Subject: Re: mackie? vs. soundcraft... Resent-Message-ID: <"h3CbiB.A.lhC.cug10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2696 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 10:22:59 -0800 X-UIDL: 8e4f9c84053b4f9bfaaa2221b4e671fb >hello all, > sorry to jump in on a converstion, but in regard to the mackie vs >soundcraft thing: mackies are cheap, quiet and they have excellent customer >support. i highly reccomend them for settings where size, reliability and >money are concerns. they should be commended for great products. True. True. >But, they >just don't sound as good as your average soundcraft ( not the new plastic >boards, either). Sad, but also true. >i have owned and used lots of mackie gear and have no >complaints other than that the mic pre's sound thin. (oh come now, you're being very generous) >period. i dare you to >A/B them with any old soundcraft or MCI or API console. sorry, but i mostly >produce records for a living and think we shouldn't confuse reliability, >price and customer service (all very important) with plain good sound. of >course it is entirely subjective, but i've yet to hear otherwise from anyone >who has checked it out. All good points. My studio experience with the Mackie has been mostly positive, though the preamps don't have NEARLY enough gain. This is, in part, how Mackie achives such stellar specs. I've been working with a studio equiped with a 32x8 w/ a 24 chanel expander, and for most aplications, we have been bypassing the Mackie pres altogether, using the board only for tape returns. This means two racks full of Focusrite, Brent Averil, Grace, Summit Audio, and Avalon front end. So, in our application, the Mackie has saved no space over other consoles, though the clients are REALLY impressed by the front end. For what it's worth. . . Doug From ???@??? Mon Feb 02 12:45:31 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 2 11:31:16 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzRaI-0005WF-00; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 11:31:10 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Date: Mon, 02 Feb 1998 11:11:08 -0700 From: "frivolous" Message-ID: Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Sent-Mail: off X-Expiredinmiddle: true X-Mailer: MailCity Service Subject: Re: new Markus Reuter CD X-Sender-Ip: 194.88.91.135 Organization: MailExcite (http://www.mailexcite.com) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"G2xSBD.A.pgD._uh10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2703 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 11:31:10 -0800 X-UIDL: 5942f1e4c27b9bfd2677fd137e724150 --- >If you enjoy listening to ambient music in the tradition of Eno, Sylvian,= > >or Fripp, you will love Markus Reuter's first solo CD 'Taster'. (Markus i= >s >one of the few masters and teachers of the 8-string Warr Guitar. He is al= >so >known for his complex compositions and virtuoso playing with the Europa >String Choir.) > >'Taster' contains seven long ambient pieces recorded at a live concert. >Markus played his Warr Guitar, using a guitar synthesizer and two >unsynchronized loop delays for a technique he calls 'orchestral >soundscaping'. = > > >The result is a collection of utterly fascinating atmospheres - >crystal-clear minimalism, vast, slow spaces, completely void of new-age >pathos, but nonetheless extremely evocative and full of this rare thing >that is so difficult to achieve or describe - magic. > >Check out Markus' homepage at > > http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/mpeters/markus.htm > >-Michael Peters > > > I've just received a message from Markus about this, and I'm certainly looking forward to hearing it. I had the pleasure of meeting Markus at one of the "projeKCt one" concerts at the Jazz Cafe (Camden Town, London) last December, and he was carrying his Warr with him then... Funny you should mention Fripp: Amazing Sounds sent me this: "On February 19, the live multimedia concert Explorations in Space" will be held at the Langford Auditorium at Vanderbilt University in Nashville, USA. The headliner for the evening will be Robert Fripp and his Frippertronics." See you around (in a loop)... frivolous frivolous@mailexcite.com London, UK http://www.geocities.com/ResearchTriangle/Lab/3242/ See the XLChords project - MS Excel does chords? Free web-based email, Forever, From anywhere! http://www.mailexcite.com From ???@??? Mon Feb 02 12:45:08 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 2 10:35:59 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzQif-0006Bj-00; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 10:35:45 -0800 From: Fmplautus@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 13:22:41 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Simm sound Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 78 Resent-Message-ID: <"QGHJh.A.-WE.D9g10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2697 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 10:35:45 -0800 X-UIDL: 35611c4f154eaa27de67ae23dff063fa Kim wrote... "gee, musicians are actually dumb enough to believe that their sound will be affected by the simms they use! Let's unload these expensive ones that nobody else will buy." The LoOpDoctORs can here the difference between different batches of SIMMS in both the Echoplex and the Jammen. We've come to prefer the Vintage Malaysian Simms from 1994...buttery mids and clear, warm highs, kind of like taking a dip in a waterfall on the road to Mandalay. And we turned Eric Johnson onto the Duracels you know. Best, The LoOpDoctOrs From ???@??? Mon Feb 02 12:45:09 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 2 10:38:45 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzQlY-0006Ye-00; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 10:38:44 -0800 Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 11:27:13 -0700 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: dtapia@unoco.edu (Douglas Tapia) Subject: Re: mackie? vs. soundcraft... Resent-Message-ID: <"dFfhl.A.jyE.WAh10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2698 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 10:38:44 -0800 X-UIDL: 151b2df14beac61a36e4960d0575df07 >This summer, I convinced Chapman Stick artist Steve Hahn >(http://www.deepchocolate.com) that he needed a new mixer to replace his >antique Tascam. We tried out a borrowed Mackie (very good, but not as much >bang for your buck as...), my Carvin (a really good value, but I'm gonna be >replacing it with...) and finally a Behringer 2642. With the Behringer it >was like the clouds parted and the light came shining down. Initially I >was skeptical because they're made in China, but after six months of >reliable use in the studio and on the road Steve's a believer (and I'm off >the hook)--plus, we opened it up and the boards, traces, wave soldering, >point soldering, wiring harnesses, etc. are gorgeous. Not a cold joint or >dodgy-looking component to be found. > >I looked into a few others: Spirit and Peavey, to be precise. Yuk. >Flimsy, scratchy sounding faders. Yeah, they've always made crap, and they always will. >How's it sound? Transparent. He's using it with an ADAT-XT, and mixdowns >to DAT made via the 2642 sound pristine. The quality of the discrete >preamps is supa-fine, the EQ section is sweet and subtle, and the power >supply is rugged and isolated from the board (and thus your rack should you >choose to rackmount it. Most all of the 1/4" connections are balanced (and >all of the XLR conns are, of course), so you can do some long distance >runaround and not worry about the electric motor in the fog machine makin' >line noise. > >The local deal on it was 550 bones (USD). This sounds like a great deal, and I've never had a problem with Behringer's product. I DO have a problem with their politics. For Behringer, R&D seems to stand for Reverse-engineer and Deviate (just enough so they can't get sued for stealing their desings) The units are prototyped in Germany, and the production cycle is fine tuned. Then, Behringer engineers detool in Germany and tool up at plants in Asia where they can pay SKILLED solders (as your experience would support) and assembly workers a few cents an hour. Before I get on my Kathy Lee soap box, if this is the American way of doing business, count me out. Their products hit great price points. (Their version of the Ramsa 31 band EQ is great, (beautiful soft interface) and is dirt cheap, but I'd rather save myself the bad karma). Just thought that you ought to know. Doug From ???@??? Mon Feb 02 12:45:26 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 2 11:10:25 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzRG7-0002q6-00; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 11:10:19 -0800 Mime-Version: 1.0 Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 10:29:46 -0800 Message-ID: <000847EA.----@wj.com> From: Mike.Biffle@wj.com (Mike Biffle) Subject: Re[2]: location To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com, Mike.Biffle@wj.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Description: cc:Mail note part Resent-Message-ID: <"IOCY7B.A.emB.Cgh10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2700 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 11:10:19 -0800 X-UIDL: e6de15ae93037672f7ec45d5f528203e I Loop in the Santa Cruz area of Californ-eye-a. South of San Francisco. -Miko > Hey Loopers. > > Every once and a while I wonder if I'm near anyone on this list. > Do you think we could all give an email with a location to the list? > Valley Forge, PA. That's about 20 miles outside of Philadelphia, where George Washington and the Continental Army hid from the British not too long ago. From ???@??? Mon Feb 02 02:39:12 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 2 01:22:38 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzI5M-0007bv-00; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 01:22:36 -0800 Message-Id: <3.0.1.16.19980202105930.301fc8f0@rank-serv.elec.gla.ac.uk> X-Sender: pycraft@rank-serv.elec.gla.ac.uk X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.1 (16) Date: Mon, 02 Feb 1998 10:59:30 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: "Michael P. Hughes, Ph.D." Subject: Re: Re: Another NAMM Report In-Reply-To: <1503899.34d4c664@aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"aDRSZC.A.y3G.B_Y10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2656 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 01:22:36 -0800 X-UIDL: 9717f2d23dbbce07a3508944c452d10f >>> The New E-Bow has an octave-up switch... >>What? E-Bows set up a magnetic field which excites the string. It's the >string >>length and taughtness that controls the pitch not the magnetic field. Or am I >>missing something? That's what I used to think, but I gather I too was missing something... someone around here dirrected their EBow and found both sensor and exciter coils, so the EBow principle is not dissimilar to the way a Frenandez Sustainer works - picks up magnetic field, generates much bigger version of same. To those with whom I discussed building a sustainer system - I've built the trian cct, and am waiting to get the cash together to get the pickup built.... Michael From ???@??? Mon Feb 02 12:46:21 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 2 12:35:26 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzSaI-0006SR-00; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 12:35:14 -0800 Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 14:10:50 -0500 (EST) From: CORROSIVE@aol.com Message-ID: <980202141050_-962713431@mrin54> To: dwhite@arbortext.com, Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Re: Location. Resent-Message-ID: <"NrL4sC.A.IoE.Fui10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2708 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 12:35:14 -0800 X-UIDL: 5d31396eb470cc9a840338d4d7de27c6 I agree that it would be way cool to find other loopers in the same town to interact with... I'm in Portland, OR- anybody else here? From ???@??? Mon Feb 02 12:45:28 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 2 11:24:49 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzRTw-0004gM-00; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 11:24:36 -0800 Message-ID: From: David Kirkdorffer To: 'David Myers' , Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: What / who is on the forefront of looping music? Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 14:13:10 -0500 X-Priority: 1 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) Content-Type: text/plain Resent-Message-ID: <"z8KFW.A.W1C.wph10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2701 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 11:24:36 -0800 X-UIDL: bc338d8b333ff4294f4d08638dfcecae David Myers' observations of Fripp at the Bottom Line brings prompts me to ask a question of all my fellow loopists. I think in the contemporary art world, a great deal of the value conferred to a "piece" is derived from it's "moving forward" or expanding an idea beyond a previous state -- puns, meanings and craftsmanship aside. So, in that context, David Myers' complaints that Fripp's "new" soundscapes aren't all that new, nor are they really "moving forward" the greater looping "oeuvre" are quite valid. Granted, that may not be Fripp's Aim. While I guess confined to a Fripp-y world, Soundscapes, or as they are recently termed, Space Music, probably *are* an expansion of the Frippertronic idea. That said, I think Fripp's concerns while he is playing his loop-based music are more to do with the Process (of improvisation and surprises) and the Setting (breaking up the audience / artist separation), than any concerns with "art." Seems to me that's more Eno's territory. *So, just for giggles, it raises the question, what / who is on the forefront of "looping-based music"?* Somewhat an impossible question, but, maybe worth bashing around for a while. David Kirkdorffer -----Original Message----- From: David Myers [SMTP:dmgraph@bway.net] Sent: Sunday, February 01, 1998 3:07 AM To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Back in the Saddle Again Cripes, annihilist wouldn't let me in since Dec. 13th; my ISP just figured out how to fix the problem, whatever it was. Anyway, hope no one will mind my playing catchup a bit, posting about some older stuff, etc. What was really curious is that the day I was cut off was when I posted the following: ------------------------------------------ Robert at the Bottom Line Saturday night; saw the early show. I don't think even the people at TC Electronic or Eventide would have been pleased--this is all that can be done with 20 grand worth of gear? I kept wanting to shout, "OK, Bob, now HIT IT!". (Wouldn't have been out of place: LOTS of people were shouting.) It was like he was waiting for the right moment to break loose, but never did and never intended to--or didn't know how. I well realize that when you make a goof in a looping situation you are in deep trouble, but his timidity was appalling; 5 minutes of what we heard would have been impressive, but he more or less just let it limp along for two hours. I love everything Crimson has done, and the "Let The Power Fall"-type Frippertronics are kind of minimalist masterpieces, but listen to what somebody like Paul Dresher did on "Liquid and Stellar Music" many years ago and you begin to see that Fripp really doesn't have much to offer. Nor do I sense that he is even aware of Dresher, Terry Riley, etc.--or perhaps any work outside rock or the rock fringe. It seems that he believes he's doing something unprecedented. What he's doing that IS different is presenting a rather inept sort of ambient music to crowds which are largely unfamiliar with even Eno's "Discreet Music" (which this show was uncannily reminicent of), and pissing them off. I think 90% of this crowd expected "Red", and if I were one of them I'd be screaming, too. But I think this is part of what Robert wants to do: mess with people. He will call it "inviting them to expand their horizons" or some such thing, but it seems to me that it's mostly just self-indulgence. Yeah, the inevitable flashbulb went off--and so did Bob. He returned, but without the promised "Q & A" period afterward. I would have asked, "can we go now?". A technical speculation. Since all Fripp's sounds are synthesized (on this occasion he played two short phrases which just MIGHT have been actual guitar sounds), couldn't one forego the pricy TC audio looping and just feed MIDI info from the guitar into a looping sequencer? Then even more radical sound alterations would of course be possible (not to mention structural gymnastics), though the gee-whiz factor involved with a 6-foot-high rack of gear would be lost.... -------------------------------------------- BTW, I wanted to put in my .02 regarding a desert island looper's list: 1) Paul Dresher "Liquid and Stellar Music" 2) Terry Riley "A Rainbow in Curved Air" or "Descending Moonshine Dervishes" 3) Robert's "Let The Power Fall" or "Evening Star" w/ Eno 4) David Torn "Tripping Over God" (anyone have a copy of "What Means Solid" they'd like to sell?) 5) I agree that Sylvian's "Gone to Earth" is full of great looping-mostly Robert's doing, I think.... Also, I must say that you guys who can tolerate "Door X" must have a screw loose. What the hell was David thinking? Did you ever hear the albums on which even Herbie Hancock decided to sing? Please! -------------------------------------------- More BTW: I just ordered more RAM to max out my Echoplex and discovered an interesting phenomenon. Several of the memory companies asked me, "what is it for?", and in one case I told them. They said, we sell so-and-so for samplers and music equipment--bottom line, the very same 30-pin SIMMs as for a Mac SE30, etc., but a jacked-up price. Reason? I dunno--maybe they've had music people return RAM more often? Anyway, if you get this question concerning 30 pin SIMMs, just tell 'em it's for a Mac Classic or something. A place called Mohawk Memory sold me 4 meg SIMMs for $14 each. -David Myers From ???@??? Mon Feb 02 12:45:31 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 2 11:28:50 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzRXx-0005DI-00; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 11:28:45 -0800 Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 14:13:26 -0500 (EST) From: CORROSIVE@aol.com Message-ID: <980202141326_1107993386@mrin39.mx> To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Re: Different EBows Resent-Message-ID: <"CTiu2D.A.MPD.2sh10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2702 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 11:28:45 -0800 X-UIDL: a701b25358918fcf0ed28c8b05e1a56e I've been hearing rumors about a multiple string e bow for years now, but.... From ???@??? Mon Feb 02 12:45:39 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 2 11:43:54 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzRmM-00075n-00; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 11:43:38 -0800 Message-ID: <11ea01bd3011$45162b60$a7f1ffd0@default> From: "future perfect" To: Subject: Re: The new ebows Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 14:32:15 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Resent-Message-ID: <"wusLPC.A.9LF.A8h10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2704 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 11:43:38 -0800 X-UIDL: 41d03ee4ab726788643fcf20731857cf I use one of the old Ebows, they are not metal, but chrome colored plastic. Mine has the 'turns itself off' feature...when it gets close to a string, or any piece of metal, it turns on...when you pull it away, it turns off. It works out fine, unless its laying around in your gig bag and it comes in contact with metal, turns itself on, and when you try to use it, the battery is dead. Fortunately, the Ebow folks sold these with the coolest leather case ever, complete with belt clip and tooled 'EBow' on the side. The case looks like it cost more than the device itself.Yes, the response is slow, but like I said, nothing you can't get used to. I kinda like this, although I must admit that I haven't tried any of the newer ones. And you can't beat the cool-o chrome color-easier for people to see and say 'what the hell is that??' Dave Eichenberger ********************************************************************* 'Future Perfect' - progressive art music - visit our website at: http://www.geocities.com/SoHo/Lofts/8082 >Anybody ever have on of the old, metal chassis Ebows? I just can't get >mine to sound as good a Daniel Ash's (it must be the gear, right? >Right?) From ???@??? Mon Feb 02 12:45:40 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 2 11:53:44 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzRvq-0000XM-00; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 11:53:26 -0800 From: "Siobhan Canty" To: "Loopers Delight" Subject: Loopers Website Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 14:35:11 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <19351216705599@cfpa.org> Resent-Message-ID: <"F20rkB.A.SeG.QGi10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2705 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 11:53:26 -0800 X-UIDL: d8a6ce2199fed1c1aec718c630638389 Does anyone know of a reason why I would not be able to connect to the looper website recently? Up until a couple days ago, I had no problem viewing it, but for the last couple days, I get a "connot connect to server" message. And I get other websites just fine! TIA From ???@??? Mon Feb 02 12:45:44 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 2 12:15:06 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzSGm-0003Yc-00; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 12:15:04 -0800 Message-ID: <124801bd3015$a4bc6b20$a7f1ffd0@default> From: "future perfect" To: Subject: Re: Loopers Website Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 15:03:33 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Resent-Message-ID: <"BlNq1D.A.yhB.8Yi10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2706 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 12:15:04 -0800 X-UIDL: a626245d30d106035461147d28f9fce0 >Does anyone know of a reason why I would not be able to connect to the >looper website recently? Ive had the same problem... Dave Eichenberger ********************************************************************* 'Future Perfect' - progressive art music - visit our website at: http://www.geocities.com/SoHo/Lofts/8082 From ???@??? Mon Feb 02 12:45:45 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 2 12:16:11 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzSHj-0003gS-00; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 12:16:03 -0800 X-Sender: nicomonguzzi@mail.vtx.ch Message-Id: In-Reply-To: References: <19980202140316125.AAA92@LARCH.interagp.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 21:05:02 +0100 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: "nicomonguzzi" Subject: Re: desert island disk: Jesus Blood Never Failed Me Yet Resent-Message-ID: <"vRCMqB.A.SqB.vZi10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2707 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 12:16:03 -0800 X-UIDL: 404777261cec938c3daeef43b327b72b Can you please give me the name of the piece of John Dowland you're talking about ? thanks nicos >I suppose I am stretching the definition of looping to an extreme here, >but the repetition of a musical figure or harmonic progression is a >standard device in classical, if not orchestral music. Think of Bach's >Chaconne in D minor, Pachelbel's Canon, Ravel's Bolero etc. There is a >piece for solo lute by John Dowland (ca 1600) which consists of a repeated >descending chromatic scale around which he weaves various harmonic and >melodic threads. If only he'd had a JamMan.... > >Peter Thompson From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 00:14:01 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 2 12:51:44 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzSq4-0000vl-00; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 12:51:32 -0800 From: Texture444@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 15:21:19 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Re: Re: Different EBows Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 84 Resent-Message-ID: <"GEGX-B.A._MH.DAj10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2710 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 12:51:33 -0800 X-UIDL: 42fa6d809c7a53d1fe958856c0c03605 once upon a time, steinberger sound (via gibson corp's mgmt & dough) funded the building of a prototype guitar (by bob wolstein) w/selectably polyphonic, in-built string drivers (ie, "e-bows"). (an additional groovic feature that was worked on was the ability to sweep through the natural harmonic series, w/a knobule.) me & henry kaiser (& david lindley, methinks) shared this steinberger guitar for a while; i had it for about 5 or 6 months. it was a little clunky (used an outboard power-thingy & attaching cable), but: it rocked!, and had enormous potential..... i used it on the eponymous "mark isham" recording for virgin (which won a grammy, in 1990?), and on the film score for columbia pictures' "the beast". anyway: insofar as i know (& much to ned steinberger's great chagrin), mr. henry j. @ gibson stopped the project before completion; i believe that after a year transpired, ownership rights were supposed to revert to the estimable mr. wolstein. just a l'il tale, for ya's..... best, david torn From ???@??? Mon Feb 02 12:46:21 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 2 12:37:28 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzScP-0006ls-00; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 12:37:25 -0800 Message-ID: <34D62C7C.2D3ED31B@bellsouth.net> Date: Mon, 02 Feb 1998 15:28:44 -0500 From: Jeff Duke Reply-To: jmar@bellsouth.net Organization: Tec Bab Labs X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Loopers Website References: <19351216705599@cfpa.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"R790rD.A.TBF.pwi10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2709 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 12:37:25 -0800 X-UIDL: edd85f0d5dc8a97ab9e39c3573c1ed4e I am also having the same prob.No answers. jeff Siobhan Canty wrote: > Does anyone know of a reason why I would not be able to connect to the > looper website recently? Up until a couple days ago, I had no problem > viewing it, but for the last couple days, I get a "connot connect to > server" message. And I get other websites just fine! TIA From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 00:14:06 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 2 13:33:22 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzTUV-0006OY-00; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 13:33:19 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: location & Loopers' CD Message-ID: <19980202.154236.4951.0.DOINA@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 1.38 X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 0-27 From: doina@juno.com (paparuda o o) Date: Mon, 02 Feb 1998 15:44:22 EST Resent-Message-ID: <"iqWQjC.A.ZiE.Gkj10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2715 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 13:33:19 -0800 X-UIDL: 7b9ffd1a9c14ba304f4bb0d8fd36ca28 >On Mon, 02 Feb 1998 00:48:57 Mark Sottilaro writes: >Do you think we could all give an email with a location? >That way we could all get an idea of what kind >of dispersion there is among us. yeah! even more, i would actually like to meet other loopers; i don't know anyone around here. also, i'd like to listen to other loopers' music, to see how they use the tools (mine is a Plex). i'm sure someone ou'there uses some tricks that i never thought of. that's why i asked previously if anyone has a copy of the first Loopers' CD; to "compare" my use of the machine with other "advanced" users, to see if i'm doing justice to all the work Matthias, Kim and Eric have put into the Plex. 'cause i believe in the VALUE of "things" that is not measured in PRICE. ...and, why not, to "steal" some "tricks of the trade" from the masters. it's seems to me that most of the loopers are into "ambient" instrumental music. i think i'm just using loops to replace other voices in the choir and to create vocal compositions in which i do all the parts live. so, please, if you have a copy of the "loopers CD", or would like to share your (COPYRIGHT protected) looped music can you let me know? many thanks to David Myers for the Mohawk Memory info Paparuda in Hartford, Connecticut. _____________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 00:14:03 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 2 13:11:51 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzT9b-0003UP-00; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 13:11:43 -0800 Message-Id: <2.2.32.19980202204951.009b3328@pop.chromatic.com> X-Sender: kflint@pop.chromatic.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 2.2 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 02 Feb 1998 12:49:51 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Kim Flint Subject: Re: Loopers Website Resent-Message-ID: <"d6EODB.A.mDC.xQj10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2712 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 13:11:43 -0800 X-UIDL: f0aa6e1a50e47e7bd303c1e521ada7fd My ISP is looking into the problem, hopefully it will be back up in a couple of hours. thanks for letting me know. (although, for future reference, it's usually a lot faster to alert me to such problems by emailing me directly at kflint@annihilist.com) kim At 03:28 PM 2/2/98 -0500, Jeff Duke wrote: >I am also having the same prob.No answers. >jeff > >Siobhan Canty wrote: > >> Does anyone know of a reason why I would not be able to connect to the >> looper website recently? Up until a couple days ago, I had no problem >> viewing it, but for the last couple days, I get a "connot connect to >> server" message. And I get other websites just fine! TIA > > > > > > _______________________________________________________ Kim Flint 408-752-9284 Mpact Systems Engineering kflint@chromatic.com Chromatic Research http://www.chromatic.com From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 00:14:02 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 2 13:09:47 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzT7d-0003A8-00; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 13:09:41 -0800 From: Fmplautus@aol.com Message-ID: <313e3577.34d6328e@aol.com> Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 15:54:36 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Location. Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 78 Resent-Message-ID: <"AsAp6D.A.bjB.yMj10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2711 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 13:09:41 -0800 X-UIDL: f38947745ef56040e15b2c63ad1982e4 The LoOpDoctOrs practice their medicine, including "loopendectomies" in Ashland, Oregon. From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 00:14:07 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 2 13:34:50 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzTVq-0006bd-00; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 13:34:42 -0800 Message-Id: <2.2.32.19980202205525.00a34c6c@pop.chromatic.com> X-Sender: kflint@pop.chromatic.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 2.2 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 02 Feb 1998 12:55:25 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com, dwhite@arbortext.com, Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Kim Flint Subject: Re: Re: Location. Resent-Message-ID: <"t2iih.A.ssE.Dlj10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2716 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 13:34:42 -0800 X-UIDL: d2e563fb948b687bbae2c87c99f5fd29 This is exactly the point of the "Loopers of the World" section of the Looper's Delight website. It contains profiles of people from all over the world, with descriptions of their styles, background, contact info, gear, etc. At this time, we are automating this section so it will be easy for people to add and modify their profiles. This should be done in a week or so, if you don't have your profile up there yet wait until the new page is ready. This is being set up Chris Chovit and Michael Peters, who have been amazing and brilliant in making it happen. Massive thanks to them! We'll announce the new version as soon as it's ready. In the mean time, feel free to browse the many profiles from other loopers. It's a great way to learn about some of the other people here. (well, you might have to wait a few hours until my ISP get's my domain name back online.....) kim At 02:10 PM 2/2/98 -0500, CORROSIVE@aol.com wrote: >I agree that it would be way cool to find other loopers in the same town to >interact with... I'm in Portland, OR- anybody else here? > > > _______________________________________________________ Kim Flint 408-752-9284 Mpact Systems Engineering kflint@chromatic.com Chromatic Research http://www.chromatic.com From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 00:14:50 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 2 17:03:21 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzWla-0003q4-00; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 17:03:10 -0800 Message-ID: <2148EC143F29D1118BE000805FC13CD014CC1D@migarexch01.maritz.com> From: "Liebig, Steuart A." To: "'Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com'" Subject: RE: mackie? vs. soundcraft... Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 14:58:41 -0600 X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) Resent-Message-ID: <"rGA3jD.A.43B.Ynm10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2730 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 17:03:10 -0800 X-UIDL: 488b9e568556a6f4bd751694f5d008fe Well, just to add more fuel to this partcular fire . . . The unfortunate reality is that A LOT of companies do business this way (even to the extent of using slave labor in China!?!?!?). Next time you buy your groovy running shoes, check it out. Even worse from my perspective (being a dad) is that it is extremely hard to get kids' toys or clothes that aren't made in China- talk about Karma . . . (p.s. uncle Bill didn't need to get bribed by the Chinese for MFN status, American business took care of that . . . .) > >The local deal on it was 550 bones (USD). > > This sounds like a great deal, and I've never had a problem with > Behringer's product. I DO have a problem with their politics. For > Behringer, R&D seems to stand for Reverse-engineer and Deviate (just > enough > so they can't get sued for stealing their desings) > > The units are prototyped in Germany, and the production cycle is fine > tuned. Then, Behringer engineers detool in Germany and tool up at > plants > in Asia where they can pay SKILLED solders (as your experience would > support) and assembly workers a few cents an hour. > > Before I get on my Kathy Lee soap box, if this is the American way of > doing > business, count me out. Their products hit great price points. (Their > version of the Ramsa 31 band EQ is great, (beautiful soft interface) > and is > dirt cheap, but I'd rather save myself the bad karma). Just thought > that > you ought to know. > > Doug > > > From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 00:14:05 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 2 13:23:58 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzTLH-00055X-00; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 13:23:47 -0800 Mime-Version: 1.0 Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 13:08:45 -0800 Message-ID: <00084B1A.----@wj.com> From: Mike.Biffle@wj.com (Mike Biffle) Subject: Process vs. Theory- was, Who's on the forefront of loopmuse To: "'David Myers'" , Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com, David Kirkdorffer Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Description: cc:Mail note part Resent-Message-ID: <"jiqZ3.A.6eD.ebj10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2714 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 13:23:47 -0800 X-UIDL: a9a552a586f73178858816b795bab3a6 David Kirkdorffer wrote... >I think in the contemporary art world, a great deal of the value >conferred to a "piece" is derived from it's "moving forward" or >expanding an idea beyond a previous state -- puns, meanings and >craftsmanship aside. Interesting comment David. When my wife was in the MFA graduate program at CCAC (California College of Arts and Crafts in Oakland, CA.) There was often this debate over Theory and continuous dialog (often just one upmanship) versus "Process" and being true to process. >So, in that context, David Myers' complaints that Fripp's "new" >soundscapes aren't all that new, nor are they really "moving forward" >the greater looping "oeuvre" are quite valid. >Granted, that may not be Fripp's Aim. While I guess confined to a >Fripp-y world, Soundscapes, or as they are recently termed, Space Music, Space Music!!!!??? We were calling our improvs Space Music in 1971!! Boy that really does break gound! (I mean wind.) 8-> >probably *are* an expansion of the Frippertronic idea. That said, I >think Fripp's concerns while he is playing his loop-based music are more >to do with the Process (of improvisation and surprises) and the Setting >(breaking up the audience / artist separation), than any concerns with >"art." My take on it regarding Fripp is this... Robert Fripp has been described by people like Bowie and Sylvian as working "very fast" and not being all that concerned with lots of takes and polishing the piece, etc. He likes to live with the results of his first or true reactions to a given musical moment. His ongoing experiments with his solo work seem to involve this "set and setting" sort of process. That being an interactive relationship with equipment, personal being, environment and audience. Not necessarily the best location to devolop a theory oriented "thesis" type of quantum leap in thought and execution. I don't believe any of his lectures and early stage exits are performance art oriented. They are practical measures he uses only to illustrate better what he's trying to accomplish. As much as I dislike his lectures to the audience, I do tend to agree with his process. He's probably taken so much crap from people that he's more stubborn in his formalistic way than ever. And I'm not sure I can blame him for that. It seems that process oriented work involves a lot of trust and a belief that you will learn and grow as much from disastrous outcomes as well as successes in the "process". Nothing is a finished piece in that they all represent only a moment in time. Next time around... Who knows? Does a process oriented approach keep you more humble? and about art? >Seems to me that's more Eno's territory. Sounds good to me... Although I've heard Eno and others describe some of his studio behavior, and he still sounds fairly process oriented. >*So, just for giggles, it raises the question, what / who is on the >forefront of "looping-based music"?* >David Kirkdorffer Good question! I better get my VISA out and buy a few more CD's! I live in a pretty tight vacuum at the moment. David Myers earlier comments... >>Robert at the Bottom Line Saturday night; saw the early show. I >>don't think even the people at TC Electronic or Eventide would have >>been pleased--this is all that can be done with 20 grand worth of >>gear? I kept wanting to shout, "OK, Bob, now HIT IT!". (Wouldn't have been >>out of place: LOTS of people were shouting.) It was like he was >>waiting for the right moment to break loose, but never did and never intended >>to--or didn't know how. I well realize that when you make a goof in a looping >>situation you are in deep trouble, but his timidity was appalling; 5 >>minutes of what we heard would have been impressive, but he more or less just >>let it limp along for two hours. >>I love everything Crimson has done, and the "Let The Power >>Fall"-type Frippertronics are kind of minimalist masterpieces, but listen >>to what somebody like Paul Dresher did on "Liquid and Stellar Music" >>many years ago and you begin to see that Fripp really doesn't have much to >>offer. Nor do I sense that he is even aware of Dresher, Terry Riley, etc.--or >>perhaps any work outside rock or the rock fringe. It seems that he believes >>he's doing something unprecedented. What he's doing that IS different is >>presenting a rather inept sort of ambient music to crowds which are largely >>unfamiliar with even Eno's "Discreet Music" (which this show was uncannily >>reminicent of), and pissing them off. I think 90% of this crowd expected >>"Red", and if I were one of them I'd be screaming, too. But I think this >>is part of what Robert wants to do: mess with people. He will call it >>"inviting them to expand their horizons" or some such thing, but it seems to >>me that it's mostly just self-indulgence. >>Yeah, the inevitable flashbulb went off--and so did Bob. He returned, >>butwithout the promised "Q & A" period afterward. I would have asked, "can wego >>now?". >>-David Myers Wow David... I'll bet you're in for a roast! I saw Fripp waaayyyy back at Madame Wongs on his first Frippertronics tour (1976 or so?) when he was carting around a couple of Revoxes. After an incredibly long wait outside, we were the treated to a long lecture about audience responsibility and his particular rules about tape recorders and cameras etc. I saw about 1/2 hour of that and left. He did more to spoil the magic of hearing his music than any flashbulb might have. I truly was looking forward to seeing him, and went away disturbed that the event was so entirely uncomfortable. Not in any mind-stretching avante-garde way, but just physically and mentally overbearing. In more recent Soundscapes concerts, as impressive as I think they are, I've often wished he'd just let it rip, if only for a moment or so. How about responsibility to your audience Robert? I'll meet you half way. Now I've done it. I'll see you in hell David Myers! -Miko From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 00:14:04 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 2 13:22:45 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzTK4-0004so-00; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 13:22:32 -0800 Message-Id: <199802022114.OAA02379@hyper.dimensional.com> From: "Scott Bullerwell" To: Subject: Re: mackie? vs. soundcraft... Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 14:09:15 -0700 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"aJeWxD.A.VTD.Xaj10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2713 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 13:22:32 -0800 X-UIDL: 0d60904594dc73866d9ece0db9cbdfd0 Doug wrote: > This sounds like a great deal, and I've never had a problem with > Behringer's product. I DO have a problem with their politics. For > Behringer, R&D seems to stand for Reverse-engineer and Deviate (just enough > so they can't get sued for stealing their desings) > > The units are prototyped in Germany, and the production cycle is fine > tuned. Then, Behringer engineers detool in Germany and tool up at plants > in Asia where they can pay SKILLED solders (as your experience would > support) and assembly workers a few cents an hour. > > Before I get on my Kathy Lee soap box, if this is the American way of doing > business, count me out. Their products hit great price points. (Their > version of the Ramsa 31 band EQ is great, (beautiful soft interface) and is > dirt cheap, but I'd rather save myself the bad karma). Just thought that > you ought to know. Agreed. I mentioned this before when someone asked for a reccomendation on a compressor. I don't pretend to be up on the human rights in China issue (certainly the military--under the trade name Norinco--does run most manufacturing) but the story on Behringer's engineering chickanery is long and dirty. They've been sued (successfully) by Aphex for copping the exciter's circuitry, and by Mackie for stealing circuit board designs. In the Mackie case, I have heard that the clincher was that the Behringer had a printed circuit board on it with an error that was identical to the error on the Mackie board in question. Oops. Now Behringer's been accused of copying the capsule from (if I remember correctly) the Neumann microphone. However, if I place the art vs. ethics consideration aside for a moment I'm sorely tempted to buy myself a Behringer 2642. As for politics--Greg Mackie is a Deadhead, something I find morally repugnant ;-) but I'd still consider buying his products. Scott From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 00:14:21 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 2 14:19:41 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzUDK-000584-00; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 14:19:38 -0800 Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 15:04:36 -0700 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: dtapia@unoco.edu (Douglas Tapia) Subject: Re: To BEhringer or not to BEhringer Resent-Message-ID: <"rb2BWD.A.AAD.RMk10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2719 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 14:19:38 -0800 X-UIDL: 162c6c53117e51bcc4d9269ad67ca67d They've been sued (successfully) by Aphex for copping the >exciter's circuitry, and by Mackie for stealing circuit board designs. In >the Mackie case, I have heard that the clincher was that the Behringer had >a printed circuit board on it with an error that was identical to the error >on the Mackie board in question. Oops. Now Behringer's been accused of >copying the capsule from (if I remember correctly) the Neumann microphone. One thing I'll say for Behringer, they pick good stuff to copy, eh? >However, if I place the art vs. ethics consideration aside for a moment I'm >sorely tempted to buy myself a Behringer 2642. As for politics--Greg >Mackie is a Deadhead, something I find morally repugnant ;-) but I'd still >consider buying his products. This is true. I would never look down on somone for buying good Behringer products at good prices. These are personal decisions, and everyone must find his/her own path. It strikes me as funny that all of a sudden, Mackie has become another BIG company in a lawsuit pitted against someone infringing on their territory. (Remember when Mackie was the little upstart that was going to kick everyone's butts? They ARE corporate America now!) As for Greg's being a Deadhead, I am inclined to agree with you, but if we refused to by technology from former associates of the Dead we'd have no Meyer, no Alembic, no Gamble consoles, no Crown derivitive mics. . . Guess The Dead were kinda like the Microsoft of the Music biz. We all use products pioneered in their ranks, but we don't like to be reminded of that fact very often. From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 00:14:43 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 2 16:06:21 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzVsa-0003uk-00; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 16:06:20 -0800 Message-ID: <2148EC143F29D1118BE000805FC13CD014CC1E@migarexch01.maritz.com> From: "Liebig, Steuart A." To: "'Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com'" Subject: RE: location & Loopers' CD Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 16:18:24 -0600 X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) Resent-Message-ID: <"LMyMvC.A.MDC.dxl10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2727 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 16:06:20 -0800 X-UIDL: f493112c828e93705b143f29c8fbdece steuart liebig culver city, ca (basically l.a.) > ---------- > From: doina@juno.com > Reply To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com > Sent: Monday, February 2, 1998 1:33 PM > To: LiebigSA@maritz.com > Subject: location & Loopers' CD > > > >On Mon, 02 Feb 1998 00:48:57 Mark Sottilaro writes: > >Do you think we could all give an email with a location? > >That way we could all get an idea of what kind > >of dispersion there is among us. > > yeah! even more, i would actually like to meet other loopers; > i don't know anyone around here. also, i'd like to listen to > other loopers' music, to see how they use the tools (mine is a Plex). > i'm sure someone ou'there uses some tricks that i never > thought of. that's why i asked previously if anyone has a copy > of the first Loopers' CD; to "compare" my use of the machine > with other "advanced" users, to see if i'm doing justice to > all the work Matthias, Kim and Eric have put into the Plex. > 'cause i believe in the VALUE of "things" that is not > measured in PRICE. ...and, why not, to "steal" some > "tricks of the trade" from the masters. > it's seems to me that most of the loopers are into "ambient" > instrumental music. i think i'm just using loops to replace > other voices in the choir and to create vocal compositions > in which i do all the parts live. > so, please, if you have a copy of the "loopers CD", or > would like to share your (COPYRIGHT protected) looped music > can you let me know? > > many thanks to David Myers for the Mohawk Memory info > > Paparuda in Hartford, Connecticut. > > _____________________________________________________________________ > You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. > Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com > Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] > > From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 00:14:22 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 2 14:23:42 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzUHE-0005fe-00; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 14:23:40 -0800 Message-ID: <34D64647.56@dmans.com> Date: Mon, 02 Feb 1998 16:18:47 -0600 From: "Mikell D. Nelson" Reply-To: mnelson@dmans.com Organization: Boomerang Musical Products X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (Win95; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Any Hot News? / where was Boomerang? References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"VLqRkD.A.0jD.bQk10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2720 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 14:23:40 -0800 X-UIDL: 00be89f56cceec13541d6750328be599 Kim Flint wrote: > > Well, I didn't see Boomerang at the show. I was all over it, and they're > not in the directory, so presumably they weren't there. Motley? Where were > you? I didn't see them last year, either. The two Texas Rangsters are alive and well; business is booming, no pun intended. But... we haven't been to NAMM since 1996. We attended that year and spent a lot of money and energy with very little to show for it, so the bitter taste is still in our mouth. One acquaintance mentioned the 3 year plan: year 1 - they notice you, year 2 - they are reassured that you are still in business, and year 3 - they think maybe you're on to something and a buy a few units. Maybe this is how it goes. :^} Does anybody in the biz have opinions about the summer NAMM show in Nashville? Is it not worth going because it's small and poorly attended or is it better for the small guy, especially accessories, because it's focused and you can have more of each store owner's time? Motley at Boomerang Musical Products From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 00:14:38 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 2 15:40:56 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzVTy-0000ej-00; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 15:40:54 -0800 From: Paolo Valladolid Message-Id: <199802022222.OAA10883@waynesworld.ucsd.edu> Subject: Re: Re: Re: Different EBows To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 14:22:17 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: from "Texture444@aol.com" at Feb 2, 98 03:21:19 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"uTLR6.A.GCH.0el10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2723 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 15:40:54 -0800 X-UIDL: f05ff45f18e032f254374a90135d490c > once upon a time, steinberger sound (via gibson corp's mgmt & dough) funded > the building of a prototype guitar (by bob wolstein) w/selectably polyphonic, > in-built string drivers (ie, "e-bows"). > (an additional groovic feature that was worked on was the ability to sweep > through the natural harmonic series, w/a knobule.) > me & henry kaiser (& david lindley, methinks) shared this steinberger guitar > for a while; i had it for about 5 or 6 months. > it was a little clunky (used an outboard power-thingy & attaching cable), but: > it rocked!, and had enormous potential..... Was this guitar the realization of your "idea" mentioned in a 1987 Electronic Musician article? You said you had an idea involving a hex pickup and a way to get synthesized sounds without the inconveniences of pitch-to-MIDI tracking, but that you couldn't talk about it at the time. Or was your idea more along the lines of what is embodied today in the Roland VG-8 (a hexaphonic digital signal processor) ? If you can't respond, that's cool too. I'm just curious. Cheers, Paolo Valladolid --------------------------------------------------------------- |Moderator of Digital Guitar Digest, an Internet mailing list |\ |for Music Technology and Stringed Instruments | \ ---------------------------------------------------------------- | \ finger pvallado@waynesworld.ucsd.edu for more info \ | \ http://waynesworld.ucsd.edu/DigitalGuitar/home.html \| ----------------------------------------------------------------- From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 00:14:24 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 2 14:38:46 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzUVo-0007jD-00; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 14:38:44 -0800 Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 17:24:34 -0500 From: buzzard@world.std.com (Sean T Barrett) Message-Id: <199802022224.AA17239@world.std.com> To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: vortex woes Resent-Message-ID: <"Jz9TFD.A.BhF.Hfk10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2721 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 14:38:44 -0800 X-UIDL: 2516cd451e15955c1511e3153fda4f83 VORTEX SPECIFIC! This is not the loop email you're looking for. Move along. Greg Hogan wrote: >It seems like your machine is confused. Try resetting it as >follows:Warning! This will erase user registers and replace them with >the presets. Thanks, Greg. It was worth a shot. Actually, before I did this, I did a little further investigation than before, and found that things were not as bad as I had thought. Whereas I had thought that all A->B copies were bad (based on 2 out of 2 samples), further investigation showed that it seems to be limited to certain patches. Resetting it did not, however, fix the problem. If someone else with a Vortex wants to check if this is a general Vortex bug, not specific to my machine, that would be cool. (Either one seems plausible at the moment.) The most consistent behavior is as follows: Turn the volume down on whatever the Vortex is feeding Copy PRESET 14A to register 14B (you'll destroy your 14B... you could try a different register of course, but it _seems_ like it has to be to a B register) Turn the knob away and back to 14 (leaving B selected). At least nine times out of ten that produces continuous high-volume noise (self-oscillation?) on my Vortex. Sean Barrett From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 00:14:25 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 2 14:40:54 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzUXs-0000EJ-00; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 14:40:52 -0800 Message-ID: <34D64848.6E46@dmans.com> Date: Mon, 02 Feb 1998 16:27:20 -0600 From: "Mikell D. Nelson" Reply-To: mnelson@dmans.com Organization: Boomerang Musical Products X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (Win95; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: zoom effects units/vocoding References: <34D5E1DA.8581BD7D@scee.sony.co.uk> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"hotc1B.A.Z4F.shk10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2722 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 14:40:52 -0800 X-UIDL: a9a128430f170a128a30f1af86a10f2d > Anyone ever combined looping with vocoding? I'm wondering what would > happen if you vocoded a loop with itself, somehow.... > Os, You sick pig, you! What a cool thought. I don't have a vocoder. Someone please try this and give a report. Motley From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 00:15:01 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 2 18:26:31 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzY4A-0007k4-00; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 18:26:26 -0800 Message-Id: <3.0.2.16.19980202143153.2187a65e@texas.net> X-Sender: sharkey@texas.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.2 (16) Date: Mon, 02 Feb 1998 14:31:53 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: james rhodes Subject: Re: Desert Island Discs/ Car CD player choices In-Reply-To: <34D28DAF.298B@earthlink.net> References: <002301bd2d7a$d3157220$70da6f83@pt205.wolfson.cam.ac.uk> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"twcK5.A.28F.H4n10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2733 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 18:26:26 -0800 X-UIDL: 6fee2da33291336d369a46f2bf0de9d0 thought i might suggest some VERY fine choices,,,when space is minimal. Looping Type: 1) Bill Nelson- "Chance Encounters in the Garden of Lights" 2) Steve Reich-"Sextet" 3) Woob- "1194" 4) David Sylvian & Holger Czukay- "Plight and Premonition" Non-Looping type: 1) Bruford-"One of a KInd" 2) Naked City-"Radio" 3) Lounge Lizards- "Voice of Chunk" 4) the Jesus Lizard- "Liar" 5) Rain Tree Crow and to those who are raggin "Door X",,,it really has some nice tunes from track 6 on...its not THAT bad....not as hip as Polytown,,,but not much is,, james From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 00:14:41 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 2 15:50:46 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzVdQ-0001uN-00; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 15:50:40 -0800 From: ENAT21213@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 18:25:53 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Location/MABEY YOU CAN HELP US?. Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 64 Resent-Message-ID: <"-HzjOB.A.KL.nil10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2725 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 15:50:40 -0800 X-UIDL: b394eb7438535d698735b0b2337c6458 Hello everyone, I loop in Myrtle Beach,South Carolina. I perform with electric bird noise which is basically my solo gig but once in a while ebn does perform as a duo.We are looking into doing a tour of the northeast around April/May.I noticed there are quite a few of you on this list that reside in the northeast region.We are seeking information on clubs,coffehouses,anywere that may be loop friendly.Basically we'll play for gas money(a place to crash would also be nice).We have a promo pack/demo we could send you/clubs/etc. We play often (mostly clubs)and have a pretty good following here in our neck of the woods(the southeast).Any loopers interested in playing the southeast?Contact us we can help. Any information or help from you guys would be greatly appeciated. thanks, Brian McKenzie ENAT21213@aol.com From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 00:14:41 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 2 16:04:26 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzVqa-0003eQ-00; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 16:04:16 -0800 Message-Id: <2.2.32.19980202233202.009a15f8@pop.chromatic.com> X-Sender: kflint@pop.chromatic.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 2.2 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 02 Feb 1998 15:32:02 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Kim Flint Subject: Re: location & Loopers' CD Resent-Message-ID: <"oforaD.A.FzB.Uvl10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2726 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 16:04:16 -0800 X-UIDL: 590e04457e95e2116c34b42f1902f219 At 03:44 PM 2/2/98 EST, paparuda o o wrote: > >yeah! even more, i would actually like to meet other loopers; I think that is generally a great idea, and probably my biggest motivation for creating this whole monster of an internet address! Get together! Collaborate! Share ideas! Real-live or Virtual! Go forth and Multiply! (pun intended there....) >it's seems to me that most of the loopers are into "ambient" >instrumental music. I'm not. In fact, I'm morally opposed to being an ambient musician. What others choose to do with their lives is their own business, but I resolutely refuse to have anything to do with this ambient stuff. I'm deeply offended by any implication that being into looping means I'm ambient. I'm proud of my long history here resisting the ambient tyranny that threatens to overcome all other loopists! I will also continue to resist shameless idol worship of this Fripp fellow. Soundscapes, poundcakes. Not for me! of course, neither of those is as sick as being a deadhead. Those maniacs are actually planning to open a Grateful Dead theme park in San Francisco. The apocalypse will arrive none too soon. this, of course, gets many smiley's: :-) :-) :-) :-) :-) >so, please, if you have a copy of the "loopers CD", or >would like to share your (COPYRIGHT protected) looped music >can you let me know? that CD project actually is not yet completed. As I understand, it's in a bag on someone's shelf awaiting arrival of the still-vaporware-Layla sound card. Seems likely that CD #2 will arrive before CD #1. kim _______________________________________________________ Kim Flint 408-752-9284 Mpact Systems Engineering kflint@chromatic.com Chromatic Research http://www.chromatic.com From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 00:14:40 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 2 15:49:42 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzVcT-0001lm-00; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 15:49:41 -0800 Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 15:34:48 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: improv@peak.org (Dave Trenkel) Subject: Re: zoom effects units/vocoding Resent-Message-ID: <"6W-3OC.A.FUH.Vhl10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2724 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 15:49:41 -0800 X-UIDL: b25a255b3c12691194ca70d2cac00710 At 4:27 PM 2/2/98, Mikell D. Nelson wrote: >> Anyone ever combined looping with vocoding? I'm wondering what would >> happen if you vocoded a loop with itself, somehow.... >> >Os, > You sick pig, you! What a cool thought. I don't have a vocoder. >Someone please try this and give a report. > >Motley It seems to me that it wouldn't affect anything, since the vocoder filters would passing the material in each range that's already there, it wouldn't be changing the spectra of the vocoded signal at all. BUT, if you put a delay line before one of the vocoder inputs, it might be an interesting effect, if the spectra of the loop were changing over time. Hmmm, and I just sold my vocoder. ________________________________________________________ Dave Trenkel : improv@peak.org : www.peak.org/~improv/ "...there will come a day when you won't have to use gasoline. You'd simply take a cassette and put it in your car, let it run. You'd have to have the proper type of music. Like you take two sticks, put 'em together, make fire. You take some notes and rub 'em together - dum, dum, dum, dum - fire, cosmic fire." -Sun Ra ________________________________________________________ From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 00:14:58 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 2 18:04:44 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzXj4-0004oq-00; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 18:04:38 -0800 Message-ID: From: "Ott, John" To: "'Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com'" Subject: RE: RE:Fernandes guy at NAMM Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 17:56:39 -0600 X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) Resent-Message-ID: <"4osuyC.A.iHD.oin10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2731 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 18:04:38 -0800 X-UIDL: 7b03189608e76b65e82aebd14c614e95 >>>>quote>>> > From: Peter Thompson > Reply To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com > Sent: Monday, February 2, 1998 6:07 PM > To: John_Ott@ATK.COM > Subject: Re: RE:Fernandes guy at NAMM > > I notice that > > both Fripp and Gabriel don't use the sustainers for sound but > > use a Roland GK-2 pickup into a GR synth or VG-8 to get > > sounds. > > > > > > later > > John > > > > > > Robert Fripp is now using a Sustainer-equipped Fernandes Les Paul and > has > been at least since I saw King Crimson in London a couple of years > ago. > > Pete > <<<From kflint Mon Feb 2 16:28:22 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzWDm-0006p0-00; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 16:28:14 -0800 Message-ID: <2148EC143F29D1118BE000805FC13CD014CC20@migarexch01.maritz.com> From: "Liebig, Steuart A." To: "'Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com'" Subject: RE: location & Loopers' CD Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 18:17:26 -0600 X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) Resent-Message-ID: <"vt6_M.A.yJF.WJm10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2728 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 16:28:14 -0800 X-UIDL: f5a77d8c4d435cc6baf8b87008771e5b Yeah, I tend to think of loops as being only a small part of the live/recorded imporvised or composed experience. A small part of the canvas, sometimes you need to do alot sometimes a little; sometimes intense noise, sometimes tonal bliss . . . If all you are doing is looping, well I don't know . . . are you playing music or IC chips? . . . I only say this because I have friends who have gone this route and I'm not really sure that it leads to what I consider an important factor in music: human interaction. (Often have the same problem with totally pre-recorded concerts or music concrete.) > ---------- > From: Kim Flint > Reply To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com > Sent: Monday, February 2, 1998 4:04 PM > To: LiebigSA@maritz.com > Subject: Re: location & Loopers' CD > > At 03:44 PM 2/2/98 EST, paparuda o o wrote: > > > > >yeah! even more, i would actually like to meet other loopers; > > I think that is generally a great idea, and probably my biggest > motivation > for creating this whole monster of an internet address! Get together! > Collaborate! Share ideas! Real-live or Virtual! Go forth and Multiply! > > > (pun intended there....) > > > >it's seems to me that most of the loopers are into "ambient" > >instrumental music. > > I'm not. In fact, I'm morally opposed to being an ambient musician. > What > others choose to do with their lives is their own business, but I > resolutely > refuse to have anything to do with this ambient stuff. I'm deeply > offended > by any implication that being into looping means I'm ambient. I'm > proud of > my long history here resisting the ambient tyranny that threatens to > overcome all other loopists! I will also continue to resist shameless > idol > worship of this Fripp fellow. Soundscapes, poundcakes. Not for me! > > of course, neither of those is as sick as being a deadhead. Those > maniacs > are actually planning to open a Grateful Dead theme park in San > Francisco. > The apocalypse will arrive none too soon. > > this, of course, gets many smiley's: :-) :-) :-) :-) :-) > > > >so, please, if you have a copy of the "loopers CD", or > >would like to share your (COPYRIGHT protected) looped music > >can you let me know? > > that CD project actually is not yet completed. As I understand, it's > in a > bag on someone's shelf awaiting arrival of the still-vaporware-Layla > sound > card. Seems likely that CD #2 will arrive before CD #1. > > kim > _______________________________________________________ > Kim Flint 408-752-9284 > Mpact Systems Engineering kflint@chromatic.com > Chromatic Research http://www.chromatic.com > > From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 00:15:00 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 2 18:25:56 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzY3Z-0007et-00; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 18:25:49 -0800 Message-ID: <34D66707.C4AAD40E@mail.clt.bellsouth.net> Date: Mon, 02 Feb 1998 19:38:32 -0500 From: "Samuel D. Burns" Reply-To: usonian@bellsouth.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.02 [en]C-DIAL (Win95; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Location. References: <34D4D843.737C@isrv.com> <34D55E4A.C92AACD9@mailbox.syr.edu> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"ZGQ0eD.A.32F.n3n10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2732 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 18:25:49 -0800 X-UIDL: bb18960a09ef2c8303a29715b7703cf8 Charlotte, NC here! Darcy Clark wrote: > Ann Arbor, MI here also ! > > only been looping for about 6 months, but loving my jamman/vortex combo ;) > > Darcy Clark > University of Michigan > --------------------- > > >Ann Arbor, MI > > > >Dave White > >Tortoise Studio Productions > > > >mark sottilaro wrote: > > > >> Hey Loopers. > >> > >> Every once and a while I wonder if I'm near anyone on this list. Do you > >>think > >> we could all give an email with a location to the list? That way we > >>could all > >> get an idea of what kind of dispersion there is among us. > >> > >> I'm living in Syracuse NY at the moment. > >> > >> Later, > >> > >> Mark Sottilaro > > Darcy Clark > +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ > Materials Science and Engineering Department > University of Michigan > Ann Arbor, MI, 48109-2136 > USA > +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ > Room 2130, Dow Building > Phone (734) 764 3377 > Fax (734) 763 4788 > E-mail darcyc@engin.umich.edu > http://msewww.engin.umich.edu/mse250 > http://msewww.engin.umich.edu/people/darcyc/ > http://mseadmin.engin.umich.edu:591/ > http://www-personal.engin.umich.edu/~darcyc/ > +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ From ???@??? Mon Feb 02 09:29:43 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 2 07:06:49 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzNSR-0004us-00; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 07:06:47 -0800 Message-Id: <3.0.1.16.19980202164117.18c7219a@rank-serv.elec.gla.ac.uk> X-Sender: pycraft@rank-serv.elec.gla.ac.uk X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.1 (16) Date: Mon, 02 Feb 1998 16:41:17 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: "Michael P. Hughes, Ph.D." Subject: Re: Fernandes Sustainer In-Reply-To: <001001bd2fe0$3b3bda80$70da6f83@pt205.wolfson.cam.ac.uk> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"_VnkX.A.zBE.b_d10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2672 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 07:06:47 -0800 X-UIDL: fbc18f29278c0cf4db70832a729eefd9 >1) Is the Fernandes or any other sustainer available as a retro-fit? Yes, but Fernandez charge a wallet-smasking 272UK for it ($400)!!! I'm currently trying to build one myself, as soon as I get the cash for the pickup together.... >2) Does anyone know how Michael Brook's Infinite Guitar works? Yes, but it's a secret! ;b But really, I'm not sure if it's anything more than a sustainer -type system with a bit more control over the cct via a footswitch. Michael From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 00:15:06 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 2 19:14:47 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzYou-0004ya-00; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 19:14:44 -0800 From: ANET@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 20:42:08 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Location/MABEY YOU CAN HELP US?. (3rd CD project) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 18 Resent-Message-ID: <"_P8zgD.A.CUE.tro10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2735 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 19:14:44 -0800 X-UIDL: 8b01800a751891c16d2a31d00190a92b Hey Brian, Got your tape for the 3rd cd project and am setting up the WEB PAGE for it. Thanks and will keep you informed. From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 00:15:04 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 2 18:59:10 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzYZo-0003Sa-00; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 18:59:08 -0800 Message-Id: <2.2.32.19980203024334.006fdee0@pop.chromatic.com> X-Sender: kflint@pop.chromatic.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 2.2 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 02 Feb 1998 18:43:34 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Kim Flint Subject: RE: RE:Fernandes guy at NAMM Resent-Message-ID: <"HIJu-.A.wxC.Sco10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2734 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 18:59:08 -0800 X-UIDL: f113a8fac9a23f862603eed33d8a6e3f At 05:56 PM 2/2/98 -0600, Ott, John wrote: > What do you sustainer owners think of the pickup > sound on sustainer equipped guitars? > > So far reports I have heard say the sound is degraded. I think they sound like crap for anything other than the sustainer. I see my fernandes as a one trick pony, which I mostly only use with lots of distortion and processing. Come to think of it, I can't even remember having it out of the case in the last year..... They are killer for loop textures, though. You absolutely have to have a whammy and some real time effects and filter control to make it interesting. Turns a guitar into more of an oscillator (as in an analog synth), with an interesting waveform that has lots of possiblities for sonic manipulation. Lots of overdubs of one note with ever so slight whammy tweaking, for those completely evil dissonances.... YES! kim _______________________________________________________ Kim Flint 408-752-9284 Mpact Systems Engineering kflint@chromatic.com Chromatic Research http://www.chromatic.com From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 00:15:09 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 2 19:42:10 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzZFM-0007Y6-00; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 19:42:04 -0800 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <313e3577.34d6328e@aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: klaw@iglou.com Subject: Re: Location. Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 22:37:52 -0500 Resent-Message-ID: <"g0MF5C.A.-kG.UEp10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2736 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 19:42:04 -0800 X-UIDL: fa782e4036e028a6866c90b4a6daea05 Greetings Im based in the great city of Louisville Ky . Been looping most of my musical life . Give or take a delay or two. Sorry:.) K Law From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 00:15:12 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 2 20:30:18 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzZzy-0004Bt-00; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 20:30:14 -0800 From: Marzzz@aol.com Message-ID: <76854fa9.34d69abb@aol.com> Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 23:19:05 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Location Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 84 Resent-Message-ID: <"j1foJC.A.NTD.lwp10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2739 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 20:30:14 -0800 X-UIDL: 4424c6e63e536c4168532662588272e7 Chicago. Deep in the heart of Les Paul into a Marshall stack classic rock territory..... From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 00:15:11 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 2 20:28:53 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzZyc-0003zX-00; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 20:28:50 -0800 From: "Randy Jones" To: Subject: Re: RE:Fernandes guy at NAMM Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 22:22:13 -0600 Message-ID: <01bd305b$4d503060$b43163d1@user.texas.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Resent-Message-ID: <"Q8CTXD.A.7KD.tvp10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2738 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 20:28:50 -0800 X-UIDL: b6046cf540ecaddaaa7d1d8243d7e749 Uh Kim, Loop textures? That ain't ambient now is it? Randy Jones -----Original Message----- From: Kim Flint To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Date: Monday, February 02, 1998 9:00 PM Subject: RE: RE:Fernandes guy at NAMM >At 05:56 PM 2/2/98 -0600, Ott, John wrote: > >> What do you sustainer owners think of the pickup >> sound on sustainer equipped guitars? >> >> So far reports I have heard say the sound is degraded. > >I think they sound like crap for anything other than the sustainer. I see my >fernandes as a one trick pony, which I mostly only use with lots of >distortion and processing. Come to think of it, I can't even remember having >it out of the case in the last year..... > >They are killer for loop textures, though. You absolutely have to have a >whammy and some real time effects and filter control to make it interesting. >Turns a guitar into more of an oscillator (as in an analog synth), with an >interesting waveform that has lots of possiblities for sonic manipulation. > >Lots of overdubs of one note with ever so slight whammy tweaking, for those >completely evil dissonances.... YES! > >kim >_______________________________________________________ >Kim Flint 408-752-9284 >Mpact Systems Engineering kflint@chromatic.com >Chromatic Research http://www.chromatic.com > > > From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 00:15:15 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 2 21:08:28 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzaaw-0007FY-00; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 21:08:26 -0800 From: KILLINFO@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 00:04:59 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Re: Re: Location. Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 59 Resent-Message-ID: <"AE9D8D.A.TgG.fWq10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2740 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 21:08:26 -0800 X-UIDL: 458be326fdca105e475d952e78a261b1 In a message dated 2/2/98 1:32:32 PM, you wrote: >This is exactly the point of the "Loopers of the World" section of the >Looper's Delight website. It contains profiles of people from all over the >world, with descriptions of their styles, background, contact info, gear, etc. > > >At this time, we are automating this section so it will be easy for people >to add and modify their profiles... Ah! I keep forgetting...not that it matters much...but nearly a year ago I moved from sunny SoCal to rainy Oregon...and I've much to change in my profile on the Loop-D page. Please post details as soon as it becomes possible to make such changes. Thanks Ted Killian From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 00:15:17 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 2 21:34:56 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzb0Y-0002Dy-00; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 21:34:54 -0800 From: Fmplautus@aol.com Message-ID: <5f14d641.34d6aa82@aol.com> Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 00:26:22 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: RE: RE:Fernandes guy at NAMM Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 78 Resent-Message-ID: <"thoYu.A.sTB.Gsq10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2742 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 21:34:54 -0800 X-UIDL: 57cd364ece7bbd195d81b9cdca65ab58 Hi Kim: Thanks for the sustainer report. You mentioned ocsillators. Have you gotten your hands on the Boss bass synthesis pedal that came out a while back and turns the bottom four strings of a guitar into something analogue synth like? If you have, how does this compare to the Sustainer? Best, The LoOpDoctOrs From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 00:15:16 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 2 21:27:46 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzatc-0001Gy-00; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 21:27:44 -0800 Message-ID: <34D6ACB0.A2849438@mailbox.syr.edu> Date: Tue, 03 Feb 1998 00:35:44 -0500 From: mark sottilaro Reply-To: msottila@mailbox.syr.edu Organization: metaliminal X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.01 (Macintosh; I; PPC) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Different EBows was Re: Another NAMM Report X-Priority: 3 (Normal) References: <001c01bd2d97$2da45d20$2222dacf@stepheng> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"QGNstD.A.oy.8nq10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2741 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 21:27:44 -0800 X-UIDL: b87392abda57ffb3b8eac5ea63d83fd6 Hey all, I use a standard ebow with a bass all the time. It's a bit trickier, but if you learn how to hold it just right, it works out fine. Mark. From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 00:15:18 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 2 21:36:38 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzb2B-0002R5-00; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 21:36:35 -0800 Message-ID: <34D6AE57.F9EB1B84@mailbox.syr.edu> Date: Tue, 03 Feb 1998 00:42:47 -0500 From: mark sottilaro Reply-To: msottila@mailbox.syr.edu Organization: metaliminal X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.01 (Macintosh; I; PPC) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: How do it know? X-Priority: 3 (Normal) References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"BzsZYD.A.zoB.nuq10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2743 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 21:36:35 -0800 X-UIDL: 80b8f1c85846b7af154755a580f5634f As is the case with a thermos that keeps hot things hot and cold things cold, if the ebow is oscillating an octave up from the harmonic of the string, how do it know? How do it know? I think something different is going on here, and like the formula for Lava Lamps and T25 (Scope ingredient) it will remain a secret until someone rats it out. Mark From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 00:15:22 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 2 22:12:03 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzbaS-0005HK-00; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 22:12:00 -0800 Message-Id: <2.2.32.19980203060756.00a55664@pop.chromatic.com> X-Sender: kflint@pop.chromatic.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 2.2 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 02 Feb 1998 22:07:56 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Kim Flint Subject: Re: How do it know? Resent-Message-ID: <"CaZ47.A.5mE.6Rr10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2744 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 22:12:00 -0800 X-UIDL: 06677890487bd41ad0e9b98e184096a9 At 12:42 AM 2/3/98 -0500, mark sottilaro wrote: >As is the case with a thermos that keeps hot things hot and cold things cold, >if the ebow is oscillating an octave up from the harmonic of the string, how >do it know? How do it know? nothing magic, I suspect. Just good old analog. It would either be a simple frequency multiplier or a fixed high pass filter, I would guess. With the fernandez I suspect high pass, since it does tend to behave a little different with high vs low pitches. sorry if that spoils it for you.....there's no tooth fairy either. kim _______________________________________________________ Kim Flint 408-752-9284 Mpact Systems Engineering kflint@chromatic.com Chromatic Research http://www.chromatic.com From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 00:15:24 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 2 22:35:42 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzbxL-0007JI-00; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 22:35:39 -0800 Message-Id: <2.2.32.19980203063117.00a00040@pop.chromatic.com> X-Sender: kflint@pop.chromatic.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 2.2 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 02 Feb 1998 22:31:17 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Kim Flint Subject: Re: RE: RE:Fernandes guy at NAMM Resent-Message-ID: <"tzEXgC.A.DgG.4nr10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2745 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 22:35:39 -0800 X-UIDL: 4a50491e7f65b23dc52c2f8f88551857 never got it or played it or even thought much about it. Probably if I wanted something really analog synth-like, I would actually first think to use an analog synth before trying to make a guitar sound like one. I'm funny that way. What I was talking about is that "guitar string waveform" is usually not an option on yer regular waveform selector knob. Now if I actually possessed an analog synth, or was possessed by one, it would probably occur to me shortly after the possibilities for triangles became a bit barren that using a "guitar string waveform" in place of the oscillator section might be pretty damn cool. Lots of nifty harmonics in those strings. And if I did do that, it would next occur to me that using a sustaining device on the guitar string to take away the remarkably predictable guitar string envelope would be darned handy, allowing me to replace it with the good ol' ADSR. Add some LFO's, some filters, and some weird effects, loop it up, and as the kids say, it would be wikked..... kim At 12:26 AM 2/3/98 EST, Fmplautus@aol.com wrote: >Hi Kim: > >Thanks for the sustainer report. You mentioned ocsillators. Have you gotten >your hands on the Boss bass synthesis pedal that came out a while back and >turns the bottom four strings of a guitar into something analogue synth like? >If you have, how does this compare to the Sustainer? > >Best, >The LoOpDoctOrs > > > _______________________________________________________ Kim Flint 408-752-9284 Mpact Systems Engineering kflint@chromatic.com Chromatic Research http://www.chromatic.com From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 10:02:07 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 3 03:37:43 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzgfd-0007bz-00; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 03:37:41 -0800 Mime-Version: 1.0 Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 09:33:07 +0300 Message-ID: <0000A525.4007@poyry.com.br> From: miguel.barella@poyry.com.br (MAT) Subject: Re[2]: Location. To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com, Fmplautus@aol.com Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Description: cc:Mail note part Resent-Message-ID: <"V4KRBD.A.b7G.8Dw10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2749 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 03:37:41 -0800 X-UIDL: d1f2ad2bed16ffef0f58f8dcba92641d Miguel Barella lives in Sao Paulo, Brazil. From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 00:15:25 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 2 22:54:23 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzcFQ-00010Y-00; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 22:54:20 -0800 Message-Id: <2.2.32.19980203065005.00a2b354@pop.chromatic.com> X-Sender: kflint@pop.chromatic.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 2.2 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 02 Feb 1998 22:50:05 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Kim Flint Subject: Re: RE:Fernandes guy at NAMM Resent-Message-ID: <"ZksySB.A.kh.a5r10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2746 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 22:54:20 -0800 X-UIDL: f645c7ad3683dda1e44fde564af6d539 At 10:22 PM 2/2/98 -0600, you wrote: >Uh Kim, > >Loop textures? That ain't ambient now is it? > gosh darn it, see what I mean? Now there are laws saying you can't loop sound textures anywhere except ambient music. Those ambient musicians are crafty! They lull everyone into a trance and before you know it they've taken over the government! Regulating everyone! Hypnotizing us with subliminal messages buried in reverb tails and noise fragments! It's a conspiracy I tell you! first it's textures, what's next? volume swells? reverb? Resist before it's too late! If we don't stop them now we'll all be ambient or playing in Garth Brooks cover bands! :-) kim _______________________________________________________ Kim Flint 408-752-9284 Mpact Systems Engineering kflint@chromatic.com Chromatic Research http://www.chromatic.com From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 00:14:19 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 2 14:10:42 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzU4R-0003ux-00; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 14:10:27 -0800 Message-Id: <3.0.1.16.19980202233635.1a6721b2@rank-serv.elec.gla.ac.uk> X-Sender: pycraft@rank-serv.elec.gla.ac.uk X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.1 (16) Date: Mon, 02 Feb 1998 23:36:35 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: "Michael P. Hughes, Ph.D." Subject: Re: Re: Fernandes Sustainer In-Reply-To: <980202113640_372078400@mrin53> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"8RXSyD.A.QBC.LFk10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2718 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 14:10:28 -0800 X-UIDL: 7f991c495874c1bd245e4a6f05f66cff >><<>1) Is the Fernandes or any other sustainer available as a retro-fit? >>Yes, but Fernandez charge a wallet-smasking 272UK for it ($400)!!!>> >Interesting...I asked the guy at the Fernandes NAMM booth about retro-fits >and he said absolutely not, too complicated getting the thing set up >correctly and since it interacts with the bridge pickup, they couldn't >guarentee that it would work well with all other pickups. I've seen the kit, in a box, and it includes both the driver and the sensor (neck s/c and bridge h/b respectively). There's a used Fer. Sust. -equipped quitar for sale in a shop in Glasgow that has a replacement Seymour at the bridge, so it's not as if the system requires a particular unit... Michael From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 01:37:42 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 3 01:24:48 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzeaz-0002D8-00; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 01:24:45 -0800 X-Sender: kflint@pop.slip.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 01:22:12 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Kim Flint Subject: Re: Simm sound Resent-Message-ID: <"rNs6YD.A.zwB._Gu10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2747 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 01:24:45 -0800 X-UIDL: 2ea770b0be9219d4a3f1ebf9c9a0269d At 1:22 PM -0500 2/2/98, Fmplautus@aol.com wrote: >Kim wrote... > >"gee, musicians are actually dumb enough to believe that their sound >will be affected by the simms they use! Let's unload these expensive ones >that nobody else will buy." > >The LoOpDoctORs can here the difference between different batches of SIMMS in >both the Echoplex and the Jammen. We've come to prefer the Vintage Malaysian >Simms from 1994...buttery mids and clear, warm highs, kind of like taking a >dip in a waterfall on the road to Mandalay. And we turned Eric Johnson onto >the Duracels you know. I've got some vintage 256k simms from the late 80's. Warmth and tone like you won't believe. These puppies will really make your echoplex sing! Highest bidder by next thursday gets 'em, you pay shipping. kim ______________________________________________________________________ Kim Flint | Looper's Delight kflint@annihilist.com | http://www.annihilist.com/loop/loop.html http://www.annihilist.com/ | Loopers-Delight-request@annihilist.com From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 10:03:10 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 3 08:52:08 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzlZt-00066z-00; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 08:52:05 -0800 Message-Id: <199802031630.IAA24344@scv2.apple.com> Subject: Re: Mixer recommendations Date: Tue, 3 Feb 98 10:30:44 -0000 x-sender: hartne.t@mail.apple.com x-mailer: Claris Emailer 1.1 From: "T.W. Hartnett" To: "Looper's Delight" Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Resent-Message-ID: <"b5IXN.A.gRE.7h010"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2768 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 08:52:05 -0800 X-UIDL: effb174098ee477049f1d7ca9308a7bd > >Speaking of mixers, anybody have any experience with Samson? They have a >couple of reasonably priced stereo powered mixers. Any idea how they sound? > I've been using the Mixpad 9 for live recording and mixing my looping rig, and have no complaints. Travis Hartnett From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 10:03:13 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 3 08:57:45 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzlfG-0006t3-00; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 08:57:38 -0800 Message-Id: <199802031635.IAA28224@scv4.apple.com> Subject: Re: RE: RE:Fernandes guy at NAMM Date: Tue, 3 Feb 98 10:36:08 -0000 x-sender: hartne.t@mail.apple.com x-mailer: Claris Emailer 1.1 From: "T.W. Hartnett" To: "Looper's Delight" Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Resent-Message-ID: <"n3bnqC.A.OOF.-o010"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2769 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 08:57:38 -0800 X-UIDL: 9e2afde5684458f887ec3baf1f502ae4 >What I was talking about is that "guitar string waveform" is usually not an >option on yer regular waveform selector knob. Now if I actually possessed an >analog synth, or was possessed by one, it would probably occur to me shortly >after the possibilities for triangles became a bit barren that using a >"guitar string waveform" in place of the oscillator section might be pretty >damn cool. Lots of nifty harmonics in those strings. And if I did do that, >it would next occur to me that using a sustaining device on the guitar >string to take away the remarkably predictable guitar string envelope would >be darned handy, allowing me to replace it with the good ol' ADSR. Add some >LFO's, some filters, and some weird effects, loop it up, and as the kids >say, it would be wikked..... I use to fantasize about a piano-type instrument which would use guitar/bass strings, and which had a an E-bow type device on each string, the intensity of which could be controlled by aftertouch pressure, or preset. All the typical guitar processing could be applied, the output split in several different ways, etc, etc. Travis From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 10:03:08 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 3 08:48:41 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzlWT-0005eH-00; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 08:48:33 -0800 Mime-Version: 1.0 Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 14:13:09 +0300 Message-ID: <0000A568.4007@poyry.com.br> From: miguel.barella@poyry.com.br (MAT) Subject: Re[2]: Simm sound To: , "Peter Thompson" Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Description: cc:Mail note part Resent-Message-ID: <"G_LEc.A.UlD.1c010"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2767 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 08:48:33 -0800 X-UIDL: 580948a041b92094337271465f850cb0 IBM 11/30 style ferrite memory will also do! Miguel ___________________________ Separador de Resposta ______________________________ Assunto: Re: Simm sound Autor: "Peter Thompson" na internet Data: 03/02/1998 16:01 > Wanna talk vintage?? > >I have a 64 bit tube RAM. This beauty, circa 1954, still works >and I have easily retro-fitted its cable to a simm socket. >You wouldn't beleive it but to hear it, but the 44 millisecond >access time actually works well to provide just the right high >frequency roll-off in the digital domain to supress quantization >and nyquist noise. The power supply is a bitch, though. > >I've been searching surplus dealers and swap-meets to find more >of these to increase my storage. > > - Floyd > > I, of course, still use punched cards for my looping. OK, the bandwidth sucks and it's a pain if you drop them, but the vintage authenticity makes grown men weep. Pete __________________________________________ Peter Thompson pt205@hermes.cam.ac.uk Wolfson College Cambridge CB3 9BB "I take another brief dip in the indifference of fools." - Bill Nelson From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 10:02:08 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 3 04:34:47 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzhYs-0001yN-00; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 04:34:46 -0800 From: Texture444@aol.com Message-ID: <274c38d6.34d70e61@aol.com> Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 07:32:31 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Re: Re: Re: Different EBows Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 84 Resent-Message-ID: <"2gezxD.A.GqB.j5w10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2750 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 04:34:46 -0800 X-UIDL: c86fa575cb2dcbc21ea1daa0f95d6686 In a message dated 2/2/98 11:35:20 PM, paolo wrote: <> well..... no, this polyphonic ebow thang wasn't my idea, at all; i just happened to be in the right place @ the right time, and, as it happened, i was already frustrated by a coupla years worth of fruitless phone conversations w/michael brook. re: what i said in that article in '87: i think i'd better find & read that piece, ta see what the hell i was talking about! i think i have a clue, though, and i think it involved looping. best, dt From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 17:34:29 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 3 10:22:54 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzmzf-0002GN-00; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 10:22:47 -0800 Message-ID: <34D718AD.40B4@nyfac.com> Date: Tue, 03 Feb 1998 13:16:29 +0000 From: tbajus Reply-To: nyfac2@nyfac.com X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (WinNT; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Simm sound References: <0000A568.4007@poyry.com.br> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"8utm0D.A.sp.72110"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2779 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 10:22:47 -0800 X-UIDL: ff34039e22c292df24e97c55afca7377 I only use pre-CBS american made tube ram. Dude. Trevor B From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 17:34:57 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 3 11:40:48 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzoD0-0003oy-00; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 11:40:38 -0800 Message-ID: <34D71977.2482@nyfac.com> Date: Tue, 03 Feb 1998 13:19:51 +0000 From: tbajus Reply-To: nyfac2@nyfac.com X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (WinNT; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Simm sound References: <199802031626.LAA01480@cliff.concentric.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"FqbICC.A._4C.ZF310"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2784 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 11:40:38 -0800 X-UIDL: bf8c828474a96736548109d2e517b1da > >>Kim wrote... > >> > >>"gee, musicians are actually dumb enough to believe that their sound > >>will be affected by the simms they use! Let's unload these expensive ones > >>that nobody else will buy." > >> 'Course, if the ram doesn't work, that would effect the sound.... TDB From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 10:02:14 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 3 05:42:01 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzibw-00051c-00; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 05:42:00 -0800 Message-Id: <199802031339.IAA14659@shell.monmouth.com> Reply-To: From: "andre" To: Subject: ADA power amps Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 08:39:24 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1162 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"_RcJlC.A.1eE.Y4x10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2751 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 05:42:00 -0800 X-UIDL: eb15cb324487d2f530e8bf1704c29164 hey. does anyone have an opinion on the ADA single space - rack power amp??? i love my ADA MP-1 , almost a decade of solid tone carving from that, a workhorse.. how is the power amp?? i know it's stereo, can you run 2 discrete signals? is it nice, clean, punchy and loud?? any 'feedback ' will be appreciated. andre' From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 10:02:17 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 3 06:05:22 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xziyX-0006R1-00; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 06:05:21 -0800 Message-Id: <199802031402.JAA22658@shell.monmouth.com> Reply-To: From: "andre" To: Subject: Re: What / who is on the forefront of looping music? Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 09:02:34 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1162 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"51j4vC.A.IyF.HOy10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2752 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 06:05:21 -0800 X-UIDL: c36b36fa2b269c661d241ccdea2dbcba > So, in that context, David Myers' complaints that Fripp's "new" > soundscapes aren't all that new, nor are they really "moving forward" > the greater looping "oeuvre" are quite valid. > > Granted, that may not be Fripp's Aim. ..whatever... i agree - it's some of fripp's most..... non exciting stuff. but , yes, i respect the fact - that was what he was going for.. but on the 2 soundsscape CDs i have , plus the G3 show, it never seemed to take off, beyond simplistic, basic synth patches thru cool stereo FX. not as adventurous as he usually is, by far! andre' From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 10:02:20 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 3 06:14:04 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzj6w-00077e-00; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 06:14:02 -0800 Message-ID: <000e01bd30ad$9d842300$70da6f83@pt205.wolfson.cam.ac.uk> From: "Peter Thompson" To: Subject: Re: What / who is on the forefront of looping music? Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 14:11:24 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Resent-Message-ID: <"LJTNUB.A.acG.WWy10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2753 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 06:14:02 -0800 X-UIDL: b1bd8c8a5e3c91ea4ebd75d654d3f48c >..whatever... i agree - it's some of fripp's most..... non exciting stuff. >but , yes, i respect the fact - that was what he was going for.. but on the >2 soundsscape CDs i have , plus the G3 show, it never seemed to take off, >beyond simplistic, basic synth patches thru cool stereo FX. not as >adventurous as he usually is, by far! > >andre' > > This is a good point. Fripp does rely too much on synth patches. Now that can sometimes work very effectively such as on A Blessing of Tears, but more often than not it just gets cloying. I would like to see him use the natural sound of the guitar more - essentially i would like him to sound like a guitarist, rather than a keyboard player. Pete From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 10:02:22 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 3 06:28:56 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzjLK-0000Qp-00; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 06:28:54 -0800 Message-Id: <98Feb3.092354est.18840@thicket.arbortext.com> Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 09:20:52 -0500 From: David White Reply-To: dwhite@arbortext.com Organization: Arbortext Inc. X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (WinNT; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Fernandes guy at NAMM References: <2.2.32.19980203065005.00a2b354@pop.chromatic.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"ewUGL.A.gI.Jky10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2754 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 06:28:54 -0800 X-UIDL: 137bb9bfdc4d216109d41c9342d7d2c1 I tried starting an Ambient Garth Brooks cover band over a year ago. No one would where the hat. (hat...cover...thinkaboutit) dave Kim Flint wrote: > At 10:22 PM 2/2/98 -0600, you wrote: > >Uh Kim, > > > >Loop textures? That ain't ambient now is it? > > > > gosh darn it, see what I mean? Now there are laws saying you can't loop > sound textures anywhere except ambient music. Those ambient musicians are > crafty! They lull everyone into a trance and before you know it they've > taken over the government! Regulating everyone! Hypnotizing us with > subliminal messages buried in reverb tails and noise fragments! It's a > conspiracy I tell you! first it's textures, what's next? volume swells? > reverb? Resist before it's too late! If we don't stop them now we'll all be > ambient or playing in Garth Brooks cover bands! > > :-) > kim > _______________________________________________________ > Kim Flint 408-752-9284 > Mpact Systems Engineering kflint@chromatic.com > Chromatic Research http://www.chromatic.com From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 10:02:24 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 3 06:35:46 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzjRw-00016j-00; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 06:35:44 -0800 Message-ID: <02a701bd30b0$dabae260$c2b854ce@mark.asisoftware.com> From: Mark@asisoftware.com (Mark Kata) To: "Loopers Delight" Subject: Fw: ADA power amps Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 09:34:37 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Resent-Message-ID: <"gN5GyD.A.7t.Oqy10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2755 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 06:35:44 -0800 X-UIDL: ebeb2d67216172894ba17b737d946585 I remember reading a review of an ADA single space 100-watt power amp with a couple of 12AX7 tubes in Guitar Player a few years ago. They said it sounded a little thin. You might want to check GP's website, they may be able to direct you to the article. Also, Harmony-Central.com may have a review of it. In any case, take the reviews with a grain of salt. Especially since GP is so tube and retro oriented. Mark Kata Mark@asisoftware.com -----Original Message----- From: andre To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Date: Tuesday, February 03, 1998 8:41 AM Subject: ADA power amps >hey. > >does anyone have an opinion on the ADA single space - rack power amp??? >i love my ADA MP-1 , almost a decade of solid tone carving from that, a >workhorse.. > >how is the power amp?? i know it's stereo, can you run 2 discrete signals? >is it nice, clean, punchy and loud?? > >any 'feedback ' will be appreciated. > >andre' > From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 10:02:26 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 3 06:42:38 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzjYb-0001ls-00; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 06:42:37 -0800 Message-Id: <3.0.2.32.19980203094126.0070918c@dharma.mitre.org> X-Sender: seligman@dharma.mitre.org X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.2 (32) Date: Tue, 03 Feb 1998 09:41:26 -0500 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Len Seligman Subject: Mixer recommendations In-Reply-To: <199802022114.OAA02379@hyper.dimensional.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"nZIBN.A.5XB.2wy10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2756 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 06:42:37 -0800 X-UIDL: e622bd1837625bd64abba2a26e53ae45 Speaking of mixers, anybody have any experience with Samson? They have a couple of reasonably priced stereo powered mixers. Any idea how they sound? Thanks, Len Silver Spring, Maryland guitar, vocals, body percussion, loops... From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 10:02:37 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 3 07:30:17 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzkIg-0005Hb-00; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 07:30:14 -0800 Date: 3 Feb 1998 15:26:48 -0000 Message-ID: <19980203152648.22198.qmail@omni1.voicenet.com> From: floyd@voicenet.com To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Simm sound Resent-Message-ID: <"wHCjqC.A.eoE.Ydz10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2758 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 07:30:14 -0800 X-UIDL: 42c60e5976df1cc10bb63ed0ce2beb99 > > > >The LoOpDoctORs can here the difference between different batches of SIMMS in > >both the Echoplex and the Jammen. We've come to prefer the Vintage Malaysian > >Simms from 1994...buttery mids and clear, warm highs, kind of like taking a > >dip in a waterfall on the road to Mandalay. And we turned Eric Johnson onto > >the Duracels you know. > > I've got some vintage 256k simms from the late 80's. Warmth and tone like > you won't believe. These puppies will really make your echoplex sing! > Highest bidder by next thursday gets 'em, you pay shipping. > > kim > Wanna talk vintage?? I have a 64 bit tube RAM. This beauty, circa 1954, still works and I have easily retro-fitted its cable to a simm socket. You wouldn't beleive it but to hear it, but the 44 millisecond access time actually works well to provide just the right high frequency roll-off in the digital domain to supress quantization and nyquist noise. The power supply is a bitch, though. I've been searching surplus dealers and swap-meets to find more of these to increase my storage. - Floyd From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 10:02:40 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 3 07:42:01 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzkU4-0006H4-00; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 07:42:00 -0800 From: Emmanuel Angel Message-Id: <199802031538.KAA00318@dolphin.upenn.edu> Subject: Lexicon Vortex for Sale To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 10:38:58 -0500 (EST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23-upenn3.1] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"Jg-zMB.A.5kF.Yoz10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2759 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 07:42:00 -0800 X-UIDL: 7f0292737810526b0689a2bba025b6fb For sale: 1 Lexicon Vortex Condition: Brand New!!! in Sealed Factory Box --- Never Opened!!! Warranty: Registration card in box Asking Price: $290.00 Contact: angel2@dolphin.upenn.edu Shipping: UPS COD to your door for cash or certified bank check As many of you know, this amazing processor sounds incredibly warm, with a host of delay, modulation, and other effects. Envelope control of many parameters. Highly programmable, with the ability to morph between sounds. Stereo in's and out's. Input for pedal control of audio morphing. Standard rack mount. E. Angel From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 10:03:27 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 3 09:16:24 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzlxH-0001ZN-00; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 09:16:15 -0800 Message-ID: <000601bd30ba$c079cce0$70da6f83@pt205.wolfson.cam.ac.uk> From: "Peter Thompson" To: Subject: Bitchery vs. Fair Comment Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 15:45:27 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Resent-Message-ID: <"HxBz2B.A.6q.S9010"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2771 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 09:16:15 -0800 X-UIDL: 4d3c86ac0391e31b4caaca4e7999abd2 As the co-accused in the Goodman Bitch Trials I would merely like to say the following: I don't see how my comment can be considered as bitching. I simple wished to amplify Andre's point about Fripps use of patches. I neither commented on nor do I agree with any of the points that he made about Fripp being exciting. Nor do I agree with the previous comments about Fripp being the 'bottom line'. I have no doubt Fripp adores what he is doing - I have a lot of time for his music. I have no desire at all for him to be 'exciting' if the definition of that word includes sounding like Satriani. Restraint is a highly underrated virtue, one that some posters to LD might like to consider. If we are going to have Mr Goodman jump down our throats every time we express an opinion, however anodyne, then perhaps we better all just stick to talking about SIMMs and mixers and stuff. Pete -----Original Message----- From: Stephen P. Goodman To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Date: 03 February 1998 14:45 Subject: Frippery vs. Bitchery >You know, at no point in this strangely looping discussion has anyone talked >about the idea that - wonder of wonders! - perhaps RF LIKES what he's doing >right now...! > >I believe we've all been there, hm? But if you're looking for blazingly >fast technique guitar, go listen to one of the fellows from the G3 tour. >Amongst the things I get out of listening to music (and yes! Fripp's work >too), "being impressed" is not high on my list of expectations before the >performance. > >Just listen to it, and if you don't like it, listen to something else. I >just think this bitching about his work is pointless unless someone can come >up with an alternative guitarist/style/etc that one likes Better. Or >perhaps it's your own work you like better, just say so. > >Who ever said it was supposed to be exciting ALL the time anyway? Or did >yez think it was a marketing ploy when Fripp said (back in the early 80s, >pre-KC2) that at times he made an effort to be as boring as humanly >possible? > >I'd have kept my keyboard untouched on this one, if it had not denigrated >into this whiningly annoying bit. It smacks a bit of the Satriani-heads who >were also disappointed in Soundscape works. Oh brother, whatta buncha >consumers THEY are. :) > >Stephen Goodman * It's... The Loop Of The Week! >EarthLight Studios * http://www.earthlight.net/Studios > >>>..whatever... i agree - it's some of fripp's most..... non exciting stuff. >>>but , yes, i respect the fact - that was what he was going for.. but on >the >>>2 soundsscape CDs i have , plus the G3 show, it never seemed to take off, >>>beyond simplistic, basic synth patches thru cool stereo FX. not as >>>adventurous as he usually is, by far! >>> >>>andre' >>> >>> >> >>This is a good point. Fripp does rely too much on synth patches. Now that >>can sometimes work very effectively such as on A Blessing of Tears, but >more >>often than not it just gets cloying. I would like to see him use the >>natural sound of the guitar more - essentially i would like him to sound >>like a guitarist, rather than a keyboard player. >> >>Pete >> >> >> > > > From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 10:02:50 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 3 08:05:56 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzkrA-0000OO-00; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 08:05:52 -0800 Message-ID: <000401bd30bd$0bed5fa0$70da6f83@pt205.wolfson.cam.ac.uk> From: "Peter Thompson" To: Subject: Re: Simm sound Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 16:01:53 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Resent-Message-ID: <"Ew9YbB.A.HB.q-z10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2760 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 08:05:52 -0800 X-UIDL: cab2b7ee48e076d2ad6bc8bd11f2f587 > Wanna talk vintage?? > >I have a 64 bit tube RAM. This beauty, circa 1954, still works >and I have easily retro-fitted its cable to a simm socket. >You wouldn't beleive it but to hear it, but the 44 millisecond >access time actually works well to provide just the right high >frequency roll-off in the digital domain to supress quantization >and nyquist noise. The power supply is a bitch, though. > >I've been searching surplus dealers and swap-meets to find more >of these to increase my storage. > > - Floyd > > I, of course, still use punched cards for my looping. OK, the bandwidth sucks and it's a pain if you drop them, but the vintage authenticity makes grown men weep. Pete __________________________________________ Peter Thompson pt205@hermes.cam.ac.uk Wolfson College Cambridge CB3 9BB "I take another brief dip in the indifference of fools." - Bill Nelson From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 10:03:03 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 3 08:35:05 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzlJI-0003nv-00; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 08:34:56 -0800 Message-Id: <215C1D5A0FFDD011B3CC00805FC18C291F6B9F@NTSRV2.LEXICON.COM> From: "Hogan, Greg (Exchange)" To: "'Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com'" Subject: RE: vortex woes Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 11:19:25 -0500 X-Priority: 3 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) Content-Type: text/plain Resent-Message-ID: <"ImAKd.A.IPC.1S010"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2764 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 08:34:56 -0800 X-UIDL: 3e4a5daa2bee2cfdcd7e202108c338a9 Dear Sean, I have been able to duplicate this. I am making our product management people aware of this. I doubt that there will be any action on this. Please let me know if you have any questions or if there is anything that I can do for you. Best regards, Greg Hogan Lexicon Customer Service Phone +781-280-0372 FAX +781-280-0499 > ---------- > From: buzzard@world.std.com[SMTP:buzzard@world.std.com] > Reply To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com > Sent: Monday, February 02, 1998 5:35 PM > To: GHogan@lexicon.com > Subject: vortex woes > > VORTEX SPECIFIC! > > This is not the loop email you're looking for. > Move along. > > Greg Hogan wrote: > >It seems like your machine is confused. Try resetting it as > >follows:Warning! This will erase user registers and replace them with > >the presets. > > Thanks, Greg. It was worth a shot. Actually, > before I did this, I did a little further investigation > than before, and found that things were not as > bad as I had thought. Whereas I had thought > that all A->B copies were bad (based on 2 out > of 2 samples), further investigation showed > that it seems to be limited to certain patches. > > Resetting it did not, however, fix the problem. > > If someone else with a Vortex wants to check if > this is a general Vortex bug, not specific to > my machine, that would be cool. (Either one > seems plausible at the moment.) > > The most consistent behavior is as follows: > Turn the volume down on whatever the Vortex is feeding > Copy PRESET 14A to register 14B (you'll destroy your > 14B... you could try a different register of course, > but it _seems_ like it has to be to a B register) > Turn the knob away and back to 14 (leaving B selected). > > At least nine times out of ten that produces > continuous high-volume noise (self-oscillation?) > on my Vortex. > > Sean Barrett > From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 10:03:06 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 3 08:41:59 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzlPt-0004je-00; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 08:41:46 -0800 Message-Id: <98Feb3.112549est.18829@thicket.arbortext.com> Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 11:22:49 -0500 From: David White Reply-To: dwhite@arbortext.com Organization: Arbortext Inc. X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (WinNT; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Simm sound References: <000401bd30bd$0bed5fa0$70da6f83@pt205.wolfson.cam.ac.uk> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"0HjZSD.A.dzC.oW010"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2766 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 08:41:46 -0800 X-UIDL: 46e89140ccfff5f84dcc659101fa0a87 Last year I had to stop using stone tablets for my processing. I developed a severe case of carpal tunnel syndrome trying to get the loop ends to match. Dave Peter Thompson wrote: > I, of course, still use punched cards for my looping. OK, the bandwidth > sucks and it's a pain if you drop them, but the vintage authenticity makes > grown men weep. > > Pete > __________________________________________ > Peter Thompson pt205@hermes.cam.ac.uk > Wolfson College > Cambridge CB3 9BB > > "I take another brief dip in the indifference of fools." > - Bill Nelson From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 10:03:05 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 3 08:39:22 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzlNT-0004OP-00; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 08:39:15 -0800 Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 11:26:54 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <199802031626.LAA01480@cliff.concentric.net> X-Sender: hideo@pop3.concentric.net X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Tom Lambrecht Subject: Re: Simm sound Resent-Message-ID: <"mr6W4D.A.-oC.eV010"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2765 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 08:39:15 -0800 X-UIDL: 374ac16ed40d0209ba014d6fda49a166 As usual, you guys ARE the cognoscenti--YOU KNOW . . . but hey, I'll share this little windfall with people like you who like the FINER things . . . got just a few of these babies--ZIPs only, for Jammies. Give a listen, tell me what they're worth. Came from this little, wizened Japanese who burned RAW silicon in a run-down storefront off the electronics district in Kyoto, doped the Si with something special, Kryptonite, maybe, I don't know--anyway, think he's dead now . . . crossed the Yakuza on some SPECIAL software--don't matter, anyway . . . you know how with some chips you can tell whether the guy was playing a Prophet or playing a Yamaha emulating a Prophet . . . WELL . . .with these chips you can tell, what kind of cables he's running . . . his taste in mixers, and . . . what color shirt he's wearing entertaining offers Tom ;) At 01:22 AM 2/3/98 -0800, you wrote: >At 1:22 PM -0500 2/2/98, Fmplautus@aol.com wrote: >>Kim wrote... >> >>"gee, musicians are actually dumb enough to believe that their sound >>will be affected by the simms they use! Let's unload these expensive ones >>that nobody else will buy." >> >>The LoOpDoctORs can here the difference between different batches of SIMMS in >>both the Echoplex and the Jammen. We've come to prefer the Vintage Malaysian >>Simms from 1994...buttery mids and clear, warm highs, kind of like taking a >>dip in a waterfall on the road to Mandalay. And we turned Eric Johnson onto >>the Duracels you know. > >I've got some vintage 256k simms from the late 80's. Warmth and tone like >you won't believe. These puppies will really make your echoplex sing! >Highest bidder by next thursday gets 'em, you pay shipping. > >kim > >______________________________________________________________________ >Kim Flint | Looper's Delight >kflint@annihilist.com | http://www.annihilist.com/loop/loop.html >http://www.annihilist.com/ | Loopers-Delight-request@annihilist.com > > > > > Tom Lambrecht hideo@concentric.net From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 10:03:34 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 3 09:41:36 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzmLl-0004ec-00; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 09:41:33 -0800 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <003701bd2e56$b48c4a40$c722dacf@stepheng> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 11:56:46 -0500 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: David Myers Subject: Re: Frippery vs. Bitchery Resent-Message-ID: <"AA0BwC.A.HeD.QU110"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2773 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 09:41:33 -0800 X-UIDL: 03dfcee1f8dc6972e7224aa18c1d945e >You know, at no point in this strangely looping discussion has anyone talked >about the idea that - wonder of wonders! - perhaps RF LIKES what he's doing >right now...! > >I believe we've all been there, hm? But if you're looking for blazingly >fast technique guitar, go listen to one of the fellows from the G3 tour. >Amongst the things I get out of listening to music (and yes! Fripp's work >too), "being impressed" is not high on my list of expectations before the >performance. > >Just listen to it, and if you don't like it, listen to something else. I >just think this bitching about his work is pointless unless someone can come >up with an alternative guitarist/style/etc that one likes Better. Or >perhaps it's your own work you like better, just say so. > >Who ever said it was supposed to be exciting ALL the time anyway? Or did >yez think it was a marketing ploy when Fripp said (back in the early 80s, >pre-KC2) that at times he made an effort to be as boring as humanly >possible? > >I'd have kept my keyboard untouched on this one, if it had not denigrated >into this whiningly annoying bit. It smacks a bit of the Satriani-heads who >were also disappointed in Soundscape works. Oh brother, whatta buncha >consumers THEY are. :) > >Stephen Goodman * It's... The Loop Of The Week! >EarthLight Studios * http://www.earthlight.net/Studios > I sure hope Robert likes what he's doing-most artists do, I assume. But as an artist, he produces product for consumption (don't get him started...) and I for one have put a few bucks in his pocket because I have really loved much of what he has done. If you saw my "desert island" loop list, you'll notice that Bob is mentioned twice. I'm not whining when I criticize some of his efforts- part of the function of art is to set up a dialog, don't you think? Would like to have seen the Guitar Trio. Couple months ago a sprang for a G3 CD, but when I put it on it was some kind of slick pop Mexican mariachi band music. Huh? Even the disc printing was correct. As far as speed guitar, I just pull out my beloved Mahavishnu records.... While I'm here, let me renew my plea for any unwanted copies of David Torn's "What Means Solid, Traveller?" David? Any discs sitting around the house? What a shame about CMP. David Myers _______________________________________________ "Bees are not as busy as we think they are. They just can't buzz any slower." -Kin Hubbard From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 10:03:17 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 3 09:05:48 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzln8-0000DU-00; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 09:05:46 -0800 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <199802021322.IAA14349@marconi.concentric.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 11:59:47 -0500 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: David Myers Subject: Re: Process vs. Theory- was, Who's on the forefront of loopmuse Resent-Message-ID: <"YQ00I.A.Q2G.p0010"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2770 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 09:05:46 -0800 X-UIDL: 72b3c03d75fa8911772271bf87de5d86 > Wow David... I'll bet you're in for a roast! > > I saw Fripp waaayyyy back at Madame Wongs on his first Frippertronics > tour (1976 or so?) when he was carting around a couple of Revoxes. > After an incredibly long wait outside, we were the treated to a long > lecture about audience responsibility and his particular rules about > tape recorders and cameras etc. I saw about 1/2 hour of that and left. > > He did more to spoil the magic of hearing his music than any flashbulb > might have. I truly was looking forward to seeing him, and went away > disturbed that the event was so entirely uncomfortable. Not in any > mind-stretching avante-garde way, but just physically and mentally > overbearing. > > In more recent Soundscapes concerts, as impressive as I think they > are, I've often wished he'd just let it rip, if only for a moment or > so. How about responsibility to your audience Robert? I'll meet you > half way. > > Now I've done it. I'll see you in hell David Myers! > -Miko It's a date, Miko. I'll bet the unclean one won't let Robert bring his rack. We'll be forced to listen to him do Q & A 24 hrs. a day.... From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 10:03:30 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 3 09:25:08 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzm5k-0002jl-00; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 09:25:00 -0800 From: Fmplautus@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 12:20:05 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Re: Simm sound Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 78 Resent-Message-ID: <"1GlXg.A.48B.LH110"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2772 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 09:25:00 -0800 X-UIDL: fd64c8cff0fdc78c4774e7525e223b18 Kim baby... Anybody with ears knows that the mid-eighties 256 k seven pin simms were rejected by Leo Fender in the use of his "secret workshop" all tube, all analogue "digital" looper because of their screechy high end, and crummy sampling characteristics. However, the 1994 Malaysian simms were actually created due to an inspired vision that a Singaporian sound engineer had of a now be-halo'd and be-winged Leo Fender at a downtown newly opened McDonalds, where he the said engineer saw Leo dip the heavenly simm into a vat of McDonald's secret sauce, and then hold it up glowingly. Hence the LoOpDoctOrs price premium on their 94 Malaysian "greenface" simms. Best, the LoOpDoctOrs From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 10:03:37 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 3 09:47:02 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzmR0-0005MX-00; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 09:46:58 -0800 From: Fmplautus@aol.com Message-ID: <752fe647.34d75499@aol.com> Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 12:32:06 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Simm sound one-upsmanship Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 78 Resent-Message-ID: <"MNrJR.A.uyD.0W110"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2774 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 09:46:58 -0800 X-UIDL: a8e518ed2b7b4a9cbde746e08f3b8264 Oh got, what a monster...let's kill it. Of many worthy candidates, stone tablet thing was the best and had the LoOpDoctORs doing toppled bowling pin imitations on the floor. Best, the LoOpDoctOrs From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 10:03:37 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 3 09:46:56 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzmQt-0005Ld-00; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 09:46:51 -0800 From: MIvanBerk@aol.com Message-ID: <1a322a02.34d75573@aol.com> Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 12:35:45 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Bitchery vs. Fair Comment Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 57 Resent-Message-ID: <"CWZNoD.A.nzD.6W110"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2775 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 09:46:51 -0800 X-UIDL: 8dae11955fec3386cbc9f7abfde44138 I think I mentioned this a couple of weeks back, but I had the odd only-in-New York City experience of being bored by Fripp at the Bottom Line (most likely the same set David Myers witnessed) immediately after hearing an immensely exciting performance by looping violinist/LiSa manipulator Kaffe Matthews. But that's my personal bias. I felt that she was doing quite a bit more (so far as loopy density goes) with quite a bit less gear, but then again, what she was doing was far more compositionally oriented than what Fripp was doing. Matthews would generally improvise a theme, then begin to alter it via processing and resampling, move on to new figures, and resurrect old ones. Fripp's appeared to be less interested in dealing with the material he produced once it hit the Eventides and tc 2290s, doing his best to absent himself from the process to the point of walking offstage and letting the machines speak for themselves for a good amount of the performance. I found this tiring, and left immediately after the flashbulb incident. I must admit, however, that what did hold my interest about the performance was the audience's reception of Fripp than by anything he was doing. Those seated near me (at least the ones who didn't spend the evening competitively cataloguing their Crimson bootleg collections), seemed to find in the performance nothing but an affirmation of their solid belief in Fripp's virtuosity -- a performance that seemed (at least to me, and for better or for worse) completely uninterested in providing such evidence. Basically, yeah, he's boring -- and perhaps he means it. But does that make it better? By the way, if our David Myers is the one who's recorded lots of "multiprocessor feedback" as Arcane Device, he produces some interesting and unsettling loop music of his own and has every right to comment without possibility of damnation. -mike From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 10:03:41 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 3 09:58:46 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzmcN-0006tS-00; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 09:58:43 -0800 From: Marzzz@aol.com Message-ID: <60621594.34d758d9@aol.com> Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 12:50:15 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com, dmgraph@bway.net Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Re: Frippery vs. Bitchery Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 82 Resent-Message-ID: <"NOZG-C.A.L8F.Sn110"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2776 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 09:58:43 -0800 X-UIDL: 8fb0b922f0cfee15a97950648261f6cd In a message dated 2/3/98 11:39:41 AM, you wrote: >While I'm here, let me renew my plea for any unwanted copies of David >Torn's "What Means Solid, Traveller?" David? Any discs sitting around the >house? What a shame about CMP. Try Audiophile Imports at 410-628-7601 or http://www.cyboard.com/audiophile.html They might still have WMST? available..... Marshall From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 17:34:16 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 3 10:06:35 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzmjt-00002x-00; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 10:06:29 -0800 Message-ID: From: David Kirkdorffer To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Who's on the forefront of loopmuse? Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 13:02:10 -0500 X-Priority: 1 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) Content-Type: text/plain Resent-Message-ID: <"Fr4mBB.A.2oG.is110"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2777 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 10:06:29 -0800 X-UIDL: f4a266fb0d5d0f8701e9cd4c62724774 I'll try this again, just to see if this gets picked up. *So, just for giggles, what / who is on the forefront of "looping-based music"?* I know this is somewhat an impossible question, but, maybe it's worth bashing around for a while. David Kirkdorffer From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 17:34:28 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 3 10:19:08 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzmvv-0001kL-00; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 10:18:55 -0800 Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 13:07:35 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <199802031807.NAA28739@shell.monmouth.com> X-Sender: andre@mail.monmouth.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: andre Subject: Re: Frippery vs. Bitchery Resent-Message-ID: <"_q6AMC.A.bT.d0110"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2778 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 10:18:55 -0800 X-UIDL: f99b1e5bd485353d4884384d2f6e2006 >Date: Tue, 03 Feb 1998 13:06:40 >To: "Stephen P. Goodman" >From: andre >Subject: Re: Frippery vs. Bitchery > >At 06:44 AM 1/31/98 -0800, you wrote: >>You know, at no point in this strangely looping discussion has anyone talked >>about the idea that - wonder of wonders! - perhaps RF LIKES what he's doing >>right now...! > > >wheeeew!! RELAX - no-one ever questioned whether RF likes wht hes doing, of course he does... altho, in the new 'nightwatch' notes - he seems unable to decide which is more torture, playing crim music, or waiting for it to be played... re-read my note (BELOW) - at the risk of sounding pompous, i thought i was quite respectful, and accepting of whatever he has to offer, just a comment. > >> >>I believe we've all been there, hm? But if you're looking for blazingly >>fast technique guitar, > >WOW!!! what a jump!!%%@?? !! No - just something that we all don't do while warming up our gear, reading a manual or something. There's a lot of leeway there. He's a nut, that's all. and i love him, but lets not play hero worship. > >go listen to one of the fellows from the G3 tour. > >who are all excellent, diverse players, despite silly generalizations > >> >>Who ever said it was supposed to be exciting ALL the time anyway? > >no-one did. but fripp's music usually is, to me. And i love all the ambient stuff - evening star, index, the exposure CD, League stuff, all of it. I just think that - though i enjoy the CDs of the last couple years (soundscapes) greatly, on stage - it's just a boring waste. I'm sorry to piss you off, really. i want this to be a loving list. > >Not to mention- we all missed 90% of his show because we dared to SHOW UP ON TIME and not an hour or more earlier, when the gates were opened at G3.. I only wish i had seen one of the shows where Mike Keneally jammed along w/ RF.. > >>into this whiningly annoying bit. It smacks a bit of the Satriani-heads who >>were also disappointed in Soundscape works. Oh brother, whatta buncha >>consumers THEY are. :) > >what's a "satriani-head"?? someone who can appreciate his very diverse music, and also love ambience and sparse use of notes?? because that's what i am. You're doing the exact thing you claim to despise... It's all music. Actually have you heard - "woodstock Jam" on Satch's Time machine CD, or anything from the "Joe Satriani" CD of last year??? I regularly play that for satch-haters - the first is an OUT jam with doug wimbush and simon phillips, the 2nd a very bluesy record with nathan east, etc. 100% of the time, guitarists cannot identify it - because they have put the guy in a box as a "shredder" and only a shredder. > > >for reference - below is my post....as well as pete's. to be honest - i don't even know if your ire was directed at me - but i had to go to bat for JS. Ironically, you seem to forget that he's a huge Crimson/Fripp fan, duh, that's why he got him on the tour... Fripp himself has said that he made more per show on G3 than a week of KC shows... so the "satch-heads" may have helped us ALL by financing some frippery... > >again - i am a fripp freak. i love basically all guitar music, i try to keep an open mind, even about stuff i'm not supposed to like... > >>>>..whatever... i agree - it's some of fripp's most..... non exciting stuff. >>>>but , yes, i respect the fact - that was what he was going for.. but on >>the >>>>2 soundsscape CDs i have , plus the G3 show, it never seemed to take off, >>>>beyond simplistic, basic synth patches thru cool stereo FX. not as >>>>adventurous as he usually is, by far! >>>> >>>>andre' >>>> >>>> >>> >>>This is a good point. Fripp does rely too much on synth patches. Now that >>>can sometimes work very effectively such as on A Blessing of Tears, but >>more >>>often than not it just gets cloying. I would like to see him use the >>>natural sound of the guitar more - essentially i would like him to sound >>>like a guitarist, rather than a keyboard player. >>> >>>Pete >> > From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 10:02:55 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 3 08:20:28 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzl5B-0001oz-00; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 08:20:21 -0800 Message-ID: Date: 3 Feb 1998 10:10:28 -0800 From: "Hartnett, Travis" Subject: FS: PCM 41 $300 To: "Loopers Delight postings" X-Mailer: Mail*Link SMTP for Quarterdeck Mail; Version 4.1.0 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; Name="Message Body" Resent-Message-ID: <"cdKRfB.A.sGB.cK010"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2761 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 08:20:21 -0800 X-UIDL: b354dab5c879385c2e6d2c5bfb703498 Cool vintage gear from Harmony Central: Lexicon PCM 41 modulation/delay $ 300 Asking Price: US$N/A Condition: Excellent Age: N/A Description: Lexicon PCM 41 modulation/Delay rack effect with manuals. Sounds great! $ 300 Email me at jekman@evansville.net Seller: James Kinney, E-mail: jekman@evansville.net Location: BOONVILLE, IN Post Date: 2/3/98 From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 10:02:56 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 3 08:20:40 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzl5M-0001qN-00; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 08:20:32 -0800 Message-ID: Date: 3 Feb 1998 10:12:19 -0800 From: "Hartnett, Travis" Subject: FS: Vortex $140 To: "Loopers Delight postings" X-Mailer: Mail*Link SMTP for Quarterdeck Mail; Version 4.1.0 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; Name="Message Body" Resent-Message-ID: <"hsBpkD.A.XHB.hK010"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2762 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 08:20:32 -0800 X-UIDL: ffa5e3d9d722e139bdccd17f17bfb4af >From Harmony Central: Stuff Asking Price: US$999 Condition: Good Age: N/A Description: Lexicon Vortex w/ accesories - $140 Drawmer M500 dynamics processor - $900 (list over $2k) Zoom 9010 multi fx (4 in 4 out) - $380 Symetrix CL150 compressors (2) - $100 each proteus 1 and 2 midi sound module - $360 AKG C414EB studio mic - $725 (not your average 414...) Yamaha NS10 monitors - $225 Kawai K1 II midi keyboard - $230 wanted: DP2 fx Seller: David Silver, E-mail: internot@cdmweb.sfai.edu Post Date: 2/2/98 From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 17:34:31 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 3 10:26:01 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzn2c-0002gZ-00; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 10:25:50 -0800 Message-ID: <01BD30A5.B77FB920@TD-300> From: jprice@intcpi.com (John Price) To: "'Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com'" Subject: RE: Bitchery vs. Fair Comment Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 13:14:47 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="---- =_NextPart_000_01BD30A5.B782ED70" Resent-Message-ID: <"w_f8uB.A.C2.T4110"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2780 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 10:25:51 -0800 X-UIDL: 242d8f3962ab174a4b9325a51b691d75 Im no authority but I strongly believe that Fripp is about 3 basic things: 1.) The Moment. 2.) The Music which presents and defines itself as it needs to be expressed. 3.) The total and perhaps absolute juxtaposition or destruction of audiences expectations - and therein his expectations as well. The latter seems to be something Fripp places a lot of emphasis on for the purpose of not having to be weighted down as he sees it by demands that take you out of the spirit of listening, hearing and knowing all music has to give you. Read any of his interviews, follow his career paths and various incarnate projects and such and theres a pattern of someone who is always looking for ways to step outside of himself and grow into something new that was not present before. The reactions Ive read thus far seem to say more about the expectations and wishes of the listener or audience as opposed to what the music needed to be and what it said or was trying to tell them. There are many ways to listen and there is always great difficulty in hearing something free from our own perceptions which can often times be a distraction and misleading. I saw Fripp at The Painted Bride in Philly and I came away with a lot of things: Boredom, Beauty, Repetition, Balance, Chaos and Extreme Calculation, Discipline, Mega-Extreme Organized thought Patterns that were Improvisationally intuitive. All this stuff was happening all at once at any given time. I tend to view music vividly as constantly contrasting and moving colors and The Painted Bride Performance at times was really cool, thrilling and concurrently really dull to the point of ennui - but I could appreciate it and hear some - not quite all but enough of what was going on to see what the big picture could be and was probably about. My only complaint was there was just way too much going so subtly at The Bride Show - Fripp was a pretty busy player just in a way you wouldn't recognize it. Ironically he was giving in (IMHO) to what so many people wanted to see him do - play a lot of notes or make lots of noise - he did it his way. None of this "insight", came to me overnight. Its been unraveling ever since I saw his performance and still keeps unfolding the more I reflect on the experience. No it aint the best thing since Ziplock bags Or Christy Canyon but its truly something else which is often missing way too often in music lately - an original perspective that can easilly be dismissed and overlooked - which is somehow where Fripp wants and seems to be right now. JP -----Original Message----- From: Peter Thompson [SMTP:pt205@hermes.cam.ac.uk] Sent: Tuesday, February 03, 1998 10:45 AM To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Bitchery vs. Fair Comment As the co-accused in the Goodman Bitch Trials I would merely like to say the following: I don't see how my comment can be considered as bitching. I simple wished to amplify Andre's point about Fripps use of patches. I neither commented on nor do I agree with any of the points that he made about Fripp being exciting. Nor do I agree with the previous comments about Fripp being the 'bottom line'. I have no doubt Fripp adores what he is doing - I have a lot of time for his music. I have no desire at all for him to be 'exciting' if the definition of that word includes sounding like Satriani. Restraint is a highly underrated virtue, one that some posters to LD might like to consider. If we are going to have Mr Goodman jump down our throats every time we express an opinion, however anodyne, then perhaps we better all just stick to talking about SIMMs and mixers and stuff. Pete -----Original Message----- From: Stephen P. Goodman To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Date: 03 February 1998 14:45 Subject: Frippery vs. Bitchery >You know, at no point in this strangely looping discussion has anyone talked >about the idea that - wonder of wonders! - perhaps RF LIKES what he's doing >right now...! > >I believe we've all been there, hm? But if you're looking for blazingly >fast technique guitar, go listen to one of the fellows from the G3 tour. >Amongst the things I get out of listening to music (and yes! Fripp's work >too), "being impressed" is not high on my list of expectations before the >performance. > >Just listen to it, and if you don't like it, listen to something else. I >just think this bitching about his work is pointless unless someone can come >up with an alternative guitarist/style/etc that one likes Better. Or >perhaps it's your own work you like better, just say so. > >Who ever said it was supposed to be exciting ALL the time anyway? Or did >yez think it was a marketing ploy when Fripp said (back in the early 80s, >pre-KC2) that at times he made an effort to be as boring as humanly >possible? > >I'd have kept my keyboard untouched on this one, if it had not denigrated >into this whiningly annoying bit. It smacks a bit of the Satriani-heads who >were also disappointed in Soundscape works. Oh brother, whatta buncha >consumers THEY are. :) > >Stephen Goodman * It's... The Loop Of The Week! >EarthLight Studios * http://www.earthlight.net/Studios > >>>..whatever... i agree - it's some of fripp's most..... non exciting stuff. >>>but , yes, i respect the fact - that was what he was going for.. but on >the >>>2 soundsscape CDs i have , plus the G3 show, it never seemed to take off, >>>beyond simplistic, basic synth patches thru cool stereo FX. not as >>>adventurous as he usually is, by far! >>> >>>andre' >>> >>> >> >>This is a good point. Fripp does rely too much on synth patches. Now that >>can sometimes work very effectively such as on A Blessing of Tears, but >more >>often than not it just gets cloying. I would like to see him use the >>natural sound of the guitar more - essentially i would like him to sound >>like a guitarist, rather than a keyboard player. >> >>Pete >> >> >> > > > From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 17:34:37 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 3 10:33:09 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzn9Y-0003fi-00; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 10:33:00 -0800 Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 11:18:13 -0700 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: dtapia@unoco.edu (Douglas Tapia) Subject: Re: Mixer recommendations Resent-Message-ID: <"PMktfB.A.wkB.y9110"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2781 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 10:33:01 -0800 X-UIDL: 5cc1f96cdee4b54e1c53c9d6f9e5f9bc >Speaking of mixers, anybody have any experience with Samson? They have a >couple of reasonably priced stereo powered mixers. Any idea how they sound? > I've had some experience with Samson in small club type reinforcment. Their stuff isn't anything to write home about IMHO. The couple I've seen tended to be rather noisy, and fairly cheesy. Pots got scratchy in no time in the smokey bar environment, the eq points didn't make a whole lot of musical sense to me, and the preamps were only fair. Then again, we were just pluging in SM57s and 58s and a couple of 421s, so it's not like we had unbelivebly clean sources. I don't suppose the speakers really helped either. Can't remember what these were, but they, and the amp and the mixer made for a sound that was stuffy and rather nasal despite some fairly heavy-handed EQ. Using this mixer with line level equipment might produce far different results. Take care, Doug T. From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 17:34:44 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 3 10:51:43 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xznRY-00063c-00; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 10:51:36 -0800 Message-Id: <1.5.4.32.19980203184633.006914f4@interactive.net> X-Sender: jbrainin@interactive.net X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 03 Feb 1998 13:46:33 -0500 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Jonathan Brainin Subject: RE: Bitchery vs. Fair Comment Resent-Message-ID: <"Pfe9YD.A.v6E.LX210"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2782 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 10:51:36 -0800 X-UIDL: 246cb38dbf683fb244d78b0d4ea6eba3 At 01:14 PM 2/3/98 -0500, you wrote: >No it aint the best thing since Ziplock bags Or Christy Canyon but its truly something else which is often missing way too often in music lately - an original perspective that can easilly be dismissed and overlooked - which is somehow where Fripp wants and seems to be right now. > >JP So who's Christy Canyon? What does she play? Jonathan Brainin jbrainin@interactive.net From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 17:34:49 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 3 11:01:19 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xznaw-0007NU-00; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 11:01:18 -0800 Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 13:51:35 -0500 From: Michael Peters Subject: AW: Re: Location. Sender: Michael Peters To: "'INTERNET:Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com'" Message-ID: <199802031352_MC2-31BE-E669@compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Disposition: inline Resent-Message-ID: <"mkEOi.A.G8F.ye210"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2783 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 11:01:18 -0800 X-UIDL: 0e9f6b7902d4500d1fafd49a02ff1844 >At this time, we are automating this section ... >This is being set up Chris Chovit and Michael Peters, >who have been amazing and brilliant in making it happen. er, ... thanks but the new automatic profile page was entirely Chris's work. Michael Peters http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/mpeters.htm From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 01:37:50 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 3 01:29:15 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzefJ-0002ix-00; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 01:29:13 -0800 Message-Id: <3.0.1.16.19980203110450.0fb7667a@rank-serv.elec.gla.ac.uk> X-Sender: pycraft@rank-serv.elec.gla.ac.uk X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.1 (16) Date: Tue, 03 Feb 1998 11:04:50 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: "Michael P. Hughes, Ph.D." Subject: Re: Re: Re: Location. In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"Kx1AE.A.ZIC.-Ju10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2748 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 01:29:13 -0800 X-UIDL: 9443e41dc5107759c00c3979f848a331 >>This is exactly the point of the "Loopers of the World" section of the >>Looper's Delight website. It contains profiles of people from all over the >>world, with descriptions of their styles, background, contact info, gear, >etc. >Ah! I keep forgetting...not that it matters much...but nearly a year ago I >moved from sunny SoCal to rainy Oregon...and I've much to change in my profile >on the Loop-D page. Please post details as soon as it becomes possible to make >such changes. I too have been planning to change my L-D page; partly because my equipment's changed, but mostly because it's so horribly pretentious! Cringe! Michael Glasgow, Scotland Home of Dolly the Looped Sheep From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 17:35:00 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 3 11:46:44 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzoIn-0004a8-00; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 11:46:37 -0800 Message-Id: <98Feb3.133739cst.26882@gateway.gibson.com> X-Sender: tspauldi@mail.nash.gibson.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 13:40:02 -0600 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Tom Spaulding Subject: Oberheim Update/News Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"azVoC.A.ogD.PK310"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2785 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 11:46:37 -0800 X-UIDL: df6d9280e08adbc1ba3c62fc4801c23f Calling All Gooberheim Fans- Dave Eichenberger, a strapping, loopish lad will be 'plexing to the puddled masses at the Florida Guitar Show on February 28th at the Thoroughbred store in Clearwater, FL. Go see him. He will be sporting the latest in fashion, the little black T-shirt with Oberheim logo. Available now from House of Oberheim, sensibly priced at an affable $15.00. A portion of all proceeds are directed to the "Thermal Problem Home for Wayward Noise". Photo with appropriate models on our website soon. Really. All EDP and Footswitch backorders will have shipped by the end of this month. Thanks for the support. Buy two - get stereo. NAMM was great fun - very busy. Many people discovering what many of you already know... It's not too soon to make plans for the Summer NAMM show in Nashville. I don't know the exact dates, but it's usually on the hottest days in July. BTW, Oberheim was translated to me as Ober ="High" or "Above" and heim = House, NOT Ober ="Out". ;) Tom "Where Can I Get One of These?" Spaulding From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 17:35:03 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 3 11:54:33 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzoQM-0005cm-00; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 11:54:26 -0800 Message-ID: <01BD30B3.2067E180@TD-300> From: jprice@intcpi.com (John Price) To: "'loopers-delight@annihilist.com'" Subject: Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 14:50:49 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"ReZtg.A.igE.IS310"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2786 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 11:54:26 -0800 X-UIDL: 0a328646d4f5b8d0474495af5c5176f2 Christy Canyon is a dark haired, Doe eyed, big boobed, very attractive and voluptuous Porno Star from the mid-late 80's whose instrument was...ummm... her body, more or less. She's a legend and truly an original that was 100% natural and ... ahemmm...proportionate or perhaps better yet passionate about her craft. She appeared in literally thousands of "loops". :) From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 17:35:07 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 3 12:09:33 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzoeu-0007NO-00; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 12:09:28 -0800 Message-Id: <2.2.32.19980203200324.00a5ff10@pop.chromatic.com> X-Sender: kflint@pop.chromatic.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 2.2 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 03 Feb 1998 12:03:24 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Kim Flint Subject: RE: Bitchery vs. Fair Comment Resent-Message-ID: <"zRO8K.A.RVG.Sh310"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2787 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 12:09:28 -0800 X-UIDL: ff5f66d78b0ea5d60eba4e22f2dd67ba At 01:46 PM 2/3/98 -0500, Jonathan Brainin wrote: >At 01:14 PM 2/3/98 -0500, you wrote: >>No it aint the best thing since Ziplock bags Or Christy Canyon but its >truly something else which is often missing way too often in music lately - >an original perspective that can easilly be dismissed and overlooked - which >is somehow where Fripp wants and seems to be right now. >> >>JP > >So who's Christy Canyon? What does she play? >Jonathan Brainin ha ha! Wouldn't you like to know? I think it's some sort of wind instrument... kim _______________________________________________________ Kim Flint 408-752-9284 Mpact Systems Engineering kflint@chromatic.com Chromatic Research http://www.chromatic.com From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 17:35:13 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 3 12:37:47 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzp6F-0002py-00; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 12:37:43 -0800 Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 15:29:39 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <199802032029.PAA15995@newman.concentric.net> X-Sender: hideo@pop3.concentric.net X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Tom Lambrecht Subject: RE: Bitchery vs. Fair Comment Resent-Message-ID: <"LaVz2C.A.byB._4310"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2789 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 12:37:43 -0800 X-UIDL: 22b119589d4622b30cf903c4997f0233 In the absence of the original poster, I will take the liberty of answering: I emphasize that I do not speak from experience of the aforementioned artiste, but I believe Ms. Canyon is in the "men's entertainment" industry (cough) Tom At 01:46 PM 2/3/98 -0500, you wrote: >At 01:14 PM 2/3/98 -0500, you wrote: >>No it aint the best thing since Ziplock bags Or Christy Canyon but its >truly something else which is often missing way too often in music lately - >an original perspective that can easilly be dismissed and overlooked - which >is somehow where Fripp wants and seems to be right now. >> >>JP > >So who's Christy Canyon? What does she play? >Jonathan Brainin >jbrainin@interactive.net > > > > Tom Lambrecht hideo@concentric.net From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 17:35:20 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 3 12:54:45 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzpMe-0004ju-00; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 12:54:40 -0800 Message-ID: <01BD30BB.84580320@TD-300> From: jprice@intcpi.com (John Price) To: "'Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com'" Subject: RE: Who's on the forefront of loopmuse? Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 15:50:55 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="---- =_NextPart_000_01BD30BB.84674560" Resent-Message-ID: <"iRacCB.A.prD.TK410"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2790 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 12:54:40 -0800 X-UIDL: 17bf90d9caec09044d9c7f2da5c318ce Gosh darn it! Im feelin awful chatty today. The forefront of Looping today is on what most here would undoubtedly consider the lowbrow side of all things loop that is if you are prone to categorizing things. IMHO - It's the dance floor dude that is still driving things loopey for the majority of the world - Musicians and audiences included. Obvious and overexposed Loop Leaders: Beck, Square Pusher, DJ's Spookey & Shadow (Spelling??) Photek, Puff Daddy ( He aint original and he sure don't drone. But his loops are in the hands and ears of eager children all across the world while their $ is secure in his bank account) and The Orb on the Higher end of low end. Frankly, I can't nor would I ever dare say that any artist is better than the other. Its always like a pissing contest. And I cant stand it when people turn music appreciation into a sport and forum for their own biases and need to be acknowledged. Just a premonition of how people will respond to DK's question. -----Original Message----- From: David Kirkdorffer [SMTP:DKirkdorffer@exapps.com] Sent: Tuesday, February 03, 1998 1:02 PM To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Who's on the forefront of loopmuse? I'll try this again, just to see if this gets picked up. *So, just for giggles, what / who is on the forefront of "looping-based music"?* I know this is somewhat an impossible question, but, maybe it's worth bashing around for a while. David Kirkdorffer From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 17:35:23 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 3 13:02:34 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzpUG-0005mz-00; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 13:02:32 -0800 Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 12:57:32 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: improv@peak.org (Dave Trenkel) Subject: Re: RE: RE:Fernandes guy at NAMM Resent-Message-ID: <"xzjiWB.A.81E.FT410"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2791 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 13:02:32 -0800 X-UIDL: aba00e51959d3b52504c30be1327aeb3 >Hi Kim: > >Thanks for the sustainer report. You mentioned ocsillators. Have you gotten >your hands on the Boss bass synthesis pedal that came out a while back and >turns the bottom four strings of a guitar into something analogue synth like? >If you have, how does this compare to the Sustainer? > >Best, >The LoOpDoctOrs I have the Korg G5, which is their take on the synth bass pedal meme. It's great for getting cheesy analog-esque bass sounds, and has a very good envelope filter, but it doesn't do endless sustain. It's tracking is kind of flaky, I've found that flat wound strings with the treble all the way down get the best performance, and the synth tones will die out long before the unaffected bass sound does. But it does get great sustaining tones with E-bow'd bass. BTW, I've been using E-bow on bass for years, and it works fine with practice. Also, I just scored a Fender Rhodes Stage 73 piano, in excellent condition for next to nothing. Spent yesterday evening running it through every effect I've got. The Vortex and Gonkulator make a particular potent combo... Just another moss-covered looper from the misty backwoods of Oregon, dt ________________________________________________________ Dave Trenkel : improv@peak.org : www.peak.org/~improv/ "...there will come a day when you won't have to use gasoline. You'd simply take a cassette and put it in your car, let it run. You'd have to have the proper type of music. Like you take two sticks, put 'em together, make fire. You take some notes and rub 'em together - dum, dum, dum, dum - fire, cosmic fire." -Sun Ra ________________________________________________________ From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 17:35:28 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 3 13:16:02 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzphF-0007IT-00; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 13:15:57 -0800 Message-ID: <19980203211101.2807.qmail@hotmail.com> X-Originating-IP: [204.74.108.99] From: "Joseph Buck" To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Oberheim Update/News Content-Type: text/plain Date: Tue, 03 Feb 1998 13:11:00 PST Resent-Message-ID: <"4NMLuC.A.JZG.jg410"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2792 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 13:15:57 -0800 X-UIDL: 84b94bcfbe3f4a9f27b59f1642cd5ed6 Tom- >BTW, Oberheim was translated to me as Ober ="High" or "Above" and heim = >House, NOT Ober ="Out". ;) I thought it meant over and out...... B ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 17:35:37 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 3 13:21:59 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzpn3-0000Fv-00; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 13:21:57 -0800 Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 16:15:42 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <199802032115.QAA23601@cliff.concentric.net> X-Sender: hideo@pop3.concentric.net (Unverified) X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Tom Lambrecht Subject: Re: Delay devices spotted Resent-Message-ID: <"zc9A3D.A.o0G.Ck410"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2793 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 13:21:57 -0800 X-UIDL: 96a33009e84e3648c89e9e59d12a8081 Recent sightings on rec: marketplace Jamman "mint" with eveything best offer over $400 boelan@aol.com PCM 42--Lexicon-modified by Gary Hall to 20 seconds of delay :0 $750 ronnieland@aol.com drone on~~~~~ Tom ps the mixer thread is fascinating--I've made a mental note to listen to more of 'em THANKS again for all the tech help I've received (specifically and inadvertently) from this group--I've got my very own POCKET PROTECTOR now . . . ;) Tom Lambrecht hideo@concentric.net From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 17:36:00 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 3 14:36:39 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzqx9-00006x-00; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 14:36:27 -0800 Message-Id: <1.5.4.32.19980203223054.0066b87c@tiac.net> X-Sender: rphunt@tiac.net (Unverified) X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 03 Feb 1998 17:30:54 -0500 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com, etnier@studiodual.com From: Reginald Hunt Subject: loops, ambient or otherwise Resent-Message-ID: <"T9U8tB.A.zBH.lr510"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2794 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 14:36:27 -0800 X-UIDL: 42669127a56a5176df3081056bd75cf3 The topics below obviously touch on some interesting fundamental points: Music and Artistically Valid Noise Yes I consider them different. Possibly Music is a subset of AVN. Or they are side by side under a larger category(?) For me, method of production is irrelavant to whether I wish or need to hear the final result. Granted, Music and AVN are broad subjects. They are not always about a final sonic result per se. But sometimes they are. And sometimes those sonic results are meant to achieve states of mind other than joy, anger, or pathos. Of course, approval of those states of mind is an essentially political choice. By method of production, I refer to technology and technique, and also to the envoronment the work is conceived in. Good work can be produced by situations ranging from a lone person in his apartment to a band/orchestra in a live venue. But since the discussion here relates to Looping as the technology/technique, I bring up the next point.... **************************************************************************** ********* My operating definition of "looping" has been this: Electronically or mechanically repeated time segments of audio. The time segments would be at least about 1 second. Obviously, the time segments must be shorter than infinite, or else no repeat occurs. A person sitting at a keyboard and playing the same phrase over and over manually is not looping, he is repeating. Yodelling in a canyon is not looping, it is echo. The effects can sometimes be similar using any of the three. Which is why I bring up the next point.... **************************************************************************** ********* The purpose of looping to me appears to be: To create interesting repeating patterns of sound (Music or AVN) easily. To create thick layers of sounds unachievable in any any other economically feasable way. To create a One-Man-Band. Any uses of looping I've experienced has fallen into one or more of those categories. Notice that I do not include any specific political, psychological, or aesthetic goals. Looping in itself is neutral to these. However, any technology or technique has uses that are immediately suggested, and others uses that are discovered or developed after experience. **************************************************************************** ********* Unfortunately, the human animal can suffer from the tendency to follow sheep-like (or lemming-like). Ambient music has suffered from its contingent of brain dead devotees, as has Fripp. Originally, ambient music was not intended as a hypnotic tranquilizer (which looping inherently lends itself to). It was meant as music which operates equally on different levels of awareness simultaneously. Persons who assume that loopers are into ambient music by default, are a type of bigot. But don't damn a style of music for that. Fripp has always been an acquired taste. His explorations extend beyond music per se. He has always questioned the audience-performer relationship, and the effect of the music business on musicians. His actions at performances are reflective of all that and probably more. He's never been about being a "hot" player. The many comments I've seen here and elsewhere asking why he doesn't "rip it up", or about him leavng the stage and observing the audience, shows a lack of understanding about the artist. Fripp has never been about being a Looper, either. For him it is a method, not the point. Seems to me, that's a good lesson for a lot of us. Reg **************************************************************************** ********* **************************************************************************** ********* From: "Liebig, Steuart A." To: "'Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com'" Subject: RE: location & Loopers' CD Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 18:17:26 -0600<>Resent-Message-ID: <"vt6_M.A.yJF.WJm10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2728 Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: rphunt@tiac.net Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 16:29:25 -0800 Yeah, I tend to think of loops as being only a small part of the live/recorded imporvised or composed experience. A small part of the canvas, sometimes you need to do alot sometimes a little; sometimes intense noise, sometimes tonal bliss . . . If all you are doing is looping, well I don't know . . . are you playing music or IC chips? . . . I only say this because I have friends who have gone this route and I'm not really sure that it leads to what I consider an important factor in music: human interaction. (Often have the same problem with totally pre-recorded concerts or music concrete.) > ---------- > From: Kim Flint > Reply To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com > Sent: Monday, February 2, 1998 4:04 PM > To: LiebigSA@maritz.com > Subject: Re: location & Loopers' CD > > At 03:44 PM 2/2/98 EST, paparuda o o wrote: > > > > >yeah! even more, i would actually like to meet other loopers; > > I think that is generally a great idea, and probably my biggest > motivation > for creating this whole monster of an internet address! Get together! > Collaborate! Share ideas! Real-live or Virtual! Go forth and Multiply! > > > (pun intended there....) > > > >it's seems to me that most of the loopers are into "ambient" > >instrumental music. > > I'm not. In fact, I'm morally opposed to being an ambient musician. > What > others choose to do with their lives is their own business, but I > resolutely > refuse to have anything to do with this ambient stuff. I'm deeply > offended > by any implication that being into looping means I'm ambient. I'm > proud of > my long history here resisting the ambient tyranny that threatens to > overcome all other loopists! I will also continue to resist shameless > idol > worship of this Fripp fellow. Soundscapes, poundcakes. Not for me! > > of course, neither of those is as sick as being a deadhead. Those > maniacs > are actually planning to open a Grateful Dead theme park in San > Francisco. > The apocalypse will arrive none too soon. > > this, of course, gets many smiley's: :-) :-) :-) :-) :-) > > > >so, please, if you have a copy of the "loopers CD", or > >would like to share your (COPYRIGHT protected) looped music > >can you let me know? > > that CD project actually is not yet completed. As I understand, it's > in a > bag on someone's shelf awaiting arrival of the still-vaporware-Layla > sound > card. Seems likely that CD #2 will arrive before CD #1. > > kim > _______________________________________________________ > Kim Flint 408-752-9284 > Mpact Systems Engineering kflint@chromatic.com > Chromatic Research http://www.chromatic.com > > From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 17:36:12 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 3 15:02:41 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzrMP-0003Ja-00; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 15:02:33 -0800 From: Fmplautus@aol.com Message-ID: <6e8ca90d.34d79ef6@aol.com> Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 17:49:24 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Re: RE: RE:Fernandes guy at NAMM Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 78 Resent-Message-ID: <"08e5AB.A.1uB.i9510"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2796 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 15:02:33 -0800 X-UIDL: e88230a3881e8723e03eea182532c946 What is it about Oregon and looping? You think it's the Twin Peaks vibe? best, The LoOpDoctOrs From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 17:36:10 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 3 14:56:35 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzrGP-0002WG-00; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 14:56:21 -0800 Message-ID: <34D79FFA.403F@earthlink.net> Date: Tue, 03 Feb 1998 14:53:47 -0800 From: Andre LaFosse Reply-To: altruist@earthlink.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01-C-MACOS8 (Macintosh; I; 68K) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Who's on the forefront of loopmuse? References: <01BD30BB.84580320@TD-300> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"RcmDLD.A.qXB.p6510"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2795 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 14:56:21 -0800 X-UIDL: 1c2dced242efbe267914db7cad487f90 Gotta add a few cents in: John Price wrote: > The forefront of Looping today is on what most here would undoubtedly > consider the lowbrow side of all things loop that is if you are prone > to categorizing things. Actually, there are quite a few of us on the list who are very much into the so-called "lowbrow" side of electronic music; there are also a few rather high-profile members of that "community" on the list. > IMHO - It's the dance floor dude that is still driving things loopey > for the majority of the world - Musicians and audiences included. There's no doubt that loop-driven music is pretty much the mainstream right now. You can't go near the top 40 without some sort of sample-based rap or R&B tune rearing its head. But I think there's a distinction to be made between something which is at the forefront of music commerce (i.e. what's selling to a lot of people) as opposed to something that's pushing the envelope of the art or craft of music in itself, which is often (and usually) very far removed from the mainstream. I'm assuming that it's the latter of these two that fostered the original post in this thread. > Obvious and overexposed Loop Leaders: Beck, I think you've got to factor Beck's co-producers into the picture as well: Carl Stephenson on _Mellow Gold_ and the Dust Brothers for most of _Odelay_. I'm not familiar with his more obscure independent releases, but my general impression (which I'll happily have disproven by anyone more well-acquainted with his work than I am) is that Beck's primarily a singer-songwriter, albiet of a wonderfully eccentric persuasion, who gets a lot of his cut-and-paste aesthetic from production collaborators. > Square Pusher, Squarepusher overexposed?! Here in America, the only way you can get hold of any of his recordings is via usually pricey British imports. Granted, 60,000 copies of _Hard Normal Daddy_ sold in the UK is quite a feat for music as angular as his, but I would definitely have to say that he's a long way from being even a mainstream artist in terms of his recognition factor within the drum-n-bass scene (to which he's only marginally a "part" of, anyway), which in itself has a very low profile relative to your typical pop music (again, this is from an American point of view. Keep in mind that Goldie only sold in the low 10,000's with _Timeless_.) Also worth noting is that Tom Jenkinson (the man behind the Squarepusher alias) goes out of his way to avoid looping in much of his programming; he deliberately programs out all of his drum patterns manually, making sure to rarely if ever repeat a pattern. It's a very different aesthetic than your standard hypnotic loop music, and in fact one of the first criticisms he recieved was that his rhythms didn't repeat enough. > Puff Daddy ( He aint original and he sure don't drone. But his loops > are in the hands and ears of eager children all across the world while > their $ is secure in his bank account) This gets back to the issue of how you're identifying the "forefront" of this sort of music-making approach. He's selling an obscene anount of records, it's true, but from a musical point of view, he's not doing anything in terms of the construction or mechanics of his music that weren't being done at least 15 years ago by hip-hop producers with more creativity, less showbiz savvy, and a smaller budget to pay for obvious sample-clearance royalties. > and The Orb on the Higher end of low end. Has anyone heard the collaboration Phillip Glass did with Richard "Aphex Twin" James a few years ago? The distinction between the "high" and "low" aspects of this music (and music in general) gets more and more blurry (not to mention useless) as more and more "serious" composers emerge with a strong background of rock and jazz in their past. I actually saw a very amusing article in a mag a few months ago (I think it was _Option_) in which a reporter played Phillip Glass a number of CDs by the likes of Orbital, Underworld, Mu-Ziq, and others to gauge his reaction. Some funny stuff in there... --Andre LaFosse From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 17:36:13 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 3 15:06:53 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzrQS-0003sP-00; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 15:06:44 -0800 From: Paolo Valladolid Message-Id: <199802032254.OAA19784@waynesworld.ucsd.edu> Subject: Re: Who's on the forefront of loopmuse? To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 14:54:39 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: <01BD30BB.84580320@TD-300> from "John Price" at Feb 3, 98 03:50:55 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"iQ_fWB.A.INC.KB610"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2797 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 15:06:45 -0800 X-UIDL: 7cb41ca806ff29d0f6d29f18d653564e I don't know if this is directly related to the question, but one interesting application of looping might be in video games. One of my roommates likes to play a Playstation game called "Parappa The Rappa". Parappa is the character you play in this game (looks like a young relative of Snoopy with a hat on). You help him rap with the people he encounters (a turnip karate sensei, a cow meter maid, etc.) by following a visual cue at the top of the screen and hitting the appropriate buttons in time with the cue and the music. There is an element of improvisation in that you can introduce a stuttering effect depending on how quickly you repeatedly hit the buttons (e.g. Parappa says "Pu-Pu-Punch!" instead of just "Punch!"). At the right of the screen there's a meter that runs from "You Be Rappin Ill!" to "You Be Rappin Excellent" or something like that. What I find interesting about this game is that it lets people with no musical training at all get a taste of musical improvisation and work on their rhythm through a non-standard interface or "instrument". Cheers, Paolo Valladolid --------------------------------------------------------------- |Moderator of Digital Guitar Digest, an Internet mailing list |\ |for Music Technology and Stringed Instruments | \ ---------------------------------------------------------------- | \ finger pvallado@waynesworld.ucsd.edu for more info \ | \ http://waynesworld.ucsd.edu/DigitalGuitar/home.html \| ----------------------------------------------------------------- From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 17:36:31 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 3 16:05:45 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzsLV-0002cs-00; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 16:05:41 -0800 Message-Id: <2.2.32.19980203235737.009acdb0@pop.chromatic.com> X-Sender: kflint@pop.chromatic.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 2.2 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 03 Feb 1998 15:57:37 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com, "'Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com'" From: Kim Flint Subject: RE: Who's on the forefront of loopmuse? Resent-Message-ID: <"-7ca6C.A.tnB.z8610"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2798 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 16:05:41 -0800 X-UIDL: 31b1aa84c7853805504ce2e8befeda13 At 03:50 PM 2/3/98 -0500, John Price wrote: >Gosh darn it! Im feelin awful chatty today. > >The forefront of Looping today is on what most here would undoubtedly consider the lowbrow side of all things loop that is if you are prone to categorizing things. > >IMHO - It's the dance floor dude that is still driving things loopey for the majority of the world - Musicians and audiences included. I tend to agree with this, although it's not always so lowbrow as you might think. A lot of that is a bit of a pose, and often times the people behind it are very sophisticated musicians. The possibilities for innovation and creativity are huge, and a lot of talented people have moved in that direction to take advantage of it. Andre did a nice job of commenting on that, no need for me to add anything there. The dance/electronic/hip-hop/etc. scene is definitely where I see all the innovation in looping as a method, as a process, as a tool, as a type of music. I see people there constantly pushing to evolve things and do something different, move it to the next level. The musicians, the audience, the dj's, and the press all seem to support and encourage that, it's ingrained in the scene in an interesting and healthy way. Loop concepts grow by leaps and bounds there. Another spot of innovation would be the solo instrumentalists, integrating loops into compositions and performances in interesting new ways, expanding their reach. I think you see that here in the many people looping with fingerstyle guitar, or cello, or voice. Probably there are innovative things happening in the academic/high-brow world, but I just don't follow that enough to know. Where I don't see much innovation with looping is in the droney guitar loop scene, the stuff often associated with Fripp. The music may continue to be vital and interesting, but the use of loops is pretty stagnant and complacent. Sorry, but I just don't see anyone pushing the looping process anywhere in that scene. (although it's possible that I just go so bored with it I stopped paying attention.) For me as a developer of loop devices, it is definitely the dance producers who are driving things. They are the ones forcing the innovation in tools and driving us with a constant flow of ideas. Trying to understand, meet, and anticipate their needs so that a looping device might be an effective instrument in that world is a very tough challenge! And the possibilities are so huge and fresh, along with the sheer volume of creativity, that the challenge is really quite exciting and fun. You really get the feeling that when a new feature is introduced, someone will jump on it and do something remarkable. With the droney guitar loop crowd, most of the push is to get one box that does all the things that different boxes available 10-20 years ago did. And that's certainly reasonable, but it's not exactly breaking new ground. You give them something new and they barely notice, maybe getting around to it after a few years. (and in 15 years they will just be demanding that feature in any new device!) anyway, that's my take. kim >Obvious and overexposed Loop Leaders: Beck, Square Pusher, DJ's Spookey & Shadow (Spelling??) Photek, Puff Daddy ( He aint original and he sure don't drone. But his loops are in the hands and ears of eager children all across the world while their $ is secure in his bank account) and The Orb on the Higher end of low end. > >Frankly, I can't nor would I ever dare say that any artist is better than the other. Its always like a pissing contest. And I cant stand it when people turn music appreciation into a sport and forum for their own biases and need to be acknowledged. Just a premonition of how people will respond to DK's question. > > > >-----Original Message----- >From: David Kirkdorffer [SMTP:DKirkdorffer@exapps.com] >Sent: Tuesday, February 03, 1998 1:02 PM >To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com >Subject: Who's on the forefront of loopmuse? > >I'll try this again, just to see if this gets picked up. > >*So, just for giggles, what / who is on the forefront of "looping-based >music"?* >I know this is somewhat an impossible question, but, maybe it's worth >bashing around for a while. > >David Kirkdorffer > >Attachment Converted: C:\Program Files\Eudora\Attach\RE Who's on the forefront of l > _______________________________________________________ Kim Flint 408-752-9284 Mpact Systems Engineering kflint@chromatic.com Chromatic Research http://www.chromatic.com From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 17:36:45 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 3 16:32:41 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzsla-0005cr-00; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 16:32:38 -0800 Mime-Version: 1.0 Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 16:14:57 -0800 Message-ID: <00085E66.----@wj.com> From: Mike.Biffle@wj.com (Mike Biffle) Subject: Re: loops, ambient or otherwise To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com, Reginald Hunt Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Description: cc:Mail note part Resent-Message-ID: <"L5wLd.A.4AE.hS710"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2799 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 16:32:38 -0800 X-UIDL: 6e0b5c990498bd8670ececd2666c4fdf Thanks Reg for such clear and devoloped definitions regarding looping. Most of my comments are in reply to your feelings about Robert Fripp below. Reginald Hunt wrote... >The topics below obviously touch on some interesting fundamental points: >Music and Artistically Valid Noise >Yes I consider them different. Possibly Music is a subset of AVN. Or they >are side by side under a larger category(?) For me, method of production is >irrelavant to whether I wish or need to hear the final result. Granted, >Music and AVN are broad subjects. They are not always about a final sonic >result per se. But sometimes they are. And sometimes those sonic results are >meant to achieve states of mind other than joy, anger, or pathos. Of course, >approval of those states of mind is an essentially political choice. >By method of production, I refer to technology and technique, and also to >the envoronment the work is conceived in. Good work can be produced by >situations ranging from a lone person in his apartment to a band/orchestra >in a live venue. But since the discussion here relates to Looping as the >technology/technique, I bring up the next point.... >**************************************************************************** >********* >My operating definition of "looping" has been this: >Electronically or mechanically repeated time segments of audio. The time >segments would be at least about 1 second. Obviously, the time segments must >be shorter than infinite, or else no repeat occurs. >A person sitting at a keyboard and playing the same phrase over and over >manually is not looping, he is repeating. Yodelling in a canyon is not >looping, it is echo. The effects can sometimes be similar using any of the >three. Which is why I bring up the next point.... >**************************************************************************** >********* >The purpose of looping to me appears to be: >To create interesting repeating patterns of sound (Music or AVN) easily. >To create thick layers of sounds unachievable in any any other economically >feasable way. >To create a One-Man-Band. >Any uses of looping I've experienced has fallen into one or more of those >categories. Notice that I do not include any specific political, >psychological, or aesthetic goals. Looping in itself is neutral to these. >However, any technology or technique has uses that are immediately >suggested, and others uses that are discovered or developed after experience. >**************************************************************************** >********* >Unfortunately, the human animal can suffer from the tendency to follow >sheep-like (or lemming-like). Ambient music has suffered from its contingent >of brain dead devotees, as has Fripp. Originally, ambient music was not >intended as a hypnotic tranquilizer (which looping inherently lends itself >to). It was meant as music which operates equally on different levels of >awareness simultaneously. Persons who assume that loopers are into ambient >music by default, are a type of bigot. But don't damn a style of music for >that. Does this imply that 'bad' ambient music has actually impaired our ability to perceive Mr. Fripp? How nasty of the mediocrities. I'm not sure how 'ambient' music was originally intended. Was there a group charter for the genre or something? Or are we now following sheep-like, some authority on the subject? I'd like to think that even the most unassuming person who purchases *any* cheesy sounds to alter their environment, is somehow taking a rather active measure to alter their experience somehow. Most commendable! Bigot? Let they without sin cast the first stone! Those mindless drones have infected us all... Animals indeed! >Fripp has always been an acquired taste. His explorations extend beyond >music per se. He has always questioned the audience-performer relationship, >and the effect of the music business on musicians. His actions at >performances are reflective of all that and probably more. He's never been >about being a "hot" player. The many comments I've seen here and elsewhere >asking why he doesn't "rip it up", or about him leavng the stage and >observing the audience, shows a lack of understanding about the artist. To believe that I don't understand the artist because I have preferences as to what I might experience at a performance seems a little PC to me. I've been able to enjoy the vast differences in much of Fripps output. Fripp doesn't have to always rip, but if I shell out to go see him, I'm hoping I might get some tiny portion that which I know to also be alive somewhere in his soul as well. After all the pendulum does swing both ways. >Fripp has never been about being a Looper, either. For him it is a method, >not the point. Seems to me, that's a good lesson for a lot of us. >Reg I dislike being boxed in by labels and expectations as well. Did you study with Mr. Fripp or what? I have been a Fripp fan and have followed his techniques and attitudes quite closely since 'In The Court...'. I've found that as I've grown older, I sometimes have to cut to the chase a little quicker than I used to. If I lack understanding about Fripp as an artist because I hope to see him in a comfortable, non-combative setting, which might allow for undistracted listening, then so be it. Let me be 'responsible' for my own listening experience without dictating to me. Maybe I'm just an old intolerant fart as well. Who am I to dictate? If lectures become a larger part of other artists performances, I may begin having a harder time enjoying them as well. Although I might actually pursue some artists due to their engaging communication style and content. I believe Fripp is starting to sound redundant to me at this point. Hopefully the pendulum will swing again and I will enjoy many more years of delightful Fripp output. I find it somewhat totalitarian though that Fripp expects certain conformities from his audience without somehow realizing that his audience might expect some regard for their needs as well. Especially having shelled out their ducats. I have my own artistic requirements and expectations of an audience as well, but I find that it gets quite complicated when I consider the many possible ways in which people listen and communicate. With that in mind I find it a little harder to tell them to shut up and listen or some other such dictate. Maybe when I get completely fed up with their antics, I'll lay down the law as well. More power to Mr. Fripp. Loop on brother... -Miko Biffle >**************************************************************************** >********* >**************************************************************************** >********* From: "Liebig, Steuart A." To: "'Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com'" Subject: RE: location & Loopers' CD Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 18:17:26 -0600<>Resent-Message-ID: <"vt6_M.A.yJF.WJm10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2728 Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: rphunt@tiac.net Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 16:29:25 -0800 Yeah, I tend to think of loops as being only a small part of the live/recorded imporvised or composed experience. A small part of the canvas, sometimes you need to do alot sometimes a little; sometimes intense noise, sometimes tonal bliss . . . If all you are doing is looping, well I don't know . . . are you playing music or IC chips? . . . I only say this because I have friends who have gone this route and I'm not really sure that it leads to what I consider an important factor in music: human interaction. (Often have the same problem with totally pre-recorded concerts or music concrete.) > ---------- > From: Kim Flint > Reply To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com > Sent: Monday, February 2, 1998 4:04 PM > To: LiebigSA@maritz.com > Subject: Re: location & Loopers' CD > > At 03:44 PM 2/2/98 EST, paparuda o o wrote: > > > > >yeah! even more, i would actually like to meet other loopers; > > I think that is generally a great idea, and probably my biggest > motivation > for creating this whole monster of an internet address! Get together! > Collaborate! Share ideas! Real-live or Virtual! Go forth and Multiply! > > > (pun intended there....) > > > >it's seems to me that most of the loopers are into "ambient" > >instrumental music. > > I'm not. In fact, I'm morally opposed to being an ambient musician. > What > others choose to do with their lives is their own business, but I > resolutely > refuse to have anything to do with this ambient stuff. I'm deeply > offended > by any implication that being into looping means I'm ambient. I'm > proud of > my long history here resisting the ambient tyranny that threatens to > overcome all other loopists! I will also continue to resist shameless > idol > worship of this Fripp fellow. Soundscapes, poundcakes. Not for me! > > of course, neither of those is as sick as being a deadhead. Those > maniacs > are actually planning to open a Grateful Dead theme park in San > Francisco. > The apocalypse will arrive none too soon. > > this, of course, gets many smiley's: :-) :-) :-) :-) :-) > > > >so, please, if you have a copy of the "loopers CD", or > >would like to share your (COPYRIGHT protected) looped music > >can you let me know? > > that CD project actually is not yet completed. As I understand, it's > in a > bag on someone's shelf awaiting arrival of the still-vaporware-Layla > sound > card. Seems likely that CD #2 will arrive before CD #1. > > kim > _______________________________________________________ > Kim Flint 408-752-9284 > Mpact Systems Engineering kflint@chromatic.com > Chromatic Research http://www.chromatic.com > > From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 17:36:59 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 3 17:18:46 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xztU5-0003Bm-00; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 17:18:37 -0800 Message-ID: <34D7B6E4.226D@att.net> Date: Tue, 03 Feb 1998 19:31:32 -0500 From: Peter Ensign Reply-To: peterensign@att.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Fernandes guy at NAMM References: <6e8ca90d.34d79ef6@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"pop7CB.A.zGB.D5710"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2801 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 17:18:37 -0800 X-UIDL: 41a09ca35204536e3a5b2f9ae605f474 Fmplautus@aol.com wrote: > > What is it about Oregon and looping? You think it's the Twin Peaks vibe? > > best, > The LoOpDoctOrs i dont want this shit From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 17:37:02 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 3 17:20:07 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xztVF-0003L6-00; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 17:19:49 -0800 Message-ID: <34D7B702.368A@att.net> Date: Tue, 03 Feb 1998 19:32:02 -0500 From: Peter Ensign Reply-To: peterensign@att.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: loops, ambient or otherwise References: <1.5.4.32.19980203223054.0066b87c@tiac.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"fN23_.A.NLB.h5710"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2802 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 17:19:49 -0800 X-UIDL: 4710f956d726b969cbb2725240f8dce1 Reginald Hunt wrote: > > The topics below obviously touch on some interesting fundamental points: > > Music and Artistically Valid Noise > > Yes I consider them different. Possibly Music is a subset of AVN. Or they > are side by side under a larger category(?) For me, method of production is > irrelavant to whether I wish or need to hear the final result. Granted, > Music and AVN are broad subjects. They are not always about a final sonic > result per se. But sometimes they are. And sometimes those sonic results are > meant to achieve states of mind other than joy, anger, or pathos. Of course, > approval of those states of mind is an essentially political choice. > > By method of production, I refer to technology and technique, and also to > the envoronment the work is conceived in. Good work can be produced by > situations ranging from a lone person in his apartment to a band/orchestra > in a live venue. But since the discussion here relates to Looping as the > technology/technique, I bring up the next point.... > > **************************************************************************** > ********* > > My operating definition of "looping" has been this: > > Electronically or mechanically repeated time segments of audio. The time > segments would be at least about 1 second. Obviously, the time segments must > be shorter than infinite, or else no repeat occurs. > > A person sitting at a keyboard and playing the same phrase over and over > manually is not looping, he is repeating. Yodelling in a canyon is not > looping, it is echo. The effects can sometimes be similar using any of the > three. Which is why I bring up the next point.... > > **************************************************************************** > ********* > > The purpose of looping to me appears to be: > > To create interesting repeating patterns of sound (Music or AVN) easily. > > To create thick layers of sounds unachievable in any any other economically > feasable way. > > To create a One-Man-Band. > > Any uses of looping I've experienced has fallen into one or more of those > categories. Notice that I do not include any specific political, > psychological, or aesthetic goals. Looping in itself is neutral to these. > However, any technology or technique has uses that are immediately > suggested, and others uses that are discovered or developed after experience. > > **************************************************************************** > ********* > > Unfortunately, the human animal can suffer from the tendency to follow > sheep-like (or lemming-like). Ambient music has suffered from its contingent > of brain dead devotees, as has Fripp. Originally, ambient music was not > intended as a hypnotic tranquilizer (which looping inherently lends itself > to). It was meant as music which operates equally on different levels of > awareness simultaneously. Persons who assume that loopers are into ambient > music by default, are a type of bigot. But don't damn a style of music for that. > > Fripp has always been an acquired taste. His explorations extend beyond > music per se. He has always questioned the audience-performer relationship, > and the effect of the music business on musicians. His actions at > performances are reflective of all that and probably more. He's never been > about being a "hot" player. The many comments I've seen here and elsewhere > asking why he doesn't "rip it up", or about him leavng the stage and > observing the audience, shows a lack of understanding about the artist. > > Fripp has never been about being a Looper, either. For him it is a method, > not the point. Seems to me, that's a good lesson for a lot of us. > > Reg > > **************************************************************************** > ********* > **************************************************************************** > ********* > > From: "Liebig, Steuart A." > To: "'Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com'" > Subject: RE: location & Loopers' CD > Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 18:17:26 -0600<>Resent-Message-ID: > <"vt6_M.A.yJF.WJm10"@ferret> > Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com > Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com > X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2728 > Resent-Sender: SmartList > Resent-To: rphunt@tiac.net > Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 16:29:25 -0800 > > Yeah, I tend to think of loops as being only a small part of the > live/recorded imporvised or composed experience. A small part of the > canvas, sometimes you need to do alot sometimes a little; sometimes > intense noise, sometimes tonal bliss . . . If all you are doing is > looping, well I don't know . . . are you playing music or IC chips? . . > . I only say this because I have friends who have gone this route and > I'm not really sure that it leads to what I consider an important factor > in music: human interaction. (Often have the same problem with totally > pre-recorded concerts or music concrete.) > > > ---------- > > From: Kim Flint > > Reply To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com > > Sent: Monday, February 2, 1998 4:04 PM > > To: LiebigSA@maritz.com > > Subject: Re: location & Loopers' CD > > > > At 03:44 PM 2/2/98 EST, paparuda o o wrote: > > > > > > > >yeah! even more, i would actually like to meet other loopers; > > > > I think that is generally a great idea, and probably my biggest > > motivation > > for creating this whole monster of an internet address! Get together! > > Collaborate! Share ideas! Real-live or Virtual! Go forth and Multiply! > > > > > > (pun intended there....) > > > > > > >it's seems to me that most of the loopers are into "ambient" > > >instrumental music. > > > > I'm not. In fact, I'm morally opposed to being an ambient musician. > > What > > others choose to do with their lives is their own business, but I > > resolutely > > refuse to have anything to do with this ambient stuff. I'm deeply > > offended > > by any implication that being into looping means I'm ambient. I'm > > proud of > > my long history here resisting the ambient tyranny that threatens to > > overcome all other loopists! I will also continue to resist shameless > > idol > > worship of this Fripp fellow. Soundscapes, poundcakes. Not for me! > > > > of course, neither of those is as sick as being a deadhead. Those > > maniacs > > are actually planning to open a Grateful Dead theme park in San > > Francisco. > > The apocalypse will arrive none too soon. > > > > this, of course, gets many smiley's: :-) :-) :-) :-) :-) > > > > > > >so, please, if you have a copy of the "loopers CD", or > > >would like to share your (COPYRIGHT protected) looped music > > >can you let me know? > > > > that CD project actually is not yet completed. As I understand, it's > > in a > > bag on someone's shelf awaiting arrival of the still-vaporware-Layla > > sound > > card. Seems likely that CD #2 will arrive before CD #1. > > > > kim > > _______________________________________________________ > > Kim Flint 408-752-9284 > > Mpact Systems Engineering kflint@chromatic.com > > Chromatic Research http://www.chromatic.com > > > > i dont want this shit From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 17:37:04 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 3 17:21:06 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xztW9-0003SF-00; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 17:20:45 -0800 Message-ID: <34D7B715.32B3@att.net> Date: Tue, 03 Feb 1998 19:32:21 -0500 From: Peter Ensign Reply-To: peterensign@att.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: loops, ambient or otherwise References: <00085E66.----@wj.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"Jz4Z0D.A.FOB.05710"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2803 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 17:20:45 -0800 X-UIDL: b51056c506db7930976d83a587d009a4 Mike Biffle wrote: > > Thanks Reg for such clear and devoloped definitions regarding looping. Most of > my comments are in reply to your feelings about Robert Fripp below. > > Reginald Hunt wrote... > > >The topics below obviously touch on some interesting fundamental points: > > >Music and Artistically Valid Noise > > >Yes I consider them different. Possibly Music is a subset of AVN. Or they > >are side by side under a larger category(?) For me, method of production is > >irrelavant to whether I wish or need to hear the final result. Granted, > >Music and AVN are broad subjects. They are not always about a final sonic > >result per se. But sometimes they are. And sometimes those sonic results are > >meant to achieve states of mind other than joy, anger, or pathos. Of course, > >approval of those states of mind is an essentially political choice. > > >By method of production, I refer to technology and technique, and also to > >the envoronment the work is conceived in. Good work can be produced by > >situations ranging from a lone person in his apartment to a band/orchestra > >in a live venue. But since the discussion here relates to Looping as the > >technology/technique, I bring up the next point.... > > >**************************************************************************** > >********* > > >My operating definition of "looping" has been this: > > >Electronically or mechanically repeated time segments of audio. The time > >segments would be at least about 1 second. Obviously, the time segments must > >be shorter than infinite, or else no repeat occurs. > > >A person sitting at a keyboard and playing the same phrase over and over > >manually is not looping, he is repeating. Yodelling in a canyon is not > >looping, it is echo. The effects can sometimes be similar using any of the > >three. Which is why I bring up the next point.... > > >**************************************************************************** > >********* > > >The purpose of looping to me appears to be: > >To create interesting repeating patterns of sound (Music or AVN) easily. > >To create thick layers of sounds unachievable in any any other economically > >feasable way. > >To create a One-Man-Band. > > >Any uses of looping I've experienced has fallen into one or more of those > >categories. Notice that I do not include any specific political, > >psychological, or aesthetic goals. Looping in itself is neutral to these. > >However, any technology or technique has uses that are immediately > >suggested, and others uses that are discovered or developed after experience. > > >**************************************************************************** > >********* > > >Unfortunately, the human animal can suffer from the tendency to follow > >sheep-like (or lemming-like). Ambient music has suffered from its contingent > >of brain dead devotees, as has Fripp. Originally, ambient music was not > >intended as a hypnotic tranquilizer (which looping inherently lends itself > >to). It was meant as music which operates equally on different levels of > >awareness simultaneously. Persons who assume that loopers are into ambient > >music by default, are a type of bigot. But don't damn a style of music for > >that. > > Does this imply that 'bad' ambient music has actually impaired our ability to > perceive Mr. Fripp? How nasty of the mediocrities. > > I'm not sure how 'ambient' music was originally intended. Was there a group > charter for the genre or something? Or are we now following sheep-like, some > authority on the subject? I'd like to think that even the most unassuming person > who purchases *any* cheesy sounds to alter their environment, is somehow taking > a rather active measure to alter their experience somehow. Most commendable! > > Bigot? Let they without sin cast the first stone! Those mindless drones have > infected us all... Animals indeed! > > >Fripp has always been an acquired taste. His explorations extend beyond > >music per se. He has always questioned the audience-performer relationship, > >and the effect of the music business on musicians. His actions at > >performances are reflective of all that and probably more. He's never been > >about being a "hot" player. The many comments I've seen here and elsewhere > >asking why he doesn't "rip it up", or about him leavng the stage and > >observing the audience, shows a lack of understanding about the artist. > > To believe that I don't understand the artist because I have preferences as to > what I might experience at a performance seems a little PC to me. I've been able > to enjoy the vast differences in much of Fripps output. Fripp doesn't have to > always rip, but if I shell out to go see him, I'm hoping I might get some tiny > portion that which I know to also be alive somewhere in his soul as well. After > all the pendulum does swing both ways. > > >Fripp has never been about being a Looper, either. For him it is a method, > >not the point. Seems to me, that's a good lesson for a lot of us. > > >Reg > > I dislike being boxed in by labels and expectations as well. Did you study with > Mr. Fripp or what? I have been a Fripp fan and have followed his techniques and > attitudes quite closely since 'In The Court...'. > > I've found that as I've grown older, I sometimes have to cut to the chase a > little quicker than I used to. If I lack understanding about Fripp as an artist > because I hope to see him in a comfortable, non-combative setting, which might > allow for undistracted listening, then so be it. Let me be 'responsible' for my > own listening experience without dictating to me. Maybe I'm just an old > intolerant fart as well. Who am I to dictate? > > If lectures become a larger part of other artists performances, I may begin > having a harder time enjoying them as well. Although I might actually pursue > some artists due to their engaging communication style and content. I believe > Fripp is starting to sound redundant to me at this point. Hopefully the pendulum > will swing again and I will enjoy many more years of delightful Fripp output. > > I find it somewhat totalitarian though that Fripp expects certain conformities > from his audience without somehow realizing that his audience might expect some > regard for their needs as well. Especially having shelled out their ducats. > > I have my own artistic requirements and expectations of an audience as well, but > I find that it gets quite complicated when I consider the many possible ways in > which people listen and communicate. With that in mind I find it a little harder > to tell them to shut up and listen or some other such dictate. Maybe when I get > completely fed up with their antics, I'll lay down the law as well. More power > to Mr. Fripp. > > Loop on brother... > -Miko Biffle > > >**************************************************************************** > >********* > >**************************************************************************** > >********* > > From: "Liebig, Steuart A." > To: "'Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com'" > Subject: RE: location & Loopers' CD > Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 18:17:26 -0600<>Resent-Message-ID: > <"vt6_M.A.yJF.WJm10"@ferret> > Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com > Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com > X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2728 > Resent-Sender: SmartList > Resent-To: rphunt@tiac.net > Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 16:29:25 -0800 > > Yeah, I tend to think of loops as being only a small part of the > live/recorded imporvised or composed experience. A small part of the > canvas, sometimes you need to do alot sometimes a little; sometimes > intense noise, sometimes tonal bliss . . . If all you are doing is > looping, well I don't know . . . are you playing music or IC chips? . . > . I only say this because I have friends who have gone this route and > I'm not really sure that it leads to what I consider an important factor > in music: human interaction. (Often have the same problem with totally > pre-recorded concerts or music concrete.) > > > ---------- > > From: Kim Flint > > Reply To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com > > Sent: Monday, February 2, 1998 4:04 PM > > To: LiebigSA@maritz.com > > Subject: Re: location & Loopers' CD > > > > At 03:44 PM 2/2/98 EST, paparuda o o wrote: > > > > > > > >yeah! even more, i would actually like to meet other loopers; > > > > I think that is generally a great idea, and probably my biggest > > motivation > > for creating this whole monster of an internet address! Get together! > > Collaborate! Share ideas! Real-live or Virtual! Go forth and Multiply! > > > > > > (pun intended there....) > > > > > > >it's seems to me that most of the loopers are into "ambient" > > >instrumental music. > > > > I'm not. In fact, I'm morally opposed to being an ambient musician. > > What > > others choose to do with their lives is their own business, but I > > resolutely > > refuse to have anything to do with this ambient stuff. I'm deeply > > offended > > by any implication that being into looping means I'm ambient. I'm > > proud of > > my long history here resisting the ambient tyranny that threatens to > > overcome all other loopists! I will also continue to resist shameless > > idol > > worship of this Fripp fellow. Soundscapes, poundcakes. Not for me! > > > > of course, neither of those is as sick as being a deadhead. Those > > maniacs > > are actually planning to open a Grateful Dead theme park in San > > Francisco. > > The apocalypse will arrive none too soon. > > > > this, of course, gets many smiley's: :-) :-) :-) :-) :-) > > > > > > >so, please, if you have a copy of the "loopers CD", or > > >would like to share your (COPYRIGHT protected) looped music > > >can you let me know? > > > > that CD project actually is not yet completed. As I understand, it's > > in a > > bag on someone's shelf awaiting arrival of the still-vaporware-Layla > > sound > > card. Seems likely that CD #2 will arrive before CD #1. > > > > kim > > _______________________________________________________ > > Kim Flint 408-752-9284 > > Mpact Systems Engineering kflint@chromatic.com > > Chromatic Research http://www.chromatic.com > > > > i dont want this shit From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 17:36:59 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 3 17:18:49 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xztU3-0003Bc-00; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 17:18:35 -0800 Message-ID: <34D7B747.3BE9@att.net> Date: Tue, 03 Feb 1998 19:33:11 -0500 From: Peter Ensign Reply-To: peterensign@att.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Who's on the forefront of loopmuse? References: <199802032254.OAA19784@waynesworld.ucsd.edu> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"nF3Bi.A.oUB.h6710"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2805 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 17:18:35 -0800 X-UIDL: 2a9edcca110d3bed7cec8d56c5180985 Paolo Valladolid wrote: > > I don't know if this is directly related to the question, but one > interesting application of looping might be in video games. > > One of my roommates likes to play a Playstation game called > "Parappa The Rappa". Parappa is the character you play in this game > (looks like a young relative of Snoopy with a hat on). You help him > rap with the people he encounters (a turnip karate sensei, a cow meter > maid, etc.) by following a visual cue at the top of the screen and > hitting the appropriate buttons in time with the cue and the music. > There is an element of improvisation in that you can introduce a > stuttering effect depending on how quickly you repeatedly hit the buttons > (e.g. Parappa says "Pu-Pu-Punch!" instead of just "Punch!"). At the > right of the screen there's a meter that runs from "You Be Rappin Ill!" > to "You Be Rappin Excellent" or something like that. > > What I find interesting about this game is that it lets people with > no musical training at all get a taste of musical improvisation and > work on their rhythm through a non-standard interface or "instrument". > > Cheers, > > Paolo Valladolid > --------------------------------------------------------------- > |Moderator of Digital Guitar Digest, an Internet mailing list |\ > |for Music Technology and Stringed Instruments | \ > ---------------------------------------------------------------- | > \ finger pvallado@waynesworld.ucsd.edu for more info \ | > \ http://waynesworld.ucsd.edu/DigitalGuitar/home.html \| > ----------------------------------------------------------------- i dont want this shit From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 19:33:02 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 3 18:31:03 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xztX7-0003a1-00; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 17:21:45 -0800 Message-ID: <34D7B758.71A7@att.net> Date: Tue, 03 Feb 1998 19:33:28 -0500 From: Peter Ensign Reply-To: peterensign@att.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Who's on the forefront of loopmuse? References: <2.2.32.19980203235737.009acdb0@pop.chromatic.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"edpibD.A.bYB.96710"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2806 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 17:21:45 -0800 X-UIDL: 3b7202d2eeb1c79496667186d93c8836 Kim Flint wrote: > > At 03:50 PM 2/3/98 -0500, John Price wrote: > >Gosh darn it! Im feelin awful chatty today. > > > >The forefront of Looping today is on what most here would undoubtedly > consider the lowbrow side of all things loop that is if you are prone to > categorizing things. > > > >IMHO - It's the dance floor dude that is still driving things loopey for > the majority of the world - Musicians and audiences included. > > I tend to agree with this, although it's not always so lowbrow as you might > think. A lot of that is a bit of a pose, and often times the people behind > it are very sophisticated musicians. The possibilities for innovation and > creativity are huge, and a lot of talented people have moved in that > direction to take advantage of it. Andre did a nice job of commenting on > that, no need for me to add anything there. > > The dance/electronic/hip-hop/etc. scene is definitely where I see all the > innovation in looping as a method, as a process, as a tool, as a type of > music. I see people there constantly pushing to evolve things and do > something different, move it to the next level. The musicians, the audience, > the dj's, and the press all seem to support and encourage that, it's > ingrained in the scene in an interesting and healthy way. Loop concepts grow > by leaps and bounds there. > > Another spot of innovation would be the solo instrumentalists, integrating > loops into compositions and performances in interesting new ways, expanding > their reach. I think you see that here in the many people looping with > fingerstyle guitar, or cello, or voice. Probably there are innovative things > happening in the academic/high-brow world, but I just don't follow that > enough to know. > > Where I don't see much innovation with looping is in the droney guitar loop > scene, the stuff often associated with Fripp. The music may continue to be > vital and interesting, but the use of loops is pretty stagnant and > complacent. Sorry, but I just don't see anyone pushing the looping process > anywhere in that scene. (although it's possible that I just go so bored with > it I stopped paying attention.) > > For me as a developer of loop devices, it is definitely the dance producers > who are driving things. They are the ones forcing the innovation in tools > and driving us with a constant flow of ideas. Trying to understand, meet, > and anticipate their needs so that a looping device might be an effective > instrument in that world is a very tough challenge! And the possibilities > are so huge and fresh, along with the sheer volume of creativity, that the > challenge is really quite exciting and fun. You really get the feeling that > when a new feature is introduced, someone will jump on it and do something > remarkable. > > With the droney guitar loop crowd, most of the push is to get one box that > does all the things that different boxes available 10-20 years ago did. And > that's certainly reasonable, but it's not exactly breaking new ground. You > give them something new and they barely notice, maybe getting around to it > after a few years. (and in 15 years they will just be demanding that feature > in any new device!) > > anyway, that's my take. > > kim > > >Obvious and overexposed Loop Leaders: Beck, Square Pusher, DJ's Spookey & > Shadow (Spelling??) Photek, Puff Daddy ( He aint original and he sure don't > drone. But his loops are in the hands and ears of eager children all across > the world while their $ is secure in his bank account) and The Orb on the > Higher end of low end. > > > >Frankly, I can't nor would I ever dare say that any artist is better than > the other. Its always like a pissing contest. And I cant stand it when > people turn music appreciation into a sport and forum for their own biases > and need to be acknowledged. Just a premonition of how people will respond > to DK's question. > > > > > > > >-----Original Message----- > >From: David Kirkdorffer [SMTP:DKirkdorffer@exapps.com] > >Sent: Tuesday, February 03, 1998 1:02 PM > >To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com > >Subject: Who's on the forefront of loopmuse? > > > >I'll try this again, just to see if this gets picked up. > > > >*So, just for giggles, what / who is on the forefront of "looping-based > >music"?* > >I know this is somewhat an impossible question, but, maybe it's worth > >bashing around for a while. > > > >David Kirkdorffer > > > >Attachment Converted: C:\Program Files\Eudora\Attach\RE Who's on the > forefront of l > > > _______________________________________________________ > Kim Flint 408-752-9284 > Mpact Systems Engineering kflint@chromatic.com > Chromatic Research http://www.chromatic.com i dont want this shit From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 17:36:57 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 3 17:16:28 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xztRn-0002tb-00; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 17:16:15 -0800 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 20:01:12 -0500 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: David Myers Subject: Loop Home Resent-Message-ID: <"_gO.A.27.z3710"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2800 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 17:16:15 -0800 X-UIDL: a377b01966a1a4f39738cccacdcf8335 Just for the info, I also cannot get in to the Loopers Delight web site as of Feb 03, 8 PM EST. David Myers From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 19:32:47 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 3 17:47:43 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xztw7-0006od-00; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 17:47:35 -0800 Message-Id: <2.2.32.19980204010422.009a0848@pop.chromatic.com> X-Sender: kflint@pop.chromatic.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 2.2 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 03 Feb 1998 17:04:22 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Kim Flint Subject: RE: Who's on the forefront of loopmuse? Resent-Message-ID: <"hrYiy.A.9DF.ZY810"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2807 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 17:47:35 -0800 X-UIDL: d06290b420e49cd174d3377a7563e550 At 07:47 PM 2/3/98 -0500, David Kirkdorffer wrote: >If it's the Dance Scene where real innovation is taking place, maybe we >ought to advertise the existence of our loopy-list to a few dance and dj >oriented web-worlds?? I have actually, a little. There are some lurking around, although more would be good and introduce some fresh perspectives. Although, after mentioning it on a dnb producer's list, one fellow checked it out and came back saying it was interesting, but "seemed like just a bunch of fripp-heads." (read that as, "only dinosaurs there") After the past couple of days, it's hard to disagree! kim _______________________________________________________ Kim Flint 408-752-9284 Mpact Systems Engineering kflint@chromatic.com Chromatic Research http://www.chromatic.com From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 17:37:00 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 3 17:19:56 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xztV8-0003KG-00; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 17:19:42 -0800 Message-ID: From: David Kirkdorffer To: "'Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com'" Subject: FW: Who's on the forefront of loopmuse? Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 20:05:58 -0500 X-Priority: 3 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) Content-Type: text/plain Resent-Message-ID: <"wbegAC.A.cRB.L6710"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2804 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 17:19:42 -0800 X-UIDL: 80589ba212d52fbe1c0e202fd75cc648 I mostly agree with what you say here. I was hoping to get us all thinking critically about what in Art would probably be called Critical Theory. Conferring issues with value based on the new ideas they contain. So who has been creating new ideas with looping? Who is expanding the looping genre? Who has been adding new twists to what has been done? It's not the amount of technology used - we all agree on that I suspect. But without a certain aspect of technology none of this would be possible. If it's the Dance Scene where real innovation is taking place, maybe we ought to advertise the existence of our loopy-list to a few dance and dj oriented web-worlds?? David -----Original Message----- From: Kim Flint [SMTP:kflint@chromatic.com] Sent: Tuesday, February 03, 1998 6:58 PM To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com; 'Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com' Subject: RE: Who's on the forefront of loopmuse? At 03:50 PM 2/3/98 -0500, John Price wrote: >Gosh darn it! Im feelin awful chatty today. > >The forefront of Looping today is on what most here would undoubtedly consider the lowbrow side of all things loop that is if you are prone to categorizing things. > >IMHO - It's the dance floor dude that is still driving things loopey for the majority of the world - Musicians and audiences included. I tend to agree with this, although it's not always so lowbrow as you might think. A lot of that is a bit of a pose, and often times the people behind it are very sophisticated musicians. The possibilities for innovation and creativity are huge, and a lot of talented people have moved in that direction to take advantage of it. Andre did a nice job of commenting on that, no need for me to add anything there. The dance/electronic/hip-hop/etc. scene is definitely where I see all the innovation in looping as a method, as a process, as a tool, as a type of music. I see people there constantly pushing to evolve things and do something different, move it to the next level. The musicians, the audience, the dj's, and the press all seem to support and encourage that, it's ingrained in the scene in an interesting and healthy way. Loop concepts grow by leaps and bounds there. Another spot of innovation would be the solo instrumentalists, integrating loops into compositions and performances in interesting new ways, expanding their reach. I think you see that here in the many people looping with fingerstyle guitar, or cello, or voice. Probably there are innovative things happening in the academic/high-brow world, but I just don't follow that enough to know. Where I don't see much innovation with looping is in the droney guitar loop scene, the stuff often associated with Fripp. The music may continue to be vital and interesting, but the use of loops is pretty stagnant and complacent. Sorry, but I just don't see anyone pushing the looping process anywhere in that scene. (although it's possible that I just go so bored with it I stopped paying attention.) For me as a developer of loop devices, it is definitely the dance producers who are driving things. They are the ones forcing the innovation in tools and driving us with a constant flow of ideas. Trying to understand, meet, and anticipate their needs so that a looping device might be an effective instrument in that world is a very tough challenge! And the possibilities are so huge and fresh, along with the sheer volume of creativity, that the challenge is really quite exciting and fun. You really get the feeling that when a new feature is introduced, someone will jump on it and do something remarkable. With the droney guitar loop crowd, most of the push is to get one box that does all the things that different boxes available 10-20 years ago did. And that's certainly reasonable, but it's not exactly breaking new ground. You give them something new and they barely notice, maybe getting around to it after a few years. (and in 15 years they will just be demanding that feature in any new device!) anyway, that's my take. kim >Obvious and overexposed Loop Leaders: Beck, Square Pusher, DJ's Spookey & Shadow (Spelling??) Photek, Puff Daddy ( He aint original and he sure don't drone. But his loops are in the hands and ears of eager children all across the world while their $ is secure in his bank account) and The Orb on the Higher end of low end. > >Frankly, I can't nor would I ever dare say that any artist is better than the other. Its always like a pissing contest. And I cant stand it when people turn music appreciation into a sport and forum for their own biases and need to be acknowledged. Just a premonition of how people will respond to DK's question. > > > >-----Original Message----- >From: David Kirkdorffer [SMTP:DKirkdorffer@exapps.com] >Sent: Tuesday, February 03, 1998 1:02 PM >To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com >Subject: Who's on the forefront of loopmuse? > >I'll try this again, just to see if this gets picked up. > >*So, just for giggles, what / who is on the forefront of "looping-based >music"?* >I know this is somewhat an impossible question, but, maybe it's worth >bashing around for a while. > >David Kirkdorffer > >Attachment Converted: C:\Program Files\Eudora\Attach\RE Who's on the forefront of l > _______________________________________________________ Kim Flint 408-752-9284 Mpact Systems Engineering kflint@chromatic.com Chromatic Research http://www.chromatic.com From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 19:32:57 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 3 18:24:50 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzuW2-0003WC-00; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 18:24:42 -0800 Message-ID: <34D7C3C5.51FA@dmans.com> Date: Tue, 03 Feb 1998 19:26:29 -0600 From: "Mikell D. Nelson" Reply-To: mnelson@dmans.com Organization: Boomerang Musical Products X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (Win95; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Location/MABEY YOU CAN HELP US?. References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"r6CzwC.A.tYC.n9810"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2812 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 18:24:42 -0800 X-UIDL: 89fd271d6d46b0234250f3d5d020887e > I perform with electric bird noise which is basically my solo gig but once in > a while ebn does perform as a duo. We are looking into doing a tour of the > northeast around April/May. I noticed there are quite a few of you on this list > that reside in the northeast region. We are seeking information on > clubs, coffehouses, anywere that may be loop friendly. Brian, Give these guys a call. Jammin' Java, 6 Chester Plaza, Chester, MD 21619; 410-604-0070, tel; 410-604-0072, fax. Brian Bowdren is probably th eguy to talk to. http://www.jamminjava.com Motley From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 19:32:52 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 3 17:58:10 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzu69-0000Kx-00; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 17:57:57 -0800 Message-ID: <01BD30E2.41DCBF50@TD-300> From: jprice@intcpi.com (John Price) To: "'loopers-delight@annihilist.com'" Subject: RE: Who's on the forefront of loopmuse? Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 20:28:14 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"O_JirB.A.ryF.Ue810"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2811 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 17:57:57 -0800 X-UIDL: 0552a98aa52ad18cb991013a6c2dacbb I completely forgot about the Chemical ( Dust Bros.). Good point. Also, I guess there are more dance-loop enthusiasts here than what I had previously assumed. Square Pusher was thrown into the fray beacause of the Press and kudos a lot of young kids seem to bestow upon him locally in Philly. I live in Downtwn and all the College Stations ie. Drexel's KDU, Princeton's 103.3 and King Britt and Josh Winks dance/trance shops are big into what he's layin down. And yes, I too payed like $22 bucks for his latest disc, ouch!! But I dig it a lot. So if something is intentionally commercial and meant for mass markets - does that mean that it inherently can't be leading edge or pioneering and ultimately flawed ??? Follow that tag and then ask yourself where & when do u make such "distinctions" ???? Can distinctions truly ever be made ??? And based on what criteria & particular consensus of conventional thought and criticism would suffice for such a categorization of ground breaking as opposed to something that is perceived to be static ?? And true just because someone is selling a lot of "product" doesn't make them an authority or a lightning rod with their pulse on trigger of what people want or need. Big Acts sell "product" because someone decided they would happen and secondly, someone spent a heck of a lot of dough on making sure they did happen and happen big. So, does the ground have to really break for something to be considered a "right on time release" ??? And if your looking for the ground to open up does it necessarily have to crack open on its surface ? My humble perception is that there are only our individual and perhaps not so humble perceptions ( tatstes are a different beast altogether ). Despite our perceptions music has a place, time and context for infinite people, places & responses. Don't we need all of it - good and bad - liked and disliked - to define the rest of whats to come ?? BTW, Mention Fripp's name and gee, theres always a controversy or an extended dialog thats full of strong and deeply help positions. Its amazing to observe the effect this man has on people. -----Original Message----- From: Andre LaFosse [SMTP:altruist@earthlink.net] Sent: Tuesday, February 03, 1998 5:54 PM To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Who's on the forefront of loopmuse? Gotta add a few cents in: John Price wrote: > The forefront of Looping today is on what most here would undoubtedly > consider the lowbrow side of all things loop that is if you are prone > to categorizing things. Actually, there are quite a few of us on the list who are very much into the so-called "lowbrow" side of electronic music; there are also a few rather high-profile members of that "community" on the list. > IMHO - It's the dance floor dude that is still driving things loopey > for the majority of the world - Musicians and audiences included. There's no doubt that loop-driven music is pretty much the mainstream right now. You can't go near the top 40 without some sort of sample-based rap or R&B tune rearing its head. But I think there's a distinction to be made between something which is at the forefront of music commerce (i.e. what's selling to a lot of people) as opposed to something that's pushing the envelope of the art or craft of music in itself, which is often (and usually) very far removed from the mainstream. I'm assuming that it's the latter of these two that fostered the original post in this thread. > Obvious and overexposed Loop Leaders: Beck, I think you've got to factor Beck's co-producers into the picture as well: Carl Stephenson on _Mellow Gold_ and the Dust Brothers for most of _Odelay_. I'm not familiar with his more obscure independent releases, but my general impression (which I'll happily have disproven by anyone more well-acquainted with his work than I am) is that Beck's primarily a singer-songwriter, albiet of a wonderfully eccentric persuasion, who gets a lot of his cut-and-paste aesthetic from production collaborators. > Square Pusher, Squarepusher overexposed?! Here in America, the only way you can get hold of any of his recordings is via usually pricey British imports. Granted, 60,000 copies of _Hard Normal Daddy_ sold in the UK is quite a feat for music as angular as his, but I would definitely have to say that he's a long way from being even a mainstream artist in terms of his recognition factor within the drum-n-bass scene (to which he's only marginally a "part" of, anyway), which in itself has a very low profile relative to your typical pop music (again, this is from an American point of view. Keep in mind that Goldie only sold in the low 10,000's with _Timeless_.) Also worth noting is that Tom Jenkinson (the man behind the Squarepusher alias) goes out of his way to avoid looping in much of his programming; he deliberately programs out all of his drum patterns manually, making sure to rarely if ever repeat a pattern. It's a very different aesthetic than your standard hypnotic loop music, and in fact one of the first criticisms he recieved was that his rhythms didn't repeat enough. > Puff Daddy ( He aint original and he sure don't drone. But his loops > are in the hands and ears of eager children all across the world while > their $ is secure in his bank account) This gets back to the issue of how you're identifying the "forefront" of this sort of music-making approach. He's selling an obscene anount of records, it's true, but from a musical point of view, he's not doing anything in terms of the construction or mechanics of his music that weren't being done at least 15 years ago by hip-hop producers with more creativity, less showbiz savvy, and a smaller budget to pay for obvious sample-clearance royalties. > and The Orb on the Higher end of low end. Has anyone heard the collaboration Phillip Glass did with Richard "Aphex Twin" James a few years ago? The distinction between the "high" and "low" aspects of this music (and music in general) gets more and more blurry (not to mention useless) as more and more "serious" composers emerge with a strong background of rock and jazz in their past. I actually saw a very amusing article in a mag a few months ago (I think it was _Option_) in which a reporter played Phillip Glass a number of CDs by the likes of Orbital, Underworld, Mu-Ziq, and others to gauge his reaction. Some funny stuff in there... --Andre LaFosse From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 10:03:01 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 3 08:34:07 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzlIU-0003hY-00; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 08:34:06 -0800 Message-Id: <3.0.1.16.19980203180241.317f797e@rank-serv.elec.gla.ac.uk> X-Sender: pycraft@rank-serv.elec.gla.ac.uk X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.1 (16) Date: Tue, 03 Feb 1998 18:02:41 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: "Michael P. Hughes, Ph.D." Subject: Re: Simm sound In-Reply-To: <19980203152648.22198.qmail@omni1.voicenet.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"RHO25B.A.mIC.MS010"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2763 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 08:34:06 -0800 X-UIDL: c59b20851b07061711334456d9522a5a Floyd: > Wanna talk vintage?? >>I have a 64 bit tube RAM. This beauty, circa 1954, still works >and I have easily retro-fitted its cable to a simm socket. >You wouldn't beleive it but to hear it, but the 44 millisecond >access time actually works well to provide just the right high >frequency roll-off in the digital domain to supress quantization >and nyquist noise. The power supply is a bitch, though. Oh yeah? Well, I've got the full 1959 Tube JamGent! 32 seconds of stereo looping, and enough valves to light up the street! The only effect box you _drive_ on stage! Hell, when I need more portablility I just dig out my Les Paulveriser!!! Michael PS this is getting silly.... From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 19:32:51 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 3 17:57:19 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzu5Q-0000FN-00; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 17:57:12 -0800 X-Sender: matthias@pop3.bahianet.com.br Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <98Feb3.092354est.18840@thicket.arbortext.com> References: <2.2.32.19980203065005.00a2b354@pop.chromatic.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 23:47:29 -0300 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: matthias@bahianet.com.br (Matthias Grob) Subject: "global english" / 60 mails/day Resent-Message-ID: <"SfIueC.A.erF.jd810"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2808 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 17:57:12 -0800 X-UIDL: 8b7bccf1507d303932bdbb381a91f972 >I tried starting an Ambient Garth Brooks cover band over a year ago. No one >would where the hat. >(hat...cover...thinkaboutit) Isn't it "wear"? Or is that part of a joke I did not grab? This triggers a concern that circulates in my head for a while: You know, I like slangs and try to follow and have good laughs sometimes, but please consider the difficulty for the few not native americans that still take their time to discover the meanings behind the often "smart chat" on this list in up to 60 mails/day. It is sad, but it takes a simple short "global english" to keep the group international. Looping definitally is not a typically american thing, even though american enterprises were the first to risk an investment (after I took the risk to develop the LOOP delay in switzerland :-) I do not want to cut the "art" aspect of emailing, but I want all interested people from any place of the globe to be able to read all mails, to follow and to feel fine to make their contribution in their "non smart" style. Please cut a thin slice of a solid simple bread that we can hold and that contains all the essence of nuriture you want to contribute and then put some jam on top if you like to make it more tasty - for those who want it and can understand it. And yes, sometimes it takes rereading and elaborating the mail... many will read it, after all, maybe years from now... Just searching for ways to make a beautifull list shine even more Matthias From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 19:32:50 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 3 17:57:27 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzu5X-0000GH-00; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 17:57:19 -0800 X-Sender: matthias@pop3.bahianet.com.br Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <2.2.32.19980202233202.009a15f8@pop.chromatic.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 23:47:39 -0300 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: matthias@bahianet.com.br (Matthias Grob) Subject: Re: Loopers' CD Resent-Message-ID: <"vspzHC.A.jtF.yd810"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2810 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 17:57:19 -0800 X-UIDL: 86440acdbce2823d6283b7aea37bed9d >>so, please, if you have a copy of the "loopers CD", or >>would like to share your (COPYRIGHT protected) looped music >>can you let me know? > >that CD project actually is not yet completed. As I understand, it's in a >bag on someone's shelf awaiting arrival of the still-vaporware-Layla sound >card. Seems likely that CD #2 will arrive before CD #1. Not that bad. Ray wrote on Jan 29th: " BTW, tonight I picked up the CD-R of the unedited tracks of the other folks' submissions. I'm going to listen to those + yours at work tomorrow, and maybe start the sequencing tomorrow night. ...I'll have the disks out by Monday. " That would be yesterday! Maybe its a good moment for those who are interested in CD #1 to mail to: Ray Peck Matthias From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 19:32:53 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 3 17:58:16 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzu6G-0000MY-00; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 17:58:04 -0800 X-Sender: matthias@pop3.bahianet.com.br Message-Id: In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 23:47:39 -0300 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: matthias@bahianet.com.br (Matthias Grob) Subject: Re: Re: Re: Different EBows Resent-Message-ID: <"rPTTHB.A.LtF.wd810"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2809 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 17:58:04 -0800 X-UIDL: 46d06e73eb636804a5f95b4e2dae2d96 >once upon a time, steinberger sound (via gibson corp's mgmt & dough) funded >the building of a prototype guitar (by bob wolstein) w/selectably polyphonic, >in-built string drivers (ie, "e-bows"). Wow, an old dream of mine: To pick up with piezos, filter perfectly separated strings and drive a magnet. No direct feedback from piezo to magnet, all under control. The actual sound can still come from a magnetic pickup. What a pity steinberger did not make it! Did they use piezos in that prototype? I met Mr. Steinberger once, years ago, and was deeply impressed. A real and serious inventor - able to bring to the market some part of what he creates - the most important contributions to guitar after Fender and LesPaul. >insofar as i know (& much to ned steinberger's great chagrin), mr. henry j. @ >gibson stopped the project before completion; i believe that after a year >transpired, ownership rights were supposed to revert to the estimable mr. >wolstein. >just a l'il tale, for ya's..... >best, >david torn Somewhat familiar tale. Mr. Wolstein would need a Kim Flint who has all this ability to convince mr. Henry about what are directions into the future :-) Then again, it must be a horrible responsability to guide such a big enterprise... Matthias From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 22:36:43 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 3 19:57:36 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzvxt-00050H-00; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 19:57:33 -0800 Message-Id: <1.5.4.32.19980204035100.0067cf58@tiac.net> X-Sender: rphunt@tiac.net X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 03 Feb 1998 22:51:00 -0500 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Reginald Hunt Subject: Who's on the forefront of loopmuse? Resent-Message-ID: <"QtcuVB.A.L_D.eX-10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2813 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 19:57:33 -0800 X-UIDL: 7a0875bbdbdf237f37920ab3beb94c7f Well, other than Ebows, mixers, equipment for sale, cheap RAM, David Torn, Buckethead, Terry Riley, Philip Glass, South Park (?!?), Porn stars, NAMM, what would you like to discuss? When is the Looper's Delight page coming back? Reg *************************************************************** X-Sender: kflint@pop.chromatic.com Date: Tue, 03 Feb 1998 17:04:22 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Kim Flint Subject: RE: Who's on the forefront of loopmuse? Resent-Message-ID: <"hrYiy.A.9DF.ZY810"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2807 Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: rphunt@tiac.net Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 17:48:57 -0800 At 07:47 PM 2/3/98 -0500, David Kirkdorffer wrote: >If it's the Dance Scene where real innovation is taking place, maybe we >ought to advertise the existence of our loopy-list to a few dance and dj >oriented web-worlds?? I have actually, a little. There are some lurking around, although more would be good and introduce some fresh perspectives. Although, after mentioning it on a dnb producer's list, one fellow checked it out and came back saying it was interesting, but "seemed like just a bunch of fripp-heads." (read that as, "only dinosaurs there") After the past couple of days, it's hard to disagree! kim _______________________________________________________ Kim Flint 408-752-9284 Mpact Systems Engineering kflint@chromatic.com Chromatic Research http://www.chromatic.com From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 22:36:52 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 3 20:16:29 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzwG8-0006xV-00; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 20:16:24 -0800 Message-ID: <34D7EA02.2A4CE190@bellsouth.net> Date: Tue, 03 Feb 1998 23:09:38 -0500 From: Jeff Duke Reply-To: jmar@bellsouth.net Organization: Tec Bab Labs X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Who's on the forefront of loopmuse? References: <1.5.4.32.19980204035100.0067cf58@tiac.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"UrHZsD.A.KnF.xm-10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2815 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 20:16:24 -0800 X-UIDL: 3f2286fb39e7fb30f8be41c71f56619d I think you have the best line on it Reg,I say its getting to be like being in a band,everybody has an opinion and we need to cut some slack here and there.By the way,do you like South Park? Jeff Reginald Hunt wrote: > Well, other than Ebows, mixers, equipment for sale, cheap RAM, David Torn, > Buckethead, Terry Riley, Philip Glass, South Park (?!?), Porn stars, NAMM, > what would you like to discuss? > > When is the Looper's Delight page coming back? > > Reg > > *************************************************************** > X-Sender: kflint@pop.chromatic.com > Date: Tue, 03 Feb 1998 17:04:22 -0800 > To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com > From: Kim Flint > Subject: RE: Who's on the forefront of loopmuse? > Resent-Message-ID: <"hrYiy.A.9DF.ZY810"@ferret> > Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com > Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com > X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2807 > Resent-Sender: SmartList > Resent-To: rphunt@tiac.net > Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 17:48:57 -0800 > > At 07:47 PM 2/3/98 -0500, David Kirkdorffer wrote: > >If it's the Dance Scene where real innovation is taking place, maybe we > >ought to advertise the existence of our loopy-list to a few dance and dj > >oriented web-worlds?? > > I have actually, a little. There are some lurking around, although more > would be good and introduce some fresh perspectives. Although, after > mentioning it on a dnb producer's list, one fellow checked it out and came > back saying it was interesting, but "seemed like just a bunch of > fripp-heads." (read that as, "only dinosaurs there") After the past couple > of days, it's hard to disagree! > > kim > _______________________________________________________ > Kim Flint 408-752-9284 > Mpact Systems Engineering kflint@chromatic.com > Chromatic Research http://www.chromatic.com From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 22:36:49 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 3 20:13:30 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzwDG-0006a8-00; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 20:13:26 -0800 Message-ID: <34D7EA3B.3812@earthlink.net> Date: Tue, 03 Feb 1998 20:12:22 -0800 From: Andre LaFosse Reply-To: altruist@earthlink.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01-C-MACOS8 (Macintosh; I; 68K) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Who's on the forefront of loopmuse? References: <01BD30E2.41DCBF50@TD-300> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"xneMKB.A.KWF.qk-10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2814 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 20:13:26 -0800 X-UIDL: 6c177a67584274abe378b9bf229f37e5 Warning: This is long and not altogether loop-based. John Price wrote: [Re: Squarepusher] > I live in Downtwn and all the College Stations ie. Drexel's KDU, > Princeton's 103.3 and King Britt and Josh Winks dance/trance shops are > big into what he's layin down. And yes, I too payed like $22 bucks for > his latest disc, ouch!! But I dig it a lot. I see what you mean here. I'd still have to single him out as pretty obscure by comparison to other artists of that ilk, though. Goldie's mug has been on half the music magazines released over the last month in anticipation of his new record (just out today, in fact), and Rupert Parkes has gotten numerous write-ups in the aftermath of _Modus Operandi_ being released. By comparison, I've only ever found two print articles about Tom Jenkinson; everything else has been online at fan-created web sites. > So if something is intentionally commercial and meant for mass markets > - does that mean that it inherently can't be leading edge or > pioneering and ultimately flawed ??? No, not necessarily. In recent "pop" terms, one example that comes to mind is the Beatles' career during the latter part of their existence, when they were releasing truly groundbreaking and experimental records like _Sgt. Pepper_ or _The White Album_ to one of the most largest and most ravenous fan bases in music history. Or look at Miles Davis' _Bitches Brew_, which was the biggest-selling jazz album in history up to that point, even as it infuriated countless members of the jazz establishment and almost single-handedly invented fusion (though to be fair, one would have to reference the bands of Larry Coryell and Tony Williams with John McLaughlin, both of which predated _Bitches' Brew_, in assessing the development of fusion). But I would also say that more often than not, the things that tend to reach the mass market are those which are essentially distillations of work that other people have done the real development on. It's very rarely the groundbreaking, experimental efforts that crack the public consciousness; it's more often works that are able to find a more generally accessible slant that somehow translates into mass appeal. And this can be a very ephemeral, unexpected thing. For instance, you can look at the success of Nirvana in 1991, who of course instigated one of the most radical sea-changes in recent popular music history. But behind every Nirvana (or Soundgarden, or Pearl Jam) are dozens of bands like the Pixies, Mother Love Bone, Skin Yard, Green River, Mudhoney, and the Melvins who were direct inspirations to the likes of Kurt Cobain and Eddie Vedder. That's not to say that the bigger-name alternative bands are less musical or less interesting than their forefathers (though that issue can be and has been debated endlessly); it simply means that they were able to carry into mass consciousness a sound that had been pioneered by other people. And I would personally say that a lot of the success of the "bigger" bands has to do with elements of accessibility and image which were very real (though not necessarily fabricated or planned). Kurt Cobain wrote some very catchy and unique songs, which bridged the gap between what would come to be termed "grunge" and the mass-market. Chris Cornell and Eddie Vedder had a rock-star frontman magnetism that translated to a certain portion of the record-buying populace. (And no, that's not a criticism of either band). Industrial music is another good example. The success of Trent Reznor in the early '90s represented a breakthrough in terms of the mass acceptance of that music, but Reznor openly ackowledges that his main contribution to the genre is to put a more song-oriented spin on an approach developed by the likes of Skinny Puppy and MInistry, who in turn were themselves taking cues from the likes of Einsturbenze Neubauten and Throbbing Gristle. You can sing along to the lyrics of "Closer" while you dance to the disco beat; that's something that can't be so easilly said about songs from _VIVIsectVI_ or _The Land Of Rape And Honey_. You can look at what's happening right now with "electronica" (what an ugly word!) in the US as another example. The groups that are breaking through in terms of sales and visibility are either acts like Prodigy and (to a lesser extent) Chemical Brothers, who have a certain amount of accessibility to their more well-known work (i.e. singers/rappers, and, in the case of Prodigy in particular, a very canny sense of image, controversy, and marketing), or else one of the seemingly dozens of female-fronted/electronic-backed groups like Hooverphonic, Lamb, Sneaker Pimps, Morcheeba, Mono, Olive, or Dubstar who have emerged in the wake of Portishead. Along similar lines, I think you've got to factor Goldie's photogenic image and penchant for vocal-oriented music into the equation when you consider why he's the guy most people in the mainstream associate with jungle. Again, I'm not saying that any of the above groups are making bad music whatsoever (personally, I'd rather listen to Liam Howlett's programming over a lot of the more underground favorites I've heard). But the point is that a lot of people (myself included, to a certain degree) are hearing these sorts of acts without ever finding out about people like Derrick May, Grooverider, Carl Craig, The Orb, Kraftwerk, Can, or other artists who helped define the vocabulary that the more mainstream-approved electronic acts are currently speaking in. > Follow that tag and then ask yourself where & when do u make such > "distinctions" ???? Can distinctions truly ever be made ??? And based > on what criteria & particular consensus of conventional thought and > criticism would suffice for such a categorization of ground breaking > as opposed to something that is perceived to be static ?? Everything I'm saying is, of course, my own opinion, and nothing more or less than that. I certainly don't presume to think that anyting I'm talking about is going to be incontrovertible fact. In answer to your above query with regards to what sorts of criteria to use in determining whether or not something is "ground-breaking": I personally make that judgement in terms of what I hear in some bit of music that seems to have some genuine innovation or experimentation to it, and I make *that* judgement based upon what I know of the history behind that particular area of music. Let's take your Puff Daddy example. In my opinion, there's nothing he's doing that hasn't been done before at least as well as he does it. What do I base this judgement on? >From a strictly musical perspective, he takes a very straightforward approach to using samples: a few very long fragments from (often well-known) sources which are sampled and looped into a new composite creation. If you look at the history of hip-hop sampling, and more specifically at records like _Paul's Boutique_ (the Dust Brothers) or _It Takes A Nation of Millions To Hold Us Back_ and _Fear Of A Black Planet_ (The Bomb Squad), what Sean Combs is doing is very, very rudimentary and simplistic by comparison. And the most recent of the three records I mentioned above came out in 1989. You could make the argument that his wholesale mutation of lines from other pop songs ("Every Breath You Take" or "Been Around The World," for example) is an innovation, but this sort of appropriation actually predates sampling. Before scratching and sampling was so widespread, embryonic hip-hop artists would simply put together a live band which would play someone else's groove as if it were their own! >From a more personal perspective, I personally don't hear anything in his music that's liable to last any longer than the various hip-hop pop sensations that have come before him: MC Hammer, Arrested Development, Young MC, Tone Loc, Vanilla Ice, Digable Planets, etc. I've also noticed that, in the case of acts like Ice Cube and Dr. Dre, the records that sent them into the highest level of prominence and mass appeal tended to be the ones that I personally found the least musically and artistically inventive and satisfying. I basically stopped listening to hip-hop (or at least new hip-hop) around 1993 or 1994, simply because the slant that the music was taking didn't grab me as much; more specifically, I felt that the rhythms were slowing down and becoming less complex and compelling, the use of samples was getting less imaginative and kalliadescopic, and the lyrical style was becoming less animated and adventurous overall. That was the same time that records like _The Chronic_, _Cypress Hill_, and _The Predator_ started making serious inroads into the mass consciousness. But again, this is all my own strictly personal opinion, which I have no empirical evidence to substantiate factually. > And true just because someone is selling a lot of "product" doesn't > make them an authority or a lightning rod with their pulse on trigger > of what people want or need. Big Acts sell "product" because someone > decided they would happen and secondly, someone spent a heck of a lot > of dough on making sure they did happen and happen big. I have to disagree with this. Look again at the example of Nirvana. In late 1991, it would have been *unthinkable* that a band that sounded and looked like they did would upset Michael Jackson from the #1 spot on the Billboard album charts. In September of 1991, _Rolling Stone_ magazine ran a cover story called "Heavy Metal Nation," an in-depth examination of the then-reigning hair-metal movement; the issue featured a shirtless, gold-lame-pants-wearing Sebastian Bach (of metal band Skid Row) striking a serpentine pose across the front of the publication. This was within one month of _Nevermind_'s release -- right before the walls fell. While heavy metal ruled the roost, DGC expected the Nirvana album sales to peak out around 200,000 at most. Likewise, simply "deciding" that something will be a big deal and pushing massive amounts of cash into it don't always add up to sales. Look at Raddish, a sort of alternative-rock slant on Hanson (for lack of a better description), made up of three teenage guys and fronted by a young songwriter hailed by many to be the next Kurt Cobain. A massive major label bidding war ensued, which resulted in a highly lucrative deal for the band. Total number of copies of Raddish's debut album sold to date: Approximately 12,000. . A recent _Entertainment Weekly_ issue held similarly strange sales figures. Try these on for size: 867,000 for the Rolling Stones' _Bridges To Babylon_; 548,000 for Elton John's _The Big Picture_; 180,000 for Michael Jackson's _Blood On The Dance Floor_; 53,000 for Bobby Brown's _Forever_. On the other hand, who on earth would have predicted in 1997 that a 15-year-old band of British Anarchist squatters with a goofy name and overt political agendas would move 2 million copies in three months? So my long-coming point here is that, in spite of the big-budget push that world-famous acts can get from major labels, people will often wind up making up their own mind about what to listen to. So if someone does in fact sell massive amounts of product, there can be made an assumption that there is, in fact, a certain tangible connection being made with where the "pulse" of the general populace is at that moment -- which would seem to be further corroborated by the rather dismal sales figures of the aforementioned once-huge sellers listed above. > So, does the ground have to really break for something to be > considered a "right on time release" ??? No. What I'm trying to say, in fact, is that innovation in an area generally happens significantly earlier than the ensuing widespread mass success. > And if your looking for the ground to open up does it necessarily have > to crack open on its surface ? I'm not sure exactly what you're asking here, but as a resident of Los Angeles, I have a rather different take on the notion of the ground "opening up," as it were... > Don't we need all of it - good and bad - liked and disliked - to > define the rest of whats to come ?? In spite of my aforementioned, grotesquely lengthy, analytical espousal, I'd like to think that we don't need to worry about defining what's to come (or what's already here, for that matter). The music, when it does come, generally speaks for itself -- and often may have something altogether unexpected to say when it does in fact show up. --Andre From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 22:36:53 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 3 20:36:36 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzwZe-00018C-00; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 20:36:34 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: looping as sin Message-ID: <19980203.231650.4951.1.DOINA@juno.com> References: <1.5.4.32.19980203223054.0066b87c@tiac.net> X-Mailer: Juno 1.38 X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 0-3,5,7-26 From: doina@juno.com (paparuda von doina) Date: Tue, 03 Feb 1998 23:18:12 EST Resent-Message-ID: <"ldC7QC.A.to.K9-10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2816 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 20:36:34 -0800 X-UIDL: e8693d0f52a4923ea8c858742c33e7f6 On Tue, 03 Feb 1998 Reginald Hunt writes: >Fripp (again? oh please!) has never been about being a >Looper, either. For him it is a method, not the point. So, for the LOOPERS the point is not the MUSIC, but the LOOPING, or, as someone else has noticed earlier, playing ICs (and SIMMs) !!! Oh! what am i going to do? i'm doomed ! Please, Reggie, have mercy! i promise to unsubscribe from this unholy site! Paparuda _____________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 22:36:54 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 3 20:45:28 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzwiE-00025n-00; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 20:45:26 -0800 Message-ID: <34D7EC0E.43FB@earthlink.net> Date: Tue, 03 Feb 1998 20:18:21 -0800 From: Andre LaFosse Reply-To: altruist@earthlink.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01-C-MACOS8 (Macintosh; I; 68K) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: PS Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"mDr59B.A.anB.oG_10"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2817 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 20:45:26 -0800 X-UIDL: 2240f713b02304927a92030015237c31 My ISP seems to have hiccupped, so my apologies to you all if you wind up getting two copies of my last post. And double apologies to Peter Ensign if he does not, in fact, want this shit! --A From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 22:37:00 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 3 22:04:48 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzxx1-0000it-00; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 22:04:47 -0800 Message-Id: <1.5.4.32.19980204060052.0066b5f8@tiac.net> X-Sender: rphunt@tiac.net (Unverified) X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 04 Feb 1998 01:00:52 -0500 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Reginald Hunt Subject: ambient & otherwise Resent-Message-ID: <"LPVmf.A.5X.SRA20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2818 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 22:04:47 -0800 X-UIDL: b19ca8639e79dec837bac10568dce0bf Response to Miko Biffle: >>Unfortunately, the human animal can suffer from the tendency to follow >>sheep-like (or lemming-like). Ambient music has suffered from its contingent >>of brain dead devotees, as has Fripp. Originally, ambient music was not >>intended as a hypnotic tranquilizer (which looping inherently lends itself >>to). It was meant as music which operates equally on different levels of >>awareness simultaneously. Persons who assume that loopers are into ambient >>music by default, are a type of bigot. But don't damn a style of music for >>that. >Does this imply that 'bad' ambient music has actually impaired our ability to >perceive Mr. Fripp? How nasty of the mediocrities. >I'm not sure how 'ambient' music was originally intended. Was there a group >charter for the genre or something? Or are we now following sheep-like, some >authority on the subject? I'd like to think that even the most unassuming person >who purchases *any* cheesy sounds to alter their environment, is somehow taking >a rather active measure to alter their experience somehow. Most commendable! I'm not referring to good or bad anything. Even the herd-instinct has value. But, like any other music form, heavy-metal, dance, whatever, ambient gets a bad reputation from a certain segment of the audience and performers who cause it to stagnate. To get a feel for ambient's original goal, Eno is always a good source. Ther are some web sites that feature useful quotes of his. >Bigot? Let they without sin cast the first stone! Those mindless drones have >infected us all... Animals indeed! My use of the word "bigot" goes by its strict definition. It is not a sin, but is indeed a mindset (again by definition). >>Fripp has always been an acquired taste. His explorations extend beyond >>music per se. He has always questioned the audience-performer relationship, >>and the effect of the music business on musicians. His actions at >>performances are reflective of all that and probably more. He's never been >>about being a "hot" player. The many comments I've seen here and elsewhere >>asking why he doesn't "rip it up", or about him leavng the stage and >>observing the audience, shows a lack of understanding about the artist. >To believe that I don't understand the artist because I have preferences as to what I might experience at a performance seems a little PC to me. Again, by definition, if the preferences don't truly apply to the artist, e.g. Fripp bashing out "Lark's Tongues" at a Soundscapes performance (which I have seen emails about in other places), then it's a lack of understanding. >I've been able >to enjoy the vast differences in much of Fripps output. Fripp doesn't have to >always rip, but if I shell out to go see him, I'm hoping I might get some tiny >portion that which I know to also be alive somewhere in his soul as well. After >all the pendulum does swing both ways. Fripp himself freely admits that there is no guarantee in regards to his performances, that anyone who purchases a ticket probably knows this, and if they don't, oh well. I've read correspondance he had with some one who complained so bitterly about his responsibilities to audience expectation that he sent them a refund on the condition they never attend one of his shows again. Also, his soul definitely does come through his Soundscapes. It may not rock, but it comes through. >Did you study with Mr. Fripp or what? Nope. >I've found that as I've grown older, I sometimes have to cut to the chase a >little quicker than I used to. If I lack understanding about Fripp as an artist >because I hope to see him in a comfortable, non-combative setting, which might >allow for undistracted listening, then so be it. Let me be 'responsible' for my >own listening experience without dictating to me. Maybe I'm just an old >intolerant fart as well. Who am I to dictate? I don't think the idea is to remove the rules, only to change them. And, indeed, he his assigning more responsibility to the audience. >If lectures become a larger part of other artists performances, I may begin >having a harder time enjoying them as well. Although I might actually pursue >some artists due to their engaging communication style and content. I believe >Fripp is starting to sound redundant to me at this point. Hopefully the pendulum >will swing again and I will enjoy many more years of delightful Fripp output. Fripp will always be part teacher, I think. >I find it somewhat totalitarian though that Fripp expects certain conformities >from his audience without somehow realizing that his audience might expect some >regard for their needs as well. Especially having shelled out their ducats. See Fripp for Fripp. Not what you need. You might get even more. Reg From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 17:35:11 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 3 12:28:35 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzoxL-0001jD-00; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 12:28:31 -0800 Message-Id: <3.0.1.16.19980203220109.0f0f4106@rank-serv.elec.gla.ac.uk> X-Sender: pycraft@rank-serv.elec.gla.ac.uk X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.1 (16) Date: Tue, 03 Feb 1998 22:01:09 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: "Michael P. Hughes, Ph.D." Subject: Re: Who's on the forefront of loopmuse? In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"1RYa3C.A.7v.Zx310"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2788 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 12:28:31 -0800 X-UIDL: ded6ebc8f05006c59914ba7765cdd895 >I'll try this again, just to see if this gets picked up. >*So, just for giggles, what / who is on the forefront of "looping-based >music"?* >I know this is somewhat an impossible question, but, maybe it's worth >bashing around for a while. The thing is, a good number of us would say "Dave Torn", but won't in case we embarass him... ;) Michael From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 22:37:03 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 3 22:18:41 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzyAP-0001zO-00; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 22:18:37 -0800 Message-Id: <1.5.4.32.19980204061343.0067049c@tiac.net> X-Sender: rphunt@tiac.net X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 04 Feb 1998 01:13:43 -0500 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Reginald Hunt Subject: Re: looping as sin Resent-Message-ID: <"3u6p7.A.gbB.TdA20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2819 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 22:18:37 -0800 X-UIDL: aacd750f741d83e9b95d93bd039de7c8 Come on let's face it. Just like any other subject, there are some folks concerned more with the technology than what it produces. We need people like that, but we can't evaluate performers strictly by their degree of technological innovation (which I've seen done here). Yes, the remark about playing ICs when looping is used by itself was pitiful. Be at peace. Reg At 11:18 PM 2/3/98 EST, you wrote: > >On Tue, 03 Feb 1998 Reginald Hunt writes: > >>Fripp (again? oh please!) has never been about being a >>Looper, either. For him it is a method, not the point. > > > >So, for the LOOPERS the point is not the MUSIC, >but the LOOPING, or, as someone else has noticed earlier, >playing ICs (and SIMMs) !!! >Oh! what am i going to do? i'm doomed ! >Please, Reggie, have mercy! i promise to unsubscribe >from this unholy site! > >Paparuda > > > > > > > > > > > > >_____________________________________________________________________ >You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. >Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com >Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] > > > > From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 22:37:04 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 3 22:22:10 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzyDo-0002Pi-00; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 22:22:08 -0800 Message-Id: <3.0.3.32.19980203221437.00a7ebe0@global.california.com> X-Sender: sechevar@global.california.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.3 (32) Date: Tue, 03 Feb 1998 22:14:37 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Sean Echevarria Subject: Re: Who's on the forefront of loopmuse? In-Reply-To: <1.5.4.32.19980204035100.0067cf58@tiac.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"CsgATD.A.6pB.QfA20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2820 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 22:22:08 -0800 X-UIDL: a369670cb401ab28277c7ad5aaaabe0a I thought it was a good mix - more lively than it's been in awhile. Peter E: we don't fucking care At 10:51 PM 2/3/98 -0500, Reg wrote: >Well, other than Ebows, mixers, equipment for sale, cheap RAM, David Torn, >Buckethead, Terry Riley, Philip Glass, South Park (?!?), Porn stars, NAMM, >what would you like to discuss? > From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 23:58:46 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 3 22:46:37 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzybT-0004My-00; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 22:46:35 -0800 Message-ID: <34D80E3F.2BCB@e-z.net> Date: Tue, 03 Feb 1998 22:44:15 -0800 From: doug pieren Reply-To: quail@e-z.net Organization: quail teeth productions X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win95; U; 16bit) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Bitchery vs. Fair Comment References: <1a322a02.34d75573@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"Iq3UPD.A.U0D.p4A20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2821 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 22:46:35 -0800 X-UIDL: 084ffb5059b3559d51cea9b71003ad0c MIvanBerk@aol.com wrote: > > I think I mentioned this a couple of weeks back, but I had the odd only-in-New > York City experience of being bored by Fripp at the Bottom Line (most likely > the same set David Myers witnessed) immediately after hearing an immensely > exciting performance by looping violinist/LiSa manipulator Kaffe Matthews. > But that's my personal bias. I felt that she was doing quite a bit more (so > far as loopy density goes) with quite a bit less gear, but then again, what > she was doing was far more compositionally oriented than what Fripp was doing. > Matthews would generally improvise a theme, then begin to alter it via > processing and resampling, move on to new figures, and resurrect old ones. > Fripp's appeared to be less interested in dealing with the material he > produced once it hit the Eventides and tc 2290s, doing his best to absent > himself from the process to the point of walking offstage and letting the > machines speak for themselves for a good amount of the performance. > > I found this tiring, and left immediately after the flashbulb incident. I > must admit, however, that what did hold my interest about the performance was > the audience's reception of Fripp than by anything he was doing. Those seated > near me (at least the ones who didn't spend the evening competitively > cataloguing their Crimson bootleg collections), seemed to find in the > performance nothing but an affirmation of their solid belief in Fripp's > virtuosity -- a performance that seemed (at least to me, and for better or for > worse) completely uninterested in providing such evidence. > > Basically, yeah, he's boring -- and perhaps he means it. But does that make > it better? > > By the way, if our David Myers is the one who's recorded lots of > "multiprocessor feedback" as Arcane Device, he produces some interesting and > unsettling loop music of his own and has every right to comment without > possibility of damnation. > > -mike Mike - Hear! Hear! If this is the one and the same David Myers, it would be cool to hear more about his interesting approaches to creating loop music. David, if you're out there and it's really you, I'm a big fan and really love your very original soundscapes... From ???@??? Tue Feb 03 23:58:48 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 3 23:27:00 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0xzzEY-00078x-00; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 23:26:58 -0800 Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19980203232645.0098e900@pop.nwlink.com> X-Sender: jt@pop.nwlink.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Tue, 03 Feb 1998 23:26:45 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: JT Subject: Re: Simm sound In-Reply-To: <000401bd30bd$0bed5fa0$70da6f83@pt205.wolfson.cam.ac.uk> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"zLIxdD.A.abG.geB20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2822 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 23:26:58 -0800 X-UIDL: f6397b4647cbcf98709f1a0bb7bec3d2 >I, of course, still use punched cards for my looping. OK, the bandwidth >sucks and it's a pain if you drop them, but the vintage authenticity makes >grown men weep. I use punched paper tape in a Frippertonics-type of setup. But there is a slight problem if you try to overlay more sound on top of it. Apparently there is a finite number of holes you can punch before the paper disintegrates. JT From ???@??? Wed Feb 04 10:58:57 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 4 01:51:43 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y01Ub-0006wJ-00; Wed, 4 Feb 1998 01:51:41 -0800 Sender: camao@camsg001.camb.scee.sony.co.uk Message-ID: <34D83975.449A63E9@scee.sony.co.uk> Date: Wed, 04 Feb 1998 09:48:37 +0000 From: Os X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (X11; I; IRIX 6.2 IP22) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: zoom effects units/vocoding References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"zgXkTB.A.dTG.omD20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2823 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 01:51:41 -0800 X-UIDL: 3611763571fedcf8ae5013dac7dacaaf Dave Trenkel wrote: > It seems to me that it wouldn't affect anything, since the vocoder filters > would passing the material in each range that's already there, it wouldn't > be changing the spectra of the vocoded signal at all. BUT, if you put a > delay line before one of the vocoder inputs, it might be an interesting > effect, if the spectra of the loop were changing over time. Hmmm, and I > just sold my vocoder. I think that's what I meant... If you used something like that LiSa software I guess you could vocode a loop with a backwards copy of itself running at double speed... oook. But no-one has any opinion on the cheap Zoom boxes that offer vocoding (1201/1204)? I'd need to justify the purchase with the knowledge that they where all-round useful. -- Os os@millennium.co.uk http://webworlds.net/os/ From ???@??? Wed Feb 04 10:58:59 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 4 03:18:11 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y02qH-0002zK-00; Wed, 4 Feb 1998 03:18:09 -0800 Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 06:15:54 -0500 (EST) From: Goddess X-Sender: Thefates@voyager.cris.com To: loopers-delight@annihilist.com Subject: Robert Fripp Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Resent-Message-ID: <"hCRVXB.A.fmC.t3E20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2824 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 03:18:09 -0800 X-UIDL: c57e82a2417e7276f0f0f0d06a4d7e0e I never thought that I'd come anywhere near this topic right now. Go figure... I must say though, that I'm not interested in getting involved in this "issue" or a debate. I just wanted to mention my experience... I was able to see Robert this summer on the G-3 tour. I was extremely moved and inspired by his performance. I felt that the performance had a wonderous type of "movement" to it. I was taken far from where I was when I came in. What did piss me off however was the crowd being so loud and disrespectful while I was trying to listen... I personally liked Robert's set better than the entire rest of the show, as it sounded to me like incessant minor pentatonic played on the one all night...dispite this, I still had a nice time hearing the other performers. Yes, I seemed to hear alot of the same sounds, but I was still moved. To me, music can have many different sounds or just one and I may think it's "good". There is more to music than the sounds used to create it. It may not have to be created by people at all like natural sounds like birds or the wind... It could be someone saying your name... There is more going on here... smiles, tweet tweet! Corynne From ???@??? Wed Feb 04 11:01:04 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 4 09:14:43 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y08PH-0006Lu-00; Wed, 4 Feb 1998 09:14:39 -0800 Message-Id: <3.0.2.16.19980204052301.2267c310@texas.net> X-Sender: sharkey@texas.net (Unverified) X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.2 (16) Date: Wed, 04 Feb 1998 05:23:01 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: james rhodes Subject: CDR870- test results, and future uses In-Reply-To: <199802031352_MC2-31BE-E669@compuserve.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"TwE7P.A.UFF.rBK20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2838 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 09:14:39 -0800 X-UIDL: 11f10d03c48e916aad0f84adde034d19 hi, i have had some time to play with the Philips CD recorder,,,and i must say i'm very impressed,,,most of my compositions i burn live to disk,,,from my Mackie 1202vlz... the results have been a low noise to signal ratio, that marvels me,,,fade outs are really quite(no hiss),,,all in all i feel that the CDR870 is a great unit for the independant musician,,,and its VERY easy to operate,,, i have already completed one disc of instrumental music for meditation, or reflection,,,or whatever. using synths,,,and chapman stick,,,and live radio communications from Mir (course i dont speak russian,,,but it sounded cool over the music) im currently working on a more hip hop, acid jazz disc,,,( even the purist looper needs other musical outlets) ive been contacted by a couple of local bands, that want me to pay me to record their gigs,,,as well,,,why not i doth say? if anyone needs a source for this unit try J&R Music in NY 1-888-221-8180 my .02 james From ???@??? Wed Feb 04 10:59:33 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 4 06:07:49 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y05UQ-0003I8-00; Wed, 4 Feb 1998 06:07:46 -0800 Message-Id: <1.5.4.32.19980204140319.0066ec40@tiac.net> X-Sender: rphunt@tiac.net X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 04 Feb 1998 09:03:19 -0500 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Reginald Hunt Subject: Re: zoom effects units/vocoding Resent-Message-ID: <"eX4AXD.A.5sC.kVH20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2825 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 06:07:46 -0800 X-UIDL: 99a3b286efae1af276750e900664ef7d You could check out the Digitech Guitar Talker. They have a phone number to call to hear it: 1-888-TALKER5 Reg At 09:48 AM 2/4/98 +0000, you wrote: >Dave Trenkel wrote: > >> It seems to me that it wouldn't affect anything, since the vocoder filters >> would passing the material in each range that's already there, it wouldn't >> be changing the spectra of the vocoded signal at all. BUT, if you put a >> delay line before one of the vocoder inputs, it might be an interesting >> effect, if the spectra of the loop were changing over time. Hmmm, and I >> just sold my vocoder. > >I think that's what I meant... > >If you used something like that LiSa software I guess you could vocode a >loop with a backwards copy of itself running at double speed... > >oook. > >But no-one has any opinion on the cheap Zoom boxes that offer vocoding >(1201/1204)? I'd need to justify the purchase with the knowledge that >they where all-round useful. > >-- >Os >os@millennium.co.uk >http://webworlds.net/os/ > > > From ???@??? Wed Feb 04 10:59:36 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 4 06:13:11 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y05Zd-0003s2-00; Wed, 4 Feb 1998 06:13:09 -0800 X-Sender: ejmd@pop.erols.com (Unverified) Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <3.0.5.32.19980203232645.0098e900@pop.nwlink.com> References: <000401bd30bd$0bed5fa0$70da6f83@pt205.wolfson.cam.ac.uk> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 09:18:58 -0500 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Ed Drake Subject: Plex Question Resent-Message-ID: <"S0ji2C.A.cVD.RbH20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2826 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 06:13:09 -0800 X-UIDL: 3c31125d9598045804c2191c6a7ffc3d In Switch Quantize under Parameters/Loops, what does Cnf mean? I couldn't find this documented anywhere. Thanks! Ed Oh yeah, what kind of shit does Peter Ensign want? From ???@??? Wed Feb 04 10:59:46 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 4 06:29:46 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y05ph-0005DO-00; Wed, 4 Feb 1998 06:29:45 -0800 Message-Id: <98Feb4.092451est.18818@thicket.arbortext.com> Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 09:21:52 -0500 From: David White Reply-To: dwhite@arbortext.com Organization: Arbortext Inc. X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (WinNT; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: "global english" / 60 mails/day References: <2.2.32.19980203065005.00a2b354@pop.chromatic.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"leBxmC.A.kpE.HrH20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2827 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 06:29:45 -0800 X-UIDL: b1926b25e19641ec5cc0715ff01fa29a While I appreciate Matthias' viewpoint, I must ask for a little slack regarding typos. Yes, I consider "where" for "wear" a typo. I know the difference, but in a two sentence joke proof reading is not a big concern. BTW, Matthias, what is "nuriture?" It is in poor taste to describe the problem and then fail the test yourself. dAve Matthias Grob wrote: > >I tried starting an Ambient Garth Brooks cover band over a year ago. No one > >would where the hat. > >(hat...cover...thinkaboutit) > > Isn't it "wear"? Or is that part of a joke I did not grab? > > This triggers a concern that circulates in my head for a while: > > You know, I like slangs and try to follow and have good laughs sometimes, > but please consider the difficulty for the few not native americans that > still take their time to discover the meanings behind the often "smart > chat" on this list in up to 60 mails/day. > > It is sad, but it takes a simple short "global english" to keep the group > international. Looping definitally is not a typically american thing, even > though american enterprises were the first to risk an investment (after I > took the risk to develop the LOOP delay in switzerland :-) > I do not want to cut the "art" aspect of emailing, but I want all > interested people from any place of the globe to be able to read all mails, > to follow and to feel fine to make their contribution in their "non smart" > style. > Please cut a thin slice of a solid simple bread that we can hold and that > contains all the essence of nuriture you want to contribute and then put > some jam on top if you like to make it more tasty - for those who want it > and can understand it. > > And yes, sometimes it takes rereading and elaborating the mail... many will > read it, after all, maybe years from now... > > Just searching for ways to make a beautifull list shine even more > Matthias From ???@??? Wed Feb 04 10:59:57 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 4 06:56:28 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y06FW-0007Fh-00; Wed, 4 Feb 1998 06:56:26 -0800 Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 09:53:22 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <199802041453.JAA10102@cliff.concentric.net> X-Sender: hideo@pop3.concentric.net X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Tom Lambrecht Subject: Re: Urban Myth #137--the $125 Jammman Resent-Message-ID: <"9r7zeC.A.naG.oDI20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2828 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 06:56:26 -0800 X-UIDL: 9345ba2589acd378c553f74a9bbb0be6 Not a myth . . . it does (did) exist . . . (somber look sweeps the horizon . . . looking for more $125 Jammans) unfortunately, I was #3 of about 40 e-mail messages that the guy told me he received within hours after his late evening post . . . many of you doubtless involved in this feverish correspondence, like workers attending the queen. time to take in a deep breath , EXHALE and let the one that got away go with it. . . take a leisurely walk admiring nature's carbon-based processor technology and . . . SENSORS BACK ON FULL SCAN Tom Tom Lambrecht hideo@concentric.net From ???@??? Thu Feb 05 01:13:25 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 4 13:21:18 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0CFt-0006ni-00; Wed, 4 Feb 1998 13:21:13 -0800 Message-ID: <34D8819F.5ED7@nyfac.com> Date: Wed, 04 Feb 1998 14:56:32 +0000 From: tbajus Reply-To: nyfac2@nyfac.com X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (WinNT; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Hardward v. software References: <1.5.4.32.19980204061343.0067049c@tiac.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"2vdyvC.A.65E.pkN20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2861 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 13:21:13 -0800 X-UIDL: b0346fb482ae7d4ad400045a8ed87bf8 I know that the constant gear references can get a bit tedious, but I find it difficult to talk (esp. write) about the abstractions of creating music. It may be my untutored approach- I have little formal training in music, and I frequently wonder whether or not my real talent (rock-wise, anyway) is not playing guitar, but just being really lucky that when my fingers flip around on the fretboard, most of the time the accidentally fall on notes that sound cool. When I improvise, unlike a lot of people, I haven't the faintest frickin' clue what is going to come out- especially when my playing is at its best. Music for me is about doing, and about sharing. I have never been a solo performer because, for me, every jam is like a call and response section. To talk about the ideas of music without interacting with whoever is speaking seems to be missing something. Besides, you girls are the only people I know that know more about gear and toys than I do. I hate to admit this, but my two functional bands (both totally loop-free (live anyway- we'll see about the studio)) have been so busy that my poor jamman has been sitting next to my bed, forlorn and lonely for the past several months. I have plans for the inprov band to resurface... JamMan v. Echoplex w/trumpet. So, in my final tangent, when does the new Ebow come out again? Trevor Bajus From ???@??? Thu Feb 05 01:13:23 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 4 13:16:34 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0CBH-00066r-00; Wed, 4 Feb 1998 13:16:27 -0800 Message-ID: <34D882AF.1704@nyfac.com> Date: Wed, 04 Feb 1998 15:01:03 +0000 From: tbajus Reply-To: nyfac2@nyfac.com X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (WinNT; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Retro Looping (was Re: Simm sound) References: <1.5.4.32.19980204165947.00677680@interactive.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"kGOP2D.A.TlE.aiN20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2859 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 13:16:27 -0800 X-UIDL: 8fbafab212d4711ebc9cf34b625b61a3 I use a rock. That's all. From ???@??? Wed Feb 04 11:00:03 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 4 07:07:01 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y06Pi-0000NV-00; Wed, 4 Feb 1998 07:06:58 -0800 From: ZeplinSoup@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 10:01:58 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Bitchery vs. Fair Comment Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 16-bit for Windows sub 64 Resent-Message-ID: <"Sk2-qD.A.SE.zNI20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2829 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 07:06:58 -0800 X-UIDL: 6056d2354d43cfe0d150d217d78de940 >So who's Christy Canyon? What does she play? Jonathan Brainin skin flute From ???@??? Thu Feb 05 01:13:24 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 4 13:16:48 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0CBO-000681-00; Wed, 4 Feb 1998 13:16:34 -0800 Message-ID: <34D88372.3B0@nyfac.com> Date: Wed, 04 Feb 1998 15:04:18 +0000 From: tbajus Reply-To: nyfac2@nyfac.com X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (WinNT; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Frippery vs. Bitchery References: <01BD319A.A9F3E560@slip139-92-21-83.lo.uk.ibm.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"en21wD.A.7lE.diN20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2860 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 13:16:34 -0800 X-UIDL: ceb15ea07db4e11eb1a0b1d999494db2 I think criticism is a good thing. Even for Fripp. I have a friend of mine who, after every show of mine that he sees, no matter how good it was, sits down, and picks it apart. The funny thing is, unless I hear the bad things, I can't appreciate the good. Nothing is worse than uncritical, unqualified praise. Trevor Bajus From ???@??? Wed Feb 04 11:00:16 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 4 07:30:48 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y06mj-0002iO-00; Wed, 4 Feb 1998 07:30:45 -0800 Message-Id: <1.5.4.32.19980204152438.0067e274@tiac.net> X-Sender: rphunt@tiac.net X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 04 Feb 1998 10:24:38 -0500 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Reginald Hunt Subject: forefront etc... Resent-Message-ID: <"ZqbYPB.A.H7B.3hI20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2831 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 07:30:45 -0800 X-UIDL: 4abe348cfa5f92c80914385aae5c5010 Kim, I for one would be interested if you would share some of the innovations in looping that are occuring in the dance/techno field. One reason I started checking out this list was to see what ideas and approaches existed beyond what I had already encountered or come up with. I've been looping since about 1983, and one thing I've seen consistently is the short attention spans manufacturers have for the subject. They dabble in long delay times, find it is not yet the market they want, then lose interest (Lexicon, Ibanez, Digitech, for example). If Oberhiem starts designing their delay units strictly for the sampling/dance market, then the rest of the Looper world will once again be stranded. Of course, that's business. Reg From ???@??? Wed Feb 04 11:00:15 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 4 07:28:52 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y06kq-0002Rh-00; Wed, 4 Feb 1998 07:28:48 -0800 Message-Id: <3.0.2.32.19980204102601.00735eb4@dharma.mitre.org> X-Sender: seligman@dharma.mitre.org X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.2 (32) Date: Wed, 04 Feb 1998 10:26:01 -0500 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Len Seligman Subject: Re: Plex Question (SwitchQuant="Cnf") Cc: tspauldi@mail.nash.gibson.com In-Reply-To: References: <3.0.5.32.19980203232645.0098e900@pop.nwlink.com> <000401bd30bd$0bed5fa0$70da6f83@pt205.wolfson.cam.ac.uk> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"UrXdID.A.WwB.qgI20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2830 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 07:28:48 -0800 X-UIDL: e69d7f29611d584dcac76d1a4029d7bd At 09:18 AM 2/4/98 -0500, you wrote: >In Switch Quantize under Parameters/Loops, what does Cnf mean? I couldn't >find this documented anywhere. >Thanks! Ed > Ed, I asked the Plex-masters the same question, and got the following reply. (Tom S., you folks should probably send out a Release 5.0 Notes addendum to the manual that has this info plus some corrections to the manual--e.g., that there is no such value as SwitchQuant="On", that instead your choices are "cnf" or "cyc"; the latter changes loops at the *cycle* boundary, not at the *loop* boundary as it says in the manual.). From: matthias@bahianet.com.br (Matthias Grob) >what is the meaning of SwitchQuant="Cnf"? It gives you time to select the loop nr and function you want. But you have to do a second press to make it finally change the loop. The second press can be any key, creating the corresponding function when you arrive in the new loop. The "neutral" one (des nothing in the new loop) is UNDO. Matthias From ???@??? Wed Feb 04 11:00:25 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 4 07:38:25 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y06u4-0003k9-00; Wed, 4 Feb 1998 07:38:20 -0800 Message-Id: <1.5.4.32.19980204153010.0066bbcc@tiac.net> X-Sender: rphunt@tiac.net (Unverified) X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 04 Feb 1998 10:30:10 -0500 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Reginald Hunt Subject: LD site outage Resent-Message-ID: <"7M3rUD.A.mpC.UnI20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2833 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 07:38:20 -0800 X-UIDL: 371f18e29d26290d5cc721202c26489a Is Looper'as Delight down permanently? Its been gone since Sunday. Email to Kim directly just bounces back. Any word? Reg From ???@??? Wed Feb 04 11:00:28 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 4 07:53:02 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y078F-0005Pm-00; Wed, 4 Feb 1998 07:52:59 -0800 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <3.0.2.32.19980204102601.00735eb4@dharma.mitre.org> References: <3.0.5.32.19980203232645.0098e900@pop.nwlink.com> <000401bd30bd$0bed5fa0$70da6f83@pt205.wolfson.cam.ac.uk> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: klaw@iglou.com Subject: Re: Plex Question (SwitchQuant="Cnf") Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 10:49:24 -0500 Resent-Message-ID: <"0fC6GB.A.zqE.N4I20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2834 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 07:52:59 -0800 X-UIDL: 73d4a2ef93b87c81358454b5584d9c8d Someone from Oberheim once told me it stood for "confirm". K LAW >At 09:18 AM 2/4/98 -0500, you wrote: >>In Switch Quantize under Parameters/Loops, what does Cnf mean? I couldn't >>find this documented anywhere. >>Thanks! Ed >> > >Ed, I asked the Plex-masters the same question, and got the following reply. > >(Tom S., you folks should probably send out a Release 5.0 Notes addendum to >the manual that has this info plus some corrections to the manual--e.g., >that there is no such value as SwitchQuant="On", that instead your choices >are "cnf" or "cyc"; the latter changes loops at the *cycle* boundary, not >at the *loop* boundary as it says in the manual.). > >From: matthias@bahianet.com.br (Matthias Grob) > >>what is the meaning of SwitchQuant="Cnf"? > >It gives you time to select the loop nr and function you want. But you have >to do a second press to make it finally change the loop. The second press >can be any key, creating the corresponding function when you arrive in the >new loop. The "neutral" one (des nothing in the new loop) is UNDO. > > >Matthias From ???@??? Wed Feb 04 12:14:01 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 4 11:41:35 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0AhK-0001jQ-00; Wed, 4 Feb 1998 11:41:26 -0800 From: "Bailey, Jim" To: 'looppost' Subject: RE: loops, ambient or otherwise Date:Wed, 4 Feb 1998 11:10:00 -0500 Message-ID: <34D8C1FC@199.71.37.25> Encoding: 46 TEXT X-Mailer: Microsoft Mail V3.0 Resent-Message-ID: <"u9D1H.A.z.SGM20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2848 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 11:41:26 -0800 X-UIDL: 23ddd35755f9768a228ff40b9c3b649b Mike Biffle wrote: > > Thanks Reg for such clear and devoloped definitions regarding looping. Most of > my comments are in reply to your feelings about Robert Fripp below. > 1/ Then kindly delete those portions to which your comments are not addressed. One problem with this list, and the reason digest subscribers sometimes get several copies in a day, is that people don't EDIT!! If I'd wanted that I'd have gone for the other version. A handy feature of these modern computers is that unwanted text can be DELETED, thereby saving not only that nebulous entity known as BANDWIDTH, but also the need to scroll through seemingly endless lines of dross. Since Kim is kind enough to keep this list unmoderated (of which, having as I do an anarchist bent, I heartily approve) then it is up to us to keep it readable. I prefer my looping in the audio domain; in text it becomes more redundant than the base track for "Healthy Colours." 2/ Then Peter Ensign commented: i dont want this shit Fine. Then don't read it! Especially, DON'T SEND IT BACK TO US!! TWICE!!! With regard to the aforementioned Mr. Fripp, I was at the "Space Music" performance here in Toronto, and found it to be a highly entertaining evening in many respects. When the sounds became less interesting, I merely tuned them out and continued to converse with friends, many of whom I hadn't seen for a long time, with one ear open to catch any interesting changes. This, as I understand, was part of Robert's expectation of me as an audient, and I was glad to oblige. It then took on some aspects of certain John Cage events such as HPSCHD, where one is free to wander about the "space" and experience the sounds from different viewpoints. I hope this helps prod the thread back to relevance. Jim Bailey From ???@??? Wed Feb 04 11:00:24 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 4 07:38:14 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y06tv-0003j2-00; Wed, 4 Feb 1998 07:38:11 -0800 Message-ID: <34D89767.385D@infobiogen.fr> Date: Wed, 04 Feb 1998 16:29:29 +0000 From: Malhomme Olivier Reply-To: malhomme@infobiogen.fr Organization: I P L X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 [fr] (Macintosh; I; PPC) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re:fernandes References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"Rf9XmD.A.hoC.MnI20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2832 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 07:38:11 -0800 X-UIDL: a5a4aa50094e449f2b7e699213fb5c02 1: They use tu sell the sustainer separatly, but no more. The fact that it must be somewhat possible since Reeves Gabrels got one on his Parker(s) fly(ies?). Ok, we certainly don't share the same bank account nor the same connections. 2: Don't know. I think still keep it quite secret with maybe the intention to sell it sometimes. 3: (bonus) The maker of the old sustainiac made quite recently an announcement for their new product. It is to be installed on a strat style guitar (it was last time I heard from them) with a lot of features that do not exist on the previous models of any manufacters, like a button to have a sudden burst of energy to have arco sounds... and the usual harmonics selector... Olivier Malhomme From ???@??? Wed Feb 04 11:00:51 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 4 08:37:59 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y07pl-0002DD-00; Wed, 4 Feb 1998 08:37:57 -0800 Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 11:31:04 -0500 (EST) From: Adam Levin To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Simm sound In-Reply-To: <3.0.5.32.19980203232645.0098e900@pop.nwlink.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Resent-Message-ID: <"_eGRyC.A.KVB.OgJ20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2836 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 08:37:57 -0800 X-UIDL: 8c5d3549e5e1c2f3d479a89abc484957 On Tue, 3 Feb 1998, JT wrote: > > >I, of course, still use punched cards for my looping. OK, the bandwidth > >sucks and it's a pain if you drop them, but the vintage authenticity makes > >grown men weep. > > I use punched paper tape in a Frippertonics-type of setup. But there is a > slight problem if you try to overlay more sound on top of it. Apparently > there is a finite number of holes you can punch before the paper > disintegrates. Surely a drawback, but it's minor when you consider that these modern digital doo-hickeys just don't have the warmth of the old punchcards. The punchcards burn much easier. -Adam --- "...if one strives at hearing for the sake of constant virtue, out of seeking liberation from cyclic existence, gradually one becomes a Hearer." - Chandrakirti From ???@??? Wed Feb 04 11:00:45 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 4 08:32:50 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y07kk-0001V7-00; Wed, 4 Feb 1998 08:32:46 -0800 Message-ID: <01BD3160.8B61DD30@TD-300> From: jprice@intcpi.com (John Price) To: "'Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com'" Subject: RE: Who's on the forefront of loopmuse? Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 11:32:08 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="---- =_NextPart_000_01BD3160.8BE84B40" Resent-Message-ID: <"9c-SVC.A.k7.IdJ20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2835 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 08:32:46 -0800 X-UIDL: 1a03ae3c1429c8aabd26c9b5c4e0fabc I kinda until like, maybe 3mos ago perceived this site as a home for classic loopers. Clearly, its more diverse than that. But I did think at first that everyone was either a guitar player or a violinist or an Analog Synth Looper doin the Ambient thang. ( Nothin wrong with any of that ) Assumptions are always fatal. -----Original Message----- From: Kim Flint [SMTP:kflint@chromatic.com] Sent: Tuesday, February 03, 1998 8:04 PM To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: RE: Who's on the forefront of loopmuse? At 07:47 PM 2/3/98 -0500, David Kirkdorffer wrote: >If it's the Dance Scene where real innovation is taking place, maybe we >ought to advertise the existence of our loopy-list to a few dance and dj >oriented web-worlds?? I have actually, a little. There are some lurking around, although more would be good and introduce some fresh perspectives. Although, after mentioning it on a dnb producer's list, one fellow checked it out and came back saying it was interesting, but "seemed like just a bunch of fripp-heads." (read that as, "only dinosaurs there") After the past couple of days, it's hard to disagree! kim _______________________________________________________ Kim Flint 408-752-9284 Mpact Systems Engineering kflint@chromatic.com Chromatic Research http://www.chromatic.com From ???@??? Wed Feb 04 11:01:00 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 4 09:02:59 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y08Dw-0004p8-00; Wed, 4 Feb 1998 09:02:56 -0800 Message-Id: <1.5.4.32.19980204165947.00677680@interactive.net> X-Sender: jbrainin@interactive.net X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 04 Feb 1998 11:59:47 -0500 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Jonathan Brainin Subject: Retro Looping (was Re: Simm sound) Resent-Message-ID: <"5MijzD.A.DAE.G5J20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2837 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 09:02:56 -0800 X-UIDL: e03a2204ebc51f78d4929e285a90a3dd At 11:31 AM 2/4/98 -0500, Adam Levin wrote: >On Tue, 3 Feb 1998, JT wrote: >> I use punched paper tape in a Frippertonics-type of setup. But there is a >> slight problem if you try to overlay more sound on top of it. Apparently >> there is a finite number of holes you can punch before the paper >> disintegrates. > >Surely a drawback, but it's minor when you consider that these modern >digital doo-hickeys just don't have the warmth of the old punchcards. > >The punchcards burn much easier. > >-Adam I've gone to a dual-mono analog setup that is built around two abacuses. Reaaly great for rythmic loops. Jonathan Brainin jbrainin@interactive.net From ???@??? Thu Feb 05 01:15:03 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 4 17:46:22 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0GOQ-0001H4-00; Wed, 4 Feb 1998 17:46:18 -0800 Message-ID: <2148EC143F29D1118BE000805FC13CD01E1F5B@migarexch01.maritz.com> From: "Liebig, Steuart A." To: "'Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com'" Subject: RE: looping as sin Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 11:32:08 -0600 X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) Resent-Message-ID: <"mAeG2D.A.Oi.qiR20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2884 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 17:46:18 -0800 X-UIDL: 6f355f66c9025f36b6c350b435b778fb Was it the comment, or the syndrome that was pitiful? > ---------- > From: Reginald Hunt > Reply To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com > Sent: Tuesday, February 3, 1998 10:18 PM > To: LiebigSA@maritz.com > Subject: Re: looping as sin > > Come on let's face it. Just like any other subject, there are some > folks > concerned more with the technology than what it produces. We need > people > like that, but we can't evaluate performers strictly by their degree > of > technological innovation (which I've seen done here). > > Yes, the remark about playing ICs when looping is used by itself was > pitiful. > > Be at peace. > Reg > > > At 11:18 PM 2/3/98 EST, you wrote: > > > >On Tue, 03 Feb 1998 Reginald Hunt writes: > > > >>Fripp (again? oh please!) has never been about being a > >>Looper, either. For him it is a method, not the point. > > > > > > > > > >So, for the LOOPERS the point is not the MUSIC, > >but the LOOPING, or, as someone else has noticed earlier, > >playing ICs (and SIMMs) !!! > >Oh! what am i going to do? i'm doomed ! > >Please, Reggie, have mercy! i promise to unsubscribe > >from this unholy site! > > > >Paparuda > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >_____________________________________________________________________ > >You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. > >Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com > >Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] > > > > > > > > > > From ???@??? Wed Feb 04 11:01:12 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 4 09:49:28 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y08wv-0002Ve-00; Wed, 4 Feb 1998 09:49:25 -0800 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <34D80E3F.2BCB@e-z.net> References: <1a322a02.34d75573@aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 12:44:04 -0500 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: David Myers Subject: Arcane Device Resent-Message-ID: <"sJ1s5D.A.2zB.jkK20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2840 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 09:49:25 -0800 X-UIDL: 942685a0e2b888e0d57d0f82138558cc >MIvanBerk@aol.com wrote: >> By the way, if our David Myers is the one who's recorded lots of >> "multiprocessor feedback" as Arcane Device, he produces some interesting and >> unsettling loop music of his own and has every right to comment without >> possibility of damnation. >> >> -mike >Mike - Hear! Hear! If this is the one and the same David Myers, it would >be cool to hear more about his interesting approaches to creating loop >music. David, if you're out there and it's really you, I'm a big fan and >really love your very original soundscapes... Okay, you guys (and a few others) have "outed" me. About 1988 I did a 5 or 6 year project called Arcane Device-I think 7 CD's, buncha tapes, an LP and one double 7-inch record, maybe 30 performances in NYC, Boston, Pittsburgh, Cleveland, Hamburg, Copenhagen. It may be of technical interest to some folks here. For this material I never used any sound "sources" for the loops-that is, it was "feedback music", the looping delays generating their own sounds by being fed into themselves. I got four 7.6 sec Digitech Time Machines and fed them into a custom mixer--basically, four channels with four effects sends on each. This formed a kind of routing matrix in which any delay could feed any delay, including itself. I "played" the delays and mixer as an instrument--very active use of the "sends". Usually, very short delays got the feedback cranking, then this sound would be handed off to a longer delay for looping, etc. Very hard to predict what might happen sometimes-I always thought of performances as something akin to a chess game or boxing match, where I was going one-on-one with whatever sounds came at me. Alot of risk involved, particularly when it was in public! My favorite CD was a little different. "Also Sprach Zarathustra" (may still be available on Staalplaat Records) was done with a Lexicon LXP-5, an MRC, and one pot. Same thing, the LXP-5 fed itself, but the MRC was used extensively to crank the parameters. Given the setup, the variety of sounds and structures is pretty amazing, even if I do say so myself. (Admittedly, a pretty bombastic title, but besides being a longtime fan of the book, I guess I thought "stickin in to" the classical establishment wouldn't hurt, either.) The last solo CD I did (had two collaborative releases with German composer Asmus Tietchens) technically puzzles even me. On "Envoi in Cumin" I again used the 4X Time Machine setup. Each delay was set for approx. 1 second. But the routing was so strange (wish I could recount it exactly) that what came out was a kind of "see-saw" base sound--yeah, a loop--which varied in period somehow. I called it a "soft loop", and it subtly changed in sound as the loop time wandered between 7 and 15 seconds! In part, this was due to these delays having LFO modulation available, which in this case I applied sparingly--a good selling point (along with all those other knobs) for the Digitechs. Hope all this may be of interest or inspiration to you loopmaniacs.... David Myers ____________________________________ "Eternity is not limited by the conditions of time, and time is eternal in virtue of its cyclic recurrence." -Hermetica, Asclepius III From ???@??? Thu Feb 05 01:13:27 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 4 13:37:14 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0CVF-0001CW-00; Wed, 4 Feb 1998 13:37:05 -0800 Message-Id: <3.0.2.16.19980204094423.2fff0ae4@texas.net> X-Sender: sharkey@texas.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.2 (16) Date: Wed, 04 Feb 1998 09:44:23 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: james rhodes Subject: Re: CDR870- test results, and future uses In-Reply-To: <3.0.1.32.19980204120629.00701158@txdirect.net> References: <3.0.2.16.19980204052301.2267c310@texas.net> <199802031352_MC2-31BE-E669@compuserve.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"nwIaKB.A.jD.Z2N20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2863 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 13:37:05 -0800 X-UIDL: f24d38381b5e2b1c947f97a3a865859f hey,, picked it up for approx $670.00 US after shipping, a few discs, etc... yes it is indeed a stand-alone unit, with RCA in/out, and digital optical in/out,,looks and functions like a DAT for more info: http://www.srtl.co.uk/srtl/cdr870.html james At 12:06 PM 2/4/98 -0600, you wrote: >how much did you pay for your phillips? Is it a standalone? > > >Real Audio Zombie Project Music! Paisley Babylon, more coming.... >http://www.txdirect.net/users/zom > > > From ???@??? Thu Feb 05 01:15:21 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 4 19:08:15 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0Hfc-0002LI-00; Wed, 4 Feb 1998 19:08:08 -0800 Message-ID: <34D8AC3F.28AB@worldnet.att.net> Date: Wed, 04 Feb 1998 09:58:23 -0800 From: Stephen Porter X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0C-WorldNet (Win16; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Vendors in New England for Studer-ReVox Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"-bbskB.A.LZB.ytS20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2890 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 19:08:08 -0800 X-UIDL: 1de21bc9e24cfd0cf6715d631d12c345 Help, Does anyone know of a vendor in Boston area that sells new ReVox B77 Tape Recorders? Or the ReVox web address? Thank You,Steve SJP1138@worldnet.att.net From ???@??? Wed Feb 04 11:01:06 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 4 09:15:54 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y08QQ-0006WH-00; Wed, 4 Feb 1998 09:15:50 -0800 Message-ID: <34D8ADB9.7A87@infobiogen.fr> Date: Wed, 04 Feb 1998 18:04:51 +0000 From: Malhomme Olivier Reply-To: malhomme@infobiogen.fr Organization: I P L X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 [fr] (Macintosh; I; PPC) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: fernandes again References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"ztGll.A.WMF.dCK20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2839 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 09:15:50 -0800 X-UIDL: 10096d4aae5e5a6098fe6d9ce703d377 To add fuel again: I own a strat style Fernandes with sust. It has two single/one humbuck. The singles sound good, brilliant and the double coil sounds with a hell of a lot of of high frequencies. I usually turn down to 80% the high on the tonality pot. Otherwise chords with distortion sounds very clear and they got a quite good load of punch. I'd say I like them. Never thought of replacemant (but I use it a lot with a VG-8 by the way, so... why would I care for pick-up sound or amps or whatever?) Olivier Malhomme From ???@??? Wed Feb 04 11:01:15 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 4 10:09:22 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y09GD-00058N-00; Wed, 4 Feb 1998 10:09:21 -0800 Message-Id: <3.0.1.32.19980204120629.00701158@txdirect.net> X-Sender: zom@txdirect.net X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.1 (32) Date: Wed, 04 Feb 1998 12:06:29 -0600 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: ZOM Subject: Re: CDR870- test results, and future uses In-Reply-To: <3.0.2.16.19980204052301.2267c310@texas.net> References: <199802031352_MC2-31BE-E669@compuserve.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"Rg1pRB.A.mGE.J2K20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2841 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 10:09:21 -0800 X-UIDL: fe14c25ba48a5ec068040de563bb2a42 how much did you pay for your phillips? Is it a standalone? Real Audio Zombie Project Music! Paisley Babylon, more coming.... http://www.txdirect.net/users/zom From ???@??? Wed Feb 04 11:01:28 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 4 10:41:50 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y09lY-0001eX-00; Wed, 4 Feb 1998 10:41:44 -0800 Message-ID: <01BD319A.A26514E0@slip139-92-21-83.lo.uk.ibm.net> From: "Brian Thomson, London UK" To: "'Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com'" Subject: Re: Location / Loopers' CD Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 18:16:39 -0000 Encoding: 8 TEXT Resent-Message-ID: <"XufdEB.A.VLH.VNL20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2843 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 10:41:44 -0800 X-UIDL: 8ee3e3ee0bf15d638c375a727535adc5 Muswell Hill, London UK. Muswell Hill is just north of Highgate - about 4 miles north of the West End... CD: I've just managed to get some of my tracks on to a CD-R ready for the next Loopers' CD, so I'll be keeping an eye open for the next mention... Brian Thomson, London UK From ???@??? Wed Feb 04 11:01:29 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 4 10:42:35 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y09mH-0001lf-00; Wed, 4 Feb 1998 10:42:29 -0800 Message-ID: <01BD319A.A9F3E560@slip139-92-21-83.lo.uk.ibm.net> From: "Brian Thomson, London UK" To: "'Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com'" Subject: RE: Frippery vs. Bitchery Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 18:20:33 -0000 Encoding: 24 TEXT Resent-Message-ID: <"AA5DIC.A.IPH.rNL20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2844 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 10:42:29 -0800 X-UIDL: 966f48af647b13b7ada87c12d90b527b >Just listen to it, and if you don't like it, listen to something else. I just think this bitching about his work is pointless unless someone can come up with an alternative guitarist/style/etc that one likes Better. Or perhaps it's your own work you like better, just say so.< If I can add my two pence on this... I think we're arguing about this because Fripp is an important personage in this regard. I mean would you care if a man engaged in, er, fellatio, if he wasn't the President Of The United States (POTUS)? (Cough) I think my analogy slipped a little there... I meant to say that Fripp's lofty status in this field means that we Care what he thinks and does, and look for meaning in it, even if there isn't meant to be any. I won't even start to talk about Expectations... Personally, I imagine that if I had bothered to stand in the hour-long queue at the recent Night Watch launch, and had a chat with him, I probably wouldn't like him as a person. And why would I want his written autograph, when I have his musical autograph on the CD in my hand? Brian Thomson, London UK bnt@ibm.net From ???@??? Wed Feb 04 11:01:19 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 4 10:30:02 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y09a8-00004U-00; Wed, 4 Feb 1998 10:29:56 -0800 Message-ID: <013601bd3199$9deaa5c0$c2b854ce@mark.asisoftware.com> From: Mark@asisoftware.com (Mark Kata) To: "Loopers Delight" Subject: RE: Arcane Device Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 13:20:48 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0133_01BD316F.B4E24320" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Resent-Message-ID: <"Bdl_9B.A.mVG.iHL20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2842 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 10:29:56 -0800 X-UIDL: dc25d942a79bfe67502506628469180d
Hi David,
 
Thanks for explaining how you made those sounds.  I have several of your works and it always puzzled me how you were able to generate the sounds.
 
Didn't you have two "instruments"?  A big console and a small portable unit?
 
You're right about knobs on equipment.  I wish every piece of equipment had three or four knobs whose control functions you could select.
 
Mark Kata
Mark@asisoftware.com
From ???@??? Wed Feb 04 11:01:30 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 4 10:42:44 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y09mQ-0001mt-00; Wed, 4 Feb 1998 10:42:38 -0800 Message-ID: <01BD319A.B128AF00@slip139-92-21-83.lo.uk.ibm.net> From: "Brian Thomson, London UK" To: "'Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com'" Subject: Unsubscribe info please? Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 18:28:21 -0000 Encoding: 16 TEXT Resent-Message-ID: <"K0Ar5.A.ZSH.-NL20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2845 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 10:42:38 -0800 X-UIDL: 47d6bd73b3110045dccd040c703ecfa6 Since the Looper's Digest site is currently off-line (it still was ten minutes ago), could someone post the un-subscription information to the list, please? I love this list, but the quantity is just too much when you're connecting through a mobile phone at 9600bps and you only have so many free call-time minutes... I'll back if I get a LAN connection like on my last placing (I'm an IT contractor). Cheers! Brian Thomson, London UK bnt@ibm.net From ???@??? Wed Feb 04 11:01:32 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 4 10:51:48 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y09vH-00034n-00; Wed, 4 Feb 1998 10:51:47 -0800 Message-Id: <3.0.3.32.19980204103928.00a88cd0@global.california.com> X-Sender: sechevar@global.california.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.3 (32) Date: Wed, 04 Feb 1998 10:39:28 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Sean Echevarria Subject: Re: Unsubscribe info please? In-Reply-To: <01BD319A.B128AF00@slip139-92-21-83.lo.uk.ibm.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"VOjXmC.A.HjB.mZL20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2846 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 10:51:47 -0800 X-UIDL: 2911be73f0047501dd13742c3e7dab64 - In the unlikely event that you ever need to unsubscribe, send a message to Loopers-Delight-request@annihilist.com with "unsubscribe" in both the subject and body. No signatures! At 06:28 PM 2/4/98 -0000, Brian Thomson, London UK wrote: >Since the Looper's Digest site is currently off-line (it still was ten >minutes ago), could someone post the un-subscription information to the >list, please? From ???@??? Wed Feb 04 12:13:56 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 4 11:07:38 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0AAV-0005O0-00; Wed, 4 Feb 1998 11:07:31 -0800 X-Sender: paulpop@marlin.ssnet.com Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Paulpop@ssnet.com (Paul Poplawski, Phd) Subject: Re: ambient & otherwise Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 10:54:20 -0800 Resent-Message-ID: <"P9n1pD.A.s_D.gqL20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2847 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 11:07:31 -0800 X-UIDL: a806167be8ae4b82db587112683003ae poppycock ... Fripp is a guitar player not the Dali Lama ... or if I am to go on the assumption that we are all the DL, then (yawn), fine, Fripp is the DL, and so am I ... I guess I am tiring of the ambient, techno-babble about his relative worth as a human next to everyone else and how serious-minded his "performances" are or are not. The experience of him recently was borrish and uninspired ... and yeah yeah ... there is little to connect with and I found it offensive that he appeared to be judging anyone who didn't arrive 30 minutes prior to the stated witching hour. Spare me. There is something a bit too self-congratulatory about all this ... play the guitar At 1:00 AM 2/4/98, Reginald Hunt wrote: >Response to Miko Biffle: > >>>Unfortunately, the human animal can suffer from the tendency to follow >>>sheep-like (or lemming-like). Ambient music has suffered from its contingent >>>of brain dead devotees, as has Fripp. Originally, ambient music was not >>>intended as a hypnotic tranquilizer (which looping inherently lends itself >>>to). It was meant as music which operates equally on different levels of >>>awareness simultaneously. Persons who assume that loopers are into ambient >>>music by default, are a type of bigot. But don't damn a style of music for >>>that. > >>Does this imply that 'bad' ambient music has actually impaired our ability to >>perceive Mr. Fripp? How nasty of the mediocrities. > >>I'm not sure how 'ambient' music was originally intended. Was there a group >>charter for the genre or something? Or are we now following sheep-like, some >>authority on the subject? I'd like to think that even the most unassuming >person >>who purchases *any* cheesy sounds to alter their environment, is somehow >taking >>a rather active measure to alter their experience somehow. Most commendable! > >I'm not referring to good or bad anything. Even the herd-instinct has value. >But, >like any other music form, heavy-metal, dance, whatever, ambient gets a bad >reputation >from a certain segment of the audience and performers who cause it to >stagnate. To get a feel >for ambient's original goal, Eno is always a good source. Ther are some web >sites >that feature useful quotes of his. > >>Bigot? Let they without sin cast the first stone! Those mindless drones have >>infected us all... Animals indeed! > >My use of the word "bigot" goes by its strict definition. It is not a sin, >but is indeed >a mindset (again by definition). > >>>Fripp has always been an acquired taste. His explorations extend beyond >>>music per se. He has always questioned the audience-performer relationship, >>>and the effect of the music business on musicians. His actions at >>>performances are reflective of all that and probably more. He's never been >>>about being a "hot" player. The many comments I've seen here and elsewhere >>>asking why he doesn't "rip it up", or about him leavng the stage and >>>observing the audience, shows a lack of understanding about the artist. > >>To believe that I don't understand the artist because I have preferences >>as to >what I might experience at a performance seems a little PC to me. > >Again, by definition, if the preferences don't truly apply to the artist, >e.g. Fripp bashing out >"Lark's Tongues" at a Soundscapes performance (which I have seen emails >about in >other places), then it's a lack of understanding. > >>I've been able >>to enjoy the vast differences in much of Fripps output. Fripp doesn't have to >>always rip, but if I shell out to go see him, I'm hoping I might get some >>tiny >>portion that which I know to also be alive somewhere in his soul as well. >After >>all the pendulum does swing both ways. > >Fripp himself freely admits that there is no guarantee in regards to his >performances, >that anyone who purchases a ticket probably knows this, and if they don't, >oh well. I've >read correspondance he had with some one who complained so bitterly about >his responsibilities >to audience expectation that he sent them a refund on the condition they >never attend one >of his shows again. >Also, his soul definitely does come through his Soundscapes. It may not >rock, but it comes through. > >>Did you study with Mr. Fripp or what? > >Nope. > >>I've found that as I've grown older, I sometimes have to cut to the chase a >>little quicker than I used to. If I lack understanding about Fripp as an >artist >>because I hope to see him in a comfortable, non-combative setting, which >>might >>allow for undistracted listening, then so be it. Let me be 'responsible' >for my >>own listening experience without dictating to me. Maybe I'm just an old >>intolerant fart as well. Who am I to dictate? > >I don't think the idea is to remove the rules, only to change them. And, >indeed, >he his assigning more responsibility to the audience. > >>If lectures become a larger part of other artists performances, I may begin >>having a harder time enjoying them as well. Although I might actually pursue >>some artists due to their engaging communication style and content. I believe >>Fripp is starting to sound redundant to me at this point. Hopefully the >pendulum >>will swing again and I will enjoy many more years of delightful Fripp output. > >Fripp will always be part teacher, I think. > >>I find it somewhat totalitarian though that Fripp expects certain >>conformities >>from his audience without somehow realizing that his audience might expect >some >>regard for their needs as well. Especially having shelled out their ducats. > >See Fripp for Fripp. Not what you need. You might get even more. > >Reg °°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°° Paul Poplawski, Ph.D. email = ppoplawski@state.de.us or paulpop@ssnet.com phone (service) = 302/737-4491 weekday office = 302/577-4980 From ???@??? Thu Feb 05 01:14:57 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 4 17:18:05 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0Fx2-0005FM-00; Wed, 4 Feb 1998 17:18:00 -0800 Message-ID: <2148EC143F29D1118BE000805FC13CD01E1F5D@migarexch01.maritz.com> From: "Liebig, Steuart A." To: "'Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com'" Subject: RE: Arcane Device Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 13:09:15 -0600 X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) Resent-Message-ID: <"51pPV.A.hjD.zCR20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2880 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 17:18:00 -0800 X-UIDL: aaed643b97455421abc5863cab51fb9f Yes for knobs. Frankly, I'd be much more likely to want something like a JamMan or Oberheim 'Plex if they had knobs. Maybe it's the neo-Luddite in me, but I prefer being able to manually adapt parameters (in addition to foot control) to whatever is going on musically. Hence my fondness for the EH 16-second delay. This morning, I was lamenting the fact that something like the 'Plex (which will obviously have superior sonic specs) isn't available with these features . . . and in a non-rack package. I'm sick of racks and like to be able to just pull out a pedal . . . again a plus of the EH16. > ---------- > From: Mark@asisoftware.com > Reply To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com > Sent: Wednesday, February 4, 1998 10:30 AM > To: LiebigSA@maritz.com > Subject: RE: Arcane Device > > Hi David, >   > Thanks for explaining how you made those sounds.  I have several of > your works and it always puzzled me how you were able to generate the > sounds. >   > Didn't you have two "instruments"?  A big console and a small portable > unit? >   > You're right about knobs on equipment.  I wish every piece of > equipment had three or four knobs whose control functions you could > select. >   > Mark Kata > Mark@asisoftware.com > From ???@??? Wed Feb 04 12:14:05 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 4 11:45:02 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0Aki-0002E4-00; Wed, 4 Feb 1998 11:44:56 -0800 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <013601bd3199$9deaa5c0$c2b854ce@mark.asisoftware.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 14:30:36 -0500 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: David Myers Subject: RE: Arcane Device Resent-Message-ID: <"ivDZvC.A.UW.fIM20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2849 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 11:44:56 -0800 X-UIDL: ea28fd19e3ea6f8a43258f8f11c28327 > Hi David, Thanks for explaining how you made those sounds. I have >several of your works and it always puzzled me how you were able to >generate the sounds. Didn't you have two "instruments"? A big console >and a small portable unit? You're right about knobs on equipment. I >wish every piece of equipment had three or four knobs whose control >functions you could select. Mark Kata Mark@asisoftware.com Yeah Mark, there was also a little unit I called the "shoebox" or "carry-on". I got three Digitech 2 second delay pedals--forget the model no., but they were pretty good bandwidth: 12 or 15K, unlike the 8 sec floor pedal which some people have mentioned here), tore them up and routed all the pots & switches to my own, crammed all the PCB's (along with a similarly-stripped Microverb) into a box about 12 X 9 X 5". Had a mixing-matrix too, of course. It was a screamer! Only recording it really got featured on was a concert recording which was on, I think, AD7 (cassette from some little label in CA). Unfortunately, a real underground venue in Pittsburgh had questionable AC and smoke came out of the poor little thing! Was never the same.... David Myers From ???@??? Wed Feb 04 12:14:03 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 4 11:44:58 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0Akc-0002DL-00; Wed, 4 Feb 1998 11:44:50 -0800 Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 14:31:23 -0500 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: David Myers Subject: Re: Frippery vs. Bitchery Resent-Message-ID: <"jAhio.A.7Z.2IM20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2850 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 11:44:50 -0800 X-UIDL: 9f82ae343ea2c3f410a270dd930b3921 >You know, at no point in this strangely looping discussion has anyone talked >about the idea that - wonder of wonders! - perhaps RF LIKES what he's doing >right now...! > >I believe we've all been there, hm? But if you're looking for blazingly >fast technique guitar, go listen to one of the fellows from the G3 tour. >Amongst the things I get out of listening to music (and yes! Fripp's work >too), "being impressed" is not high on my list of expectations before the >performance. > >Just listen to it, and if you don't like it, listen to something else. I >just think this bitching about his work is pointless unless someone can come >up with an alternative guitarist/style/etc that one likes Better. Or >perhaps it's your own work you like better, just say so. > >Who ever said it was supposed to be exciting ALL the time anyway? Or did >yez think it was a marketing ploy when Fripp said (back in the early 80s, >pre-KC2) that at times he made an effort to be as boring as humanly >possible? > >I'd have kept my keyboard untouched on this one, if it had not denigrated >into this whiningly annoying bit. It smacks a bit of the Satriani-heads who >were also disappointed in Soundscape works. Oh brother, whatta buncha >consumers THEY are. :) > >Stephen Goodman * It's... The Loop Of The Week! >EarthLight Studios * http://www.earthlight.net/Studios > I sure hope Robert likes what he's doing-most artists do, I assume. But as an artist, he produces product for consumption (don't get him started...) and I for one have put a few bucks in his pocket because I have really loved much of what he has done. If you saw my "desert island" loop list, you'll notice that Bob is mentioned twice. I'm not whining when I criticize some of his efforts- part of the function of art is to set up a dialog, don't you think? Would like to have seen the Guitar Trio. Couple months ago a sprang for a G3 CD, but when I put it on it was some kind of slick pop Mexican mariachi band music. Huh? Even the disc printing was correct. As far as speed guitar, I just pull out my beloved Mahavishnu records.... While I'm here, let me renew my plea for any unwanted copies of David Torn's "What Means Solid, Traveller?" David? Any discs sitting around the house? What a shame about CMP. David Myers _______________________________________________ "Bees are not as busy as we think they are. They just can't buzz any slower." -Kin Hubbard From ???@??? Wed Feb 04 12:14:06 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 4 11:45:46 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0AlP-0002KD-00; Wed, 4 Feb 1998 11:45:39 -0800 Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 14:31:45 -0500 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: David Myers Subject: Re: Process vs. Theory- was, Who's on the forefront of loopmuse Resent-Message-ID: <"MMLqZD.A.Yc.FJM20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2851 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 11:45:39 -0800 X-UIDL: daa158ea5a7f2fd16f59b9f8aa8224ca > Wow David... I'll bet you're in for a roast! > > I saw Fripp waaayyyy back at Madame Wongs on his first Frippertronics > tour (1976 or so?) when he was carting around a couple of Revoxes. > After an incredibly long wait outside, we were the treated to a long > lecture about audience responsibility and his particular rules about > tape recorders and cameras etc. I saw about 1/2 hour of that and left. > > He did more to spoil the magic of hearing his music than any flashbulb > might have. I truly was looking forward to seeing him, and went away > disturbed that the event was so entirely uncomfortable. Not in any > mind-stretching avante-garde way, but just physically and mentally > overbearing. > > In more recent Soundscapes concerts, as impressive as I think they > are, I've often wished he'd just let it rip, if only for a moment or > so. How about responsibility to your audience Robert? I'll meet you > half way. > > Now I've done it. I'll see you in hell David Myers! > -Miko It's a date, Miko. I'll bet the unclean one won't let Robert bring his rack. We'll be forced to listen to him do Q & A 24 hrs. a day.... From ???@??? Thu Feb 05 01:13:09 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 4 12:24:35 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0BMz-0007gw-00; Wed, 4 Feb 1998 12:24:29 -0800 X-Sender: kflint@pop.slip.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <98Feb4.092451est.18818@thicket.arbortext.com> References: <2.2.32.19980203065005.00a2b354@pop.chromatic.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 11:35:33 -0800 To: dwhite@arbortext.com, Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Kim Flint Subject: Re: "global english" / 60 mails/day Resent-Message-ID: <"IhEVqB.A.I_F.SxM20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2856 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 12:24:29 -0800 X-UIDL: 981e363d8d3cb5ac19d4b379cdbd2842 Hey dude, let's not get nasty about it. Matthias speaks english as his fifth or sixth language. He does quite well, considering, as do the many other non-english speakers here. Far, far better than I could manage in ANY of their native languages. His request to keep idiomatic usages of english to a minimum makes sense, because lots of people won't understand you otherwise. I'm sure his request wasn't only directed at you, and I don't see that it was hostile in any way. (quite the contrary, actually.) He just wanted to enjoy the joke with the rest of us and wasn't able to. There's no need to get defensive and make personal jabs over it. kim At 9:21 AM -0500 2/4/98, David White wrote: >While I appreciate Matthias' viewpoint, I must ask for a little slack >regarding >typos. Yes, I consider "where" for "wear" a typo. I know the difference, >but in >a two sentence joke proof reading is not a big concern. > >BTW, Matthias, what is "nuriture?" It is in poor taste to describe the problem >and then fail the test yourself. > >dAve > >Matthias Grob wrote: > >> >I tried starting an Ambient Garth Brooks cover band over a year ago. No one >> >would where the hat. >> >(hat...cover...thinkaboutit) >> >> Isn't it "wear"? Or is that part of a joke I did not grab? >> >> This triggers a concern that circulates in my head for a while: >> >> You know, I like slangs and try to follow and have good laughs sometimes, >> but please consider the difficulty for the few not native americans that >> still take their time to discover the meanings behind the often "smart >> chat" on this list in up to 60 mails/day. >> >> It is sad, but it takes a simple short "global english" to keep the group >> international. Looping definitally is not a typically american thing, even >> though american enterprises were the first to risk an investment (after I >> took the risk to develop the LOOP delay in switzerland :-) >> I do not want to cut the "art" aspect of emailing, but I want all >> interested people from any place of the globe to be able to read all mails, >> to follow and to feel fine to make their contribution in their "non smart" >> style. >> Please cut a thin slice of a solid simple bread that we can hold and that >> contains all the essence of nuriture you want to contribute and then put >> some jam on top if you like to make it more tasty - for those who want it >> and can understand it. >> >> And yes, sometimes it takes rereading and elaborating the mail... many will >> read it, after all, maybe years from now... >> >> Just searching for ways to make a beautifull list shine even more >> Matthias ______________________________________________________________________ Kim Flint | Looper's Delight kflint@annihilist.com | http://www.annihilist.com/loop/loop.html http://www.annihilist.com/ | Loopers-Delight-request@annihilist.com From ???@??? Thu Feb 05 01:13:08 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 4 12:24:00 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0BMN-0007bi-00; Wed, 4 Feb 1998 12:23:51 -0800 X-Sender: kflint@pop.slip.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <1.5.4.32.19980204153010.0066bbcc@tiac.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 11:40:13 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Kim Flint Subject: Re: LD site outage Resent-Message-ID: <"1W4dZD.A.69F.HxM20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2855 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 12:23:51 -0800 X-UIDL: d0ae9ffce06bbd98f7fb31c9e4becaf5 >Is Looper'as Delight down permanently? Its been gone since Sunday. Email to >Kim directly just bounces back. Any word? > > >Reg The retards at my ISP are still sitting on it. I informed them today that I would be suing them if it wasn't up soon, we'll see if that approach works. I doubt it, though. kim ______________________________________________________________________ Kim Flint | Looper's Delight kflint@annihilist.com | http://www.annihilist.com/loop/loop.html http://www.annihilist.com/ | Loopers-Delight-request@annihilist.com From ???@??? Thu Feb 05 02:27:30 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 5 01:15:02 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0NOf-0001S3-00; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 01:15:01 -0800 From: Anthony Bowyer-Lowe To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com MMDF-Warning: Parse error in original version of preceding line at post.mail.demon.net Subject: Re: zoom effects units/vocoding Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 19:53:30 -0000 Message-ID: <01bd31a6$9149b1a0$LocalHost@amudarya> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Resent-Message-ID: <"q1CIcB.A.3_.OJY20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2908 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 01:15:01 -0800 X-UIDL: e7bf0b2c832b12767177096b24d2bbd8 >But no-one has any opinion on the cheap Zoom boxes that offer vocoding >(1201/1204)? I'd need to justify the purchase with the knowledge that >they where all-round useful. Buy as many 1201's as you can afford. For the money, they are brilliant - I have 3 (two in the studio, one on my turntables) and plan to get some more (allowing connection of a few in series, etc). Don't have much time for a full review (illness, bah), but remind me to rave about these boxes again soon. Note that two 1201's are more powerful than one 1204, go for the 1201's. Cheers, ynohtnA. (Oh: Brighton, England). -- Anthony Bowyer-Lowe <= The Essence Of Anthony. http://www.amudarya.demon.co.uk/ (Updated: 01/98) From ???@??? Wed Feb 04 12:14:09 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 4 12:02:50 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0B1v-0004qA-00; Wed, 4 Feb 1998 12:02:43 -0800 X-Sender: cstecker@barr642.berkeley.edu Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 11:54:47 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: cstecker@cogsci.berkeley.edu (Chris Stecker) Subject: Loopers' Delight Pages Resent-Message-ID: <"Pl3V8.A.DzC.7ZM20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2852 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 12:02:43 -0800 X-UIDL: 5f32e0902d8a72f2a5b9ff874fa8b42f Looper's Delight page...that sounds excellent. Who's been hosting it? What is/was on it? Why is it not up now? If anyone else is putting it back up, I'd love to check it out. If it needs a site for hosting, I think ovenguard music would be happy to help out. Our site has a little extra space, good access, and all that. Several of our artists are loopers of one form or another (I really don't want to start up another highbrow/lowbrow thread, so that's all I'll say about the music for now ;-) Anyway, the main site's at http://www.ovenguard.com/music, and if there are past keepers of the page, I'd like to hear from them, either about the page or about hosting a new one. If I don't hear from anybody, who would like to help put a page together? -Chris >When is the Looper's Delight page coming back? > >Reg <<<--->>> Chris Stecker Honcho, Ovenguard Music (http://www.ovenguard.com/music/) cstecker@ovenguard.com From ???@??? Thu Feb 05 01:13:12 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 4 12:32:15 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0BUR-0000y1-00; Wed, 4 Feb 1998 12:32:11 -0800 Message-Id: <2.2.32.19980204201515.00a763e4@pop.chromatic.com> X-Sender: kflint@pop.chromatic.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 2.2 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 04 Feb 1998 12:15:15 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Kim Flint Subject: Re: Loopers' Delight Pages Resent-Message-ID: <"1DpW4B.A.xxG.02M20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2857 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 12:32:11 -0800 X-UIDL: 7c5892c01d6a7affa980779b0717cf87 At 11:54 AM 2/4/98 -0800, Chris Stecker wrote: >Looper's Delight page...that sounds excellent. Who's been hosting it? >What is/was on it? Why is it not up now? If anyone else is putting it >back up, I'd love to check it out. If it needs a site for hosting, I think >ovenguard music would be happy to help out. Our site has a little extra >space, good access, and all that. Several of our artists are loopers of >one form or another (I really don't want to start up another >highbrow/lowbrow thread, so that's all I'll say about the music for now ;-) >Anyway, the main site's at http://www.ovenguard.com/music, and if there >are past keepers of the page, I'd like to hear from them, either about the >page or about hosting a new one. If I don't hear from anybody, who would >like to help put a page together? > jeez, the site's been up for a year and a half, and averaging over 3000 hits a week up until Sunday, when something went funny with the domain name. My domain name has been out for the past four days, which I realize is an eternity on the internet, and I'm trying everything I can to get it back again. But let's try not to make too many assumptions about my demise, alright? If you really need to get to it, you can use my ISP's domain: http://www.slip.net/~kflint/loop/loop.html kim _______________________________________________________ Kim Flint 408-752-9284 Mpact Systems Engineering kflint@chromatic.com Chromatic Research http://www.chromatic.com From ???@??? Thu Feb 05 01:13:11 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 4 12:30:13 1998 Received: from thicket.arbortext.com (arbortext.com) [198.108.59.203] by ferret.slip.net with esmtp (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0BSI-0000UF-00; Wed, 4 Feb 1998 12:29:58 -0800 Received: by thicket.arbortext.com id <18825>; Wed, 4 Feb 1998 15:27:27 -0500 Message-Id: <98Feb4.152727est.18825@thicket.arbortext.com> Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 15:24:28 -0500 From: David White Reply-To: dwhite@arbortext.com Organization: Arbortext Inc. X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (WinNT; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Kim Flint , Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: "global english" / 60 mails/day References: <2.2.32.19980203065005.00a2b354@pop.chromatic.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-UIDL: 66e89dde26b0c7af3c38809f083e4f0b It wasn't my intent to be nasty only to reflect. Thanks for the correction. Dave Kim Flint wrote: > Hey dude, let's not get nasty about it. Matthias speaks english as his > fifth or sixth language. He does quite well, considering, as do the many > other non-english speakers here. Far, far better than I could manage in ANY > of their native languages. His request to keep idiomatic usages of english > to a minimum makes sense, because lots of people won't understand you > otherwise. I'm sure his request wasn't only directed at you, and I don't > see that it was hostile in any way. (quite the contrary, actually.) He just > wanted to enjoy the joke with the rest of us and wasn't able to. There's no > need to get defensive and make personal jabs over it. > > kim > > At 9:21 AM -0500 2/4/98, David White wrote: > >While I appreciate Matthias' viewpoint, I must ask for a little slack > >regarding > >typos. Yes, I consider "where" for "wear" a typo. I know the difference, > >but in > >a two sentence joke proof reading is not a big concern. > > > >BTW, Matthias, what is "nuriture?" It is in poor taste to describe the problem > >and then fail the test yourself. > > > >dAve > > > >Matthias Grob wrote: > > > >> >I tried starting an Ambient Garth Brooks cover band over a year ago. No one > >> >would where the hat. > >> >(hat...cover...thinkaboutit) > >> > >> Isn't it "wear"? Or is that part of a joke I did not grab? > >> > >> This triggers a concern that circulates in my head for a while: > >> > >> You know, I like slangs and try to follow and have good laughs sometimes, > >> but please consider the difficulty for the few not native americans that > >> still take their time to discover the meanings behind the often "smart > >> chat" on this list in up to 60 mails/day. > >> > >> It is sad, but it takes a simple short "global english" to keep the group > >> international. Looping definitally is not a typically american thing, even > >> though american enterprises were the first to risk an investment (after I > >> took the risk to develop the LOOP delay in switzerland :-) > >> I do not want to cut the "art" aspect of emailing, but I want all > >> interested people from any place of the globe to be able to read all mails, > >> to follow and to feel fine to make their contribution in their "non smart" > >> style. > >> Please cut a thin slice of a solid simple bread that we can hold and that > >> contains all the essence of nuriture you want to contribute and then put > >> some jam on top if you like to make it more tasty - for those who want it > >> and can understand it. > >> > >> And yes, sometimes it takes rereading and elaborating the mail... many will > >> read it, after all, maybe years from now... > >> > >> Just searching for ways to make a beautifull list shine even more > >> Matthias > > ______________________________________________________________________ > Kim Flint | Looper's Delight > kflint@annihilist.com | http://www.annihilist.com/loop/loop.html > http://www.annihilist.com/ | Loopers-Delight-request@annihilist.com From ???@??? Thu Feb 05 01:13:19 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 4 12:40:06 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0Bc1-000263-00; Wed, 4 Feb 1998 12:40:01 -0800 Message-Id: <98Feb4.152727est.18825@thicket.arbortext.com> Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 15:24:28 -0500 From: David White Reply-To: dwhite@arbortext.com Organization: Arbortext Inc. X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (WinNT; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Kim Flint , Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: "global english" / 60 mails/day References: <2.2.32.19980203065005.00a2b354@pop.chromatic.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"wXIfzB.A.ho.T_M20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2858 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 12:40:01 -0800 X-UIDL: c65985ccb462c6baed8a2fcb138a8e40 It wasn't my intent to be nasty only to reflect. Thanks for the correction. Dave Kim Flint wrote: > Hey dude, let's not get nasty about it. Matthias speaks english as his > fifth or sixth language. He does quite well, considering, as do the many > other non-english speakers here. Far, far better than I could manage in ANY > of their native languages. His request to keep idiomatic usages of english > to a minimum makes sense, because lots of people won't understand you > otherwise. I'm sure his request wasn't only directed at you, and I don't > see that it was hostile in any way. (quite the contrary, actually.) He just > wanted to enjoy the joke with the rest of us and wasn't able to. There's no > need to get defensive and make personal jabs over it. > > kim > > At 9:21 AM -0500 2/4/98, David White wrote: > >While I appreciate Matthias' viewpoint, I must ask for a little slack > >regarding > >typos. Yes, I consider "where" for "wear" a typo. I know the difference, > >but in > >a two sentence joke proof reading is not a big concern. > > > >BTW, Matthias, what is "nuriture?" It is in poor taste to describe the problem > >and then fail the test yourself. > > > >dAve > > > >Matthias Grob wrote: > > > >> >I tried starting an Ambient Garth Brooks cover band over a year ago. No one > >> >would where the hat. > >> >(hat...cover...thinkaboutit) > >> > >> Isn't it "wear"? Or is that part of a joke I did not grab? > >> > >> This triggers a concern that circulates in my head for a while: > >> > >> You know, I like slangs and try to follow and have good laughs sometimes, > >> but please consider the difficulty for the few not native americans that > >> still take their time to discover the meanings behind the often "smart > >> chat" on this list in up to 60 mails/day. > >> > >> It is sad, but it takes a simple short "global english" to keep the group > >> international. Looping definitally is not a typically american thing, even > >> though american enterprises were the first to risk an investment (after I > >> took the risk to develop the LOOP delay in switzerland :-) > >> I do not want to cut the "art" aspect of emailing, but I want all > >> interested people from any place of the globe to be able to read all mails, > >> to follow and to feel fine to make their contribution in their "non smart" > >> style. > >> Please cut a thin slice of a solid simple bread that we can hold and that > >> contains all the essence of nuriture you want to contribute and then put > >> some jam on top if you like to make it more tasty - for those who want it > >> and can understand it. > >> > >> And yes, sometimes it takes rereading and elaborating the mail... many will > >> read it, after all, maybe years from now... > >> > >> Just searching for ways to make a beautifull list shine even more > >> Matthias > > ______________________________________________________________________ > Kim Flint | Looper's Delight > kflint@annihilist.com | http://www.annihilist.com/loop/loop.html > http://www.annihilist.com/ | Loopers-Delight-request@annihilist.com From ???@??? Wed Feb 04 12:14:11 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 4 12:04:09 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0B3E-00051g-00; Wed, 4 Feb 1998 12:04:04 -0800 X-Sender: matthias@pop3.bahianet.com.br Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <199802031635.IAA28224@scv4.apple.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 17:57:32 -0300 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: matthias@bahianet.com.br (Matthias Grob) Subject: Re: RE: RE:Fernandes guy at NAMM Resent-Message-ID: <"DmnvbD.A.CDD.obM20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2854 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 12:04:04 -0800 X-UIDL: 0c777a169f3560b663edf72539049f4f >>What I was talking about is that "guitar string waveform" is usually not an >>option on yer regular waveform selector knob. Now if I actually possessed an >>analog synth, or was possessed by one, it would probably occur to me shortly >>after the possibilities for triangles became a bit barren that using a >>"guitar string waveform" in place of the oscillator section might be pretty >>damn cool. Lots of nifty harmonics in those strings. And if I did do that, >>it would next occur to me that using a sustaining device on the guitar >>string to take away the remarkably predictable guitar string envelope would >>be darned handy, allowing me to replace it with the good ol' ADSR. Add some >>LFO's, some filters, and some weird effects, loop it up, and as the kids >>say, it would be wikked..... Travis proposed: >I use to fantasize about a piano-type instrument which would use >guitar/bass strings, and which had a an E-bow type device on each string, >the intensity of which could be controlled by aftertouch pressure, or >preset. All the typical guitar processing could be applied, the output >split in several different ways, etc, etc. In my ideas drawer, there is a design of a piano with activation magnet on each bass string which could either be used to give the bass notes a long sustain or an infinite sustain (E-bow like) or they could be activated only by the magnet, controlled by a organ like bass pedal, so the notes would come in without attack. The next step then could be to include magnets that activate the hammers, so the whole bass line could be played on the pedal or even sequenced. And this would basically be an accoustic instrument, a piano with enhanced bass playing options. I hope I can build one when I am retired or so :-) Matthias From ???@??? Wed Feb 04 12:14:10 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 4 12:03:49 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0B2v-0004ym-00; Wed, 4 Feb 1998 12:03:45 -0800 X-Sender: matthias@pop3.bahianet.com.br Message-Id: In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 17:57:32 -0300 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: matthias@bahianet.com.br (Matthias Grob) Subject: Re: Who's on the forefront of loopmuse? Resent-Message-ID: <"j6lQNB.A.mCD.mbM20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2853 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 12:03:45 -0800 X-UIDL: 64609b9ac38c854cdda382b765c682c3 >I'll try this again, just to see if this gets picked up. > >*So, just for giggles, what / who is on the forefront of "looping-based >music"?* >I know this is somewhat an impossible question, but, maybe it's worth >bashing around for a while. > >David Kirkdorffer If you are looking for a virtuosity competition, we could simply count the foot operations / second and maybe give a bonus if difficult and combined functions are used. :-) If we consider any music with a repeated drum beat, we do not get anywhere. If its about music as we develop it on this list, I hope the CD projects will help us to feel where the various styles are going and discuss our favourites. I am really curious to hear all that! How is it, Mat? Ray? Matthias From ???@??? Thu Feb 05 01:13:26 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 4 13:36:56 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0CUy-00019x-00; Wed, 4 Feb 1998 13:36:48 -0800 Message-Id: <199802042112.NAA04419@gw1.bi-tech.com> From: "Matt McCabe" To: "Loop List" Subject: converters Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 13:24:35 -0800 X-Msmail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1161 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"cRJtF.A.VC.T2N20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2862 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 13:36:48 -0800 X-UIDL: 672c2b543be9ed2c2d7f28465080c19f I'm looking for an ADAT Light Pipe to S/PDIF converter. Do they exist? Thanks....now back to the loops! Matt From ???@??? Thu Feb 05 01:14:30 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 4 15:46:20 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0EWG-0001MN-00; Wed, 4 Feb 1998 15:46:16 -0800 From: Edward_Chang@mail.amsinc.com Date: Wed, 04 Feb 98 16:41:00 est Encoding: 22 Text Message-Id: <9801048866.AA886646463@mail.amsinc.com> To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: sampling rights Resent-Message-ID: <"vsc7cC.A.ax.TzP20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2870 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 15:46:16 -0800 X-UIDL: 4f3217ae41fab3e34694d7e364034aea Warning - this post may not be quite loop specific, but I thought I'd give it a shot.... I'm currently putting together some material for a CD (self-financed, of course - what kinda nut would wanna...) and some of it uses tape loop samples of pre-existing material (as well as turntables) like George Winston, Bing Crosby, The Story of Little Red Riding Hood... Those of you who have seen my live performances know what I'm talking about. It's pretty fast and fleeting, more of a "transient noise" than a theme for a piece and I would think I shouldn't have to pay royalties or anything, but... Does anyone know what Christian Marclay/John Oswald/Otomo Yoshihide/(hell John Cage for that matter) does. Oswald samples probably around 200 songs on his Plunderphonics record and I'm wondering if he might've done anything more than just putting it out. I did talk to one CD guy and he said as long as your work doesn't eat into the market of the person you are sampling, they probably won't sue you. Sounds reasonable. Any idea loop-mates? ed From ???@??? Thu Feb 05 01:13:29 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 4 13:50:29 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0CiA-00039q-00; Wed, 4 Feb 1998 13:50:26 -0800 From: Paolo Valladolid Message-Id: <199802042143.NAA27855@waynesworld.ucsd.edu> Subject: Re: RE: RE:Fernandes guy at NAMM To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 13:43:27 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: <199802031635.IAA28224@scv4.apple.com> from "T.W. Hartnett" at Feb 3, 98 10:36:08 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"oRk7zB.A.0BC.GEO20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2864 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 13:50:26 -0800 X-UIDL: 00ac7171fba4324087100c325d8d3593 > I use to fantasize about a piano-type instrument which would use > guitar/bass strings, and which had a an E-bow type device on each string, > the intensity of which could be controlled by aftertouch pressure, or > preset. All the typical guitar processing could be applied, the output > split in several different ways, etc, etc. > > Travis This almost sounds like Art Durkee's IFSS-equipped Stick. IFSS is the Infinite Feedback Sustain System developed by Art and Al Jewer for the Stick. One major component is a contact driver attached to the back of the Stick. There used to be a FAQ on the IFSS on the Laughing Cat Records page but it's gone for some reason. But Art can still be contacted at Stickdragn@aol.com Cheers, Paolo Valladolid --------------------------------------------------------------- |Moderator of Digital Guitar Digest, an Internet mailing list |\ |for Music Technology and Stringed Instruments | \ ---------------------------------------------------------------- | \ finger pvallado@waynesworld.ucsd.edu for more info \ | \ http://waynesworld.ucsd.edu/DigitalGuitar/home.html \| ----------------------------------------------------------------- From ???@??? Thu Feb 05 01:13:30 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 4 13:59:00 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0CqN-0004Mm-00; Wed, 4 Feb 1998 13:58:55 -0800 From: Paolo Valladolid Message-Id: <199802042148.NAA27917@waynesworld.ucsd.edu> Subject: Re: RE: RE:Fernandes guy at NAMM To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 13:48:39 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: from "Matthias Grob" at Feb 4, 98 05:57:32 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"iAnXGB.A.3wC.JJO20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2865 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 13:58:55 -0800 X-UIDL: 14508fefdd315e3a046a9bc539fad2e1 > >>What I was talking about is that "guitar string waveform" is usually not an > >>option on yer regular waveform selector knob. Now if I actually possessed an > >>analog synth, or was possessed by one, it would probably occur to me shortly > >>after the possibilities for triangles became a bit barren that using a > >>"guitar string waveform" in place of the oscillator section might be pretty > >>damn cool. Lots of nifty harmonics in those strings. And if I did do that, > >>it would next occur to me that using a sustaining device on the guitar > >>string to take away the remarkably predictable guitar string envelope would > >>be darned handy, allowing me to replace it with the good ol' ADSR. Add some > >>LFO's, some filters, and some weird effects, loop it up, and as the kids > >>say, it would be wikked..... This reminds me to ask... Has anyone here tried feeding their guitar/Stick/ bass/whatever into the analog input of a Waldorf Pulse Plus or one of the other analog synths that have analog inputs? I recall Robert (oh no!) Fripp used to feed his Les Paul signal into a Synthi for his Frippertronics sound. Pete Cosey did that too with Miles Davis. I think side one of Pangaea has an extended guitar solo processed through a Synthi. In a late 80s interview with Cosey, he said that the Synthi ended up sitting in his basement (or garage?) for his kids to play with and make Darth Vader voices. Cheers, Paolo Valladolid --------------------------------------------------------------- |Moderator of Digital Guitar Digest, an Internet mailing list |\ |for Music Technology and Stringed Instruments | \ ---------------------------------------------------------------- | \ finger pvallado@waynesworld.ucsd.edu for more info \ | \ http://waynesworld.ucsd.edu/DigitalGuitar/home.html \| ----------------------------------------------------------------- From ???@??? Thu Feb 05 01:13:31 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 4 14:08:47 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0Czr-0005lV-00; Wed, 4 Feb 1998 14:08:43 -0800 From: Paolo Valladolid Message-Id: <199802042159.NAA28103@waynesworld.ucsd.edu> Subject: Re: Who's on the forefront of loopmuse? To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 13:59:35 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: <2.2.32.19980204010422.009a0848@pop.chromatic.com> from "Kim Flint" at Feb 3, 98 05:04:22 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"dSNxw.A.lQE.jTO20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2866 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 14:08:43 -0800 X-UIDL: 4023eaf691e9644a216cea1631553b2e > I have actually, a little. There are some lurking around, although more > would be good and introduce some fresh perspectives. Although, after > mentioning it on a dnb producer's list, one fellow checked it out and came > back saying it was interesting, but "seemed like just a bunch of > fripp-heads." (read that as, "only dinosaurs there") After the past couple > of days, it's hard to disagree! > > kim I have to give you guys major props for turning me on to Photek, The Orb, DJ Krush, etc. etc... guys who are hardly guitar oriented. It was refreshing for me to discover a whole new universe of music that I ignorantly put down as the product of "musically-ignorant lazy button-pushers and robbers of 'real' music". Cheers, Paolo "recovering-Fripp-head" Valladolid --------------------------------------------------------------- |Moderator of Digital Guitar Digest, an Internet mailing list |\ |for Music Technology and Stringed Instruments | \ ---------------------------------------------------------------- | \ finger pvallado@waynesworld.ucsd.edu for more info \ | \ http://waynesworld.ucsd.edu/DigitalGuitar/home.html \| ----------------------------------------------------------------- From ???@??? Thu Feb 05 01:13:35 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 4 14:18:10 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0D8v-00070M-00; Wed, 4 Feb 1998 14:18:05 -0800 From: MIvanBerk@aol.com Message-ID: <2e7620ed.34d8e69e@aol.com> Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 17:07:23 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Fernandes guy at NAMM Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 57 Resent-Message-ID: <"i1oyHB.A.cDG.ogO20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2867 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 14:18:05 -0800 X-UIDL: 1b8153211bd59e13ed1da28918f872bf In a message dated 98-02-04 16:56:05 EST, Paolo Valladolid wrote: << This reminds me to ask... Has anyone here tried feeding their guitar/Stick/ bass/whatever into the analog input of a Waldorf Pulse Plus or one of the other analog synths that have analog inputs? I recall Robert (oh no!) Fripp used to feed his Les Paul signal into a Synthi for his Frippertronics sound. Pete Cosey did that too with Miles Davis. I think side one of Pangaea has an extended guitar solo processed through a Synthi. >> I consistently run my guitar through an analog filterbank. I started out with autowahs, attempting to confuse them via a volume pedal placed beforehand in the signal chain; I've since moved on to an MAM Resonator filterbank, and currently use a Lovetone Meatball filterbank/envelope follower, which is the best I've found for severely altering the guitar envelope while allowing "guitaristic" control (by picking pressure) of the resultant sound. The MAM performs better (or at least it becomes more entertaining) placed after my Echoplex, for coloring loops. Basically, filters (and synths that allow external audio input to their VCF sections) can really get the guitar into some seriously appealing--or unpleasant, depending on your personal taste--analog-synthetic territory. -michael berk From ???@??? Thu Feb 05 01:13:39 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 4 14:33:11 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0DNW-00013D-00; Wed, 4 Feb 1998 14:33:10 -0800 Message-Id: <98Feb4.162750cst.26888@gateway.gibson.com> X-Sender: tspauldi@mail.nash.gibson.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 16:30:21 -0600 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Tom Spaulding Subject: Filter Kings In-Reply-To: <2e7620ed.34d8e69e@aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"pEmcuC.A.Se.puO20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2868 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 14:33:10 -0800 X-UIDL: da6f21a7911703a44dfc5d53386af406 Loopolites- The recent mention of filters prompts a shameless plug for the affordable Oberheim/Viscount GM400 and big-buck GM1000 processors. Each has a Comb Filter, a Ring Modulator and Rotary Speaker modes in addition to the usual guitar-friendly effects.I have not had enough time to really check them out but the Viscount demonstrator did some cool loops with them and the Echoplex at NAMM... Tom "Who's this Fripp then?" Spaulding From ???@??? Thu Feb 05 01:13:42 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 4 14:40:38 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0DUf-00022i-00; Wed, 4 Feb 1998 14:40:33 -0800 From: Marzzz@aol.com Message-ID: <150575f4.34d8ecd2@aol.com> Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 17:33:52 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: RE: Frippery vs. Bitchery Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 82 Resent-Message-ID: <"5Si5LD.A.CJB.vzO20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2869 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 14:40:33 -0800 X-UIDL: 14c0ae9abc32daaec9009563777eb913 In a message dated 2/4/98 12:39:41 PM, Brian wrote: >Personally, I imagine that if I had bothered to stand in the hour-long >queue at the recent Night Watch launch, and had a chat with him, I probably >wouldn't like him as a person. And why would I want his written autograph, >when I have his musical autograph on the CD in my hand? How about a photograph?? LOL, Marshall From ???@??? Thu Feb 05 01:14:32 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 4 15:57:27 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0Egz-0002uJ-00; Wed, 4 Feb 1998 15:57:21 -0800 From: "Randy Jones" To: Subject: Re: Arcane Device Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 17:43:40 -0600 Message-ID: <01bd31c6$b8de3d60$733163d1@user.texas.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Resent-Message-ID: <"jharpC.A.mOB.12P20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2871 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 15:57:21 -0800 X-UIDL: 952dbebcdc182d7de3d4c8b9f696d17f Hi All, Buy Looper First! Found a couple of locations for David Myers CDs 8 Arcane Device - Diabolis Ex Machina(CD) http://www.staalplaat.com/st-a.htm Didn't see any others at Staaplaat, but some very interesting looking items here. You can convert Dutch Guilders and other currency here: http://www.cookiesfromeden.com/convert.html Both " Also Sprach·and Envoi" located here: http://home.t-online.de/home/Art.Konkret/mailca.htm Left email for visa order, will see. They are are in some nonamerican land, I think they speak Globlish though. Randy Jones David Myers wrote (edited)> >My favorite CD was a little different. "Also Sprach Zarathustra" (may >still be available on Staalplaat Records) was done with a Lexicon LXP-5, an >MRC, and one pot. Same thing, the LXP-5 fed itself, but the MRC was used >extensively to crank the parameters. Given the setup, the variety of >sounds and structures is pretty amazing, even if I do say so myself. >(Admittedly, a pretty bombastic title, but besides being a longtime fan of >the book, I guess I thought "stickin in to" the classical establishment >wouldn't hurt, either.) > >The last solo CD I did (had two collaborative releases with German composer >Asmus Tietchens) technically puzzles even me. On "Envoi in Cumin" I again >used the 4X Time Machine setup. Each delay was set for approx. 1 second. >But the routing was so strange (wish I could recount it exactly) that what >came out was a kind of "see-saw" base sound--yeah, a loop--which varied in >period somehow. I called it a "soft loop", and it subtly changed in sound >as the loop time wandered between 7 and 15 seconds! In part, this was due >to these delays having LFO modulation available, which in this case I >applied sparingly--a good selling point (along with all those other knobs) >for the Digitechs. > From ???@??? Thu Feb 05 01:14:34 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 4 15:59:07 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0EiT-000376-00; Wed, 4 Feb 1998 15:58:53 -0800 From: "Randy Jones" To: Subject: Re: CDR870- test results, and future uses Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 17:45:37 -0600 Message-ID: <01bd31c6$fe6724a0$733163d1@user.texas.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Resent-Message-ID: <"mUacbC.A.CiB.64P20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2873 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 15:58:53 -0800 X-UIDL: c4659ba74dbd23c7f79188ab83d90cdd Hello James How do we purchase a copy of the MirStick? C'mon don't be modest! Buy Looper First! Randy Jones -----Original Message----- From: james rhodes To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Date: Wednesday, February 04, 1998 11:17 AM Subject: CDR870- test results, and future uses > hi, >i have had some time to play with the Philips CD recorder,,,and i must say >i'm very impressed,,,most of my compositions i burn live to disk,,,from my >Mackie 1202vlz... the results have been a low noise to signal ratio, that >marvels me,,,fade outs are really quite(no hiss),,,all in all i feel that >the CDR870 is a great unit for the independant musician,,,and its VERY easy >to operate,,, > >i have already completed one disc of instrumental music for meditation, or >reflection,,,or whatever. using synths,,,and chapman stick,,,and live radio >communications from Mir (course i dont speak russian,,,but it sounded cool >over the music) > >im currently working on a more hip hop, acid jazz disc,,,( even the purist >looper needs other musical outlets) > >ive been contacted by a couple of local bands, that want me to pay me to >record their gigs,,,as well,,,why not i doth say? > >if anyone needs a source for this unit try J&R Music in NY 1-888-221-8180 > >my .02 >james > > From ???@??? Thu Feb 05 01:14:33 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 4 15:57:48 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0EhJ-0002ww-00; Wed, 4 Feb 1998 15:57:41 -0800 Message-ID: <000801bd31c7$11b88440$70da6f83@pt205.wolfson.cam.ac.uk> From: "Peter Thompson" To: Subject: Re: Retro Looping (was Re: Simm sound) Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 23:46:09 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Resent-Message-ID: <"E7hk_B.A.qRB.H3P20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2872 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 15:57:41 -0800 X-UIDL: 113b128665be4e416d1f07bbe46683ed A rock??? Luxury....... -----Original Message----- From: tbajus To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Date: 04 February 1998 21:08 Subject: Re: Retro Looping (was Re: Simm sound) >I use a rock. > >That's all. > > From ???@??? Thu Feb 05 01:14:38 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 4 16:12:04 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0Ev3-0004rW-00; Wed, 4 Feb 1998 16:11:53 -0800 Message-Id: <3.0.3.32.19980204185753.006a808c@mail.interagp.com> X-Sender: cdeupree@mail.interagp.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.3 (32) Date: Wed, 04 Feb 1998 18:57:53 -0500 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: cdeupree@interagp.com (Caleb Deupree) Subject: Re: sampling rights In-Reply-To: <9801048866.AA886646463@mail.amsinc.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"0pAa0C.A.J8D.eKQ20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2874 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 16:11:53 -0800 X-UIDL: f0f4f7854cdf0ea94e677fda971615f5 At 04:41 PM 2/4/98 est, Edward_Chang@mail.amsinc.com wrote: > Oswald samples probably > around 200 songs on his Plunderphonics record and I'm wondering if he > might've done anything more than just putting it out. Since you picked a particularly outrageous example, Oswald was not just sued, he was forced to destroy both all remaining copies of his first CD *and* the master tapes. The only reason they didn't try to round up all the ones that had already gone out was because some rich (i.e., with deep pockets) or otherwise influential library absolutely refused to give up their copy. Now he also had outrageous cover art, which probably had more direct effects... See http://www.interlog.com/~vacuvox for additional info on Oswald. -- Caleb Deupree cdeupree@interagp.com cdeupree@erinet.com Computers are useless; they can only give you answers -- Pablo Picasso From ???@??? Thu Feb 05 01:14:41 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 4 16:20:22 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0F3E-0005zp-00; Wed, 4 Feb 1998 16:20:20 -0800 X-Sender: doug@mail.lightlink.com Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <9801048866.AA886646463@mail.amsinc.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 16:20:28 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Doug Wyatt Subject: Re: sampling rights Resent-Message-ID: <"79Bk4D.A.UAF.aSQ20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2875 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 16:20:20 -0800 X-UIDL: 931656bc0c3e13556a36853783288bac At 4:41 PM -0500 2/4/98, Edward_Chang@mail.amsinc.com wrote: > I'm currently putting together some material for a CD (self-financed, of > course - what kinda nut would wanna...) and some of it uses tape loop > samples of pre-existing material (as well as turntables) like George > Winston, Bing Crosby, The Story of Little Red Riding Hood... Those of > you who have seen my live performances know what I'm talking about. It's > pretty fast and fleeting, more of a "transient noise" than a theme for a > piece and I would think I shouldn't have to pay royalties or anything, > but... Does anyone know what Christian Marclay/John Oswald/Otomo > Yoshihide/(hell John Cage for that matter) does. Oswald samples probably > around 200 songs on his Plunderphonics record and I'm wondering if he > might've done anything more than just putting it out. > > I did talk to one CD guy and he said as long as your work doesn't eat > into the market of the person you are sampling, they probably won't sue > you. Sounds reasonable. Any idea loop-mates? I'm in the same position. I've sampled some snippets from commercial sources and now I'm faced with signing a document asserting to the CD manufacturer that I haven't violated anyone's copyrights. >From what little I've read, it boils down to how recognizable your samples are. If, by having taken such a small sample (less than half a second or a second), or by having transmogrified it so extensively, that the sample is not recognizable as having been derived from the original, I wouldn't worry about it. On the other hand, if it is blatantly obvious to anyone who hears your music that you lifted a sample from someplace in particular, it would seem advisable to get the permission of the recording's copyright owner. And if your sample is large enough, you might have to pay a mechanical license fee to the composition's owner. I have several blatant samples for which I was fortunate enough to get permission because the owners are nice individuals and not large corporations. And I have a few much less blatant samples which are owned by large corporations, but are unlikely to be recognizable. With these I'll take my chances (and not tempt fate by crediting them!). This might not be too directly relevant to your situation or it might be. $0.02. Doug --- Doug Wyatt Sonosphere - music and music software doug@sonosphere.com http://www.sonosphere.com/ From ???@??? Thu Feb 05 01:14:45 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 4 16:52:48 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0FYV-0001rp-00; Wed, 4 Feb 1998 16:52:39 -0800 Message-Id: <1.5.4.32.19980205004600.0067788c@tiac.net> X-Sender: rphunt@tiac.net X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 04 Feb 1998 19:46:00 -0500 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Reginald Hunt Subject: Re: LD site outage Resent-Message-ID: <"kJD0kC.A.vBB.HwQ20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2876 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 16:52:39 -0800 X-UIDL: af3e89097f80b18a99965b2f0fda56d7 Thanks man. Good Luck. Thanls for the other URL. Reg At 11:40 AM 2/4/98 -0800, you wrote: >>Is Looper'as Delight down permanently? Its been gone since Sunday. Email to >>Kim directly just bounces back. Any word? >> >> >>Reg > >The retards at my ISP are still sitting on it. I informed them today that I >would be suing them if it wasn't up soon, we'll see if that approach works. >I doubt it, though. > >kim > >______________________________________________________________________ >Kim Flint | Looper's Delight >kflint@annihilist.com | http://www.annihilist.com/loop/loop.html >http://www.annihilist.com/ | Loopers-Delight-request@annihilist.com > > > > > From ???@??? Thu Feb 05 01:14:46 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 4 16:59:45 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0FfI-0002qk-00; Wed, 4 Feb 1998 16:59:40 -0800 Message-Id: <1.5.4.32.19980205005024.00674d88@tiac.net> X-Sender: rphunt@tiac.net X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 04 Feb 1998 19:50:24 -0500 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Reginald Hunt Subject: RE: loops, ambient or otherwise Resent-Message-ID: <"RwRMlD.A.5mB.V0Q20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2877 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 16:59:40 -0800 X-UIDL: f3dab6bc35c085ddcd238b99449a383f Actually, for the email that you respnded to, I edited out quite a lot. I do try to be considerate. And brief. Though, if something does have to be lengthy, I try to break things up with enough "white space" to make it easier to read. Reg > >1/ Then kindly delete those portions to which your comments are not >addressed. One problem with this list, and the reason digest subscribers >sometimes get several copies in a day, is that people don't EDIT!! If I'd >wanted that I'd have gone for the other version. A handy feature of these >modern computers is that unwanted text can be DELETED, thereby saving not >only that nebulous entity known as BANDWIDTH, but also the need to scroll >through seemingly endless lines of dross. Since Kim is kind enough to >keep this list unmoderated (of which, having as I do an anarchist bent, I >heartily approve) then it is up to us to keep it readable. I prefer my >looping in the audio domain; in text it becomes more redundant than the >base track for "Healthy Colours." > >2/ Then Peter Ensign commented: > >i dont want this shit > >Fine. Then don't read it! Especially, DON'T SEND IT BACK TO US!! TWICE!!! > > > >With regard to the aforementioned Mr. Fripp, I was at the "Space Music" >performance here in Toronto, and found it to be a highly entertaining >evening in many respects. When the sounds became less interesting, I >merely tuned them out and continued to converse with friends, many of >whom I hadn't seen for a long time, with one ear open to catch any >interesting changes. This, as I understand, was part of Robert's >expectation of me as an audient, and I was glad to oblige. It then took >on some aspects of certain John Cage events such as HPSCHD, where one is >free to wander about the "space" and experience the sounds from different >viewpoints. > >I hope this helps prod the thread back to relevance. > >Jim Bailey > > > > From ???@??? Thu Feb 05 01:14:53 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 4 17:12:43 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0Fro-0004XI-00; Wed, 4 Feb 1998 17:12:36 -0800 Message-Id: <2.2.32.19980205010303.00b965ac@pop.chromatic.com> X-Sender: kflint@pop.chromatic.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 2.2 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 04 Feb 1998 17:03:03 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Kim Flint Subject: Re: LD site outage Resent-Message-ID: <"X1IfEB.A._JD.3_Q20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2878 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 17:12:37 -0800 X-UIDL: 5715b6c270ef43bb7e60ce02d5bbd170 Ok, the Looper's Delight web site seems to be back on line now! surf for your loop fix here: http://www.annihilist.com/loop/loop.html I guess my ISP got tired of just knocking the mailing list out for a week, and decided to go for the web site this time. Can't wait to see what goes wrong next.... my patience is more or less exhausted with these problems, if anyone has a recommendation for good SF bay area ISP's that can provide reasonably sophisticated, fast web serving, mailing lists, fast mail servers, capable, responsive tech support, ISDN access, multi-user business accounts, etc., (ie not personal type $20 accounts, I need much more than that.) please email me at home: kflint@annihilist.com. kim ________________________________________________________ Kim Flint 408-752-9284 Mpact System Engineering kflint@chromatic.com Chromatic Research http://www.chromatic.com From ???@??? Thu Feb 05 01:14:55 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 4 17:17:27 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0FwR-0005Aq-00; Wed, 4 Feb 1998 17:17:23 -0800 Message-ID: <34D910D6.5362E150@bellsouth.net> Date: Wed, 04 Feb 1998 20:07:34 -0500 From: Jeff Duke Reply-To: jmar@bellsouth.net Organization: Tec Bab Labs X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: LD site outage References: <1.5.4.32.19980205004600.0067788c@tiac.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"MwPWCB.A.hdD.HCR20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2879 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 17:17:23 -0800 X-UIDL: 8fc032153af0a256fd86185c8e4542d3 Reginald Hunt wrote: > Thanks man. Good Luck. Thanls for the other URL. > > Reg > Its back up for me! Jeff From ???@??? Thu Feb 05 01:15:00 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 4 17:23:40 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0G2P-0005zY-00; Wed, 4 Feb 1998 17:23:33 -0800 From: Paolo Valladolid Message-Id: <199802050112.RAA29875@waynesworld.ucsd.edu> Subject: Liquid Audio To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 17:12:24 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: from "Doug Wyatt" at Feb 4, 98 04:20:28 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"ClLJRB.A.SRE.KIR20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2881 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 17:23:33 -0800 X-UIDL: 969da52072f4b95bc3478680c76198b2 A recent article in the fishwr- I mean, newspaper mentioned software called Liquid Audio (URL is http://ww.liquidaudio.com). Here's an excerpt: "Liquid Audio, available for Windows and the Mac, is being used by several musicians to sell music via direct downloads for as little as 99 cents per song." Judging by the great interest in the CD project, I just thought I'd pass this along as yet another possible avenue for us to share our music with the world for fun and profit. :) Cheers, Paolo Valladolid --------------------------------------------------------------- |Moderator of Digital Guitar Digest, an Internet mailing list |\ |for Music Technology and Stringed Instruments | \ ---------------------------------------------------------------- | \ finger pvallado@waynesworld.ucsd.edu for more info \ | \ http://waynesworld.ucsd.edu/DigitalGuitar/home.html \| ----------------------------------------------------------------- From ???@??? Thu Feb 05 01:15:02 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 4 17:38:17 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0GGc-0000CW-00; Wed, 4 Feb 1998 17:38:14 -0800 From: Fmplautus@aol.com Message-ID: <7873b55c.34d9149e@aol.com> Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 20:23:27 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Re: LD site outage Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 78 Resent-Message-ID: <"ZrQGjD.A.4ZG.FYR20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2883 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 17:38:14 -0800 X-UIDL: a599c734482bcc4bc9f4fa3fdf0e2a5a Hey Kim, make a deal with America Online for your page. From ???@??? Thu Feb 05 01:15:01 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 4 17:32:17 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0GAm-0007Aq-00; Wed, 4 Feb 1998 17:32:12 -0800 From: Fmplautus@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 20:24:26 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: RE: Arcane Device Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 78 Resent-Message-ID: <"6IG35C.A.7vF.VTR20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2882 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 17:32:12 -0800 X-UIDL: ef3835aef86267a33d2bac68b3821082 The Jamman has several, beautiful, sensual knobs. Best, The LoOpDoctOrs From ???@??? Thu Feb 05 01:15:12 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 4 18:39:35 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0HDq-0006YG-00; Wed, 4 Feb 1998 18:39:26 -0800 Message-Id: <199802050231.VAA01173@shell.monmouth.com> Reply-To: From: "andre" To: Subject: northeast tour??? LOOP shows... Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 21:31:25 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1162 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"-hcjvC.A.QRF.RSS20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2885 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 18:39:26 -0800 X-UIDL: 01968e4f2c6f93786a9db0785c9249cb hello. re:april/may tour i may be able to help - i've been thinking of doing a 'weird looping' night with my duo JFK's LSD UFO at one of 2 cool clubs in the asbury park/longbranch NJ area. If we swing it - we can get a few groups on the bill and get some interest going! Email me with any dates you've got in mind....(Bon, are you listening??? Lets do another nite at the saint !!) ps - any zappa fans out there?? - my zappa tribute band's site is up - http://www.jswd.net/projectobject - we're about to embark on a mini tour of upstate NY with Ike Willis, who played/sang with zappa from 1978-88. Incidentally, anyone out there ever check out frank's use of loops , starting in 1984 ??? they became an integral part of his soloing palette.. andre@monmouth.com ---------- > From: ENAT21213@aol.com > To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com > Subject: Location/MABEY YOU CAN HELP US?. > Date: Monday, February 02, 1998 6:25 PM > > Hello everyone, > I loop in Myrtle Beach,South Carolina. > I perform with electric bird noise which is basically my solo gig but once in > a while ebn does perform as a duo.We are looking into doing a tour of the > northeast around April/May.I noticed there are quite a few of you on this list > that reside in the northeast region.We are seeking information on > clubs,coffehouses,anywere that may be loop friendly.Basically we'll play for > gas money(a place to crash would also be nice).We have a promo pack/demo we > could send you/clubs/etc. > We play often (mostly clubs)and have a pretty good following here in our neck > of the woods(the southeast).Any loopers interested in playing the > southeast?Contact us we can help. > Any information or help from you guys would be greatly appeciated. > thanks, > Brian McKenzie > ENAT21213@aol.com > From ???@??? Thu Feb 05 01:15:13 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 4 18:44:18 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0HIL-00079A-00; Wed, 4 Feb 1998 18:44:05 -0800 Message-Id: <199802050233.VAA02062@shell.monmouth.com> Reply-To: From: "andre" To: Subject: Re: mackie? vs. soundcraft... Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 21:33:24 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1162 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"Yk3O5D.A.kfF.KUS20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2886 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 18:44:05 -0800 X-UIDL: 6f1fc8126b710c2bf7d4fc636ac6901c > Next time you buy your groovy running shoes, check it out. Even worse > from my perspective (being a dad) is that it is extremely hard to get > kids' toys or clothes that aren't made in China- talk about Karma . . . > don't let your dogma get run over by your karma.... andre' rama From ???@??? Thu Feb 05 01:15:14 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 4 18:46:01 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0HK2-0007N8-00; Wed, 4 Feb 1998 18:45:50 -0800 Message-Id: <199802050236.VAA03176@shell.monmouth.com> Reply-To: From: "andre" To: Subject: Is mackie Tapco today??? Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 21:35:57 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1162 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"pULmJ.A.2yF.mWS20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2887 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 18:45:50 -0800 X-UIDL: 0fe8af90fe1399b1dc6a4fdd291ab271 someone told me that TAPCO is what became the mackie co. of today?? i have a really cool, pretty quiet Tapco 6 ch mixer. simple, 2 band eq, effects loop, mic level outs, xlr and 1/4" ins, reverb. probably findable used - it's a warhorse can anyone yay/nay this????? is mackie tapco ?? andre@monmouth.com From ???@??? Thu Feb 05 01:15:18 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 4 18:53:39 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0HRS-0000VL-00; Wed, 4 Feb 1998 18:53:30 -0800 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <01bd31c6$b8de3d60$733163d1@user.texas.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 21:46:35 -0500 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: David Myers Subject: Another cheap Vortex sighting Resent-Message-ID: <"wN9LC.A.nDH.mgS20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2888 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 18:53:30 -0800 X-UIDL: a36dbd6af84f19c13f9930153423a884 >From Harmony Central: FS: Lexicon Vortex Asking Price: US$150 Condition: Mint Age: 1 year Description: Perfect, mint condition Lexicon Vortex Morphing Processor. Great spatial effects. Used exclusively in smoke-free project studio. Less than 10 hours of accumulated use - spent most of its life in the box. $150.00 Seller: Fred Block, 612.379.2142 E-mail: f@usinternet.com Location: MINNEAPOLIS, MN Post Date: 2/4/98 David Myers From ???@??? Thu Feb 05 01:15:20 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 4 19:01:10 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0HYp-0001U8-00; Wed, 4 Feb 1998 19:01:07 -0800 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <01bd31c6$b8de3d60$733163d1@user.texas.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 21:52:19 -0500 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: David Myers Subject: Re: Arcane Device Resent-Message-ID: <"Yn9C6C.A.6b.ZmS20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2889 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 19:01:07 -0800 X-UIDL: 38f5a4c7ebd6f3273993e62e02ea1810 >Hi All, > >Buy Looper First! > >Found a couple of locations for David Myers CDs >8 Arcane Device - Diabolis Ex Machina(CD) >http://www.staalplaat.com/st-a.htm >Didn't see any others at Staaplaat, but some very interesting looking items >here. >You can convert Dutch Guilders and other currency here: >http://www.cookiesfromeden.com/convert.html >Both " Also Sprach·and Envoi" located here: >http://home.t-online.de/home/Art.Konkret/mailca.htm >Left email for visa order, will see. They are are in some nonamerican land, >I think they speak Globlish though. > >Randy Jones Thanks Randy. Even *I* don't know where to find the last remnants of my own stuff. As far as I know, pretty much everything is seriously out of print. For anyone who might be interested, I've put a more or less complete Arcane Device discography w/ descriptions and issuing label addresses on my homepage: www.bway.net/~dmgraph. From ???@??? Thu Feb 05 01:15:39 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 4 22:50:19 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0L8c-0006my-00; Wed, 4 Feb 1998 22:50:18 -0800 Message-Id: <3.0.2.16.19980204190131.20f7f95a@texas.net> X-Sender: sharkey@texas.net (Unverified) X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.2 (16) Date: Wed, 04 Feb 1998 19:01:31 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: james rhodes Subject: Re: Mir conversations Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"FavkBC.A.e3F.vAW20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2900 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 22:50:18 -0800 X-UIDL: 4fefdf63cffeb9d60749f0b2d942bd65 > >sure,, >well on occasion when i have play live,(and record) i will bring along scanning reciever, and i will scan the airwaves for communication (ie airport traffic, mall security, cops etc,,,) i will come out an RCA on the VHF reciever, to my jamman,,and then to my mixer(with effects loops delays, backwards,,,you name it) in most cases the sample of conversation (ie subject matter, emotions) actually affects the composition ,,,and takes me in directions i might not if gone,,,(hope this isnt confusing,,,im sleepy) well anyway,, MIR transmits to earth on the VHF frequency 143.6200 Mhz,,,depending on your location on earth, you should be able to catch transmissions at some point during a 24 hour period,,one must be patiant,,,and a voice activated recording system allows a better chance of catching transmissions for review later,,,but in a live setting i just take what the airwaves will give me,,, james > > > > > >At 06:33 PM 2/4/98 -0500, you wrote: >>Just curious, where did you source the Mir conversations? Sounds like >>an interesting composition! >>Samuel D. Burns >> >> >> >> From ???@??? Thu Feb 05 01:15:26 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 4 19:42:52 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0ID5-0005e8-00; Wed, 4 Feb 1998 19:42:43 -0800 Message-Id: <2.2.32.19980205033654.00bc2b18@pop.chromatic.com> X-Sender: kflint@pop.chromatic.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 2.2 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 04 Feb 1998 19:36:54 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Kim Flint Subject: Re: Re: LD site outage Resent-Message-ID: <"a_7OlC.A.arE.CQT20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2891 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 19:42:43 -0800 X-UIDL: 98540b946c4d7d8d05d06c224e03cc46 uh, the goal is to get *better* service than I currently get.... kim At 08:23 PM 2/4/98 EST, you wrote: >Hey Kim, make a deal with America Online for your page. ________________________________________________________ Kim Flint 408-752-9284 Mpact System Engineering kflint@chromatic.com Chromatic Research http://www.chromatic.com From ???@??? Thu Feb 05 01:15:27 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 4 19:43:44 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0IE2-0005mR-00; Wed, 4 Feb 1998 19:43:42 -0800 Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 22:38:24 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <199802050338.WAA07510@mcfeely.concentric.net> X-Sender: hideo@pop3.concentric.net (Unverified) X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Tom Lambrecht Subject: Re: Hot buttered Vortex sighting Resent-Message-ID: <"XhKPUB.A.3yE.4QT20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2892 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 19:43:42 -0800 X-UIDL: e983e3ad455f61fb9235bb402e021880 It ain' a $125 Jamman . . . but it is a $150 Vortex freshly posted to Harmony in mint condition, less than 10 hours says the owner call him (don't e-mail---- thats how you lose that treasured piece of gear) he's on the East Coast-------- wake him up and apologize and tell him you want IT his name is Fred 612.379.2142 you'll thank me in the morning good luck Tom Tom Lambrecht hideo@concentric.net From ???@??? Thu Feb 05 01:15:29 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 4 19:55:53 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0IPl-00079Z-00; Wed, 4 Feb 1998 19:55:49 -0800 Message-Id: <2.2.32.19980205035050.00bb4754@pop.chromatic.com> X-Sender: kflint@pop.chromatic.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 2.2 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 04 Feb 1998 19:50:50 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Kim Flint Subject: RE: Arcane Device Resent-Message-ID: <"ghXkED.A.TKG.LdT20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2893 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 19:55:50 -0800 X-UIDL: 555088c86a6943b2026da3b10858a03e The echoplex has knobs for input volume, output volume, mix, and feedback control. (that's four!) With midi cc knobs, you can control feedback (in addition to the front) and loop out volume (=5!!). You can even plug a pedal in the back for feedback, loop out volume, or delay line in volume (=6!!!). There's not really any other parameter available where it would make sense to use a knob on it. Most people use the mix and feedback knobs all the time to control things. What else would you like knobs to do? oh, and everything can be controlled with your tappin' feet. kim At 01:09 PM 2/4/98 -0600, Liebig, Steuart A. wrote: >Yes for knobs. > >Frankly, I'd be much more likely to want something like a JamMan or >Oberheim 'Plex if they had knobs. Maybe it's the neo-Luddite in me, but >I prefer being able to manually adapt parameters (in addition to foot >control) to whatever is going on musically. Hence my fondness for the EH >16-second delay. This morning, I was lamenting the fact that something >like the 'Plex (which will obviously have superior sonic specs) isn't >available with these features . . . and in a non-rack package. I'm sick >of racks and like to be able to just pull out a pedal . . . again a >plus of the EH16. > ________________________________________________________ Kim Flint 408-752-9284 Mpact System Engineering kflint@chromatic.com Chromatic Research http://www.chromatic.com From ???@??? Thu Feb 05 01:15:30 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 4 20:15:43 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0Iiz-0001CB-00; Wed, 4 Feb 1998 20:15:41 -0800 Message-Id: <199802050412.XAA16002@shell.monmouth.com> Reply-To: From: "andre" To: Subject: Fripp site Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 23:11:50 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1162 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"wBBYgC.A.Qv.gwT20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2894 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 20:15:41 -0800 X-UIDL: e6e9e345fd42ce7619b133e6f92518e6 hey all... don't want to risk the firestorm bringing up this surname, but have you checked out http://www.fripp.com ??? it's *his* sister Patricia, who is kindof an inspirational speaker in san fran..... interesting to check out how genes work.... ...she's a........lecturer. check it out - fun site, funny comments from her, too! plus a pic or 2 of bro' RF andre' From ???@??? Thu Feb 05 01:15:32 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 4 20:58:51 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0JOh-0004wK-00; Wed, 4 Feb 1998 20:58:47 -0800 Message-Id: <1.5.4.32.19980205045347.006652fc@tiac.net> X-Sender: rphunt@tiac.net X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 04 Feb 1998 23:53:47 -0500 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Reginald Hunt Subject: RE: looping as sin Resent-Message-ID: <"SPaqND.A.uKE.ZYU20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2895 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 20:58:47 -0800 X-UIDL: 626fa572943bdf48702ed304f7da7ce9 The remark. The writer was stating that solo looping was not music. Reg At 11:32 AM 2/4/98 -0600, you wrote: >Was it the comment, or the syndrome that was pitiful? > >> ---------- >> From: Reginald Hunt >> Reply To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com >> Sent: Tuesday, February 3, 1998 10:18 PM >> To: LiebigSA@maritz.com >> Subject: Re: looping as sin >> >> Come on let's face it. Just like any other subject, there are some >> folks >> concerned more with the technology than what it produces. We need >> people >> like that, but we can't evaluate performers strictly by their degree >> of >> technological innovation (which I've seen done here). >> >> Yes, the remark about playing ICs when looping is used by itself was >> pitiful. From ???@??? Thu Feb 05 01:15:33 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 4 21:02:38 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0JSN-0005Pf-00; Wed, 4 Feb 1998 21:02:35 -0800 Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 23:56:14 -0500 (EST) From: CORROSIVE@aol.com Message-ID: <980204235613_-1295285190@mrin51.mx> To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: RDS & 16 sec vs. Plex & Jamman Resent-Message-ID: <"Furl1.A.JdE.vaU20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2896 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 21:02:35 -0800 X-UIDL: f6a353193b16eebea8a62982c529463d I agree with Mark's comments about being able to manually change parameters, but the one thing that keeps bringing me back to the RDS-8000 & EH 16sec (or at least putting them in the chain before the plex & jamman) is the ability to change the pitch of your loops after they've been trapped... also the lowered resolution of EH stuff is so cool- i wish the Plex had a switch on it so U could sample at 4 bits.... From ???@??? Thu Feb 05 01:15:35 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 4 21:42:12 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0K4g-0000xZ-00; Wed, 4 Feb 1998 21:42:10 -0800 Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 00:37:23 -0500 (EST) From: Adam Levin Reply-To: Adam Levin To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Baltimore Loopage Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Resent-Message-ID: <"yJCi-B.A.Vd.PBV20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2897 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 21:42:10 -0800 X-UIDL: 6f8c795e4d1d5e51b240002adc2f47d9 My band, The Dark Aether Project will be performing Saturday, February 28th at Orion Studios in Baltimore, Maryland. This will be our official CD release show. I'll be laying down some Stick loops with my Digitech RDS-8000, Zoom 508 and thanks to Pat Murphy and the service department at Obie, my resurrected Echoplex which made it back in time to be featured on a couple of the tracks on the forthcoming CD. We'll have some special guests appearing with us for this performance. Also on the bill are Smoking Granny who are a cool fusion/avante-garde outfit from North Carolina as well as Finneus Gauge, the band whose album was picked as one of the best of the year by Keyboard Magazine. They draw frequent comparisons to Bruford and the original UK lineup. See http://www.ari.net/prog/shows/showcase/ for more info on this and other shows at Orion See http://www.ari.net/prog/bands/dap/ for the Dark Aether Project web site. -Adam --- "...if one strives at hearing for the sake of constant virtue, out of seeking liberation from cyclic existence, gradually one becomes a Hearer." - Chandrakirti From ???@??? Thu Feb 05 01:15:36 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 4 22:04:59 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0KQi-000300-00; Wed, 4 Feb 1998 22:04:56 -0800 From: Dpcoffin@aol.com Message-ID: <5f1cfb06.34d9555b@aol.com> Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 00:59:53 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Filter Kings Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 84 Resent-Message-ID: <"2212AC.A.mPC.pVV20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2898 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 22:04:56 -0800 X-UIDL: ffec8baef92b55bc5db43ca0f92ed311 In a message dated 2/4/98 5:32:15 PM, Tom wrote: >Each has a Comb >Filter, a Ring Modulator and Rotary Speaker modes in addition to the usual >guitar-friendly effects. Speak o' th devil...as I read this I'm noodling into my phones on my GT-5 running thru its comb filters and DEEEP ring mod realms.... dpc From ???@??? Thu Feb 05 01:15:37 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 4 22:05:23 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0KR6-000335-00; Wed, 4 Feb 1998 22:05:20 -0800 Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19980204220255.0099dd60@pop.nwlink.com> X-Sender: jt@pop.nwlink.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Wed, 04 Feb 1998 22:02:55 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: JT Subject: System 7 / 777 Cc: pvallado@waynesworld.ucsd.edu In-Reply-To: <199802042159.NAA28103@waynesworld.ucsd.edu> References: <2.2.32.19980204010422.009a0848@pop.chromatic.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"KigvLD.A.xRC.4VV20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2899 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 22:05:20 -0800 X-UIDL: 1321d2b5d70815977e2edf51e9f43e76 >I have to give you guys major props for turning me on to Photek, The Orb, >DJ Krush, etc. etc... guys who are hardly guitar oriented. It was >refreshing for me to discover a whole new universe of music that I >ignorantly put down as the product of "musically-ignorant lazy button-pushers >and robbers of 'real' music". If you like the Orb, Check out System 7 (in the UK), aka 777 (in the States) for loopy guitar stuff a la Steve Hillage. Each of their CDs is somewhat different. The first one (777) is orange (I think the seashell image may have changed a few years ago) and is the most different of the bunch. You may like Golden Section, Power of Seven, or the Water or Fire Album more. Water is a pretty ambient; Fire is basically the same thing with beats mixed in. JT From ???@??? Thu Feb 05 10:22:20 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 5 04:35:06 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0QWE-0003i1-00; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 04:35:02 -0800 Mime-Version: 1.0 Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 09:06:38 +0300 Message-ID: <0000A7B4.4007@poyry.com.br> From: miguel.barella@poyry.com.br (MAT) Subject: Re: converters To: "Loop List" , "Matt McCabe" Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Description: cc:Mail note part Resent-Message-ID: <"lhLld.A.5DD.WEb20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2918 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 04:35:02 -0800 X-UIDL: f054e54ea01963850b220e729590f462 Alesis used to make this converter. It is discontinued now. Miguel ___________________________ Separador de Resposta ______________________________ Assunto: converters Autor: "Matt McCabe" na internet Data: 04/02/1998 13:24 I'm looking for an ADAT Light Pipe to S/PDIF converter. Do they exist? Thanks....now back to the loops! Matt From ???@??? Sun Feb 08 00:54:17 1998 >From kflint Sat Feb 7 23:07:06 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y1QpR-0004Hh-00; Sat, 7 Feb 1998 23:07:01 -0800 Message-ID: <000e01bd3203$f069d400$b123dacf@stepheng> Reply-To: "Stephen P. Goodman" From: "Stephen P. Goodman" To: Subject: Re: ra page Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 23:01:51 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Resent-Message-ID: <"sJupoD.A.IlD.aiV30"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3066 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sat, 7 Feb 1998 23:07:01 -0800 X-UIDL: a0a06e0ffb2a4c2cc1b7df5d654d0d88 >At 8:38 PM -0500 2/7/98, Jeff Duke wrote: >>is there any possibility of having a music page in ra( for space >>considerations) >>of loopers on this site?I think it would be great to hear what everybodys >>typing about. > And Kim responded: >But it's still a pretty good idea. However, with the current diskspace >allotment, we'd probably run out of room quickly if we did something like >this. Well, to be succinct, I believe there are enough of us out here who already post our work online, to be able to supply Kim links to existing work on our own sites. No disk space problem there, eh? Stephen Goodman * It's... The Loop Of The Week! EarthLight Studios * http://www.earthlight.net/Studios From ???@??? Thu Feb 05 01:15:42 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 4 23:18:41 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0La2-00017R-00; Wed, 4 Feb 1998 23:18:38 -0800 Message-Id: <2.2.32.19980205071509.00bb45b8@pop.chromatic.com> X-Sender: kflint@pop.chromatic.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 2.2 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 04 Feb 1998 23:15:09 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Kim Flint Subject: Re: forefront etc... Cc: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Resent-Message-ID: <"-SwvAC.A.kw.ncW20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2901 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 23:18:38 -0800 X-UIDL: faee5385b243294c4a37ec70f5c21359 At 10:24 AM 2/4/98 -0500, Reginald Hunt wrote: >Kim, > >I for one would be interested if you would share some of the innovations in >looping that are occuring in the dance/techno field. One reason I started >checking out this list was to see what ideas and approaches existed beyond >what I had already encountered or come up with. I would, although I'm really busy......so I'll leave the music to someone else. As far as looping device innovations, you see things like tempo matching, poyphony with lots of mixing and control options, lots of sync features, much tighter integration to PC's, waveform editing, unique and different effects, lots of triggering features. Looping devices tend to come from two historical paths, delays and samplers. Modern devices are starting to merge the two. The echoplex and jamman, for example, have a number of features that are mostly common to samplers but previously unknown in delays. On the sampler side, Akai and Roland samplers have tap functions for quickly grabbing loops and using them immediately, something previously only seen in delays. I would expect these trends to continue. >I've been looping since about 1983, and one thing I've seen consistently is >the short attention spans manufacturers have for the subject. They dabble in >long delay times, find it is not yet the market they want, then lose >interest (Lexicon, Ibanez, Digitech, for example). They dabbled in these products and nobody bought them..... >If Oberhiem starts designing their delay units strictly for the >sampling/dance market, then the rest of the Looper world will once again be >stranded. Of course, that's business. I don't understand why you see these as mutually exclusive goals. Could you elaborate on that? To me they merge together quite well, with features from either side being attractive to the other. In paying heavy attention to these loopy things over the past few years, I just see a wide continuum of loop oriented styles, with different musicians located all over it. In many cases, people with very different sounding music use very similar loop techniques, and similar devices and approaches to it. I don't see some clear distinction between a "sampling/dance market" and "the rest of the Looper world." In fact, that's why I created Looper's Delight in the first place, to bring all these various loopers together so that we can all plainly see the things we share and trade the ideas we've develop in our own little universes. Seems to be working pretty well so far. To me, drawing such arbitrary distictions between ourselves usually has a lot more to do with human arrogance and ego than anything else. We agonize over subtle differences of detail, just to prove we are not one of "them." We fear some association with the "wrong" crowd. My experience is that these walls harmed me more than they ever helped. The fear just keeps me shrouded in ignorance. The best things that ever happen to me come from finding the common ground and learning to understand and love the differences. I like to encourage that attitude here. The diversity on Looper's Delight will regularly surprise you, so enjoy it! And it's certainly not good business to draw such boundaries and distinctions; you sell far more product by finding commonalities and joining markets together, not carving them up! kim ________________________________________________________ Kim Flint 408-752-9284 Mpact System Engineering kflint@chromatic.com Chromatic Research http://www.chromatic.com From ???@??? Thu Feb 05 01:15:46 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 4 23:34:01 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0Lou-0002LC-00; Wed, 4 Feb 1998 23:34:00 -0800 Message-Id: <2.2.32.19980205072926.00bd9924@pop.chromatic.com> X-Sender: kflint@pop.chromatic.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 2.2 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 04 Feb 1998 23:29:26 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Kim Flint Subject: Re: sampling rights Cc: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Resent-Message-ID: <"bsG-5C.A.85B.1qW20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2902 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 23:34:00 -0800 X-UIDL: 26791acb76130f43fdff92209e58fd41 At 06:57 PM 2/4/98 -0500, Caleb Deupree wrote: >At 04:41 PM 2/4/98 est, Edward_Chang@mail.amsinc.com wrote: > >> Oswald samples probably >> around 200 songs on his Plunderphonics record and I'm wondering if he >> might've done anything more than just putting it out. > >Since you picked a particularly outrageous example, Oswald was not just >sued, he was forced to destroy both all remaining copies of his first CD >*and* the master tapes. The only reason they didn't try to round up all >the ones that had already gone out was because some rich (i.e., with deep >pockets) or otherwise influential library absolutely refused to give up >their copy. I tend to believe that most sampling falls under the "fair use" portions of typical copyright laws. Similar to quoting another article or collage art. Proving it, though, is incredibly difficult, and apparently there isn't a lot of case background to develop those areas of the law. One exception is 2 Live Crew's successful fair use defense against Roy Orbison, for their sampling of "Pretty Woman." They had the money to do it, though. Typically the sampling party doesn't have anywhere near the legal budget of the one being sampled. (as was poor negativland's situation when U2 and Casey Casem were obliterating them for their parody of "I still haven't found what I'm looking for," which had some hysterical samples of Casem radio outtakes.) So rather than battle it out in court, the practice of seeking permission and paying licensing fees has developed. Many people who use lots of samples blatently ignore this, however. It's part of the culture of some scenes to take the samples without permission. This is now so common that most seem to get away with it. The risk is up to you I guess. kim ________________________________________________________ Kim Flint 408-752-9284 Mpact System Engineering kflint@chromatic.com Chromatic Research http://www.chromatic.com From ???@??? Thu Feb 05 01:15:54 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 4 23:51:28 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0M5h-0003qt-00; Wed, 4 Feb 1998 23:51:21 -0800 Message-Id: <2.2.32.19980205074528.00bbb074@pop.chromatic.com> X-Sender: kflint@pop.chromatic.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 2.2 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 04 Feb 1998 23:45:28 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Kim Flint Subject: Re: RE: Frippery vs. Bitchery Cc: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Resent-Message-ID: <"ij5HH.A.8_C._4W20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2903 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 23:51:21 -0800 X-UIDL: ce272a186a06686c390d4096261d6e35 >In a message dated 2/4/98 12:39:41 PM, Brian wrote: > >>Personally, I imagine that if I had bothered to stand in the hour-long >>queue at the recent Night Watch launch, and had a chat with him, I probably >>wouldn't like him as a person. And why would I want his written autograph, >>when I have his musical autograph on the CD in my hand? > it's funny...I spent part of an afternoon with Robert Fripp when I did a product demo for him before a King Crimson show. I'd never really listened to him before that, and never found his music interesting enough to listen afterwards either. But I found Robert to be a very nice, open fellow, and enjoyed our conversations about gear and loops and such. Maybe he just treats his fans badly? another funny thing. People talk about Fripp on this list every now and then, but they almost never talk about what he actually does with looping. I think I know more about his looping from talking to him directly about it than I ever learned from anybody here. Maybe some of us non-fripp enthusiasts might like to hear something a little more loop specific? It would certainly be more interesting to me than comparisons between Robert Fripp and Joe Satriani, or opinions about his lectures, or indignant defenses of some Frippian character trait, or whatever else you've been talking about. kim ________________________________________________________ Kim Flint 408-752-9284 Mpact System Engineering kflint@chromatic.com Chromatic Research http://www.chromatic.com From ???@??? Thu Feb 05 01:15:55 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 4 23:51:47 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0M65-0003up-00; Wed, 4 Feb 1998 23:51:45 -0800 Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 02:46:13 -0500 (EST) From: Goddess X-Sender: Thefates@viking.cris.com To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Bitchery vs. Fair Comment In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Resent-Message-ID: <"5QUiyD.A.6BD.K5W20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2904 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 23:51:45 -0800 X-UIDL: e15296841fe1d513c36ecd07ccaaae99 No offense, but would you please keep your scuzzy ideas to yourself!!! From ???@??? Thu Feb 05 01:15:56 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 5 00:07:31 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0MLJ-0005A6-00; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 00:07:29 -0800 Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 03:04:19 -0500 (EST) From: Goddess X-Sender: Thefates@viking.cris.com To: loopers-delight@annihilist.com Subject: Clarification... Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Resent-Message-ID: <"UYwQu.A.MjE.FKX20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2905 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 00:07:29 -0800 X-UIDL: 4cc897ae347c497fcabc20ab08755fa5 I aught to have mentioned that my last msg just now was meant for Zepplin Soup and that assinine msg concerning Christy Canyon... From ???@??? Thu Feb 05 10:22:42 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 5 06:35:11 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0SOP-0002xs-00; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 06:35:05 -0800 Mime-Version: 1.0 Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 11:38:51 +0300 Message-ID: <0000A7DB.4007@poyry.com.br> From: miguel.barella@poyry.com.br (MAT) Subject: Re[2]: Arcane Device To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com, Kim Flint Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Description: cc:Mail note part Resent-Message-ID: <"74D_kD.A.cWC.y0c20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2922 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 06:35:05 -0800 X-UIDL: 6d4d02cc3f09f34618565c37b3f53932 ___________________________ Separador de Resposta ______________________________ The echoplex has knobs for input volume, output volume, mix, and feedback control. (that's four!) With midi cc knobs, you can control feedback (in addition to the front) and loop out volume (=5!!). You can even plug a pedal in the back for feedback, loop out volume, or delay line in volume (=6!!!). There's not really any other parameter available where it would make sense to use a knob on it. Most people use the mix and feedback knobs all the time to control things. What else would you like knobs to do? ===> I would realy like to control delay time with a knob in any device (JM or Plex) Miguel From ???@??? Thu Feb 05 01:15:57 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 5 00:48:44 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0MzD-0007Qm-00; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 00:48:43 -0800 Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 03:46:07 -0500 (EST) From: Goddess X-Sender: Thefates@viking.cris.com To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Mir conversations In-Reply-To: <3.0.2.16.19980204190131.20f7f95a@texas.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Resent-Message-ID: <"glrDO.A.1vG.TxX20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2906 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 00:48:43 -0800 X-UIDL: 713b2b81b91b7074aa3f129ff54b13d6 That's a wonderfully creative idea, I love it!!! smiles, Corynne On Wed, 4 Feb 1998, james rhodes wrote: > > > >sure,, > >well on occasion when i have play live,(and record) i will bring along > scanning reciever, and i will scan the airwaves for communication (ie > airport traffic, mall security, cops etc,,,) i will come out an RCA on the > VHF reciever, to my jamman,,and then to my mixer(with effects loops delays, > backwards,,,you name it) in most cases the sample of conversation (ie > subject matter, emotions) actually affects the composition ,,,and takes me > in directions i might not if gone,,,(hope this isnt confusing,,,im sleepy) > well anyway,, MIR transmits to earth on the VHF frequency 143.6200 > Mhz,,,depending on your location on earth, you should be able to catch > transmissions at some point during a 24 hour period,,one must be > patiant,,,and a voice activated recording system allows a better chance of > catching transmissions for review later,,,but in a live setting i just take > what the airwaves will give me,,, > james > > > > > > > > > > > >At 06:33 PM 2/4/98 -0500, you wrote: > >>Just curious, where did you source the Mir conversations? Sounds like > >>an interesting composition! > >>Samuel D. Burns > >> > >> > >> > >> > > > From ???@??? Thu Feb 05 01:15:58 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 5 01:10:48 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0NKX-0000wJ-00; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 01:10:45 -0800 Reply-To: "Stefano Voulaz" From: "Stefano Voulaz" To: Subject: Sound of Voices (R: Mir conversations) Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 10:08:38 +0100 Message-ID: <01bd3215$a5904740$6902a8c0@voulaz> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Resent-Message-ID: <"DMPgkB.A._o.DGY20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2907 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 01:10:45 -0800 X-UIDL: c437322eb9934183e348de73145b7961 >> >well on occasion when i have play live,(and record) i will bring along >> scanning reciever, and i will scan the airwaves for communication (ie >> airport traffic, mall security, cops etc,,,) i will come out an RCA on the >> VHF reciever, to my jamman,,and then to my mixer(with effects loops delays, >> backwards,,,you name it) in most cases the sample of conversation (ie [snip] This is an interestig approach. I use to do similar things with western Europe AM radio stations, where the buzzy and whistling programs give a sort of background and direction to looping. And the fact that I cannot understand a single word is one of the most exciting things, since it's no longer the contents that's important, but the container (i.e., the sound). This is however an approach I have ever had in listening music: not being a native English speaker, I cannot fully understand the text of the songs I listen to (unless I have the lyrics). Even though, or, better, due to this fact, I really love listening to the *sound* of the voices I hear (I think to David Sylvian or the the latest Bjork, for example), a sound that might have gone lost if I'd fully understand the text (for being concentrated on it). Any comment on this ill-earing? Ciao! Stefano Voulaz (The Looping uncle) From ???@??? Thu Feb 05 02:27:31 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 5 01:22:29 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0NVs-00022p-00; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 01:22:28 -0800 Sender: camao@camsg001.camb.scee.sony.co.uk Message-ID: <34D9842B.450A1096@scee.sony.co.uk> Date: Thu, 05 Feb 1998 09:19:39 +0000 From: Os X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (X11; I; IRIX 6.2 IP22) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com" Subject: Re: Sound of Voices (R: Mir conversations) References: <01bd3215$a5904740$6902a8c0@voulaz> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"8q8B6D.A.WsB.FRY20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2909 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 01:22:28 -0800 X-UIDL: 9ec02a77befc0fb9985c741fbcd45c72 Stefano Voulaz wrote: > This is an interestig approach. I use to do similar things with western > Europe AM radio stations, where the buzzy and whistling programs give a sort > of background and direction to looping. I tend to use European shortwave transmissions. They just give an immediate interest to a track, rather like adding pepper to a cooking pot. Maybe it's because it provides that essential human interest in otherwise instrumental music? For a recent track I fed the radio through an envelope-tracking resonant filter, which sounded good - disguised the words quite well, so it was just more of a random burbling texture. When you do this sort of thing you start to really notice the inherent rhythms in speech. -- Os os@millennium.co.uk http://webworlds.net/os/ From ???@??? Thu Feb 05 02:27:32 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 5 01:29:56 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0Nd4-0002dD-00; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 01:29:54 -0800 Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 04:27:38 -0500 (EST) From: Goddess X-Sender: Thefates@viking.cris.com To: loopers-delight@annihilist.com Subject: question... Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Resent-Message-ID: <"sBtyQD.A.5QC.NYY20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2910 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 01:29:54 -0800 X-UIDL: 4d0ee6dac862eb5f4038ec94d48e8f3c This question has been a curiousity of mine for a while now, and as the conversation here lately has been concerned with people's feelings about Robert Fripp which seem to be mostly negative, I thought this would be a good place to ask it. What is it concerning him that seems to upset people so? I mean this question quite sincerely as I've noticed this happening quite a lot in interviews, articles, etc. I'm asking this because I don't understand it and I'd genuinely like to know what's going on. My experiences with him have been warm, friendly and pleasant and I'm not sure why he seems to come off to some people in such a negative light. I should probably add that this question is strictly my curiousity as a musician,it doesn't come from being a "Fripp-fan", liking his music or some such thing. I've got no special affinity for Robert over anyone else in my life and am not trying to "support" him. I'm a musician, and I do what I do. Other musicians do what they do and that's that. So, to anyone who'd care to anser this question honestly, I'd be extremely appreciative. Anyway, let's all have some fun and play a lot of cool music! Sincerely, smiles and Thanks, Corynne From ???@??? Thu Feb 05 02:27:35 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 5 01:42:24 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0Np8-0003LN-00; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 01:42:22 -0800 Message-Id: <199802050939.DAA12274@smtp1.mailsrvcs.net> From: "future perfect" To: Subject: Loop Definition? Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 04:41:25 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 In-Reply-To: Importance: Normal Resent-Message-ID: <"qvcxvC.A.h6C.vjY20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2911 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 01:42:22 -0800 X-UIDL: 9b69219c0bae3bba1c2b9fc91ae79aba I was wondering if anyone had a good definition of 'looping' for the civilians out there. I'm talking about a concise explanation for people who do not know what 'sampling' or 'multitrack recording' is. It is difficult enough explaining to musicians who do not understand where all the sound is coming from, much less someone who knows nothing of music technology as a whole. Just interested, as I have been in the position to explain it several times, and it is difficult without any reference points. Thanks, Dave Eichenberger ********************************************************************* 'Future Perfect' - progressive art music - visit our website at: http://www.geocities.com/SoHo/Lofts/8082 From ???@??? Thu Feb 05 02:27:37 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 5 02:00:32 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0O6h-0004ER-00; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 02:00:31 -0800 Message-ID: <34D98DA5.79AA5D16@bellsouth.net> Date: Thu, 05 Feb 1998 05:00:05 -0500 From: Jeff Duke Reply-To: jmar@bellsouth.net Organization: Tec Bab Labs X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Liquid Audio References: <199802050112.RAA29875@waynesworld.ucsd.edu> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"lLbkr.A.MyD.90Y20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2912 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 02:00:31 -0800 X-UIDL: 45eb7d5cc5ec151554f437389b188e05 Paolo Valladolid wrote: > A recent article in the fishwr- I mean, newspaper mentioned software > called Liquid Audio (URL is http://ww.liquidaudio.com). Here's an > excerpt: > > "Liquid Audio, available for Windows and the Mac, is being used by > several musicians to sell music via direct downloads for as little > as 99 cents per song." > > Mornin friends, > The Knitting Factory (http://www.knittingfactory.com/)ha s a recording > label that uses Liquid Audio.It sounds good on the samples. Jeff DukeTecBabLabs http://members.tripod.com/~dukesr/index.html From ???@??? Thu Feb 05 02:27:38 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 5 02:12:23 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0OIA-0004xA-00; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 02:12:22 -0800 Message-ID: <34D99040.C9181538@bellsouth.net> Date: Thu, 05 Feb 1998 05:11:12 -0500 From: Jeff Duke Reply-To: jmar@bellsouth.net Organization: Tec Bab Labs X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: andre@monmouth.com CC: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: northeast tour??? LOOP shows... References: <199802050231.VAA01173@shell.monmouth.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"YrpcyD.A.sYE.m_Y20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2913 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 02:12:22 -0800 X-UIDL: 6e3d56da95544720d3f1658f32ae3922 andre wrote: > hello. > > ps - any zappa fans out there?? - my zappa tribute band's site is up - > http://www.jswd.net/projectobject - we're about to embark on a mini tour of > upstate NY with Ike Willis, who played/sang with zappa from 1978-88. > Incidentally, anyone out there ever check out frank's use of loops , > starting in 1984 ??? they became an integral part of his soloing palette.. > > andre@monmouth.com > > I love Zappa,I first saw the Mothers at the Denver Pop Festivel in '69.I > couldnt get the streaming on your site to work though.Is rm streaming?I use > ram. Jeff From ???@??? Thu Feb 05 10:22:14 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 5 04:27:17 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0QOe-0002jX-00; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 04:27:12 -0800 Message-ID: <01BD3230.AB1D8720@slip139-92-21-97.lo.uk.ibm.net> From: "Brian Thomson, London UK" To: "'Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com'" Subject: RE: RE: Frippery vs. Bitchery + Markus Reuter's "Taster" + Bye Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 10:17:17 -0000 Encoding: 75 TEXT, 85 UUENCODE X-MS-Attachment: WINMAIL.DAT 0 00-00-1980 00:00 Resent-Message-ID: <"jeRbID.A.0IC.A9a20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2915 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 04:27:12 -0800 X-UIDL: 0aaffd2c58495800326a92d5229f5333 ---------- From: Kim Flint Sent: 05 February 1998 07:45 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Cc: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: RE: Frippery vs. Bitchery >>In a message dated 2/4/98 12:39:41 PM, Brian wrote: >> >>>Personally, I imagine that if I had bothered to stand in the hour-long >>>queue at the recent Night Watch launch, and had a chat with him, I probably >>>wouldn't like him as a person. And why would I want his written autograph, >>>when I have his musical autograph on the CD in my hand? >> > >another funny thing. People talk about Fripp on this list every now and >then, but they almost never talk about what he actually does with looping. I >think I know more about his looping from talking to him directly about it >than I ever learned from anybody here... Well, if I had the opportunity to actually _talk_ with the guy, I'm sure we would get on just fine. I'm sure he would make fewer assumptions about me than I would about him. My point was that many of the opinions people have about him are formed at such autograph-signing sessions or other public appearances, where we aren't seeing the Real Fripp. I may even go so far as to say that the Real Fripp can be found between the bits on the tracks of the CD, and I have little inclination to look anywhere else. When I listen to A Blessing Of Tears or Radiophonics, I know all I _need_ to know about the guy, though it would still be very interesting to discuss the theory and practice of looping with him in person. When it comes pure Fripp looping-with-guitar, I swear by his "Bringing Down The Light", the last track on the Sylvian/Fripp "First Day" album, and the build-ups before his solos on Sylvian/Fripp's "Damage" live album. On both, you can follow which notes he's playing when, to see how he got there - which decreased my respect for him not one iota. Of course, we Loopers are a bit short of heroes, so it's not surprising that folks like Fripp, Torn, Eno, Riley get slightly canonized. Another chap I recommend highly in looping circles in Paul Schutze. If you find his Apart album (Virgin Ambient AMBT6, 1995), GRAB! I don't know for sure if he's looping live in the sense used on this list, but it sure sounds like it. Repetition of acoustic and analogue synth sounds, no guitar. Makes train journeys fly by in a theta state... --- Also: I've had some more mail from Markus Reuter about his "Taster" live looping CD, which Michael Peters recommended to you folks recently. Just in case you guys lost the information, here's Markus' mail .sig file, with all the relevant URLs. Now you have NO excuse! 8{ -> Markus Reuter, Dammwiese 7, 33613 Bielefeld, Germany <- -> email mreuter@post.uni-bielefeld.de <-> phone (521) 896248 <- -> http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/mpeters/markus.htm <- -> check out my newly released cd "TASTER - live in cologne" <- -> http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/mpeters/taster.htm <- --- Thanks to the folks who sent / posted the unsubscribe info. I'm leaving the list for now, until I get some more mail bandwidth (I have a ThinkPad and a 9600bps mobile phone link). Still, I'll keep an eye on the Web site, and I'm especially interested in contributing to the next Loopers' CD... Cheers, Brian Thomson, London, UK bnt@ibm.net Attachment converted: shards o' data:WINMAIL.DAT (????/----) (00000D41) From ???@??? Thu Feb 05 10:22:17 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 5 04:27:48 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0QP9-0002oB-00; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 04:27:43 -0800 Message-ID: <01BD3230.BEA8E280@slip139-92-21-97.lo.uk.ibm.net> From: "Brian Thomson, London UK" To: "'Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com'" Subject: RE: converters Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 10:17:47 -0000 Encoding: 26 TEXT, 40 UUENCODE X-MS-Attachment: WINMAIL.DAT 0 00-00-1980 00:00 Resent-Message-ID: <"iJ5FVD.A.UMC.Z9a20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2916 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 04:27:43 -0800 X-UIDL: 4094bf869f8e4eee72faa1c1cc3e2851 I believe that Apogee do one, and also Kurzweil to go with their K2500. I don't have their URLs handy, but I remember getting the information from Alesis themselves (http://www.alesis.com), who keep a list of "ADAT Optical" - compatible equipment on their site... Cheers, Brian Thomson, London UK bnt@ibm.net ---------- From: Matt McCabe Sent: 04 February 1998 21:24 To: Loop List Subject: converters I'm looking for an ADAT Light Pipe to S/PDIF converter. Do they exist? Thanks....now back to the loops! Matt Attachment converted: shards o' data:WINMAIL.DAT 1 (????/----) (00000D42) From ???@??? Thu Feb 05 02:48:08 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 5 02:29:28 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0OYh-0005oj-00; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 02:29:27 -0800 X-Sender: kflint@pop.slip.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <01BD3160.8B61DD30@TD-300> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 02:18:15 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Kim Flint Subject: RE: Who's on the forefront of loopmuse? Resent-Message-ID: <"WuQFI.A.BQF.EQZ20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2914 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 02:29:27 -0800 X-UIDL: 93d0ce77047a490003bb4507717c4d62 At 11:32 AM -0500 2/4/98, John Price wrote: >I kinda until like, maybe 3mos ago perceived this site as a home for >classic loopers. > >Clearly, its more diverse than that. But I did think at first that >everyone was either a guitar player or a violinist or an Analog Synth >Looper doin the Ambient thang. ( Nothin wrong with any of that ) > >Assumptions are always fatal. hey, what sorts of things do you do? kim ______________________________________________________________________ Kim Flint | Looper's Delight kflint@annihilist.com | http://www.annihilist.com/loop/loop.html http://www.annihilist.com/ | Loopers-Delight-request@annihilist.com From ???@??? Thu Feb 05 10:23:43 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 5 08:54:18 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0UZ4-0001sX-00; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 08:54:14 -0800 Message-ID: <34D9A8A5.1E3C@nyfac.com> Date: Thu, 05 Feb 1998 11:55:17 +0000 From: tbajus Reply-To: nyfac2@nyfac.com X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (WinNT; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Mir conversations References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"bo-QrB.A.FNB.k2e20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2936 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 08:54:14 -0800 X-UIDL: 1cb28095c55b8d0d36ee21014c8138f9 I helped a friend of mine build an audio istalation a several years ago. We filled up a few 4track tapes with loops, samples, and beats, 2 stereo receivers, a drum machine, damn near every single pedal I owned (at that point, about forty or so( I have since trimmed down to a svelt twenty-five or so), every rack gadget I had, a turntable, four stereo speakers we found dumpster diving, and a mixer. Overlapping, asyncronous loops, random radio blasts, Sugarhill Gang era breakbeats, Neil Young Trans samples. It was great. A very talented boy, that Alex. From ???@??? Thu Feb 05 10:23:47 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 5 09:10:51 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0Up4-0004A8-00; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 09:10:46 -0800 Message-ID: <34D9AB78.2DE0@nyfac.com> Date: Thu, 05 Feb 1998 12:07:20 +0000 From: tbajus Reply-To: nyfac2@nyfac.com X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (WinNT; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: sampling rights References: <199802051513.KAA30666@mail.colba.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"xKV0VC.A.kvC.wBf20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2938 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 09:10:46 -0800 X-UIDL: dcf880bd133605a941920cdd6e657fd1 Julia & Dave wrote: > BTW, Oswald is an Artist, not a thief. The same goes for Negativland. > They were quoting, not stealing. Old Pablo said something to the effect of 'a good artist immitates, a great one steals'. BTW: Can anybody explain to me the difference between Puff Daddy and MC Hammer/Vanilla Ice? This is not a joke. The last two were vilified for plundering the works of others, using the quotes in the same way as the were intended to be used, and rapping on top of them. How do you spell Puff Daddy? Has he been given credibility because of his bullshit 'from the street' posture? PE, where are you? Trevor Bajus From ???@??? Thu Feb 05 10:22:19 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 5 04:33:19 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0QUW-0003Ua-00; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 04:33:16 -0800 Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 21:29:38 +0900 (JST) Message-Id: X-Mailer: Macintosh Eudora Pro Version 2.1.3-J Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-2022-JP" To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: cave@pop1.osk.3web.ne.jp (Sunao Inami) Subject: Re: converters Resent-Message-ID: <"syOtGD.A.m3C.4Cb20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2917 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 04:33:16 -0800 X-UIDL: 4f31d3f6b5b05b1f732cb4c2b2c5015d Hi Matt, > I'm looking for an ADAT Light Pipe to S/PDIF converter. Do they exist? Fostex's converter(digital patchbay) can ADAT optical to S/PDIF or AES/EBU c onvert. I guess price is under $300. Regards Sunao Inami E-mail cave@osk.3web.ne.jp URL"cave home" http://www.threeweb.ad.jp/~cave/ tel&fax "CAVE Studio" +81 6 370 8562 Osaka,Japan tel&fax "home" +81 6 370 0928 Osaka,Japan snail mail address #102,4-4-10,Sugawara, Higashiyodogawa, Osaka City JAPAN 533 From ???@??? Thu Feb 05 10:22:25 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 5 05:22:01 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0RFf-0005vs-00; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 05:21:59 -0800 X-Sender: rmenger@mail.groupz.net Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 08:18:39 -0500 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Richard Menger Subject: PCM-42 upgrade Resent-Message-ID: <"u5AYtC.A.ZVF.qxb20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2919 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 05:21:59 -0800 X-UIDL: 6dd3009ccd8cdfaf4633d7e1a69786d1 Anyone know anywhere I can get more memory added to my PCM-42?...I'm dying over here!!!! Rich "DOS Computers manufactured by companies such as IBM, Compaq, Tandy, and millions of others are by far the most popular, with about 70 million machines in use worldwide. Macintosh fans, on the other hand, may note that cockroaches are far more numerous than humans, and that numbers alone do not denote a higher life form." From ???@??? Thu Feb 05 10:22:28 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 5 05:45:20 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0RcE-0007N6-00; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 05:45:18 -0800 From: Texture444@aol.com Message-ID: <12ea28db.34d9c0cc@aol.com> Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 08:38:18 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Re: Re: Re: Different EBows Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 84 Resent-Message-ID: <"vZyFMD.A.ApG.SHc20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2920 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 05:45:18 -0800 X-UIDL: 47aadd9131479ed14ea8f7bdf4da1002 In a message dated 2/4/98 1:53:07 AM, matthias wrote: <> no; it was a magnetic pickup ("humbucker"-sized, powered by a remote supply), fixed in the "neck" position. best, dt From ???@??? Thu Feb 05 10:22:33 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 5 06:29:48 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0SJF-0002Jm-00; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 06:29:45 -0800 From: MIvanBerk@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 09:25:24 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: JamMan spotted Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 82 Resent-Message-ID: <"C0E1LC.A.E3B.twc20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2921 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 06:29:45 -0800 X-UIDL: 9a5ac656c1328ea3724dec80d10dff96 w/memory expansion and extra pedal. Mint condition, packed in original box with manual, Lexicon sticker, cables, etc.. $500 + shipping charges email me or call: 770-867-8957 before 4pm, EST Adam Nitti ajnitti@atl.mindspring.com http://www.hidwater.com/nitti/ From ???@??? Thu Feb 05 10:22:49 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 5 07:06:28 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0Ssk-0005Ql-00; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 07:06:26 -0800 From: KULTBOX@aol.com Message-ID: <6e919874.34d9cee5@aol.com> Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 09:38:27 EST To: andre@monmouth.com, Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Is mackie Tapco today??? Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 51 Resent-Message-ID: <"GeevnD.A.L0E.XTd20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2924 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 07:06:26 -0800 X-UIDL: 4376da76005b91193134d80b02cb3c59 In a message dated 98-02-04 21:46:35 EST, andre@monmouth.com writes: << can anyone yay/nay this????? is mackie tapco ?? >> yes it is From ???@??? Fri Feb 06 01:22:48 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 5 12:07:55 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0XaM-0001lK-00; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 12:07:46 -0800 Message-ID: <34D9D563.6B48@nyfac.com> Date: Thu, 05 Feb 1998 15:06:11 +0000 From: tbajus Reply-To: nyfac2@nyfac.com X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (WinNT; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Pivotal loop moments, or, when did you realize your compulsive need to aquire toys had reached dangerous levels? References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"tR6JWD.A.gz.qph20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2949 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 12:07:46 -0800 X-UIDL: 5920a9bc768e3a2fb4c9a7156b85e651 Anybody want to share a few moments that made them realize that they had no alternative other than to become a loopster? Or shining moments? I can't figure out when I started. I can say that I had the realization that I was a loopster when I was reading a description of this newfangled product called the JamMan. Reading that ad made me think, haven't I been doing sort of a halfassed version of this for a while now, and realized I had better go for at least another quarter of an ass. I put off the purchase of this box for a very long time, untill I struck up a conversation with a young lad who had an echoplex, and said he'd heard about some wacky mailing list... Somewhere after the beginning and before the end of the aforementioned saga, I remember seeing Yo La Tengo, and watching Ira Kaplan split his signal with an ABY box, sending a loop of an Emaj chord into a battered Fender Deluxe, with the tremelo set on stun, and noodling over it using another amp. That moment, as much as anything, cemented my resolve to get one of those there boxes. Trevor From ???@??? Thu Feb 05 10:22:55 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 5 07:18:45 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0T4b-0006jH-00; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 07:18:41 -0800 Message-Id: <199802051513.KAA30666@mail.colba.net> From: "Julia & Dave" To: Subject: Re: sampling rights Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 10:15:25 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1161 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"ICfDV.A.B-F.aed20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2925 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 07:18:41 -0800 X-UIDL: 180136ef808ffac4bcf4d35fc2191ddf ---------- > From: Kim Flint > To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com > Cc: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com > Subject: Re: sampling rights > Date: Thursday, February 05, 1998 2:29 AM, Kim Flint wrote: > Many people who use lots of samples blatently ignore this, however. It's > part of the culture of some scenes to take the samples without permission. > This is now so common that most seem to get away with it. The risk is up to > you I guess. > > kim Well, As a victim of sampling (three incidents so far), I've learnt to be more vigilant. Of course, the people who have sampled my stuff are creative, and I believe they were using my material as a quote rather than as a crucial element in their music. In the past, I've done the same, "quoting" jazz pieces from the 1930s etc. Let's face it, If you absolutely have to have that sound, and you'd have to recreate the circumstances, technological limitations and general atmosphere that was when, you would either have to be able to move time and space, or give up entirely. On the other hand, If I catch anyone using my music as a basis for a piece, and feel they would not be able to create anything of equal value on their own, I will get a lawyer on the case. It has become quite trendy to pilfer from other people's music to make your own. When I got my first sampler back in the mid-eighties, I was concerned with finding sounds from the real world to put to unreal use, not shopping for records I could steal from. When the world ran out of sounds, I sold the sampler and moved on to synthesis. Looping is the best form of sampling. You sample yourself. When everything has been sampled, and people have to sample samples of samples, I'm sure they'll have to come up with a new way for slackers to make music. BTW, Oswald is an Artist, not a thief. The same goes for Negativland. They were quoting, not stealing. Hope I'm making sense. I've only had one coffee this morning. ;) D 4 V 1 D K R 1 5 T 1 4 N --------------------------------------------- jndk@colba.net http://www.alien8recordings.com > ________________________________________________________ > Kim Flint 408-752-9284 > Mpact System Engineering kflint@chromatic.com > Chromatic Research http://www.chromatic.com > From ???@??? Thu Feb 05 10:23:00 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 5 07:24:54 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0TAV-0007XJ-00; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 07:24:47 -0800 Message-Id: <1.5.4.32.19980205151937.00680ea0@tiac.net> X-Sender: rphunt@tiac.net X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 05 Feb 1998 10:19:37 -0500 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Reginald Hunt Subject: Re: forefront etc... Resent-Message-ID: <"hrY7L.A.GkG.Jjd20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2926 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 07:24:47 -0800 X-UIDL: 3450fc8839b216f56ad2d659134a8e31 >>I've been looping since about 1983, and one thing I've seen consistently is >>the short attention spans manufacturers have for the subject. They dabble in >>long delay times, find it is not yet the market they want, then lose >>interest (Lexicon, Ibanez, Digitech, for example). > >They dabbled in these products and nobody bought them..... That's basically what I said. I'm only noting what I've seen. I don't condemn a company for what they consider a good marketing decision. This isn't about good guys and bad guys. >>If Oberhiem starts designing their delay units strictly for the >>sampling/dance market, then the rest of the Looper world will once again be >>stranded. Of course, that's business. > >I don't understand why you see these as mutually exclusive goals. Could you >elaborate on that? To me they merge together quite well, with features from >either side being attractive to the other. Personally I don't see them as mutually exclusive. But once a manufacturer starts to aim at a particular market, the focus of a product can become extremely narrow. But, from your comments here, I'm encouraged that it may not happen in this case. >To me, drawing such arbitrary distictions between ourselves usually has a >lot more to do with human arrogance and ego than anything else. We agonize >over subtle differences of detail, just to prove we are not one of "them." >We fear some association with the "wrong" crowd. My experience is that these >walls harmed me more than they ever helped. The fear just keeps me shrouded >in ignorance. The best things that ever happen to me come from finding the >common ground and learning to understand and love the differences. I like to >encourage that attitude here. The diversity on Looper's Delight will >regularly surprise you, so enjoy it! All distinctions are arbitrary (Zen speaking). But are necessary to function. I've spent energy on this list myself responding to the Fripp/drone-guitar/ambient-bashing I've seen here. I do enjoy the various attitudes here, but that doesn't mean I'll leave them untouched. >And it's certainly not good business to draw such boundaries and >distinctions; you sell far more product by finding commonalities and joining >markets together, not carving them up! Actually, often it is good business. Specializing can be crucial to suiccess if not survival. Again, I'm not for or against this. I'm mentioning what I've seen, and expressing concern over its effects. Reg From ???@??? Thu Feb 05 10:23:03 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 5 07:27:59 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0TDX-0000CH-00; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 07:27:55 -0800 Message-Id: <1.5.4.32.19980205152133.0067b6a8@tiac.net> X-Sender: rphunt@tiac.net X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 05 Feb 1998 10:21:33 -0500 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Reginald Hunt Subject: Re: Bitchery vs. Fair Comment Resent-Message-ID: <"r8151.A.byG.6kd20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2927 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 07:27:55 -0800 X-UIDL: dfe587b5f7d262e63d22579df60bc9cd No offense taken. Reg At 02:46 AM 2/5/98 -0500, you wrote: > No offense, but would you please keep your scuzzy ideas to yourself!!! > > > > > > From ???@??? Thu Feb 05 10:23:05 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 5 07:33:38 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0TJ0-0000ry-00; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 07:33:34 -0800 Message-ID: <01BD3221.7BC8D1F0@TD-300> From: jprice@intcpi.com (John Price) To: "'Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com'" Subject: RE: Who's on the forefront of loopmuse? Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 10:33:16 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="---- =_NextPart_000_01BD3221.7BD1F9B0" Resent-Message-ID: <"_SyHED.A.nc.Hsd20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2928 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 07:33:34 -0800 X-UIDL: b3809cf80acde88d00dccbef15107fd9 Ultra Urban, Groove - Pop - Stuff It aint Prodigy nor is it Photek and its not Babyface. It walks a lot of lines but its more a less quirky & groove oriented PoP >from an African American Perspective that's perhaps more flexible than folks might initially imagine. My group is called Akash - just me and whoever I can get to collaborate. I live in Downtown Philly. I play guitar, bass and some keys. but Im more of a beat Looper and arranger more than anything else these days. I run an ASR 10 w/ 16megs ram 273 seconnds of sample time !! More than I ever end up using !! The ASR has a lot of Great and edit friendly effects builtin too - just no rom based samples. I usually make my own samples from either the guitar & bass that I run thru 2 Zooms MEP's - the 505 w/vol/exp controller and the 508 w/ a stereo split sent to a Mackie 1202 then rerun thru a Boss Rack Mount Delay that I cant seem to remember the name of... The DE 2 or somethin ??? I pull WAV files of the Net from free dwnload sites for other preset tones. I have not really had the need to steal beats or use Sample Disc's. ( Though Im in no ways against doing that - its fun to try and create or duplicate a sound you like on your own because often it takes you and your music in a different direction than what it initially was you thought you needed. Often times I come up with sounds I like better than the one I wanted to sample - Its just very time consuming but worth every ounce of scrutiny ya put into it ) I do ok with the rythms (spelling?? ) I make just sequencing them as I go along and Loooping them endlessly at some points adding effects or sometimes just going with a dry sound. I use Cakewalk as a Sequencer and record straight to hard disk. Ive been saving and dreaming of The VS-880 w/ cd burner and add on effects board . After taxes this yr one of those chumpys is gonna be in my hands. No amps, just PA Speakers ASR - It's a product more associated with DJ's than flesh and Blood musicians but They sound great ( They're not Ensoniq products) I try to keep things simple but expressive and groveful ( Mantra - All effort goes into da groove out of it and back again! ) and somewhat engaging from an hopefully original perspective. I also try to have a sense of restraint with just enuff room for chaos to sneak in every now and then. I always loved the Frippy Stuff, Crimson, ENO, Phillip Glass and Laurie Anderson along with LTD, Eath Wind and Fire and Weater Report and Mingus and The Sugarhill Gang - and The Sex Pistols Growing up in the 80's - it was all natural. I was drawn to the site for reasons concerning tech, Musical inspiration, expansion of influencesall across the board. I aint no star. The odds are agianst me in that area. But who says I cant do what I need to do and exist and perhaps thrive and enjoy life. That's what I do. JP -----Original Message----- From: Kim Flint [SMTP:kflint@annihilist.com] Sent: Thursday, February 05, 1998 5:18 AM To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: RE: Who's on the forefront of loopmuse? At 11:32 AM -0500 2/4/98, John Price wrote: >I kinda until like, maybe 3mos ago perceived this site as a home for >classic loopers. > >Clearly, its more diverse than that. But I did think at first that >everyone was either a guitar player or a violinist or an Analog Synth >Looper doin the Ambient thang. ( Nothin wrong with any of that ) > >Assumptions are always fatal. hey, what sorts of things do you do? kim ______________________________________________________________________ Kim Flint | Looper's Delight kflint@annihilist.com | http://www.annihilist.com/loop/loop.html http://www.annihilist.com/ | Loopers-Delight-request@annihilist.com From ???@??? Thu Feb 05 10:23:11 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 5 07:43:49 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0TSr-0001qy-00; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 07:43:45 -0800 Message-ID: <01BD3222.F52D8580@TD-300> From: jprice@intcpi.com (John Price) To: "'Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com'" Subject: RE: Bitchery vs. Fair Comment Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 10:43:52 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="---- =_NextPart_000_01BD3222.F562ED60" Resent-Message-ID: <"I5d1yD.A.EaB.91d20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2929 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 07:43:45 -0800 X-UIDL: 2d27a89f07ecba562153400118e07c3b Humor is intrepreted in a number of ways and sometimes it can be perceived in ways that make others uncomfortable or irritated. Sex is a very personal and hot button topic that upon reflection is most appropriately left out of this list. My appologies to Goddess. JP -----Original Message----- From: Goddess [SMTP:Thefates@CONCENTRIC.NET] Sent: Thursday, February 05, 1998 2:46 AM To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Bitchery vs. Fair Comment No offense, but would you please keep your scuzzy ideas to yourself!!! From ???@??? Fri Feb 06 01:23:19 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 5 13:18:03 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0YgJ-0002hU-00; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 13:17:59 -0800 From: Edward_Chang@mail.amsinc.com Date: Thu, 05 Feb 98 10:50:00 est Encoding: 10 Text Message-Id: <9801058867.AA886721498@mail.amsinc.com> To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: thanks for the sampling advice Resent-Message-ID: <"DVCazB.A.I0B.Hsi20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2955 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 13:17:59 -0800 X-UIDL: 9378b9beb7af979b71ae1cd80b402ffc Thanks for the advice on sampling rights all. After considering your esteemed opinions I think I'll probably end up substituting the sampled works with samples of home recordings of myself playing bad versions of the artists I want to sample. How hard can it be to fake George Winston? My Bing Crosby impression however will definitely be something along the lines of "unrecognizable". ed From ???@??? Thu Feb 05 10:23:15 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 5 07:56:39 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0TfJ-000387-00; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 07:56:37 -0800 From: ZeplinSoup@aol.com Message-ID: <3e30096c.34d9e01b@aol.com> Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 10:51:53 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Oh ye of non monotone-drone loops.. Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 16-bit for Windows sub 64 Resent-Message-ID: <"ujK5tB.A.9iC.3Be20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2930 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 07:56:37 -0800 X-UIDL: f96b7d9068312e408672c5b402bb0f10 techniques to solve this???.. smooth transition between different loops with respect to harmony,making it interesting and nondronal is kinda tricky no?feedback control and mixer faders help but what other ways too?in particular with the jambird... Shoot the moon! Reeve From ???@??? Thu Feb 05 10:23:17 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 5 08:07:14 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0TpW-0004Ac-00; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 08:07:10 -0800 From: ZeplinSoup@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 11:02:40 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Bitchery vs. Fair Comment Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 16-bit for Windows sub 64 Resent-Message-ID: <"QJSADC.A.wkD.1Le20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2931 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 08:07:10 -0800 X-UIDL: 85a09e5bfbf07235c8ce4a2bcf158667 JP-- whoops...I certainly didnot mean to offend anyone.with that comment..if I did I am sorry.you can tie me to a post and beat me.My type of humor is very verbal,playing off of words,I like assonance(I guess im a smart ass).I am also very impulsive and tend to say or do things without thinking about the consequences.this has gotten me in trouble before many many times .but if your wheels were bent so far out of shape that your little buggy wont ride no more then mabey you are taking things a little to seriously and should lighten up a bit.humor makes the world more bearable to me(not as much as music) From ???@??? Thu Feb 05 10:23:28 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 5 08:24:29 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0U6F-0005pw-00; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 08:24:27 -0800 Message-ID: <01BD3228.5BE532F0@TD-300> From: jprice@intcpi.com (John Price) To: "'Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com'" Subject: RE: Bitchery vs. Fair Comment Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 11:22:34 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="---- =_NextPart_000_01BD3228.5BF7A980" Resent-Message-ID: <"64negC.A.r2E.Kae20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2932 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 08:24:27 -0800 X-UIDL: 29a5521482e4e94d18e8f5b40759840d No No No. I was referring to my initial reference to you Ms. know who of the mid - late 80's that seemed to be the origin of what offended Goddess. I was apologizing to Goddess and anyone else who may have taken offense as opposed to chastising you. -----Original Message----- From: ZeplinSoup@aol.com [SMTP:ZeplinSoup@aol.com] Sent: Thursday, February 05, 1998 11:03 AM To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Bitchery vs. Fair Comment JP-- whoops...I certainly didnot mean to offend anyone.with that comment..if I did I am sorry.you can tie me to a post and beat me.My type of humor is very verbal,playing off of words,I like assonance(I guess im a smart ass).I am also very impulsive and tend to say or do things without thinking about the consequences.this has gotten me in trouble before many many times .but if your wheels were bent so far out of shape that your little buggy wont ride no more then mabey you are taking things a little to seriously and should lighten up a bit.humor makes the world more bearable to me(not as much as music) From ???@??? Thu Feb 05 10:23:33 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 5 08:31:42 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0UDD-0006qU-00; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 08:31:39 -0800 Message-Id: <199802051625.LAA06721@shell.monmouth.com> Reply-To: From: "andre" To: Subject: Re: Clarification... Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 11:25:03 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1162 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"C4o9FB.A.NoF.2fe20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2933 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 08:31:39 -0800 X-UIDL: b945024867e59e5375906c26dca05c35 welcome to another aspect of the crazy BOYWORLD, goddess. every day i cringe but- i'm sorry - what can ya do...? andre@monmouth.com ---------- > From: Goddess > To: loopers-delight@annihilist.com > Subject: Clarification... > Date: Thursday, February 05, 1998 3:04 AM > > I aught to have mentioned that my last msg just now was meant for > Zepplin Soup and that assinine msg concerning Christy Canyon... > > From ???@??? Thu Feb 05 10:23:35 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 5 08:36:27 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0UHo-0007Sg-00; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 08:36:24 -0800 Message-Id: <199802051629.LAA08388@shell.monmouth.com> Reply-To: From: "andre" To: Subject: Re: Sound of Voices /ham radio etc Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 11:29:32 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1162 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"g3Z4sD.A.DNG.Gke20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2934 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 08:36:24 -0800 X-UIDL: 49b3cf7b2447a99b3f6c14405ea9fd10 using shortwave bites: i love this approach too - how weird - just yesterday i started hunting up a power supply for this am/tv/shortwave radio i have - so i could splice stuff into my loops. sometimes i sample stuff from am radio - i just input to the sample (old mirage) and load away, without hearing what i've tuned in - it's always a riot what ends up getting caught. i have some old vinyl record by Holger Czukay - anyone remember CAN , the seminal experimental german group?? he used a lot of live Ham/shortwave radio on his records/live shows. andre" andre@monmouth.com ------- From ???@??? Thu Feb 05 10:23:38 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 5 08:45:01 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0UQ6-0000gn-00; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 08:44:58 -0800 Message-Id: <199802051640.LAA13079@shell.monmouth.com> Reply-To: From: "andre" To: Subject: Re: question... Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 11:40:31 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1162 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"AZoY4D.A.uK.Tue20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2935 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 08:44:58 -0800 X-UIDL: 6fb71dba29ff7da73836392aeada6515 > From: Goddess > To: loopers-delight@annihilist.com > Subject: question... > Date: Thursday, February 05, 1998 4:27 AM > > This question has been a curiousity of mine for a while now, and as the > conversation here lately has been concerned with people's feelings about > Robert Fripp which seem to be mostly negative, I thought this would be a > good place to ask it. > > What is it concerning him that seems to upset people so? i for one love the guy immensely - over half of my 33 years have been greatly brightened by Crimson (now playing: larks tongues) and various frippery, on record and onstage. But, i must say -for me - the 10% of animus i have for RF is ONLY for the extreme hangup about pictures, bootlegs, people not dancing when he does 'dance music', etc. Or, as someone recently posted- lecturing for 30mins or more on the "audience's responsibilities"- He needs to chill out. OK, maybe lets not use flash cameras. that's understandable to a degree. But - to leave the stage in a huff - as he reportedly did in early dec in London (ProjeKt OnE concert) - is a stretch. You're in the rock world, you're in the public, these are the trade-offs. simple. it's not like people throw bottles or spit at him, or yell 'freebird'. And bootlegs?? Only the people who fanatically follow an artist even wnat these things. So - they've already bought all the CDs, go to all the shows. Relax. It hasn't hurt Phish or the Dead to encourage taping. In fact - i firmly believe it helps, since people have a cheap way to turn tons of people on to this new music. I love his eccentric, english humour, and dry wit when writing. and he has been so instrumental in helping to get 'art music' respected and taken as seriously as other 'high brow' forms of human expression. Hats off to Fripp, but i hope he mellows out one day. There's a trade-off when you want to be a public figure, and i fear he will never be at peace with the randomness that brings. my $0.08 andre' From ???@??? Thu Feb 05 10:23:46 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 5 09:01:50 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0UgI-0002w8-00; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 09:01:42 -0800 From: ZeplinSoup@aol.com Message-ID: <571a2c61.34d9ee96@aol.com> Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 11:53:40 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Bitchery vs. Fair Comment Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 16-bit for Windows sub 64 Resent-Message-ID: <"FIYFzC.A.y5B.07e20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2937 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 09:01:42 -0800 X-UIDL: 3725b08d14dfd7facdbfa97ff6176bff oh silly me hardee harr harr Still I offer this challenge: can you think of any reason why we should take life seriously? someone up there has a sense of humor! From ???@??? Thu Feb 05 10:23:57 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 5 09:34:33 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0VBy-0007CZ-00; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 09:34:26 -0800 Message-Id: <199802051708.KAA11908@hyper.dimensional.com> From: "Scott Bullerwell" To: Subject: Re: converters Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 10:02:33 -0700 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"PZnsAB.A.JzF.NZf20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2942 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 09:34:26 -0800 X-UIDL: 2b76f48682a639cf5a7e1baf1849f3c8 Yeah, it's called the Alesis BRC and it's the size of a mobile home. Well, not quite--but it's big. Another gizmo that can in theory do this is the latest version of the E-mu Darwin, assuming it's not vaporware. Scott Bullerwell tanelorn@dimensional.com Boulder, Colorado, USA ---------- > From: Matt McCabe > To: Loop List > Subject: converters > Date: Wednesday, February 04, 1998 14:24 > > I'm looking for an ADAT Light Pipe to S/PDIF converter. Do they exist? > > Thanks....now back to the loops! > > Matt > > From ???@??? Thu Feb 05 10:23:50 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 5 09:15:23 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0UtP-0004jd-00; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 09:15:15 -0800 Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 12:04:17 -0500 (EST) From: Nick Ring X-Sender: nick@plato To: andre cc: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Sound of Voices /ham radio etc In-Reply-To: <199802051629.LAA08388@shell.monmouth.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Resent-Message-ID: <"e3JrrC.A.zOD.UFf20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2939 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 09:15:15 -0800 X-UIDL: adede0de0fa002994439655b882765f9 On Thu, 5 Feb 1998, andre wrote: > i have some old vinyl record by Holger Czukay - anyone remember CAN , the > seminal experimental german group?? he used a lot of live Ham/shortwave > radio on his records/live shows. Ah, Can is crucial and far from forgotten. There seems to have been an audience revival of sorts over the last couple of years. Can is certainly one of my favorite musical groups. No colour. Their take on minimalism for a full-out sound is pretty great. Not a surprise that two of them were stockhausen-trained (bringing in great experimentalism with shortwave radio and an outthere musical comprehension). The only Holger Czukay record I have is Der Osten Ist Rot, but that has some nifty ham moments. not quite coherent today, nick From ???@??? Thu Feb 05 10:23:49 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 5 09:15:14 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0UtH-0004iT-00; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 09:15:07 -0800 Message-Id: <3.0.1.32.19980205180520.00c8ae78@pop.stud.ntnu.no> X-Sender: eriklj@pop.stud.ntnu.no X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (32) Date: Thu, 05 Feb 1998 18:05:20 +0100 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: eriklj@stud.ntnu.no Subject: Modern composers and "techno" artists Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"PlFQ3B.A.XQD.eFf20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2940 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 09:15:07 -0800 X-UIDL: 0d516b651d0896ab1df71a19f709bc88 Andre LaFosse wrote: >I actually saw a very amusing article in a mag a few months ago (I think >it was _Option_) in which a reporter played Phillip Glass a number of >CDs by the likes of Orbital, Underworld, Mu-Ziq, and others to gauge his >reaction. Some funny stuff in there... Also, at http://www.jimstonebraker.com/ksadvice.html there is an interview with Karlheinz Stockhausen, were he is introduced and gives his opinion to the music of Aphex Twin, Plastikman, Scanner and Daniel Pemberton. Somewhere in the interview Stockhausen describes the technique of looping as being "too old fashioned", and Daniel Pemberton gets a little embarraced about it and blames his use of it on lack of equipment...Interesting reading, although it may not be politically correct as far as this list goes. Have yet to see a post discussing the limitations of looping. Anyway, read and enjoy. Later, Erik Ljones (Norway) From ???@??? Thu Feb 05 10:23:58 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 5 09:58:13 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0VYp-00029b-00; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 09:58:03 -0800 From: KULTBOX@aol.com Message-ID: <6322a30a.34d9f4eb@aol.com> Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 12:20:41 EST To: nyfac2@nyfac.com, Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: sampling rights Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 51 Resent-Message-ID: <"75EtnC.A.W9.Fvf20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2943 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 09:58:03 -0800 X-UIDL: ca15bcb3328faa4131957bcce24e908b In a message dated 98-02-05 12:11:25 EST, you write: << How do you spell Puff Daddy? Has he been given credibility because of his bullshit 'from the street' posture? >> sice when is sean combs from the street? he bills himself as a savey business man.... why he is not stealing? cuz he is making people like STING some big money...he get permission to use the hook...the team's up with the artist..and they both cash in bigtime.......im not a big fan of this..but what u gonna do...he even makes it a point to say in one of his songs..somthing like...."i take hits from the 80's and turn them into hits for the 90's..., or some shit...like that.... BTW ....commercial muzik still suks.... and "F" puff daddy........but he had a master plan....and hes laffin all t he way 2 the bank......... just distort and twist yer loops enuff when u sample em and youll never get caught..........or just get the rights to do it,,,, robbi rob kultbox records chicago From ???@??? Thu Feb 05 10:23:52 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 5 09:30:49 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0V8O-0006i9-00; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 09:30:44 -0800 Message-Id: <199802051722.MAA00189@shell.monmouth.com> Reply-To: From: "andre" To: , Subject: Re: sampling rights Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 12:22:44 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1162 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"v3LC7.A.yYF.QWf20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2941 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 09:30:44 -0800 X-UIDL: a0ffbc0e7a9e91ae92ddd67d91e4be9f > PE, where are you? > > > Trevor Bajus the good news is - public enemy ( all the original dudes, flav, chuck, terminator, prof) have reunited for amongst other things, a spike lee soundtrack.....can't wait - lets get back to some hip -hop with a brain - some actual topics that matter - not blatant disrespect and violence ( to be fair, there also is a lot of smart rap out there now, just not the charting stuff) andre' > From ???@??? Fri Feb 06 01:24:07 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 5 15:56:28 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0b9a-0005Oi-00; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 15:56:22 -0800 Message-Id: <199802052335.PAA26974@scv3.apple.com> Subject: Re: Loop Definition? Date: Thu, 5 Feb 98 17:36:14 -0000 x-sender: hartne.t@mail.apple.com x-mailer: Claris Emailer 1.1 From: "T.W. Hartnett" To: "Looper's Delight" Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Resent-Message-ID: <"zNRkIC.A.TCE.K-k20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2964 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 15:56:22 -0800 X-UIDL: 4eef3ff7d3640979c66b429534526379 > I was wondering if anyone had a good definition of 'looping' for the >civilians out there. I'm talking about a concise explanation for people who >do not know what 'sampling' or 'multitrack recording' is. It is difficult >enough explaining to musicians who do not understand where all the sound is >coming from, much less someone who knows nothing of music technology as a >whole. I always liked the definition that Torn used in his video tapes: "real-time interactive multitrack recording sessions with myself". I don't think of sample triggering as Looping, or repeating drum-machine phrases/samples as Looping--they may be "looping", but without the interactive aspect, it's something different to me. Travis Hartnett From ???@??? Thu Feb 05 11:24:07 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 5 10:45:34 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0WIe-0007dS-00; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 10:45:24 -0800 Message-ID: Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 17:43:30 +0000 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: babs Subject: Re: Mir conversations In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Turnpike Trial Version 3.03a Resent-Message-ID: <"SG13o.A.diG._dg20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2945 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 10:45:24 -0800 X-UIDL: c1d2accf46d12e9bbde5554ff0638193 >sure,, >well on occasion when i have play live,(and record) i will bring along >scanning reciever, and i will scan the airwaves for communication (ie >airport traffic, mall security, cops etc,,,) i will come out an RCA on >the VHF reciever, to my jamman,,and then to my mixer(with effects loops >delays, backwards,,,you name it) in most cases the sample of >conversation (ie subject matter, emotions) actually affects the >composition ,,,and takes me in directions i might not if gone,,,(hope >this isnt confusing,,,im sleepy) This is very similar to the DJ 'Scanner' aka Robin Rimbaud who gained notoriety after taping a member of the Royal family's analogue cellphone conversation and using it on one of his records. Live he mixes radio traffic (mainly cell and portable phone conversations , the emphasis on communication and different emotions) with minimalist ambient samples, whilst a film is shown. He has a website but I can't remember the address offhand, but his work is really worth checking out. If you don't have a scanner,radio or poor wireless system :) to hand you can always hide a microphone somewhere to pick up and loop anything your audience is saying, hours of idle amusement and a great way to get less- than enthusiastic audience members to shut up... Babs From ???@??? Thu Feb 05 10:23:59 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 5 10:00:03 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0Vad-0002Pb-00; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 09:59:55 -0800 Message-ID: <01BD3235.2FBFDB00@TD-300> From: jprice@intcpi.com (John Price) To: "'Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com'" Subject: RE: Modern composers and "techno" artists Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 12:54:18 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="---- =_NextPart_000_01BD3235.2FCC1000" Resent-Message-ID: <"H4NBUD.A.HJB.Xwf20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2944 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 09:59:55 -0800 X-UIDL: b03954f10c2548e4a106851a131d8a10 Im deeply interested in how and if you can go from nothing to full blown dance/techno/house or whatever... grooves live and in real time. L -----Original Message----- From: eriklj@stud.ntnu.no [SMTP:eriklj@stud.ntnu.no] Sent: Thursday, February 05, 1998 12:05 PM To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Modern composers and "techno" artists Andre LaFosse wrote: >I actually saw a very amusing article in a mag a few months ago (I think >it was _Option_) in which a reporter played Phillip Glass a number of >CDs by the likes of Orbital, Underworld, Mu-Ziq, and others to gauge his >reaction. Some funny stuff in there... Also, at http://www.jimstonebraker.com/ksadvice.html there is an interview with Karlheinz Stockhausen, were he is introduced and gives his opinion to the music of Aphex Twin, Plastikman, Scanner and Daniel Pemberton. Somewhere in the interview Stockhausen describes the technique of looping as being "too old fashioned", and Daniel Pemberton gets a little embarraced about it and blames his use of it on lack of equipment...Interesting reading, although it may not be politically correct as far as this list goes. Have yet to see a post discussing the limitations of looping. Anyway, read and enjoy. Later, Erik Ljones (Norway) From ???@??? Fri Feb 06 01:24:24 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 5 16:42:57 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0bsb-00038t-00; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 16:42:53 -0800 Message-ID: <2148EC143F29D1118BE000805FC13CD01E1F64@migarexch01.maritz.com> From: "Liebig, Steuart A." To: "'Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com'" Subject: RE: Arcane Device Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 12:17:48 -0600 X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) Resent-Message-ID: <"h2hWcD.A.FTC.Btl20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2967 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 16:42:53 -0800 X-UIDL: 7416a07054c4e310ccc7a201c7c28dc5 Well . . . I like to be able to mess with the time, modulation capabilities, in addition to blend, etc. with my little hands. I guess that my feet and my head aren't as smart as my hands. That's for starters, I guess that I also have problems with the non-visual aspects of some of these gizmos too. Plus the rack thing . . . sometimes I look in these things and it seems like there's a lot of dead space filling up a 19-inch rack . . . how about a table-top version so I don't have to cut something up or dismantle it? > ---------- > From: Kim Flint > Reply To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com > Sent: Wednesday, February 4, 1998 7:56 PM > To: LiebigSA@maritz.com > Subject: RE: Arcane Device > > The echoplex has knobs for input volume, output volume, mix, and > feedback > control. (that's four!) With midi cc knobs, you can control feedback > (in > addition to the front) and loop out volume (=5!!). You can even plug a > pedal > in the back for feedback, loop out volume, or delay line in volume > (=6!!!). > There's not really any other parameter available where it would make > sense > to use a knob on it. Most people use the mix and feedback knobs all > the time > to control things. What else would you like knobs to do? > > oh, and everything can be controlled with your tappin' feet. > > kim > > At 01:09 PM 2/4/98 -0600, Liebig, Steuart A. wrote: > >Yes for knobs. > > > >Frankly, I'd be much more likely to want something like a JamMan or > >Oberheim 'Plex if they had knobs. Maybe it's the neo-Luddite in me, > but > >I prefer being able to manually adapt parameters (in addition to > foot > >control) to whatever is going on musically. Hence my fondness for the > EH > >16-second delay. This morning, I was lamenting the fact that > something > >like the 'Plex (which will obviously have superior sonic specs) isn't > >available with these features . . . and in a non-rack package. I'm > sick > >of racks and like to be able to just pull out a pedal . . . again a > >plus of the EH16. > > > ________________________________________________________ > Kim Flint 408-752-9284 > Mpact System Engineering kflint@chromatic.com > Chromatic Research http://www.chromatic.com > > From ???@??? Fri Feb 06 01:22:47 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 5 11:58:26 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0X6M-0005ky-00; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 11:36:46 -0800 X-Sender: kflint@pop.slip.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 10:44:56 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Kim Flint Subject: Re: PCM-42 upgrade Resent-Message-ID: <"_8GnkD.A.OzD.EHh20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2946 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 11:36:47 -0800 X-UIDL: 7b9cda4ddd5a7e11786683fc7ed8733b At 8:18 AM -0500 2/5/98, Richard Menger wrote: >Anyone know anywhere I can get more memory added to my PCM-42?...I'm dying >over here!!!! >Rich I think you want Bob Sellon, if he's still doing it. Bob, you listening? kim ______________________________________________________________________ Kim Flint | Looper's Delight kflint@annihilist.com | http://www.annihilist.com/loop/loop.html http://www.annihilist.com/ | Loopers-Delight-request@annihilist.com From ???@??? Fri Feb 06 01:24:28 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 5 17:12:24 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0cL5-0006wX-00; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 17:12:19 -0800 Message-Id: <199802060047.QAA16990@scv4.apple.com> Subject: Cutting edge looping technique, etc. Date: Thu, 5 Feb 98 18:48:11 -0000 x-sender: hartne.t@mail.apple.com x-mailer: Claris Emailer 1.1 From: "T.W. Hartnett" To: "Looper's Delight" Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Resent-Message-ID: <"Bpj4TD.A.-DF.bCm20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2971 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 17:12:19 -0800 X-UIDL: cd53e395c1d41ce12e77e4225a33e5fd >People bursting with creative expansion need many new >things to get them to new places. Huge, exciting challenges and >possibilities lie there, and that's what's likely to continue to push us. I'd love to hear about the cutting edge looping being done in the dance world, but all I've heard about is synchronized sampling and using a lot of effects. I don't see the dance world as having made much more forward progress than the guitar/ambient camp, which is just fine by me, as long as the outcome is interesting. The ability to trigger recorded and treated pieces of audio has been in place for over a decade, it's just cheaper and easier now, but the basic process seems the same. Dance wizards, please enlighten me. And as far as the "forefront of looping", I have to take my hat off to the Arkane Device guy. The description of the setup is some severely tripped-out damage. I MUST find some of that to listen to. Travis Hartnett From ???@??? Fri Feb 06 01:22:42 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 5 11:37:21 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0X6q-0005ot-00; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 11:37:16 -0800 X-Sender: kflint@pop.slip.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <01BD3230.AB1D8720@slip139-92-21-97.lo.uk.ibm.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 11:12:46 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Kim Flint Subject: Fripp's loop technique Resent-Message-ID: <"E_KNsD.A.zzD.HHh20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2947 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 11:37:16 -0800 X-UIDL: fa0c1f1da43c573b4ea5f9c279d1fee9 At 10:17 AM +0000 2/5/98, Brian Thomson, London UK wrote: >>another funny thing. People talk about Fripp on this list every now and >>then, but they almost never talk about what he actually does with looping. >I >>think I know more about his looping from talking to him directly about it >>than I ever learned from anybody here... > >When it comes pure Fripp looping-with-guitar, I swear by his "Bringing Down >The Light", the last track on the Sylvian/Fripp "First Day" album, and the >build-ups before his solos on Sylvian/Fripp's "Damage" live album. On both, >you can follow which notes he's playing when, to see how he got there - >which decreased my respect for him not one iota. ok, sure, I could add these to my mile long list of cds to buy. But the odds are sort of against any one item on that list actually getting into my cd collection, so it could be years before I actually get any of these. I guess what I'm really looking for is some deeper analysis of Fripp's use of looping. A lot of you seem to be very knowledgeable about him, so what can you teach me? What sort of approach does he take to loops? Does he have some typical processes or techniques? How do loops relate to his musical style? Is there some sort of purpose or underlying motivation in his use of looping? Has he developed his use of looping in any particular way over the years? Non-frippheads want to know.... kim ______________________________________________________________________ Kim Flint | Looper's Delight kflint@annihilist.com | http://www.annihilist.com/loop/loop.html http://www.annihilist.com/ | Loopers-Delight-request@annihilist.com From ???@??? Fri Feb 06 01:24:38 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 5 17:55:29 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0d0h-0004gP-00; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 17:55:19 -0800 Message-Id: <199802060113.RAA25234@scv2.apple.com> Subject: RE: looping as sin Date: Thu, 5 Feb 98 19:13:56 -0000 x-sender: hartne.t@mail.apple.com x-mailer: Claris Emailer 1.1 From: "T.W. Hartnett" To: "Looper's Delight" Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Resent-Message-ID: <"fqwu9D.A.z-C.Crm20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2976 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 17:55:19 -0800 X-UIDL: 283c9303e2ba4266d24f6291b91f49aa >If music is creative, it's creative . . . however if the MACHINE is >dictating the "music" ("playing IC chips"), and NOT the player. Then I >do have a problem. If the machine HINDERS or LIMITS flexibility or >musical decision-making I believe the tool is in charge and not the >operator. (Of course it is cool to react to what is being spit back at >you . . . lots of grey area here to be sure.) But whatever tool you're using, from a piano to an Echoplex, is going to provide limitations. I mean a piano has only 88 notes. Talk about the tool being in charge... "Limitations" can often just point you in different directions than you might have otherwise pursued... In a world where people can request 4-bit sampling as an option on the EDP, the definition of limitation becomes very elastic indeed. Travis Hartnett From ???@??? Fri Feb 06 01:22:43 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 5 11:37:30 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0X71-0005qX-00; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 11:37:27 -0800 X-Sender: kflint@pop.slip.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <0000A7DB.4007@poyry.com.br> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 11:21:24 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Kim Flint Subject: Re[2]: Arcane Device Resent-Message-ID: <"57RkaD.A.V0D.MHh20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2948 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 11:37:27 -0800 X-UIDL: 7a876b8f4ea2ae4eee81c1ebcd70c268 At 11:38 AM +0300 2/5/98, MAT wrote: >___________________________ Separador de Resposta >______________________________ > > >The echoplex has knobs for input volume, output volume, mix, and feedback >control. (that's four!) With midi cc knobs, you can control feedback (in >addition to the front) and loop out volume (=5!!). You can even plug a pedal >in the back for feedback, loop out volume, or delay line in volume (=6!!!). >There's not really any other parameter available where it would make sense to >use a knob on it. Most people use the mix and feedback knobs all the time to >control things. What else would you like knobs to do? > > >===> I would realy like to control delay time with a knob in any device (JM >or Plex) yeah, we know! :-) interesting problem, new technology comes along, making huge improvements in some ways and obsoleting the old stuff. But there's usually some characteristic of the old stuff that becomes very difficult in the new technology. And then you need a few more generations of new technology before you are able to do the old idea again. In this case, you used to be able to easily change the sample clock on A/D and D/A convertors, and they would be happy and nothing else in a simple delay system would get screwed up. Nowadays, the convertors give better audio but don't let you do that sample clock trick anymore, and other things in the system that need accurate timing (like midi) get screwed up. So for the echoplex and jamman, this sort of thing is impossible. So now you need to add a fair amount of dsp processing and more sophisticated real-time os techniques to be able to do what once just required a very cheap part. such is progress.... kim ______________________________________________________________________ Kim Flint | Looper's Delight kflint@annihilist.com | http://www.annihilist.com/loop/loop.html http://www.annihilist.com/ | Loopers-Delight-request@annihilist.com From ???@??? Fri Feb 06 01:24:27 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 5 17:02:58 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0cBp-0005jR-00; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 17:02:45 -0800 Message-ID: <2148EC143F29D1118BE000805FC13CD01E1F68@migarexch01.maritz.com> From: "Liebig, Steuart A." To: "'Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com'" Subject: RE: looping as sin Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 13:21:27 -0600 X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) Resent-Message-ID: <"ZPYHFB.A.ZTE.w8l20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2969 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 17:02:45 -0800 X-UIDL: 4f2662fa056cce3817a01fc783b617e6 FYI Apparently, I wasn't very clear in what I wanted to say. Solo Looping wasn't NECESSARILY the problem in my view: If music is creative, it's creative . . . however if the MACHINE is dictating the "music" ("playing IC chips"), and NOT the player. Then I do have a problem. If the machine HINDERS or LIMITS flexibility or musical decision-making I believe the tool is in charge and not the operator. (Of course it is cool to react to what is being spit back at you . . . lots of grey area here to be sure.) > ---------- > From: Reginald Hunt > Reply To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com > Sent: Wednesday, February 4, 1998 8:58 PM > To: LiebigSA@maritz.com > Subject: RE: looping as sin > > The remark. The writer was stating that solo looping was not music. > > Reg > > > At 11:32 AM 2/4/98 -0600, you wrote: > >Was it the comment, or the syndrome that was pitiful? > > > >> ---------- > >> From: Reginald Hunt > >> Reply To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com > >> Sent: Tuesday, February 3, 1998 10:18 PM > >> To: LiebigSA@maritz.com > >> Subject: Re: looping as sin > >> > >> Come on let's face it. Just like any other subject, there are some > >> folks > >> concerned more with the technology than what it produces. We need > >> people > >> like that, but we can't evaluate performers strictly by their > degree > >> of > >> technological innovation (which I've seen done here). > >> > >> Yes, the remark about playing ICs when looping is used by itself > was > >> pitiful. > > From ???@??? Fri Feb 06 01:22:55 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 5 12:27:22 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0Xt5-00049Z-00; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 12:27:07 -0800 From: Texture444@aol.com Message-ID: <7ee515eb.34da19b5@aol.com> Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 14:57:34 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: backporch of looping (was: forefront) Content-type: text/plain X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 84 Resent-Message-ID: <"pus0n.A.MLC.D1h20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2952 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 12:27:07 -0800 X-UIDL: bd5ddd62a58f54a595719c38dc1b5fd4 kim, since your (and matthias') thoughts are extremely important to me in my looping life, i'd like to weave a bit of potentially pointless blather raving into this thread, for a brief minute..... dt kflint said: >I tend to agree with this, although it's not always so lowbrow as you might >think. A lot of that is a bit of a pose, and often times the people behind >it are very sophisticated musicians. >The possibilities for innovation and >creativity are huge, and a lot of talented people have moved in that >direction to take advantage of it. Andre did a nice job of commenting on >that, no need for me to add anything there. >The dance/electronic/hip-hop/etc. scene is definitely where I see all the >innovation in looping as a method, as a process, as a tool, as a type of >music. I see people there constantly pushing to evolve things and do >something different, move it to the next level. The musicians, the audience, >the dj's, and the press all seem to support and encourage that, it's >ingrained in the scene in an interesting and healthy way. Loop concepts grow >by leaps and bounds there. >Another spot of innovation would be the solo instrumentalists, integrating >loops into compositions and performances in interesting new ways, expanding >their reach. I think you see that here in the many people looping with >fingerstyle guitar, or cello, or voice. Probably there are innovative things >happening in the academic/high-brow world, but I just don't follow that >enough to know. >Where I don't see much innovation with looping is in the droney guitar loop >scene, the stuff often associated with Fripp. The music may continue to be >vital and interesting, but the use of loops is pretty stagnant and >complacent. Sorry, but I just don't see anyone pushing the looping process >anywhere in that scene. (although it's possible that I just go so bored with >it I stopped paying attention.) >For me as a developer of loop devices, it is definitely the dance producers >who are driving things. They are the ones forcing the innovation in tools >and driving us with a constant flow of ideas. Trying to understand, meet, >and anticipate their needs so that a looping device might be an effective >instrument in that world is a very tough challenge! And the possibilities >are so huge and fresh, along with the sheer volume of creativity, that the >challenge is really quite exciting and fun. You really get the feeling that >when a new feature is introduced, someone will jump on it and do something >remarkable. >With the droney guitar loop crowd, most of the push is to get one box that >does all the things that different boxes available 10-20 years ago did. And >that's certainly reasonable, but it's not exactly breaking new ground. You >give them something new and they barely notice, maybe getting around to it >after a few years. (and in 15 years they will just be demanding that feature >in any new device!) >anyway, that's my take. >kim well: i hope i understand some of yer frustrations as a developer and list- maintainer/moderator. (mostly, ya know, i lurk, here: i usually mass-dispense w/the reading of any posts that compare/gossip about/overfocus upon/weigh/ any particular artists' "value to culture", and look desperately for positing forwards of the list-folks' creative "ideas", and technical/artistic problem- solving): anyway, i might comment thusly: 1) for the purpose of discussion, i gotta state that methinks there's nothing intrinsically "wrong" w/"droney guitar loop" music, as there's nothing intrinsically "wrong" w/not being attached to pushing "the forefront" of *any* kinda music nor technology, as there's nothing intrinsically "wrong" w/the lack of desire and/or *ability* to push that "forefront", as there's nothing intrinsically "wrong" w/boredom; me, i listen to whatever music has the power to transform my day, which is sometimes independent of my often virulent "need for *the new*": sometimes not. ya know, like: sam barber & jon hassell & g.s. sachdev & howlin' wolf & arvo part & jobim & john adams & steve gorn & qawwali & terry riley & chris whitley, ronnysides, we, the i.s. picklz, spooky, t. singh, main, tricky, kevin shields, disposable heroes, bjork, khol nayak, ry cooder, thomas newman, etc. and, technologically: an optigan is a terrible thing to waste, as are the oud, the national resonator guitar, a '60 alfa spider giulietta, a G3 mac, working isdn lines & toshiba librettos! that being said: 2) me, too!, re: yer enthusiasm for past, current & potential loop-activity in the "dance" scene: some great things afoot, w/brilliant things to come. (probably from one of my kids, who's deep inside nyc's trip-hop & battle scenes.) 8-)) but: (my big 'but', as it were): on the "droney guitar loop crowd" -(which, for better or worse, i do *not* consider myself to belong to, as i've never belonged to any crowd, butcept the crowd of beings struggling for happiness, dontcha know)- as it relates to furthering your (& other designer's) creative motivation for looping instrument design: 3) a) not barring that heady thrust for "the new", i think that a minor design error can be made when discarding the old (loop-)farts' desires to incorporate 20-year-old features into a new instrument; firstly, because its likely that those features may have some actual *musical* value; secondly, because those self-same features can certainly afford to be "modernised"/expanded upon; and thirdly, given the sometimes-slow (but, incessant) proclivity towards creative expansion in human nature, its fair to assume that said features -as they are- have *not yet been mined to their fullest depth*. b) as a mini-side-note to a), i've noticed a vaguely similar type of chrono- myopia in the musicians' world: futurist-espousing guitarists, illbient, trip- hop & ambient whatevers etc., uninquiringly-and, maybe even disrespectfully, by default, if you will- ignorant of the historical/cultural continuum of musical/artistic ideas that, even subconsciously, may have at least *led* us to our current 'new' genres. honestly, i feel -and constantly battle- this nearsighted tendency in my own small self..... 4) while i'm not sufficiently aware of the kinds of creative design demands that the dance scene presents you w/as challenging, i feel compelled (for some probably egoistic horrid reason) to outline some of *my* frustrations as a looper, over these past xx years (but, specifically, since 1981). however, i should preface this all w/a personal pointed statement of my honest & extreme support: in the summer of '97, when i received the Loop 5.0 software for the EDP and after i had the foot-console's broken plastic switches replaced w/heavy-duty steel ones, i finally started to use the damned EDP *regularly*. (the jamman has been replaced, and for good reason; it's now just an additional unit: an assistant: the loop support team: sideman nŽe jamman). Loop 5.0 addressed the most damaging myriad bugs/weirdnesses (that previously had made the EDP just a wonderful promise to me), including all kindsa seemingly random cliks'n'pops & (unusable) glop in the audio: how?, i don't know: but: thanks: really: my sincerest gratitude goes to y'all for your (& matthias' & oberheim's) considerable perseverance & fortitude. this *is* my endorsement of the deep, deep EDP w/Loop 5.0., (but *not* of the user's manual!), for what its worth..... my further comments about what i've been trying to get *anybody* to build into a looping instrument- for years- should not be construed as negating the real value of an EDP w/Loop 5.0 (excluding that user's manual). so. back in '85 ('86?, '84?), gary hall & i had some meetings w/a slew of lexicon executives, re: looping's future (new methods for triggering/storage/manipulation), effects, etc. one of the main things that i brought into (and carried out of) this discussion was a focus on turning looping into an actual instrument. so, what do the more socially acceptable instruments have, that loopers lack? among other things: a physical/visceral/visual "interface"; footpedals & front panels just don't cut it. there remains ample reason to allow for the inclusion of some type of external controls attached to a looping instrument in order to provide the player (!and their audience!) w/ some physical correlation between what is *played/manipulated* by the player & what is *heard* by all: the value of this physical ãcontrol surfaceä can't be over-estimated, as it seems truly part & parcel of what distinguishes any instrument as an obvious *instrument for expression*, regardless of the resulting musical "idiom". me: i like to *see* the dj *feel* what he's fucking with, i like to *feel* (by proxy) the guitarist destroy his shit. (as a sidenote: witness roland's promising inclusion of a coupla dimension light-beams, as configurable controllers, on 2 of their new products aimed at the dance marketplace)! anyway: back to that meeting: i also noted that synths & samplers had storage/future playback: computers had storage: loopers did not. synths & samplers had audio mangling: loopers did not. anyway: lexicon let everything that we discussed (so earnestly, it seemed!) slide by, insofar as i know, until lex employees bob sellon & joe waltz developed the jamman *on their own time*, in the 90's. also: c. '87-'88 (?), antony widoff & i (w/a young, brilliant hardware engr., whose name i, unfortunately, can't remember) started working on "The Fly" for intelligent music. the fly was my idea of a looper: not necessarily highest audio quality (but w/a good sound), pressure+positionally sensitive user- configurable control pad (like an advanced "ribbon"), reversing, multiple triggering choices incl. chromatic (or, configurable) transposition, editing, possibly polyphonic w/multiple assignable outputs, lfo & filtering options, (!turntable inputs!) and, we hoped for eventual storage/recall capability: all this to be done "on the fly" (get it? "do it on the fly"! ha, ha: ha: my marketing idea). this was meant to be sold to folks who might be interested in using live sampling for non-rigidified idioms, primarily: 1) rappers, 2) producer/engrs, 3) drummers, 4) guitarists. but: our project was *far* from being a priority, & intelligent's funding folded: end of chapter, at least till some of these features showed up on yamaha's su10 phrase sampler, many moons later. (in '92, i inadvertently picked up some lit on matthias' original paradis' looper: though i couldn't afford to buy a second looper at the time, i was intrigued & *very* enthused!) i'll skip forward to the jamman: a wonderfully cheap device w/*so* many less features than i'd hoped for (though, it did -mostly- sync to clocks!) & a marginally humane interface; they'd already fixed the hardware & most software, when i was invited to "participate", so there was no real chance for me to get my admittedly self-serving points across. i'd also hoped for a longer-term commitment from the lexies, whom i thought would evangelise the fuck out of looping to the dance/guitar/producer markets to enable the building of jamsuperman, but..... i had pitched to them that one strong way to let musicians & salespeople know that looping (& the jammer) was capable of being an exciting *instrument in it's own right* might be to sponsor a *regularly scheduled* series of educational clinics, over the course of 1-2 years, and they -nominally, but with obvious reluctance in a large part of the camp- accepted the idea (thanks to heavy effort by looping devotee & internal lex-guy jon durant). in the end i, myself, did a total of one such clinic: a dismal failure, possibly due to the nearly complete lack of advertisement until the *actual day* of the clinic, maybe?! so: natch, nobody @ lex wanted to take responsibility for such a failure, and: lo & behold (self-fulfilling prophecies being what they are): i did no more. later on? jamman dropped: no jamsuperman: cripes. (my further discussions w/eventide, tc and yamaha, interspersed across all these buncha years, bore no fruit.....) in parallel to my ongoing micro-drama, of course, you all were banging it out: matthias/kim/Ÿberheim/gibson. anyway: aw, shit! what am i blabbering about, here? i didn't mean for this to come across as "my looping summer vacation". sorry. i's just trying to say: whatever: i hope, kim, that you're not flatly chucking the concepts and general approaches of the old loop-farts (esp., guitar category) because of your reaction to their/our musical output: i do find it somewhat out-of- character, but this particular list *can* occasionally irritate with it's ambient/shmambient guitargodgurugoo- but: maybe it might be prudent -or even valuable- to get some of the grandpas involved in product design *before* there's a commitment to hardware, functionality, market direction, et al. maybe the fripp guy might yet have some unbelievably deep (yet marketable) ideas! fool that i am: i think *i* do. i do look forward to working with ya, and soon. dude: best, david torn From ???@??? Fri Feb 06 01:22:54 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 5 12:26:31 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0XsH-00043S-00; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 12:26:17 -0800 From: MIvanBerk@aol.com Message-ID: <35a9057.34da1c3d@aol.com> Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 15:08:27 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: sample clock playback tricks Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 57 Resent-Message-ID: <"oIgm8C.A.ZGC.e0h20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2951 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 12:26:18 -0800 X-UIDL: 5e4f5a13a2eb1f824468f7b79e4e1f6d In a message dated 98-02-05 14:53:28 EST, Kim wrote: << interesting problem, new technology comes along, making huge improvements in some ways and obsoleting the old stuff. But there's usually some characteristic of the old stuff that becomes very difficult in the new technology. And then you need a few more generations of new technology before you are able to do the old idea again. In this case, you used to be able to easily change the sample clock on A/D and D/A convertors, and they would be happy and nothing else in a simple delay system would get screwed up. Nowadays, the convertors give better audio but don't let you do that sample clock trick anymore, and other things in the system that need accurate timing (like midi) get screwed up. So for the echoplex and jamman, this sort of thing is impossible. So now you need to add a fair amount of dsp processing and more sophisticated real-time os techniques to be able to do what once just required a very cheap part. such is progress.... kim >> Any idea how the Boomerang folks got around this problem, at least insofar as their unit offers half speed/half sample rate playback? Boomerang folks? From ???@??? Fri Feb 06 01:22:49 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 5 12:09:58 1998 Received: from falcon (falcon.slip.net) [207.171.193.27] by ferret.slip.net with smtp (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0XcD-0001xx-00; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 12:09:41 -0800 Received: from (mail.exapps.com) [209.48.133.7] by falcon.slip.net with esmtp (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0XWf-0007lb-00; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 12:03:58 -0800 Received: by mail.exapps.com with Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) id <1GJRZ4C6>; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 15:11:14 -0500 Message-ID: From: David Kirkdorffer To: 'Kim Flint' , Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: RE: Fripp's loop technique -- what's Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 15:11:10 -0500 X-Priority: 3 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) Content-Type: text/plain X-UIDL: 6054d2c870347ac7b7c2b11ac5134c74 Here's a little something from the DGM website, about Fripp's Soundscapes. For more, surf to: http://www.discipline.co.uk/news/news.htm Liner notes to various Fripp soundscape records are also reproduced at the site. David Kirkdorffer The Soundscape performances are part of an ongoing series which has the aim of finding ways in which intelligence and music, definition and discovery, courtesy and reciprocation may enter into the act of music for both musician and audience. These performances often take place within a commercial culture in which the act of music is inescapably ill-placed. Better, if possible, that performances take place outside that culture. Better, if possible, that performers and audiences drop the demands they carry and which relentlessly accompany the commercial culture. The series is itself part of an ongoing exploration of how one might be a musician, professional musician and human being simultaneously; and how music might enter our sorry world, despite all our efforts to keep it out. Soundscapes continue to evolve, surprise, excite, educate and instruct me. They are true to the moment in which they appear.nsoundsc2.htm nsoundsc2.htm It is far easier to give a technical explanation of SOUNDSCAPES than a musical one. The basic technique of SOUNDSCAPES is the same as Frippertonics. This involved two REVOX tape recorders linked together so that a note was recorded onto the first machine and then played back on the second machine. By feeding the output of the second machine back into the first machine, a note could be made to repeat many times, as it was recorded back onto the first machine, played back on the second machine, recorded back onto the first machine, played back on the second machine etc. The overall effect was that any note you played would come back after a set amount of time and keep repeating itself. By adding new notes, a repeating phrase could be built up. In SOUNDSCAPES, the REVOX tape recorders have been replaced by digital delay units, TC2290. These units will allow a maximum delay of 64 seconds, so that the space between playing a note and it being heard again can be over a minute. This delay time is variable, so that a piece can start with a short delay time, with notes repeating quickly, and can then be lengthened so that any new notes will repeat over a longer period. In addition, Robert Fripp uses not one, but four delay units, so that different phrases can be played into different machines and cycle over a different period of time. The combined output of these delay units is played through a series of digital processors, and the net result is SOUNDSCAPES. All Soundscape performances and recording are improvised, with Robert Fripp both controlling and reacting to the output of the delay units. In Robert Fripp's words "Soundscapes are based on delay, repetition, and hazard" and are "improvised and largely governed by the time, place, audience and the performer's response to them". He usually adds the rider that "this remains the best way I know of making a lot of noise with one guitar". From ???@??? Fri Feb 06 01:22:53 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 5 12:23:07 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0Xp8-0003dQ-00; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 12:23:02 -0800 Message-ID: From: David Kirkdorffer To: 'Kim Flint' , Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: RE: Fripp's loop technique -- what's Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 15:11:10 -0500 X-Priority: 3 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) Content-Type: text/plain Resent-Message-ID: <"9aK7jD.A.93B.Wyh20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2950 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 12:23:02 -0800 X-UIDL: 620eb9e0cba31c70875892809d7ea345 Here's a little something from the DGM website, about Fripp's Soundscapes. For more, surf to: http://www.discipline.co.uk/news/news.htm Liner notes to various Fripp soundscape records are also reproduced at the site. David Kirkdorffer The Soundscape performances are part of an ongoing series which has the aim of finding ways in which intelligence and music, definition and discovery, courtesy and reciprocation may enter into the act of music for both musician and audience. These performances often take place within a commercial culture in which the act of music is inescapably ill-placed. Better, if possible, that performances take place outside that culture. Better, if possible, that performers and audiences drop the demands they carry and which relentlessly accompany the commercial culture. The series is itself part of an ongoing exploration of how one might be a musician, professional musician and human being simultaneously; and how music might enter our sorry world, despite all our efforts to keep it out. Soundscapes continue to evolve, surprise, excite, educate and instruct me. They are true to the moment in which they appear.nsoundsc2.htm nsoundsc2.htm It is far easier to give a technical explanation of SOUNDSCAPES than a musical one. The basic technique of SOUNDSCAPES is the same as Frippertonics. This involved two REVOX tape recorders linked together so that a note was recorded onto the first machine and then played back on the second machine. By feeding the output of the second machine back into the first machine, a note could be made to repeat many times, as it was recorded back onto the first machine, played back on the second machine, recorded back onto the first machine, played back on the second machine etc. The overall effect was that any note you played would come back after a set amount of time and keep repeating itself. By adding new notes, a repeating phrase could be built up. In SOUNDSCAPES, the REVOX tape recorders have been replaced by digital delay units, TC2290. These units will allow a maximum delay of 64 seconds, so that the space between playing a note and it being heard again can be over a minute. This delay time is variable, so that a piece can start with a short delay time, with notes repeating quickly, and can then be lengthened so that any new notes will repeat over a longer period. In addition, Robert Fripp uses not one, but four delay units, so that different phrases can be played into different machines and cycle over a different period of time. The combined output of these delay units is played through a series of digital processors, and the net result is SOUNDSCAPES. All Soundscape performances and recording are improvised, with Robert Fripp both controlling and reacting to the output of the delay units. In Robert Fripp's words "Soundscapes are based on delay, repetition, and hazard" and are "improvised and largely governed by the time, place, audience and the performer's response to them". He usually adds the rider that "this remains the best way I know of making a lot of noise with one guitar". From ???@??? Fri Feb 06 01:23:37 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 5 14:02:32 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0ZNJ-0000HI-00; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 14:02:25 -0800 Message-Id: <215C1D5A0FFDD011B3CC00805FC18C292298B5@NTSRV2.LEXICON.COM> From: "Sellon, Bob (Exchange)" To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: RE: PCM-42 upgrade Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 15:11:13 -0500 X-Priority: 3 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) Content-Type: text/plain Resent-Message-ID: <"FylfpC.A.E5G.oWj20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2958 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 14:02:25 -0800 X-UIDL: fce3597004803e70e62584ffceebe8dd Rich, I have some of the original Lexicon memory upgrade boards but I have been having trouble getting RAM chips for my 20 second upgrade. I am, however, still working on it. If you are interested, contact me directly at bsellon@lexicon.com. Bob Sellon Lexicon/Stec > ---------- > From: Richard Menger[SMTP:rmenger@groupz.net] > Reply To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com > Sent: Thursday, February 05, 1998 8:21 AM > To: bsellon@lexicon.com > Subject: PCM-42 upgrade > > Anyone know anywhere I can get more memory added to my PCM-42?...I'm > dying > over here!!!! > Rich > > "DOS Computers manufactured by companies such as IBM, Compaq, Tandy, > and > millions of others are by far the most popular, with about 70 million > machines in use worldwide. Macintosh fans, on the other hand, may note > that > cockroaches are far more numerous than humans, and that numbers alone > do > not denote a higher life form." > > > From ???@??? Fri Feb 06 01:24:24 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 5 16:22:02 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0bYL-0000qk-00; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 16:21:57 -0800 From: Edward_Chang@mail.amsinc.com Date: Thu, 05 Feb 98 15:24:00 est Encoding: 20 Text Message-Id: <9801058867.AA886734818@mail.amsinc.com> To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Stockhausen, radios, minimalism Resent-Message-ID: <"ciNsPC.A.YF.0Yl20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2966 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 16:21:58 -0800 X-UIDL: 2ad12c3959440ba2c60e0f40dfbbe758 Speaking of using radio broadcasts as sonic source material, some of my favorite stuff is from Stockhausen 60's stuff. "Prozession" and "Kurzwellen" both use shortwave radio as PRIMARY instruments, that is, just about everyone is playing one with scored instructions on how to add accompaniment. "Spiral" is about a soloist using radio as a "accompanist from the heavens". None of the above is loopy, but can be pretty funny. Oh yeah Keith Rowe as well as Fred Frith both have been using radios into their guitars for 2 or 3 decades. Last months issue of "Resonance" (a British experimental music magazine) devoted the entire issue to radio in exp. music. Worth checking out if you see it. Radio is a time-honored tradition and barrels of fun. Wandering on to a loop-related topic, There was a thread about minimalism a couple days ago and another piece worth checking out is Stockhausen's "Stimmung" which is a 60 minute piece using just 6 vocalists doing loop-oriented singing. They change the timbre of their voices by altering the shape of their mouth cavities and emphasizing overtones. More dynamic than Reich, Riley and Glass (which is probably why I like it). From ???@??? Fri Feb 06 01:23:11 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 5 13:07:09 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0YVl-0001L0-00; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 13:07:05 -0800 Message-ID: <01BD324F.98F489D0@TD-300> From: jprice@intcpi.com (John Price) To: "'Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com'" Subject: RE: Fripp's loop technique -- what's Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 16:03:23 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="---- =_NextPart_000_01BD324F.99BFC910" Resent-Message-ID: <"0TvPvC.A.sa.chi20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2954 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 13:07:05 -0800 X-UIDL: 878622ce94d7871c626eeaae0af0c99e I saw Fripp's soundscapes as more as a juggling act. I can't stand Fripp's ramblings even though I see his goals and intent as pure. His music puts things in better perspective. Simplicity has never been one of his strongest suits either. Re; Soundscapes. Good gracious I lost count of the loops he had going live at the Painted Bride which floated in and out all at once where he somehow intuitively seemed to know where it all ended and began simultaneouslyu expanding them and subtracting from them at random. His soundscapes are on the surface a lot less intricate and sparse than his other Frippy Stuff but that is quite deceiving. Its just as complicated and intricate as some of say Bruford's busy or odd metered Drum Patterns by virtue of quantity of ideas he juglles simultaneously. You really have to listen because not all of the ideas he's juggling are that interesting or exciting but they are all quite deliberate and related. (IMHO) -----Original Message----- From: David Kirkdorffer [SMTP:DKirkdorffer@exapps.com] Sent: Thursday, February 05, 1998 3:11 PM To: 'Kim Flint'; Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: RE: Fripp's loop technique -- what's Here's a little something from the DGM website, about Fripp's Soundscapes. For more, surf to: http://www.discipline.co.uk/news/news.htm Liner notes to various Fripp soundscape records are also reproduced at the site. David Kirkdorffer The Soundscape performances are part of an ongoing series which has the aim of finding ways in which intelligence and music, definition and discovery, courtesy and reciprocation may enter into the act of music for both musician and audience. These performances often take place within a commercial culture in which the act of music is inescapably ill-placed. Better, if possible, that performances take place outside that culture. Better, if possible, that performers and audiences drop the demands they carry and which relentlessly accompany the commercial culture. The series is itself part of an ongoing exploration of how one might be a musician, professional musician and human being simultaneously; and how music might enter our sorry world, despite all our efforts to keep it out. Soundscapes continue to evolve, surprise, excite, educate and instruct me. They are true to the moment in which they appear.nsoundsc2.htm nsoundsc2.htm It is far easier to give a technical explanation of SOUNDSCAPES than a musical one. The basic technique of SOUNDSCAPES is the same as Frippertonics. This involved two REVOX tape recorders linked together so that a note was recorded onto the first machine and then played back on the second machine. By feeding the output of the second machine back into the first machine, a note could be made to repeat many times, as it was recorded back onto the first machine, played back on the second machine, recorded back onto the first machine, played back on the second machine etc. The overall effect was that any note you played would come back after a set amount of time and keep repeating itself. By adding new notes, a repeating phrase could be built up. In SOUNDSCAPES, the REVOX tape recorders have been replaced by digital delay units, TC2290. These units will allow a maximum delay of 64 seconds, so that the space between playing a note and it being heard again can be over a minute. This delay time is variable, so that a piece can start with a short delay time, with notes repeating quickly, and can then be lengthened so that any new notes will repeat over a longer period. In addition, Robert Fripp uses not one, but four delay units, so that different phrases can be played into different machines and cycle over a different period of time. The combined output of these delay units is played through a series of digital processors, and the net result is SOUNDSCAPES. All Soundscape performances and recording are improvised, with Robert Fripp both controlling and reacting to the output of the delay units. In Robert Fripp's words "Soundscapes are based on delay, repetition, and hazard" and are "improvised and largely governed by the time, place, audience and the performer's response to them". He usually adds the rider that "this remains the best way I know of making a lot of noise with one guitar". From ???@??? Fri Feb 06 01:23:27 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 5 13:31:43 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0YtY-0004PB-00; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 13:31:40 -0800 Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 16:23:14 -0500 From: buzzard@world.std.com (Sean T Barrett) Message-Id: <199802052123.AA16356@world.std.com> To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: backporch of looping (was: forefront) Resent-Message-ID: <"SrvIMB.A.aMD.k3i20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2956 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 13:31:40 -0800 X-UIDL: f8577b54b90a5e090fa14369edabe8a6 I reformatted David Torn's post so I could read it, and assuming it came through a mess for everyone, I figured I'd share my fixed version for those who cannot easily do it themselves. (Or should that be "david torn", a la e e cummings?) [There may still be a few random spaces stuck in the the middle of words--mea culpa. There were a few characters I had to guess, and I simply excised one word ("n?e", perhaps "nee" with an accented middle letter?). I'm not sure how the tab characters were intended to appear; I just replaced them with two spaces. Oh, and I trimmed down the quoted text.] =-=-= kim, since your (and matthias') thoughts are extremely important to me in my looping life, i'd like to weave a bit of potentially pointless blather raving into this thread, for a brief minute..... dt kflint said: [snip] >The dance/electronic/hip-hop/etc. scene is definitely where I see all the >innovation in looping as a method, as a process, as a tool, as a type of >music. I see people there constantly pushing to evolve things and do >something different, move it to the next level [snip] >Loop concepts grow by leaps and bounds there. [snip] >Where I don't see much innovation with looping is in the droney guitar loop >scene, the stuff often associated with Fripp. The music may continue to be >vital and interesting, but the use of loops is pretty stagnant and >complacent. Sorry, but I just don't see anyone pushing the looping process >anywhere in that scene. (although it's possible that I just go so bored with >it I stopped paying attention .) [snip] >kim well: i hope i understand some of yer frustrations as a developer and list- maintainer/moderator. (mostly, ya know, i lurk, here: i usually mass-dispense w/the reading of any posts that compare/gossip about/overfocus upon/weigh/ any particular artists' "value to culture", and look desperately for positing forwards of the list-folks' creative "ideas", and technical/artistic problem-solving): anyway, i might comment thusly: 1) for the purpose of discussion, i gotta state that methinks there's nothing intrinsically "wrong" w/"droney guitar loop" music, as there's nothing intrinsically "wrong" w/not being attached to pushing "the forefront" of *any* kinda music nor technology, as there's nothing intrinsically "wrong" w/the lack of desire and/or *ability* to push that "forefront", as there's nothing intrinsically "wrong" w/boredom; me, i listen to whatever music has the power to transform my day, which is sometimes independent of my often virulent "need for *the new*": sometimes not. ya know, like: sam barber & jon hassell & g.s. sachdev & howlin' wolf & arvo part & jobim & john adams & steve gorn & qawwali & terry riley & chris whitley, ronnysides, we, the i.s. picklz, spooky, t. singh, main, tricky, kevin shields, disposable heroes, bjork, khol naya k, ry cooder, thomas newman, etc. and, technologically: an optigan is a terrible thing to waste, as are the oud, the national resonator guitar, a '60 alfa spider giulietta, a G3 mac, working isdn lines & toshiba librettos! that being said: 2) me, too!, re: yer enthusiasm for past, current & potential loop-activity in the "dance" scene: some great things afoot, w/brilliant things to come. (probably from one of my kids, who's deep inside nyc's trip-hop & battle scenes.) 8-)) but: (my big 'but', as it were): on the "droney guitar loop crowd" -(which, for better or worse, i do *not* consider myself to belong to, as i've never belonged to any crowd, butcept the crowd of beings struggling for happiness, dontcha know)- as it relates to furthering your (& other designer's) creative motivation for looping instrument design: 3) a) not barring that heady thrust for "the new", i think that a minor design error can be made when discarding the old (loop-)farts' desires to incorporate 20-year-old features into a new instrument; firstly, because its likely that those features may have some actual *musical* value; secondly, because those self-same features can certainly afford to be "modernised"/expanded upon; and thirdly, given the sometimes-slow (but, incessant) proclivity towards creative expansion in human nature, its fair to assume that said features -as they are- have *not yet been mined to their fullest depth*. b) as a mini-side-note to a), i've noticed a vaguely similar type of chrono- myopia in the musicians' world: futurist-espousing guitarists, illbient, trip- hop & ambient whatevers etc., uninquiringly--and, maybe even disrespectfully, by default, if you will--ignorant of the historical/cultural continuum of musical/artistic ideas that, even subconsciously, may have at least *led* us to our current 'new' genres. honestly, i feel -and constantly battle- this nearsighted tendency in my own small self..... 4) while i'm not sufficiently aware of the kinds of creative design demands that the dance scene presents you w/as challenging, i feel compelled (for some probably egoistic horrid reason) to outline some of *my* frustrations as a looper, over these past xx years (but, specifically, since 1981). however, i should preface this all w/a personal pointed statement of my honest & extreme support: in the summer of '97, when i received the Loop 5.0 software for the EDP and after i had the foot-console's broken plastic switches replaced w/heavy-duty steel ones, i finally started to use the damned EDP *regularly*. (the jamman has been replaced, and for good reason; it's now just an additional unit: an assistant: the loop support team: sideman [?] jamman). Loop 5.0 addressed the most damaging myriad bugs/weirdnesses (that previously had made the EDP just a wonderful promise to me), including all kindsa seemingly random cliks'n'pops & (unusable) glop in the audio: how?, i don't know: but: thanks: really: my sincerest gratitude goes to y'all for your (& matthias' & oberheim's) consider able perseverance & fortitude. this *is* my endorsement of the deep, deep EDP w/Loop 5.0., (but *not* of the user's manual!), for what its worth..... my further comments about what i've been trying to get *anybody* to build into a looping instrument- for years- should not be construed as negating the real value of an EDP w/Loop 5.0 (excluding that user's manual). so. back in '85 ('86?, '84?), gary hall & i had some meetings w/a slew of lexicon executives, re: looping's future (new methods for triggering/storage/manipulation), effects, etc. one of the main things that i brought into (and carried out of) this discussion was a focus on turning looping into an actual instrument. so, what do the more socially acceptable instruments have, that loopers lack? among other things: a physical/visceral/visual "interface"; footpedals & front panels just don't cut it. there remains ample reason to allow for the in lusion of some type of external controls attached to a looping instrument in order to provide the player (!and their audience!) w/ some physical correlation between what is *played/manipulated* by the player & what is *heard* by all: the value of this physical "control surface" can't be over-estimated, as it seems truly part & parcel of what distinguishes any instrument as an obvious *instrument for expression*, regardless of the resulting musical "idiom". me: i like to *see* the dj *feel* what he's fucking with, i like to *feel* (by proxy) the guitarist destroy his shit. (as a sidenote: witness roland's promising inclusion of a coupla dimension light-beams, as configurable controllers, on 2 of their new products aimed at the dance marketplace)! anyway: back to that meeting: i also noted that synths & samplers had storage/future playback: computers had storage: loopers did not. synths & samplers had audio mangling: loopers did not. anyway: lexicon let everything that we discussed (so earnestly, it seemed!) slide by, insofar as i know, until lex employees bob sellon & joe waltz developed the jamman *on their own time*, in the 90's. also: c. '87-'88 (?), antony widoff & i (w/a young, brilliant hardware engr., whose name i, unfortunately, can't re member) started working on "The Fly" for intelligent music. the fly was my idea of a looper: not necessarily highest audio quality (but w/a good sound), pressure+positionally sensitive user- configurable control pad (like an advanced "ribbon"), reversing, multiple triggering choices incl. chromatic (or, configurable) transposition, editing, possibly polyphonic w/multiple assignable outputs, lfo & filtering options, (!turnt able inputs!) and, we hoped for eventual storage/recall capability: all this to be done "on the fly" (get it? "do it on the fly"! ha, ha: ha: my marketing idea). this was meant to be sold to folks who might be interested in using live sampling for non-rigidified idioms, primarily: 1) rappers, 2) producer/engrs, 3) drummers, 4) guitarists. but: our project was *far* from being a priority, & intelligent's funding folded: end of chapter, at least till some of these features showed up on yamaha's su10 phrase sampler, many moons later. (in '92, i inadvertently picked up some lit on matthias' original paradis' looper: though i couldn't afford to buy a second looper at the time, i was intrigued & *very* enthused!) i'll skip forward to the jamman: a wonderfully cheap device w/*so* many less features than i'd hoped for (though, it did -mostly - sync to clocks!) & a marginally humane interface; they'd already fixed the hardware & most software, when i was invited to "participate", so there was no real chance for me to get my admittedly self-serving points across. i'd also hoped for a longer-term commitment from the lexies, whom i thought would evangelise the fuck out of looping to the dance/guitar/producer markets to enable the building of jamsuperman, but..... i had pitched to them that one strong way to let musicians & salespeople know that looping (& the jammer) was capable of being an exciting *instrument in it's own right* might be to sponsor a *regularly scheduled* series of educational clinics, over the course of 1-2 years, and they -nominally, but with obvious reluctance in a large part of the camp- accepted the idea (thanks to heavy effort by looping devotee & internal lex-guy jon durant). in the end i, myself, did a total of one such clinic: a dismal failure, possibly due to the nearly complete lack of advertisement until the *actual day* of the clinic, maybe?! so: natch, nobody @ lex wanted to take responsibility for such a failure, and: lo & behold (self-fulfilling prophecies being what they are): i did no more. later on? jamman dropped: no jamsuperman: cripes. (my further discussions w/eventide, tc and yamaha, interspersed across all these buncha years, bore no fruit.....) in parallel to my ongoing micro-drama, of course, you all were banging it out: matthias/kim/Oberheim/gibson. anyway: aw, shit! what am i blabbering about, here? i didn't mean for this to come across as "my looping summer vacation". sorry. i's just trying to say: whatever: i hope, kim, that you're not flatly chucking the concepts and general approaches of the old loop-farts (e sp., guitar category) because of your reaction to their/our musical output: i do find it somewhat out-of- character, but this particular list *can* occasionally irritate with it's ambient/shmambient guitargodgurug oo- but: maybe it might be prudent -or even valuable- to get some of the grandpas involved in product design *before* there's a commitment to hardware, functionality, market direction, et al. maybe the fripp guy might yet have some unbelievably deep (yet marketable) ideas! fool that i am: i think *i* do. i do look forward to working with ya, and soon dude: best, david torn From ???@??? Fri Feb 06 01:23:32 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 5 13:40:12 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0Z1d-0005Th-00; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 13:40:01 -0800 Message-Id: <98Feb5.153142cst.26891@gateway.gibson.com> X-Sender: tspauldi@mail.nash.gibson.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 15:34:17 -0600 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Tom Spaulding Subject: Re: backporch of looping (was: forefront) In-Reply-To: <7ee515eb.34da19b5@aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"lMyIAD.A.ySE.KAj20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2957 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 13:40:01 -0800 X-UIDL: 1c0e758cc9b8d1e1d5ab9f0d99c51ef1 David- Thanks for the extremely useful information. I have been searching for a way to explain what the future could be (and share some of my new-found excitement about looping) with some of the powers that be here at Oberheim. It has recently occurred to me, (and I apologize for the naivete)that looping is the "found link" between "live" and "recorded" music. It is a truly "Live Recording". As you are well aware, the amount of interest shown in new technologies by corporations consumed with "doing what it is we really do" is directly proportional to the bottom line, and sometimes even the whimsy of Management. That Lexicon bailed on the JamMan or that we at Oberheim have been at a loss on how to market what is essentially a new instrument is not really surprising, given the fact that every dollar spent needs to be accounted for. Virtually no one that works here (Gibson)has heard of you, or Fripp, or DJ Spooky, or any non-mainstream (whatever that means) artist, based on my informal poll. That is not to say that we have ignorant, uninformed dullards walking around here, merely that their realm of experience lays comfortably upon the bed of the familiar names and faces we all know and love. What Artist Relations person would walk into a Marketing meeting with a Polytown CD and actually convince the group that this was the future and that Slash and Ace and Joe and Jimmy and B.B were passe, or at least only part of the picture? It does not happen. I am currently creating a "Looping Manifesto" to attempt to describe what possibilities are out there for Oberheim/Gibson. This is a new world, one that many will be certain is flat or at best temporary. It is now my feeling that if we do not create a market for Looping, it will remain a cultural, fringe anomaly. Eventually the visionaries will give up, sell off their ideas or have them revert back to them undeveloped. The Echoplex is a powerful tool, still in it's infancy, I hope. I know Kim is looking for Oberheim to get behind it, push it, market it or just understand it. Your suggestion of giving clinics is wonderful. Who can do them? I have been to/given many clinics that are basically a hot player burning through a few tunes and taking Q & A afterwards. This is fine, for what it is. The direct interface of fans to heroes is rare enough. However, a clinic on Looping is akin to teaching a new language and asking for your audience to look at the technology from a very different angle than they may be used to. How do we do it so it works? A guitar can be seen as merely a triggering device for the true instrument, the Loop. The Loop becomes the medium of expression, the path from heart to head to hand to amp is interrupted by this new brain, this new collector of multiple ideas. The guitar becomes simply an appendage like the tongue...it helps to form words, but does not communicate much by itself. Who needs any particular model anymore? This will threaten companies who sell product based on the uniqueness of tone, appearance, etc. Sure, a Les Paul or a Strat has it's own identity, but what is Fender admitting when they sell a "Roland-ready" Strat with GK-9 pickup attached? This all sounds a bit "deep", and I apologize to those who are bored with it. I have to ask: Am I actually "getting it"? Is this what it feels like to see the future? Thank you David, for what Jerry Maguire called a "Mission Statement"...Things We Think But Do Not Say" indeed. Tom From ???@??? Fri Feb 06 01:23:03 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 5 12:46:42 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0YBy-0006go-00; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 12:46:38 -0800 X-Sender: matthias@pop3.bahianet.com.br (Unverified) Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 18:44:38 -0300 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: matthias@bahianet.com.br (Matthias Grob) Subject: 75 mails today! Resent-Message-ID: <"Ld9SWB.A.3SF.ZNi20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2953 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 12:46:38 -0800 X-UIDL: fcee38e1e8b21963c71bed2c9fa23a39 sorry people. I have to take a break (and learn english :-) If you feel that some posts need an answer of mine please forward it to me. If you feel that I should know about some post, please CC it to me. I apreciate private mail Matthias From ???@??? Fri Feb 06 01:23:46 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 5 14:14:02 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0ZYN-0001l6-00; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 14:13:51 -0800 Message-Id: <2.2.32.19980205220533.00cedf4c@pop.chromatic.com> X-Sender: kflint@pop.chromatic.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 2.2 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 05 Feb 1998 14:05:33 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Kim Flint Subject: Re: sample clock playback tricks Cc: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Resent-Message-ID: <"A_F_DC.A.2v.ffj20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2959 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 14:13:51 -0800 X-UIDL: a39e7ea28e930173a2ae00a2ddcff764 At 03:08 PM 2/5/98 EST, MIvanBerk@aol.com wrote: >In a message dated 98-02-05 14:53:28 EST, Kim wrote: > ><< interesting problem, new technology comes along, making huge improvements > in some ways and obsoleting the old stuff. But there's usually some > characteristic of the old stuff that becomes very difficult in the new > technology. And then you need a few more generations of new technology > before you are able to do the old idea again. In this case, you used to be > able to easily change the sample clock on A/D and D/A convertors, and they > would be happy and nothing else in a simple delay system would get screwed > up. Nowadays, the convertors give better audio but don't let you do that > sample clock trick anymore, and other things in the system that need > accurate timing (like midi) get screwed up. So for the echoplex and jamman, > this sort of thing is impossible. So now you need to add a fair amount of > dsp processing and more sophisticated real-time os techniques to be able to > do what once just required a very cheap part. such is progress.... > > kim >> > >Any idea how the Boomerang folks got around this problem, at least insofar as >their unit offers half speed/half sample rate playback? Boomerang folks? I don't know how Boomerang does it, but half speed is usually quite easy with the current crop of A/D convertors. You usually have a few fixed sample rates available that can be selected by the processor, these tend to match sample rates used in various common devices: CD's, DAT, sound cards, etc. So you just switch it on the fly. Variable sample rates, on the other hand, are not so easy. Boomerang also doesn't have to deal with sync, so the question of "what the hell do we do with the midi clock when the user is goin' mad on the delay time knob?" is not an issue for them. kim ________________________________________________________ Kim Flint 408-752-9284 Mpact System Engineering kflint@chromatic.com Chromatic Research http://www.chromatic.com From ???@??? Fri Feb 06 01:23:55 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 5 15:05:04 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0aLt-0007LV-00; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 15:05:01 -0800 Message-Id: <2.2.32.19980205225819.009ac0a4@pop.chromatic.com> X-Sender: kflint@pop.chromatic.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 2.2 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 05 Feb 1998 14:58:19 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Kim Flint Subject: Re: backporch of looping (was: forefront) Resent-Message-ID: <"2QdmLD.A.COG.JRk20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2960 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 15:05:01 -0800 X-UIDL: f4b06d7cf454086dbafeb32062f1f2ea Thanks for the thoughts David! appreciated, as always. No time for serious discussion at the moment, but one point to clarify: At 02:57 PM 2/5/98 EST, Texture444@aol.com wrote: > 3) a) not barring that heady thrust for "the new", i think that a minor design > error can be made when discarding the old (loop-)farts' desires to incorporate > 20-year-old features into a new instrument; firstly, because its likely that > those features may have some actual *musical* value; > secondly, because those self-same features can certainly afford to be > "modernised"/expanded upon; and > thirdly, given the sometimes-slow (but, incessant) proclivity towards creative > expansion in human nature, its fair to assume that said features -as they are- > have *not yet been mined to their fullest depth*. Please don't get me wrong. We have no plans to give up on "old" ideas, didn't mean to imply any such thing. In fact, for many, these "old" ideas are brand spankin' new, and we look forward to introducing them to new legions. The reason old ideas hang around is that they were good ideas, no point in tossing them. And we certainly recognize the potential for expanding these ideas and have many intentions to do so. Just managing to integrate them with other ideas we already have in place will force this, and there will be plenty of unfathomable opportunities in the future along those lines. What I do mean to say is, from the technical innovation and developer's standpoint, a lot of people who come from the looping "old skool" are quite complacent in what they do, and are not the ones feeding us with new possibilities for our technical developments. They just want something that works like another thing did in the past. Not a judgement of that, just what we hear all the time. I sort of figure that once the variable delay time thing comes to pass, they will be gleefully happy and not be tugging on our pants leg anymore. It's in all the new music where the new challenges for innovation come from. People bursting with creative expansion need many new things to get them to new places. Huge, exciting challenges and possibilities lie there, and that's what's likely to continue to push us. I'd like to encourage the "grandpas" as you say, to remain open to the new ideas, and resist the easy urge to think they already know it all, that the new contains no value. In other words, resist adopting your parent's "when I was a lad we knew how to do it right, not like these kids today" mantra. It is entirely possible, actually probable, that some new loop concept required by the cutting edge illbient remix artist will also be the greatest thing since tape-loops to our lovably curmudgeonly "droney guitar crowd." And it's entirely possible that said new idea will inspire our grandpas in a new way, and they'll be back tuggin' our trousers again. Keep the mind open, keep the blinders off, and stay (de)tuned... kim ________________________________________________________ Kim Flint 408-752-9284 Mpact System Engineering kflint@chromatic.com Chromatic Research http://www.chromatic.com From ???@??? Fri Feb 06 01:24:01 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 5 15:33:25 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0anG-0002Y9-00; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 15:33:18 -0800 From: Paolo Valladolid Message-Id: <199802052322.PAA07567@waynesworld.ucsd.edu> Subject: Advice To Clever Children To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 15:22:44 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: <2.2.32.19980205225819.009ac0a4@pop.chromatic.com> from "Kim Flint" at Feb 5, 98 02:58:19 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"ha4YxB.A.dHB.Onk20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2961 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 15:33:18 -0800 X-UIDL: dacc9565ad714d56a9f7719934cace79 To whoever posted this URL: http://www.jimstonebraker.com/ksadvice.html Thanks! It was a very interesting read, to say the least, Stockhausen's comments on looping (mostly negative) and his recommendations to several artists (Richard James/Aphex Twin, Scanner, and David Pemberton) on pieces of his own to listen to. I don't mean to be negative (there's been enough negativity of late) but Stockhausen's comments sounded like "you kids are kind of ignorant, why not listen to some of my stuff and learn from a real master". :) Equally entertaining were the responses from James, Scanner, and Pemberton. All were actually well-reasoned responses rather than just "F--- off, old fart!". James' "why dont YOU try listening to MY stuff" was pretty good. :) They should get on this list! Imagine the kind of discourse that we would see! Wait, we kind of have that now, don't we? The subscribership already ranges from grizzled, veteran "grandpas" to wannabee me, from guitar players to keyboardists to DJs(?), etc. Cheers, Paolo Valladolid --------------------------------------------------------------- |Moderator of Digital Guitar Digest, an Internet mailing list |\ |for Music Technology and Stringed Instruments | \ ---------------------------------------------------------------- | \ finger pvallado@waynesworld.ucsd.edu for more info \ | \ http://waynesworld.ucsd.edu/DigitalGuitar/home.html \| ----------------------------------------------------------------- From ???@??? Fri Feb 06 01:24:02 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 5 15:37:02 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0aql-00030C-00; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 15:36:55 -0800 Message-Id: <2.2.32.19980205232459.009eec3c@pop.chromatic.com> X-Sender: kflint@pop.chromatic.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 2.2 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 05 Feb 1998 15:24:59 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Kim Flint Subject: Re: backporch of looping (was: forefront) Resent-Message-ID: <"mBJa1C.A.XgB.Jqk20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2962 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 15:36:55 -0800 X-UIDL: 5b2b22fdc5de9dba3fbcff9b114e43c0 At 03:34 PM 2/5/98 -0600, Tom Spaulding wrote: >Virtually no one that works here (Gibson)has heard of you, or Fripp, or DJ >Spooky, or any non-mainstream (whatever that means) artist, based on my >informal poll. That is not to say that we have ignorant, uninformed >dullards walking around here, merely that their realm of experience lays >comfortably upon the bed of the familiar names and faces we all know and >love. What Artist Relations person would walk into a Marketing meeting with >a Polytown CD and actually convince the group that this was the future and >that Slash and Ace and Joe and Jimmy and B.B were passe, or at least only >part of the picture? It does not happen. > > I am currently creating a "Looping Manifesto" to attempt to describe what >possibilities are out there for Oberheim/Gibson. This is a new world, one >that many will be certain is flat or at best temporary. It is now my >feeling that if we do not create a market for Looping, it will remain a >cultural, fringe anomaly. Eventually the visionaries will give up, sell off >their ideas or have them revert back to them undeveloped. Hey Tom, just tell them that Looping is the perfect way to play all the parts in "Sweet Home Alabama" all by yourself. No need to share the stage with some other ego-mad guitar player. It'll be all you! You also might want to remind them that the kids today aren't listening to guitar music much anymore, and Gibson's gonna have to think of something eventually! :-) kim ________________________________________________________ Kim Flint 408-752-9284 Mpact System Engineering kflint@chromatic.com Chromatic Research http://www.chromatic.com From ???@??? Fri Feb 06 01:24:03 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 5 15:41:02 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0aub-0003Vm-00; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 15:40:53 -0800 From: Texture444@aol.com Message-ID: <2e79e05a.34da4ad7@aol.com> Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 18:27:17 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Re: backporch of looping (was: forefront) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 84 Resent-Message-ID: <"gBWamB.A.j6B.Jtk20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2963 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 15:40:53 -0800 X-UIDL: a6fe5b0148196dffffc6901c3ddda36b kim, yup: just checking! anyway: give *me* the new stuff, yo! i always bored w/meself: gotta keep moving, fluid, crisp: try to fuck w/time'nspace some more, the way it do us! best, dt From ???@??? Fri Feb 06 01:24:11 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 5 16:07:15 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0bK2-0006qn-00; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 16:07:10 -0800 Message-ID: <34DA52FE.2A1749B8@bellsouth.net> Date: Thu, 05 Feb 1998 19:02:06 -0500 From: Jeff Duke Reply-To: jmar@bellsouth.net Organization: Tec Bab Labs X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Liquid Audio References: <199802050112.RAA29875@waynesworld.ucsd.edu> <34D98DA5.79AA5D16@bellsouth.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"JYko8B.A.gsF.LLl20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2965 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 16:07:10 -0800 X-UIDL: 44d35528fab826f1137ce46b53b8885c Jeff Duke wrote: > Paolo Valladolid wrote: > > > A recent article in the fishwr- I mean, newspaper mentioned software > > called Liquid Audio (URL is http://ww.liquidaudio.com). Here's an > > excerpt: > > > > "Liquid Audio, available for Windows and the Mac, is being used by > > several musicians to sell music via direct downloads for as little > > as 99 cents per song." > > > > > > Mornin friends, > > > The Knitting Factory (http://www.knittingfactory.com/)ha s a recording > > label that uses Liquid Audio.It sounds good on the samples. > > Jeff DukeTecBabLabs > http://members.tripod.com/~dukesr/index.html Here is the url for the label,its pretty amazing compared to ra. http://www.liquidaudio.com/knitting/index.html From ???@??? Fri Feb 06 01:24:30 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 5 17:24:00 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0cWJ-0000f1-00; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 17:23:55 -0800 X-Sender: landman@mail.wco.com Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 17:17:02 -0700 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: landman@wco.com (Mark Landman) Subject: Re: sample clock playback tricks Resent-Message-ID: <"qsIGH.A.FsG.BPm20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2973 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 17:23:55 -0800 X-UIDL: 5d43355a4422314fa2f3d9d3457de933 Kim said; >I don't know how Boomerang does it, but half speed is usually quite easy >with the current crop of A/D convertors. You usually have a few fixed sample >rates available that can be selected by the processor, these tend to match >sample rates used in various common devices: CD's, DAT, sound cards, etc. So >you just switch it on the fly. Variable sample rates, on the other hand, are >not so easy. Boomerang also doesn't have to deal with sync, so the question >of "what the hell do we do with the midi clock when the user is goin' mad on >the delay time knob?" is not an issue for them. > Well, totally variable delay time is desirable, but being able to switch to some musically useful ratios, (1/2, 2/3, etc.) would probably be just as good. This could be a general master control, or perhaps the setting could be saved per loop? My experience is that I like to be able to record/overdub at varying speeds, and later be free to change the playback. Now obviously you couldn't go back and change rates in an overdubbed loop, but perhaps each loop "register" could remember it's current setting? Really what we all probably desire is a "quad" Echoplex with sliders for mixing, and integeral effects with multiple sends, etcÉ So if we take the Echoplex, Rolands new SP-808, and Davids "Fly", and put them in a blender, we come up with something closeÉ Mark From ???@??? Thu Feb 05 10:22:48 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 5 06:49:40 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0ScT-00043T-00; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 06:49:37 -0800 Message-Id: <3.0.1.16.19980205162535.0dafe4d4@rank-serv.elec.gla.ac.uk> X-Sender: pycraft@rank-serv.elec.gla.ac.uk X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.1 (16) Date: Thu, 05 Feb 1998 16:25:35 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: "Michael P. Hughes, Ph.D." Subject: RE: RE: Frippery vs. Bitchery In-Reply-To: <01BD3230.AB1D8720@slip139-92-21-97.lo.uk.ibm.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"cdvHaC.A.VgD.XDd20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2923 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 06:49:37 -0800 X-UIDL: 4d59009c6b8151efb22da62a89c3cae2 Brian: >When it comes pure Fripp looping-with-guitar, I swear by his "Bringing Down >The Light", the last track on the Sylvian/Fripp "First Day" album, and the >build-ups before his solos on Sylvian/Fripp's "Damage" live album. On both, >you can follow which notes he's playing when, to see how he got there - >which decreased my respect for him not one iota. Funnily enough, I also point people to the same piece when people ask what "looping" is; "BDtL" is long enough to say "There! You heard that bit before!" but short enough not to bore them silly. I also rate the 6-minute "Firepower" outro (again from The First Day), which is a marvellous demonstration of live buildups using looping - no editing, just "here it is". Gorgeous. Michael PS Read the www.fripp.com site - she looks scarily like him! And as for her books "secrets of the masters" and "get what you want".... From ???@??? Fri Feb 06 01:24:25 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 5 16:51:08 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0c0X-0004Bo-00; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 16:51:05 -0800 From: Texture444@aol.com Message-ID: <571b7d71.34da5ccd@aol.com> Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 19:43:55 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Stockhausen, radios, minimalism Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 84 Resent-Message-ID: <"MnvTAD.A.kHD.izl20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2968 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 16:51:05 -0800 X-UIDL: f6a95363ca5b5746314394937ab88e71 ed, thanks for the stockhausen info-shite. on the 'nother tip, i've been using a coupla microcassette recorders, clocks, me voice & toys into guitar pickups for a bit of a while. best, dt From ???@??? Fri Feb 06 01:24:32 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 5 17:41:10 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0cmu-0002wM-00; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 17:41:04 -0800 Message-Id: <1.5.4.32.19980206010133.0068f97c@tiac.net> X-Sender: rphunt@tiac.net (Unverified) X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 05 Feb 1998 20:01:33 -0500 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Reginald Hunt Subject: Re: Fripp's loop technique Resent-Message-ID: <"f3sNQ.A.wcB.5em20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2975 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 17:41:04 -0800 X-UIDL: 7f77885ecfb86c87d59f6973373e7a6f >ok, sure, I could add these to my mile long list of cds to buy. But the >odds are sort of against any one item on that list actually getting into my >cd collection, so it could be years before I actually get any of these. I >guess what I'm really looking for is some deeper analysis of Fripp's use of >looping. A lot of you seem to be very knowledgeable about him, so what can >you teach me? What sort of approach does he take to loops? Does he have >some typical processes or techniques? How do loops relate to his musical >style? Is there some sort of purpose or underlying motivation in his use of >looping? Has he developed his use of looping in any particular way over the >years? Its funny that you want to understand Fripp's approach without actually listening to any of his music. But, here's some cliff notes that others will probably be better than me at fleshing it out: There are basically two Fripps in regards to looping. Starting with Eno, he used 2 reel to reel tape decks side by side. Tape would be strung from a full supply reel on the left deck to an empty take-up reel on the right. His guitar would feed the input of the left deck. The playback of the right deck would also feed the input on the left deck. This allowed a long delay usually between 8 and 14 seconds, letting Fripp develop from single notes or arpeggios very lush textures. They would then edit the tapes, and he would double track solos over some of them. The albums they made were "No Pussyfooting" and "Evening Star". He toured with a basic version of this setup for a few years, performing in record stores and pizza shops among other venues. This setup was named "Frippertronics". It allowed him to explore his ideas regardig an alternative view of the music business and the audience performer relationship. It allowed him to be a "small mobile intelligent unit". Q&A sessions during the performances were typical. A few albums were compiled from these tours as well, "Let the Power Fall", "God Save the King". Fripp used "Frippertronics" in other contexts. He would copy parts onto multitrack tape to include with rock pieces and ballads. The album "Exposure" is a good example. He also did this when King Crimson was reformed. Using TC Electronics TS2290 delays, he replaced the tape decks. With guitar synth, and a rack full of delays and processors, he now produces "Soundscapes" which he has used on King Crimson records and with other artists. 4 albums and an EP of pure "Soundscapes " have been released too. Soundscapes are essentially Fripp feeding 4 delays with guitar synth. The delays may are may not all be set at the same delay times, but I believe they are normally outputed in parallel. The delay times are usually very long, so the sense of repetition is slight. Fripp tends to go with string pads, choir pads, and other "spacey" sounds, so far. Auto panning, echo, heavy flanging, pitch bending are all used. This can be truly stunning to experience live. I do recommend the CD single "Pie Jesu" for the title track. Truly beautiful, and practically heartbreaking. Believe me, I welcome any corrections. Reg From ???@??? Fri Feb 06 01:24:27 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 5 17:10:23 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0cJA-0006gL-00; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 17:10:20 -0800 Message-ID: <34DA6171.2F58@earthlink.net> Date: Thu, 05 Feb 1998 17:03:45 -0800 From: Andre LaFosse Reply-To: altruist@earthlink.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01-C-MACOS8 (Macintosh; I; 68K) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Advice To Clever Children References: <199802052322.PAA07567@waynesworld.ucsd.edu> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"d_ldpB.A.zvE.BAm20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2970 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 17:10:21 -0800 X-UIDL: cb42b75db34d589e8905ab24171ea3d2 Paolo Valladolid wrote: > > To whoever posted this URL: > > http://www.jimstonebraker.com/ksadvice.html Agreed -- a very amusing article. It just occured to me, after reading the interviews there, how wierd it is that two students of Stockhausen would go on to form Can, one of the most loop-oriented "rock" bands of all time. If you ever wondered what it would sound like if a band of live musicians decided to play sample-based dance muisc, just have a listen to Can circa "Ege Bamyasi." They were doing it about 25 years ago! --Andre From ???@??? Fri Feb 06 01:24:29 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 5 17:23:30 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0cVs-0000bW-00; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 17:23:28 -0800 Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 17:11:38 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: 8brain@spiritone.com (R.Fahl) Subject: Looper knobs Resent-Message-ID: <"xq81-B.A.glG.VOm20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2972 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 17:23:28 -0800 X-UIDL: 53c0acc2d50300903526de97f7135157 > >------------------------------ >Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 11:38:51 +0300 >From: miguel.barella@poyry.com.br (MAT) >To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com, Kim Flint >Subject: Re[2]: Arcane Device >Message-ID: <0000A7DB.4007@poyry.com.br> >Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 >Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit >Content-Description: cc:Mail note part > >___________________________ Separador de Resposta >______________________________ > > >The echoplex has knobs for input volume, output volume, mix, and feedback >control. (that's four!) With midi cc knobs, you can control feedback (in >addition to the front) and loop out volume (=5!!). You can even plug a pedal >in the back for feedback, loop out volume, or delay line in volume (=6!!!). >There's not really any other parameter available where it would make sense to >use a knob on it. Most people use the mix and feedback knobs all the time to >control things. What else would you like knobs to do? > > >===> I would realy like to control delay time with a knob in any device (JM >or Plex) > >Miguel > How about using a Peavey 1600 MIDIfader to control the Plex? They're very easy to set up. That would give you 16 sliders to play with. Romeo From ???@??? Fri Feb 06 01:24:31 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 5 17:40:58 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0cmf-0002uT-00; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 17:40:49 -0800 Message-Id: <1.5.4.32.19980206011314.006735d0@tiac.net> X-Sender: rphunt@tiac.net (Unverified) X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 05 Feb 1998 20:13:14 -0500 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Reginald Hunt Subject: Re: backporch of looping (was: forefront) Resent-Message-ID: <"RXHL9.A.6ZB.nem20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2974 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 17:40:49 -0800 X-UIDL: 7dbb8157d54f7d2992342cb12ee62189 Amen to Tom's response to David. Reg From ???@??? Fri Feb 06 01:24:52 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 5 18:20:04 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0dOR-0007e0-00; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 18:19:51 -0800 Message-Id: <2.2.32.19980206013812.00b8fd5c@pop.chromatic.com> X-Sender: kflint@pop.chromatic.com (Unverified) X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 2.2 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Date: Thu, 05 Feb 1998 17:38:12 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Kim Flint Subject: Re: sample clock playback tricks Cc: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Resent-Message-ID: <"uZArK.A.IsF.SAn20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2980 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 18:19:51 -0800 X-UIDL: 2d0835af8f66183186e06a10acf44cc4 At 05:17 PM 2/5/98 -0700, Mark Landman wrote: > >Well, totally variable delay time is desirable, but being able to switch to >some musically useful ratios, (1/2, 2/3, etc.) would probably be just as >good. This could be a general master control, or perhaps the setting could >be saved per loop? unfortunately, you don't get musically useful ratios with the easy method so much as industry standard ratios. 44.1 : 48 is probably not what most are looking for.... >Really what we all probably desire is a "quad" Echoplex with sliders for >mixing, and integeral effects with multiple sends, etcÉ > >So if we take the Echoplex, Rolands new SP-808, and Davids "Fly", and put >them in a blender, we come up with something closeÉ now the fun part, how much are you willing to spend on said flying Rolo-plex? Do you have a few Rolex's to hawk first? kim ________________________________________________________ Kim Flint 408-752-9284 Mpact System Engineering kflint@chromatic.com Chromatic Research http://www.chromatic.com From ???@??? Fri Feb 06 01:24:40 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 5 17:56:01 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0d1F-0004ke-00; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 17:55:53 -0800 Message-ID: <34DA6A95.41ED97DA@mail.clt.bellsouth.net> Date: Thu, 05 Feb 1998 20:42:45 -0500 From: "Samuel D. Burns" Reply-To: usonian@bellsouth.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.02 [en]C-DIAL (Win95; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Mir conversations References: <3.0.2.16.19980204190131.20f7f95a@texas.net> Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="------------3950812C7C4D189824D55DDF" Resent-Message-ID: <"Q3m4wD.A.9FD.4rm20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2977 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 17:55:53 -0800 X-UIDL: 58c5eb6a291e3c3af1314bd125039f17 I appreciate your resonse...creative indeed.  To me, this is one of the higher purposes of an exchange forum such as this, and I thank you for the stimulation!
 

james rhodes wrote:

>
>sure,,
>well on occasion when i have play live,(and record) i will bring along
scanning reciever, and i will scan the airwaves for communication (ie
airport traffic, mall security, cops etc,,,) i will come out an RCA on the
VHF reciever, to my jamman,,and then to my mixer(with effects loops delays,
backwards,,,you name it) in most cases the sample of conversation (ie
subject matter, emotions) actually affects the composition ,,,and takes me
in directions i might not if gone,,,(hope this isnt confusing,,,im sleepy)
well anyway,, MIR transmits to earth on the VHF frequency 143.6200
Mhz,,,depending on your location on earth, you should be able to catch
transmissions at some point during a 24 hour period,,one must be
patiant,,,and a voice activated recording system allows a better chance of
catching transmissions for review later,,,but in a live setting i just take
what the airwaves will give me,,,
james
>
>
>
>
>
>At 06:33 PM 2/4/98 -0500, you wrote:
>>Just curious, where did you source the Mir conversations?  Sounds like
>>an interesting composition!
>>Samuel D. Burns
>>
>>
>>
>>
  From ???@??? Fri Feb 06 01:24:59 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 5 18:41:45 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0dOp-0007hF-00; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 18:20:15 -0800 Message-Id: <2.2.32.19980206020041.00b9db78@pop.chromatic.com> X-Sender: kflint@pop.chromatic.com (Unverified) X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 2.2 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 05 Feb 1998 18:00:41 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Kim Flint Subject: RE: looping as sin Resent-Message-ID: <"_5epoB.A.UsF.SAn20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2979 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 18:20:15 -0800 X-UIDL: 2f23fe5fd90653aea1050f92754caed9 At 01:21 PM 2/5/98 -0600, Liebig, Steuart A. wrote: >FYI > >Apparently, I wasn't very clear in what I wanted to say. > >Solo Looping wasn't NECESSARILY the problem in my view: > >If music is creative, it's creative . . . however if the MACHINE is >dictating the "music" ("playing IC chips"), and NOT the player. Then I >do have a problem. If the machine HINDERS or LIMITS flexibility or >musical decision-making I believe the tool is in charge and not the >operator. (Of course it is cool to react to what is being spit back at >you . . . lots of grey area here to be sure.) My guitar limits my flexibility because I can't play it perfectly. Even if I could I wouldn't be able to decide to play a chord with 13 notes in it. I can't do a lot of things with it, actually. My flexibility is very limited by this instrument that I managed to enjoy playing for the last 21 years. So the tool is in charge? Doesn't seem so. It just has a boundary of possibility within which I use it. I own a hammer which does a terrible job of cutting wood. But it sure is good at hammering. Should I hate my hammer for controlling me like this? Or should I accept it as a hammer, use my saw for cutting, and just get on with it? I'm reasonably certain that infinitely-capable tools are still a few years away, so you might expect to be subjegated to machines for a while. Or you might accept the limitation of a given tool and use it for whatever it does do, and have it serve your needs. In any event, the limits of the tools used will always dictate the music to some extent, as will the limits of the musician using them. How could you possibly avoid that? kim ________________________________________________________ Kim Flint 408-752-9284 Mpact System Engineering kflint@chromatic.com Chromatic Research http://www.chromatic.com From ???@??? Fri Feb 06 01:24:53 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 5 18:24:06 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0dSG-0000Mc-00; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 18:23:48 -0800 Message-ID: <19980206020106.1919.qmail@hotmail.com> X-Originating-IP: [204.74.108.99] From: "Joseph Buck" To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: on the backporch with tom, dt, and mix culture...... Content-Type: text/plain Date: Thu, 05 Feb 1998 18:01:05 PST Resent-Message-ID: <"Xkxs1D.A.bAG.ADn20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2981 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 18:23:48 -0800 X-UIDL: 042af8cadaa0e8e1bf268a09a7c64e37 Tom, DT, Kim et allah- Thank you so much for again providing the reason why I am on this list. Really revolutionary stuff that makes me thing about the nature of music and how it is (and can be) made. All thoughts here are quick and whilst at work so apologies for any incompleteness and confusion. I reckon I'll start with your comments Tom- >Virtually no one that works here (Gibson)has heard of you, or Fripp, >or DJ Spooky, or any non-mainstream (whatever that means) artist, >based on my informal poll. That is not to say that we have ignorant, >uninformed dullards walking around here, merely that their realm of >experience lays comfortably upon the bed of the familiar names and >faces we all know and love. What Artist Relations person would walk >into a Marketing meeting with a Polytown CD and actually convince the >group that this was the future and that Slash and Ace and Joe and >Jimmy and B.B were passe, or at least only part of the picture? It >does not happen. Here, I think is a real problem. How to address it? Less Marketing and Business majors in AR and more musicians who have a real knowledge of the consumer perhaps? >Your suggestion of giving clinics is wonderful. Who can do them? I >have been to/given many clinics that are basically a hot >player burning through a few tunes and taking Q & A afterwards. This >is fine, for what it is. The direct interface of fans to heroes is >rare enough. However,a clinic on Looping is akin to teaching a new >language and asking for your audience to look at the technology from >a very different angle than they may be used to. Although fine, I do not think this is the the best and only way to get the product sold into the hands of the musician. Another approach is a more symposia based dialogue between the users of similar media (samplers, sequencers) in their work. Load up the joint with turntablists, electonica mavens,keyboardists, drummers, lofi destructors and perhaps if the input they give is listened to, bango another market is opened up! >How do we do it so it works? A guitar can be seen as merely a >triggering device for the true instrument, the Loop. For the future, I think the approach is on what sounds are there at the end of the day and not the worship of tools. and now on to dt's stuff: >1) for the purpose of discussion, i gotta state that methinks there's >nothing intrinsically "wrong" w/"droney guitar loop" music, as >there's nothing intrinsically "wrong" w/not being attached to pushing >"the forefront" of *any* kinda music nor technology, as there's >nothing intrinsically "wrong" w/the lack of desire and/or *ability* >to push that "forefront", as there's nothing intrinsically "wrong" >w/boredom Respectfully DT (and ya knows I loves ya,) that I think that musicians need to take a tip from the wider art world. I encourage and respect artists (i.e. Miles) who do explorations to whatever area they like to send us reports back from there. I even do not have a problem if they even then stay within that eddy that they have created for their entire career (say like Rauschenberg), but I do start to get jumpy when someone from the get go forsakes the development (or further development) of their own voice and builds a condo own someone else's claim.... >i listen to whatever music has the power to transform my day, >which is sometimes independent of my often virulent "need for *the >new* ya know, like: >..........the i.s. picklz..... here here! q-bert and the fellas are amazing! glad you like. more people should listen to em... >....khol nayak... you crack me up. you still listen to that tape? >toshiba librettos! que? >(probably from one of my kids, who's deep inside nyc's trip-hop & >battle scenes.) wow! elijah makes tapes? >4) while i'm not sufficiently aware of the kinds of creative design >demands that the dance scene presents you w/as challenging, i feel >compelled (for some probably egoistic horrid reason) to outline some >of *my* frustrations I think it boils down to that seemingly elusive dream of intuitive electronica. I don't want or need a million damn options tacked on in bank after bank of whatsits. Give me a process where it would learn from me and branch as I do... >this *is* my endorsement of the deep,deep EDP w/Loop 5.0., (but *not* >of the user's manual!) ah my other elusive dream for electronica. user's manuals that are equally intuitive... >so, what do the more socially acceptable instruments have, that >loopers lack? among other things: a physical/visceral/visual >"interface"; footpedals & front panels just don't cut it. >there remains ample reason to allow for the inclusion of some type of >external controls attached to a looping instrument in order to >provide the player (!and their audience!) w/ some physical >correlation between what is *played/manipulated* by the player & what >is *heard* by all...... >..........(as a sidenote: witness roland's promising inclusion of a >coupla dimension light-beams, as configurable controllers, on 2 of >their new products aimed at the dance marketplace)! May I just take this time to credit Don Buchla for coming up with the first working versions of all of the above.... Still looking for a Buchla Thunder. Don't think he is making them anymore.... selam, Joseph Buck ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From ???@??? Fri Feb 06 01:24:50 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 5 18:14:59 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0dJe-00070E-00; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 18:14:54 -0800 Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19980205200521.007cfa50@mail.nash.gibson.com> X-Sender: tspauldi@mail.nash.gibson.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 20:05:21 -0600 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: tspauldi@mail.nash.gibson.com Subject: Re: backporch of looping (was: forefront) In-Reply-To: <2.2.32.19980205232459.009eec3c@pop.chromatic.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"kFklu.A.jcF.U-m20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2978 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 18:14:54 -0800 X-UIDL: 16987c2007e9e2bb664441e2f2d02c36 Kim- Either we'll think of something, or you already have... Tom At 05:24 PM 2/5/98 -0600, you wrote: >At 03:34 PM 2/5/98 -0600, Tom Spaulding wrote: >>Virtually no one that works here (Gibson)has heard of you, or Fripp, or DJ >>Spooky, or any non-mainstream (whatever that means) artist, based on my >>informal poll. That is not to say that we have ignorant, uninformed >>dullards walking around here, merely that their realm of experience lays >>comfortably upon the bed of the familiar names and faces we all know and >>love. What Artist Relations person would walk into a Marketing meeting with >>a Polytown CD and actually convince the group that this was the future and >>that Slash and Ace and Joe and Jimmy and B.B were passe, or at least only >>part of the picture? It does not happen. >> >> I am currently creating a "Looping Manifesto" to attempt to describe what >>possibilities are out there for Oberheim/Gibson. This is a new world, one >>that many will be certain is flat or at best temporary. It is now my >>feeling that if we do not create a market for Looping, it will remain a >>cultural, fringe anomaly. Eventually the visionaries will give up, sell off >>their ideas or have them revert back to them undeveloped. > >Hey Tom, > >just tell them that Looping is the perfect way to play all the parts in >"Sweet Home Alabama" all by yourself. No need to share the stage with some >other ego-mad guitar player. It'll be all you! > >You also might want to remind them that the kids today aren't listening to >guitar music much anymore, and Gibson's gonna have to think of something >eventually! :-) > >kim >________________________________________________________ >Kim Flint 408-752-9284 >Mpact System Engineering kflint@chromatic.com >Chromatic Research http://www.chromatic.com > > > > From ???@??? Fri Feb 06 01:24:54 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 5 18:29:10 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0dXO-00013c-00; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 18:29:06 -0800 Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 18:11:37 -0800 Message-Id: <199802060211.SAA05058@fracture.lizard.net> From: Ray Peck To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Loopers' CD #1 In-Reply-To: References: X-Mailer: VM 6.32 under Emacs 19.34.1 Resent-Message-ID: <"XTiiEB.A.f0G.eKn20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2982 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 18:29:06 -0800 X-UIDL: 4398957d6488a417a57867b622416921 Kim Flint writes: >that CD project actually is not yet completed. As I understand, it's in a >bag on someone's shelf awaiting arrival of the still-vaporware-Layla sound >card. Seems likely that CD #2 will arrive before CD #1. Actually, I found another way to get the bits into the computer. As a few people here know, the disk is ready to go, except that I'm now waiting for an updated mix of Michael Peters' track, which will arrive in a week. The CD should be ready to mail on the 15th of Feb. I hope to *barely* beat CD2 to the mailboxes of the world. :-( ---------- Note: my email address is hacked as an anti-spam measure. Please remove the 'no-spam-' to reply to me. Sorry for the inconvenience. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- You need only reflect that one of the best ways to get yourself a reputation as a dangerous citizen these days is to go about repeating the very phrases which our founding fathers used in the struggle for independence. - Charles A. Beard, American Historian, 1874-1948 From ???@??? Fri Feb 06 01:25:08 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 5 19:21:35 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0eM9-0006d1-00; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 19:21:33 -0800 X-Sender: landman@mail.wco.com Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 19:20:10 -0700 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: landman@wco.com (Mark Landman) Subject: Re: sample clock playback tricks Resent-Message-ID: <"9xRTFC.A.jxF.PDo20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2984 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 19:21:33 -0800 X-UIDL: 2ec653709578e9170f4563e4b8702a51 Kim said; >now the fun part, how much are you willing to spend on said flying >Rolo-plex? Do you have a few Rolex's to hawk first? > Actually, I'd call it the MonsterPlexÉ But if we compare list $ on the Plex and the SP-808, we're certainly in the ballpark. I think the SP's going to street price at around $1500, up to 2 grand for the monster would be worth saving for. So the question is, how "bang for the buck" in terms of features, etc., can we get for $2000, $2500, $3000É? Mark From ???@??? Fri Feb 06 01:25:07 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 5 19:14:19 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0eF7-0005q2-00; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 19:14:17 -0800 Message-Id: <1.5.4.32.19980206030941.006693dc@tiac.net> X-Sender: rphunt@tiac.net X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 05 Feb 1998 22:09:41 -0500 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Reginald Hunt Subject: Re: backporch of looping (was: forefront) Resent-Message-ID: <"dF6YmD.A.nFF.y8n20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2983 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 19:14:17 -0800 X-UIDL: b4e11fa66eebd60cbd02ee2ced857830 >You also might want to remind them that the kids today aren't listening to >guitar music much anymore, and Gibson's gonna have to think of something >eventually! :-) Deja Vu! From ???@??? Fri Feb 06 01:25:09 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 5 19:26:32 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0eQs-0007Dt-00; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 19:26:26 -0800 Message-Id: <1.5.4.32.19980206031926.00675588@tiac.net> X-Sender: rphunt@tiac.net X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 05 Feb 1998 22:19:26 -0500 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Reginald Hunt Subject: RE: looping as sin Resent-Message-ID: <"Ch4GSC.A.5FG.-Fo20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2985 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 19:26:26 -0800 X-UIDL: 312788692313c9dbdd1b8cd5266525a5 >Apparently, I wasn't very clear in what I wanted to say. > >Solo Looping wasn't NECESSARILY the problem in my view: > >If music is creative, it's creative . . . however if the MACHINE is >dictating the "music" ("playing IC chips"), and NOT the player. Then I >do have a problem. If the machine HINDERS or LIMITS flexibility or >musical decision-making I believe the tool is in charge and not the >operator. (Of course it is cool to react to what is being spit back at >you . . . lots of grey area here to be sure.) I think I agree. But at the same time, all instruments limit the musician. The idea is to work within those limits to generate beauty. Some artists are actually inspired by that. But at the same time, there will be those who are more fascinated by the hardware and by making it jump through as many hoops as possible. We need them too. Though we might not want to sit through an evening of it. Reg From ???@??? Fri Feb 06 01:25:28 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 5 20:28:18 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0fOg-0004jC-00; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 20:28:14 -0800 From: Rockinews@aol.com Message-ID: <130227f7.34da8fd2@aol.com> Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 23:21:35 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Fwd: Re[4]: craft project Content-type: multipart/mixed; boundary="part0_886738896_boundary" X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 16-bit for Windows sub 38 Resent-Message-ID: <"uBVCNB.A.D1D.sAp20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2986 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 20:28:14 -0800 X-UIDL: d17bd1c4830979c5be7283cba0defe0b Content-ID: <0_886738896@inet_out.mail.aol.com.1> Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII I do not even know where to begin... Read from bottom up. ___________________________ Reply Separator __________________________ Subject: Re[3]: craft project Date: 01/28/98 02:37 PM Not to mention that she said: "Easier and easier to get a big controller" and "one gadget that does everything and then some (G-force" ______________________________ Reply Separator _______________________ Subject: Re[2]: craft project Date: 01/28/98 12:55 PM In Addition, he said, "I made a tube 7.5" by 1.5"" ______________________________ Reply Separator ________________________ Subject: Re: craft project Date: 01/28/98 12:51 PM He said... "consider doing a doily for the top of my rack" ______________________________ Forward Header ________________________ Subject: Re: craft project Author: at -fabrik/internet Date: 01/28/98 06:32 AM At 01:48 PM 1/27/98 -0500, you wrote: >Hey kids, SNIP >considerable spaghetti problem. >So, I decided to build my own snake. After a variety of >tape/twist-tie configurations failed, I got $.50 of fabric >at Ben Franklin and spent an afternoon sewing and >listening to Paul Bley albums. I made a tube 7.5'x 1.5" >and threaded my cables through it. Presto-quick and tidy >setup and teardown. >I suppose this little invention won't catch on because >it's getting easier and easier to get one big controller >that can run all your stuff or one gadget that does >everything and then some (G-Force? Eventide? Powerbook >with MAX?), but I figured I'd share my Martha Stewart >moment with y'all. Jeff, was wondering if you'd consider doing a lace doily for the top of my rack ;) Seriously, you're going to make some lucky loopette one heck of a catch someday ;0 if you added velcro, you could use it as a wrap--make getting the cables in and out easier (yeah, I know it's being done commercially, but in a LIGHT BLUE SILK CHENILLE to DIE FOR) . . . I've been meaning to check out the drainage field hose section of Home Depot and look for a practical diameter thaat I could slit and pack with cables >Oh yeah, under no circumstances read Mark Vail's Vintage >Synthesizers book. It's worse than pornography. I was >filled with an unstoppable violent lust for gear. I'm on a post-gear orgy, 12-step program at the present time. Please respect my WEAKENED state . . . no more references to LOVELY, LOOOOVVVELY, gear (drool) >Jeff Schwartz >jeffs@bgnet.bgsu.edu >http://www.bgsu.edu/~jeffs/main.html > > > drone on~~~~~~~~~~~~~Tom Tom Lambrecht hideo@concentric.net Return-Path: Received: from relay23.mail.aol.com (relay23.mail.aol.com [172.31.106.69]) by air16.mail.aol.com (v37.8) with SMTP; Thu, 29 Jan 1998 17:47:26 -0500 Received: from mailhub.chadbourne.com ([12.0.78.11]) by relay23.mail.aol.com (8.8.5/8.8.5/AOL-4.0.0) with SMTP id RAA00922 for ; Thu, 29 Jan 1998 17:28:02 -0500 (EST) From: kristina.sruoginis@chadbourne.com Received: (qmail 5442 invoked from network); 29 Jan 1998 22:27:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO chadbourne.com) (unknown) by unknown with SMTP; 29 Jan 1998 22:27:10 -0000 Received: from ccMail by chadbourne.com (ccMail Link to SMTP R8.11.00.3) id AA886112787; Thu, 29 Jan 98 17:26:29 -0500 Message-Id: <9801298861.AA886112787@chadbourne.com> X-Mailer: ccMail Link to SMTP R8.11.00.3 Date: Thu, 29 Jan 98 17:23:56 -0500 To: Subject: Re[4]: craft project Content-Description: "cc:Mail Note Part" Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: multipart/mixed; boundary="part1_886738896_boundary" Content-ID: <0_886738896@inet_out.mail.aol.com.3> Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII In a message dated 98-01-29 17:47:26 EST, kristina.sruoginis@chadbourne.com writes: << Subj: Re[4]: craft project Date: 98-01-29 17:47:26 EST From: kristina.sruoginis@chadbourne.com To: swargenius@AOL.COM I do not even know where to begin... ______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________ Subject: Re[3]: craft project Author: Kristina Sruoginis at CPNY4 Date: 01/28/98 02:37 PM Not to mention that she said: "Easier and easier to get a big controller" and "one gadget that does everything and then some (G-force" ______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________ Subject: Re[2]: craft project Author: Bill Lambertson at CPNY4 Date: 01/28/98 12:55 PM In Addition, he said, "I made a tube 7.5" by 1.5"" ______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________ Subject: Re: craft project Author: Kristina Sruoginis at CPNY4 Date: 01/28/98 12:51 PM He said... "consider doing a doily for the top of my rack" ______________________________ Forward Header __________________________________ Subject: Re: craft project Author: at -fabrik/internet Date: 01/28/98 06:32 AM At 01:48 PM 1/27/98 -0500, you wrote: >Hey kids, SNIP >considerable spaghetti problem. >So, I decided to build my own snake. After a variety of >tape/twist-tie configurations failed, I got $.50 of fabric >at Ben Franklin and spent an afternoon sewing and >listening to Paul Bley albums. I made a tube 7.5'x 1.5" >and threaded my cables through it. Presto-quick and tidy >setup and teardown. >I suppose this little invention won't catch on because >it's getting easier and easier to get one big controller >that can run all your stuff or one gadget that does >everything and then some (G-Force? Eventide? Powerbook >with MAX?), but I figured I'd share my Martha Stewart >moment with y'all. Jeff, was wondering if you'd consider doing a lace doily for the top of my rack ;) Seriously, you're going to make some lucky loopette one heck of a catch someday ;0 if you added velcro, you could use it as a wrap--make getting the cables in and out easier (yeah, I know it's being done commercially, but in a LIGHT BLUE SILK CHENILLE to DIE FOR) . . . I've been meaning to check out the drainage field hose section of Home Depot and look for a practical diameter thaat I could slit and pack with cables >Oh yeah, under no circumstances read Mark Vail's Vintage >Synthesizers book. It's worse than pornography. I was >filled with an unstoppable violent lust for gear. I'm on a post-gear orgy, 12-step program at the present time. Please respect my WEAKENED state . . . no more references to LOVELY, LOOOOVVVELY, gear (drool) >Jeff Schwartz >jeffs@bgnet.bgsu.edu >http://www.bgsu.edu/~jeffs/main.html > > > drone on~~~~~~~~~~~~~Tom Tom Lambrecht hideo@concentric.net ----------------------- Headers -------------------------------- Return-Path: Received: from relay23.mail.aol.com (relay23.mail.aol.com [172.31.106.69]) by air16.mail.aol.com (v37.8) with SMTP; Thu, 29 Jan 1998 17:47:26 -0500 Received: from mailhub.chadbourne.com ([12.0.78.11]) by relay23.mail.aol.com (8.8.5/8.8.5/AOL-4.0.0) with SMTP id RAA00922 for ; Thu, 29 Jan 1998 17:28:02 -0500 (EST) From: kristina.sruoginis@chadbourne.com Received: (qmail 5442 invoked from network); 29 Jan 1998 22:27:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO chadbourne.com) (unknown) by unknown with SMTP; 29 Jan 1998 22:27:10 -0000 Received: from ccMail by chadbourne.com (ccMail Link to SMTP R8.11.00.3) id AA886112787; Thu, 29 Jan 98 17:26:29 -0500 Message-Id: <9801298861.AA886112787@chadbourne.com> X-Mailer: ccMail Link to SMTP R8.11.00.3 Date: Thu, 29 Jan 98 17:23:56 -0500 To: Subject: Re[4]: craft project MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Description: "cc:Mail Note Part" >> Return-Path: Received: from relay23.mail.aol.com (relay23.mail.aol.com [172.31.106.69]) by air16.mail.aol.com (v37.8) with SMTP; Thu, 29 Jan 1998 17:47:26 -0500 Received: from mailhub.chadbourne.com ([12.0.78.11]) by relay23.mail.aol.com (8.8.5/8.8.5/AOL-4.0.0) with SMTP id RAA00922 for ; Thu, 29 Jan 1998 17:28:02 -0500 (EST) From: kristina.sruoginis@chadbourne.com Received: (qmail 5442 invoked from network); 29 Jan 1998 22:27:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO chadbourne.com) (unknown) by unknown with SMTP; 29 Jan 1998 22:27:10 -0000 Received: from ccMail by chadbourne.com (ccMail Link to SMTP R8.11.00.3) id AA886112787; Thu, 29 Jan 98 17:26:29 -0500 Message-Id: <9801298861.AA886112787@chadbourne.com> X-Mailer: ccMail Link to SMTP R8.11.00.3 Date: Thu, 29 Jan 98 17:23:56 -0500 To: Subject: Re[4]: craft project Content-Description: "cc:Mail Note Part" Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain I do not even know where to begin... ______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________ Subject: Re[3]: craft project Author: Kristina Sruoginis at CPNY4 Date: 01/28/98 02:37 PM Not to mention that she said: "Easier and easier to get a big controller" and "one gadget that does everything and then some (G-force" ______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________ Subject: Re[2]: craft project Author: Bill Lambertson at CPNY4 Date: 01/28/98 12:55 PM In Addition, he said, "I made a tube 7.5" by 1.5"" ______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________ Subject: Re: craft project Author: Kristina Sruoginis at CPNY4 Date: 01/28/98 12:51 PM He said... "consider doing a doily for the top of my rack" ______________________________ Forward Header __________________________________ Subject: Re: craft project Author: at -fabrik/internet Date: 01/28/98 06:32 AM At 01:48 PM 1/27/98 -0500, you wrote: >Hey kids, SNIP >considerable spaghetti problem. >So, I decided to build my own snake. After a variety of >tape/twist-tie configurations failed, I got $.50 of fabric >at Ben Franklin and spent an afternoon sewing and >listening to Paul Bley albums. I made a tube 7.5'x 1.5" >and threaded my cables through it. Presto-quick and tidy >setup and teardown. >I suppose this little invention won't catch on because >it's getting easier and easier to get one big controller >that can run all your stuff or one gadget that does >everything and then some (G-Force? Eventide? Powerbook >with MAX?), but I figured I'd share my Martha Stewart >moment with y'all. Jeff, was wondering if you'd consider doing a lace doily for the top of my rack ;) Seriously, you're going to make some lucky loopette one heck of a catch someday ;0 if you added velcro, you could use it as a wrap--make getting the cables in and out easier (yeah, I know it's being done commercially, but in a LIGHT BLUE SILK CHENILLE to DIE FOR) . . . I've been meaning to check out the drainage field hose section of Home Depot and look for a practical diameter thaat I could slit and pack with cables >Oh yeah, under no circumstances read Mark Vail's Vintage >Synthesizers book. It's worse than pornography. I was >filled with an unstoppable violent lust for gear. I'm on a post-gear orgy, 12-step program at the present time. Please respect my WEAKENED state . . . no more references to LOVELY, LOOOOVVVELY, gear (drool) >Jeff Schwartz >jeffs@bgnet.bgsu.edu >http://www.bgsu.edu/~jeffs/main.html > > > drone on~~~~~~~~~~~~~Tom Tom Lambrecht hideo@concentric.net From ???@??? Fri Feb 06 01:25:31 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 5 20:40:43 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0faf-0005zg-00; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 20:40:37 -0800 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <34D9D563.6B48@nyfac.com> References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 23:33:11 -0500 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: David Myers Subject: Re: Pivotal loop moments, or, when did you realize your compulsive need to aquire toys had reached dangerous levels? Resent-Message-ID: <"AY4dVC.A.N3E.4Kp20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2987 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 20:40:37 -0800 X-UIDL: 9b1d96f6394e2585ad4f96486515fd5c >Anybody want to share a few moments that made them realize that they had >no alternative other than to become a loopster? Or shining moments? > >I can't figure out when I started. I can say that I had the realization >that I was a loopster when I was reading a description of this >newfangled product called the JamMan. Reading that ad made me think, >haven't I been doing sort of a halfassed version of this for a while >now, and realized I had better go for at least another quarter of an >ass. I put off the purchase of this box for a very long time, untill I >struck up a conversation with a young lad who had an echoplex, and said >he'd heard about some wacky mailing list... > >Somewhere after the beginning and before the end of the aforementioned >saga, I remember seeing Yo La Tengo, and watching Ira Kaplan split his >signal with an ABY box, sending a loop of an Emaj chord into a battered >Fender Deluxe, with the tremelo set on stun, and noodling over it using >another amp. That moment, as much as anything, cemented my resolve to >get one of those there boxes. > >Trevor Actually, I think that for me the fascination with the loop goes back before I even began doing music. It's about time itself somehow. I must have seen George Pal's film of "The Time Machine" a dozen times, and have always been riveted by any sort of time-related book or film. I was a novice guitarist (still am) about 1966 when I ran into an Echoplex, and it destroyed me--they practically had to drag me out of the store. To me, it didn't matter what you put INTO the thing, it was what the thing did--store a chunk of time, let you mess with that. It still blows my mind. Perhaps this is why most of what I've done doesn't use any instruments, just delays and loops singing their own songs.... David Myers ____________________________________ "Eternity is not limited by the conditions of time, and time is eternal in virtue of its cyclic recurrence." -Hermetica, Asclepius III From ???@??? Fri Feb 06 01:25:32 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 5 20:41:31 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0fbS-00066A-00; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 20:41:26 -0800 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <571b7d71.34da5ccd@aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 23:33:53 -0500 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: David Myers Subject: Re: Stockhausen, radios, minimalism Resent-Message-ID: <"LYjqbB.A.Q5E.GLp20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2988 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 20:41:26 -0800 X-UIDL: 8b689d735cf323712c4ccac9631d26fb >ed, >thanks for the stockhausen info-shite. > >on the 'nother tip, i've been using a coupla microcassette recorders, clocks, >me voice & toys into guitar pickups for a bit of a while. > >best, >dt David- A friend of mine, Nic Collins, used to somehow pump audio INTO a guitar (which he called "inverse guitar") and drive the strings with radio broadcasts or whatever, then recording the sound of the strings resonating with such stuff. Pretty weird, no? Kinda like what David Tudor (who he once worked with) used to do, driving oil drums and suchlike with transducers. David Myers From ???@??? Fri Feb 06 01:25:33 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 5 20:41:48 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0fbf-00067j-00; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 20:41:39 -0800 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <1.5.4.32.19980206010133.0068f97c@tiac.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 23:34:02 -0500 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: David Myers Subject: Re: Fripp's loop technique Resent-Message-ID: <"ypqXO.A.U7E.RLp20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2989 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 20:41:39 -0800 X-UIDL: 3d6e2e3c93328dc32cc10015fa4e3cb9 What I never see mentioned is what Robert was doing between these two stages. Around the early days of KC2, he sometimes did performances with guitar synthesizer and an E-H 16 sec. box. I saw him do a little taste at Tower Records (NYC) with this, and have an umpteenth-generation bootleg (please don't release the dogs, R.) of a clandestine concert recording apparently using this setup. I think it was a step beyond his Les Paul/Revox material, but not so lost in un-guitarish noise washes as the "Soundscapes". Damn pity he never put any of it to disk--maybe someone can tell me otherwise. -David Myers >There are basically two Fripps in regards to looping. > >Starting with Eno, he used 2 reel to reel tape decks side by side. Tape >would be strung from a full supply reel on the left deck to an empty take-up >reel on the right. His guitar would feed the input of the left deck. The >playback of the right deck would also feed the input on the left deck. This >allowed a long delay usually between 8 and 14 seconds, letting Fripp develop >from single notes or arpeggios very lush textures. They would then edit the >tapes, and he would double track solos over some of them. The albums they >made were "No Pussyfooting" and "Evening Star". > >He toured with a basic version of this setup for a few years, performing in >record stores and pizza shops among other venues. This setup was named >"Frippertronics". It allowed him to explore his ideas regardig an >alternative view of the music business and the audience performer >relationship. It allowed him to be a "small mobile intelligent unit". Q&A >sessions during the performances were typical. A few albums were compiled >from these tours as well, "Let the Power Fall", "God Save the King". > >Fripp used "Frippertronics" in other contexts. He would copy parts onto >multitrack tape to include with rock pieces and ballads. The album >"Exposure" is a good example. He also did this when King Crimson was reformed. > >Using TC Electronics TS2290 delays, he replaced the tape decks. With guitar >synth, and a rack full of delays and processors, he now produces >"Soundscapes" which he has used on King Crimson records and with other >artists. 4 albums and an EP of pure "Soundscapes " have been released too. > >Soundscapes are essentially Fripp feeding 4 delays with guitar synth. The >delays may are may not all be set at the same delay times, but I believe >they are normally outputed in parallel. The delay times are usually very >long, so the sense of repetition is slight. Fripp tends to go with string >pads, choir pads, and other "spacey" sounds, so far. Auto panning, echo, >heavy flanging, pitch bending are all used. This can be truly stunning to >experience live. > >I do recommend the CD single "Pie Jesu" for the title track. Truly >beautiful, and practically heartbreaking. > >Believe me, I welcome any corrections. > >Reg From ???@??? Fri Feb 06 01:25:38 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 5 21:22:18 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0gEy-0001Uh-00; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 21:22:16 -0800 Message-ID: <34DA9C11.EDF@voicenet.com> Date: Fri, 06 Feb 1998 00:13:52 -0500 From: Charles Cohen X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Macintosh; I; 68K) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: re: Advice To Clever Children & on the backporch Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"28pC6D.A.2DB.H1p20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2990 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 21:22:16 -0800 X-UIDL: f3faf9fd2cd20685234620343141ed09 Paolo wrote: > I don't mean to be negative (there's > been enough negativity of late) but Stockhausen's comments sounded > like > "you kids are kind of ignorant, why not listen to some of my stuff and > learn from a real master". :) ...one "veteran grandpa" here who remembers Stockhausen being self-righteous even when he was young... and Joseph Buck wrote: > Still looking for a Buchla Thunder. Don't think he is making them > anymore.... He told me a couple of months ago he still has some for sale. Call him in Berkely Don't know the number offhand, but he's in the phone book. Buchla & Associates -- **** What's Charles up to? **** http://www.voicenet.com/~ccohen From ???@??? Fri Feb 06 01:25:47 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 5 22:25:38 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0hED-0005uu-00; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 22:25:33 -0800 Message-ID: <19980206062057.23816.rocketmail@send1b.yahoomail.com> Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 22:20:57 -0800 (PST) From: Bret Subject: Re: Stockhausen, radios, minimalism To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Resent-Message-ID: <"6V390.A.ZEF.Zvq20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2991 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 22:25:33 -0800 X-UIDL: c097ad237cf4968e34fe1be173e15c79 Thanks for the tip on the Stockhausen interview, fun reading. I had forgotton about the fun of radio until several of you started discussing this. As a kid in 1968, I heard about Moogs synths and knew I must have one. Being 11 it was out of the question, for the time. I got interested in Shortwave radio, and recieved one with a Beat Frequency Ocillator (BFO) for single sideband and code reception. Now single sideband (SSB) was cool because you could vary the pitch of the ham operator who was talking to create some real funky voices. In fact, it was difficult to decide what the real pitch of their voice should be, since I had no reference. Later, a friend gave me a pair of kid's walkie talkies that were broken. I soon discovered that using the BFO while recieving walkie talkie transmissions of humming and singing would make sounds that were out of this world. It was a primitive ring modulator (heterodyning) First I would null out the carrier frequency so it didn't whine. Sweeping a pitch (my voice) through this setup made repeating sweeps of sounds, as though there were echos, but they weren't echos (hard to explain). Eventually I plugged my guitar into the walkie talkie to ring modulate that. At that time, I had know clue that other people made noise like that. Voice was the most fun. In the late 70's I experimented with CPU noise from programs running on my TI 59 calculator, going through inductive pickups (against the calculator). Never taped any of this stuff, nor developed any real control, but it was fun. Guess I am exposing more of my nerd-dom. Always loved tinkerin with gadgets, specially ifin they makes a noise. To me back then, the RFI noise was fun. Now if it happens it is the CPU of my VS-880 going through the bass pickups and it is NOISE, and is a sign for me to Step Away from the Mixer, Mr. Moreland, yer getting too noisey to keep recording. Someone else asked about use of analog synth filters on guitars, etc. I used to have fun playing a guitar through the audio input of a micro moog in a couple of ways. One is to set the random, auto trigger sample hold to control the filter frequency with the filter quite resonsant. Frank Zappa has used this too good effect (isn't his an oberheim sample hold?). The other way I have done this is using the LFO to sweep the resonant filter, more like a rhythmic wah wah effect. Like that Bread song, was it The Diary? You guys probably won't fess to knowing that kind of music. Hey man, it was the 70's. bret _________________________________________________________ DO YOU YAHOO!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com From ???@??? Fri Feb 06 01:25:48 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 5 22:29:52 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0hIM-0006Tl-00; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 22:29:50 -0800 Message-Id: Date: Fri, 6 Feb 1998 07:23:13 +0100 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com References: Subject: unsubscribe X-Mailer: T-Online eMail 2.12 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8BIT X-Sender: 06119505308-0001@t-online.de From: Uta.Til@t-online.de (uta) Resent-Message-ID: <"5a8smC.A.sVF.wxq20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2992 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 22:29:50 -0800 X-UIDL: 244891a1b440f215a71ebde86d40b8e0 Unsubscripe From ???@??? Fri Feb 06 01:25:58 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 6 00:34:08 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0jEc-0005q5-00; Fri, 6 Feb 1998 00:34:06 -0800 Message-Id: <1.5.4.32.19980206083031.0067db2c@tiac.net> X-Sender: rphunt@tiac.net X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Fri, 06 Feb 1998 03:30:31 -0500 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Reginald Hunt Subject: Re: Fripp's loop technique Resent-Message-ID: <"JkHAZD.A.bQF.pps20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2993 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 6 Feb 1998 00:34:06 -0800 X-UIDL: 05329116de564096996090adca9b2c11 Thanks, I'd heard rumors to the effect that Fripp used the "Fripp-in-a-box", but never had details. Reg At 11:34 PM 2/5/98 -0500, you wrote: > >What I never see mentioned is what Robert was doing between these two >stages. Around the early days of KC2, he sometimes did performances with >guitar synthesizer and an E-H 16 sec. box. I saw him do a little taste at >Tower Records (NYC) with this, and have an umpteenth-generation bootleg >(please don't release the dogs, R.) of a clandestine concert recording >apparently using this setup. I think it was a step beyond his Les >Paul/Revox material, but not so lost in un-guitarish noise washes as the >"Soundscapes". Damn pity he never put any of it to disk--maybe someone can >tell me otherwise. > >-David Myers From ???@??? Fri Feb 06 10:20:34 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 6 02:21:38 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0kuf-0003BY-00; Fri, 6 Feb 1998 02:21:37 -0800 X-Sender: kflint@pop.slip.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <3.0.5.32.19980205200521.007cfa50@mail.nash.gibson.com> References: <2.2.32.19980205232459.009eec3c@pop.chromatic.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Fri, 6 Feb 1998 02:19:13 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Kim Flint Subject: Re: backporch of looping (was: forefront) Resent-Message-ID: <"F5pkH.A.ewC.hOu20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2994 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 6 Feb 1998 02:21:37 -0800 X-UIDL: 0b1bb06249a9a68b38d7d944b56f1f3a At 8:05 PM -0600 2/5/98, tspauldi@mail.nash.gibson.com wrote: >Kim- > >Either we'll think of something, or you already have... > >Tom > hey, give credit to Matthias. He's the one with the genius ideas. I can claim some little bits here and there, but mostly my job is trying to convince people with MBA's to sign contracts for odd niche products. That and stirring shit up, which I've been told I have a knack for.... :-) kim ______________________________________________________________________ Kim Flint | Looper's Delight kflint@annihilist.com | http://www.annihilist.com/loop/loop.html http://www.annihilist.com/ | Loopers-Delight-request@annihilist.com From ???@??? Fri Feb 06 10:21:56 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 6 10:03:38 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0s7i-0002m2-00; Fri, 6 Feb 1998 10:03:34 -0800 Message-ID: <34DB097A.223F@nyfac.com> Date: Fri, 06 Feb 1998 13:00:42 +0000 From: tbajus Reply-To: nyfac2@nyfac.com X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (WinNT; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: screaming guitar References: <3.0.1.32.19980206183615.011cc9ec@pop.stud.ntnu.no> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"tqXdoB.A.5eB._5020"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3006 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 6 Feb 1998 10:03:34 -0800 X-UIDL: 553317f121e186c4fdb9a7fb7215ec3f eriklj@stud.ntnu.no wrote: > > Robert Hampson of Main has been known for doing this live as well. It can > indeed produce some otherworldly sounds, but it doesn't seem to work very > well with my J. Barden single coil pick ups (and I've tried shouting REALLY > loud into them). So, eh, what I need is a bad guitar mic. that picks up a > lot of hum and buss and other "unwanted" noise...any recomandations? Later, > > Erik Ljones (Norway) Are you sure your Bardens are single coils? I thought they were all humbuckers. What allows you to talk into your pickups is that the wire wrappings on your pickups are loose, aloowing your voice to move a tiny bit. That is why you need all the distortion to hear your voice. Pickups like that are called, oddly enough, microphonic. Microphonic pickups can be a collosal pain in the ass. I use a lot of string feedback live, when I can play loud enough to get the guitar to be responsive enough. I have an Ebow to fake it at lower volumes, but IMHO, it just is not as cool as a really loud amp making your string wiggle about buck wild. Anyway, microphonic feedback is when the coils on you pickup vibrate and cause that high pitched squeeling noise that keeps happening when you hold your hand over your strings. Not that microphonic feedback is without its own charms. Many a Neil Young solo has been well punctuated with an ear piercing whistle or two. From ???@??? Fri Feb 06 10:20:49 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 6 04:07:31 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0mZ8-0007OR-00; Fri, 6 Feb 1998 04:07:30 -0800 Message-ID: <34DB0A00.3679@infobiogen.fr> Date: Fri, 06 Feb 1998 13:02:57 +0000 From: Malhomme Olivier Reply-To: malhomme@infobiogen.fr Organization: I P L X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 [fr] (Macintosh; I; PPC) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: when did you realize your compulsive need... References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"V89iHC.A.RsG.lxv20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2995 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 6 Feb 1998 04:07:30 -0800 X-UIDL: ab92cec77c345ffc23d8350b3d70229b Yep! it is all your fault! Olivier Malhomme From ???@??? Fri Feb 06 10:20:50 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 6 04:13:09 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0meZ-00004a-00; Fri, 6 Feb 1998 04:13:07 -0800 Message-ID: <34DB0B2E.F2D@infobiogen.fr> Date: Fri, 06 Feb 1998 13:07:59 +0000 From: Malhomme Olivier Reply-To: malhomme@infobiogen.fr Organization: I P L X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 [fr] (Macintosh; I; PPC) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: looping through other toys References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"1NjlX.A.xHH.B2v20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2996 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 6 Feb 1998 04:13:07 -0800 X-UIDL: a426d97fbf4531f27393f950c03c92bc Does anyone has tried Metasynth? I spent a few hours on the demo recentl -which allows looping). Damned! what an incerdibly powerful thing. That is almost unfair. I could not liive without i t now (but I have just the demo. The soft is quite expensive to me (249$). Olivier Malhomme From ???@??? Fri Feb 06 10:21:06 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 6 05:32:28 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0ntK-0003me-00; Fri, 6 Feb 1998 05:32:26 -0800 Date: Fri, 6 Feb 1998 08:14:41 -0500 From: Jon Durant <74074.1316@compuserve.com> Subject: Re: backporch of looping (was: forefront) Sender: Jon Durant <74074.1316@compuserve.com> To: "INTERNET:Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com" Message-ID: <199802060818_MC2-322B-5A58@compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline Resent-Message-ID: <"OrvHSD.A.7-C.4-w20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2998 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 6 Feb 1998 05:32:26 -0800 X-UIDL: 1f640082fd1389a48977333405854a60 Hey DT- Thanks for dragging up some most unpleasant memories, Mr. Tork. But, for the record, and for those who are relatively new, the Mr. Jon Durant (that's me) about whom David Torb speaks in his tome no longer works for Lexicon. Tom writes: >Virtually no one that works here (Gibson)has heard of you, or Fripp, or DJ >Spooky, or any non-mainstream (whatever that means) artist, based on my >informal poll. That is not to say that we have ignorant, uninformed >dullards walking around here, merely that their realm of experience lays >comfortably upon the bed of the familiar names and faces we all know and >love. What Artist Relations person would walk into a Marketing meeting with >a Polytown CD and actually convince the group that this was the future and >that Slash and Ace and Joe and Jimmy and B.B were passe, or at least only >part of the picture? It does not happen. Tom, you really should try it anyway. Really. It produces some of the most amazing responses you'll ever encounter in your professional life. When I pointed out that unlike the artists they wanted to use (Van Halen, Clapton. Really.) Mr. Tom actually *uses* the effects we were asking him to endorse, they responded, "what difference does that make?" OK, thanks, my day's been ruined and it's but 8:00. I really thought I was outta this argument. Later, jd From ???@??? Fri Feb 06 10:21:05 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 6 05:29:18 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0nqE-0003Po-00; Fri, 6 Feb 1998 05:29:14 -0800 Message-Id: <199802061325.IAA01855@shell.monmouth.com> Reply-To: From: "andre" To: Subject: Re: Fripp's loop technique Date: Fri, 6 Feb 1998 08:25:17 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1162 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"n655fB.A.O1C.W9w20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2997 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 6 Feb 1998 05:29:14 -0800 X-UIDL: fe4cc34a2ea4e1ccb977b9dbbccaa3e8 > guess what I'm really looking for is some deeper analysis of Fripp's use of > looping. A lot of you seem to be very knowledgeable about him, so what can > you teach me? What sort of approach does he take to loops? Does he have > some typical processes or techniques? How do loops relate to his musical > style? Is there some sort of purpose or underlying motivation in his use of > looping? Has he developed his use of looping in any particular way over the > years? > > Non-frippheads want to know....> kim > for me - let the power fall - was a seminal RECORD to hear... i still love it - lush, up front guitar, using ol fashioned tape loops - what an influence. It was part of what prompted me to take 'electronic music' with Daniel Goode at Rutgers - where amonsgt other things - i got to learn how to make real tape loops - an indelible experience.but i digress.... On the league of gentlemen RECORD - there are these cool vignettes of looping synth, a bell-like sound , and every loop would add a couple notes..... that's a defining fripp moment. i think for him - repetition is more of a defining term, strictly speaking. Then theres his other , oft used technique of setting up a loop or loops, then having drum, bass, vocals, other guitar over it, so the loop acts as a background/ backwash for the 'song'. andre' From ???@??? Fri Feb 06 10:21:31 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 6 07:19:32 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0pYw-0002cs-00; Fri, 6 Feb 1998 07:19:30 -0800 Message-ID: From: David Kirkdorffer To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: screaming guitar Date: Fri, 6 Feb 1998 10:17:10 -0500 X-Priority: 3 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) Content-Type: text/plain Resent-Message-ID: <"KIElaC.A.HDC.Sky20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3000 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 6 Feb 1998 07:19:30 -0800 X-UIDL: 142155fe7c1fb901e1f679b16af553a7 Yes - one thing I like to do shout into the pickups of my guitar and loop the output. Sounds quite otherworldly once it's made it's way through a few effects. And then reversing the lot becomes quite a trip. However, I don't do this live much. Comes off as kinda too much when doing these loopy textures and then seeing some bloke scream into his guitar. Then again, maybe I should - and enhance the Neanderthal humour factor. (so often drained when everyone is sitting about listening). David -----Original Message----- From: Texture444@aol.com [SMTP:Texture444@aol.com] Sent: Thursday, February 05, 1998 7:44 PM To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Stockhausen, radios, minimalism ed, thanks for the stockhausen info-shite. on the 'nother tip, i've been using a coupla microcassette recorders, clocks, me voice & toys into guitar pickups for a bit of a while. best, dt From ???@??? Fri Feb 06 10:21:32 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 6 07:28:26 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0phY-0003f4-00; Fri, 6 Feb 1998 07:28:24 -0800 Sender: jfm3@ix.netcom.com Message-ID: <34DB2B03.2DC6198D@acm.org> Date: Fri, 06 Feb 1998 10:23:58 -0500 From: Joe Miklojcik Organization: Rutgers University ACS X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.0.30 i686) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com, cchohen@voicenet.com Subject: Re: Advice To Clever Children & on the backporch References: <34DA9C11.EDF@voicenet.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"JJ_XYB.A.11C.try20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3001 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 6 Feb 1998 07:28:24 -0800 X-UIDL: ff39ded1b7844d3a445a6548fef68de4 Charles Cohen wrote: > and Joseph Buck wrote: > > > Still looking for a Buchla Thunder. Don't think he is making them > > anymore.... > > He told me a couple of months ago he still has some for sale. Call him > in Berkely Don't know the number offhand, but he's in the phone book. > Buchla & Associates > I will sell my Thunder for a reasonable price. Please email me asap! (jfm3) From ???@??? Fri Feb 06 10:21:34 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 6 07:41:25 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0pu4-0004fs-00; Fri, 6 Feb 1998 07:41:20 -0800 From: Texture444@aol.com Message-ID: <3e33b029.34db2e2b@aol.com> Date: Fri, 6 Feb 1998 10:37:13 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: for an EDP system approach (was: backporch) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 84 Resent-Message-ID: <"I2d1TC.A.U_D.34y20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3002 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 6 Feb 1998 07:41:20 -0800 X-UIDL: 544c4b2e50d4d0d35d0589d551528076 while i still have this minute for quick-think: in my "backporch" post that began to include my loop-desire-dealies, i inadvertently skipped some key factors, yo : a mixer. a mixer! (it hasn't escaped my attention that some o'the listers, here, have posted on this very subject): for almost 2 years, i've been pitching some manufacturers (mackie: no response, rane: passed, tone king: wants to do it, but no resources, chris davis, speck: passed, and now, rivera amplifiers: thinking seriously & mesa: interested, but passed) on building an overly simplified kinda "matrix"-mixer, specifically for loop-purposes, but: w/lotsa other potential apps. starts, here: we're talking about a clean 12:2 (or, 8:2, whatever) stereo mixer (!critically!, in 2-4 rack spaces) w/no eq but, maybe, for a lo-cut, minimum 4 selectably pre- or post- fader sends w/individual send mutes, mutes on all channels, panning, maybe 1 or 2 mic-pres, touchy-feely-knobs (possibly: faders, or both but: touchy-feely!), coupla selectable turntable/or cd inputs, a single control for the main stereo output, headphone amp w/separate output ctrl, and "main" mutes. the touchy-feely thing is important, as is the user's ability to get instant & accurate visual feedback from the mixer's panel: in this regard, some color-coded bright led's might serve. the full-tilt (good name, that: "full-tilt": catchy, even) version includes a stereo sub-buss which can be assigned to the main outs, or it's own pair; all channels can be assigned to either/both busses, and the buss-to-output control is a horizontal crossfader. additionally, there's a big-assed 4-way spring- loaded toggle switch which, on it's vertical axis, acts as the crossfader does (but, in a momentary fashion); on the toggle's horizontal axis- in both directions -the switch turns all mixer outputs "off". (this could be achieved w/2 separate 3-way togglers). the full-tilt might also include an onboard, accessible programmable matrix for the sends, and/or programmable 'scenes' for the mutes: while i don't think of midi as a necessity, here, i'm sure it'd have it's uses. in a connected warp, something similar might be included in the next generation EDP, or as part of a feature-expanding rack-mount "add-on" to the current EDP***: multiple, user-selectable inputs-to-the-looper. {while i'm on this silly wishlist crap: it'd be wonderful to have a metronome/clock in the EDP, whereby you could pre-set the tempo of a loop and see and/or hear some kinda stupidly obvious & accurate light/audio blip; not that i'm gonna even mention wanting to have a tempo calculator for 'wild' loops (ie, "post-set" of tempo), nor my evil hankering for a "fit-to-chosen-tempo" function)}. {***ya know, like ya buy the original EDP, 'n then expand it w/the new unit(s)?} which sorta leads me to my foregone (though maybe not explicitly-enough stated) desired conclusion: an open, intensely flexible, cross-marketable, beginner-to-expert looping SYSTEM anyway, i think more, but: the soapbox is slippery, and i'm outta time! best to all, dt From ???@??? Sat Feb 07 03:16:28 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 6 14:18:20 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0w64-0004rk-00; Fri, 6 Feb 1998 14:18:08 -0800 Message-Id: <199802062152.NAA09288@scv2.apple.com> Subject: Re: screaming guitar Date: Fri, 6 Feb 98 15:53:27 -0000 x-sender: hartne.t@mail.apple.com x-mailer: Claris Emailer 1.1 From: "T.W. Hartnett" To: "Looper's Delight" Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Resent-Message-ID: <"gO_mDC.A.rID.bl420"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3018 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 6 Feb 1998 14:18:08 -0800 X-UIDL: 0b70b843cb714ad0801211136913494c >I used to put the strings of the guitar against my neck and talk, such that >my throat vibrated the strings. It was either that string vibration or the >actual sound of my voice getting picked up by microphonic pickups that >resulted in sound, not sure, but it worked alright. Hmm, don't think I've >tried that since I was about 14, maybe I should give it another go. The electric shaver or vibrator near the pickups is also a neat sound. Vibrators with a variable speed control are good to tune the resultant squall. Travis Hartnett From ???@??? Fri Feb 06 10:21:35 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 6 08:00:22 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0qCP-0006K0-00; Fri, 6 Feb 1998 08:00:17 -0800 From: ZeplinSoup@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Fri, 6 Feb 1998 10:55:36 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re:the forefront of loopmuse's setup Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 16-bit for Windows sub 64 Resent-Message-ID: <"sbyFkB.A.LeF.kKz20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3003 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 6 Feb 1998 08:00:17 -0800 X-UIDL: 66b9b357897397ecc6b484cdbc494849 dont know the name of who it is,but I can describe a few things about perhaps how or why it is on the forefront.whoever it is (Beavis?) this is how I envision their setup which makes them forefront: all instruments run through a computer running something similar to wavelab1.6 which has a "live input" feature.I always wonder why no one talks about it BTW.what you can do with it is use various direct x plugins -as many as your comp can handle-to treat your instrument inputs in 24-bit quality in real time and then use the outputs from the computer to feed your amps,jammies,and plexes-with the audiomedia III in NT have 24bit output--woohoo!(or whatever the current mac standards are now...or is there a standard for mac?(sigh). + midi control is available for some of these plugins-in particular the dsp-fx plugins which are supposed to sound better than anything including lexicon.with a midi fader box all parameters can be controlled for wildness.perhaps the looper on the front of fore will also be making his own sounds via physical modeling,perhaps with software help by the likes of Reality and virtual waves.these sounds i imagine people have never heard before.perhaps he is triggering these sounds from his guitar equipted with a midi converter and builds loop textures with these wild tones + .I could go on but I belive the forefront includes the new music technological breakthgoughs to startling degrees.... Reeve From ???@??? Fri Feb 06 10:21:37 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 6 08:06:05 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0qHx-000747-00; Fri, 6 Feb 1998 08:06:01 -0800 Message-Id: <98Feb6.095924cst.26891@gateway.gibson.com> X-Sender: tspauldi@mail.nash.gibson.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Fri, 6 Feb 1998 10:01:53 -0600 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Tom Spaulding Subject: Re: for an EDP system approach (was: backporch) In-Reply-To: <3e33b029.34db2e2b@aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"DiVO0B.A.h9F.dOz20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3004 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 6 Feb 1998 08:06:01 -0800 X-UIDL: 390a61804040a76b31d0602d1b8e5f68 DT- We like the sound of it (heh, heh). I am not the killer-app type, so if possible, can the denizens of this list think of any non-looping apps that I can use to pitch this dream mixer to the villa full of engineers at Viscount? Molto benne! BTW: Oberheim showed a prototype tabletop MIDI controller, the MC3000d that has: 2 ins, 2 thrus, 8 outs 128 MIDI channels, 8 Main Zones and 8 Aux zones, 8 sliders and three wheels, 3 system pedals and 5 assignable pedals, 48 tables of program changes, 16 ROM tables, 48 tables of SYS-EX with a learning function and check control. Cross-matrix MIDI patchbay programmable to each patch, Zone transportation, Mute, Solo, Filters, Bulk-dump 240x64 pixel LCD display. Perhaps some cross-pollination of the EDP, the Full-Tilt Mixer and the MC3000d would be just the thing... Tom From ???@??? Sat Feb 07 03:15:59 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 6 10:49:10 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0spf-0001C4-00; Fri, 6 Feb 1998 10:48:59 -0800 Message-Id: <215C1D5A0FFDD011B3CC00805FC18C291F6BC8@NTSRV2.LEXICON.COM> From: "Hogan, Greg (Exchange)" To: "'Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com'" Cc: "'SJP1138@worldnet.att.net'" Subject: RE: Vendors in New England for Studer-ReVox Date: Fri, 6 Feb 1998 11:50:54 -0500 X-Priority: 3 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) Content-Type: text/plain Resent-Message-ID: <"EBFanD.A.w7G.gh120"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3008 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 6 Feb 1998 10:48:59 -0800 X-UIDL: b5581607a920012b8fec96b3a8f47b75 Stepehn Porter posted:"Help, > Does anyone know of a vendor in Boston area that sells new ReVox B77 > Tape Recorders? Or the ReVox web address? > Thank You,Steve SJP1138@worldnet.att.net" > Try calling Studer at 212-807-0377. From ???@??? Sat Feb 07 03:16:02 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 6 11:20:35 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0tK7-0005P4-00; Fri, 6 Feb 1998 11:20:27 -0800 Message-Id: <199802061830.LAA00734@hyper.dimensional.com> From: "Scott Bullerwell" To: Subject: Re: Stockhausen, radios, minimalism Date: Fri, 6 Feb 1998 10:23:58 -0700 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"rmSvOB.A.BVD.88120"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3009 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 6 Feb 1998 11:20:27 -0800 X-UIDL: 900cd66b8a317ce3a623f7d390c4b237 Bret wrote: > Hey man, it was the 70's. Words to live by. Scott From ???@??? Fri Feb 06 10:21:51 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 6 09:42:43 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0rnS-0000F5-00; Fri, 6 Feb 1998 09:42:38 -0800 Message-Id: <3.0.1.32.19980206183615.011cc9ec@pop.stud.ntnu.no> X-Sender: eriklj@pop.stud.ntnu.no X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (32) Date: Fri, 06 Feb 1998 18:36:15 +0100 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: eriklj@stud.ntnu.no Subject: Re: screaming guitar In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"Y1bKOD.A.a0G.go020"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3005 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 6 Feb 1998 09:42:38 -0800 X-UIDL: 348fc3926f05e8b3bb43421c67d063c3 David Kirkdorffer wrote: >Yes - one thing I like to do shout into the pickups of my guitar and >loop the output. Sounds quite otherworldly once it's made it's way >through a few effects. And then reversing the lot becomes quite a trip. >However, I don't do this live much. Comes off as kinda too much when >doing these loopy textures and then seeing some bloke scream into his >guitar. Robert Hampson of Main has been known for doing this live as well. It can indeed produce some otherworldly sounds, but it doesn't seem to work very well with my J. Barden single coil pick ups (and I've tried shouting REALLY loud into them). So, eh, what I need is a bad guitar mic. that picks up a lot of hum and buss and other "unwanted" noise...any recomandations? Later, Erik Ljones (Norway) From ???@??? Sat Feb 07 03:16:01 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 6 11:20:35 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0tK6-0005Os-00; Fri, 6 Feb 1998 11:20:26 -0800 Message-Id: <199802061830.LAA00737@hyper.dimensional.com> From: "Scott Bullerwell" To: "Looper's Delight" Subject: Expensive black boxes with flashing lights Date: Fri, 6 Feb 1998 10:56:19 -0700 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"ILTb-D.A.OWD.D9120"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3010 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 6 Feb 1998 11:20:26 -0800 X-UIDL: 429189345f05ed4effab40c46a043737 Soundsculpture has a new product called the "Cosmix" which is a 1U rack thingy that does an awful lot of fancy signal path routing, syncing, etc. Designed primarily for automated ADAT mixdowns where MTC sync is helpful, it also has live applications when multiple signal sources are involved. http://www.soundsculpture.com/page0.htm includes a description. If you're not familiar with it, you might also want to look at their Switchblade device (used by the likes of Trey Gunn, Buck Dharma, Steve Rothery, and... (gasp) Fripp. Mondo-powerful midi-controlled analog signal path routing. Scott Bullerwell tanelorn@dimensional.com Boulder, Colorado, USA From ???@??? Sat Feb 07 03:16:32 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 6 15:01:56 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0wmH-0002Yq-00; Fri, 6 Feb 1998 15:01:45 -0800 Message-ID: <34DB4EF3.34B4@nyfac.com> Date: Fri, 06 Feb 1998 17:57:07 +0000 From: tbajus Reply-To: nyfac2@nyfac.com X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (WinNT; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: screaming vibrators, and other tricks References: <199802062152.NAA09288@scv2.apple.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"VTw5j.A.6MB.8P520"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3021 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 6 Feb 1998 15:01:45 -0800 X-UIDL: dc7f679d6bab9e6fc6da77fe3c7c642d T.W. Hartnett wrote: > > The electric shaver or vibrator near the pickups is also a neat sound. > Vibrators with a variable speed control are good to tune the resultant > squall. A friend of mine, Jordan Mamone of Alger Hiss, has a favorite toy for this sort of thing: an electric lint shaver/remover/thingy. He pressed his finger on the screen and pushes it against the blade, varying the speed (as well as whittling down his finger callouses a bit). I myself have used the old vibrator (as suggested by Reeves Gabriels) for noisemaking, as well as other uses.... Trevor From ???@??? Fri Feb 06 10:21:58 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 6 10:17:33 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0sL8-0004fC-00; Fri, 6 Feb 1998 10:17:26 -0800 Message-ID: <19980206180507.5388.qmail@hotmail.com> X-Originating-IP: [204.74.108.99] From: "Joseph Buck" To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: re: Buchla Thunder......... Content-Type: text/plain Date: Fri, 06 Feb 1998 10:05:06 PST Resent-Message-ID: <"lB72tB.A.KAD.rE120"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3007 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 6 Feb 1998 10:17:26 -0800 X-UIDL: f08bdc313767adeb59c3557699cb40a9 C- >He told me a couple of months ago he still has some for sale. Call him >in Berkely Don't know the number offhand, but he's in the phone book. >Buchla & Associates Will do! Good to hear. Thanks so much. Buck ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From ???@??? Sat Feb 07 03:17:20 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 6 16:45:12 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0yOM-000765-00; Fri, 6 Feb 1998 16:45:10 -0800 Message-Id: <199802070017.QAA09840@scv3.apple.com> Subject: Re: screaming guitar Date: Fri, 6 Feb 98 18:18:37 -0000 x-sender: hartne.t@mail.apple.com x-mailer: Claris Emailer 1.1 From: "T.W. Hartnett" To: "Looper's Delight" Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Resent-Message-ID: <"1bxXoD.A.ivF.Hz620"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3026 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 6 Feb 1998 16:45:10 -0800 X-UIDL: e41df5596f6e4fa536cc243e9823e048 >> The electric shaver or vibrator near the pickups is also a neat sound. >> Vibrators with a variable speed control are good to tune the resultant >> squall. > >The "O-Bow"! > >I laughed so hard when I read this that my officemate thought I'd finally >lost whatever was left of my mind. > >At the end of a performance you could toss it into the crowd and they'd >part like the Red Sea tryin' not to touch it. Hey I hold the O-bow in my *hand*... Travis From ???@??? Sat Feb 07 03:16:15 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 6 13:38:57 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0vU4-0007bQ-00; Fri, 6 Feb 1998 13:38:52 -0800 From: Paolo Valladolid Message-Id: <199802061846.KAA13677@waynesworld.ucsd.edu> Subject: Re: Pivotal loop moments, or, when did you realize your To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Date: Fri, 6 Feb 1998 10:46:58 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: <3.0.1.16.19980206163621.0bb7995c@rank-serv.elec.gla.ac.uk> from "Michael P. Hughes, Ph.D." at Feb 6, 98 04:36:21 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"umXR3B.A.PEG.GD420"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3015 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 6 Feb 1998 13:38:52 -0800 X-UIDL: b6ee8e5d34ad8916ccc3fcf74264e121 For me, my pivotal moments occured when I signed up for a class at UCSD entitled "Introduction To Music Making". The instructor turned out to be a large man with an equally large laugh named George Lewis. He said he wanted us to learn how to make music with anything instead of just playing the usual instruments in the conventional manner. Then he started playing videos and recordings of himself and some weirdos he played with like that old guy who plays his violin like he's going to start a fire from bowing so hard, a bandleader named John Zorn, a neck-bending guitar player named Bill... uhh... Frizz-something... :), and other folks. Among the many ideas he fed us for "music making" was collecting cheap stuff from pawn shops like old analog delay pedals (this was _before_ the vintage-anything craze), Radio Shack mixers, cassette tapes made for answering machines, and so on. He said he and his buddies used this cheap stuff (in conjunction with old boomboxes) to make loops and other noise. All in all, it was the most enjoyable class I ever took in college. I got turned on to the idea that making music in less conventional ways could be really fun. Quite a few students left because they were pissed off by the strange music George played (actually, most of these were the ones that came to UCSD expecting a conservatory-type of music education and didn't realize the contemporary music bent of its music department). One stayed just long enough so that he could put on his project which involved him standing in the middle of the classroom repeating "This is bullshit!" over and over. I wonder what his grade was? :) Hey come to think of it, if he had made loops of "This is bullshit!" and played them for us he might have actually gotten a decent grade! :) :) :) But I think the ones that stayed were, like me, attracted to the playful atmosphere in music-making that George fostered. I got myself a delay pedal and used it to make haunted-house type noises for one of the three projects in which I participated. Maybe I ought to dig it out again and have more conversations with myself. Cheers, Paolo Valladolid --------------------------------------------------------------- |Moderator of Digital Guitar Digest, an Internet mailing list |\ |for Music Technology and Stringed Instruments | \ ---------------------------------------------------------------- | \ finger pvallado@waynesworld.ucsd.edu for more info \ | \ http://waynesworld.ucsd.edu/DigitalGuitar/home.html \| ----------------------------------------------------------------- From ???@??? Sat Feb 07 03:16:07 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 6 12:43:20 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0uc8-0000VD-00; Fri, 6 Feb 1998 12:43:08 -0800 Message-ID: <01BD3331.663A1AE0.andrew@bocs.co.uk> From: Andrew To: "'Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com'" Subject: RE: Stockhausen, radios, minimalism Date: Fri, 6 Feb 1998 18:59:48 -0000 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet E-mail/MAPI - 8.0.0.4211 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"LLHjLC.A.JGG.zK320"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3013 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 6 Feb 1998 12:43:09 -0800 X-UIDL: 7bf5135203eb48df10415e6c7b3a2fe8 . I used to have fun playing a guitar through the audio input of a micro moog in a couple of ways. One is to set the random, auto trigger sample hold to control the filter frequency with the filter quite resonsant. Frank Zappa has used this too good effect (isn't his an oberheim sample hold?). yes indeed, check out 'Ship Ahoy' on 'Shut up n' play yer Guitar' - amazing sounds. Also , 'Black Napkins' off 'Zoot Allures' has more of the same. Anyone out there know how to make these sounds on currently available equipment ? Regards Andrew Andrew@bocs.com From ???@??? Sat Feb 07 03:16:03 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 6 11:44:47 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0thY-0000p1-00; Fri, 6 Feb 1998 11:44:40 -0800 Message-ID: <01BD330C.B087B5F0@TD-300> From: jprice@intcpi.com (John Price) To: "'loopers-delight@annihilist.com'" Subject: Date: Fri, 6 Feb 1998 14:37:00 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"oiuBGB.A.RxG.5W220"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3011 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 6 Feb 1998 11:44:40 -0800 X-UIDL: 659e0cc78d80ef8f1473bf730b4f0b09 Here goes again: There has to be a more hands on way to build non rhythmic samples and static-non-pre - looped preset tones into full blown grooves that are triggered all live and in real time with perfect synchronization from scratch. I know Roland has a Drum set which gives you access to this type of Rhythm setup. Unfortunately, I'm a pathetic drummer with no patience or desire to learn how to be a decent real time skin banger. I'm convinced that there's gotta be a way to make MIDI and groove based music through clever looping live. It would put a little more of chaos and real time interaction with the technology into the picture and possibly add more color and diversity to clubland. Though Sequencing is cool for a lot of clever musical applications, I'm trying to approach this from say a traditional musicians perspective or better yet a jazz musicians perspective but one that shoots squarely at the dance floor. I know really good hip-hop DJ's can do something similar to this sorta thing from turn tables. But DJ's are usually ( not always ) using preexisting material and just spinning another tale on a tale that has already been told some time earlier. Now its not that this format isn't exciting or incapable of inspiration - God knows the nights Ive left the Dance floor in NYC or Philly shaking >from what were DJ Earthquakes. I'm just curious as to how the reception of the audience as well how the experience would be from a performance based perspective that was kinda worked for and more tangible for an audience and performer - similar to what DT expressed in an earlier post. For instance I'm more interested in taking something that generally provides basic tones accessible by hand or foot with sounds like a kick, snare, a hi-hat or a tom and looping them layer by layer adding melody on top of that & then building a piece more and more as ya go along using no preset beats, no preset loops,... just going for it as either one person or even as part of an ensemble. This may be a stupid question which has an answer I've overlooked. Or I may be asking for a mix of a many different things to form a new instrument. It's a burning question. Any thoughts anyone ??? JP From ???@??? Sat Feb 07 03:19:28 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 6 20:01:52 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y11Sd-0003sJ-00; Fri, 6 Feb 1998 20:01:47 -0800 Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Fri, 6 Feb 1998 22:19:03 +0200 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: patrick@his.com (Patrick Smith) Subject: Jamman, Vortex, Mackie Sightings Resent-Message-ID: <"I5sGUB.A.XuC.0r920"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3033 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 6 Feb 1998 20:01:47 -0800 X-UIDL: a58bb20bdcf5c36917f2f725300c61c4 Check out the Rogue Music Auction, soon. Currently there is one Jam Man, One Vortex, Two Mackies 1604VLZ's( I love mine BTW....tremendous routing options) and One Mackie 1202. I can feel the GAS building now. For those internationals on the list. GAS is an acronym for Gear Avarice Syndrome. :) Patrick *** *** ** Fingerpaint http://www.his.com/~patrick/FNGP.html *** ** From ???@??? Sat Feb 07 03:16:08 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 6 13:03:30 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0uaj-0000J0-00; Fri, 6 Feb 1998 12:41:41 -0800 Message-Id: <199802062019.UAA28098@beryl.sol.co.uk> From: "John Stevens" To: "LOOPERS-DELIGHT" Subject: MUCHO FRIPPERY Date: Fri, 6 Feb 1998 20:25:21 -0000 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"vxJugD.A.JuF.DI320"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3012 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 6 Feb 1998 12:41:42 -0800 X-UIDL: 841c484ac4656b011b16c85ae4571718 Seems many are missing the point: that the gig/event,whatever, IS the significant experience. I too love the old Frippertronics- and would "consume" more, were it available. But, also enjoy the current Soundscape recordings ; though I do agree Space Music is a retro-genre hook (shades of Gong, Hillage, T'dream et al) on which to hang this essentially forward-looking music. As for RF being cold, aloof etc etc.......all I can say is having studied with him on several GC courses that the Crafty One always seemed a decent, humane, generous spirited and instructive person who went out of his way to help those (especially klutzes like me ) to comprehend something of his vision and experience in music. John Stevens From ???@??? Sat Feb 07 03:20:34 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 6 22:58:57 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y14E3-0001Va-00; Fri, 6 Feb 1998 22:58:55 -0800 Message-ID: <2148EC143F29D1118BE000805FC13CD01E1F6D@migarexch01.maritz.com> From: "Liebig, Steuart A." To: "'Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com'" Subject: RE: looping as sin Date: Fri, 6 Feb 1998 14:41:18 -0600 X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) Resent-Message-ID: <"NCaSeC.A._JB.OWA30"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3040 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 6 Feb 1998 22:58:55 -0800 X-UIDL: 59847b4e2e431b5064c134c1d5f8d0cf > >If music is creative, it's creative . . . however if the MACHINE is > >dictating the "music" ("playing IC chips"), and NOT the player. Then > I > >do have a problem. If the machine HINDERS or LIMITS flexibility or > >musical decision-making I believe the tool is in charge and not the > >operator. (Of course it is cool to react to what is being spit back > at > >you . . . lots of grey area here to be sure.) > > > I think I agree. But at the same time, all instruments limit the musician. The idea is to work within those limits to generate beauty. Some artists are actually inspired by that. But at the same time, there will be those who are more fascinated by the hardware and by making it jump through as many hoops as possible. We need them too. Though we might not want to sit through an evening of it. Reg > But whatever tool you're using, from a piano to an Echoplex, is going > to > provide limitations. I mean a piano has only 88 notes. Talk about > the > tool being in charge... > "Limitations" can often just point you in different directions than > you > might have otherwise pursued... > In a world where people can request 4-bit sampling as an option on the > > EDP, the definition of limitation becomes very elastic indeed. > > Travis Hartnett > > > My guitar limits my flexibility because I can't play it perfectly. Even if I could I wouldn't be able to decide to play a chord with 13 notes in it. I can't do a lot of things with it, actually. My flexibility is very limited by this instrument that I managed to enjoy playing for the last 21 years. So the tool is in charge? Doesn't seem so. It just has a boundary of possibility within which I use it. I own a hammer which does a terrible job of cutting wood. But it sure is good at hammering. Should I hate my hammer for controlling me like this? Or should I accept it as a hammer, use my saw for cutting, and just get on with it? I'm reasonably certain that infinitely-capable tools are still a few years away, so you might expect to be subjegated to machines for a while. Or you might accept the limitation of a given tool and use it for whatever it does do, and have it serve your needs. In any event, the limits of the tools used will always dictate the music to some extent, as will the limits of the musician using them. How could you possibly avoid that? kim First off, I'm not the guy who came up with the "sin" angle, someone else can take credit for that. Second, I think it's interesting that this has created some real annoyance . . . I can agree with some of the stuff that's been written back . . . hence my remark about a grey area. BUT . . . the piano isn't making sound by itself (at least the acoustic piano isn't . . . John Cage 4'33"???), so I would dispute that it can be in charge as much as one of our favorite processors can. Electric Guitars/Basses can feedback without your fingers touching the strings . . . again, there's a lot of grey area here. People are also limited by thgeir own imaginations . . . (Personally, I'm from the Stravinsky school: I find freedom in small box [of parameters with which to deal].) I think that my original comment was taken somewhat out of context-it was about a SYNDROME, not the tech or the potential of the tech: IF someone is noodling with a guitar (or any instrument) without processing, it can be just as annoying (or more so) than any IC chip. But I have to go back to situations that I've been in where people were so hung up on their processors that they couldn't react to a group improv situation. As far as my experience goes, the micro-processors in these machines can't react as quickly as I can to someone else's playing, particulary where change of tonality is concerned. I guess I'm bugged when I feel that people are abdicating their musical flexibilty or decision-making to whatever tool it is that they use. Lastly, with all this talk of the human/instrument interface also being a "limitation" . . . my question is this: What is more capable of nuanced performance people or machines? For example, the old tech of Violins, etc. has been developed for many thousands of years, try to get a MIDI instrument to be as nuanced both from the hardware side and the performance practice side. I don't expect machines to perform as well as people, I use 'em and think that they're great tools, but I understand what I consider to be their limitations and uses. I've been using looping devices for about 14-15 years now, I really, really like 'em. I love a lot of processors, but they're no t the endall or be all. Not condemning tech, just some blind uses of it. From ???@??? Sat Feb 07 03:16:14 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 6 13:31:07 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0vMV-0006eP-00; Fri, 6 Feb 1998 13:31:03 -0800 Message-Id: <3.0.2.32.19980206162317.006c6194@dharma.mitre.org> X-Sender: seligman@dharma.mitre.org X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.2 (32) Date: Fri, 06 Feb 1998 16:23:17 -0500 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com, matthias@bahianet.com.br (Matthias Grob) From: Len Seligman Subject: How to route multiple instruments, loopers, etc. Cc: churwitz@igc.apc.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"V61AzC.A._HF.z7320"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3014 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 6 Feb 1998 13:31:03 -0800 X-UIDL: c89e664928a13b48f6acc7e9b67dd276 Dear Loop Dudes (and Dudesses), I've been puzzling over how to route multiple instruments and loopers and would appreciate any and all ideas. (As you can tell, I'm naive about the capabilities of modern mixers and other High Gear issues.) I'm a guitarist/vocalist/loopist playing with a violinist/vocalist/loopist. We want to be able to loop our instruments as well as vocals and would also like to be able to give a soundperson some control over our different levels. Here's what I'm currently thinking of doing: First, we run the guitar and violin through any effects and preamps we want, so that we like the basic tone. Then, split the signal of the guitar, violin and both vocals so that one "half" of each goes direct to the main mixer. Then take the "other half" of the guitar and my vocal mike, route it to a little mixer, then to my Echoplex (which would be set all the way to wet) and then have my loopage got to another channel of the main mixer. Similarly, Cheryl's violin and vocal would go direct to the main board, but also have them go to a little mixer which can be 'plexed (all the way on wet) and then run to the band board. At the band board, then, there would be 6 channels that a soundperson could control: live guitar, violin, and 2 vocals, plus my loopage and Cheryl's loopage. We have a Quadraverb that could be used in the effects loop of the main board. Is this a good way to do things? An alternative would be to not "split" the signals and then just have two inputs to the main mixer: all my stuff (both live and looped) and all Cheryl's stuff (both live and looped). But while this latter option has the virtue of simplicity, it doesn't give a soundperson much control, and it doesn't give much opportunity for using stereo in the mains. Also, with any of these approaches, we don't have a lot of flexibility in having different reverb levels of the different sound sources--e.g., for approach #1, there's a single reverb setting for all my loopage, regardless of sound source. Oh yeah, one more complication is that I may use some other sound sources, like a mandolin with some kind of pickup. Any recommendations on what to do would be greatly appreciated. Also, if we did "split" the signals from our instruments and vocals, what's the best way to do that? Is there a relatively inexpensive "splitter" box? Or do our individual mixers need to be sophisticated ones with all kinds of routing options? How do we not go completely broke with all this? Thanks a lot! -Len Looper's Anonymous of Silver Spring, Maryland (USA) From ???@??? Sat Feb 07 03:17:17 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 6 16:15:17 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0xvH-0003H8-00; Fri, 6 Feb 1998 16:15:07 -0800 Message-Id: <199802062146.OAA01960@hyper.dimensional.com> From: "Scott Bullerwell" To: Subject: Re: How to route multiple instruments, loopers, etc. Date: Fri, 6 Feb 1998 14:40:54 -0700 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"66HveD.A.mEC.NW620"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3024 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 6 Feb 1998 16:15:07 -0800 X-UIDL: 3d3c358752d3ccab9ffe922cc05c9f0e Len sed: > First, we run the guitar and violin through any effects and preamps we > want, so that we like the basic tone. Then, split the signal of the guitar, > violin and both vocals so that one "half" of each goes direct to the main > mixer. Then take the "other half" of the guitar and my vocal mike, route it > to a little mixer, then to my Echoplex (which would be set all the way to > wet) and then have my loopage got to another channel of the main mixer. > Similarly, Cheryl's violin and vocal would go direct to the main board, but > also have them go to a little mixer which can be 'plexed (all the way on > wet) and then run to the band board. At the band board, then, there would > be 6 channels that a soundperson could control: live guitar, violin, and 2 > vocals, plus my loopage and Cheryl's loopage. We have a Quadraverb that > could be used in the effects loop of the main board. Channel outs, half-inserts, etc. can be pulled off the board and routed to a little resistance mixer like the DOD, then into the looper, and then the looper output can be run to a vacant channel. You can also run the loopers off free Aux sends. If you use stereo loops this could eat up your Aux bus real fast, though, crowding out FX units. > Any recommendations on what to do would be greatly appreciated. Also, if we > did "split" the signals from our instruments and vocals, what's the best > way to do that? Is there a relatively inexpensive "splitter" box? Or do our > individual mixers need to be sophisticated ones with all kinds of routing > options? How do we not go completely broke with all this? Jeff Beck uses a simple Y-splitter. Morley has a passive ABY box that will do it. In my experience passive signal splitting is frequently lossy. Active signal splitting can be done by routing the mono signal to a stereo preamp. If you have lots of signals to split, consider running them into a stereo submix and sending the L and R of the submix (pan to the middle for mono) to your looper and board respectively. Last, expensive resort: see my recent post on the Switchblade etc. You'd be better served by advice from smart people, though. Anyone? Scott From ???@??? Sat Feb 07 03:16:26 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 6 13:59:49 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0vo5-0002Ti-00; Fri, 6 Feb 1998 13:59:34 -0800 Message-Id: <2.2.32.19980206214750.00c596a0@pop.chromatic.com> X-Sender: kflint@pop.chromatic.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 2.2 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Fri, 06 Feb 1998 13:47:50 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Kim Flint Subject: Re: screaming guitar Cc: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Resent-Message-ID: <"5fOYpC.A.5AB.vU420"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3016 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 6 Feb 1998 13:59:34 -0800 X-UIDL: 4d23f4fa4531988065436bebd1a0de80 At 10:17 AM 2/6/98 -0500, David Kirkdorffer wrote: >Yes - one thing I like to do shout into the pickups of my guitar and >loop the output. Sounds quite otherworldly once it's made it's way >through a few effects. And then reversing the lot becomes quite a trip. > I used to put the strings of the guitar against my neck and talk, such that my throat vibrated the strings. It was either that string vibration or the actual sound of my voice getting picked up by microphonic pickups that resulted in sound, not sure, but it worked alright. Hmm, don't think I've tried that since I was about 14, maybe I should give it another go. Last time I saw Buckethead he was using a star wars toy to do this. Wookie yells, yoda, "use the force Luke," it was great, perverted nostalgia. kim ________________________________________________________ Kim Flint 408-752-9284 Mpact System Engineering kflint@chromatic.com Chromatic Research http://www.chromatic.com From ???@??? Sat Feb 07 03:16:30 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 6 14:41:45 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0wSo-00004w-00; Fri, 6 Feb 1998 14:41:38 -0800 From: Paolo Valladolid Message-Id: <199802062149.NAA15246@waynesworld.ucsd.edu> Subject: Re: MUCHO FRIPPERY To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Date: Fri, 6 Feb 1998 13:49:46 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: <199802062019.UAA28098@beryl.sol.co.uk> from "John Stevens" at Feb 6, 98 08:25:21 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"8RSOpC.A.96F._6420"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3019 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 6 Feb 1998 14:41:38 -0800 X-UIDL: 34c58087a4f7ce5a316f9817d5bd9b82 Fripp is on the Elephant Talk list. Perhaps someone can convince him to come hang out with us a bit here on Loopers Delight. Then we'd all have a much better chance to understand what his thought processes are regarding looping. Cheers, Paolo Valladolid --------------------------------------------------------------- |Moderator of Digital Guitar Digest, an Internet mailing list |\ |for Music Technology and Stringed Instruments | \ ---------------------------------------------------------------- | \ finger pvallado@waynesworld.ucsd.edu for more info \ | \ http://waynesworld.ucsd.edu/DigitalGuitar/home.html \| ----------------------------------------------------------------- From ???@??? Sat Feb 07 03:16:29 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 6 14:41:44 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0wSm-00004U-00; Fri, 6 Feb 1998 14:41:36 -0800 From: Paolo Valladolid Message-Id: <199802062153.NAA15286@waynesworld.ucsd.edu> Subject: Re: Stockhausen, radios, minimalism To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Date: Fri, 6 Feb 1998 13:53:45 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: <01BD3331.663A1AE0.andrew@bocs.co.uk> from "Andrew" at Feb 6, 98 06:59:48 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"tDEsWB.A.Q7F.B7420"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3020 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 6 Feb 1998 14:41:36 -0800 X-UIDL: df5415484579d60e5c40ec5f1dbaa2cf > I used to have fun playing a guitar through the audio input of a micro > moog in a couple of ways. One is to set the random, auto trigger > sample hold to control the filter frequency with the filter quite > resonsant. Frank Zappa has used this too good effect (isn't his an > oberheim sample hold?). > > yes indeed, check out 'Ship Ahoy' on 'Shut up n' play yer Guitar' - amazing sounds. > Also , 'Black Napkins' off 'Zoot Allures' has more of the same. > > Anyone out there know how to make these sounds on currently available equipment ? > Peavey still makes an analog synth-type filter for guitar/bass/whatever. I think it's called the Spectrum or something like that. There's also the Pulse Plus made by Waldorf except it's actually a full-blown monophonic analog synth that happens to have an input. Cheers, Paolo Valladolid --------------------------------------------------------------- |Moderator of Digital Guitar Digest, an Internet mailing list |\ |for Music Technology and Stringed Instruments | \ ---------------------------------------------------------------- | \ finger pvallado@waynesworld.ucsd.edu for more info \ | \ http://waynesworld.ucsd.edu/DigitalGuitar/home.html \| ----------------------------------------------------------------- From ???@??? Sat Feb 07 03:16:27 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 6 14:08:09 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0vwD-0003Ym-00; Fri, 6 Feb 1998 14:07:58 -0800 X-Sender: doug@mail.lightlink.com Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <01BD330C.B087B5F0@TD-300> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Fri, 6 Feb 1998 17:00:35 -0500 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Doug Wyatt Subject: Re: Resent-Message-ID: <"NKWHq.A.8tB.Ya420"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3017 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 6 Feb 1998 14:07:58 -0800 X-UIDL: b35734510f815b3d374697419d14fa25 At 14:37 -0500 2/6/98, John Price wrote: > There has to be a more hands on way to build non rhythmic samples and >static-non-pre - looped preset tones into full blown grooves that are >triggered all live and in real time with perfect synchronization from >scratch. Have you checked out some of the more real-time things you can do with a MIDI sequencer? Some programs have a loop record mode where you can add notes while the loop plays, and have them play back quantized if that's what you want. Some are good at triggering entire sequences as layers, synchronized to sequences already playing. I work for Opcode and so my myopia is towards Vision. (www.opcode.com) Then there are programs like M (www.cycling74.com) which can use algorithms to shuffle around your notes and rhythms. I know, taking a computer onstage isn't easy (though i've done it). And I still wish for more realtime interactivity in the audio domain, like having my sampler be more like a looper and less one-mode-ish. Doug --- Doug Wyatt Sonosphere - music and music software doug@sonosphere.com http://www.sonosphere.com/ From ???@??? Sat Feb 07 03:17:16 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 6 16:14:42 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0xuX-0003BY-00; Fri, 6 Feb 1998 16:14:21 -0800 Message-Id: <199802062254.PAA02466@hyper.dimensional.com> From: "Scott Bullerwell" To: Subject: Re: screaming guitar Date: Fri, 6 Feb 1998 15:48:48 -0700 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"pZQeRD.A.JEC.LW620"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3023 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 6 Feb 1998 16:14:21 -0800 X-UIDL: eb8e72e27d60c700261704265dff23a3 Travis writes: > The electric shaver or vibrator near the pickups is also a neat sound. > Vibrators with a variable speed control are good to tune the resultant > squall. The "O-Bow"! I laughed so hard when I read this that my officemate thought I'd finally lost whatever was left of my mind. At the end of a performance you could toss it into the crowd and they'd part like the Red Sea tryin' not to touch it. >From The Home Office, Scott From ???@??? Sat Feb 07 03:16:33 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 6 15:04:06 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0woR-0002qI-00; Fri, 6 Feb 1998 15:03:59 -0800 From: KRosser414@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Fri, 6 Feb 1998 17:51:52 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Sharing moments... Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 18 Resent-Message-ID: <"K4TY5.A.6YB.ZR520"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3022 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 6 Feb 1998 15:03:59 -0800 X-UIDL: 0c6b6e9e80e0054652c617f662ac2daa >Anybody want to share a few moments that made them realize that they had >no alternative other than to become a loopster? Or shining moments? My interest in it started in the late 70's/early 80's when I was playing with rock bands and had two cheap-o tape Echoplex knock-offs with different lengths. Being a bit of a harmony freak from way back, one fun thing I used to do with them was play a series of intervals (verystraight witha clean dry guitar sound) in one and then a series of intervals in another in unrelated keys sometimes in different registers, other times all within the same octave, then set them both to looping at different lengths to hear how they recombined harmonically. Biggest lesson I learned from this: rock bands have no interest in this stuff. My looping in band situations was pretty much limited to droney textural bits when my focus as a player began to get clearer and I realized that when everyone was telling me what a drag it was that I couldn't just come up with "a solo" for each song and play it right, that really what I was craving was improvisational experience. I then exited the more straight-ahead song oriented rock world and got involved in some free improvising rock bands that were a bit of an offshoot of the early 80's arty-punk sorta thing but started to become frustrated by what seemed to be a willful disdain for knowing what the fuck you were doing which was sorta part & parcel of the times in the avant-rock world or so it seemed. I then realized to try to get deeper into being an improvisor it would help to be able to study a tradition in which improvising was integral. Granted, there's many great traditions like this all over the world, but being an American we have a great one right here that I could sink my teeth into, so I took a roughly 15-year detour into studying and playing jazz as much as possible. Not to say that I've even come close to mastering that particular idiom, but after studying what jazz has to offer in terms of harmonic improvisation, melodic development, free improvising, standard song forms, blues forms, etc., in the last few years I've found the road diverging again, where I'm realizing that my loyalty to jazz is as a vehicle or method for improvisation, not preservation or expanding of the jazz tradition, as much as I respect it. I'm an improvisor first, jazz musician second. Maybe looper third or so. I've spent the last couple years revisiting and refining a lot of the old things I learned about sound processing and specifically looping (though now it's a Lexicon LXP-5 and Digitech 7.6 Time machine in place of those old tape echoes) and I'm wondering how to combine this stuff with the vocabulary of techniques I learned in the jazz world. I did study one non-western tradition for a while, three years of the chinese pipa, but it was all classical-based, I'm not really sure what kind of improvising tradition there is with that instrument but my teacher, bless her, wants nothing to do with it. There is an improvising pipa player in NYC that's worked with Derek Bailey but I think she's an anomaly rather than the norm among pipa players. I know there's a pretty rich history of improvising in Arabic music and I just tried out this electric oud at the NAMM show that knocked my socks off, the guy that makes 'em is fairly local and gives lessons, so my mind's beginning to reel again... Where do I expect to end up from any of this? Beats me. To directly answer the initial question, there was no epiphanous moment when I realized I dug looping the same way I realized I'm an improvisor. To me looping in and of itself is about as intrinsically interesting as slide guitar, a minor 9th chord, soaring feedback or rhythm changes, in other words it's what you do with it. Others feel the same way about improvising. To each his or her own. I mostly lurk here for that reason, looking for the odd tip here or there. Ken R From ???@??? Sat Feb 07 15:18:57 1998 >From kflint Sat Feb 7 06:43:13 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y1BTM-0004Vf-00; Sat, 7 Feb 1998 06:43:12 -0800 From: Anthony Bowyer-Lowe To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com MMDF-Warning: Parse error in original version of preceding line at post.mail.demon.net Subject: Perforrmance composition. Date: Fri, 6 Feb 1998 23:50:43 -0000 Message-ID: <01bd335a$09e02680$LocalHost@amudarya> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Resent-Message-ID: <"ypASKD.A.XCE.BKH30"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3048 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sat, 7 Feb 1998 06:43:12 -0800 X-UIDL: 022d8a38ac727ec4a4940374ff5e2b15 >For instance I'm more interested in taking something that >generally provides basic tones accessible by hand or foot >with sounds like a kick, snare, a hi-hat or a tom and looping >them layer by layer adding melody on top of that & then building >a piece more and more as ya go along using no preset beats, no >preset loops,... just going for it as either one person or even >as part of an ensemble. Roland Tr808 drum machine (plus 606 for triggering other drum devices) plus Sequential Circuits Studio 440 midi sequencer, sampler, and drum programmer do this for me... Add other equipment (esp. synths/samplers with arpeggiators) to taste. Full realtime improvised composition. Yay... ynohtnA. -- Anthony Bowyer-Lowe <= The Essence Of Anthony. http://www.amudarya.demon.co.uk/ (Updated: 01/98) From ???@??? Sat Feb 07 03:17:19 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 6 16:24:07 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0y3p-0004NN-00; Fri, 6 Feb 1998 16:23:57 -0800 From: PJBMHB@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Fri, 6 Feb 1998 19:12:35 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: screaming guitar (Bardens) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 16-bit for Windows sub 41 Resent-Message-ID: <"DBfSFB.A.rzC.Ac620"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3025 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 6 Feb 1998 16:23:57 -0800 X-UIDL: 0d80435e5ec78a633c8ab8f95910237e I love my barden pickups. If i knew that they would inhibit my ability to shout into my guitar I don't know if I would have bought them. sarcastically, =-) PJ From ???@??? Fri Feb 06 10:21:28 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 6 06:59:57 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0pFz-00015o-00; Fri, 6 Feb 1998 06:59:55 -0800 Message-Id: <3.0.1.16.19980206163621.0bb7995c@rank-serv.elec.gla.ac.uk> X-Sender: pycraft@rank-serv.elec.gla.ac.uk X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.1 (16) Date: Fri, 06 Feb 1998 16:36:21 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: "Michael P. Hughes, Ph.D." Subject: Re: Pivotal loop moments, or, when did you realize your compulsive need to aquire toys had reached dangerous levels? Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"s3B5WB.A.as.ySy20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2999 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 6 Feb 1998 06:59:55 -0800 X-UIDL: f4b22aa3f624b3873d8d52f13e887aab Trevor: >Anybody want to share a few moments that made them realize that they had >no alternative other than to become a loopster? Or shining moments? I put the cart before the horse; I listened to my dad's copy of the Easter Monday flexi from Guitar Player, back before I'd ever touched a guitar in earnest. My dad's a guitar player, sort of Chet Atkins meets Hank Marvin, and he'd discarded the soundpage into the record pile whereupon I came across it. I was imressed, and read the article - it didn't make much sense, which I attributed to not playing guitar. Little did I know that Fripp never makes much sense anyway! I was blown away by that piece - at the time I was into Vangelis and Tangerine Dream, and this seemed similar but more jagged. And he was doing it on his own, which really intrigued me. So when I stated playing guitar myself (a couple of years later - after I'd left home, oddly enough), I knew I had to be a looper - initially on a Frontline 2-sec digital delay, now on the JamMan. It was, at least in part, loopmusic that inspired me to take up the guitar in the first place. Michael From ???@??? Sat Feb 07 03:17:27 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 6 17:21:28 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0yxG-0003Ss-00; Fri, 6 Feb 1998 17:21:14 -0800 Message-ID: <34DBB52B.ED2118B@mail.clt.bellsouth.net> Date: Fri, 06 Feb 1998 20:13:15 -0500 From: "Samuel D. Burns" Reply-To: usonian@bellsouth.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.02 [en]C-DIAL (Win95; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: question... References: Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="------------0285C57D0D0E8C2C8CE8CBF1" Resent-Message-ID: <"idDV7D.A.ZaC.kV720"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3027 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 6 Feb 1998 17:21:15 -0800 X-UIDL: 66bd506194a919d3d0d69cdb98078162 If you will allow me one viewpoint... I only have listened to some of his CD's, but more importantly, watched his video titled "The Robert Friptt String Quintet" and I sense a lack of passion and vitality, even though his music is quite interesting, he just doesn't project any "it" (in a Gertrude Stein sense.

Samuel D. Burns
2/6/98
 

2/
Goddess wrote:

  This question has been a curiousity of mine for a while now, and as the
conversation here lately has been concerned with people's feelings about
Robert Fripp which seem to be mostly negative, I thought this would be a
good place to ask it.

  What is it concerning him that seems to upset people so?

  I mean this question quite sincerely as I've noticed this happening
quite a lot in interviews, articles, etc.  I'm asking this because I don't
understand it and I'd genuinely like to know what's going on.  My
experiences with him have been warm, friendly and pleasant and I'm not
sure why he seems to come off to some people in such a negative light.  I
should probably add that this question is strictly my curiousity as a
musician,it doesn't come from being a "Fripp-fan", liking his music or
some such thing.  I've got no special affinity for Robert over anyone else
in my life and am not trying to "support" him.  I'm a musician, and I do
what I do.  Other musicians do what they do and that's that.  So, to
anyone who'd care to anser this question honestly, I'd be extremely
appreciative.  Anyway, let's all have some fun and play a lot of cool
music!

Sincerely, smiles and Thanks,

Corynne

  From ???@??? Sat Feb 07 03:17:28 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 6 17:36:22 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0zBl-0005LV-00; Fri, 6 Feb 1998 17:36:13 -0800 Message-ID: <34DBB59C.24873D81@mail.clt.bellsouth.net> Date: Fri, 06 Feb 1998 20:15:09 -0500 From: "Samuel D. Burns" Reply-To: usonian@bellsouth.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.02 [en]C-DIAL (Win95; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com" Subject: The Robert Fripp String Quintet video Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="------------6548AEE7FC3C84F11906CB81" Resent-Message-ID: <"F2DxRB.A.t0D.5g720"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3029 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 6 Feb 1998 17:36:13 -0800 X-UIDL: f43d665b5d98e08a4ef79e86040753ba I have the referenced video for sale, watched twice, for $25 plus shipping.  COD FedEx OK.  Samuel D. Burns
  From ???@??? Sat Feb 07 03:17:27 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 6 17:28:50 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0z4T-0004O7-00; Fri, 6 Feb 1998 17:28:41 -0800 Message-ID: <34DBB638.1C38C427@mail.clt.bellsouth.net> Date: Fri, 06 Feb 1998 20:17:44 -0500 From: "Samuel D. Burns" Reply-To: usonian@bellsouth.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.02 [en]C-DIAL (Win95; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com" Subject: Roland DJ-70 Sampling Keyboard Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="------------20283E727CC9A3D680989E27" Resent-Message-ID: <"vKucIC.A.R8C.vZ720"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3028 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 6 Feb 1998 17:28:41 -0800 X-UIDL: e62bb21a4a00715fc505b14412d27f59 The referenced keyboard, always used only in a private studio, with manual is for sale for $900.  As you may know, these units sold new for well over $2,500.  Great for automatic, instant looping sampling.  No, this is not the newest version with SCSI.    Fed Ex COD OK.
 
 
 
  From ???@??? Sat Feb 07 03:17:29 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 6 17:36:42 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0zCA-0005Od-00; Fri, 6 Feb 1998 17:36:38 -0800 Message-ID: <34DBB70D.12A55388@mail.clt.bellsouth.net> Date: Fri, 06 Feb 1998 20:21:18 -0500 From: "Samuel D. Burns" Reply-To: usonian@bellsouth.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.02 [en]C-DIAL (Win95; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com" Subject: Roland S220 Sampler For Sale Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="------------FBDB4E7E2B1C86539DD40E49" Resent-Message-ID: <"awbtWB.A.H2D.Ch720"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3030 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 6 Feb 1998 17:36:38 -0800 X-UIDL: abcc537f409ef8d032b1a46974bcdb58 This rack unit is my very first sampling baby...true, only about 5 seconds of sampling ability, and it saves to those funky little disks, but I will include over 30 of those disks, and sell this black box that introduced me to this great wonderful world of sampling and loops for $150, with a shoebox full of disks.  COD Fed Ex OK.

 Samuel D. Burns From ???@??? Sat Feb 07 03:17:38 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 6 18:22:48 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y0zuo-0002SZ-00; Fri, 6 Feb 1998 18:22:46 -0800 Message-ID: <34DBBCA8.5317@earthlink.net> Date: Fri, 06 Feb 1998 20:45:12 -0500 From: djdowling@earthlink.net Reply-To: djdowling@earthlink.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0-C-NSCP (Macintosh; U; 68K) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: unsubscribe References: <199802070017.QAA09840@scv3.apple.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"yzdNbD.A.e3B.LS820"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3031 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 6 Feb 1998 18:22:46 -0800 X-UIDL: 9807eeb6f555800211ad6af6eb4f584b please unsubscribe there are not enough hours in the day D From ???@??? Sat Feb 07 03:18:19 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 6 19:06:13 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y10aq-0006vl-00; Fri, 6 Feb 1998 19:06:12 -0800 Message-Id: <2.2.32.19980207030122.00b8a6f0@pop.chromatic.com> X-Sender: kflint@pop.chromatic.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 2.2 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Fri, 06 Feb 1998 19:01:22 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Kim Flint Subject: Re: real time groove loops Resent-Message-ID: <"q2rmKD.A.SCG.t6820"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3032 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 6 Feb 1998 19:06:12 -0800 X-UIDL: f7523c4a8a526e77134226ab8ef9c8bd At 02:37 PM 2/6/98 -0500, John Price wrote: >Here goes again: > >There has to be a more hands on way to build non rhythmic samples and >static-non-pre - looped preset tones into full blown grooves that are >triggered all live and in real time with perfect synchronization >from scratch. > >I know Roland has a Drum set which gives you access to this type of >Rhythm setup. Unfortunately, I'm a pathetic drummer with no patience >or desire to learn how to be a decent real time skin banger. > >I'm convinced that there's gotta be a way to make MIDI and groove >based music through clever looping live. It would put a little more >of chaos and real time interaction with the technology into the >picture and possibly add more color and diversity to clubland. > >Though Sequencing is cool for a lot of clever musical applications, >I'm trying to approach this from say a traditional musicians >perspective or better yet a jazz musicians perspective but one >that shoots squarely at the dance floor. > I've been thinking about this concept a lot lately, too. You're definitely not alone in wanting something like this, I see it in a lot of people. Even more, I see a lot of people on the verge of making this realization, but not quite there yet. Even just for the dance floor, there is a need for the music to respond and work with the energy of the crowd, which lends itself well to a live approach. Much of this music has a background of non-realtime, studio based composition, so I think it doesn't naturally dawn on people to do otherwise. But they're starting to... A lot of electronic music has exciting, complex, danceable grooves, and creating it by carefully entering things into a sequencer program on a computer just feels totally wrong. You should be able to jump around and be physically active and involved in creating it, in real time. With something like drum and bass, which really lends itself to a jazz perspective of improvisation and rhythmic complexity, this seems to become even more true. It just wants you to be involved and feeling it, yet the only way to really produce it is through insanely anal computer efforts. So how? There doesn't seem to be any good instruments for this. Trends are emerging, very much in the infancy. There's more real time access and control to sequencers, more knobs appearing on things. But nothing satisfying in the way an actual "instrument" is. I've been playing around with ideas like pre-composing rhythm fragments, and using them in real time. it's ok, sort of like having to communicate with predefined sentence fragments rather than being able to construct them on the fly. I don't have any gear that does this well, but the akai MPC boxes would work ok if you had the multiple output option. The roland sp808 might work, since it has some onboard mixing and effects. I've started experimenting with loopers for this, actually, and I think that approach is pretty interesting. Capturing bits of a groove from the sequencer, and mixing it back into the pattern in different ways, or mixing it into a different pattern. Very helpful to have multiple outputs from the sequencer for that, so that you can capture just a part of it, like the bass drum or something. I've also got drum triggers set up so I can play samples live, which I usually loop on the echoplex and sync to other patterns. I like having the actual audio looping, since there's more opportunity to muck with it and record the result, without needing numerous effects processors for every single sound source. This way I can record a loop with some effect box, then have the effect box free to patch into another signal and use a different effect. This is all in a very rudimentary, experimental stage so far, but I've had some fun with it. Since I've been getting more into percussion, and have acquired a variety of drums lately, I'll probably next want to be looping my live drum playing along with other stuff. Like you, I'm a crappy percussionist, but I can usually manage a cool rhythm once or twice without screwing it up. Looping is great for that, since the loop keeps it correct and in tempo. So that's another opportunity, I think, for mixing live and electronic sounds. Still, the tools just ain't happening yet, at least in the "instrument" sense. room for innovation..... kim ________________________________________________________ Kim Flint 408-752-9284 Mpact System Engineering kflint@chromatic.com Chromatic Research http://www.chromatic.com From ???@??? Sat Feb 07 03:19:31 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 6 20:04:15 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y11Uy-0004BT-00; Fri, 6 Feb 1998 20:04:12 -0800 Message-ID: <34DBDC9A.6A73@earthlink.net> Date: Fri, 06 Feb 1998 20:01:30 -0800 From: Andre LaFosse Reply-To: altruist@earthlink.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01-C-MACOS8 (Macintosh; I; 68K) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: real time groove loops References: <2.2.32.19980207030122.00b8a6f0@pop.chromatic.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"SLPjN.A.r5C.8s920"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3034 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 6 Feb 1998 20:04:12 -0800 X-UIDL: 189e4bc1e6ded88bd54c1a2b13836788 > At 02:37 PM 2/6/98 -0500, John Price wrote: > >Here goes again: > > > >There has to be a more hands on way to build non rhythmic samples and > >static-non-pre - looped preset tones into full blown grooves that are > >triggered all live and in real time with perfect synchronization > >from scratch. > >I'm convinced that there's gotta be a way to make MIDI and groove > >based music through clever looping live. It would put a little more > >of chaos and real time interaction with the technology into the > >picture and possibly add more color and diversity to clubland. The Echoplex is great for this. If you use the multiply and insert functions, you can get perfectly quantized cut-and-paste textures happening in real time with nothing "recorded" before the fact. You can quantize the multiples of the loop within the unit, or sync to an outside source like a sequencer or drum machine. As far as I'm concerned it's one of the most powerful and revolutionary features in the unit. One thing I've been doing lately is synchronizing a hard disc recorder so that it sends MIDI clock into the Echoplex, which then sends an audio signal back to the recorder. I then improvise some loops onto disk, using the quantize and multiply/insert functions. Once I've recorded a few minutes' worth of material, I go back and select the best bits from the improv, which are then looped within the recorder along a given track. The same basic thing could be done live, especially using MIDI sync. Kim said: > A lot of electronic music has exciting, complex, danceable grooves, and > creating it by carefully entering things into a sequencer program on a > computer just feels totally wrong. Funny, for me it makes perfect sense. I never use a sequencer program on a computer to buukd grooves, though. I use an old Roland TR-626, which has a built-in step time programmer, which I use to trigger percussion (or non-percussion) samples. You can loop a bar over and over, and add one drum sound at a time on a visual grid, so you hear the pattern building as you go. I create patterns on this and then transfer them onto the computer. It's the only way I could see doing it; there's no way I could come up with decent patterns entering them one-by-one in step time on a screen, or manually via keys on a keyboard. > You should be able to jump around and be > physically active and involved in creating it, in real time. I've actually seen quite a bit of footage of live techno shows where the guys are hopping up and down on stage -- which is pretty funny, because the only performance thing they're doing is hitting the "next pattern" button on their sequencer. Not quite the same thing, though. > With something > like drum and bass, which really lends itself to a jazz perspective of > improvisation and rhythmic complexity, this seems to become even more > true. I just don't think it's possible, in my opinion. A big part of the sound of jungle to my ears is the fact that you're getting very choppy, angular breaks in the sound, which stem from the ambience of the source sound being cut up into different subsections, or from the distinct sort of precision that comes from electronically triggering sampled sounds at high speeds. Those sorts of phenomena just don't exist in nature. I like quite a bit of the much-balleyhooed Roni Size album, which mixes live rhythm sections with electronics in a d&b context, but a lot of the rhythms just don't grab me because the "real" drummers I've heard trying to play d&b grooves on that and other projects just don't (and, I would venture to suggest, very likely *couldn't*) have the characteristic supple-yet-ultra-precise sound that I'm always looking for in that music. I think this is one of the reasons there's so much hubbub over d&b: It represents a new level of intricacy and complexity being brought to what is often a characteristically rigid genre, and it's happening on the technology's own terms, to come up with things that someone behind an acoustic drum kit can't really play. > I've been playing around with ideas like pre-composing rhythm fragments, and > using them in real time. it's ok, sort of like having to communicate with > predefined sentence fragments rather than being able to construct them on > the fly. I did a couple of jungle remixes with a fellow musician, which consisted of doing this sort of thing live to tape. I set up several different channels of drum loops on a multitrack hard disk recorder, and then we improvised the mix, bringing different combinations in and out of the mix by muting or unmuting channels of loops. Listening back to some of those mixes, there are some interesting combinations of parts that I wouldn't have thought of if I were piecing it together. But I don't know that I'd say the mixes have all that "live" of a feel (although, at 189 and 204 BPM, respectively, they're not exactly insomnia-curing). > Still, the tools just ain't happening yet, at least in the > "instrument" > sense. room for innovation..... It would be great to see something like that come to pass, but I just don't see how it's fundamentally possible, any more than it would be possible, say, for Enya to do a live rendition of her hundreds of multitracked vocal parts. It's the age-old live-vs.-studio debate. So much modern dance music is an inherently studio-based thing, and I do think there's a limit as to how much of that side of things can realistically be transferred into the spontaneous, live realm. For me, that's one of the interesting dualities of the music: that something so energetic and lively can be produced by a method so deliberate and painstaking. --Andre From ???@??? Sat Feb 07 03:19:35 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 6 20:08:50 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y11ZP-0004j0-00; Fri, 6 Feb 1998 20:08:47 -0800 Message-Id: <1.5.4.32.19980207040403.0066bfd4@tiac.net> X-Sender: rphunt@tiac.net X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Fri, 06 Feb 1998 23:04:03 -0500 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Reginald Hunt Subject: Re: Resent-Message-ID: <"N3krSD.A.FDE.51920"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3035 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 6 Feb 1998 20:08:47 -0800 X-UIDL: f59899d890c24661a53bb107c46895ea This is a semi-reply, since I might be mistaken about what your referring to... One thing I've fiddled with is using the GR-1 (which has drums, basses, etc.) into a Jamman to create looping grooves that I can add to or solo over. It takes practice though, cause grooves are touchy things. I've also wondered if something like a "MIDI Delay" box wouldn't be interesting. Something that would: 1. Accept MIDI input and then output it again & again after a set delay time, like loop record on a sequencer. Then it could possibly use preset rules to change the data on each repeat, if desired, incl. note number, velocity, channel, mod, bend... 2. Provide a click on a selected MIDI note. So you could start out with a bass drum or hi-hat for example. 3. Store preset loop parameters, allow multiple loops as part of the preset, allow saving of the loops to disk or thru MIDI dump. 5. Follow MIDI clock, incl. tempo changes. 6. Have incredibly long loops with little RAM. 7. Let you do this w/o dragging a computer around. Has anyone already seen something like this on the market? Does it sound useful? Forgive me if I missed the point. Reg At 02:37 PM 2/6/98 -0500, you wrote: >Here goes again: > >There has to be a more hands on way to build non rhythmic samples and static-non-pre - looped preset tones into full blown grooves that are triggered all live and in real time with perfect synchronization from scratch. > >I know Roland has a Drum set which gives you access to this type of Rhythm setup. Unfortunately, I'm a pathetic drummer with no patience or desire to learn how to be a decent real time skin banger. > >I'm convinced that there's gotta be a way to make MIDI and groove based music through clever looping live. It would put a little more of chaos and real time interaction with the technology into the picture and possibly add more color and diversity to clubland. > >Though Sequencing is cool for a lot of clever musical applications, I'm trying to approach this from say a traditional musicians perspective or better yet a jazz musicians perspective but one that shoots squarely at the dance floor. > >I know really good hip-hop DJ's can do something similar to this sorta thing from turn tables. But DJ's are usually ( not always ) using preexisting material and just spinning another tale on a tale that has already been told some time earlier. > >Now its not that this format isn't exciting or incapable of inspiration - God knows the nights Ive left the Dance floor in NYC or Philly shaking from what were DJ Earthquakes. I'm just curious as to how the reception of the audience as well how the experience would be from a performance based perspective that was kinda worked for and more tangible for an audience and performer - similar to what DT expressed in an earlier post. > >For instance I'm more interested in taking something that generally provides basic tones accessible by hand or foot with sounds like a kick, snare, a hi-hat or a tom and looping them layer by layer adding melody on top of that & then building a piece more and more as ya go along using no preset beats, no preset loops,... just going for it as either one person or even as part of an ensemble. > >This may be a stupid question which has an answer I've overlooked. Or I may be asking for a mix of a many different things to form a new instrument. > >It's a burning question. Any thoughts anyone ??? > >JP > > > > From ???@??? Sat Feb 07 03:20:05 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 6 21:04:55 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y12Rh-00012e-00; Fri, 6 Feb 1998 21:04:53 -0800 Message-Id: <3.0.3.32.19980206205831.009f8320@global.california.com> X-Sender: sechevar@global.california.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.3 (32) Date: Fri, 06 Feb 1998 20:58:31 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Sean Echevarria Subject: Re: Jamman, Vortex, Mackie Sightings In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"xc6GyC.A.al.hq-20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3036 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 6 Feb 1998 21:04:53 -0800 X-UIDL: b5462310ead61f0d4fa4cd10858a93c3 I thought it was Gear Acquisition Syndrome... At 10:19 PM 2/6/98 +0200, you wrote: >For those internationals on the list. GAS is an acronym for Gear Avarice >Syndrome. :) From ???@??? Sat Feb 07 03:20:08 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 6 21:38:32 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y12yC-0003XH-00; Fri, 6 Feb 1998 21:38:28 -0800 Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Fri, 6 Feb 1998 21:35:47 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: improv@peak.org (Dave Trenkel) Subject: Re: screaming guitar Resent-Message-ID: <"VYCr2.A.BBD.oK_20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3037 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 6 Feb 1998 21:38:28 -0800 X-UIDL: 150cb8d5d2cb651ab51db9c17dc875c4 >Yes - one thing I like to do shout into the pickups of my guitar and >loop the output. Sounds quite otherworldly once it's made it's way >through a few effects. And then reversing the lot becomes quite a trip. > >However, I don't do this live much. Comes off as kinda too much when >doing these loopy textures and then seeing some bloke scream into his >guitar. > >Then again, maybe I should - and enhance the Neanderthal humour factor. >(so often drained when everyone is sitting about listening). > >David Mark France, the guitarist I play with in Minus, uses a thin strip of some kind of flexible metal that he attaches to one of his pickups, held in place by the magnets. He takes one end of the strip between his lips and hums into it, and the it gets (very) amplified by the pickups, and usually run through a fuzz and envelope filter. We do a Miles Davis tune where he plays the head this way, the sound is really eerie. ________________________________________________________ Dave Trenkel : improv@peak.org : www.peak.org/~improv/ "...there will come a day when you won't have to use gasoline. You'd simply take a cassette and put it in your car, let it run. You'd have to have the proper type of music. Like you take two sticks, put 'em together, make fire. You take some notes and rub 'em together - dum, dum, dum, dum - fire, cosmic fire." -Sun Ra ________________________________________________________ From ???@??? Sat Feb 07 03:20:09 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 6 22:00:28 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y13JS-00058j-00; Fri, 6 Feb 1998 22:00:26 -0800 Message-Id: <2.2.32.19980207055704.00bc5f98@pop.chromatic.com> X-Sender: kflint@pop.chromatic.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 2.2 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Fri, 06 Feb 1998 21:57:04 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Kim Flint Subject: Re: real time groove loops Resent-Message-ID: <"95x2FD.A.dkE.Zf_20"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3038 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 6 Feb 1998 22:00:26 -0800 X-UIDL: f6ac57b167fb2d724d7be7d8741aa99f At 08:01 PM 2/6/98 -0800, Andre LaFosse wrote: >Kim said: >> A lot of electronic music has exciting, complex, danceable grooves, and >> creating it by carefully entering things into a sequencer program on a >> computer just feels totally wrong. > >Funny, for me it makes perfect sense. I never use a sequencer program >on a computer to buukd grooves, though. I use an old Roland TR-626, >which has a built-in step time programmer, which I use to trigger >percussion (or non-percussion) samples. You can loop a bar over and >over, and add one drum sound at a time on a visual grid, so you hear the >pattern building as you go. I create patterns on this and then transfer >them onto the computer. It's the only way I could see doing it; there's >no way I could come up with decent patterns entering them one-by-one in >step time on a screen, or manually via keys on a keyboard. I guess it "feels totally wrong" because I've been dealing with live percussion in so many different forms for so long, and I always approach it that way. (I realized a long time ago that I'm a frustrated drummer playing the wrong instrument, I was always air-drumming instead of air-guitaring...) I usually have the beat I want in my head and can usually play it, in a very immediate, "just feel it" sort of way. Programming it from there is usually very tedious. The worst part is getting that "feel" right because I have to figure out, in a very analytical way, the very human aspects of rhythm. Like leading or lagging the beat, degrees of swing, dynamics in accents, etc. Getting it right takes forever and is very frustrating for someone with an attention span as short as mine. And certainly, the "liveness" is gone. A good instrument, in an abstracted sense of it, would allow those ideas to flow without interference. (With some practice and dedication of course, as any good instrument should require.) It would also allow me to intuitively create the music I like, without requiring that I sit in front of computers like I do all the other times in my life. >> You should be able to jump around and be >> physically active and involved in creating it, in real time. > >I've actually seen quite a bit of footage of live techno shows where the >guys are hopping up and down on stage -- which is pretty funny, because >the only performance thing they're doing is hitting the "next pattern" >button on their sequencer. Not quite the same thing, though. yeah, that's not what I mean. Nothing to do with the visual aspects on stage. Good, groovy rhythms come from your body, not your head. That's the most important thing I learned from my attempt to learn west african drumming. The rhythm has to be in your body or you never get it. I find that being physically involved in a rhythm has much better results than just thinking about it. And clicking a mouse just isn't that physical.... >> With something >> like drum and bass, which really lends itself to a jazz perspective of >> improvisation and rhythmic complexity, this seems to become even more > true. > >I just don't think it's possible, in my opinion. A big part of the >sound of jungle to my ears is the fact that you're getting very choppy, >angular breaks in the sound, which stem from the ambience of the source >sound being cut up into different subsections, or from the distinct sort >of precision that comes from electronically triggering sampled sounds at >high speeds. Those sorts of phenomena just don't exist in nature. oh sure. I'm not talking about instruments in any traditional sense, or trying to have live drummers in drum and bass. That might be sort of interesting, but mostly misses the point, as you noted. It's contrained by nature and tradition, whereas drum and bass is not. I'm wondering what an actual *instrument* might be that could allow a music like drum and bass to be created in the sort of musically intuitive, live, improvisational fashion that I love, and allow for all those characteristics that I like in drum and bass. Most likely, it wouldn't much resemble any traditional sort of instrument, although it might likely have elements of those. (old ideas are often good ideas....) Not possible? I don't think I know that phrase.....there's "difficult" and "time consuming" and "expensive" but nothing's impossible..... >music. I think this is one of the reasons there's so much hubbub over >d&b: It represents a new level of intricacy and complexity being brought >to what is often a characteristically rigid genre, and it's happening on >the technology's own terms, to come up with things that someone behind >an acoustic drum kit can't really play. absolutely. One thing I like about drum and bass is that it has abstracted percussion quite a bit, and deals with it in and of itself. Constraints imposed by centuries of tradition are just absent, as are constraints of human capability. It's just percussion. An instrument that fits with that would also have to free itself from traditions, and allow for entirely new approaches. >> Still, the tools just ain't happening yet, at least in the >> "instrument" >> sense. room for innovation..... > >It would be great to see something like that come to pass, but I just >don't see how it's fundamentally possible, Not being able to see how it's possible is the thing that separates us normal folks from the geniuses! It's the Matthias' and Don Buchla's and Einstein's who are able to envision these things and bring them to us, usually long before we are able to accept them. I have the foolish faith in human ingenuity that's telling me that somewhere, sometime, someone will find the answer. The sooner the better, actually.... >multitracked vocal parts. It's the age-old live-vs.-studio debate. So >much modern dance music is an inherently studio-based thing, and I do >think there's a limit as to how much of that side of things can >realistically be transferred into the spontaneous, live realm. Maybe the trick is to consider the studio an instrument, rather than an assortment of tools connected together. Design it according to some conceptions and rules of "instrument" and maybe you are on the right track.... I've heard remix artists talk about their studios this way. >For me, >that's one of the interesting dualities of the music: that something so >energetic and lively can be produced by a method so deliberate and >painstaking. For me, that's just a problem begging for a solution.....I guess that's why I wound up being an engineer. kim ________________________________________________________ Kim Flint 408-752-9284 Mpact System Engineering kflint@chromatic.com Chromatic Research http://www.chromatic.com From ???@??? Sat Feb 07 03:20:32 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 6 22:48:20 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y143m-0000W8-00; Fri, 6 Feb 1998 22:48:18 -0800 Message-Id: <1.5.4.32.19980207064310.00740c48@pop.mindspring.com> X-Sender: gls@pop.mindspring.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sat, 07 Feb 1998 00:43:10 -0600 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Grover Sheffield Subject: Re: Re: backporch of looping (was: forefront) Resent-Message-ID: <"WQ6gZD.A.xL.DMA30"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3039 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 6 Feb 1998 22:48:18 -0800 X-UIDL: d9d59950d097fdeaa57685a95e6098f5 Thanks - I enjoyed that! Grover At 06:27 PM 2/5/98 EST, you wrote: >kim, >yup: >just checking! >anyway: >give *me* the new stuff, yo! >i always bored w/meself: >gotta keep moving, fluid, crisp: >try to fuck w/time'nspace some more, the way it do us! >best, >dt > > From ???@??? Sat Feb 07 15:18:53 1998 >From kflint Sat Feb 7 04:58:42 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y19qC-0000up-00; Sat, 7 Feb 1998 04:58:40 -0800 Mime-Version: 1.0 Date: Sat, 7 Feb 1998 10:26:33 +0300 Message-ID: <0000AA24.4007@poyry.com.br> From: miguel.barella@poyry.com.br (MAT) Subject: Re: AW: MUCHO FRIPPERY To: "'INTERNET:Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com'" , Michael Peters Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Description: cc:Mail note part Resent-Message-ID: <"g1mmlD.A.6p.znF30"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3046 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sat, 7 Feb 1998 04:58:40 -0800 X-UIDL: ebec3a913936fe271c0b28324133f956 It also happened to me. Guitar Craft courses changed everything. Miguel ___________________________ Separador de Resposta ______________________________ Assunto: AW: MUCHO FRIPPERY Autor: Michael Peters na internet Data: 07/02/1998 04:50 >As for RF being cold, aloof etc etc.......all I can say is having studied >with him on several GC courses that the Crafty One always seemed a >decent, humane, generous spirited and instructive person who went out of >his way to help those (especially klutzes like me ) to comprehend >something of his vision and experience in music. agreed - had the same experience Michael Peters http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/mpeters.htm From ???@??? Sat Feb 07 03:20:36 1998 >From kflint Sat Feb 7 00:08:54 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y15Jj-0005N5-00; Sat, 7 Feb 1998 00:08:51 -0800 Message-Id: <2.2.32.19980207080540.00bb1da8@pop.chromatic.com> X-Sender: kflint@pop.chromatic.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 2.2 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sat, 07 Feb 1998 00:05:40 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Kim Flint Subject: RE: looping as sin Resent-Message-ID: <"fIDt7.A.C0E._XB30"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3041 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sat, 7 Feb 1998 00:08:51 -0800 X-UIDL: 5ad714a3f296ec5255f5aafb3d88e195 At 02:41 PM 2/6/98 -0600, Liebig, Steuart A. wrote: > IF someone is noodling with a guitar (or any instrument) without >processing, it can be just as annoying (or more so) than any IC chip. >But I have to go back to situations that I've been in where people were >so hung up on their processors that they couldn't react to a group >improv situation. As far as my experience goes, the micro-processors in >these machines can't react as quickly as I can to someone else's >playing, particulary where change of tonality is concerned. I guess I'm >bugged when I feel that people are abdicating their musical flexibilty >or decision-making to whatever tool it is that they use. So it seems you are bothered by the people and not so much the tools they use? > Lastly, with all this talk of the human/instrument interface >also being a "limitation" . . . my question is this: What is more >capable of nuanced performance people or machines? For example, the old >tech of Violins, etc. has been developed for many thousands of years, >try to get a MIDI instrument to be as nuanced both from the hardware >side and the performance practice side. I don't expect machines to >perform as well as people, I use 'em and think that they're great tools, >but I understand what I consider to be their limitations and uses. I always find it remarkable when people perceive the newer, electronic devices as "technology" in preference to older things. I think the piano is one of the most stunning technological accomplishments humans have ever made. The amount of knowledge and invention that had to happen before the modern piano could exist is simply amazing. That to me is one of the finest examples of technology I can think of. Just because it's been basically finished for a hundred years doesn't lessen the technical accomplishment. Now, ICs are no slouch in the technology department either, but knowing what goes into them, I just don't see it as so amazing. It always strikes me as odd when people express an emotionally driven bias against the bits of technology that happened recently, but are accepting of what happened before some arbitrary date. It's luddite hypocrisy. (hmm, I should send that to Ted Kaczinski...) As you noted, some instruments have been in development for hundreds or even thousands of years. A LOT of people spent their entire lives on these, passing it on to generations of developers and inventors who spent their entire lives. Electronic instruments have a few decades on them, with most of the work happening in the last two. Maybe the refinements are still going on and have a ways to go? Really, I don't see any point in getting bent about that. It's like hating a four year old for not have the maturity and wisdom of his grandfather. Give it time, they'll get there. and there are certainly a lot of people making expressive, nuanced music with existing electronic instruments. Perhaps you just forced these instruments into an inappropriate context, and expected what they weren't really capable of? It seems like you developed your entire bias from playing in a group improv situation with somebody using a midi controller! And let me guess, was it that least developed of all midi devices, the guitar synth? A bit circumstantial, isn't it? The people who create remarkable music with electronic instruments use them for what the can do, and place that in service of their music. And a lot of what electronics can do isn't possible any other way, so for a lot of people it opens possiblities they could not have had otherwise. Some of them do pretty good stuff. And some people just play with the knobs and make goofy noises and never do anything remarkable other than enjoy themselves. You can't really fault them or the electronics for that, can you? kim ________________________________________________________ Kim Flint 408-752-9284 Mpact System Engineering kflint@chromatic.com Chromatic Research http://www.chromatic.com From ???@??? Sat Feb 07 03:20:44 1998 >From kflint Sat Feb 7 00:21:24 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y15Vq-0006Ri-00; Sat, 7 Feb 1998 00:21:22 -0800 Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sat, 7 Feb 1998 00:17:45 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: improv@peak.org (Dave Trenkel) Subject: Analog filters, was Re: Fernandes guy at NAMM Resent-Message-ID: <"pCIVWC.A.qqF.liB30"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3042 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sat, 7 Feb 1998 00:21:22 -0800 X-UIDL: 7ec5d642d252c2670de8f328b640f19b >In a message dated 98-02-04 16:56:05 EST, Paolo Valladolid wrote: > ><< This reminds me to ask... Has anyone here tried feeding their guitar/Stick/ > bass/whatever into the analog input of a Waldorf Pulse Plus or one of the > other analog synths that have analog inputs? I recall Robert (oh no!) > Fripp used to feed his Les Paul signal into a Synthi for his Frippertronics > sound. Pete Cosey did that too with Miles Davis. I think side one of > Pangaea has an extended guitar solo processed through a Synthi. >> > >I consistently run my guitar through an analog filterbank. I started out with >autowahs, attempting to confuse them via a volume pedal placed beforehand in >the signal chain; I've since moved on to an MAM Resonator filterbank, and >currently use a Lovetone Meatball filterbank/envelope follower, which is the >best I've found for severely altering the guitar envelope while allowing >"guitaristic" control (by picking pressure) of the resultant sound. The MAM >performs better (or at least it becomes more entertaining) placed after my >Echoplex, for coloring loops. Basically, filters (and synths that allow >external audio input to their VCF sections) can really get the guitar into >some seriously appealing--or unpleasant, depending on your personal >taste--analog-synthetic territory. > >-michael berk Analog filters are one of my true loves, and I've currently got an abundance. Here's what I'm currently using: Peavey SPAF: This is a 1 rack-space unit that gets consistantly sneered upon by the Analog Heaven purists, but I like mine quite a bit. It's a 24 db/octave filter modeled on the minimoog, with very snappy envelope response, programmable ADSR's for both filter and amplitude envelopes, extensive MIDI capabilities, and they generally show up used for around $200-$250. I use mine constantly, it's one of the few pieces I don't think I'd ever part with. ARP Odyssey and Axxe: I have these 2 units patched together into a psuedo-modular, they have virtually identical filters, kind of thin sounding (12 db/octave), but I often patch stereo signals through them, with subtly different modulation on each channel, great for adding subtle motion to a sound without being obviously filtered. Doepfer A-100 series mini-modular: I only have their A-120 24db/octave low pass filter (they make several others), again modelled on the minimoog, but sounds completely different from the Peavey, much harder and glassier, with a fairly harsh resonance. I have their envelope follower module on order, which will make this a bit easier to use tp process external sounds. I'm very impressed with the capabilities of Doepfer stuff in general, and the fact that you can buy the modules seperately and build up your system slowly is quite nice. Their ring modulator is also excellent. Oberheim SEM: This is a single voice channel from Oberheims famous 2,4,6 & 8 voice synths. Mine was in pretty bad shape when I bought it, and I just fixed the external filter in, and added patch points for simultaneous high, low, and band pass outputs. The Oberheim filters have a very distinctive sound, the SEM filter will not go into self-oscillation, unlike the Moog and ARP styles. To be honest, I only finished the mods and repairs on this unit recently, and haven't really used this much, but it has some interesting possibilities. there's other things on the market as well, some very nice new stuff has come around lately like the MAM and Lovetone units Michael mentions, the Sherman Filterbank, which has gotten some good reviews and the Waldorf 4-pole, which is the filter section of the Pulse. And don't forget the cheap stomp box envelope filters, Bill Lasswell gets some awesome sounds out of the DOD unit. ________________________________________________________ Dave Trenkel : improv@peak.org : www.peak.org/~improv/ "...there will come a day when you won't have to use gasoline. You'd simply take a cassette and put it in your car, let it run. You'd have to have the proper type of music. Like you take two sticks, put 'em together, make fire. You take some notes and rub 'em together - dum, dum, dum, dum - fire, cosmic fire." -Sun Ra ________________________________________________________ From ???@??? Sat Feb 07 03:20:51 1998 >From kflint Sat Feb 7 01:55:03 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y16yT-0002YE-00; Sat, 7 Feb 1998 01:55:01 -0800 Date: Sat, 7 Feb 1998 04:50:11 -0500 From: Michael Peters Subject: AW: MUCHO FRIPPERY Sender: Michael Peters To: "'INTERNET:Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com'" Message-ID: <199802070451_MC2-3244-96E7@compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Disposition: inline Resent-Message-ID: <"0SD0JD.A.tHC.b7C30"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3043 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sat, 7 Feb 1998 01:55:01 -0800 X-UIDL: eb09d4ba60ae1f8f2961852d866302f9 >As for RF being cold, aloof etc etc.......all I can say is having studied >with him on several GC courses that the Crafty One always seemed a >decent, humane, generous spirited and instructive person who went out of >his way to help those (especially klutzes like me ) to comprehend >something of his vision and experience in music. agreed - had the same experience Michael Peters http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/mpeters.htm From ???@??? Sat Feb 07 03:20:52 1998 >From kflint Sat Feb 7 02:34:59 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y17b7-00048R-00; Sat, 7 Feb 1998 02:34:57 -0800 Date: Sat, 7 Feb 1998 05:31:15 -0500 From: Michael Peters Subject: AW: screaming guitar Sender: Michael Peters To: "'INTERNET:Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com'" Message-ID: <199802070531_MC2-324C-D0D6@compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Disposition: inline Resent-Message-ID: <"Wj_ebD.A.0sD.KhD30"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3044 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sat, 7 Feb 1998 02:34:57 -0800 X-UIDL: c686900ea5ffda347d323dfd0b225f78 >a thin strip of some kind of flexible metal that he >attaches to one of his pickups, held in place by the magnets that sounds *very* cool, and inventive! Michael Peters http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/mpeters.htm From ???@??? Sat Feb 07 15:18:49 1998 >From kflint Sat Feb 7 04:38:12 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y19WM-000015-00; Sat, 7 Feb 1998 04:38:10 -0800 X-Sender: LEO@MAIL.DINONET.IT X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Leonardo Cavallo Subject: Re: real time groove loops Date: Sat, 7 Feb 1998 13:44:00 +0100 Message-ID: <19980207124359859.AAA162@Default> Resent-Message-ID: <"S6kIhC.A.3JH.lUF30"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3045 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sat, 7 Feb 1998 04:38:10 -0800 X-UIDL: ffb449d13bf3c4e916c764df2ee8ed83 Really interesting topic, guys... Just tonight I've seen a live performance by an italian rapper with his band. There was a D.J. in the group too, and his solo moment was, in my opinion, the highlight of the show. With his turntable and scratching techniques he could play this enormous "rhythm machine", altering drum loops in real time like I've never seen on stage. He was really a turntable virtuoso, changing records and playing them with incredible speed and fluency. Altough I don't see myself beynd a turntable handling old vinyls in the near future, that use of rhythms is what I'd like to do with my samples. This guy could begin with a drum loop, mixing over another percussion pattern, creating interesting textures. Then he could alter the pitch and velocity of any loop creating various effects. But the most important aspect was the interactive side of his playing. He could react and improvise with its setup, creating a wide array of rhythmic patterns with a strong musical (rhythmic) sense. He was able to stop and repeat a single drum sound too. For example, from the first kick beat of a bar he could create infinite variations and improvisations over the other drum loop going. (I imagine what a guy with those skills could be in a non strictly hiphop situation. It's a sin that often people in music are not really interested in other music forms. I'd like to play with this guy in another setting, rock, funk, strictly jazz, prog, ambient..., out from the hip hop, "scratch because you have to" stereotype). Clearly, this kind of approach we're talking lends beyond the acustic drum kit and the human drummer. It's more, and d&b is the perfect example, lika rhythmic orchestra playing. It's "hyperdrums", and imagining of a real drummer playing that shit is nearly impossible. An interesting approach to live playin is combining breakbeats and real playin. If the drummer is well tuned in the idiom, the result it's a thrill (I've got some experience on this). And altough this rhythmic exasperation is strictly technologic dependant, I agree with Kim seeing it like a weird evolution of jazz rhytmic intricacy. If you listen to d&b you notice that in most cases the hyperdrum tracks are the only "instrument" in the piece costantly evolving and improvising. Improvising, it's the key word. Often the rest is strictly pattern based, but the drums are changing all over the place. Not being a drummer, not being a jungle producer, I'd like to be able to manipulate and improvise with these rhythms live, not just writing all those variations in some seq. >A good instrument, in an abstracted sense of it, would allow those ideas to >flow without interference. (With some practice and dedication of course, as >any good instrument should require.) It would also allow me to intuitively >create the music I like, without requiring that I sit in front of computers >like I do all the other times in my life. > Maybe some strange union between a turntable, a tape looper, a digital looper, a sampler, a mixer and a multi FX? What's about the new roland stuff? It seems to me that the answer to all this could came from the software too, not just the hardware. Computers applications in real time music are quickly evolving and offering interesting alternatives. In its semplicity, an with all its limitations, think to rebirth as example. Or the software based samplers and soft emulation synths. At a certain point you'll have the chance to connect all these progs together in a organic and functioning way to external modules and be able to create some real music. I know it's not as fancy as real funky knobs to operate on stage but could be the nearest solution in the next future. Consider that producing a software is a lot cheaper. What you think about it? ciao leo PS off topic (???). What are the chances to order an Echoplex here in Europe? From ???@??? Sat Feb 07 15:18:56 1998 >From kflint Sat Feb 7 06:34:19 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y1BKj-00041D-00; Sat, 7 Feb 1998 06:34:17 -0800 X-Sender: doug@mail.lightlink.com Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <2.2.32.19980207080540.00bb1da8@pop.chromatic.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sat, 7 Feb 1998 09:38:12 -0500 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Doug Wyatt Subject: RE: looping as sin Resent-Message-ID: <"oveYaB.A.fkD.fBH30"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3047 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sat, 7 Feb 1998 06:34:17 -0800 X-UIDL: 5cfd0e22afbb48ec09536616eac1d7fe Steuart wrote: > > guess I'm > >bugged when I feel that people are abdicating their musical flexibilty > >or decision-making to whatever tool it is that they use. I feel this too sometimes, but I also think that some constraints are a necessary element for creativitiy. I think of constraints as ways of letting us zoom in a bit from the perspective of "absolutely anything's possible" to "here's an interesting little bunch of ideas to be elaborated on." Now sure, using the same tool all the time might have an annoying tendency to keep us focused on one group of approaches instead of finding others. Kim wrote: > I always find it remarkable when people perceive the newer, electronic > devices as "technology" in preference to older things. I think the piano is > one of the most stunning technological accomplishments humans have ever > made. The amount of knowledge and invention that had to happen before the > modern piano could exist is simply amazing. That to me is one of the finest > examples of technology I can think of. Just because it's been basically > finished for a hundred years doesn't lessen the technical accomplishment. Agreed. Sometimes I think of how revolutionary equal temperament was. And yet, in the bigger picture, it too is a constraint. Sometimes I like to microtune my synths as a way of choosing a different constraint. Now if only there were an effects module in some of these digital pianos in order to try to reproduce what happens when you play more than one note, so it doesn't sound like two notes played in isolation from each other. Doug --- Doug Wyatt Sonosphere - music and music software doug@sonosphere.com http://www.sonosphere.com/ From ???@??? Sat Feb 07 15:18:58 1998 >From kflint Sat Feb 7 06:58:57 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y1Bia-0005OC-00; Sat, 7 Feb 1998 06:58:56 -0800 Message-ID: <01BD33AE.E26974D0.douglas-lawrence@home.com> From: Douglas Lawrence Reply-To: "douglas-lawrence@home.com" To: "'Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com'" Subject: FS: Lexicon JamMan Date: Sat, 7 Feb 1998 09:58:03 -0500 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet E-mail/MAPI - 8.0.0.4211 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"eYAtF.A.92E.pYH30"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3049 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sat, 7 Feb 1998 06:58:56 -0800 X-UIDL: 6e3a3c5cddfe17ffee0740c717e95e64 For Sale: Lexicon JamMan w/ full memory upgrade, footswitch, and manual. (Slight scratches on top when removed from rack, but face it perfect) I just got my Echoplex, so I don't need the JamMan anymore. I also got to pay the "Lexicon has discontinued this item" inflated price. I'll let go of it for $500 (I'll cover USPS shipping in the lower 48). Promply reply to e-mail at: Douglas-Lawrence@home.com From ???@??? Sat Feb 07 15:18:59 1998 >From kflint Sat Feb 7 07:11:30 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y1Bui-000626-00; Sat, 7 Feb 1998 07:11:28 -0800 Message-Id: <199802071509.KAA28327@shell.monmouth.com> Reply-To: From: "andre" To: Subject: Re: midi delay Date: Sat, 7 Feb 1998 10:08:15 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1162 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"cIXdOC.A.TdF.ZkH30"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3050 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sat, 7 Feb 1998 07:11:28 -0800 X-UIDL: 4fb9d3204d661bf4931deec13eb54e32 > One thing I've fiddled with is using the GR-1 (which has drums, basses, > etc.) into a Jamman to create looping grooves that I can add to or solo > over. It takes practice though, cause grooves are touchy things. > > I've also wondered if something like a "MIDI Delay" box wouldn't be > interesting. Something that would: i beleive the "pocket" midi people made one....??? i know others have as well. this idea exists..any one have one?? andre' From ???@??? Sat Feb 07 15:19:07 1998 >From kflint Sat Feb 7 07:55:59 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y1Cbj-0000K8-00; Sat, 7 Feb 1998 07:55:55 -0800 Message-Id: <1.5.4.32.19980207155221.00664f38@tiac.net> X-Sender: rphunt@tiac.net (Unverified) X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sat, 07 Feb 1998 10:52:21 -0500 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Reginald Hunt Subject: RE: looping as sin Resent-Message-ID: <"6SiFOC.A.IUH.vNI30"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3051 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sat, 7 Feb 1998 07:55:55 -0800 X-UIDL: 4854e823009cce0c5b2d0b7040b83f2c Kim's response to this is excellent! Here Here! Some other thoughts: >>my question is this: What is more >>capable of nuanced performance people or machines? >>I don't expect machines to >>perform as well as people, Machines are still pretty much doing what we tell them (when they work). GIGO. The user also has to be sensible as to what context they bring technology into. E.G., I like to develop loops synced w/ MIDI drum & bass tracks, but I might not want to try the same with a live rock band, unless the other musicians specifically wanted to do this, it would take their cooperation & patience. A performer may also make a better choice not to bring a technology into a certain situation, until they've mastered the device(s) well enough to work within the context. Or the other parties involved may want to expand their expectations. I was in a music class where the ensemble is basically jamming standard jazzbo, and for my solo I would push the guitar p/u's into the speaker and modulate the feedback with my phase shifter while swinging the guitar around. This angered the instructor, and may not have met current expectations, but it was fun to do (but maybe only for me, oh well). Reg At 12:05 AM 2/7/98 -0800, you wrote: >At 02:41 PM 2/6/98 -0600, Liebig, Steuart A. wrote: >> IF someone is noodling with a guitar (or any instrument) without >>processing, it can be just as annoying (or more so) than any IC chip. >>But I have to go back to situations that I've been in where people were >>so hung up on their processors that they couldn't react to a group >>improv situation. As far as my experience goes, the micro-processors in >>these machines can't react as quickly as I can to someone else's >>playing, particulary where change of tonality is concerned. I guess I'm >>bugged when I feel that people are abdicating their musical flexibilty >>or decision-making to whatever tool it is that they use. > >So it seems you are bothered by the people and not so much the tools they use? > > > >> Lastly, with all this talk of the human/instrument interface >>also being a "limitation" . . . my question is this: What is more >>capable of nuanced performance people or machines? For example, the old >>tech of Violins, etc. has been developed for many thousands of years, >>try to get a MIDI instrument to be as nuanced both from the hardware >>side and the performance practice side. I don't expect machines to >>perform as well as people, I use 'em and think that they're great tools, >>but I understand what I consider to be their limitations and uses. > >I always find it remarkable when people perceive the newer, electronic >devices as "technology" in preference to older things. I think the piano is >one of the most stunning technological accomplishments humans have ever >made. The amount of knowledge and invention that had to happen before the >modern piano could exist is simply amazing. That to me is one of the finest >examples of technology I can think of. Just because it's been basically >finished for a hundred years doesn't lessen the technical accomplishment. > >Now, ICs are no slouch in the technology department either, but knowing what >goes into them, I just don't see it as so amazing. It always strikes me as >odd when people express an emotionally driven bias against the bits of >technology that happened recently, but are accepting of what happened before >some arbitrary date. It's luddite hypocrisy. (hmm, I should send that to Ted >Kaczinski...) > >As you noted, some instruments have been in development for hundreds or even >thousands of years. A LOT of people spent their entire lives on these, >passing it on to generations of developers and inventors who spent their >entire lives. Electronic instruments have a few decades on them, with most >of the work happening in the last two. Maybe the refinements are still going >on and have a ways to go? Really, I don't see any point in getting bent >about that. It's like hating a four year old for not have the maturity and >wisdom of his grandfather. Give it time, they'll get there. > >and there are certainly a lot of people making expressive, nuanced music >with existing electronic instruments. Perhaps you just forced these >instruments into an inappropriate context, and expected what they weren't >really capable of? It seems like you developed your entire bias from playing >in a group improv situation with somebody using a midi controller! And let >me guess, was it that least developed of all midi devices, the guitar synth? >A bit circumstantial, isn't it? > >The people who create remarkable music with electronic instruments use them >for what the can do, and place that in service of their music. And a lot of >what electronics can do isn't possible any other way, so for a lot of people >it opens possiblities they could not have had otherwise. Some of them do >pretty good stuff. > >And some people just play with the knobs and make goofy noises and never do >anything remarkable other than enjoy themselves. You can't really fault them >or the electronics for that, can you? > >kim >________________________________________________________ >Kim Flint 408-752-9284 >Mpact System Engineering kflint@chromatic.com >Chromatic Research http://www.chromatic.com > > > > From ???@??? Sat Feb 07 15:19:08 1998 >From kflint Sat Feb 7 08:09:36 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y1Cox-0001Ec-00; Sat, 7 Feb 1998 08:09:35 -0800 Message-ID: <34DC895F.7BCA1814@mailbox.syr.edu> Date: Sat, 07 Feb 1998 11:18:39 -0500 From: mark sottilaro Reply-To: msottila@mailbox.syr.edu Organization: metaliminal X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.01 (Macintosh; I; PPC) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: looping as dinner. X-Priority: 3 (Normal) References: <1.5.4.32.19980207155221.00664f38@tiac.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"UUa2ID.A.b5.kaI30"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3052 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sat, 7 Feb 1998 08:09:35 -0800 X-UIDL: 26eba00320e5bc895b0c3bed9f9b391e A saxophone is a machine, as well as is a piano or guitar. Laurie Anderson once had a performance that involved a lot full of cars that she conducted. Also, if you have any problems with machines as art, check out the performance artists, "Survival Research Group" From ???@??? Sat Feb 07 15:19:13 1998 >From kflint Sat Feb 7 09:11:43 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y1Dmx-0004vw-00; Sat, 7 Feb 1998 09:11:35 -0800 Date: Sat, 7 Feb 1998 12:00:52 -0500 From: R & T Cummings Subject: Re: real time groove loops Sender: R & T Cummings To: "INTERNET:Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com" Message-ID: <199802071201_MC2-325E-746E@compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Disposition: inline Resent-Message-ID: <"HOvfCC.A.rpD.SPJ30"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3056 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sat, 7 Feb 1998 09:11:35 -0800 X-UIDL: e9696e4d0ddefee86c9d28866d6b8058 Kim wrote: >I like having the actual audio looping, since there's more opportunity to muck with it and record the result, without needing numerous effects processors for every single sound source. This way I can record a loop with some effect box, then have the effect box free to patch into another signal and use a different effect.< This sounds interesting - this is similar to what I'm trying to do! But what do you mean by having the actual audio looping? Do you trigger prerecorded loops (i.e. recorded with effects) or are you switching patches on the fly? BTW, Tom Roady is an experienced percussion sample looper - maybe he has some ideas? (Hi Tom) Thanks, Rob in Berlin From ???@??? Sat Feb 07 15:19:11 1998 >From kflint Sat Feb 7 09:11:09 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y1DmP-0004rO-00; Sat, 7 Feb 1998 09:11:01 -0800 Date: Sat, 7 Feb 1998 12:00:55 -0500 From: R & T Cummings Subject: Re: real time groove loops (The Return of) Sender: R & T Cummings To: "INTERNET:Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com" Message-ID: <199802071201_MC2-325E-7471@compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Disposition: inline Resent-Message-ID: <"CZwVCC.A.dmD.BPJ30"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3053 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sat, 7 Feb 1998 09:11:02 -0800 X-UIDL: bda7a37bd7d155a55adc53f598e3b12f Kim also wrote: >Good, groovy rhythms come from your body, not your head. That's the most important thing I learned from my attempt to learn west african drumming. The rhythm has to be in your body or you never get it. I find that being physically involved in a rhythm has much better results than just thinking about it. And clicking a mouse just isn't that physical....< Hey, that's well put! :-) I'm also someone who learned about West African drumming (a little). In fact I create loops using talking drum, kalimbas, bells, Tunesian drums, etc. etc. I usually play drum set live to my percussion loops as well as to insane analog drum machine (a Jomox - sounds great!) beats from my bandmate. It sounds like we have similiar approaches, except I don't (can't) play guitar! Anyways, glad to be on a thread I can relate to! (Sorry, but I don't know Fripp) From ???@??? Sat Feb 07 15:19:12 1998 >From kflint Sat Feb 7 09:11:42 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y1Dmv-0004vm-00; Sat, 7 Feb 1998 09:11:33 -0800 Date: Sat, 7 Feb 1998 12:00:59 -0500 From: R & T Cummings Subject: RE: looping as sin Sender: R & T Cummings To: "INTERNET:Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com" Message-ID: <199802071201_MC2-325E-7472@compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Disposition: inline Resent-Message-ID: <"3beMO.A._mD.EPJ30"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3054 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sat, 7 Feb 1998 09:11:33 -0800 X-UIDL: 96f3ac5f2e5e492301900b7c15000a59 Avec beaucoup du fromage, s'il vous plait: (in other words, it's a bit cheesy but appropriate) "It's not what you do, it's the way that you do it." Me, I like looping but I also dig playing acoustically. It's all OK to me. From ???@??? Sat Feb 07 15:19:14 1998 >From kflint Sat Feb 7 09:11:48 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y1Dn4-0004wy-00; Sat, 7 Feb 1998 09:11:42 -0800 Date: Sat, 7 Feb 1998 12:01:02 -0500 From: R & T Cummings Subject: Re: real time groove loops Sender: R & T Cummings To: "INTERNET:Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com" Message-ID: <199802071201_MC2-325E-7474@compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Disposition: inline Resent-Message-ID: <"7zSUZ.A.1oD.OPJ30"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3055 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sat, 7 Feb 1998 09:11:42 -0800 X-UIDL: c0757b081c15538dfd4b58d6c2585674 Leo wrote: >PS off topic (???). What are the chances to order an Echoplex here in Europe?< I second this request! :-) From ???@??? Sat Feb 07 15:19:32 1998 >From kflint Sat Feb 7 13:52:00 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y1IAG-0004yr-00; Sat, 7 Feb 1998 13:51:56 -0800 Message-Id: <3.0.2.16.19980207100050.24f77b30@texas.net> X-Sender: sharkey@texas.net (Unverified) X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.2 (16) Date: Sat, 07 Feb 1998 10:00:50 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: james rhodes Subject: San Antonio looping live at the Clipper Ship 02/20/98 In-Reply-To: <199802071201_MC2-325E-7472@compuserve.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"qJCkb.A.gBE.-XN30"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3058 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sat, 7 Feb 1998 13:51:56 -0800 X-UIDL: 5ac909b90e6dd247e80c78a4ea1f7e65 just thought i might mention a small live looping canvas at the Clipper Ship book store on Feb 20th, 1998 at 722 Balcones Heights Rd. San Antonio, TX (210) 734-5409... i will play for about an hour starting about 10:00pm, to be followed by Dreamland,,,playing as a quartet,(clarinet, sitar, guitar, and keys) they usually sound great,,,and are very talented,,..the guitarist(james Sidlo) uses a boomerang/parker fly/ebow approach,,,while the sitarist (Bob Catlin) uses a plex,,,the clarinet player has played with the San Antonio Symphony,,,and the synth/keyboardist uses a tasteful texture of sounds... the show's free,,,and theres probably free coffee....plan on recording the show live to CD,,,,so anyone in the area please drop by and support independent music...and by the way i'll be playing Chapman Stick/Keys with some live VHF from afar...thanks for your time james rhodes From ???@??? Sat Feb 07 15:19:28 1998 >From kflint Sat Feb 7 13:12:32 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y1HY6-0002ac-00; Sat, 7 Feb 1998 13:12:30 -0800 Message-ID: <34DCCEE0.4F49@earthlink.net> Date: Sat, 07 Feb 1998 13:15:12 -0800 From: Andre LaFosse Reply-To: altruist@earthlink.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01-C-MACOS8 (Macintosh; I; 68K) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: real time groove loops References: <2.2.32.19980207055704.00bc5f98@pop.chromatic.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"87O4PB.A.lGC.A2M30"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3057 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sat, 7 Feb 1998 13:12:30 -0800 X-UIDL: 3e312e1440e7dae5f6cf47daab391891 Kim Flint wrote: > Good, groovy rhythms come from your body, not your head. That's the > most important thing I learned from my attempt to learn west african > drumming. Didn't you study with Alfred Ladzekpo? He and his brother Kobla have been running the African program at my alma mater CalArts for many years now. Small world (or at least a small circle of left-leaning West Coast colleges). Anyway... > The rhythm has to be in your body or you never get it. I > find that > being physically involved in a rhythm has much better results than > just > thinking about it. And clicking a mouse just isn't that physical.... What if you took a program like Steinberg's Recycle! to chop up the different sections of a drum break, but then assigned each different section to a series of electronic drum pads that could trigger them? You'd basically have a number of groove sub-sections (maybe no longer than two or three eight-notes each) that could be played in a live, spontaneous manner. If the fragments are short enough, and the tempo fast enough, you could be doing enough to really be "playing" the rhythms yourself, even as the sampled bits fill in ultra-precise details of the groove. I also recall seeing an MTV news story many years ago about a guy (don't recall his name) who has designed a suit that had percussion pads all over it. So he produced rhythms by striking these different pads all over his body. including kick drum samples in his boot heel which he triggered by stomping the ground with his foot. Kind of a strange visual spectacle... It would definitely be more physically involved. Just don't get that snare pad on your knee confused with your nose... > I'm wondering what an actual *instrument* might be that could allow a > music > like drum and bass to be created in the sort of musically intuitive, > live, > improvisational fashion that I love, and allow for all those > characteristics > that I like in drum and bass. Most likely, it wouldn't much resemble > any > traditional sort of instrument, although it might likely have elements > of > those. (old ideas are often good ideas....) Well, it depends on a lot of what characteristics you really want to see translated from d&b into a live realm. I think the idea above about triggering fragments of a break live is one answer to that, but you've still got to sit in front of a computer long enough to chop the breaks and then assign them, unless you had a system whereby the rhythms from an incoming source were automatically tempo-measured and chopped up, then assigned to various triggers. And you'd have to give yourself over to the tempo dictated by the subsets of the different breaks. > >It would be great to see something like that come to pass, but I just > >don't see how it's fundamentally possible, > > Not being able to see how it's possible is the thing that separates us > normal folks from the geniuses! It's the Matthias' and Don Buchla's > and > Einstein's who are able to envision these things and bring them to us, > usually long before we are able to accept them. I have the foolish > faith in > human ingenuity that's telling me that somewhere, sometime, someone > will > find the answer. The sooner the better, actually.... I don't mean to adopt any sort of cynical, naysayer stance, and you're faith in human ingenuity is far from foolish (as I think you'd agree). But I fear that the shroud of normality surrounding my worldview prevents me from understanding how to go about having one's cake and eating it too. It's like somebody wishing they could experience the sensation of being immersed in water without having to get wet; or a stage play director wishing that he could integrate the characteristics of a quick-edit action sequence in a film into the realm of live theater performance; or a live band of musicians wishing that they could get the same sense of freedom and abandon that comes from playing live on stage in front of a crowd when they go into a studio to record behind sonic baffles in seperate rooms from one another with headphones on to get sonic isolation of their different instruments. There are ways of bringing these various dualities closer together, to be sure, and trying to bridge these gaps can wind up leading a person towards something altogether new and unexpected, which they might not have anticipated stumbling into in the first place (which in my opinion is often better anyway). But in each case, there's a certain fundamental difference between what goes on in these two different realms, and I don't think you can expect to bridge the gap between them without losing a certain amount of the characteristics of each one. So in dealing with the issue of, "How do you make an inherently pieced-together work of art happen spontaneously and improvisationally," you've really got to think about what kinds of trade-offs you want to make. How do you paint a painting spontaneously? How to you compose an orchestral arrangement spontaneously? How do you record an album spontaneously? There are ways to do all of these things, but they don't lead you to the same places that you can go if you do things in a more setup-time method. I read an interview with Rupert Parkes not long ago, where he said that the piecing-together process is one of the most fundamental aspects of what he does, and that live performance has no interest for him, and no relavence to what he does. Then again, I heard talk on Usenet of an upcoming Photek performance in Canada (?!?!), so maybe he changed his mind... -- Andre "Deep thoughts with Looper's Delight" LaFosse From ???@??? Sat Feb 07 15:19:33 1998 >From kflint Sat Feb 7 13:53:10 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y1IBQ-00057Q-00; Sat, 7 Feb 1998 13:53:08 -0800 From: bryan.helm@dinosaur.com Message-ID: <9802071443.0KOFW00@dinosaur.com> Organization: The Dinosaur Board X-Mailer: TBBS/TIGER v1.0 Date: Sat, 07 Feb 98 14:43:11 -0700 Subject: call and response To: loopers-delight@annihilist.com Resent-Message-ID: <"gWwiDB.A.rGE.vYN30"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3059 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sat, 7 Feb 1998 13:53:08 -0800 X-UIDL: d5aaf4135ab4b706cc9241f7bb2e6399 Greetings loopers, I began about a month ago contacting local area (Boulder/Denver CO) loop artisits concerning my desire to organize a loop oriented performance to showcase this musical form. With a roster of six interested parties so far, I wanted to go ahead and put the call out ,as it where, to anyone else in this area (or not) who might be interested in this project. Currently the time frame is late summer, early fall ,this year. The venue will be in line with the needs dictated by the level of interest generated by the participating artists and the anticipated audience. The only determining factor for participation is the predominance of loop technology as part of his/her musical pre- -sentation. There are already a couple of diverse styles in and amongst the initial loopists interested, however my aim is to present as full a range as possible: ambient,death metal,industrial, bluegrass,etc..etc... This is part of a larger design that would hopefully in time result in an international conference (symposium) on looping, with the inclusion of industry reps, more renowned loopists, increased media exposure, and certainly a bigger budget. However in the meantime it'll be a local affair to test the waters, and ourselves, and see if the public sees this as synchronized swimming or a mass drowning. If you feel this might be of interest to you please contact me via e-mail,snail mail,phone, signal fire, whatever suits you best and I look forward to talking with you. Thanks again for your time. Sincerely, Bryan Helm bryan.helm@dinosaur.com 715 Goss Dr. Longmont,CO 80501 (303) 684-9069 From ???@??? Sat Feb 07 16:38:16 1998 >From kflint Sat Feb 7 15:46:14 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y1Jwm-00060F-00; Sat, 7 Feb 1998 15:46:08 -0800 Message-Id: <3.0.1.32.19980207174347.007164e4@txdirect.net> X-Sender: zom@txdirect.net X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.1 (32) Date: Sat, 07 Feb 1998 17:43:47 -0600 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: ZOM Subject: Re: San Antonio looping live at the Clipper Ship 02/20/98 In-Reply-To: <3.0.2.16.19980207100050.24f77b30@texas.net> References: <199802071201_MC2-325E-7472@compuserve.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"zZv8_D.A.uCF.ZEP30"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3060 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sat, 7 Feb 1998 15:46:08 -0800 X-UIDL: f8e443a2671017cf168a31c7e7aec732 HEY! Really cool! I am gonna try and make that show....we should try and get together sometime and play a show......so Bob-dog is playing too, eh? neat...I dont really know him personally, but I saw him w/ Test Department a while back....coolness....... haven't seen Sidlo in a while....... Do you have anything recorded? Lets trade tapes or something...... At 10:00 AM 07-02-98, you wrote: > just thought i might mention a small live looping canvas at the Clipper >Ship book store on Feb 20th, 1998 at 722 Balcones Heights Rd. San Antonio, TX >(210) 734-5409... > >i will play for about an hour starting about 10:00pm, to be followed by >Dreamland,,,playing as a quartet,(clarinet, sitar, guitar, and keys) >they usually sound great,,,and are very talented,,..the guitarist(james >Sidlo) uses a boomerang/parker fly/ebow approach,,,while the sitarist (Bob >Catlin) uses a plex,,,the clarinet player has played with the San Antonio >Symphony,,,and the synth/keyboardist uses a tasteful texture of sounds... >the show's free,,,and theres probably free coffee....plan on recording the >show live to CD,,,,so anyone in the area please drop by and support >independent music...and by the way i'll be playing Chapman Stick/Keys with >some live VHF from afar...thanks for your time > >james rhodes > > > > Real Audio Zombie Project Music! Paisley Babylon, more coming.... http://www.txdirect.net/users/zom From ???@??? Sat Feb 07 17:16:31 1998 >From kflint Sat Feb 7 16:44:54 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y1KrW-0005iD-00; Sat, 7 Feb 1998 16:44:46 -0800 X-Sender: kflint@pop.slip.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <199802071201_MC2-325E-746E@compuserve.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sat, 7 Feb 1998 16:35:55 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Kim Flint Subject: Re: real time groove loops Resent-Message-ID: <"hsaVDD.A.bkE.t5P30"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3062 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sat, 7 Feb 1998 16:44:46 -0800 X-UIDL: 576dc4fa3256d944c7edb59f880b14c8 >Kim wrote: >>I like >having the actual audio looping, since there's more opportunity to muck >with >it and record the result, without needing numerous effects processors for >every single sound source. This way I can record a loop with some effect >box, then have the effect box free to patch into another signal and use a >different effect.< > >This sounds interesting - this is similar to what I'm trying to do! > >But what do you mean by having the actual audio >looping? >Do you trigger prerecorded loops (i.e. recorded with effects) >or are you switching patches on the fly? > What I mean is, it starts as a midi sequencer pattern, triggering samples. I would then loop the actual audio from the sampler in the echoplex (or jamman or whatever), with any effects, eq, live playing or whatever added. Now that it's looping, I can use the sequencer, sampler, effects, eq, etc for other things. They don't have to stay dedicated to the first loop. Then using a mixer, I can switch between the first loop from the echoplex and any new loops from the other stuff on the fly. With the multiple loops on the echoplex, I can create a bunch of them this way and switch between different ones for different parts of the piece. It's a nice way to do things very quickly while reducing the amount of gear you need. >BTW, Tom Roady is an experienced percussion sample looper - maybe >he has some ideas? (Hi Tom) I'd love to hear 'em! kim ______________________________________________________________________ Kim Flint | Looper's Delight kflint@annihilist.com | http://www.annihilist.com/loop/loop.html http://www.annihilist.com/ | Loopers-Delight-request@annihilist.com From ???@??? Sat Feb 07 17:16:29 1998 >From kflint Sat Feb 7 16:44:45 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y1KrO-0005hF-00; Sat, 7 Feb 1998 16:44:38 -0800 X-Sender: kflint@pop.slip.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <34DCCEE0.4F49@earthlink.net> References: <2.2.32.19980207055704.00bc5f98@pop.chromatic.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sat, 7 Feb 1998 16:36:19 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Kim Flint Subject: Re: real time groove loops Resent-Message-ID: <"f-yNXD.A.qjE.p5P30"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3061 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sat, 7 Feb 1998 16:44:38 -0800 X-UIDL: 9a983fccaa3d5f4aa1d9d068675de4a2 At 1:15 PM -0800 2/7/98, Andre LaFosse wrote: >Kim Flint wrote: > >> Good, groovy rhythms come from your body, not your head. That's the >> most important thing I learned from my attempt to learn west african >> drumming. > >Didn't you study with Alfred Ladzekpo? He and his brother Kobla have >been running the African program at my alma mater CalArts for many years >now. Small world (or at least a small circle of left-leaning West Coast >colleges). Anyway... It was actually C.K. Ladzekpo, who teaches at UC Berkeley. There's a whole big family of Ladzekpos around that do west african drumming performances and classes and such. "Studied with" is not exactly the right term in my case. More like "be totally humbled by." I learned a lot from that experience and that class, even if I never got past sucking at it. >> The rhythm has to be in your body or you never get it. I >> find that >> being physically involved in a rhythm has much better results than >> just >> thinking about it. And clicking a mouse just isn't that physical.... > >What if you took a program like Steinberg's Recycle! to chop up the >different sections of a drum break, but then assigned each different >section to a series of electronic drum pads that could trigger them? >You'd basically have a number of groove sub-sections (maybe no longer >than two or three eight-notes each) that could be played in a live, >spontaneous manner. If the fragments are short enough, and the tempo >fast enough, you could be doing enough to really be "playing" the >rhythms yourself, even as the sampled bits fill in ultra-precise details >of the groove. yeah, that's one idea I'm thinking about. Like it would be absurd to think you could play a dnb type snare roll. But it wouldn't be so absurd to think of it as a single thing, which you trigger and deal with the dynamics and length of it. And speaking of real-time Recycle, the new roland sp808 has that feature, or something real close. You can sample a whole breakbeat, have it chop it up and automatically assign each piece to a pad. Pretty cool! It also has the time expansion/contraction features that let you match tempos without affecting the pitch. >I also recall seeing an MTV news story many years ago about a guy (don't >recall his name) who has designed a suit that had percussion pads all >over it. So he produced rhythms by striking these different pads all >over his body. including kick drum samples in his boot heel which he >triggered by stomping the ground with his foot. Kind of a strange >visual spectacle... It would definitely be more physically involved. >Just don't get that snare pad on your knee confused with your nose... sort of like "futureman" Wooten of bela fleck fame? or zendrum. Zendrum looks pretty cool, actually. I could relate to that since I'm always tapping out rhythms with my fingers. All that guitar technique wouldn't go to waste either.... >So in dealing with the issue of, "How do you make an inherently >pieced-together work of art happen spontaneously and improvisationally," >you've really got to think about what kinds of trade-offs you want to >make. How do you paint a painting spontaneously? How to you compose an >orchestral arrangement spontaneously? How do you record an album >spontaneously? There are ways to do all of these things, but they don't >lead you to the same places that you can go if you do things in a more >setup-time method. > >I read an interview with Rupert Parkes not long ago, where he said that >the piecing-together process is one of the most fundamental aspects of >what he does, and that live performance has no interest for him, and no >relavence to what he does. Then again, I heard talk on Usenet of an >upcoming Photek performance in Canada (?!?!), so maybe he changed his >mind... I'm not really so interested in "live performance" as more of a live approach. And I guess that to me really means a tool, or "instrument" that allows the easy and free flow of ideas, and encourages the musicality of it. It needs to be elegant, and intuitive, and musical. There's no reason why it doesn't have to allow this piecing together practice, that's part of the music, it should be part of the instruments that create it. What I find in the tools used now (for dnb, anyway) is clumsy and tedious, not well suited to the purpose, and not very musical to me. And naturally, I think real-time looping is a big part of the answer! kim ______________________________________________________________________ Kim Flint | Looper's Delight kflint@annihilist.com | http://www.annihilist.com/loop/loop.html http://www.annihilist.com/ | Loopers-Delight-request@annihilist.com From ???@??? Sat Feb 07 17:43:25 1998 >From kflint Sat Feb 7 17:41:42 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y1LkZ-00059o-00; Sat, 7 Feb 1998 17:41:39 -0800 Message-ID: <34DD0C98.933627EB@bellsouth.net> Date: Sat, 07 Feb 1998 20:38:32 -0500 From: Jeff Duke Reply-To: jmar@bellsouth.net Organization: Tec Bab Labs X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: real time groove loops References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"lgkCTB.A.FPE.lwQ30"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3063 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sat, 7 Feb 1998 17:41:39 -0800 X-UIDL: 4f52d00809f95f93cb52631797ed9da7 Hey Kim, Is there any audio on the net of you ?I'd love to hear some,even ra would be cool. In fact is there any possibility of having a music page in ra( for space considerations) of loopers on this site?I think it would be great to hear what everybodys typing about. Jeff Duke Tecbablabs http://members.tripod.com/~dukesr/index.html Kim Flint wrote: > >Kim wrote: > >>I like > >having the actual audio looping, since there's more opportunity to muck > >with > >it and record the result, without needing numerous effects processors for > >every single sound source. This way I can record a loop with some effect > >box, then have the effect box free to patch into another signal and use a > >different effect.< > > > >This sounds interesting - this is similar to what I'm trying to do! > > > >But what do you mean by having the actual audio > >looping? > >Do you trigger prerecorded loops (i.e. recorded with effects) > >or are you switching patches on the fly? > > > > What I mean is, it starts as a midi sequencer pattern, triggering samples. > I would then loop the actual audio from the sampler in the echoplex (or > jamman or whatever), with any effects, eq, live playing or whatever added. > Now that it's looping, I can use the sequencer, sampler, effects, eq, etc > for other things. They don't have to stay dedicated to the first loop. Then > using a mixer, I can switch between the first loop from the echoplex and > any new loops from the other stuff on the fly. With the multiple loops on > the echoplex, I can create a bunch of them this way and switch between > different ones for different parts of the piece. It's a nice way to do > things very quickly while reducing the amount of gear you need. > > >BTW, Tom Roady is an experienced percussion sample looper - maybe > >he has some ideas? (Hi Tom) > > I'd love to hear 'em! > > kim > > ______________________________________________________________________ > Kim Flint | Looper's Delight > kflint@annihilist.com | http://www.annihilist.com/loop/loop.html > http://www.annihilist.com/ | Loopers-Delight-request@annihilist.com From ???@??? Sat Feb 07 19:29:38 1998 >From kflint Sat Feb 7 18:38:49 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y1Mdp-0005Ru-00; Sat, 7 Feb 1998 18:38:45 -0800 Message-ID: <34DD1B26.1D97@earthlink.net> Date: Sat, 07 Feb 1998 18:40:38 -0800 From: Andre LaFosse Reply-To: altruist@earthlink.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01-C-MACOS8 (Macintosh; I; 68K) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: real time groove loops References: <2.2.32.19980207055704.00bc5f98@pop.chromatic.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"pZQNH.A.slE.wmR30"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3064 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sat, 7 Feb 1998 18:38:45 -0800 X-UIDL: 3200b7dd23465ba06712db3e6d286619 Kim Flint wrote: > And speaking of real-time Recycle, the new roland sp808 has that feature, > or something real close. You can sample a whole breakbeat, have it chop it > up and automatically assign each piece to a pad. Pretty cool! It also has > the time expansion/contraction features that let you match tempos without > affecting the pitch. A lot of the new Roland dance products look interesting. There's all sorts of hype about their product line at http://www.rolandus.com/pr/pr.html > >I also recall seeing an MTV news story many years ago about a guy (don't > >recall his name) who has designed a suit that had percussion pads all > >over it. So he produced rhythms by striking these different pads all > >over his body. including kick drum samples in his boot heel which he > >triggered by stomping the ground with his foot. Kind of a strange > >visual spectacle... It would definitely be more physically involved. > >Just don't get that snare pad on your knee confused with your nose... > > sort of like "futureman" Wooten of bela fleck fame? or zendrum. Zendrum > looks pretty cool, actually. I could relate to that since I'm always > tapping out rhythms with my fingers. All that guitar technique wouldn't go > to waste either.... The guy's name is on the tip of my brain, though I can't quite place it. His band was named after himself, or his stage moniker (which was somewhat cheesy, I believe). He had this vaguely Eraserhead-shaped hairdo, too. It must have been close to ten years ago that I saw that story, though. It'll probably come to me all of a sudden some time in the future. --Andre From ???@??? Sun Feb 08 00:54:11 1998 >From kflint Sat Feb 7 22:38:48 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y1QO3-0001OT-00; Sat, 7 Feb 1998 22:38:43 -0800 X-Sender: kflint@pop.slip.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <34DD0C98.933627EB@bellsouth.net> References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sat, 7 Feb 1998 22:24:37 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Kim Flint Subject: Re: ra page Resent-Message-ID: <"ZZmYJ.A.F5._HV30"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3065 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sat, 7 Feb 1998 22:38:43 -0800 X-UIDL: 372d24c84235c21ed5b5b91c116aedd0 At 8:38 PM -0500 2/7/98, Jeff Duke wrote: >is there any possibility of having a music page in ra( for space >considerations) >of loopers on this site?I think it would be great to hear what everybodys >typing about. This is sort of the point of the cd projects! But it's still a pretty good idea. However, with the current diskspace allotment, we'd probably run out of room quickly if we did something like this. So we'd need more space, which is more money. The various CD projects will hopefully generate some income for Looper's Delight, which I'd be happy to put toward a larger disk space allotment. Another option is for people to have samples of themselves on their own websites, with links there from the profiles on Looper's Delight. I'm pretty sure a number of people already do this. kim ______________________________________________________________________ Kim Flint | Looper's Delight kflint@annihilist.com | http://www.annihilist.com/loop/loop.html http://www.annihilist.com/ | Loopers-Delight-request@annihilist.com From ???@??? Sun Feb 08 02:58:53 1998 >From kflint Sun Feb 8 02:42:36 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y1UC2-0004SC-00; Sun, 8 Feb 1998 02:42:34 -0800 Message-ID: <34DD703E.4CF3@fredmarshall.com> Date: Sun, 08 Feb 1998 02:44:04 -0600 From: Fred Marshall Reply-To: fred@fredmarshall.com X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (Macintosh; I; PPC) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Sharing moments... References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"Ldwj2.A.PAE.auY30"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3067 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sun, 8 Feb 1998 02:42:34 -0800 X-UIDL: 3cf60e62528539fed4c6347b3d900503 - somebody wrote : > I then realized to try to get deeper into > being an improvisor it would help to be able to study a tradition in which > improvising was integral. Granted, there's many great traditions like this > all over the world, but being an American we have a great one right here that > I could sink my teeth into, so I took a roughly 15-year detour into studying > and playing jazz as much as possible. > > Not to say that I've even come close to mastering that particular idiom, but > after studying what jazz has to offer in terms of harmonic improvisation, > melodic development, free improvising, standard song forms, blues forms, etc., > in the last few years I've found the road diverging again, where I'm realizing > that my loyalty to jazz is as a vehicle or method for improvisation, not > preservation or expanding of the jazz tradition, as much as I respect it. I'm > an improvisor first, jazz musician second. ++++++++++++++ - Sounds like a pretty good description of a "jazz musician" . . . (the 15 years were well spent ) ! - Jazz, like any other lineage, is merely the wake of the boat . . . - your frustration with: ++++++++++++++ >what seemed to be a willful disdain for knowing what the fuck you were doing which was sorta part & parcel of the times in the avant-rock world or so it seemed. ++++++++++++++ - is very astute . . . and your choice of research vehicle, likewise. . . - the so-called "primitive" early american (probably early-anywhere) painters also experienced this . . . their paintings had no 3-d ness - - - something is in the distance, put it higher on the page , etc.- - - until they saw paintings with PERSPECTIVE . . . then they had to "pretend to be primitive" to produce the same results - - making a study of a form where each performance has to be NEW, USEFUL, and DIFFERENT (aslo the definition of patentability) has potentially life changing effects. http://www.fredmarshall.com ps - i have no clue as to what you play , but i have a feeling that if you drag your stuff to the nearest place that will allow you to, and "just do it", that i will. From ???@??? Sun Feb 08 13:40:05 1998 >From kflint Sun Feb 8 07:37:53 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y1Yno-00054X-00; Sun, 8 Feb 1998 07:37:52 -0800 Message-Id: <199802081534.KAA00851@shell.monmouth.com> Reply-To: From: "andre" To: , Subject: Re: real time groove loops LIVE report, also DT comin up!!! Date: Sun, 8 Feb 1998 10:34:44 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1162 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"umZTJB.A.ajE.IDd30"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3068 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sun, 8 Feb 1998 07:37:52 -0800 X-UIDL: 754d3a5b54a84f518a72af7eb5960d08 the other , west coast andre said.... > Well, it depends on a lot of what characteristics you really want to see > translated from d&b into a live realm. I think the idea above about > triggering fragments of a break live is one answer to that,...... isa w Dave Fiucynski's new band FUZEBOX last night - holy shit!!! But relevantly, his drummer had a full set but also a KAT - and they were doing some drums & bass LIVE - it was great - that makes it for me - otherwise most of what i've heard in that genre doesnt change enuf. Dave had a cool WOODY custom doubleneck guitar - with the upper necvk fretless!!!! he was doing this sitar-like raga stuff over the D & B... wow - that's the shit live!!!! oh- and NY area freaks - I'm working on the SAINT in asbury park for a LOOP NIGHT - perhaps early April???late march?? stay tuned, email me privately if interested. and don't miss Sakamoto w DJ Spooky and our very own DT - it's MIGHTY FREE at the world trade center on wed feb 11 ( two days after my 33rd, yay!!!!) 8pm sharp. call J&R music world for TIX... it should be a hair raiser. a hare razor too. ouch. check the village voice for more info peace - east coast 'dre From ???@??? Sun Feb 08 13:40:13 1998 >From kflint Sun Feb 8 07:46:46 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y1YwO-0005it-00; Sun, 8 Feb 1998 07:46:44 -0800 Message-ID: <34DDD315.2B592F98@bellsouth.net> Date: Sun, 08 Feb 1998 10:45:26 -0500 From: Jeff Duke Reply-To: jmar@bellsouth.net Organization: Tec Bab Labs X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Stephen P. Goodman" CC: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: ra page References: <000e01bd3203$f069d400$b123dacf@stepheng> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"keZl5.A.tDF.xKd30"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3069 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sun, 8 Feb 1998 07:46:44 -0800 X-UIDL: 7e689137b697bf392d819a907b9a6fad Stephen P. Goodman wrote: > >At 8:38 PM -0500 2/7/98, Jeff Duke wrote: > >>is there any possibility of having a music page in ra( for space > >>considerations) > >>of loopers on this site?I think it would be great to hear what everybodys > >>typing about. > > > And Kim responded: > >But it's still a pretty good idea. However, with the current diskspace > >allotment, we'd probably run out of room quickly if we did something like > >this. > > Well, to be succinct, I believe there are enough of us out here who already > post our work online, to be able to supply Kim links to existing work on our > own sites. No disk space problem there, eh? > > Stephen Goodman * It's... The Loop Of The Week! > EarthLight Studios * http://www.earthlight.net/Studios Yes! We have the loopers of the world,the band pages etc,why not a pure ram page for the music?Its so easy (and free)to put up a small site w/ra that even I was able to do it.After all It's only talk without the music!Not that I havnt gotten some great new tips urls ,etc from that aformentioned talk. Jeff From ???@??? Sun Feb 08 13:40:16 1998 >From kflint Sun Feb 8 08:41:23 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y1ZnF-0000NM-00; Sun, 8 Feb 1998 08:41:21 -0800 Message-ID: <34DDE018.F383BD3@bellsouth.net> Date: Sun, 08 Feb 1998 11:40:56 -0500 From: Jeff Duke Reply-To: jmar@bellsouth.net Organization: Tec Bab Labs X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: fred@fredmarshall.com CC: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Sharing moments... References: <34DD703E.4CF3@fredmarshall.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"FNplYB.A.OH.g-d30"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3070 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sun, 8 Feb 1998 08:41:21 -0800 X-UIDL: d69983588f4628f503c968ebb5464341 Fred Marshall wrote: > - making a study of a form where each performance has to be NEW, USEFUL, > and DIFFERENT (aslo the definition of patentability) has potentially > life changing effects. > > > http://www.fredmarshall.com > > > ps - i have no clue as to what you play , but i have a feeling that if > you drag your stuff to the nearest place that will allow you to, and > "just do it", that i will. > > > Love your page Fred,the shockwave sounds great.Being an > improv.musicion(untrained,doh!)Simpsons ref,your remarks made a lot of sense to > me.Our motto here at the *lab* is becoming, so what,just play!.Different than the > last time I played is the crux of the bisquet as it were. JeffTecBabLabs http://members.tripod.com/~dukesr/index.html From ???@??? Sun Feb 08 13:40:19 1998 >From kflint Sun Feb 8 09:05:44 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y1aAo-0001kM-00; Sun, 8 Feb 1998 09:05:42 -0800 Message-Id: <3.0.1.32.19980208180319.00b5c418@pop.stud.ntnu.no> X-Sender: eriklj@pop.stud.ntnu.no X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (32) Date: Sun, 08 Feb 1998 18:03:19 +0100 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: eriklj@stud.ntnu.no Subject: Re: screaming guitar (Bardens) In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"K_Z7QC.A.EaB.eVe30"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3071 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sun, 8 Feb 1998 09:05:42 -0800 X-UIDL: b2f1c9efd4568e2c69d489b22cd5f9a5 tbajus wrote: >Are you sure your Bardens are single coils? I thought they were all >humbuckers. Nope, they are single coils. I know the difference. PJ wrote: >I love my barden pickups. If i knew that they would inhibit my ability to >shout into my guitar I don't know if I would have bought them. >sarcastically, =-) Hope you're sarcasm wasn't directed at me. I was not being too serious about this myself actually, but this irony/wittiness/sarcasm thing i have found doesn't work very well when communicating on other peoples terms (read language). Later, Erik Ljones (Norway) From ???@??? Sun Feb 08 13:40:20 1998 >From kflint Sun Feb 8 09:10:34 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y1aFU-0002Cd-00; Sun, 8 Feb 1998 09:10:32 -0800 From: PJBMHB@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Sun, 8 Feb 1998 12:07:45 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: screaming guitar (Bardens) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 16-bit for Windows sub 41 Resent-Message-ID: <"6rDZ_.A.00B.2Ze30"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3072 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sun, 8 Feb 1998 09:10:32 -0800 X-UIDL: a3154bb603f094ce7124cc0051c1a9af i was just being silly and was not directing my sarcasm to anyone in particular. if anyone was in any way offended by my comments they should not have been. if they were, anyways, i am profoundly sorry. i do love my bardens. they are humbuckers in a single-coil space and sound awesome even if you can't yell through them too well. =-) PJ From ???@??? Sun Feb 08 13:40:26 1998 >From kflint Sun Feb 8 10:03:56 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y1b58-0005Pi-00; Sun, 8 Feb 1998 10:03:54 -0800 Message-Id: <3.0.1.32.19980208190028.00b626d0@pop.stud.ntnu.no> X-Sender: eriklj@pop.stud.ntnu.no X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (32) Date: Sun, 08 Feb 1998 19:00:28 +0100 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: eriklj@stud.ntnu.no Subject: Re: screaming guitar (Bardens) In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"HwZ4MC.A.GtE.BLf30"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3074 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sun, 8 Feb 1998 10:03:54 -0800 X-UIDL: 70e9ed6fb0cefe026a2bc348f2572664 I just wrote: >Nope, they are single coils (Joe Barden). I know the difference. ...Oops. At least I thought I did. My Bardens are dual bladed in a single coil space, and like PJ mentioned, they sound awesome too. I apologize for that mistake, Erik Ljones (Norway) From ???@??? Sun Feb 08 13:40:34 1998 >From kflint Sun Feb 8 11:17:51 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y1cEf-0001sX-00; Sun, 8 Feb 1998 11:17:49 -0800 From: bryan.helm@dinosaur.com Message-ID: <9802081209.0H34F00@dinosaur.com> Organization: The Dinosaur Board X-Mailer: TBBS/TIGER v1.0 Date: Sun, 08 Feb 98 12:09:46 -0700 Subject: q/a To: loopers-delight@annihilist.com Resent-Message-ID: <"33EnuC.A.LiB.WRg30"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3076 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sun, 8 Feb 1998 11:17:49 -0800 X-UIDL: eb9b9fc4c3785d36d1d724750592f613 Well I've collected all my thoughts and cereal boxtops to join in the recent questionfest....here goes: 1.Who's on the forefront of looping? Commercially, dollar for dollar, year in year out, probably either the dreaded Mr. F or old Mr. Delirium Tremors himself, no surprise. >From an aesthetic vantage point the forefront belongs to artists that I would suspect are not only not on this list but little concerned with anyone elses opinion of their work or collection of gear. To be popular one must be a mediocrity. 2.Why is Fripp and his work seen by many people in a difficult at best context? People's expectations can ruin anything. IMHO all you get for your ticket purchase is a seat in the hall. If you want to be assured of hearing familiar tunes, go see the Beach Boys or Wayne Newton, they ALWAYS play the same tunes and try to please their devoted followers,(what a great crowd..anybody here from Cleveland?). When an artist has many facets to their work. it's unlikely they'll all be showcased in a solo concert, especially when a goodly volume of that work is in a group (duo,trio,quartet,quintet,sextet,ensemble), and all are done with seperate intent. Solo Fripp is NOT King Crimson, what's the mystery folks? 3. When was the seminal moment that I knew looping was for me? When I first ran the Wurlitzer electric piano into the analog tape echoplex in the sound on sound mode, in the mid-70's. Abuse of a Space-echo and then a couple of half- track decks was not far behind. 4.What is it about looping that makes it different from other musical pursuits? The instant multi-track dynamics are certainly the most immediate of the intrigues. Artists confined to monophonic outputs from their instrument(trumpet, old synth, etc,) can realize polyphony within a far more casual context than studio multitracking has traditionally presented ( an aspect that is changing). This freedom I believe extends one's desire to hear all sound subjected to the manipulation of the loop, once begun. To be honest it's the same issue as humor: you either get the joke or you don't ...explaining it is of no use to the unexperienced. Only mass market exposure to the technique's result will alleviate this ad man/ manufacturer's nightmare ( and this is happening around the world, every hour, every day now). Listening to, and/or making loop music is an aquired taste.For me, after 20 years there are still lots of new recipes to be created via the tools at hand, be it a dull knife or a deluxe food processor, the artisitic integrity is the true fulcrum. Enough of my blather...loop on. Bryan Helm From ???@??? Sun Feb 08 13:40:35 1998 >From kflint Sun Feb 8 11:35:05 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y1cVL-0002zs-00; Sun, 8 Feb 1998 11:35:03 -0800 Message-Id: <199802081932.OAA16150@shell.monmouth.com> Reply-To: From: "andre" To: Subject: Re: q/a..... alas...more fripp talk Date: Sun, 8 Feb 1998 14:31:58 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1162 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"IFU6GC.A.ZkC.Qhg30"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3077 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sun, 8 Feb 1998 11:35:03 -0800 X-UIDL: 5c75830b667b2cdb529b36b622a7e7eb > > 2.Why is Fripp and his work seen by many people in > a difficult at best context? People's expectations can > ruin anything. IMHO all you get for your ticket purchase > is a seat in the hall. If you want to be assured of hearing > familiar tunes, go see the Beach Boys or Wayne Newton, > they ALWAYS play the same tunes and try to please their > devoted followers,(what a great crowd..anybody here from > Cleveland?). When an artist has many facets to their work. > it's unlikely they'll all be showcased in a solo concert, > especially when a goodly volume of that work is in a group > (duo,trio,quartet,quintet,sextet,ensemble), and all are done > with seperate intent. Solo Fripp is NOT King Crimson, what's > the mystery folks? alas... that's not the point. i think all us "complainers" KNOW that Fripp isn't Crimson, etc... and i'm sure almost no-one goes to his solo shows and doesn't know - generally - what to expect.. I just don't see the dichotomy of loving an artist and their work -but having a couple of constructive criticisms/witticisms ... :) that's the problem with us 'rock fans' - it's all football at a certain point, and the hero worship can overtake us.......... And believe me, Fripp can take the heat - he sure dishes it out - i've read him in interviews dissing the "innappropiate picking style of Beck and Hendrix..." which is all cool - it's his opinion - but why are so many people on this list so protective and defensive about the guy !?! ...imagine posting that to a beck/hendrix list.... even the little asides when someone brings him up - a la "..yada yada yada..Robert (oh no! )Fripp" we're caught in a LOOP with this subject.... it's all hilarious to me. i;m gonna logoff and go loopin' andre' east From ???@??? Sun Feb 08 13:40:36 1998 >From kflint Sun Feb 8 11:40:09 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y1caG-0003Yv-00; Sun, 8 Feb 1998 11:40:08 -0800 From: bryan.helm@dinosaur.com Message-ID: <9802081233.0HNFX00@dinosaur.com> Organization: The Dinosaur Board X-Mailer: TBBS/TIGER v1.0 Date: Sun, 08 Feb 98 12:33:52 -0700 Subject: moral boxes To: loopers-delight@annihilist.com Resent-Message-ID: <"7K8RoB.A.qDD.4lg30"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3078 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sun, 8 Feb 1998 11:40:08 -0800 X-UIDL: a3c4c623f0965950796cd3d7fededa0c On the issue of the political correctness of electronic devices per their manufacturer's business ethics.....well... they're all decended from Edison, who had his lapses into less than ethical behaviour (Tesla comes to mind....). Bryan Helm From ???@??? Sun Feb 08 13:40:24 1998 >From kflint Sun Feb 8 09:53:35 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y1av7-0004PH-00; Sun, 8 Feb 1998 09:53:33 -0800 Message-ID: <34DE0B85.202B@mail.giga.com.mx> Date: Sun, 08 Feb 1998 11:46:13 -0800 From: Jesœs Cuevas-Cardona X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win16; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: location Content-Type: text/plain Resent-Message-ID: <"7FibOC.A.74D.JCf30"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3073 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sun, 8 Feb 1998 09:53:33 -0800 X-UIDL: e4ca013ae7bee07f0566776b7cc4ef54 I«m looping in Pachuca, Hgo., 100kms away from Mexico City. Jesus Cuevas-Cardona From ???@??? Sun Feb 08 13:40:27 1998 >From kflint Sun Feb 8 10:05:31 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y1b6c-0005bg-00; Sun, 8 Feb 1998 10:05:26 -0800 Message-ID: <34DE0DFA.46EB@mail.giga.com.mx> Date: Sun, 08 Feb 1998 11:56:42 -0800 From: Jesœs Cuevas-Cardona X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win16; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: question: mackie&jamman-vortex set Content-Type: text/plain Resent-Message-ID: <"IyHCU.A.jyE.tLf30"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3075 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sun, 8 Feb 1998 10:05:26 -0800 X-UIDL: 66f1d296badc99ae8fe0038668d6a29a Hi, loopers: I «ve a question: I am a saxophone player and I like to loop my saxs(alto and baritone) but in my one man band I sing (overtone singing) and play another instruments (experimental and home-made). I have a mackie 1202, a vortex, a jamman, proteus 1&2 synth modules, and quadraverb. I need to procese the signal of the four mono channels of the mackie, so i put jamman and vortex in the sends and return both signals in channels 9-10 and 11-12. My question is: how can I do the quadraverb "wet" all the signals in a controled way?. I have not another aux send to do this. I don«t want to put jamman or vortex in line, because I need to use them with my voice and another instruments at the same time. Can anybody help me? Jesus Cuevas-Cardona From ???@??? Sun Feb 08 13:40:50 1998 >From kflint Sun Feb 8 13:38:39 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y1eQw-0002PO-00; Sun, 8 Feb 1998 13:38:38 -0800 Message-ID: <34DE1A18.503CF6D8@earthlink.net> Date: Sun, 08 Feb 1998 13:48:27 -0700 From: William Moyer Reply-To: vargo2muse@earthlink.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 (Macintosh; U; PPC) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: EDP best price? Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; x-mac-type="54455854"; x-mac-creator="4D4F5353" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"vPbuP.A.zAC.KVi30"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3080 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sun, 8 Feb 1998 13:38:38 -0800 X-UIDL: c1576a9de77a28ff66be0c08645d7ab3 Hey loopers, feels like I'm falling into the void with you all. Working on a project witha choreographer who's willing to fund raise for a looping device. Where can I get the best leal on an EDP. Found one in Seattle for $650 plus tax. Then I'll have to do the memory thing . Any advice appreciated. Can I trigger multiple loops from my drum triggers, i.e. DK10? Thanks, Bill Moyer Vashon,WA From ???@??? Sun Feb 08 13:40:46 1998 >From kflint Sun Feb 8 12:57:29 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y1dn5-00001G-00; Sun, 8 Feb 1998 12:57:27 -0800 Message-Id: <3.0.3.32.19980208125207.009f7310@global.california.com> X-Sender: sechevar@global.california.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.3 (32) Date: Sun, 08 Feb 1998 12:52:07 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Sean Echevarria Subject: CMP releases are available In-Reply-To: <3e33b029.34db2e2b@aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"HNXK4.A.W8G.-th30"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3079 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sun, 8 Feb 1998 12:57:27 -0800 X-UIDL: 067ed865c3d95e4c699e100156e27a0d FYI: The CMP records catalog is now being carried at the Artist Shop - http://www.artist-shop.com/cmp/index.htm From ???@??? Sun Feb 08 15:04:14 1998 >From kflint Sun Feb 8 13:57:49 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y1ejU-0003hT-00; Sun, 8 Feb 1998 13:57:48 -0800 Message-ID: <34DE1EB0.E0E21B64@earthlink.net> Date: Sun, 08 Feb 1998 14:08:08 -0700 From: William Moyer Reply-To: vargo2muse@earthlink.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 (Macintosh; U; PPC) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: EDP: best price? Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; x-mac-type="54455854"; x-mac-creator="4D4F5353" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"_3V0kC.A.dND.Cni30"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3081 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sun, 8 Feb 1998 13:57:48 -0800 X-UIDL: 3310e62000ed590212ca7c0e1a2758d1 Hey loopers, feels like I'm falling into the void with you all. Working on a project witha choreographer who's willing to fund raise for a looping device. Where can I get the best leal on an EDP. Found one in Seattle for $650 plus tax. Then I'll have to do the memory thing . Any advice appreciated. Can I trigger multiple loops from my drum triggers, i.e. DK10? Thanks, Bill Moyer Vashon,WA From ???@??? Sun Feb 08 19:27:32 1998 >From kflint Sun Feb 8 15:06:42 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y1fo8-0000pU-00; Sun, 8 Feb 1998 15:06:40 -0800 X-Sender: kflint@pop.slip.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <34DE1A18.503CF6D8@earthlink.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sun, 8 Feb 1998 14:17:33 -0800 To: vargo2muse@earthlink.net, Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Kim Flint Subject: Re: EDP best price? Resent-Message-ID: <"_nFeg.A.ce.Ynj30"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3083 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sun, 8 Feb 1998 15:06:40 -0800 X-UIDL: 99cb8d534294e7663ce7aeb5fba86f19 At 1:48 PM -0700 2/8/98, William Moyer wrote: >Hey loopers, feels like I'm falling into the void with you all. >Working on a project witha choreographer who's willing to fund raise for >a looping device. Where can I get the best leal on an EDP. Found one >in Seattle for $650 plus tax. that sounds like the typical price.... >Then I'll have to do the memory thing . simms is dirt cheap these days. maxing out the echoplex memory takes 4 4MB simms, about $15 each. >Any advice appreciated. Can I trigger multiple loops from my drum >triggers, i.e. DK10? If they can trigger any other sort of sampler, they should be able to trigger echoplex loops too. kim ______________________________________________________________________ Kim Flint | Looper's Delight kflint@annihilist.com | http://www.annihilist.com/loop/loop.html http://www.annihilist.com/ | Loopers-Delight-request@annihilist.com From ???@??? Sun Feb 08 19:27:46 1998 >From kflint Sun Feb 8 17:31:12 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y1i3x-0001nz-00; Sun, 8 Feb 1998 17:31:09 -0800 From: MIvanBerk@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Sun, 8 Feb 1998 20:27:15 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: question: mackie&jamman-vortex set Content-type: text/plain X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 82 Resent-Message-ID: <"laCJ-C.A.KbB.2ul30"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3084 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sun, 8 Feb 1998 17:31:09 -0800 X-UIDL: 279144e01fbcb8f5d72e29ac0362b8d5 In a message dated 2/8/98 1:04:29 PM, Jesus Cuevas-Cardona wrote: <> This may be an inelegant solution, but here's what I do: Split your second aux send with a Y-cord -- send one half of Aux 2 to the Vortex as usual; send the other half to the Quadraverb and bring it back on one of your remaining stereo channels. This should work, you just have to keep in mind that whatever you send to the Vortex also gets sent to the Quadraverb. -Mike From ???@??? Sun Feb 08 20:32:24 1998 >From kflint Sun Feb 8 19:29:51 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y1juo-0001VD-00; Sun, 8 Feb 1998 19:29:50 -0800 X-Sender: kflint@pop.slip.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sun, 8 Feb 1998 18:22:41 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Kim Flint Subject: Re: cc's for nextloop Resent-Message-ID: <"CDaFkB.A.1KB.Uen30"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3086 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sun, 8 Feb 1998 19:29:50 -0800 X-UIDL: e3cebf3a7abe3a51300a98530e131fe0 this is sort of old, but I'm sort of behind.... At 2:00 PM -0500 1/25/98, klaw@iglou.com wrote: >Hello everyone . Top o the day to ya. Regarding switching loops with ccs : >How is this done? I thought the ccs were feedback, vol. I switch with note >ons did I miss something? Using continuous controllers to trigger echoplex loops is much like using notes. basically, the controller number is equivalent to note# and controller value is equivalent to velocity. You send the appropriate cc with some non-zero value, and it's treated as note on, and then send the same cc with value 0 and it's the note-off. >Also perhaps a question for KIm : Is it possible with current hardware on >plex to reset loops to startpoint when using nxtloop? This has always >seemed so logical& musical.If I have a number of loops in a piece I need >them to start at the beginning when I switch rather than run continously. >I supose it would have its uses in a random sort of way but its not very >predictable. Maybe have a option to reset or run like in mute mode.BTW >thanks Kim for your ideas on the quantize function. I finally found a use >for this!Works excellent in V5.0. That's a pretty good idea for a parameter, actually. (more parameters, yeeee...) Let me explain some about how it does work, and maybe you'll find a way that works for you anyway. The default state of NextLoop isn't really random. You return to the loop at the point where you left it. When you are working in free, unquantized approach, this is often appropriate. In a rhythmic sense (and this is appropriate to droney and groovy loops), you will often leave a loop at it's end instead of random spots in the middle. So when you return to it, it will be at it's beginning. What the "beginning" or "end" is can be a matter of perception, and may not coincide with the spot in memory that the echoplex thinks is the beginning. It'll have much more to do with what's in the loop and how you developed it. For example, say you start off a loop with some ambient, textural sounds, and then gradually add to it and develop it in such a way that some more percussive sounds begin to define a rhythm. Probably it will have a point somewhere that feels like the beginning. And probably that will have nothing to do with where the little startpoint LED is blinking, because who's going to constrain themselves to that while creating a loop? So when you used Next you would switch out of a loop when you felt you were at it's end, and therefore return to it later at what feels like the beginning. That's the free approach. There's also the SwitchQuantizing mode, where the loops automatically switch at the end and start at the beginning. To me this is more appropriate where accurate rhythm is important. It does sort of assume you want the loop to go all the way to it's end. When triggering with midi, with the "SamperStyle" parameter set to either "One" or "Att" the loops start at the beginning when they are triggered. ("One" means the loop is triggered and plays one time through, and can be retriggered each time the midi note is sent. "Att" means the loop is triggered at the begining and plays as long as the note is held. When the noteoff comes, the loop turns off) Sounds like you want another SamplerStyle parameter of "start", where you trigger the loop with midi, it starts at it's beginning, and continues looping. (just like MuteMode=Start parameter.) Seems like a reasonable idea to me. hope that helps. kim ______________________________________________________________________ Kim Flint | Looper's Delight kflint@annihilist.com | http://www.annihilist.com/loop/loop.html http://www.annihilist.com/ | Loopers-Delight-request@annihilist.com From ???@??? Sun Feb 08 19:27:53 1998 >From kflint Sun Feb 8 19:02:50 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y1jUf-0007S6-00; Sun, 8 Feb 1998 19:02:49 -0800 From: Drumworker@aol.com Message-ID: <247bdc77.34de7097@aol.com> Date: Sun, 8 Feb 1998 21:57:25 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: UNSUBSCRIBE Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0.i for Mac sub 148 Resent-Message-ID: <"fj30xD.A.PmG.VEn30"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3085 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sun, 8 Feb 1998 19:02:49 -0800 X-UIDL: a2f5474561db460608d4c0bfede6c0ef Please UNSUBSCRIBE me from the mailing list. I'll probably join you again in the future. Many Thanks P. Ormandy Drumworker@aol.com From ???@??? Mon Feb 09 00:24:32 1998 >From kflint Sun Feb 8 20:35:17 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y1kw6-00060D-00; Sun, 8 Feb 1998 20:35:14 -0800 X-Sender: kflint@pop.slip.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <247bdc77.34de7097@aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sun, 8 Feb 1998 20:21:14 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Kim Flint Subject: Re: UNSUBSCRIBE Resent-Message-ID: <"8_OsgC.A.2VF.-ao30"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3087 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sun, 8 Feb 1998 20:35:14 -0800 X-UIDL: 7c425906f99f3896d4d1a1688c51d5c9 >Please UNSUBSCRIBE me from the mailing list. I'll probably join you again in >the future. > >Many Thanks OK, I don't say this very often (or ever), but seems like this is a good time, since I'm now completely sick of spending so much time helping people with this. Subscribing and Unsubscribing to this mailing list, as with every other mailing list on the entire Internet, is *AUTOMATED ON A SERVER*. That means that there is a computer where you send the request, and it handles it automatically. There are *NO HUMANS* involved in this process. If you post a message like this to the list, there is no human (or at least no willing human) who will then go and send the commands to the server for you. You have to do it all by yourself! There is a page on the Looper's Delight website that explains how to do this: http://www.annihilist.com/loop/list/LoopList.html Some other things to note: - When emailing commands to the server, don't strike up a conversation. The computer does not care what you have to say. Remember, there are NO HUMANS involved. The computer will not understand your witty banter, and will send you the automatically generated help file. - There is only one way to spell the word "subscribe" and only one way to spell "unsubscribe." Never in my life could I have imagined how many ways people could come up with to misspell these words. If the email has only one word in it, is it really so hard to check that you've spelled it right? The computer will not understand creative reinterpretations of the spelling of these words and will send you the help file. - Turn your sig file off. The computer will not be impressed by your nifty quotes and ascii art, and will send you the help file if you leave the sig file on. - If you are using hotmail or one of the other free email services that automatically attach sig file advertisements, you're screwed. You'll have to mail me and ask for help, and wait until I have time to get around to it. You get what you pay for. - Some newer email programs default to send email as HTML code. TURN THIS OPTION OFF. Not only does it screw up the server, most people who do not use these mail programs will be profoundly irritated by you. Just because morons at Netscape and Microsoft thought this was a good idea does not mean you should stoop to their level. - Don't send subscribe requests to the list address. There is a separate address for this. Nobody actually cares if you are subscribing or unsubscribing. - If you get an error from the server from your request mail, don't resend the exact same thing to the server 600 times. Expecting different results from the exact same actions is one definition of insanity. It's probably also an indicator of pure, unadulterated stupidity. Try to be above that. - this is really not complicated. Just follow the directions, and you will be fine! kim ______________________________________________________________________ Kim Flint | Looper's Delight kflint@annihilist.com | http://www.annihilist.com/loop/loop.html http://www.annihilist.com/ | Loopers-Delight-request@annihilist.com From ???@??? Mon Feb 09 00:24:36 1998 >From kflint Sun Feb 8 21:06:51 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y1lQf-0000Kw-00; Sun, 8 Feb 1998 21:06:49 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Date: Sun, 8 Feb 1998 21:46:34 -0700 Subject: Re: Location. Message-ID: <19980208.220019.4406.0.zenchi@juno.com> References: X-Mailer: Juno 1.49 X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 0-12 From: zenchi@juno.com (Robert L Williams) Resent-Message-ID: <"JnpGf.A.5C.N5o30"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3088 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sun, 8 Feb 1998 21:06:49 -0800 X-UIDL: 37c2f48cb339df3cca1ca44e6adcc97e On Mon, 2 Feb 1998 22:37:52 -0500 klaw@iglou.com writes: > Greetings Im based in the great city of Louisville Ky . Been >looping >most of my musical life . Give or take a delay or two. Sorry:.) > > K Law Louisville is my home town, I now reside in Englewood, CO (20 mins south of Denver). Robert dERiSiOn _____________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] From ???@??? Mon Feb 09 00:24:37 1998 >From kflint Sun Feb 8 21:14:13 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y1lXm-00010R-00; Sun, 8 Feb 1998 21:14:10 -0800 From: Dpcoffin@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Mon, 9 Feb 1998 00:11:19 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: question: mackie&jamman-vortex set Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 84 Resent-Message-ID: <"eJtOuD.A.sq.BAp30"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3089 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sun, 8 Feb 1998 21:14:10 -0800 X-UIDL: 07d08464b30252b72a008eb0073f48b2 Hello, Jesus I hate to tell you how much my routing life improved when I sold my beloved little 1202 and got a 1604vlz! dpc In a message dated 2/8/98 1:04:09 PM, you wrote: >My question is: how can I do the quadraverb "wet" all the > >signals in a controled way?. I have not another aux send to do this. From ???@??? Mon Feb 09 00:24:45 1998 >From kflint Sun Feb 8 22:45:16 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y1mxu-0006EP-00; Sun, 8 Feb 1998 22:45:14 -0800 Message-ID: <34DEA5BA.72E87360@bellsouth.net> Date: Mon, 09 Feb 1998 01:44:10 -0500 From: Jeff Duke Reply-To: jmar@bellsouth.net Organization: Tec Bab Labs X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com" Subject: Laurie and David Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"3sUTq.A.2mF.lVq30"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3090 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sun, 8 Feb 1998 22:45:14 -0800 X-UIDL: 380f93ac7c0b654481a93445ac132197 My bro sent me this. This is from the Rocktropolis news letter: http://www.rocktropolis.com Wednesday, Feb. 11 8:00 pm Rocktropolis and our sister site Classical Insites present award-winning composer and musician Ryuichi Sakamoto. Watch and listen to the performance live, and, through special Internet technology, participate directly in the event as it happens. Sakamoto's new album, "Discord," features spoken word performances by Laurie Anderson, David Byrne, Patti Smith, David Sylvian, DJ Spooky, David Torn, Bernardo Bertolucci and others. "Discord" Live will allow the Internet audience to applaud via their computer keyboards. Also, those with MIDI-compatible computers and keyboards will be able to hook directly into Sakamoto's piano signal, allowing him to "play" their computer or instruments as he plays live. YES -- "Open Your Eyes" Cybercast, Thursday, Feb. 12, 8 p.m. (EST) The renowned progressive rock band reunited in 1997 for a triumphant world tour. This show, recorded at L.A.'s Universal Amphitheatre, features material from their latest album "Open Your Eyes" and such classic works as "Roundabout," "And You And I," "Siberian Khatru," and "Owner of a Lonely Heart." From ???@??? Mon Feb 09 10:16:24 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 9 06:42:57 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y1uQB-000752-00; Mon, 9 Feb 1998 06:42:55 -0800 Message-Id: <3.0.2.32.19980209093944.006adb68@mail1.hbsp.harvard.edu> X-Sender: rlamphear@mail1.hbsp.harvard.edu X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.2 (32) Date: Mon, 09 Feb 1998 09:39:44 -0500 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: "Rich Lamphear" Subject: DOD 8 second delay In-Reply-To: <199802062254.PAA02466@hyper.dimensional.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"6C-eXB.A.YYG.YVx30"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3092 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 9 Feb 1998 06:42:55 -0800 X-UIDL: 946a8e6be5be7aa76d358b42eb2b7d86 Has anyone been able to check out the new DOD 8-second delay pedal ($100)? Looks pretty cool from the description, apparently does looping. Also, there's been a few mentions of the Lexicon LXP-5 on the list. What features does this unit offer to someone interested in looping/sound mangulation/guitar mayhem? thanks, Rich From ???@??? Mon Feb 09 10:16:26 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 9 07:07:22 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y1unp-00013x-00; Mon, 9 Feb 1998 07:07:21 -0800 X-Sender: ejmd@pop.erols.com Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <34DE0B85.202B@mail.giga.com.mx> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 9 Feb 1998 10:13:58 -0500 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Ed Drake Subject: Question about the Boomerang Resent-Message-ID: <"dOjqrD.A.vs.Jsx30"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3093 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 9 Feb 1998 07:07:21 -0800 X-UIDL: a1a9f3f36a0b8817ccc5cae75f122c0b Hello fellow loopers, A friend of mine just told me that the Boomerang will let you play backwards live in realtime. I told him I had not heard that, but I knew you could flip the recorded loop around and play it backwards. My friend said someone demonstrated a Boomerang to him and he swore the guy was playing a backwards solo live in realtime. If the 'Rang can do this, I'm surprised this hasn't been mentioned before, as it is a pretty cool thing. If it has been mentioned, I must have missed it. You guys at Boomerang should add this to your ads and marketing, there might be a few crazy backwards loopers out there who would get into this. Also is there any progress on a software update for the Boomerang for better sampling rate? Thanks! Ed From ???@??? Mon Feb 09 10:16:33 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 9 07:50:23 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y1vTP-0004HY-00; Mon, 9 Feb 1998 07:50:19 -0800 Message-Id: <199802091549.IAA01740@hyper.dimensional.com> From: "Scott Bullerwell" To: "Looper's Delight" , "Steve Hahn" Subject: Mackie v. Behringer thrown out Date: Mon, 9 Feb 1998 08:43:29 -0700 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"LnAF8.A.fdD.rSy30"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3095 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 9 Feb 1998 07:50:19 -0800 X-UIDL: b30ba33510b77a50a1399345deb42448 ---------- > From: Scott Weigand > To: tanelorn@dimensional.com > Subject: News FYI > Date: Sunday, February 08, 1998 20:40 > > JUDGE THROWS OUT MACKIE SUIT AGAINST BEHRINGER!!!!!! > > The district court for the Western District of Washington has dismissed > the patent infringement claim brought by Mackie Designs Inc. against > Sampson's supplier Behringer. The judge also dismissed the claims agains > Sam Ash Music, and threw out the only evidence Mackie could muster to > support its claim of intentional wrongdoing as unreliable. Litigation > may still continue as to some of Mackie's other claims. > From ???@??? Mon Feb 09 10:16:48 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 9 08:28:04 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y1w3v-0007gp-00; Mon, 9 Feb 1998 08:28:03 -0800 Date: Mon, 9 Feb 1998 11:23:17 -0500 (EST) From: JJavid@aol.com Message-ID: <980209112317_-1161824922@mrin53> To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Simple Question Resent-Message-ID: <"Ay_BRC.A.OxG.22y30"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3096 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 9 Feb 1998 08:28:03 -0800 X-UIDL: bdf68c8d1be264f3398b3c061c0c633f Hello Loopers, I play the Chapman Stick and am very interested in Looping. Where is the CHEAPEST place to get an Echo-plex. Mail order s fine with me. David From ???@??? Mon Feb 09 10:16:59 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 9 09:21:07 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y1wtE-0004wO-00; Mon, 9 Feb 1998 09:21:04 -0800 Date: Mon, 9 Feb 1998 10:17:42 -0700 (MST) From: Dan Howarth To: stickwire-l@netcom.com, loopers-delight@annihilist.com Subject: FS: synth bass pedal Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Resent-Message-ID: <"OzhfgC.A.ARE.Epz30"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3097 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 9 Feb 1998 09:21:04 -0800 X-UIDL: 24fbeb616fef9d018f94c07ff6d5636a for sale: Korg G5 Synth Bass pedal, great condition. $300 OBO. private email only. howarth@u.arizona.edu From ???@??? Mon Feb 09 10:17:02 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 9 09:47:38 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y1xIs-00003K-00; Mon, 9 Feb 1998 09:47:34 -0800 From: Paolo Valladolid Message-Id: <199802091743.JAA29143@waynesworld.ucsd.edu> Subject: Re: Stick/Loop gig To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Date: Mon, 9 Feb 1998 09:43:39 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: <672ad45b.34de3007@aol.com> from "PMimlitsch@aol.com" at Feb 8, 98 05:21:57 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"kzJFNC.A.u4G.ZB030"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3098 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 9 Feb 1998 09:47:34 -0800 X-UIDL: 28da05e8bdaa85a5175b9cef2435510b Hi Paul, Just a friendly reminder that some of us can't see the 1550K file attachment that came with your post. Thanks, Paolo From ???@??? Mon Feb 09 10:17:05 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 9 10:13:46 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y1xi5-000309-00; Mon, 9 Feb 1998 10:13:37 -0800 Date: Mon, 9 Feb 1998 13:08:27 -0500 (EST) From: Monkici@aol.com Message-ID: <980209130827_612156615@mrin53> To: loopers-delight@annihilist.com Subject: jampersons for sale Resent-Message-ID: <"RZ5U5.A.-QC.bZ030"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3099 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 9 Feb 1998 10:13:37 -0800 X-UIDL: f42940d7b7032ed3440e6b0a90cf8865 i have two jammans (jammen?) for sale on with and one without the upgrade. have some footswitches and at least one manual (maybe two..) will consider trade for EDP. $750 or best offer rich 513 861 1687 From ???@??? Mon Feb 09 11:28:02 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 9 11:01:21 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y1ySB-0000v0-00; Mon, 9 Feb 1998 11:01:15 -0800 X-Sender: kflint@pop.slip.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: References: <34DE0B85.202B@mail.giga.com.mx> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 9 Feb 1998 10:40:03 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Kim Flint Subject: Re: Question about the Boomerang Resent-Message-ID: <"HWay7B.A.F5G.CB130"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3102 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 9 Feb 1998 11:01:15 -0800 X-UIDL: a28f0aab1beb0fa93154702d81b44ea8 Digitech also has a new pedal that does this. Can't remember the name, some sort of "space music" theme. I think it did other things like ring mod and such, looks like a whammy pedal. kim >Hello fellow loopers, > >A friend of mine just told me that the Boomerang will let you play >backwards live in realtime. I told him I had not heard that, but I knew you >could flip the recorded loop around and play it backwards. My friend said >someone demonstrated a Boomerang to him and he swore the guy was playing a >backwards solo live in realtime. If the 'Rang can do this, I'm surprised >this hasn't been mentioned before, as it is a pretty cool thing. If it has >been mentioned, I must have missed it. You guys at Boomerang should add >this to your ads and marketing, there might be a few crazy backwards >loopers out there who would get into this. Also is there any progress on a >software update for the Boomerang for better sampling rate? Thanks! >Ed ______________________________________________________________________ Kim Flint | Looper's Delight kflint@annihilist.com | http://www.annihilist.com/loop/loop.html http://www.annihilist.com/ | Loopers-Delight-request@annihilist.com From ???@??? Mon Feb 09 10:52:01 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 9 10:51:32 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y1yIk-0007Iv-00; Mon, 9 Feb 1998 10:51:30 -0800 Message-Id: X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise 4.1 Date: Mon, 09 Feb 1998 11:41:37 -0700 From: Tom Johnson To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: DOD 8 second delay Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Disposition: inline Resent-Message-ID: <"s30gq.A.lKG.67030"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3101 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 9 Feb 1998 10:51:30 -0800 X-UIDL: 4a7c3c67fa5116dfba7ed9930c4ac132 I talked to a salesman at Guitar Center the other day who called DOD to ask them about it. He (the DOD rep) said it should be out in April, to which the salesman said, "Which means May." And he said it should be retail-priced $120-150. The DFX-94 (4 second delay) is no longer being produced, by the way. :-( Tom Johnson 10 string Chapman Stick #2604 From ???@??? Mon Feb 09 10:52:00 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 9 10:46:13 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y1yDa-0006YA-00; Mon, 9 Feb 1998 10:46:10 -0800 From: MIvanBerk@aol.com Message-ID: <8368f08d.34df4e0f@aol.com> Date: Mon, 9 Feb 1998 13:42:21 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Digital Echoplex for sale Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 57 Resent-Message-ID: <"Jj7mND.A.StF.d4030"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3100 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 9 Feb 1998 10:46:10 -0800 X-UIDL: bd53a30505d36cacbb8931150f5064a1 I hate to do this, but hard times are here, and I'm not using it enough to warrant having it around. Lovingly cared for, with Loop 5.0 upgrade and 4 MB of memory (50.3 seconds). With FC-7 footcontroller, and a 3-space shallow depth rack bag, with a pocket that neatly holds the footcontroller. $750 I strongly prefer a New York City area or area-accessible buyer. -Mike From ???@??? Mon Feb 09 10:16:32 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 9 07:49:20 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y1vSP-00048U-00; Mon, 9 Feb 1998 07:49:17 -0800 Message-Id: <3.0.2.16.19980209104532.33a7dbfc@postoffice.mail.cornell.edu> X-Sender: km15@postoffice.mail.cornell.edu X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.2 (16) -- [Cornell Modified] Date: Mon, 09 Feb 1998 10:45:32 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Kevin Miller Subject: RE: looping as sin In-Reply-To: <3.0.1.16.19980209131547.26af379e@rank-serv.elec.gla.ac.uk> References: <2.2.32.19980207080540.00bb1da8@pop.chromatic.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"CVyyY.A.MaD.RSy30"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3094 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 9 Feb 1998 07:49:17 -0800 X-UIDL: 72d06958c626b68e98241d2fba34e871 >between, we're not interested. I'm not against processing - obviously, or >I'd not be here - but I do worry that our "ambient drone-guitar noodlings" >are little more than attempts to attract attention through novelty of tone, >rather than musical merit. After all, how many of us have actually sat down >and _composed_ looping pieces, rather than just noodling? > >Michael Well, I figure I can noodle any time, and I might come up with something useful, but if I've decided to record something it's almost always composed. That involves sections (whose borders may or may not be rigidly defined) and transitions. For me, the idea is to create movement through an imaginary environment, and the movement has a stronger purpose if I think about it ahead of time. There may be drone-y guitar in the piece, and there may be some noodling involved, but it's part of an overall structure. I'm sure I'm not the only one who works this way. As long as I'm still using analog tape, I'll be trying not to waste it on something I won't be listening to in a year! Kevin From ???@??? Mon Feb 09 18:41:05 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 9 13:16:55 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y20ZN-0000pT-00; Mon, 9 Feb 1998 13:16:49 -0800 Date: Mon, 9 Feb 1998 13:46:25 -0500 (EST) From: Todd Pafford Reply-To: Todd Pafford To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Expression pedal for the Vortex Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Resent-Message-ID: <"Ewr0JC.A.jC.-D330"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3110 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 9 Feb 1998 13:16:49 -0800 X-UIDL: 5a5d8359f0a6ad2cfbe611b1dab4dfe3 Hi all, Can anyone recommend a good expression pedal to use with the Vortex? How much do these things normally go for and where would be a good place to find one? Thanks :) --- "If the doors of perception were cleansed everything would appear to man as it is, infinite." -- William Blake Todd Pafford galen@erols.com From ???@??? Mon Feb 09 11:28:03 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 9 11:03:06 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y1yTs-0001Ax-00; Mon, 9 Feb 1998 11:03:00 -0800 X-Sender: doug@mail.lightlink.com Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <3.0.1.16.19980209131547.26af379e@rank-serv.elec.gla.ac.uk> References: <2.2.32.19980207080540.00bb1da8@pop.chromatic.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 9 Feb 1998 14:00:25 -0500 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Doug Wyatt Subject: RE: looping as sin Resent-Message-ID: <"FwdmVB.A.OJH.vC130"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3103 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 9 Feb 1998 11:03:00 -0800 X-UIDL: 3d4986bd904c8d8cb90e37239e0537cb At 13:15 -0500 2/9/98, Michael P. Hughes, Ph.D. wrote: > >> > guess I'm > >> >bugged when I feel that people are abdicating their musical flexibilty > >> >or decision-making to whatever tool it is that they use. > > >> I always find it remarkable when people perceive the newer, electronic > >> devices as "technology" in preference to older things. I think the >piano is > >> one of the most stunning technological accomplishments humans have ever > >> made. The amount of knowledge and invention that had to happen before the > >> modern piano could exist is simply amazing. That to me is one of the >finest > >> examples of technology I can think of. Just because it's been basically > >> finished for a hundred years doesn't lessen the technical accomplishment. > > >Sometimes I think of how revolutionary equal temperament was. And yet, in > >the bigger picture, it too is a constraint. Sometimes I like to microtune > >my synths as a way of choosing a different constraint. > > I often find it amazing that using a single tonality is insufficient for us > these days. The "one-sound" violin has been sufficient for about 4 > centuries of music; at no point did anyone say "right, we've exhausted all > we can do with that, bin it". Michael, It's fascinating to me that you used the violin as an analogy with which to knock microtuning, since, unlike many other instruments, you can play a true perfect fifth on a violin. I was in a band with a gifted violinist who told me that he was always making his intervals pure, never equally tempered. If you haven't already done so, it's worth the effort to hear the difference between an equally tempered fifth and a pure one, on the same instrument if possible. (That's the "sensible" rationale for microtuning. My other one: what's so special about the mathematical ratios used in Western tunings anyway? There are more than 12 musically interesting ratios.) > The breadth of new music is countless idioms > composed for this simple instrument is huge. True. This is a testament to the expressiveness of the instrument as a solo voice. > And yet nowadays, if our > processor can't perform infinite combinations of voices that we can switch > between, we're not interested. I'm not against processing - obviously, or > I'd not be here - but I do worry that our "ambient drone-guitar noodlings" > are little more than attempts to attract attention through novelty of tone, > rather than musical merit. I think it's worth pointing out that keyboards and guitar are not the expressive solo voices that a violin is. On a violin or saxophone, a single note without any electronic enhancement at all is capable of expressing great feeling. On unprocessed electric guitar and keyboards, you play one note and it sort of goes, plonk. Yeah, you can bend and add vibrato on a guitar, but you still can't really convey the same sense of effort required to sustain a tone that one hears from wind and string instruments. Would it be fair to say that what usually gets respect in guitar and keyboard playing circles is the facility to put long strings of interesting notes together, more than the ability to evoke a beautiful tone of any one note? What constitutes "musical merit," anyway? Yeah, this is subjective. To me, sure, a beautiful tone and good technique, and yes, notes written on a piece of paper can be discerned to have musical merit without even hearing them performed well. So musical merit comes both from the performer and composer. As a composer, I'm totally inspired by sound. I look at it like this -- is it easier to compose when staring at a blank piece of manuscript paper or while playing my instrument? When I create synthesizer patches I would rather start editing from a randomly generated patch in which I can hear a hint of something cool than from a raw sine wave. To me, technology, like any technique (note similar etymologies) is just a means to the end, not the end. Every method of composing has its pitfalls -- for me the dangers of composing in a traditional way are a certain blocky-ness and difficulty in making transitions between disparate ideas. And composing based on improvisations, while producing pieces with more continuity, has the danger of producing meandering and unfocused pieces. And yes, when using technology we can get distracted by it and forget the point. Similarly, when pursuing something interesting from a music theory point of view, that focus has just as much danger of distracting us from creating good music. To return to what you said, there's nothing wrong with attracting attention through novelty of tone. Whatever floats the composer's boat. The question is really whether, after the novelty wears off after a few listenings, the music still says something to you. > After all, how many of us have actually sat down > and _composed_ looping pieces, rather than just noodling? An approach I used recently and really enjoyed was: record long spacey semi-droney improvisation with 2.7-second delay and less than 100% feedback (partially loopy). Chop it up and crossfade between phrases to remove the less inspired parts and create more dramatic tonal and mood shifts. Extract several repetitions of a nice loop, sample it, and crossfade from the improv into the loop. Compose a few minutes of stuff on top of this loop and other phrases from the original improv. At some level _everything_ is noodling ... when I compose I noodle until I find something that sounds good, makes musical sense, says what I want it to say, etc. etc. Is "just" noodling trial and error with inadequate editing? To me "noodling" is a willingness to listen to the right hemisphere, especially early in the process (the left hemisphere usually gets plenty of chances to edit later on). Doug --- Doug Wyatt Sonosphere - music and music software doug@sonosphere.com http://www.sonosphere.com/ From ???@??? Mon Feb 09 18:40:40 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 9 11:31:35 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y1yvS-0004br-00; Mon, 9 Feb 1998 11:31:30 -0800 Message-ID: <000801bd3590$60d24e40$70da6f83@pt205.wolfson.cam.ac.uk> From: "Peter Thompson" To: Subject: Re: DOD 8 second delay Date: Mon, 9 Feb 1998 19:24:42 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Resent-Message-ID: <"pWUZCC.A.XdD.Rg130"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3104 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 9 Feb 1998 11:31:30 -0800 X-UIDL: 3f6622d028008f09a70eac4681f09192 Does anyone know whether this unit will be available in the UK? One presumes the price will be the same in UKP as in dollars??? Pete __________________________________________ Peter Thompson pt205@hermes.cam.ac.uk Wolfson College Cambridge CB3 9BB "I take another brief dip in the indifference of fools." - Bill Nelson From ???@??? Mon Feb 09 18:40:42 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 9 11:35:19 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y1yz6-00057Q-00; Mon, 9 Feb 1998 11:35:16 -0800 Date: Mon, 9 Feb 1998 14:25:46 -0500 (EST) From: Adam Levin Reply-To: Adam Levin To: stickwire-l@netcom.com, Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Finneus Gauge/Smokin' Granny/Dark Aether Project Feb 28th in Baltimore Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Resent-Message-ID: <"QrPbEB.A.AuD.Ii130"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3105 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 9 Feb 1998 11:35:16 -0800 X-UIDL: 0478b19be3f146fef0781e844e205c61 Baltimore Progressive Rock Showcase Series at Orion Sound Studios 2903 Whittington Ave Baltimore, Maryland Saturday, February 28th 1998 - 7:30PM F I N N E U S - Redefining musical boundaries, finneus gauge G A U G E incorporates elements of jazz, rock, fusion, funk, and soaring vocal harmonies that have won over many fans worldwide, including the folks at Keyboard Magazine who picked their debut CD as one of the top releases of the year. S M O K I N ' - This outfit featuring former members of Freehand G R A N N Y were one of the favorites at Progday 97 last year. Brewing up a mixture heavy on the fusion with a dabble of the avant-garde and a heaping spoonful of improv, they're sure to delight. T H E D A R K - Featuring Adam Levin (Chapman Stick/loops/guitar), A E T H E R Yaman Aksu (fretted and fretless guitars/guitar P R O J E C T synth) and Brian Griffin (percussion), this trio plays a blend of progressive/psychedelic rock with ethnic folk and jazz-based improv sensibilities. The core trio will be joined by some very special guests to celebrate the release of their debut CD. ADMISSION: $13.00 at the door. All ages welcome! OTHER INFO: Call the studio at 410.646.7334 after 2pm EST, email mpotter@stsci.edu or alevin@ari.net, or point your favorite web browser to http://prog.ari.net/prog/shows/showcase/ Orion Studios is a rehearsal and recording studio located in southwest Baltimore, Maryland. Orion has 21 rehearsal studios which are rented on a monthly basis, plus a 24 track digital recording studio attached to a showcase room. The show will take place in the Showcase Room. - Sodas will be available, but there is no liquor license. If you want to drink alcohol and are of age, BYOB and please act responsibly. - There are a limited number of couches and chairs available, so feel free to bring blankets or lawn chairs to sit on. - Please do not bring flash cameras or recording devices. - There will be a retail area where the bands and other vendors will be selling CDs, tapes, and T-shirts, so bring plenty of cash! - Vendors interested in attending should call Orion or email mpotter@stsci.edu about table rentals. ======================================================================== Directions: -Take I-95 to exit 50, Caton Ave. (Just inside the south west side of the 695 beltway) -Take Caton Ave south to the third traffic light and turn left onto Washington Blvd -Go 1/4 mile up the hill to the U-Haul sign and turn right onto Inverness. -At the end of Inverness, turn left onto Whittington Ave. -Go to the end of Whittington and turn right into the parking lot at 2903 Whittington, in the Whittington Business Center. -Orion is on the right. -Adam --- "...if one strives at hearing for the sake of constant virtue, out of seeking liberation from cyclic existence, gradually one becomes a Hearer." - Chandrakirti From ???@??? Mon Feb 09 18:40:43 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 9 11:39:05 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y1z2e-0005eM-00; Mon, 9 Feb 1998 11:38:56 -0800 Message-Id: <199802091933.MAA02229@hyper.dimensional.com> From: "Scott Bullerwell" To: Subject: Re: Question about the Boomerang Date: Mon, 9 Feb 1998 12:27:29 -0700 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"cAWLjC.A.JGE.sk130"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3106 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 9 Feb 1998 11:38:56 -0800 X-UIDL: 3f415bdec40a81ac13797e35992c1670 Space Station. Bannana yellow. About $150 on the street. BTW, the 'Rang sorta does real-time backwards: the backwards notes are, in essence, delayed by the length of the loop. It's still a hell of a cool trick. Scott Bullerwell tanelorn@dimensional.com Boulder, Colorado, USA Happy Boomerang User ---------- > From: Kim Flint > To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com > Subject: Re: Question about the Boomerang > Date: Monday, February 09, 1998 11:40 > > Digitech also has a new pedal that does this. Can't remember the name, some > sort of "space music" theme. I think it did other things like ring mod and > such, looks like a whammy pedal. > > kim > > > >Hello fellow loopers, > > > >A friend of mine just told me that the Boomerang will let you play > >backwards live in realtime. I told him I had not heard that, but I knew you > >could flip the recorded loop around and play it backwards. My friend said > >someone demonstrated a Boomerang to him and he swore the guy was playing a > >backwards solo live in realtime. If the 'Rang can do this, I'm surprised > >this hasn't been mentioned before, as it is a pretty cool thing. If it has > >been mentioned, I must have missed it. You guys at Boomerang should add > >this to your ads and marketing, there might be a few crazy backwards > >loopers out there who would get into this. Also is there any progress on a > >software update for the Boomerang for better sampling rate? Thanks! > >Ed > > > ______________________________________________________________________ > Kim Flint | Looper's Delight > kflint@annihilist.com | http://www.annihilist.com/loop/loop.html > http://www.annihilist.com/ | Loopers-Delight-request@annihilist.com > > From ???@??? Mon Feb 09 18:41:17 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 9 15:39:18 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y22n9-0007Ha-00; Mon, 9 Feb 1998 15:39:11 -0800 Message-ID: <2148EC143F29D1118BE000805FC13CD01E1F72@migarexch01.maritz.com> From: "Liebig, Steuart A." To: "'Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com'" Subject: RE: looping as sin Date: Mon, 9 Feb 1998 13:36:20 -0600 X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) Resent-Message-ID: <"dm7bq.A.rPG.GK530"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3111 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 9 Feb 1998 15:39:11 -0800 X-UIDL: 8729fbaa59bcf997614916a13d1ecd44 > At 02:41 PM 2/6/98 -0600, Liebig, Steuart A. wrote: > > IF someone is noodling with a guitar (or any instrument) without > >processing, it can be just as annoying (or more so) than any IC chip. > >But I have to go back to situations that I've been in where people > were > >so hung up on their processors that they couldn't react to a group > >improv situation. As far as my experience goes, the micro-processors > in > >these machines can't react as quickly as I can to someone else's > >playing, particulary where change of tonality is concerned. I guess > I'm > >bugged when I feel that people are abdicating their musical > flexibilty > >or decision-making to whatever tool it is that they use. > So it seems you are bothered by the people and not so much the tools they use? Right! > > Lastly, with all this talk of the human/instrument interface > >also being a "limitation" . . . my question is this: What is more > >capable of nuanced performance people or machines? For example, the > old > >tech of Violins, etc. has been developed for many thousands of years, > >try to get a MIDI instrument to be as nuanced both from the hardware > >side and the performance practice side. I don't expect machines to > >perform as well as people, I use 'em and think that they're great > tools, > >but I understand what I consider to be their limitations and uses. > I always find it remarkable when people perceive the newer, electronic > devices as "technology" in preference to older things. I think the > piano is > one of the most stunning technological accomplishments humans have > ever > made. The amount of knowledge and invention that had to happen before > the > modern piano could exist is simply amazing. That to me is one of the > finest > examples of technology I can think of. Just because it's been > basically > finished for a hundred years doesn't lessen the technical > accomplishment. > You'll note that I did include a violin as an example of technology ("old tech") in my last note. Ditto for the pianoforte . . . (Of course a concert quality violin is BIG BIG Bucks . . . can't imagine most of us WANTING to spend $100,00 plus for a looper . . . . so there's one trade-off.) As far as I'm concerned, my "primary" instrument, the electric bass, is totally in it's infancy-both from the tech and understanding/expectation sides of things. Now, ICs are no slouch in the technology department either, but knowing what > goes into them, I just don't see it as so amazing. It always strikes > me as > odd when people express an emotionally driven bias against the bits of > technology that happened recently, but are accepting of what happened > before > some arbitrary date. It's luddite hypocrisy. (hmm, I should send that > to Ted > Kaczinski...) > Again, I've had about 15 DDLs in my life and still have three. Not hung up on pre-CBS Strats or Jazz Basses either. NOT AN EMOTIONAL DIATRIBE AGAINST THE DEVICES! JUST USAGE THEREOF. As you noted, some instruments have been in development for hundreds or even > thousands of years. A LOT of people spent their entire lives on these, > passing it on to generations of developers and inventors who spent > their > entire lives. Electronic instruments have a few decades on them, with > most > of the work happening in the last two. Maybe the refinements are still > going > on and have a ways to go? Really, I don't see any point in getting > bent > about that. It's like hating a four year old for not have the maturity > and > wisdom of his grandfather. Give it time, they'll get there. > Right (on both counts), but I don't expect the tech to "really" come of age in my lifetime . . . DAMN. Will still use the stuff. (When will they scrap/modify MIDI? It only has 128 variables on volume from ppp to fff, as far as I can tell, that's LAUGHABLE to a violinist/flautist, etc.) Not bent, just an OBSERVATION about the "NOW." and there are certainly a lot of people making expressive, nuanced music > with existing electronic instruments. Perhaps you just forced these > instruments into an inappropriate context, and expected what they > weren't > really capable of? It seems like you developed your entire bias from > playing > in a group improv situation with somebody using a midi controller! And > let > me guess, was it that least developed of all midi devices, the guitar > synth? > A bit circumstantial, isn't it? > NOT A GUITAR SYNTH (do you dislike these?). A person playing a "regular instrument" through a bunch of processing. Not totally based on one experience, just an example. Agreed: "forced these instruments into an inappropriate context." MY POINT EXACTLY-or perhaps, not ADAPTING their approach to the context (back to Musical Decisions/Flexibilty). I still don't think that electronics are as fully "evolved" (from both a tech and performance practice perspective). But try to get a violin to loop by itself . . . Also, the first time that I brought this up was in a discussion that was precipitated vis a vis AMBIENT MUSIC and the pros and cons. The people who create remarkable music with electronic instruments use them > for what the can do, and place that in service of their music. And a > lot of > what electronics can do isn't possible any other way, so for a lot of > people > it opens possiblities they could not have had otherwise. Some of them > do > pretty good stuff. > Right . . . I have plenty of synths too . . . try to invite a Syphony Orchestra into your home to have a rehearsal, for FREE. And some people just play with the knobs and make goofy noises and never do > anything remarkable other than enjoy themselves. You can't really > fault them > or the electronics for that, can you? > Same could be said for perspectives on AMBIENT music. Some is gonna be crap and some good . . . My main question is this: What's the focal point? Music or tech? Just dealing with/communicating MY pet peeve . . . steuart > kim > ________________________________________________________ > Kim Flint 408-752-9284 > Mpact System Engineering kflint@chromatic.com > Chromatic Research http://www.chromatic.com > > From ???@??? Mon Feb 09 18:41:32 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 9 16:49:23 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y23t2-0007Pb-00; Mon, 9 Feb 1998 16:49:20 -0800 Message-ID: <2148EC143F29D1118BE000805FC13CD01E1F75@migarexch01.maritz.com> From: "Liebig, Steuart A." To: "'Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com'" Subject: RE: real time groove loops Date: Mon, 9 Feb 1998 13:51:36 -0600 X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) Resent-Message-ID: <"qWJZ1.A.89F.UJ630"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3114 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 9 Feb 1998 16:49:20 -0800 X-UIDL: 2d78c7b94d5ba0a766a1ba41628150bb > ---------- > From: Kim Flint > Reply To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com > Sent: Friday, February 6, 1998 7:06 PM > To: LiebigSA@maritz.com > Subject: Re: real time groove loops > > > So how? There doesn't seem to be any good instruments for this. Trends > are > emerging, very much in the infancy. There's more real time access and > control to sequencers, more knobs appearing on things. But nothing > satisfying in the way an actual "instrument" is. > HHHMMMMM . . . From ???@??? Mon Feb 09 18:40:50 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 9 12:06:08 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y1zSt-0000dd-00; Mon, 9 Feb 1998 12:06:03 -0800 From: MIvanBerk@aol.com Message-ID: <5b247d11.34df609d@aol.com> Date: Mon, 9 Feb 1998 15:01:31 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: More loopers for sale Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 57 Resent-Message-ID: <"zm1FWB.A.OP.0D230"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3107 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 9 Feb 1998 12:06:03 -0800 X-UIDL: 7f333482607a73f1d9c785501362a272 I also have for sale. I'm basically selling the majority of my rack looping gear, because I'm not using it enough, and it isn't making me any money: A Vortex, in perfect condition, with one Lexicon footswitch and a Roland EV-5 expression pedal: $250 A Digitech RDS 8000 Time Machine, 8 second delay, with 2 Hosa momentary footswitches. $200 I have manuals for both, and if you're interested in picking up both items, I'll throw in a two-space SKB rack. I strongly prefer a New York City area-or-accessible buyer. -Mike From ???@??? Mon Feb 09 18:40:55 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 9 12:45:10 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y204e-0004lK-00; Mon, 9 Feb 1998 12:45:04 -0800 X-Lotus-FromDomain: TRUEVISION From: Greg_Leistikow@truevision.com To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Message-ID: <052565A6.006E0C4E.00@in-mail1.truevision.com> Date: Mon, 9 Feb 1998 15:30:10 -0500 Subject: New looper wannabe... Resent-Message-ID: <"RMmo2D.A.SrD.8l230"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3108 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 9 Feb 1998 12:45:04 -0800 X-UIDL: 49ee8b34b29c6bf18f399144c1f03a1b I have been lurking for a few months and I wanted to introduce myself. I am a Chapman Stick/Guitar/keyboard player into innovative music in general, including looping of course. I currently do limited loop style of grooves with an MXR one second delay that does a good job, for what it is. That is one of the reasons for this post, I keep seeing these cool looping devices come and go for sale but I am in the unfortunate position of having no cash. I do have some gear that I would be willing to trade including an Audiomedia card for digital recording on older nubus Macs and even some Mac gear to go along with it. Email in private if interested and if nothing else, I look forward to more high quality looping discussion and contributing where I can. Greg By the way, I think that the limits of an instrument to a large degree define the music that is ultimately made with it. Fully exploring those limits is only possible with a whole lot of time and dedication. I remember reading an article a while back where the author lamented what he called "Options anxiety". If there are too many choice of sounds, etc, it can just about shut down the creative process. The limitations many times help to promote focus. For what it is worth. From ???@??? Mon Feb 09 18:40:56 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 9 12:50:41 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y20A3-0005Wf-00; Mon, 9 Feb 1998 12:50:39 -0800 Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 9 Feb 1998 13:44:14 -0700 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: dtapia@unoco.edu (Douglas Tapia) Subject: DigiTech Space Station Cc: mtp@unoco.edu Resent-Message-ID: <"S-iCo.A.jXE.qq230"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3109 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 9 Feb 1998 12:50:39 -0800 X-UIDL: b642d3d3ff42d7de122d06a32d20b8ff >Digitech also has a new pedal that does this. Can't remember the name, some >sort of "space music" theme. I think it did other things like ring mod and >such, looks like a whammy pedal. > Yes, and if I'm not mistaken, it's called the "XP-300 Space Station" It's supposed to have a "string pad swell" setting, wammy, reverse playback, filtering stuff, sample&hold, etc. List is arround $240.00, but you should be able to find it for less. Does anyone have any experience with this device? I think I saw John Scofield use this (or a similar looking wammy type box) recently at a quartet gig, though I'm not sure. It was the first time I'd ever heard Sco use anything like looping in his performance. It was pretty cool: very "Friselian." He would loop stuff like crazy flanged fret noise and string scrapings and then play over the top of this. He also seemed to be using this same box to transpose the instrument well in excess of two octaves, which when combined with an envelope filter, made his guitar sound quite a bit like a violin. If anyone knows for sure if this is one of the new Digitech boxes or what it is, let us know. It was VERY cool! Doug From ???@??? Mon Feb 09 10:16:07 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 9 03:38:58 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y1rY9-0007Gy-00; Mon, 9 Feb 1998 03:38:57 -0800 Message-Id: <3.0.1.16.19980209131547.26af379e@rank-serv.elec.gla.ac.uk> X-Sender: pycraft@rank-serv.elec.gla.ac.uk X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.1 (16) Date: Mon, 09 Feb 1998 13:15:47 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: "Michael P. Hughes, Ph.D." Subject: RE: looping as sin In-Reply-To: References: <2.2.32.19980207080540.00bb1da8@pop.chromatic.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"KJzYrB.A.JkG.Jpu30"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3091 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 9 Feb 1998 03:38:57 -0800 X-UIDL: fa6265e06c3ef719a4eb944b0304d48c >> > guess I'm >> >bugged when I feel that people are abdicating their musical flexibilty >> >or decision-making to whatever tool it is that they use. >> I always find it remarkable when people perceive the newer, electronic >> devices as "technology" in preference to older things. I think the piano is >> one of the most stunning technological accomplishments humans have ever >> made. The amount of knowledge and invention that had to happen before the >> modern piano could exist is simply amazing. That to me is one of the finest >> examples of technology I can think of. Just because it's been basically >> finished for a hundred years doesn't lessen the technical accomplishment. >Sometimes I think of how revolutionary equal temperament was. And yet, in >the bigger picture, it too is a constraint. Sometimes I like to microtune >my synths as a way of choosing a different constraint. I often find it amazing that using a single tonality is insufficient for us these days. The "one-sound" violin has been sufficient for about 4 centuries of music; at no point did anyone say "right, we've exhausted all we can do with that, bin it". The breadth of new music is countless idioms composed for this simple instrument is huge. And yet nowadays, if our processor can't perform infinite combinations of voices that we can switch between, we're not interested. I'm not against processing - obviously, or I'd not be here - but I do worry that our "ambient drone-guitar noodlings" are little more than attempts to attract attention through novelty of tone, rather than musical merit. After all, how many of us have actually sat down and _composed_ looping pieces, rather than just noodling? Michael From ???@??? Mon Feb 09 18:41:26 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 9 16:25:18 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y23Vk-0004Vz-00; Mon, 9 Feb 1998 16:25:16 -0800 Message-ID: <34DF9D8B.51E295E4@bellsouth.net> Date: Mon, 09 Feb 1998 19:21:32 -0500 From: Jeff Duke Reply-To: jmar@bellsouth.net Organization: Tec Bab Labs X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: looping as sin References: <2148EC143F29D1118BE000805FC13CD01E1F72@migarexch01.maritz.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"9kYNQD.A.-lD.60530"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3112 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 9 Feb 1998 16:25:16 -0800 X-UIDL: 118a45ad079bf2bb2715c722e21d7309 Liebig, Steuart A. wrote: > > > My main question is this: What's the focal point? Music or tech? > > . . > > steuart > > To me its the music,the tec is just there as a tool to use how you seel > fit to.Not being a *serious* musicion seems to be an asset in appreciating > the listening to of many styles without having to be a critic.To me it's > an emotional release after work to crank up and noodle away,if there is > something there then I put it up on the web just cause I can and it's > *fun*.Thanks for you remarks on this ongoing discusion. Jeffhttp://members.tripod.com/~dukesr/index.html From ???@??? Mon Feb 09 18:41:30 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 9 16:44:40 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y23oO-0006ji-00; Mon, 9 Feb 1998 16:44:32 -0800 Date: Mon, 9 Feb 1998 19:37:57 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <199802100037.TAA16601@shell.monmouth.com> X-Sender: andre@mail.monmouth.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: andre Subject: Re: UNSUBSCRIBE humor Resent-Message-ID: <"AZsRKB.A.TbF.4F630"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3113 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 9 Feb 1998 16:44:32 -0800 X-UIDL: b946d0eb946bdac37c89e03212b955aa you're awesome , kim !!! this was one of the funniest things i've seen in a while!! :) i , too, do not suffer foolishness lightly, and respect others who don't ...i cracked up at this classic. andre' >Please UNSUBSCRIBE me from the mailing list. I'll probably join you again in >>the future. >> >>Many Thanks > > >OK, I don't say this very often (or ever), but seems like this is a good >time, since I'm now completely sick of spending so much time helping people >with this. There are *NO HUMANS* involved in this process. If you post how hard is this to understand?? when will people learn!? spell "unsubscribe." Never in my life could I have imagined how many ways >people could come up with to misspell these words. If the email has only >one word in it, is it really so hard to check that you've spelled it right? hotmail...?it. You get what you pay for. > Just because >morons at Netscape and Microsoft thought this was a good idea does not mean >you should stoop to their level. love it> Expecting different results >from the exact same actions is one definition of insanity. It's probably >also an indicator of pure, unadulterated stupidity. Try to be above that. > >- this is really not complicated. Just follow the directions, and you will >be fine! - this last advice is basically impossible for most americans> From ???@??? Mon Feb 09 18:41:34 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 9 17:15:07 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y24Hr-0002Zw-00; Mon, 9 Feb 1998 17:14:59 -0800 Message-Id: <2.2.32.19980210010812.00a66440@pop.chromatic.com> X-Sender: kflint@pop.chromatic.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 2.2 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 09 Feb 1998 17:08:12 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Kim Flint Subject: Re: UNSUBSCRIBE humor Resent-Message-ID: <"AVnsnC.A.RtB.Kj630"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3115 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 9 Feb 1998 17:14:59 -0800 X-UIDL: 09ee8571553b245be560b7627ae60344 At 07:37 PM 2/9/98 -0500, andre wrote: >you're awesome , kim !!! > >this was one of the funniest things i've seen in a while!! :) Too bad it didn't work. A few hours after I sent this there was a guy trying to unsubscribe with his sig file on. He sent the exact same mail about four times in a row. It's no wonder the aliens never stop here. >>- this is really not complicated. Just follow the directions, and you will >>be fine! > >- this last advice is basically impossible for most americans Nope, one thing I've learned from this is that stupidity transcends all borders.... now who was is that said stupidity is the most common material in the universe again? Was that Zappa or George Carlin? kim _______________________________________________________ Kim Flint 408-752-9284 Mpact Systems Engineering kflint@chromatic.com Chromatic Research http://www.chromatic.com From ???@??? Mon Feb 09 18:41:35 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 9 17:18:20 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y24L2-00031h-00; Mon, 9 Feb 1998 17:18:16 -0800 Message-Id: <1.5.4.32.19980210011052.0066399c@tiac.net> X-Sender: rphunt@tiac.net X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 09 Feb 1998 20:10:52 -0500 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Reginald Hunt Subject: RE: looping as sin Resent-Message-ID: <"NcmQSB.A.lAC.Wl630"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3116 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 9 Feb 1998 17:18:16 -0800 X-UIDL: 8a369dee673102129da492245ae7f5fb Actually, by strange coincindence I was working on a straight frippertronics piece last week, and by the time I got it tracked right, I had it memorized. This got me wondering about a good way to notate it for future refernce or performance. Anybody know of work being done in loop notation? Reg >I'm not against processing - obviously, or >I'd not be here - but I do worry that our "ambient drone-guitar noodlings" >are little more than attempts to attract attention through novelty of tone, >rather than musical merit. After all, how many of us have actually sat down >and _composed_ looping pieces, rather than just noodling? > >Michael > > > From ???@??? Mon Feb 09 22:18:09 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 9 19:48:13 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y26g6-0000fx-00; Mon, 9 Feb 1998 19:48:10 -0800 From: Texture444@aol.com Message-ID: <2d382d98.34dfcd31@aol.com> Date: Mon, 9 Feb 1998 22:44:44 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: RE: looping as sin Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 82 Resent-Message-ID: <"ctIg7D.A.WR.70830"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3117 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 9 Feb 1998 19:48:10 -0800 X-UIDL: be5721f4f044344dc8d8582a1da25128 to doug's post: so well-spoke. dude! the somewhat-less-than-lucid-tonight dt From ???@??? Mon Feb 09 22:18:19 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 9 21:29:15 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y28Ft-0000qh-00; Mon, 9 Feb 1998 21:29:13 -0800 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <052565A6.006E0C4E.00@in-mail1.truevision.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 00:25:14 -0500 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: David Myers Subject: Re: New looper wannabe... Resent-Message-ID: <"nP7nS.A.EV.AT-30"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3118 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 9 Feb 1998 21:29:13 -0800 X-UIDL: 829527771df5c52ca4f064811646b557 >I remember reading an article a while back where the author lamented what >he called >"Options anxiety". If there are too many choice of sounds, etc, it can >just about shut down the creative process. The limitations many times help >to promote focus. For what it is worth. Good point, Greg. I think this has been the major reason that I have always focused on making music without any instruments at all (Feedback Music, detailed here recently). It sure helps the focus! David Myers ____________________________________ "Eternity is not limited by the conditions of time, and time is eternal in virtue of its cyclic recurrence." -Hermetica, Asclepius III From ???@??? Tue Feb 10 01:46:30 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 9 22:31:23 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y29E1-0005ix-00; Mon, 9 Feb 1998 22:31:21 -0800 From: TritoneDW@aol.com Message-ID: <9c584a4f.34dff331@aol.com> Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 01:26:54 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Notation for Looping Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 49 Resent-Message-ID: <"TOnxH.A.bAF.5N_30"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3119 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 9 Feb 1998 22:31:21 -0800 X-UIDL: 638670fc38168938c52f5a1b7cf7ad7d In a message dated 98-02-09 20:18:24 EST, you write: << Actually, by strange coincindence I was working on a straight frippertronics piece last week, and by the time I got it tracked right, I had it memorized. This got me wondering about a good way to notate it for future refernce or performance. Anybody know of work being done in loop notation? Reg >> Funny, I've been thinking about this too, as I'm in the process of composing some music for electric guitar, one movement of which will be looped. I'm thinking of some sort of graphical notation. I've played pieces which are made up of cells of music, to be played ad lib ( Like "In C" by TERRY RILEY :-) ) or Leo Brouwer guitar etude #20. One could use the same sort of idea for loop notation--graphically define the boundery of the loop, punch in points, etc. You would probably have several representations as the loop was built, sort of like several sections of repeats in standard notation. Does this make any sense at all? I have a strong idea about how to do this, but it's nearly impossible to describe this in e-mail. Feel free to e-mail me privately, if you like. Anyone else ever done this? Drew W. From ???@??? Tue Feb 10 01:46:31 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 9 23:00:34 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y29gG-0000lB-00; Mon, 9 Feb 1998 23:00:32 -0800 Message-Id: <199802100657.BAA06643@shell.monmouth.com> Reply-To: From: "andre" To: Subject: Re: UNSUBSCRIBE humor Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 01:57:13 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1162 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"pHNetD.A.Tc.0p_30"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3120 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 9 Feb 1998 23:00:32 -0800 X-UIDL: 1def71ae3bbbf76ba4d990d6fe471647 > > Too bad it didn't work. A few hours after I sent this there was a guy trying > to unsubscribe with his sig file on. He sent the exact same mail about four > times in a row. It's no wonder the aliens never stop here. sigh. > > > >>- this is really not complicated. Just follow the directions, and you will > >>be fine! > > > >- this last advice is basically impossible for most americans > > Nope, one thing I've learned from this is that stupidity transcends all > borders.... oops - you're right. i think we've just perfected it to the n-th degree. > > now who was is that said stupidity is the most common material in the > universe again? Was that Zappa or George Carlin? i think zappa. have you heard that recent george carlin cd?? backin town or something??? where he talks about balancing the deficit ??? incredibly funny. Peace andre' From ???@??? Tue Feb 10 09:47:45 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 10 05:39:42 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y2FuX-0003qQ-00; Tue, 10 Feb 1998 05:39:41 -0800 Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 08:37:05 GMT Message-Id: <199802100837.IAA24420@phyleus.interlinx.qc.ca> X-Sender: erich@interlinx.qc.ca X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: erich kory Subject: Re: screaming guitar Resent-Message-ID: <"OS2mrB.A.dTD.HgF40"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3123 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 05:39:41 -0800 X-UIDL: 9ade0461ef7c1ca37afcda6bafb42bc5 I sometimes make loops with several of the natural harmonics of the cello. Just by their nature the chords that come out have an interesting harmony......should work on any string instrument and helps when you use the higher 7ths and combinations of overtones from different strings........ erich > I sometimes like to get the guitar feeding back at different pitches and >use them in loops.It can be interesting if the frequencies create diatonic >harmonies... > > Whoohooo!!! I have a variable-speed vibrater, but I've never used it on >my guitar. I wonder if it'll make my guitar scream as much as it makes... >lol! > >smiles, > >Corynne > > > >On Fri, 6 Feb 1998, T.W. Hartnett wrote: > >> >I used to put the strings of the guitar against my neck and talk, such that >> >my throat vibrated the strings. It was either that string vibration or the >> >actual sound of my voice getting picked up by microphonic pickups that >> >resulted in sound, not sure, but it worked alright. Hmm, don't think I've >> >tried that since I was about 14, maybe I should give it another go. >> >> The electric shaver or vibrator near the pickups is also a neat sound. >> Vibrators with a variable speed control are good to tune the resultant >> squall. >> >> Travis Hartnett >> >> > > > From ???@??? Tue Feb 10 01:46:39 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 10 01:35:52 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y2C6Z-0001bk-00; Tue, 10 Feb 1998 01:35:51 -0800 Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 04:33:32 -0500 (EST) From: Goddess X-Sender: Thefates@mariner.cris.com To: "Looper's Delight" Subject: Re: screaming guitar In-Reply-To: <199802062152.NAA09288@scv2.apple.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Resent-Message-ID: <"UDX8vC.A.vTB.w7B40"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3121 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 01:35:51 -0800 X-UIDL: 738f42427e410214ce03debbe6a27d9f I sometimes like to get the guitar feeding back at different pitches and use them in loops.It can be interesting if the frequencies create diatonic harmonies... Whoohooo!!! I have a variable-speed vibrater, but I've never used it on my guitar. I wonder if it'll make my guitar scream as much as it makes... lol! smiles, Corynne On Fri, 6 Feb 1998, T.W. Hartnett wrote: > >I used to put the strings of the guitar against my neck and talk, such that > >my throat vibrated the strings. It was either that string vibration or the > >actual sound of my voice getting picked up by microphonic pickups that > >resulted in sound, not sure, but it worked alright. Hmm, don't think I've > >tried that since I was about 14, maybe I should give it another go. > > The electric shaver or vibrator near the pickups is also a neat sound. > Vibrators with a variable speed control are good to tune the resultant > squall. > > Travis Hartnett > > From ???@??? Tue Feb 10 02:17:51 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 10 01:46:39 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y2CH0-0002Mp-00; Tue, 10 Feb 1998 01:46:38 -0800 Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 04:44:12 -0500 (EST) From: Goddess X-Sender: Thefates@mariner.cris.com To: loopers-delight@annihilist.com Subject: Thank you... Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Resent-Message-ID: <"7RlCEC.A.E_B.wFC40"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3122 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 01:46:38 -0800 X-UIDL: d6a7491f93668a16a51db8f6ff245bb8 I would just like to sincerely thank those of you who responded to my "question", "you know who you are..." lol. I wasn't sure if anyone would actually take the time but I'm very glad you did. It's nice to hear different perspectives on things... I'm sorry it took me a long time to respnd, but I've been having rather serious computer problems of late but, at last, they are subsiding. talk with ya soon... smiles, small furry animals and wierd modal-playing... Corynne From ???@??? Tue Feb 10 09:47:48 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 10 06:16:04 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y2GTh-0005x1-00; Tue, 10 Feb 1998 06:16:01 -0800 Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 09:12:14 -0500 (EST) From: Monkici@aol.com Message-ID: <980210091214_-1194657867@mrin39.mx> To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Notation for Looping Resent-Message-ID: <"za5c6D.A.zSF._BG40"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3124 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 06:16:01 -0800 X-UIDL: f877148afabcff65dc479657162df674 i think that notation for looping would be written like any other music. don't forget that Bach was looping hundreds of years ago- three voice fugues and inventions, etc... you would write the theme and perhaps use a new color or something no notate parts that are being played mechanically perhaps using black only for the parts actually being played live. you could use multiple staves if there are many lines. as for guitar techniques, i.e. volume swells, etc. there is already esatblished protocol for that. From ???@??? Tue Feb 10 09:48:00 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 10 07:50:00 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y2Hwc-0004hk-00; Tue, 10 Feb 1998 07:49:58 -0800 Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 10:45:50 -0500 (EST) From: Monkici@aol.com Message-ID: <980210104550_-1496407318@mrin52> To: loopers-delight@annihilist.com Subject: OBERHEIM? Resent-Message-ID: <"7e3iQC.A.LEE.tZH40"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3125 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 07:49:58 -0800 X-UIDL: 9ab8eaa70152509d67c6f9922ac9d21f perhaps i missed it.... but, is the EDP something a human can actually purchase or only read about???!!??? where can one buy (NOT ORDER/BACK ORDER) one? oberheim are you listening? ric 513 861 1687 From ???@??? Tue Feb 10 09:48:08 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 10 08:22:37 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y2ISA-0007RX-00; Tue, 10 Feb 1998 08:22:34 -0800 Message-Id: <98Feb10.101801cst.26881@gateway.gibson.com> X-Sender: tspauldi@mail.nash.gibson.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 10:20:28 -0600 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Tom Spaulding Subject: Re: OBERHEIM? Yes, dear? In-Reply-To: <980210104550_-1496407318@mrin52> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/enriched; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"ja7DvD.A.giG.13H40"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3126 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 08:22:34 -0800 X-UIDL: 3e03cdfac745563d173db02e742079ea Ric- Actually, you've missed quite a bit. And yes, I am always listening. Just ask anyone on this list! If a human actually got a Thoroughbred Music catalog (813-889-3874), or a Musician's Friend catalog (541-772-5173)or called Bananas at Large (415-457-7600), they could order an Echoplex. I am only suggesting these dealers because of their easy accessibility, not meaning to exclude the other fine Oberheim dealers in the USA. Echoplexes are back ordered because they are in high demand. We keep making them, people keep buying them. Fortunately, we are experiencing only a 15-30 day gap between orders and shipments these days, as opposed to the previous six months or so. (Thank Yew, thank yew vary mush). I suggest if you want one any time soon, get on a waiting list at one of these dealers and take your turn in line. Unless, of course, you can find a dealer who has them in stock, at which time your desire for immediate gratification could conceivably be sated. Unfortunately, popularity can be so inconvenient at times. ;) Tom "Can't please hardly any of 'em, seemingly" Spaulding Oberheim Product Manager p.s. Hey Kim...How soon until this is a FAQ??!! >perhaps i missed it.... but, is the EDP something a human can actually >purchase or only read about???!!??? where can one buy (NOT ORDER/BACK ORDER) >one? > > oberheim are you listening? > >ric >513 861 1687 > > > From ???@??? Tue Feb 10 09:48:11 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 10 08:35:34 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y2Ief-00011m-00; Tue, 10 Feb 1998 08:35:29 -0800 Message-ID: From: David Kirkdorffer To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: RE: DigiTech Space Station Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 11:34:17 -0500 X-Priority: 3 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) Content-Type: text/plain Resent-Message-ID: <"KqTG7B.A.ln.XEI40"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3127 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 08:35:29 -0800 X-UIDL: e7d76042795fb7122f39159224e06816 Has anyone actually seen *in real life* one of these DigiTech Space Station's?? I've only ever seen them in catalogs etc. Never on a shelf. David From ???@??? Tue Feb 10 10:13:54 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 10 10:08:16 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y2K6Q-00039B-00; Tue, 10 Feb 1998 10:08:14 -0800 X-Sender: kflint@pop.slip.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <98Feb10.101801cst.26881@gateway.gibson.com> References: <980210104550_-1496407318@mrin52> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 10:01:50 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Kim Flint Subject: Re: OBERHEIM? Yes, dear? Resent-Message-ID: <"S9CHVB.A.MIC.fYJ40"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3128 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 10:08:14 -0800 X-UIDL: bb0d6fd6d2dc5e37a02c644d045a1841 At 10:20 AM -0600 2/10/98, Tom Spaulding wrote: >>>> p.s. Hey Kim...How soon until this is a FAQ??!! The official policy here at Looper's Delight Headquarters is this: If you think it should be on the website, congratulations, it's your job! kim ______________________________________________________________________ Kim Flint | Looper's Delight kflint@annihilist.com | http://www.annihilist.com/loop/loop.html http://www.annihilist.com/ | Loopers-Delight-request@annihilist.com From ???@??? Tue Feb 10 11:03:47 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 10 10:14:44 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y2KCf-000425-00; Tue, 10 Feb 1998 10:14:41 -0800 From: bryan.helm@dinosaur.com Message-ID: <9802101103.0FJGY00@dinosaur.com> Organization: The Dinosaur Board X-Mailer: TBBS/TIGER v1.0 Date: Tue, 10 Feb 98 11:03:44 -0700 Subject: loop notes To: loopers-delight@annihilist.com Resent-Message-ID: <"VJBm4.A.AFD.GfJ40"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3129 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 10:14:41 -0800 X-UIDL: 83b247586d397b6078889307f3558822 Actually there is interesting work "notation wise" being done from a loop context by (gasp & shudder) Mr. Fripp. My understanding is that producer David Singleton has utilized a software process that "disects" as it were the relative harmonic aspects of several of Fripps loops and has then taken that information to a musical notation format for the purposes of choral performances of these works. Specifics of devices used in, and commercial avilability of such works is unknown to me at this time however. Sorry to use the "F" word twice, but seeing as I'm already booked to play hell for an extended engagement, what could it possibly matter to me. FYI- good seats still available. Bryan P.S. Don't fool yourself, we're still in the dark ages of looping. From ???@??? Tue Feb 10 11:03:52 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 10 10:50:10 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y2Kky-00005Z-00; Tue, 10 Feb 1998 10:50:08 -0800 Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 10:45:46 -0800 (PST) From: Doug Michael X-Sender: dmic27@ccnet3 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Graphic Notation In-Reply-To: <9c584a4f.34dff331@aol.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Resent-Message-ID: <"HDCinD.A.s5G.oBK40"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3130 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 10:50:08 -0800 X-UIDL: 4eb80a7127579472c7c171904a2d94f0 On Tue, 10 Feb 1998 TritoneDW@aol.com wrote: > In a message dated 98-02-09 20:18:24 EST, you write: > This got me wondering about a good way to notate it for future refernce or > performance. Anybody know of work being done in loop notation? > Reg > >> > Funny, I've been thinking about this too, as I'm in the process of composing > some music for electric guitar, one movement of which will be looped. I'm > thinking of some sort of graphical notation. I've played pieces which are made > up of cells of music, to be played ad lib ( Like "In C" by TERRY RILEY :-) ) > or Leo Brouwer guitar etude #20. One could use the same sort of idea for loop > notation--graphically define the boundery of the loop, punch in points, etc. > You would probably have several representations as the loop was built, sort of > like several sections of repeats in standard notation. Does this make any > sense at all? I have a strong idea about how to do this, but it's nearly > impossible to describe this in e-mail. Feel free to e-mail me privately, if > you like. > Anyone else ever done this? > Drew W. Hello, You might want to check out a couple books on graphic notation. These are somewhat dated but very informative and helpful for anyone using this type of notation. New Music - A Guide to Notational Signs for Contemporary Music By Howard Risatti published by the University of Illinois Press Notation in New Music By Erhard Karkoschka published by Praeger Publishers. These have some great examples and helped me a lot when I was notating a piece I wrote for electric guitar and tape. These books don't have any specific loop orientated notation but many of the ideas could be adapted to loop type music. Doug Michael http://www.ccnet.com/~dmic27 From ???@??? Tue Feb 10 11:03:53 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 10 10:58:11 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y2Ksi-00017f-00; Tue, 10 Feb 1998 10:58:08 -0800 Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 10:53:30 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: improv@peak.org (Dave Trenkel) Subject: Re: DOD 8 second delay Resent-Message-ID: <"O3t7kC.A.Kb.aIK40"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3131 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 10:58:08 -0800 X-UIDL: 4528d63e6573625d0eeb420858bf7437 At 9:39 AM 2/9/98, Rich Lamphear wrote: >Has anyone been able to check out the new DOD 8-second delay pedal ($100)? >Looks pretty cool from the description, apparently does looping. > >Also, there's been a few mentions of the Lexicon LXP-5 on the list. What >features does this unit offer to someone interested in looping/sound >mangulation/guitar mayhem? > >thanks, >Rich I've had an LXP-5 for about 7 years now, and I use it all the time. In combination with an external controller, like Lexicon's MRC or the Peavey PC-1600, the LXP is a serious audio mangling tool. It only loops for a little over a second, but you can modify the loop length, great for stuttering effects. It also has a very good sounding pitch changer, with a wide range, 2 octaves down to 1 octave above original pitch. Nice dense reverbs. There's also a stereo delay section, independant of the mono delay/looping section. And it's a great sounding little box, even though it only samples at 32k, the sound quality is very nice and warm. The major drawback of the LXP is that, without the MRC or PC-1600, it has a lousy user interface. I defy any sane person to try to program it from the front panel, it can be done, but is near impossible. If you get one, plan on budgeting extra for a controller, or look for one sold with an MRC. With the MRC, operating the LXP is a breeze. The PC-1600 has to be programmed to work with the LXP, but once you've set it up, it's very easy to use. Another downside is that you can't program the order of effects, there's 2 different chains available, the first is Mono delay/loop-> stereo delay-> pitch shifter-> reverb, the second chain bypasses the pitch shifter and puts more DSP power to the delay and reverb. ________________________________________________________ Dave Trenkel : improv@peak.org : www.peak.org/~improv/ "...there will come a day when you won't have to use gasoline. You'd simply take a cassette and put it in your car, let it run. You'd have to have the proper type of music. Like you take two sticks, put 'em together, make fire. You take some notes and rub 'em together - dum, dum, dum, dum - fire, cosmic fire." -Sun Ra ________________________________________________________ From ???@??? Tue Feb 10 18:05:20 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 10 13:20:32 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y2N6Q-0007Yf-00; Tue, 10 Feb 1998 13:20:26 -0800 Message-Id: <215C1D5A0FFDD011B3CC00805FC18C291F6BD5@NTSRV2.LEXICON.COM> From: "Hogan, Greg (Exchange)" To: "'Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com'" Subject: RE: DOD 8 second delay Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 15:16:37 -0500 X-Priority: 3 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) Content-Type: text/plain Resent-Message-ID: <"PZKz5C.A.5jG.DOM40"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3133 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 13:20:26 -0800 X-UIDL: b8a692aa5670e592dbf5c19e3ac6eebe > Rich Lamphear[SMTP:rlamphear@hbsp.harvard.edu] asked: "Also, there's been a few mentions of the Lexicon LXP-5 on the list. What > features does this unit offer to someone interested in looping/sound > mangulation/guitar mayhem?" Dear Rich, The LXP-5 is a layered-effect processor that gives you up to 3 voices of delay. eq and reverb at the same time or 2 voices of delay eq and reverb. You have a mono delay voice of up to 1.04S and then a delay voice on each side of up to 325ms. Fairly limited as far as looping goes but many great options for sound mangling, um, er, processing. Please let me know if you have any questions or if there is anything that I can do for you. Best regards, Greg Hogan Lexicon Customer Service Phone +781-280-0372 FAX +781-280-0499 From ???@??? Tue Feb 10 18:05:24 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 10 13:38:36 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y2NNr-0001jd-00; Tue, 10 Feb 1998 13:38:27 -0800 From: Paolo Valladolid Message-Id: <199802102133.NAA08405@waynesworld.ucsd.edu> Subject: Re: looping as sin To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 13:33:09 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: <3.0.1.16.19980210215840.277f3152@rank-serv.elec.gla.ac.uk> from "Michael P. Hughes, Ph.D." at Feb 10, 98 09:58:40 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"FOYG0C.A.IAB.eeM40"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3134 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 13:38:27 -0800 X-UIDL: 4790925b988e45216c4f215d4162abc5 > >instrument if possible. (That's the "sensible" rationale for microtuning. > >My other one: what's so special about the mathematical ratios used in > >Western tunings anyway? There are more than 12 musically interesting > >ratios.) > > Well, Steve Vai played a 13-note-per-scale guitar with "Xavian" tuning..... There is a player in the Boston, Massachussetts, USA area by the name of John ??? who plays a 31-note/octave guitar. I think it is a fretless with the lines for that 31-note/octave temperament (and I think at least one other temperament - perhaps 19-tone) painted on. I think Jon Durant knows who I'm talking about; it was his brother Kingsley (are you there??) who sent me a tape of this amazing player. > have their one instrument and know it inside out. However, with synth > players the sounds are only as good as long as the synth is in vogue - how > many players (besides Eno) have decided to say "right, I've got a DX7 (or > whatever), and I'm going to get everything I can from it." Pat Metheny has been using the same GR300 synth for about 15-17 years. Interesting that someone said that synths just go "plonk". What interests me about synths are those sounds that can be sustained indefinitely while having their timbre altered in various ways. Cheers, Paolo Valladolid --------------------------------------------------------------- |Moderator of Digital Guitar Digest, an Internet mailing list |\ |for Music Technology and Stringed Instruments | \ ---------------------------------------------------------------- | \ finger pvallado@waynesworld.ucsd.edu for more info \ | \ http://waynesworld.ucsd.edu/DigitalGuitar/home.html \| ----------------------------------------------------------------- From ???@??? Tue Feb 10 18:05:25 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 10 13:58:13 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y2Ngv-0003xu-00; Tue, 10 Feb 1998 13:58:09 -0800 From: MIvanBerk@aol.com Message-ID: <694749f8.34e0cbfb@aol.com> Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 16:51:53 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: looping as sin Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 57 Resent-Message-ID: <"rmgsGD.A.UJD.SxM40"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3135 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 13:58:09 -0800 X-UIDL: b1685dee775d3b5abf73f7e08ada616a In a message dated 98-02-10 16:36:37 EST, Paolo wrote: << There is a player in the Boston, Massachussetts, USA area by the name of John ??? who plays a 31-note/octave guitar. I think it is a fretless with the lines for that 31-note/octave temperament (and I think at least one other temperament - perhaps 19-tone) painted on. I think Jon Durant knows who I'm talking about; it was his brother Kingsley (are you there??) who sent me a tape of this amazing player. >> His name's John Cutler, I believe. He has a brother who's a fretless bassist, playing in the same 31-note/octave scale. They both played in LaMonte Young's Forever Bad Blues Band, who put out a double CD-set of...um...interesting blues stomps, all in equal temperament. It's pretty jarring to hear those I- IV-Vs in their ideal forms. Mike (Just to get away from the whole this-instrument-is-more-inherentlyexpressive- than-that-one argument, which we ALL know is bullshit) From ???@??? Wed Feb 11 10:10:49 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 10 19:30:29 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y2SsV-0004Gi-00; Tue, 10 Feb 1998 19:30:27 -0800 Message-Id: <1.5.4.32.19980211032550.0067f4f4@tiac.net> X-Sender: rphunt@tiac.net X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 22:25:50 -0500 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Reginald Hunt Subject: Re: screaming guitar Resent-Message-ID: <"S9pFq.A.7kD.3pR40"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3136 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 19:30:27 -0800 X-UIDL: f7e5d5d9638612e5c277a2c7c27da11a Uhhhh....never mind. At 04:33 AM 2/10/98 -0500, you wrote: > I sometimes like to get the guitar feeding back at different pitches and >use them in loops.It can be interesting if the frequencies create diatonic >harmonies... > > Whoohooo!!! I have a variable-speed vibrater, but I've never used it on >my guitar. I wonder if it'll make my guitar scream as much as it makes... >lol! > >smiles, > >Corynne > > > >On Fri, 6 Feb 1998, T.W. Hartnett wrote: > >> >I used to put the strings of the guitar against my neck and talk, such that >> >my throat vibrated the strings. It was either that string vibration or the >> >actual sound of my voice getting picked up by microphonic pickups that >> >resulted in sound, not sure, but it worked alright. Hmm, don't think I've >> >tried that since I was about 14, maybe I should give it another go. >> >> The electric shaver or vibrator near the pickups is also a neat sound. >> Vibrators with a variable speed control are good to tune the resultant >> squall. >> >> Travis Hartnett >> >> > > > > From ???@??? Wed Feb 11 10:10:50 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 10 19:41:07 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y2T2k-0005cJ-00; Tue, 10 Feb 1998 19:41:02 -0800 Message-Id: <1.5.4.32.19980211033322.00671e7c@tiac.net> X-Sender: rphunt@tiac.net X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 22:33:22 -0500 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Reginald Hunt Subject: Re: Notation for Looping Resent-Message-ID: <"AQYf2C.A.oaE._wR40"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3137 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 19:41:02 -0800 X-UIDL: 9a251a41459f0a6cfab8a0a8b91b148c Actually I'm thinking more a shorthand technique. Doing a completely linear score for a loop piece with 50 or a hundred passes would be possible but not practical. Bach's fugues are incredible, but are limited by human mechanics (for lack of a better description). And Terry Riley's approach may not address actual timing relationships between phrases, which I also consider when looping. The CD I have has the score, but not a fully detailed description of performing it (but the notes are excellent nonetheless). Reg At 09:12 AM 2/10/98 -0500, you wrote: >i think that notation for looping would be written like any other music. > don't forget that Bach was looping hundreds of years ago- three voice fugues >and inventions, etc... you would write the theme and perhaps use a new color >or something no notate parts that are being played mechanically perhaps using >black only for the parts actually being played live. you could use multiple >staves if there are many lines. as for guitar techniques, i.e. volume swells, >etc. there is already esatblished protocol for that. > > > From ???@??? Wed Feb 11 10:11:01 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 10 19:59:54 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y2TKy-00001z-00; Tue, 10 Feb 1998 19:59:52 -0800 Message-Id: <1.5.4.32.19980211033524.0067a354@tiac.net> X-Sender: rphunt@tiac.net X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 22:35:24 -0500 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Reginald Hunt Subject: Re: OBERHEIM? Yes, dear? Resent-Message-ID: <"uSsPh.A.e6G.XFS40"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3140 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 19:59:52 -0800 X-UIDL: a9b58c05167d2539978fe06f007ade67 Actually, last week Thoroughbred said the wait was two weeks. Week before that it was one week. Manny's estimates a month. Reg At 10:20 AM 2/10/98 -0600, you wrote: >Ric- >Actually, you've missed quite a bit. And yes, I am always listening. Just ask anyone on this list! > >If a human actually got a Thoroughbred Music catalog (813-889-3874), or a Musician's Friend catalog (541-772-5173)or called Bananas at Large (415-457-7600), they could order an Echoplex. I am only suggesting these dealers because of their easy accessibility, not meaning to exclude the other fine Oberheim dealers in the USA. > >Echoplexes are back ordered because they are in high demand. We keep making them, people keep buying them. Fortunately, we are experiencing only a 15-30 day gap between orders and shipments these days, as opposed to the previous six months or so. (Thank Yew, thank yew vary mush). > >I suggest if you want one any time soon, get on a waiting list at one of these dealers and take your turn in line. Unless, of course, you can find a dealer who has them in stock, at which time your desire for immediate gratification could conceivably be sated. > >Unfortunately, popularity can be so inconvenient at times. ;) > >Tom "Can't please hardly any of 'em, seemingly" Spaulding >Oberheim Product Manager > >p.s. Hey Kim...How soon until this is a FAQ??!! > > >>perhaps i missed it.... but, is the EDP something a human can actually >>purchase or only read about???!!??? where can one buy (NOT ORDER/BACK ORDER) >>one? >> >> oberheim are you listening? >> >>ric >>513 861 1687 >> >> >> > > From ???@??? Wed Feb 11 10:10:56 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 10 19:46:25 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y2T7v-0006JY-00; Tue, 10 Feb 1998 19:46:23 -0800 Message-Id: <1.5.4.32.19980211033802.0067a508@tiac.net> X-Sender: rphunt@tiac.net X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 22:38:02 -0500 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Reginald Hunt Subject: Re: loop notes Resent-Message-ID: <"ovdBYC.A.ZAF.Z1R40"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3138 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 19:46:23 -0800 X-UIDL: e8c2081dc14ce5d7f83b3d0640678e8e Wow, that's interesting. Are you talking Fast Fourier, which would then deduce fundamentals? I hope DGM releases a choral recording of the results. Reg At 11:03 AM 2/10/98 -0700, you wrote: > >Actually there is interesting work "notation wise" being >done from a loop context by (gasp & shudder) Mr. Fripp. >My understanding is that producer David Singleton has >utilized a software process that "disects" as it were the >relative harmonic aspects of several of Fripps loops and >has then taken that information to a musical notation format >for the purposes of choral performances of these works. >Specifics of devices used in, and commercial avilability >of such works is unknown to me at this time however. >Sorry to use the "F" word twice, but seeing as I'm already >booked to play hell for an extended engagement, what >could it possibly matter to me. FYI- good seats still >available. > > Bryan > >P.S. Don't fool yourself, we're still in the > dark ages of looping. > > > From ???@??? Wed Feb 11 10:10:58 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 10 19:51:02 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y2TCO-0006tZ-00; Tue, 10 Feb 1998 19:51:00 -0800 Message-Id: <1.5.4.32.19980211034539.006825d8@tiac.net> X-Sender: rphunt@tiac.net X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 22:45:39 -0500 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Reginald Hunt Subject: RE: looping as sin Resent-Message-ID: <"NUm5nD.A.A9F.e8R40"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3139 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 19:51:00 -0800 X-UIDL: 8d2f6cf9318d91239b5ce0c058b7ce93 Artists of many mediums fall prey to that temptation. Unfortunately, observing a great experimenter can give the false sense that it is from the nature of experimentation that the greatness comes. Reg >Sure; looped noodles can be inspiring (as well as the name of a tasty >Chinese meal...?), but I feel that often we loopers are all too willing to >do our trial-and-error compositions in public. > >Michael From ???@??? Wed Feb 11 10:11:06 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 10 21:27:48 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y2Ui0-0007V3-00; Tue, 10 Feb 1998 21:27:44 -0800 Message-ID: <34E135FE.6DC6@dmans.com> Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 23:24:14 -0600 From: "Mikell D. Nelson" Reply-To: mnelson@dmans.com Organization: Boomerang Musical Products X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (Win95; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: sample clock playback tricks References: <35a9057.34da1c3d@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"Yx30xD.A.voG.8XT40"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3141 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 21:27:44 -0800 X-UIDL: f378030017a2243bff77117e65093af3 > In a message dated 98-02-05 14:53:28 EST, Kim wrote: > > << interesting problem, new technology comes along, making huge improvements > in some ways and obsoleting the old stuff. But there's usually some > characteristic of the old stuff that becomes very difficult in the new > technology. And then you need a few more generations of new technology > before you are able to do the old idea again. In this case, you used to be > able to easily change the sample clock on A/D and D/A convertors, and they > would be happy and nothing else in a simple delay system would get screwed > up. Nowadays, the convertors give better audio but don't let you do that > sample clock trick anymore, and other things in the system that need > accurate timing (like midi) get screwed up. So for the echoplex and jamman, > this sort of thing is impossible. So now you need to add a fair amount of > dsp processing and more sophisticated real-time os techniques to be able to > do what once just required a very cheap part. such is progress.... > > kim >> > > Any idea how the Boomerang folks got around this problem, at least insofar as > their unit offers half speed/half sample rate playback? Boomerang folks? The convertor we use offers a range of fixed sample rates mathematically related to the frequency of the associated oscillator or crystal. We have recently upgraded to a chip that offers more flexibility. I believe the sample rate can be set to 1K, 2K, 3K... up to the frequency of the driving oscillator. Another benefit of this chip is that it is absolutely silent when switching between rates. As far as converters that are truely continuously variable in sample rate... I don't know of one, but then I haven't done a survey of the current technology; it changes rapidly. Mike Nelson Boomerang Musical Products PO Box 541595 Dallas, TX 75354-1595 Tel 800-530-4699 (outside USA, 214-340-6913) Fax 214-343-1038 email mnelson@dmans.com web page http://www.boomerangmusic.com From ???@??? Wed Feb 11 10:11:07 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 10 21:52:03 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y2V5V-0001xs-00; Tue, 10 Feb 1998 21:52:01 -0800 From: Dpcoffin@aol.com Message-ID: <929d52e4.34e13a96@aol.com> Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 00:43:48 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: RE: looping as sin Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 84 Resent-Message-ID: <"f0wkgC.A.ZeB.9uT40"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3142 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 21:52:01 -0800 X-UIDL: 595b3627cf88659bcd9eeffc2c5e0b0c >After all, how many of us have actually sat down >and _composed_ looping pieces, rather than just noodling? But, after that, how many of us have been present when an angelic alien intelligence took command of out bodies while we held the guitar, and blew something astonishing out of our hands that eclipsed anything we ever composed??? dpc From ???@??? Tue Feb 10 18:05:17 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 10 12:24:33 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y2MEB-0001p7-00; Tue, 10 Feb 1998 12:24:23 -0800 Message-Id: <3.0.1.16.19980210215840.277f3152@rank-serv.elec.gla.ac.uk> X-Sender: pycraft@rank-serv.elec.gla.ac.uk X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.1 (16) Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 21:58:40 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: "Michael P. Hughes, Ph.D." Subject: RE: looping as sin In-Reply-To: References: <3.0.1.16.19980209131547.26af379e@rank-serv.elec.gla.ac.uk> <2.2.32.19980207080540.00bb1da8@pop.chromatic.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"U6mZYC.A.iIB.FZL40"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3132 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 12:24:23 -0800 X-UIDL: dcc251ce0d1a6ed7c6d2c70ae550ee18 Doug: >It's fascinating to me that you used the violin as an analogy with which to >knock microtuning, I never knocked microtuning! Did not! Did not! :) >since, unlike many other instruments, you can play a true perfect fifth on a >violin. I was in a band with a gifted violinist who told me that he was always >making his intervals pure, never equally tempered. How did he sound when playing with the rest of the band? <:o >If you haven't already done so, it's worth the effort to hear the >difference between an equally tempered fifth and a pure one, on the same >instrument if possible. (That's the "sensible" rationale for microtuning. >My other one: what's so special about the mathematical ratios used in >Western tunings anyway? There are more than 12 musically interesting >ratios.) Well, Steve Vai played a 13-note-per-scale guitar with "Xavian" tuning..... >I think it's worth pointing out that keyboards and guitar are not the >expressive solo voices that a violin is. On a violin or saxophone, a >single note without any electronic enhancement at all is capable of >expressing great feeling. On unprocessed electric guitar and keyboards, >you play one note and it sort of goes, plonk. Yeah, you can bend and add >vibrato on a guitar, but you still can't really convey the same sense of >effort required to sustain a tone that one hears from wind and string >instruments. Would it be fair to say that what usually gets respect in >guitar and keyboard playing circles is the facility to put long strings of >interesting notes together, more than the ability to evoke a beautiful tone >of any one note? I'm not objecting to electrifying interuments per se - I play an electric guitar after all. In a way this has come about as an observation of my _own_ playing - I notice myself saying "Okay, I played with the neck pickup last time around, so this loop I'd better switch to the bridge, and maybe roll up the tone, or turn on the ADL". This is quite important if one is noodling (which I often do, natch) to prevent a complete mess. But it does bother me - after all many musical ensembles manage to play with identical instruments playing different pieces and it sounds great. I feel that being able to come up with valid musical statements with one voice is difficult - way beyond me, probably - but probably reflects a truer understanding of the instrument. >What constitutes "musical merit," anyway? Yeah, this is subjective. To >me, sure, a beautiful tone and good technique, and yes, notes written on a >piece of paper can be discerned to have musical merit without even hearing >them performed well. So musical merit comes both from the performer and >composer. Tone and technique play a role, but what makes a piece of music compelling? How important is melody, for example? >As a composer, I'm totally inspired by sound. I look at it like this -- is >it easier to compose when staring at a blank piece of manuscript paper or >while playing my instrument? When I create synthesizer patches I would >rather start editing from a randomly generated patch in which I can hear a >hint of something cool than from a raw sine wave. I think it's probably synthesizers that most confuse me on this issue. The violin, or piano, or oboe or whatever is unto itself - most players will have their one instrument and know it inside out. However, with synth players the sounds are only as good as long as the synth is in vogue - how many players (besides Eno) have decided to say "right, I've got a DX7 (or whatever), and I'm going to get everything I can from it." >To return to what you said, there's nothing wrong with attracting attention >through novelty of tone. Whatever floats the composer's boat. The >question is really whether, after the novelty wears off after a few >listenings, the music still says something to you. Exactly my point - sorry if I didn't express it well enough. I mean, everyone's felt what it's like to get on a really inspiring piece of kit, me included. But I've also listened basck to pieces I recorded with new kit (in an "ispired" frame of mind), only to find out I sounded like someone who's got a new toy but doesn't know what to do with it. >At some level _everything_ is noodling ... when I compose I noodle until I >find something that sounds good, makes musical sense, says what I want it >to say, etc. etc. Is "just" noodling trial and error with inadequate >editing? To me "noodling" is a willingness to listen to the right >hemisphere, especially early in the process (the left hemisphere usually >gets plenty of chances to edit later on). Sure; looped noodles can be inspiring (as well as the name of a tasty Chinese meal...?), but I feel that often we loopers are all too willing to do our trial-and-error compositions in public. Michael From ???@??? Wed Feb 11 10:11:09 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 10 22:38:16 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y2VoC-0005FP-00; Tue, 10 Feb 1998 22:38:12 -0800 Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 01:33:13 -0500 (EST) From: CORROSIVE@aol.com Message-ID: <980211013313_1766358055@mrin39.mx> To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: 'real time' backwards guitar... Resent-Message-ID: <"c6NyzB.A.zfE.3ZU40"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3143 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 22:38:12 -0800 X-UIDL: e1bf9d733c7b1033df8a1b8a1187de3d OK- i used to think this was a highly guarded secret, but I'll spill it to you other loopdudes...if you want exceptionally cool, almost 'real time' backwards guitar...find an old boss half rack RPS-10, put the knob on 'inverse' and be Adrian Belew (p.s. dont tell any non loopers) >>>gregor From ???@??? Wed Feb 11 10:11:11 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 10 23:04:29 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y2WDb-00079R-00; Tue, 10 Feb 1998 23:04:27 -0800 Message-ID: <34E14D04.1E48@dmans.com> Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 01:02:28 -0600 From: "Mikell D. Nelson" Reply-To: mnelson@dmans.com Organization: Boomerang Musical Products X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (Win95; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Question about the Boomerang References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"ME0FhC.A.8cG.lzU40"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3144 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 23:04:27 -0800 X-UIDL: 6f50d442fa2dcb2f0009579e7892f861 > Hello fellow loopers, > > A friend of mine just told me that the Boomerang will let you play > backwards live in realtime. I told him I had not heard that, but I knew you > could flip the recorded loop around and play it backwards. My friend said > someone demonstrated a Boomerang to him and he swore the guy was playing a > backwards solo live in realtime. If the 'Rang can do this, I'm surprised > this hasn't been mentioned before, as it is a pretty cool thing. If it has > been mentioned, I must have missed it. You guys at Boomerang should add > this to your ads and marketing, there might be a few crazy backwards > loopers out there who would get into this. Also is there any progress on a > software update for the Boomerang for better sampling rate? Thanks! > Ed Hi Ed, It's true. It's true. The Rang talks drawkcab. Start in idle mode and turn off the through signal with the THRU MUTE switch. Press REVERSE. Then press RECORD twice, choosing a loop length - about a measure is suggested. The Rang responds by turning on the REVERSE, PLAY, and RECORD LED's. It then records a measure of sound and plays it backwards while recording more; this process continues indefinitely. You are playing a measure ahead of what the audience hears, but they hear only reverse lead. Ah, software version 2. It's coming, but slowly. You won't catch me quoting any dates, but hopefully it won't be too long. We do anticipate increasing the sample rate by about 20-30 percent. We will send up flares when it's ready, rest assured. Mike Nelson Boomerang Musical Products PO Box 541595 Dallas, TX 75354-1595 Tel 800-530-4699 (outside USA, 214-340-6913) Fax 214-343-1038 email mnelson@dmans.com web page http://www.boomerangmusic.com From ???@??? Wed Feb 11 10:11:13 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 10 23:20:32 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y2WT8-0000iJ-00; Tue, 10 Feb 1998 23:20:30 -0800 Message-ID: <34E150B4.509C@dmans.com> Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 01:18:12 -0600 From: "Mikell D. Nelson" Reply-To: mnelson@dmans.com Organization: Boomerang Musical Products X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (Win95; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Question about the Boomerang References: <199802091933.MAA02229@hyper.dimensional.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"SWNvr.A.mY.bCV40"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3145 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 23:20:30 -0800 X-UIDL: 0be347fed5bd203caccf82992d314b2a > > BTW, the 'Rang sorta does real-time backwards: the backwards notes are, in > essence, delayed by the length of the loop. It's still a hell of a cool > trick. > > Scott Bullerwell There is no real-time backwards device. It's a conceptual impossiblity. You can't play a passage in reverse until you get to the end. Even if the passage is very short, you have to wait that amount of time. And another thing! %^) If you attempt to use the Boomerang Phrase Sampler and do two lightning speed presses of the RECORD button in the reverse playback mode, in an attempt to approximate real-time, you will be disappointed. Here's what happens. Your two second lick (for example) will be divided into 20 tenth of a second snippets, each of which is individually reversed and played back. This sounds very choppy, not at all like the typical reverse leads created by Jimi Hendrix, George Harrison, or Adrian Belew. The reverse parts of songs we love were recorded in their entirety and then reversed, most likely by flipping the tape over on an analog machine. These days there are much easier ways to do this. Motley From ???@??? Wed Feb 11 10:11:14 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 10 23:45:48 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y2WrX-0002cb-00; Tue, 10 Feb 1998 23:45:43 -0800 X-Sender: doug@mail.lightlink.com Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <199802102133.NAA08405@waynesworld.ucsd.edu> References: <3.0.1.16.19980210215840.277f3152@rank-serv.elec.gla.ac.uk> from "Michael P. Hughes, Ph.D." at Feb 10, 98 09:58:40 pm Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 02:37:22 -0500 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Doug Wyatt Subject: Re: looping as sin Resent-Message-ID: <"isp3SC.A.H7B.ZYV40"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3146 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 23:45:43 -0800 X-UIDL: 8bc43d3e027d2f0342c7545eda579654 At 13:33 -0800 2/10/98, Paolo Valladolid wrote: > > have their one instrument and know it inside out. However, with synth > > players the sounds are only as good as long as the synth is in vogue - how > > many players (besides Eno) have decided to say "right, I've got a DX7 (or > > whatever), and I'm going to get everything I can from it." > > Pat Metheny has been using the same GR300 synth for about 15-17 years. more on this in my reply to Michael > Interesting that someone said that synths just go "plonk". What interests > me about synths are those sounds that can be sustained indefinitely while > having their timbre altered in various ways. I said that unprocessed guitars and keyboards (I should have said pianos) go "plonk". Sustained sounds that _don't_ change their timbre are the worst. (Does one have to hate one's instrument before being able to transcend it? :) ) But yes, finding ways to modulate sustained sounds is very cool. Doug --- Doug Wyatt Sonosphere - music and music software doug@sonosphere.com http://www.sonosphere.com/ From ???@??? Wed Feb 11 10:11:14 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 10 23:45:58 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y2Wrh-0002dq-00; Tue, 10 Feb 1998 23:45:53 -0800 X-Sender: doug@mail.lightlink.com Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <3.0.1.16.19980210215840.277f3152@rank-serv.elec.gla.ac.uk> References: <3.0.1.16.19980209131547.26af379e@rank-serv.elec.gla.ac.uk> <2.2.32.19980207080540.00bb1da8@pop.chromatic.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 02:46:35 -0500 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Doug Wyatt Subject: RE: blooping as fun Resent-Message-ID: <"8dwW_C.A.c7B.bYV40"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3147 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 23:45:53 -0800 X-UIDL: 14f44268533e6deac7e200df1912fd79 At 21:58 -0500 2/10/98, Michael P. Hughes, Ph.D. wrote: > Doug: > >It's fascinating to me that you used the violin as an analogy with which to > >knock microtuning, > > I never knocked microtuning! Did not! Did not! :) Well, I remember the comment as quoting my statement about using other tunings as new constraints and inspiration, then expressing amazement that people weren't satisfied with the tonalities they already had. :) > >since, unlike many other instruments, you can play a true perfect fifth on > a >violin. I was in a band with a gifted violinist who told me that he was > always >making his intervals pure, never equally tempered. > > How did he sound when playing with the rest of the band? <:o I probably overamplified what he said. When playing backing parts he would probably adapt his tuning to the keyboards. But I'm sure that when he's playing in situations where he's way out in front, as he often is, he's hearing his intervals as pure. (I'm sure this is also true of vocalists singing a cappella except in the most chromatic contexts.) But of course there's the joke about how to know when the violin player is out of tune (he's moving his bow) and there's some truth to that too ... but this is the real world; excessively perfect intonation on a vocal part reduces our perception of the sound as being human. Imperfection is cool. > >I think it's worth pointing out that keyboards and guitar are not the > >expressive solo voices that a violin is. On a violin or saxophone, a > >single note without any electronic enhancement at all is capable of > >expressing great feeling. On unprocessed electric guitar and keyboards, > >you play one note and it sort of goes, plonk. Yeah, you can bend and add > >vibrato on a guitar, but you still can't really convey the same sense of > >effort required to sustain a tone that one hears from wind and string > >instruments. Would it be fair to say that what usually gets respect in > >guitar and keyboard playing circles is the facility to put long strings of > >interesting notes together, more than the ability to evoke a beautiful tone > >of any one note? (To respond to someone else's comment, I didn't write this paragraph to knock keyboards and guitar ... merely to point out my dissatisfaction with the traditional uses of these instruments, and point out where the road leads when we play these instruments with an anti-technological bias. Been there.) > I'm not objecting to electrifying interuments per se - I play an electric > guitar after all. In a way this has come about as an observation of my > _own_ playing - I notice myself saying "Okay, I played with the neck pickup > last time around, so this loop I'd better switch to the bridge, and maybe > roll up the tone, or turn on the ADL". This is quite important if one is > noodling (which I often do, natch) to prevent a complete mess. But it does > bother me - after all many musical ensembles manage to play with identical > instruments playing different pieces and it sounds great. I feel that > being able to come up with valid musical statements with one voice is > difficult - way beyond me, probably - but probably reflects a truer > understanding of the instrument. I play MIDI keyboards so my views are probably going to seem more exaggerated, but, durn it, my entire keyboard technique can be expressed with a very narrow little bit of bandwidth. There are 61 notes on my keyboard and I can strike them with 127 velocities (actually a lot fewer than that because my DX7II is an old and lame controller that doesn't even generate all 127 values). To make expressive music with this gear I found it essential to discover further means of controlling sound in realtime. So I dabble with ways to control the synthesis parameters on the fly and with processing the audio after it exits the synths. I learn to use the pitch wheel and various other forms of control in ways that I like. I think a less extreme form of what I'm saying here applies to guitar. Guitar technique requires a fair bit more bandwidth to describe than keyboard, but maybe still not as much as, say, trumpet, and nowhere nearly as much as voice (I dare say). > >What constitutes "musical merit," anyway? Yeah, this is subjective. To > >me, sure, a beautiful tone and good technique, and yes, notes written on a > >piece of paper can be discerned to have musical merit without even hearing > >them performed well. So musical merit comes both from the performer and > >composer. > > Tone and technique play a role, but what makes a piece of music compelling? > How important is melody, for example? Depends on who's listening and what mood they're in. And it depends on how creative you are with the definition of a melody. If you play a series of chords on guitar or piano, the leading voice can be perceived as a melody. Even a sample of unmusical noise can be perceived as having a melody, especially if it's repeated along with something else that has pitches. > I think it's probably synthesizers that most confuse me on this issue. The > violin, or piano, or oboe or whatever is unto itself - most players will > have their one instrument and know it inside out. However, with synth > players the sounds are only as good as long as the synth is in vogue - how > many players (besides Eno) have decided to say "right, I've got a DX7 (or > whatever), and I'm going to get everything I can from it." And Paolo noted: "Pat Metheny has been using the same GR300 synth for about 15-17 years." Yeah. He's got a completely distinctive sound on that thing. I think every synth sound is different when it comes to learning how to solo with it. There are a lot of sounds I can do things with, but there are only a handful that I really feel completely open with -- and some of them come from my DX7, which was my main axe 1984-1995 :) I'm trying to create a new set of sounds but it takes awhile and so sometimes I play that DX7 sound. There's also something there about letting the sound suggest the technique with which it's to be played rather than using the same technique for every sound. Perhaps what's most precious amongst synthesists is the ability to adapt one's keyboard (&/or other controller) technique in order to play the sound expressively. To me it's really friggin' hard and that's why I have bread-and-butter sounds. > >To return to what you said, there's nothing wrong with attracting attention > >through novelty of tone. Whatever floats the composer's boat. The > >question is really whether, after the novelty wears off after a few > >listenings, the music still says something to you. > > Exactly my point - sorry if I didn't express it well enough. (no need to apologize, I just saw a big avenue to explore some of my favorite topics :) ) > I mean, > everyone's felt what it's like to get on a really inspiring piece of kit, > me included. But I've also listened basck to pieces I recorded with new > kit (in an "ispired" frame of mind), only to find out I sounded like > someone who's got a new toy but doesn't know what to do with it. Well, shit happens :) I'd go as far as to say that the main focus of my musical approach right now is to try to find ways to get to that point of being inspired by sound, capture improvisations on tape or in a sequencer, and then compose with those bits. At least 95% of what I record is crap. But I find that the other 5% is what keeps me going. > Sure; looped noodles can be inspiring (as well as the name of a tasty > Chinese meal...?), but I feel that often we loopers are all too willing to > do our trial-and-error compositions in public. I suspect this is a danger of improvised music in general, not just looping. (This weekend I recorded 180 minutes of group improvisations with some friends and got perhaps 2 or 3 pieces, 6 to 10 minutes in length, that might stand up to repeated listening.) I haven't seen enough trial-and-error looping in public to be able to agree with you're saying, but I can imagine that the danger of an excessively static improvisation could be increased by using loops. Still, the rules of group improvisation I like to play by include "improvise a form as you improvise each part; don't be afraid to start something completely different." (The other main one being "don't be afraid to repeat yourself so that others can develop parts to support yours." Heh.) Doug --- Doug Wyatt Sonosphere - music and music software doug@sonosphere.com http://www.sonosphere.com/ From ???@??? Wed Feb 11 10:11:18 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 11 00:44:59 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y2Xmp-0006Ey-00; Wed, 11 Feb 1998 00:44:55 -0800 Sender: camao@camsg001.camb.scee.sony.co.uk Message-ID: <34E16444.BFF479B1@scee.sony.co.uk> Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 08:41:40 +0000 From: Os X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (X11; I; IRIX 6.2 IP22) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: OBERHEIM? Yes, dear? References: <98Feb10.101801cst.26881@gateway.gibson.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"yAERjC.A.fkF.oRW40"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3148 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 00:44:55 -0800 X-UIDL: 9ed961f6961127ef6645252dc4e356ac Tom Spaulding wrote: > Echoplexes are back ordered because they are in high demand. We keep making them, people keep buying them. Fortunately, we are experiencing only a 15-30 day gap between orders and shipments these days, as opposed to the previous six months or so. (Thank Yew, thank yew vary mush). > > p.s. Hey Kim...How soon until this is a FAQ??!! Here's another one for the FAQ - when will the Echoplex be on sale in the UK? cheers, -- Os os@millennium.co.uk http://webworlds.net/os/ From ???@??? Wed Feb 11 10:11:19 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 11 01:21:40 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y2YMM-0000Z7-00; Wed, 11 Feb 1998 01:21:38 -0800 Message-ID: <000e01bd36ce$1e5fce40$70da6f83@pt205.wolfson.cam.ac.uk> From: "Peter Thompson" To: Subject: Re: Question about the Boomerang Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 09:19:12 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Resent-Message-ID: <"8ctmWB.A.sS.S0W40"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3150 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 01:21:38 -0800 X-UIDL: 687a3737a2b925f06886dbf7cc394f6e As I remember Adrian Belew used the 'reverse' setting on his Roland reverb unit to produce those backwards sounds such as heard on Heartbeat. I have an old Nanoverb which has a similar function which essentially plays the reverb backwards (not the original note). On the 'effects only' setting the effect is that of a series of backwards notes. Yours ever Pete __________________________________________ -----Original Message----- From: Mikell D. Nelson To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Date: 11 February 1998 07:18 Subject: Re: Question about the Boomerang >> >> BTW, the 'Rang sorta does real-time backwards: the backwards notes are, in >> essence, delayed by the length of the loop. It's still a hell of a cool >> trick. >> >> Scott Bullerwell > > There is no real-time backwards device. It's a conceptual >impossiblity. You can't play a passage in reverse until you get to the >end. Even if the passage is very short, you have to wait that amount of >time. And another thing! %^) If you attempt to use the Boomerang Phrase >Sampler and do two lightning speed presses of the RECORD button in the >reverse playback mode, in an attempt to approximate real-time, you will >be disappointed. Here's what happens. Your two second lick (for example) >will be divided into 20 tenth of a second snippets, each of which is >individually reversed and played back. This sounds very choppy, not at >all like the typical reverse leads created by Jimi Hendrix, George >Harrison, or Adrian Belew. > The reverse parts of songs we love were recorded in their entirety and >then reversed, most likely by flipping the tape over on an analog >machine. These days there are much easier ways to do this. > >Motley > > From ???@??? Wed Feb 11 10:11:18 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 11 00:53:24 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y2Xuz-0006wM-00; Wed, 11 Feb 1998 00:53:21 -0800 Message-ID: <34E17426.E08@infobiogen.fr> Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 09:49:28 +0000 From: Malhomme Olivier Reply-To: malhomme@infobiogen.fr Organization: I P L X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 [fr] (Macintosh; I; PPC) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: noises, vibrators and odd tunings References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"aFyDDC.A.RSG.3ZW40"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3149 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 00:53:21 -0800 X-UIDL: 8f1eee5a32bdf76a7e1a32cac3c4cacf In answer to Corynne's post (at least) I also use different noises to create harmonies, including sustained harmonics through Frenandes's sustainer. Due to a VG 8 I can even build chords or passing notes/chords with very different timbres in it. I'm just at the beginning of "arranging" chords and lines with very different and/or weird sounds. In answer to many post, which lead me to microtuning. I don't possesss any whatever/octave axe, but I'm considering using the VG-8 to do that. Some will say it won't change the scale of the neck, but I can tune a string, -say- to a quarter tone below the one before (or a 8th tone) and go on an one. Of course it is going to dramatically reduce the extent (?) of the octaves covered by the instrument, but It should offer some interesting results. Did anyone already tried this? Olivier Malhomme From ???@??? Wed Feb 11 10:12:01 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 11 07:29:18 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y2e69-00049d-00; Wed, 11 Feb 1998 07:29:17 -0800 Message-ID: <34E17E3B.6FBE@nyfac.com> Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 10:32:27 +0000 From: tbajus Reply-To: nyfac2@nyfac.com X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (WinNT; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: screaming guitar References: <1.5.4.32.19980211032550.0067f4f4@tiac.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"kNZV6B.A.llD.qMc40"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3157 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 07:29:17 -0800 X-UIDL: f40b4a753ff0d3f14cc2f105898e189a > > Whoohooo!!! I have a variable-speed vibrater, but I've never used it on > >my guitar. I wonder if it'll make my guitar scream as much as it makes... > >lol! > > > >smiles, > > > >Corynne My ex never let me use hers, so I had to buy my own. It was traumatic- I still get redfaced when I have to buy condoms... Still, lots of women seem to prick up their ears when they saw me bust that badboy out. Little demonstration of, uh, manual dexterity :) Trevor Bajus From ???@??? Wed Feb 11 10:11:31 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 11 02:51:56 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y2Zli-0004Xp-00; Wed, 11 Feb 1998 02:51:54 -0800 Message-ID: <029401bd36db$1f04fc00$c2b854ce@mark.asisoftware.com> From: Mark@asisoftware.com (Mark Kata) To: "Loopers Delight" Subject: Fw: RE: looping as sin Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 05:52:17 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Resent-Message-ID: <"1dpwN.A.c_D.tIY40"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3151 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 02:51:54 -0800 X-UIDL: 7bf5d5ab11cc792615f9133817b66235 It's happened to me quite a few times. Mark Kata Mark@asisoftware.com -----Original Message----- > > >>After all, how many of us have actually sat down >>and _composed_ looping pieces, rather than just noodling? > >But, after that, how many of us have been present when an angelic alien >intelligence took command of out bodies while we held the guitar, and blew >something astonishing out of our hands that eclipsed anything we ever >composed??? >dpc > From ???@??? Wed Feb 11 10:11:33 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 11 02:54:08 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y2Znr-0004no-00; Wed, 11 Feb 1998 02:54:07 -0800 Message-ID: <029d01bd36db$54f015c0$c2b854ce@mark.asisoftware.com> From: Mark@asisoftware.com (Mark Kata) To: Subject: Re: 'real time' backwards guitar... Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 05:53:48 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Resent-Message-ID: <"dTS65.A.sIE.IKY40"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3152 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 02:54:07 -0800 X-UIDL: 4f45bacb0feee6ab7b9a6d0e60869184 There's also a setting for a pitch-shifted backwards guitar. Mark Kata Mark@asisoftware.com >OK- i used to think this was a highly guarded secret, but I'll spill it to >you other loopdudes...if you want exceptionally cool, almost 'real time' >backwards guitar...find an old boss half rack RPS-10, put the knob on >'inverse' and be Adrian Belew (p.s. dont tell any non loopers) >>>gregor > From ???@??? Wed Feb 11 10:11:38 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 11 05:52:34 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y2caT-0004VA-00; Wed, 11 Feb 1998 05:52:29 -0800 Message-Id: <98Feb11.084631est.18826@thicket.arbortext.com> Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 08:43:30 -0500 From: David White Reply-To: dwhite@arbortext.com Organization: Arbortext Inc. X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (WinNT; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: screaming guitar References: <1.5.4.32.19980211032550.0067f4f4@tiac.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"TI0UDC.A.f5D.1xa40"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3153 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 05:52:29 -0800 X-UIDL: 63de6c3b75a087da4041a4f51fd10a37 A multispeed electric screwdriver works pretty well, doesn't offend the more gentle minded in the crowd and is handy for those last minute rack additions. Dave Reginald Hunt wrote: > Uhhhh....never mind. > > At 04:33 AM 2/10/98 -0500, you wrote: > > I sometimes like to get the guitar feeding back at different pitches and > >use them in loops.It can be interesting if the frequencies create diatonic > >harmonies... > > > > Whoohooo!!! I have a variable-speed vibrater, but I've never used it on > >my guitar. I wonder if it'll make my guitar scream as much as it makes... > >lol! > > > >smiles, > > > >Corynne > > > > > > > >On Fri, 6 Feb 1998, T.W. Hartnett wrote: > > > >> >I used to put the strings of the guitar against my neck and talk, such that > >> >my throat vibrated the strings. It was either that string vibration or the > >> >actual sound of my voice getting picked up by microphonic pickups that > >> >resulted in sound, not sure, but it worked alright. Hmm, don't think I've > >> >tried that since I was about 14, maybe I should give it another go. > >> > >> The electric shaver or vibrator near the pickups is also a neat sound. > >> Vibrators with a variable speed control are good to tune the resultant > >> squall. > >> > >> Travis Hartnett > >> > >> > > > > > > > > From ???@??? Wed Feb 11 10:11:50 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 11 06:50:37 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y2dUe-0000e1-00; Wed, 11 Feb 1998 06:50:32 -0800 Message-Id: <98Feb11.084446cst.26888@gateway.gibson.com> X-Sender: tspauldi@mail.nash.gibson.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 08:47:08 -0600 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Tom Spaulding Subject: Re: OBERHEIM? Yes, dear? In-Reply-To: <1.5.4.32.19980211033524.0067a354@tiac.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"gB0d2D.A.UUH.Vmb40"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3154 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 06:50:32 -0800 X-UIDL: 9ae17997de0a8a873ba1145eb52d402b Reg- Consider me the horse's mouth, among other equine orifices (orifici?) Some dealers have them on order already. Some dealers don't order until they get a consumer request. Some dealers have credit problems. Some dealers keep a good number "in the pipeline" and are usually near the top of the list... Every time I say two weeks, I get calls on the 15th day. Therefore, I refer the right honorable gentlemen to the reply I gave some postings ago. ;) Tom At 09:35 PM 2/10/98 -0600, you wrote: >Actually, last week Thoroughbred said the wait was two weeks. Week before >that it was one week. > >Manny's estimates a month. > >Reg > > > >At 10:20 AM 2/10/98 -0600, you wrote: >>Ric- >>Actually, you've missed quite a bit. And yes, I am always listening. Just >ask anyone on this list! >> >>If a human actually got a Thoroughbred Music catalog (813-889-3874), or a >Musician's Friend catalog (541-772-5173)or called Bananas at Large >(415-457-7600), they could order an Echoplex. I am only suggesting these >dealers because of their easy accessibility, not meaning to exclude the >other fine Oberheim dealers in the USA. >> >>Echoplexes are back ordered because they are in high demand. We keep making >them, people keep buying them. Fortunately, we are experiencing only a 15-30 >day gap between orders and shipments these days, as opposed to the previous >six months or so. (Thank Yew, thank yew vary mush). >> >>I suggest if you want one any time soon, get on a waiting list at one of >these dealers and take your turn in line. Unless, of course, you can find a >dealer who has them in stock, at which time your desire for immediate >gratification could conceivably be sated. >> >>Unfortunately, popularity can be so inconvenient at times. ;) >> >>Tom "Can't please hardly any of 'em, seemingly" Spaulding >>Oberheim Product Manager >> >>p.s. Hey Kim...How soon until this is a FAQ??!! >> >> >>>perhaps i missed it.... but, is the EDP something a human can actually >>>purchase or only read about???!!??? where can one buy (NOT ORDER/BACK ORDER) >>>one? >>> >>> oberheim are you listening? >>> >>>ric >>>513 861 1687 >>> >>> >>> >> >> > > > > From ???@??? Wed Feb 11 10:11:51 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 11 06:52:37 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y2dWc-0000va-00; Wed, 11 Feb 1998 06:52:34 -0800 Message-Id: <98Feb11.084624cst.26888@gateway.gibson.com> X-Sender: tspauldi@mail.nash.gibson.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 08:48:48 -0600 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Tom Spaulding Subject: Re: OBERHEIM? Yes, dear? In-Reply-To: <34E16444.BFF479B1@scee.sony.co.uk> References: <98Feb10.101801cst.26881@gateway.gibson.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"KWybGC.A.1O.Aob40"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3155 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 06:52:34 -0800 X-UIDL: bac581dfa1068b1849f05cb7a9e486d5 Os- Soon, oh soon the light...CE testing is under way in beautiful Italy. Tom At 02:41 AM 2/11/98 -0600, you wrote: >Tom Spaulding wrote: > >> Echoplexes are back ordered because they are in high demand. We keep making them, people keep buying them. Fortunately, we are experiencing only a 15-30 day gap between orders and shipments these days, as opposed to the previous six months or so. (Thank Yew, thank yew vary mush). > >> > >> p.s. Hey Kim...How soon until this is a FAQ??!! > >Here's another one for the FAQ - when will the Echoplex be on sale in >the UK? > > > >cheers, >-- >Os >os@millennium.co.uk >http://webworlds.net/os/ > > > From ???@??? Wed Feb 11 10:11:57 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 11 07:20:20 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y2dxR-0003Fk-00; Wed, 11 Feb 1998 07:20:17 -0800 Reply-To: "Stefano Voulaz" From: "Stefano Voulaz" To: Subject: R: OBERHEIM? Yes, dear? Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 16:18:29 +0100 Message-ID: <01bd3700$4ed23a90$6902a8c0@voulaz> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Resent-Message-ID: <"6eWH0C.A.9oC.fDc40"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3156 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 07:20:17 -0800 X-UIDL: 572ca9fcd5aba040a737bd0dd7813949 Where? WHERE? I'm going to steal one... Stefano - The Looping Uncle 8^)# -----Messaggio originale----- Da: Tom Spaulding A: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Data: mercoledl 11 febbraio 1998 15.53 Oggetto: Re: OBERHEIM? Yes, dear? >Os- > >Soon, oh soon the light...CE testing is under way in beautiful Italy. > >Tom From ???@??? Wed Feb 11 10:12:09 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 11 08:47:05 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y2fJL-0003iN-00; Wed, 11 Feb 1998 08:46:59 -0800 Message-Id: <199802111646.JAA01003@hyper.dimensional.com> From: "Scott Bullerwell" To: Subject: Re: screaming guitar Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 09:39:57 -0700 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"qeZH3C.A.N9C.MUd40"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3159 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 08:46:59 -0800 X-UIDL: 58c348726214ea247f0430bf152eb5a2 David White writes: > A multispeed electric screwdriver works pretty well, doesn't offend the more gentle > minded in the crowd and is handy for those last minute rack additions. Yeah, but any number of people will stroll off with your electric screwdriver. I've yet to hear of anyone stealing someone else's vibrator. Scott From ???@??? Wed Feb 11 10:12:11 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 11 08:56:32 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y2fSV-0004xa-00; Wed, 11 Feb 1998 08:56:27 -0800 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <34E1DC40.980@infobiogen.fr> References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: klaw@iglou.com Subject: Re: Reverse thingys Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 11:51:36 -0500 Resent-Message-ID: <"xZa0MD.A.ODE.dcd40"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3160 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 08:56:27 -0800 X-UIDL: 6a7a40c45624fa91a42deaeb55906432 Lest we forget the formidable reverse shift on the ol Eventide H3000. The ultimate pych-guitar" realtime" effect algorythm. 2 independent delays with pitch shift feedback & a hold function . It too breaks the input up into little chunks & reverses them with just a slight processing delay. Henry Kaiser has made extensive use (overuse?) of this awesomesound. Personal fave is My Bloody Val designed by Guy Fixen ( MBV , Moonshake producer plays in Laika) . I showed this to a friend one night when we were in a hurry to go catch a band & He didnt let go of that seat or guitar for 20 minutes.Spinning spiraling whisps & little tornadoes of sound .. Buy one for this alone( yeah right!) I hear TCs new box has got a similar thing like to hear it . bye K Law >A little correction: Belew also uses an old RPS-10 from boss to play >"reverse leads" and it works with the same way the bommerang does (it >was just waaaayyy older). A lot of reverse on KC circa 80-83 are done >with a RPS-10; You can duplicate exactly the effect. I know, I have one. > >"This sounds very choppy, not at all like the typical reverse leads >created by Jimi Hendrix, George Harrison, or Adrian Belew." > >Like the F-man says "music plays the human instrument. I'm quite >convinced of that. Sometimes Music just flows in you and you "do" things >you wouldn't have dome otherwise. We sometimes call it inspiration. We >know it is both highly desirable and unpredictable. I just believe it to >be music speaking from time to time to me. Rest of the time, I prepare >myself, works on chops and skills, not to be too limited when Music >speaks. I try to learn to interfere as low as possible. Try to keep my >ego from blocking the music (I was never too happy with the ability to >play at lightning speed a major scale, as far as "music" is concerned, I >had to find something else...) > >"But, after that, how many of us have been present when an angelic alien >intelligence took command of out bodies while we held the guitar, and >blew >something astonishing out of our hands that eclipsed anything we ever >composed??? >dpc" > > >Olivier Malhomme From ???@??? Wed Feb 11 10:12:12 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 11 09:07:28 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y2fd8-0006Jn-00; Wed, 11 Feb 1998 09:07:26 -0800 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: klaw@iglou.com Subject: Re: cc's for nextloop Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 12:03:15 -0500 Resent-Message-ID: <"WAHKt.A.YaF.Znd40"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3161 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 09:07:26 -0800 X-UIDL: 2af0813c1de43e32e76c4fe3e7686fff Hey Kim thanks for the tutorial; it made perfect sense for once. Regarding the posts earlier about live dnb It is very possible to do snare flutters & rolls in a improvised context. I use a cc tied to the tempo function in the infamous Cyclone( another fine Oberheim product) . Using a foot pedal I can vary the speed of a non transposing repeating note , I have to watch when I switch this function on & off mind you or it will rapidly repeat ever note ..maybe ok for Alec Empire but ....(You have to keep a watchful eye on the Cyclone too it can & will reset itself in a most unpredictable fashion as witnessed at a recent gig) In my sampler I assign a cc to alter the vol of the note or pitch or whatever .The resultant fading in of the note really sounds cool & it works in the groove quite well. While programming this data is recorded into a sequence as well I can then go back & edit & copy etc how iI like .Even though I own Cubase(but no ideal Mac situation) I actually use a Yamaha Qy 700 for my sequences & Ive tried to come up with ways to make the tedious aspect of progamming this unit fun, I was talking to some junglists on IRC one night and they thought I was crazy, Of course these guys had never heard of Recycle & did all their breaks by hand (such purists) working only on Atari & running Cakewalk > Hey whatever works! It was good to see this thread going cause I know alot of people out there really dig drum N bass. K LAW >this is sort of old, but I'm sort of behind.... > >At 2:00 PM -0500 1/25/98, klaw@iglou.com wrote: >>Hello everyone . Top o the day to ya. Regarding switching loops with ccs : >>How is this done? I thought the ccs were feedback, vol. I switch with note >>ons did I miss something? > >Using continuous controllers to trigger echoplex loops is much like using >notes. basically, the controller number is equivalent to note# and >controller value is equivalent to velocity. You send the appropriate cc >with some non-zero value, and it's treated as note on, and then send the >same cc with value 0 and it's the note-off. > > >>Also perhaps a question for KIm : Is it possible with current hardware on >>plex to reset loops to startpoint when using nxtloop? This has always >>seemed so logical& musical.If I have a number of loops in a piece I need >>them to start at the beginning when I switch rather than run continously. >>I supose it would have its uses in a random sort of way but its not very >>predictable. Maybe have a option to reset or run like in mute mode.BTW >>thanks Kim for your ideas on the quantize function. I finally found a use >>for this!Works excellent in V5.0. > >That's a pretty good idea for a parameter, actually. (more parameters, >yeeee...) Let me explain some about how it does work, and maybe you'll >find a way that works for you anyway. > >The default state of NextLoop isn't really random. You return to the loop >at the point where you left it. > >When you are working in free, unquantized approach, this is often >appropriate. In a rhythmic sense (and this is appropriate to droney and >groovy loops), you will often leave a loop at it's end instead of random >spots in the middle. So when you return to it, it will be at it's >beginning. What the "beginning" or "end" is can be a matter of perception, >and may not coincide with the spot in memory that the echoplex thinks is >the beginning. It'll have much more to do with what's in the loop and how >you developed it. > >For example, say you start off a loop with some ambient, textural sounds, >and then gradually add to it and develop it in such a way that some more >percussive sounds begin to define a rhythm. Probably it will have a point >somewhere that feels like the beginning. And probably that will have >nothing to do with where the little startpoint LED is blinking, because >who's going to constrain themselves to that while creating a loop? So when >you used Next you would switch out of a loop when you felt you were at it's >end, and therefore return to it later at what feels like the beginning. > >That's the free approach. There's also the SwitchQuantizing mode, where the >loops automatically switch at the end and start at the beginning. To me >this is more appropriate where accurate rhythm is important. It does sort >of assume you want the loop to go all the way to it's end. > >When triggering with midi, with the "SamperStyle" parameter set to either >"One" or "Att" the loops start at the beginning when they are triggered. >("One" means the loop is triggered and plays one time through, and can be >retriggered each time the midi note is sent. "Att" means the loop is >triggered at the begining and plays as long as the note is held. When the >noteoff comes, the loop turns off) Sounds like you want another >SamplerStyle parameter of "start", where you trigger the loop with midi, it >starts at it's beginning, and continues looping. (just like MuteMode=Start >parameter.) Seems like a reasonable idea to me. > >hope that helps. > >kim > > > >______________________________________________________________________ >Kim Flint | Looper's Delight >kflint@annihilist.com | http://www.annihilist.com/loop/loop.html >http://www.annihilist.com/ | Loopers-Delight-request@annihilist.com From ???@??? Wed Feb 11 10:12:05 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 11 08:18:55 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y2es8-0000bK-00; Wed, 11 Feb 1998 08:18:52 -0800 Message-ID: <34E1DC40.980@infobiogen.fr> Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 17:13:38 +0000 From: Malhomme Olivier Reply-To: malhomme@infobiogen.fr Organization: I P L X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 [fr] (Macintosh; I; PPC) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Reverse and musicBut, after that, how many of us have been present when an angelic alien intelligence took command of out bodies while we held the guitar, and blew something astonishing out of our hands that eclipsed anything we ever composed??? dpc References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"DNNasB.A.ZG.Q6c40"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3158 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 08:18:52 -0800 X-UIDL: eeaa7066dd5626df404b641c365e9c18 A little correction: Belew also uses an old RPS-10 from boss to play "reverse leads" and it works with the same way the bommerang does (it was just waaaayyy older). A lot of reverse on KC circa 80-83 are done with a RPS-10; You can duplicate exactly the effect. I know, I have one. "This sounds very choppy, not at all like the typical reverse leads created by Jimi Hendrix, George Harrison, or Adrian Belew." Like the F-man says "music plays the human instrument. I'm quite convinced of that. Sometimes Music just flows in you and you "do" things you wouldn't have dome otherwise. We sometimes call it inspiration. We know it is both highly desirable and unpredictable. I just believe it to be music speaking from time to time to me. Rest of the time, I prepare myself, works on chops and skills, not to be too limited when Music speaks. I try to learn to interfere as low as possible. Try to keep my ego from blocking the music (I was never too happy with the ability to play at lightning speed a major scale, as far as "music" is concerned, I had to find something else...) "But, after that, how many of us have been present when an angelic alien intelligence took command of out bodies while we held the guitar, and blew something astonishing out of our hands that eclipsed anything we ever composed??? dpc" Olivier Malhomme From ???@??? Wed Feb 11 11:47:05 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 11 11:08:08 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y2hVs-0003rh-00; Wed, 11 Feb 1998 11:08:04 -0800 Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 14:02:01 -0500 (EST) From: Adam Levin To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: screaming guitar In-Reply-To: <199802111646.JAA01003@hyper.dimensional.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Resent-Message-ID: <"2AyEX.A.LAD.tXf40"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3162 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 11:08:04 -0800 X-UIDL: 358619c31b40f84710e8b14586159a9a On Wed, 11 Feb 1998, Scott Bullerwell wrote: > Yeah, but any number of people will stroll off with your electric > screwdriver. I've yet to hear of anyone stealing someone else's vibrator. Would *you* go around telling people that your vibrator was stolen? 8) -Adam --- "...if one strives at hearing for the sake of constant virtue, out of seeking liberation from cyclic existence, gradually one becomes a Hearer." - Chandrakirti From ???@??? Wed Feb 11 11:47:07 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 11 11:22:30 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y2hjm-0005gh-00; Wed, 11 Feb 1998 11:22:26 -0800 X-Sender: ejmd@pop.erols.com Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <98Feb6.095924cst.26891@gateway.gibson.com> References: <3e33b029.34db2e2b@aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 14:24:36 -0500 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Ed Drake Subject: Oberheim MIDI controller MC3000d Resent-Message-ID: <"cq7SYD.A.AkE.Jkf40"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3163 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 11:22:26 -0800 X-UIDL: b7739847a646ed30a6057b25f9efa092 Recently on LD Tom Spaulding posted this: >Oberheim showed a prototype tabletop MIDI controller, the MC3000d that has: > >2 ins, 2 thrus, 8 outs >128 MIDI channels, >8 Main Zones and 8 Aux zones, 8 sliders and three wheels, >3 system pedals and 5 assignable pedals, >48 tables of program changes, >16 ROM tables, >48 tables of SYS-EX with a learning function and check control. >Cross-matrix MIDI patchbay programmable to each patch, >Zone transportation, Mute, Solo, Filters, Bulk-dump >240x64 pixel LCD display. Tom, is this piece going to be shipping in the near future and what is the projected list price of it? Also, when you say 3 system pedals and 5 assignable pedals, is this as in footpedals? Inquiring minds want to know. Thanks! Ed From ???@??? Wed Feb 11 11:47:07 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 11 11:43:12 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y2i3n-0000RU-00; Wed, 11 Feb 1998 11:43:07 -0800 Message-Id: <98Feb11.133508cst.26886@gateway.gibson.com> X-Sender: tspauldi@mail.nash.gibson.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 13:37:29 -0600 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Tom Spaulding Subject: Re: Oberheim MC3000d (Buy 'em and we'll have World Peace ) In-Reply-To: References: <98Feb6.095924cst.26891@gateway.gibson.com> <3e33b029.34db2e2b@aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"b_y14C.A.KyG.p2f40"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3164 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 11:43:07 -0800 X-UIDL: 98fd69c243a45d3075b3fff58a31b5db >Tom, is this piece going to be shipping in the near future and what is the >projected list price of it? Also, when you say 3 system pedals and 5 >assignable pedals, is this as in footpedals? Inquiring minds want to know. >Thanks! Ed Ed D. and the Inquring Mimes- It was shown as a prototype. I don't know any pricing info yet. There are eight 1/4" jacks for pedals, three of which are system wide and five that can be programmed to control any suitable parameter(s). It sounds cool... How much would you be willing to pay for such a device? That will help us determine the pricing, at least when we negotiate with the manufacturer (Viscount). We have ordered 10 units as a trial run and will have them in a couple of months, probably by Frankfurt... Yes, they are CE approved! Tom "Takin' dem prices to da People" Spaulding (Deep inside Gooberheim HQ, Twangtown USA) >Tom, is this piece going to be shipping in the near future and what is the >projected list price of it? Also, when you say 3 system pedals and 5 >assignable pedals, is this as in footpedals? Inquiring minds want to know. >Thanks! Ed From ???@??? Thu Feb 12 00:28:17 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 11 11:53:47 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y2iE6-0001q4-00; Wed, 11 Feb 1998 11:53:46 -0800 Message-Id: <98Feb11.134735cst.26886@gateway.gibson.com> X-Sender: tspauldi@mail.nash.gibson.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 13:50:01 -0600 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Tom Spaulding Subject: (Yet)Another Request for Input/Output Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/enriched; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"Sj72bC.A.rFB.QCg40"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3165 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 11:53:46 -0800 X-UIDL: 38c22a078a22f3ab092e43f0fc93d8b0 House of Loops- At the risk of getting even less response than when I solicited additions/suggestions to shore up the much-maligned Owner's Manual (which will remain malignant, for now), I need to ask another thing: What are some of the non-obvious applications you are having your Echoplex (or JamMan or whatever) do? I was thinking that it/they make great sketchpads for songwriters, engineers can audition different reverbs on individual tracks and them listen back loop by loop, etc... ...Or you can continue to lurk until you have a tasty Fripp thread or malfunctioning EDP message to gnaw on :) Thanks in advance!!!! Really!!! Tom "Got my tix to see Fripp/Belew/Gunn on the 20th" Spaulding From ???@??? Thu Feb 12 09:33:25 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 12 01:52:11 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y2vJR-0007WH-00; Thu, 12 Feb 1998 01:52:09 -0800 Message-ID: <01BD372C.A4D393E0.andrew@no-spam-bocs.co.uk> From: Andrew To: "'mnelson@dmans.com'" , "Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com" Subject: RE: Question about the Boomerang Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 20:35:50 -0000 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet E-mail/MAPI - 8.0.0.4211 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"wVAzEC.A.BzG.vWs40"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3188 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 01:52:09 -0800 X-UIDL: 002d9c2814a6fd08c0f9b33115a13d76 Mike said : . This sounds very choppy, not at all like the typical reverse leads created by Jimi Hendrix, George Harrison, or Adrian Belew. Anyone familiar with the Hendrix album 'Concerts' ? They play 'Are You Experienced' live, and Jimi plays the backwards solo bit, and it's practically the same ! Probably better due to the massive feedback he's getting - one of the all time HUGE guitar sounds ever achieved I reckon... regards Andrew From ???@??? Thu Feb 12 00:28:22 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 11 12:33:22 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y2iqM-0005jZ-00; Wed, 11 Feb 1998 12:33:18 -0800 X-Sender: ejmd@pop.erols.com Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <98Feb11.133508cst.26886@gateway.gibson.com> References: <98Feb6.095924cst.26891@gateway.gibson.com> <3e33b029.34db2e2b@aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 15:39:05 -0500 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Ed Drake Subject: Re: Oberheim MC3000d (Buy 'em and we'll have World Peace ) Resent-Message-ID: <"0wEnkC.A.4-E.Cpg40"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3166 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 12:33:18 -0800 X-UIDL: 3a509c40dad494ede7d6c856015aec44 Tom said: >It was shown as a prototype. I don't know any pricing info yet. There are >eight 1/4" jacks for pedals, three of which are system wide and five that >can be programmed to control any suitable parameter(s). It sounds cool... > >How much would you be willing to pay for such a device? That will help us >determine the pricing, at least when we negotiate with the manufacturer >(Viscount). We have ordered 10 units as a trial run and will have them in a >couple of months, probably by Frankfurt... Yes, they are CE approved! > >Tom Tom, it sounds like your closest competition is the Peavey PC-1600x, but I don't know how these 2 units compare as far as features, etc. They sound similar. Some of the folks on this list have PC-1600s, maybe they could comment on this. I think the street price for the Peavey is around $300. Being primarily a guitarist, and since the Digitech PMC-10 is getting impossibly hard to find (if anyone knows where one is, let me know), I am attracted to the feature of putting some of the controls on the floor, that is why I asked about the foot pedals. I don't know whether the Peavey can do this or not. I hope this is helpful. Ed From ???@??? Thu Feb 12 00:28:23 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 11 12:56:00 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y2jCH-0000Nm-00; Wed, 11 Feb 1998 12:55:57 -0800 Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 12:52:09 -0800 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <98Feb11.133508cst.26886@gateway.gibson.com> References: <98Feb6.095924cst.26891@gateway.gibson.com> <3e33b029.34db2e2b@aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Chris Chovit Subject: Re: Oberheim MC3000d (Buy 'em and we'll have World Peace ) Resent-Message-ID: <"Y2Ki8C.A.oNH.49g40"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3167 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 12:55:57 -0800 X-UIDL: 33f9632240f45489a0d4a5b18f2b911a Tom Spaulding wrote: >How much would you be willing to pay for such a device? That will help us >determine the pricing, at least when we negotiate with the manufacturer >(Viscount). Too bad the price isn't based on a fixed profit margin, so as to give the customers the best possible value. But if the information will help: I'd be willing to pay $100 for such a device. - chris From ???@??? Thu Feb 12 00:28:25 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 11 13:47:21 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y2jzy-0005m4-00; Wed, 11 Feb 1998 13:47:18 -0800 Message-Id: <98Feb11.154152cst.26886@gateway.gibson.com> X-Sender: tspauldi@mail.nash.gibson.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 15:44:19 -0600 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Tom Spaulding Subject: Re: FOR SALE: World Peace $100 obo In-Reply-To: References: <98Feb11.133508cst.26886@gateway.gibson.com> <98Feb6.095924cst.26891@gateway.gibson.com> <3e33b029.34db2e2b@aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/enriched; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"EROWjC.A.c3E.dth40"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3168 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 13:47:18 -0800 X-UIDL: 8cb6347bb71bd98680cfe15417eafae3 > >Too bad the price isn't based on a fixed profit margin, so as to give the >customers the best possible value. But if the information will help: I'd >be willing to pay $100 for such a device. > >- chris Chris- Thanks for your reply. Hmmm... I guess we won't get a sale from you!! Maybe you just left off a zero...!! Here's how it sorta works: Viscount develops a new product/technology. They then propose a price to us based on their cost of R&D (greedy engineers), manufacturing costs (disgusting factory laborers) and build in a fair profit margin for themselves. We inevitably ask for a lower price and try to get it as cheaply as possible, so we can offer it at a fair profit (pesky wife and mortgage and all them hangers-on, ya know). We then sell it to a dealer, after designing (darn creative types)and printing (awful press owners)and distributing (evil truck drivers)ads/brochures and buying space (nasty ad editors) to put them in, and he sells it to you for a fair profit. (Only because he needs your disposable income, which you really shouldn't even have, because everyone should work as cheaply as possible and at fixed profit margins - just enough to cover costs, so as to give employers the best possible labor value). :) Tom "Just a Sittin' Here Gettin' Filthy Rich" Spaulding From ???@??? Thu Feb 12 00:28:30 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 11 14:14:29 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y2kQE-0000r0-00; Wed, 11 Feb 1998 14:14:26 -0800 From: Paolo Valladolid Message-Id: <199802112203.OAA16587@waynesworld.ucsd.edu> Subject: Re: Oberheim MIDI controller MC3000d To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 14:03:26 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: from "Ed Drake" at Feb 11, 98 02:24:36 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"S2rgWB.A.KX.iHi40"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3169 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 14:14:26 -0800 X-UIDL: bc1fda24dd1c30886a960554f565c5dd What is this thing anyway? A MIDI keyboard controller or something more like the Peavey fader unit for controlling MIDI parameters? Paolo Valladolid --------------------------------------------------------------- |Moderator of Digital Guitar Digest, an Internet mailing list |\ |for Music Technology and Stringed Instruments | \ ---------------------------------------------------------------- | \ finger pvallado@waynesworld.ucsd.edu for more info \ | \ http://waynesworld.ucsd.edu/DigitalGuitar/home.html \| ----------------------------------------------------------------- From ???@??? Thu Feb 12 00:28:30 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 11 14:29:17 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y2keS-0002VK-00; Wed, 11 Feb 1998 14:29:08 -0800 Message-Id: <98Feb11.162329cst.26886@gateway.gibson.com> X-Sender: tspauldi@mail.nash.gibson.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 16:25:58 -0600 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Tom Spaulding Subject: Re: Oberheim MIDI controller MC3000d In-Reply-To: <199802112203.OAA16587@waynesworld.ucsd.edu> References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"8fVelB.A.0vB.UUi40"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3170 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 14:29:08 -0800 X-UIDL: 7f6cc9783668cfe2a7d8dc3ab8f6917b At 04:03 PM 2/11/98 -0600, you wrote: >What is this thing anyway? A MIDI keyboard controller or something more >like the Peavey fader unit for controlling MIDI parameters? >BTW: Oberheim showed a prototype tabletop MIDI controller, the MC3000d that has: 2 ins, 2 thrus, 8 outs 128 MIDI channels, 8 Main Zones and 8 Aux zones, 8 sliders and three wheels, 3 system pedals and 5 assignable pedal jacks, 48 tables of program changes, 16 ROM tables, 48 tables of SYS-EX with a learning function and check control 48 after touch curves that can be programmed with point to point resolution and assignable to single zones Cross-matrix MIDI patchbay programmable for each patch Zone transportation, Mute, Solo, Filters, Bulk-dump 240x64 pixel LCD display. It is the brains of our MC3000 88-note controller without the keys. It will run your rack of gear and allow pedal/slider/wheel controllers of parameters. Currently valued at $100. :) Tom "Croesus" Spaulding From ???@??? Thu Feb 12 00:28:31 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 11 14:33:39 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y2kim-000351-00; Wed, 11 Feb 1998 14:33:36 -0800 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <98Feb11.134735cst.26886@gateway.gibson.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 17:26:54 -0500 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: David Myers Subject: Re: (Yet)Another Request for Input/Output Resent-Message-ID: <"zLXev.A.OKC.aXi40"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3171 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 14:33:36 -0800 X-UIDL: 6d13f6f334b6623d497339eb2d9c0562 Tom--or anybody (is there a looper in the house?): Are F/B/G doing a tour? How about NYC? Despite my recent comments on Fripp's date here in Dec., the mentioned bill would be of maximum interest! David Myers >House of Loops- > >At the risk of getting even less response than when I solicited >additions/suggestions to shore up the much-maligned Owner's Manual (which >will remain malignant, for now), I need to ask another thing: > > What are some of the non-obvious applications you are having your >Echoplex (or JamMan or whatever) do? > >I was thinking that it/they make great sketchpads for songwriters, >engineers can audition different reverbs on individual tracks and them >listen back loop by loop, etc... > >...Or you can continue to lurk until you have a tasty Fripp thread or >malfunctioning EDP message to gnaw on :) > >Thanks in advance!!!! Really!!! > >Tom "Got my tix to see Fripp/Belew/Gunn on the 20th" Spaulding From ???@??? Thu Feb 12 00:28:32 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 11 14:39:45 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y2koe-0003sf-00; Wed, 11 Feb 1998 14:39:40 -0800 From: Marzzz@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 17:34:14 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: FOR SALE: Echoplex SIMMs Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 82 Resent-Message-ID: <"d3lMZC.A.bAD.6di40"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3172 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 14:39:40 -0800 X-UIDL: 8eb90e260b8058d0f338a079de48b9f8 Hi all- I have four 1 Meg SIMMs leftover from upgrading my new Echoplex to its 16 Meg maximum. If anyone has a need for them, I would like to offer them for sale, any remotely reasonable offer accepted. Yes, they are used, for about an hour...... Marshall From ???@??? Thu Feb 12 00:28:33 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 11 14:49:00 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y2kxd-0005AO-00; Wed, 11 Feb 1998 14:48:57 -0800 Message-Id: <98Feb11.164209cst.26886@gateway.gibson.com> X-Sender: tspauldi@mail.nash.gibson.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 16:44:27 -0600 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Tom Spaulding Subject: Re: (Yet)Another Request for Input/Output In-Reply-To: References: <98Feb11.134735cst.26886@gateway.gibson.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"BYSPW.A.CIE._li40"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3173 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 14:48:57 -0800 X-UIDL: 035c1278ab15b7b40ea461f9f36f8499 At 04:26 PM 2/11/98 -0600, you wrote: >Tom--or anybody (is there a looper in the house?): > >Are F/B/G doing a tour? How about NYC? Despite my recent comments on >Fripp's date here in Dec., the mentioned bill would be of maximum interest! > >David Myers David- According to Mr.Gunn, Projekct 2, is on tour. The Nashvile date is during the NEA Extravaganza, our version of SXSW: ts, > >hey there. > >yes, i am the third part of the Projekct 2 group with Adrian and Robert and >will be performing in nashville on the 20th. we have a west coast tour in >march, japan in april, east coast and europe in may. This much I know, I know no more... Tom "How Green is My Portfolio" Spaulding From ???@??? Thu Feb 12 00:28:40 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 11 15:01:23 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y2l9b-0006oq-00; Wed, 11 Feb 1998 15:01:19 -0800 From: Marzzz@aol.com Message-ID: <1761898.34e22b12@aol.com> Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 17:49:49 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Throwing it into reverse Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 82 Resent-Message-ID: <"_GNWfC.A.IIF.fti40"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3174 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 15:01:19 -0800 X-UIDL: 76ee920e1233a77c1b8babbda1e432d2 In a message dated 2/11/98 1:20:02 AM, you wrote: >not at >all like the typical reverse leads created by Jimi Hendrix, George >Harrison, or Adrian Belew. > The reverse parts of songs we love were recorded in their entirety and >then reversed, most likely by flipping the tape over on an analog >machine. These days there are much easier ways to do this. Is it me, or do backward distorted guitar chords sound like an accordian? Reverse neo-ambient polkas, anyone? Marshall From ???@??? Thu Feb 12 00:28:41 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 11 15:01:39 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y2l9r-0006qv-00; Wed, 11 Feb 1998 15:01:35 -0800 Message-ID: <34E22BA6.444AF12E@bellsouth.net> Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 17:52:22 -0500 From: Jeff Duke Reply-To: jmar@bellsouth.net Organization: Tec Bab Labs X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: (Yet)Another Request for Input/Output References: <98Feb11.134735cst.26886@gateway.gibson.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"SMsu8.A.0LF.4ti40"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3175 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 15:01:35 -0800 X-UIDL: 1513f65685cf7672b64a35d39bccc4aa Tom Spaulding wrote: > House of Loops- > > What are some of the non-obvious applications you are having your Echoplex (or JamMan or whatever) do? > > Thanks in advance!!!! Really!!! > > Tom "Got my tix to see Fripp/Belew/Gunn on the 20th" Spaulding Gee Tom I kinda wanted to see the vibrator thread keep on a bit more ... but I digress.A recent use that I have had for my Jamman is as a party favor! I hook a mic up and put it in the middle of the room,jm on echo with a high repeat and 100% wet.It then goes in to the TBL sound system,anyway suddenly every 30secs the whole party starts repeating,pretty intense.If I have music on the stereo also ... Jeff "I wish I had tix and time too!" Duke From ???@??? Thu Feb 12 00:28:43 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 11 15:31:14 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y2lcS-0002KO-00; Wed, 11 Feb 1998 15:31:08 -0800 Message-Id: <98Feb11.172438cst.26891@gateway.gibson.com> X-Sender: tspauldi@mail.nash.gibson.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 17:28:04 -0600 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Tom Spaulding Subject: Re: Throwing it into reverse In-Reply-To: <1761898.34e22b12@aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"bpL83C.A._oB.oOj40"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3176 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 15:31:08 -0800 X-UIDL: 1c2e068fc834e71122888b7f596b7916 >Is it me, or do backward distorted guitar chords sound like an accordian? >Reverse neo-ambient polkas, anyone? > >Marshall > It's you and all them brat-eatin', beer-swillin', Packer-lovin', cow-tippin', cheese-headed squeezebox types in Wisconsin...my homies!! Belew spent some time in Lake Geneva...maybe that's where he got it?! Tom "Polishing My Mercedes" Spaulding From ???@??? Thu Feb 12 00:28:48 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 11 15:53:24 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y2lxp-0004uh-00; Wed, 11 Feb 1998 15:53:13 -0800 Message-ID: <00e001bd3747$340e4cc0$9222dacf@stepheng> Reply-To: "Stephen P. Goodman" From: "Stephen P. Goodman" To: Subject: Re: Throwing it into reverse Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 15:45:55 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Resent-Message-ID: <"UXe3TD.A.TqD.ngj40"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3177 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 15:53:13 -0800 X-UIDL: 9199b433631db42852ec3c180ed00f7d >> The reverse parts of songs we love were recorded in their entirety and >>then reversed, most likely by flipping the tape over on an analog >>machine. These days there are much easier ways to do this. > Yes, but they still just don't sound the same to me. :) There's going to be an example of this on my opening page to EarthLight Studios in the coming weeks, actually, funny it should come up now. :) Marshall asked: >Is it me, or do backward distorted guitar chords sound like an accordian? >Reverse neo-ambient polkas, anyone? I think it's an effect from the waves we're generating with distortion (both natural and via devices), actually. Also the accordian tends to have a softer attack, which would tend to mimic the reversed decay, wouldn't it? What does the rest of yez think? Stephen Goodman * It's... The Loop Of The Week! EarthLight Studios * http://www.earthlight.net/Studios From ???@??? Thu Feb 12 00:28:49 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 11 15:58:36 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y2m2z-0005c9-00; Wed, 11 Feb 1998 15:58:33 -0800 Message-ID: <34E239AB.E05B7F6C@bellsouth.net> Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 18:52:11 -0500 From: Jeff Duke Reply-To: jmar@bellsouth.net Organization: Tec Bab Labs X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com" Subject: Live Internet broadcast Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"Sb_ZHC.A.DNE.vkj40"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3178 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 15:58:33 -0800 X-UIDL: eef1469092d8c6fe3c5590ad8842a375 just thought somebody might be interested ; http://data.classicalinsites.com/events/sakamoto/default.asp Jeff From ???@??? Thu Feb 12 00:29:41 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 11 17:26:25 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y2nPu-00072D-00; Wed, 11 Feb 1998 17:26:18 -0800 Message-Id: <199802120121.UAA11500@shell.monmouth.com> Reply-To: From: "andre" To: Subject: Re: 'real time' backwards guitar... Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 20:20:29 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1162 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"0RnFtD.A.-CG.i6k40"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3179 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 17:26:18 -0800 X-UIDL: d918195dc7cb66b4a37ee5b760954a80 > > OK- i used to think this was a highly guarded secret, but I'll spill it to > you other loopdudes...if you want exceptionally cool, almost 'real time' > backwards guitar...find an old boss half rack RPS-10, put the knob on > 'inverse' and be Adrian Belew (p.s. dont tell any non loopers) >>>gregor aaarargggagggrHHHHHH!!!! Doesn't he PLAY IN A BAND WITH Robert Fripp???? (sounds juvenile, doesn't it now?) TOPICAL ---- yes - the RPS rules - i usually patch it's 100% wet signal into my mixer, where that crazy backwards signal can show up on the direct line at will. works wonders. and nice for that extra delay for a solo - when all your loopers are in use andre' > From ???@??? Thu Feb 12 00:29:41 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 11 17:42:06 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y2nf1-0000yZ-00; Wed, 11 Feb 1998 17:41:55 -0800 Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 20:36:16 -0500 (EST) From: JJavid@aol.com Message-ID: <980211203615_-26987171@mrin54> To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: What does a Echo-plex cost? Resent-Message-ID: <"BXQ85.A.sU.OJl40"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3180 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 17:41:55 -0800 X-UIDL: dd02ebc33c884768e8e5e41cf922426c Another simple post. What is the going rate for an Echo-plex and for the footcontroller? David From ???@??? Thu Feb 12 00:29:53 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 11 21:06:17 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y2qqm-0002xb-00; Wed, 11 Feb 1998 21:06:16 -0800 Message-ID: <34E282FA.106D@bgnet.bgsu.edu> Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 00:04:58 -0500 From: Jeff Schwartz X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.02 (Macintosh; I; 68K) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: jmar@bellsouth.net CC: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Looper party game #2 References: <98Feb11.134735cst.26886@gateway.gibson.com> <34E22BA6.444AF12E@bellsouth.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"QEMos.A.6fC.kKo40"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3181 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 21:06:16 -0800 X-UIDL: 6a85923ef829c0e25b1da5ec473fa1e8 I make my JamPerson available to guests to record and play backwards phrases of their choice. I call it "pretend you're in a devil-worshiping metal band." Always a big hit. As previously discussed, many of our other favorite gadgets can also do this. Oh yeah, I noticed in the new Guitar World a letter from Eventide asserting their trademark on the word "harmonizer." Where do I go to register the words "distortion," "reverb," "delay," "sampler," etc.? Also, I noticed a few Ann Arbor loopers during the recent location thread. I'm down in Bowling Green Ohio and would love to play at a A2 Loopfest. How about it? -- Jeff Schwartz jeffs@bgnet.bgsu.edu http://www.bgsu.edu/~jeffs/main.html From ???@??? Thu Feb 12 00:29:58 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 11 22:02:14 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y2rit-0007G5-00; Wed, 11 Feb 1998 22:02:11 -0800 Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 00:58:40 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <1.5.4.16.19980212004751.5847f06c@pop.mindspring.com> X-Sender: nickd@pop.mindspring.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (16) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: nick douglas Subject: Re: (Yet)Another Request for Input/Output Resent-Message-ID: <"a1i1RB.A.WaG.U-o40"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3182 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 22:02:11 -0800 X-UIDL: 9e4d2fcbfb261175f91f33acb70ce5fa Tom -- or anybody who knows, Are you aware of any other loopers playing during the NEA Extravaganza? I'll be back in my old Gnashville hometown for that projeKCt two show; I don't know which other acts to go see, but surely more than one band in 200 does loops! At 04:44 PM 2/11/98 -0600, you wrote: > >At 04:26 PM 2/11/98 -0600, you wrote: >>Tom--or anybody (is there a looper in the house?): >> >>Are F/B/G doing a tour? How about NYC? Despite my recent comments on >>Fripp's date here in Dec., the mentioned bill would be of maximum interest! >> >>David Myers > >David- > >According to Mr.Gunn, Projekct 2, is on tour. The Nashvile date is during >the NEA Extravaganza, our version of SXSW: > >ts, >> >>hey there. >> >>yes, i am the third part of the Projekct 2 group with Adrian and Robert and >>will be performing in nashville on the 20th. we have a west coast tour in >>march, japan in april, east coast and europe in may. > >This much I know, I know no more... > >Tom "How Green is My Portfolio" Spaulding > > Nick "lusting for an EDP" Douglas Nick Douglas nickd@mindspring.com From ???@??? Thu Feb 12 00:29:59 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 11 22:17:00 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y2rxB-0000m5-00; Wed, 11 Feb 1998 22:16:57 -0800 From: ENAT21213@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 01:13:32 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: What does a Echo-plex cost? Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 16-bit for Windows sub 58 Resent-Message-ID: <"kTBZNB.A.uY.bMp40"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3183 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 22:16:57 -0800 X-UIDL: e3da14f033fb47701f603f91b0576c23 toomuch From ???@??? Thu Feb 12 00:30:00 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 11 22:41:30 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y2sKs-0002rd-00; Wed, 11 Feb 1998 22:41:26 -0800 Message-Id: <2.2.32.19980212063654.00d8cd24@pop.chromatic.com> X-Sender: kflint@pop.chromatic.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 2.2 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 22:36:54 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Kim Flint Subject: Re: those pesky trademarks Resent-Message-ID: <"C_CkqB.A.JNC.xip40"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3184 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 22:41:26 -0800 X-UIDL: 4191db363a48d6f925e020d695b736f9 At 12:04 AM 2/12/98 -0500, Jeff Schwartz wrote: >Oh yeah, I noticed in the new Guitar World a letter from >Eventide asserting their trademark on the word >"harmonizer." Where do I go to register the words >"distortion," "reverb," "delay," "sampler," etc.? To register a trademark, you go to the Patent and Trademark Office of your respective country, fill out forms, pay fees, etc. Some additional processes to get it international. If the word has already been used in product names, you won't get it. So your choices here probably wouldn't fly. Eventide, on the other hand, probably does have a trademark on "harmonizer" since they have been making products with that name for a long time, certainly before anyone else was. Matthias, as it happens, registered the word "Loop" internationally for music, audio, and media products quite a long time ago when he first started working on these things. That trademark is now owned by Aurisis Research, our little loopy company, and is the name for our software. That's why the echoplex says "Loop" when you turn it on. With any (or a lot of) luck, lot's of stuff will say that when it turns on, and we'll be like dolby or something. (well, I can dream....) Oh, and our massive, well-financed legal department is ready to take names and kick butt, so watch yerself. :-) kim ________________________________________________________ Kim Flint 408-752-9284 Mpact System Engineering kflint@chromatic.com Chromatic Research http://www.chromatic.com From ???@??? Thu Feb 12 00:30:04 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 11 23:05:04 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y2shh-0004jf-00; Wed, 11 Feb 1998 23:05:01 -0800 Message-Id: <2.2.32.19980212070138.00d9a420@pop.chromatic.com> X-Sender: kflint@pop.chromatic.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 2.2 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 23:01:38 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Kim Flint Subject: Re: What does a Echo-plex cost? Cc: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Resent-Message-ID: <"2g1ycD.A.PJE.25p40"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3185 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 23:05:01 -0800 X-UIDL: 5a5bd3485ee61bd77c812665e4e3156a At 01:13 AM 2/12/98 EST, ENAT21213@aol.com wrote: >toomuch I think I saw them somewhere around $650 in the Thoroughbred catalog, or about 1/6 the price of a certain guitar I bought recently. Not sure about the footpedal price. "Too much" is sort of an eye of the beholder's bank account thing, I guess. Funny thing about music gear pricing: no matter what the price is, there are a bunch of people complaining loudly that it is too much. No matter how much you lower the price, they never buy it, because they're broke! Yet at any price point, there seem to be plenty of people quietly buying. Lexicon sells their $2000 reverbs, Eventide sells their $4000 harmonizers. When I worked at Gibson, it always amazed me that the custom shop had the audacity to produce guitars and price them at $20,000 and beyond. I mean, they're nice guitars, but $20,000, $30,000, $60,000???? But what amazed me even more than the prices, is they never have any trouble selling them all..... kim ________________________________________________________ Kim Flint 408-752-9284 Mpact System Engineering kflint@chromatic.com Chromatic Research http://www.chromatic.com From ???@??? Thu Feb 12 00:30:08 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 11 23:46:52 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y2tM9-00000b-00; Wed, 11 Feb 1998 23:46:49 -0800 From: Paolo Valladolid Message-Id: <199802120743.XAA20198@waynesworld.ucsd.edu> Subject: Re: screaming guitar To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 23:43:58 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: from "Adam Levin" at Feb 11, 98 02:02:01 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"uv-zoD.A.4BH.Dhq40"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3186 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 23:46:49 -0800 X-UIDL: ec87795882cc621ea8fa2c7cd4c2d62d This may be old hat for you guys but I discovered I could get a sound on my Chapman Stick by blowing on the pickups. Now it's kind of awkward to try to play my Stick while blowing on a pickup; it puts me in weird positions and I'm sure anyone who sees me would think I'm performing a perverted oral activity on my Stick. So I thought it would be cool to have a plastic or rubber tube rigged so I could play Stick in the normal position yet be able to blow some air onto my Stick pickups at the same time. I posted this idea to the Stick list and Harvey Starr (inventor of the Ztar, Zboard, and Microzone microtonal MIDI controller) suggested using the kind of tubing one uses for aquariums and some kind of air pump/valves/whatever to "amplify" the breath. Without the help of an air compressor or something like that I have to blow fairly hard at the pickup. Cheers, Paolo Valladolid --------------------------------------------------------------- |Moderator of Digital Guitar Digest, an Internet mailing list |\ |for Music Technology and Stringed Instruments | \ ---------------------------------------------------------------- | \ finger pvallado@waynesworld.ucsd.edu for more info \ | \ http://waynesworld.ucsd.edu/DigitalGuitar/home.html \| ----------------------------------------------------------------- From ???@??? Thu Feb 12 01:36:45 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 12 00:44:53 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y2uGI-0003dE-00; Thu, 12 Feb 1998 00:44:50 -0800 X-Sender: kflint@pop.slip.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <199802120743.XAA20198@waynesworld.ucsd.edu> References: from "Adam Levin" at Feb 11, 98 02:02:01 pm Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 00:42:00 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Kim Flint Subject: Re: screaming guitar Resent-Message-ID: <"9ekoa.A.7HD.eXr40"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3187 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 00:44:50 -0800 X-UIDL: e52b6c3ea53c1a198d09f9d426c055eb At 11:43 PM -0800 2/11/98, Paolo Valladolid wrote: >So I thought it would be cool to have a plastic or rubber tube rigged >so I could play Stick in the normal position yet be able to blow some >air onto my Stick pickups at the same time. I posted this idea to >the Stick list and Harvey Starr (inventor of the Ztar, Zboard, and >Microzone microtonal MIDI controller) suggested using the kind of tubing >one uses for aquariums and some kind of air pump/valves/whatever to "amplify" >the breath. Without the help of an air compressor or something like that >I have to blow fairly hard at the pickup. I'd say, once you get this breath controlled air compressor working, just play that and forget about the stick! And make me one too..... kim ______________________________________________________________________ Kim Flint | Looper's Delight kflint@annihilist.com | http://www.annihilist.com/loop/loop.html http://www.annihilist.com/ | Loopers-Delight-request@annihilist.com From ???@??? Thu Feb 12 09:33:58 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 12 07:27:37 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y30Xz-0001kU-00; Thu, 12 Feb 1998 07:27:31 -0800 Message-ID: <34E2CEC3.229F@nyfac.com> Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 10:28:19 +0000 From: tbajus Reply-To: nyfac2@nyfac.com X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (WinNT; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: What does a Echo-plex cost? References: <98Feb12.083201cst.26886@gateway.gibson.com> <34E309F5.6509FA3C@scee.sony.co.uk> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"jkiaLB.A.GBB.xOx40"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3195 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 07:27:31 -0800 X-UIDL: e34a1242a349b0d924e517f5488742de > So here in the UK we're looking at 750 pounds?!? > > Nobody's going to buy that, surely! > > Considering the sort of multi-effects box you can get for 300 pounds, > 750 for a 12 second delay seems a bit steep. (I know it's not just a > delay, but still....) I don't know... Not that cost is an indicator of worth, but my main guitar is worth (now) about $1200, my main amp I bought for $1000, not to mention the 8000 odds and ends that I use. If you are getting to use as a delay, you are, shall we say, not really getting you money's worth. There are a wide variety delay pedals out there that I could aquire for between $30-$300. Some will sound good. Just be glad you are not a classical musician. I was working on a film shoot with a friend of mine, who was going to the Curtis school of music, in Philly. Luis kindly offered to show up to the set with a $100k bass he had on loan, to use as a prop. Somebody stepped on it. Trev From ???@??? Thu Feb 12 09:33:43 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 12 05:43:41 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y2yvT-0001Ft-00; Thu, 12 Feb 1998 05:43:39 -0800 From: "Bailey, Jim" To: 'looppost' Subject: RE: UNSUBSCRIBE humor Date:Thu, 12 Feb 1998 08:45:00 -0500 Message-ID: <34E2FC5D@199.71.37.25> Encoding: 13 TEXT X-Mailer: Microsoft Mail V3.0 Resent-Message-ID: <"urBps.A.J3.cvv40"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3189 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 05:43:39 -0800 X-UIDL: cc2654f3b68a0c79ce4b82a3aa2c9f8f >now who was is that said stupidity is the most common material in the >universe again? Was that Zappa or George Carlin? >kim Or, to paraphrase Douglas Adams (from The Hitchiker's Guide to the Galaxy): "Intelligence is a constant; the population is growing." Jim Bailey From ???@??? Thu Feb 12 09:33:46 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 12 06:36:41 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y2zkl-0004U5-00; Thu, 12 Feb 1998 06:36:39 -0800 Message-Id: <98Feb12.083201cst.26886@gateway.gibson.com> X-Sender: tspauldi@mail.nash.gibson.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 08:35:20 -0600 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Tom Spaulding Subject: Re: What does a Echo-plex cost? In-Reply-To: <980211203615_-26987171@mrin54> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"93pkEC.A.D8D.ahw40"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3190 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 06:36:39 -0800 X-UIDL: 9712da9c69aa86c00261849f2f1779de David- Retail for the box is $999. Pedal is $159. Street price is usually $750 for both. Sometimes less, sometimes more. Tom At 07:36 PM 2/11/98 -0600, you wrote: >Another simple post. What is the going rate for an Echo-plex and for the >footcontroller? >David > > > From ???@??? Thu Feb 12 09:33:47 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 12 06:44:45 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y2zsW-0005J3-00; Thu, 12 Feb 1998 06:44:40 -0800 Sender: camao@camsg001.camb.scee.sony.co.uk Message-ID: <34E309F5.6509FA3C@scee.sony.co.uk> Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 14:40:53 +0000 From: Os X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (X11; I; IRIX 6.2 IP22) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: What does a Echo-plex cost? References: <98Feb12.083201cst.26886@gateway.gibson.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"VTPtCC.A.ZpE.how40"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3191 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 06:44:40 -0800 X-UIDL: ef8eb8bc183d2094c39d7852fd9a116f Tom Spaulding wrote: > > David- > > Retail for the box is $999. Pedal is $159. Street price is usually $750 for > both. Sometimes less, sometimes more. So here in the UK we're looking at 750 pounds?!? Nobody's going to buy that, surely! Considering the sort of multi-effects box you can get for 300 pounds, 750 for a 12 second delay seems a bit steep. (I know it's not just a delay, but still....) -- Os os@millennium.co.uk http://webworlds.net/os/ From ???@??? Thu Feb 12 09:33:52 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 12 06:58:53 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y306F-0006Yq-00; Thu, 12 Feb 1998 06:58:51 -0800 Message-Id: <98Feb12.085421cst.26887@gateway.gibson.com> X-Sender: tspauldi@mail.nash.gibson.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 08:57:49 -0600 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Tom Spaulding Subject: Re: What does a Echo-plex cost? In-Reply-To: <34E309F5.6509FA3C@scee.sony.co.uk> References: <98Feb12.083201cst.26886@gateway.gibson.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"28VrOC.A.D4F.N2w40"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3192 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 06:58:51 -0800 X-UIDL: 5ea075701cc488d08b5e75d11f7d075b Well, umm, yeah actually they buy them a lot. We're still backordered and dealers are ordering a dozen at a time. I agree it's not a delay...it's a 198 seconds (max) undoable real-time digital multitrack in a single rack space with foot controls, reverse function that holds upto nine loops that you can recall at any time. Plus a whole lot more...Considering you could buy a vintage tube tape Echoplex for between $500-600, I think it's a tremendous deal. Tom "Too skint for my own EDP" Spaulding At 08:40 AM 2/12/98 -0600, you wrote: >Tom Spaulding wrote: >> >> David- >> >> Retail for the box is $999. Pedal is $159. Street price is usually $750 for >> both. Sometimes less, sometimes more. > >So here in the UK we're looking at 750 pounds?!? > >Nobody's going to buy that, surely! > >Considering the sort of multi-effects box you can get for 300 pounds, >750 for a 12 second delay seems a bit steep. (I know it's not just a >delay, but still....) > >-- >Os >os@millennium.co.uk >http://webworlds.net/os/ > > > From ???@??? Thu Feb 12 09:33:53 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 12 07:10:51 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y30Ho-0007kJ-00; Thu, 12 Feb 1998 07:10:48 -0800 X-Sender: dmgraph@bway.net (Unverified) Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <2.2.32.19980212063654.00d8cd24@pop.chromatic.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 10:06:35 -0500 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: David Myers Subject: Re: those pesky trademarks Resent-Message-ID: <"RDOIrB.A.h2G.iAx40"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3193 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 07:10:48 -0800 X-UIDL: 73111ab41f1a0a8f74131616d3cda4dc >At 12:04 AM 2/12/98 -0500, Jeff Schwartz wrote: > >>Oh yeah, I noticed in the new Guitar World a letter from >>Eventide asserting their trademark on the word >>"harmonizer." Where do I go to register the words >>"distortion," "reverb," "delay," "sampler," etc.? > >To register a trademark, you go to the Patent and Trademark Office of your >respective country, fill out forms, pay fees, etc. Some additional processes >to get it international. If the word has already been used in product names, >you won't get it. So your choices here probably wouldn't fly. Eventide, on >the other hand, probably does have a trademark on "harmonizer" since they >have been making products with that name for a long time, certainly before >anyone else was. > >kim Eventide has had this trademark for a long time. I can remember such letters appearing in the magazines at least 10 or 15 years ago. Give 'em a break--they really were harmonizing before anyone else, no? David Myers From ???@??? Thu Feb 12 09:33:54 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 12 07:14:45 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y30La-0000Ql-00; Thu, 12 Feb 1998 07:14:42 -0800 Sender: camao@camsg001.camb.scee.sony.co.uk Message-ID: <34E310BA.C35F5335@scee.sony.co.uk> Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 15:09:46 +0000 From: Os X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (X11; I; IRIX 6.2 IP22) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: What does a Echo-plex cost? References: <98Feb12.083201cst.26886@gateway.gibson.com> <98Feb12.085421cst.26887@gateway.gibson.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"TBm-rB.A.GPH.oDx40"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3194 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 07:14:42 -0800 X-UIDL: 4177c19c7e3f0b36c473d16eaae5c90d My point was mainly that in the UK we suffer from the 1 UKP == 1 dollar problem, which makes things much more expensive. If the EDP comes out at a properly exchange-rate-converted price (750 dollars == 450 pounds approx) then that would be reasonable (though I'd still like a bit more than 12s for that money). So, how about it? Do you know what the UK price will be? os. PS. for the difference between 750 UKP and 450 UKP I could fly to the states, convert the currency, buy the EDP & come home with money to spare! Tom Spaulding wrote: > > Well, umm, yeah actually they buy them a lot. We're still backordered and > dealers are ordering a dozen at a time. I agree it's not a delay...it's a > 198 seconds (max) undoable real-time digital multitrack in a single rack > space with foot controls, reverse function that holds upto nine loops that > you can recall at any time. Plus a whole lot more...Considering you could > buy a vintage tube tape Echoplex for between $500-600, I think it's a > tremendous deal. > > Tom "Too skint for my own EDP" Spaulding > > At 08:40 AM 2/12/98 -0600, you wrote: > >Tom Spaulding wrote: > >> > >> David- > >> > >> Retail for the box is $999. Pedal is $159. Street price is usually $750 for > >> both. Sometimes less, sometimes more. > > > >So here in the UK we're looking at 750 pounds?!? > > > >Nobody's going to buy that, surely! > > > >Considering the sort of multi-effects box you can get for 300 pounds, > >750 for a 12 second delay seems a bit steep. (I know it's not just a > >delay, but still....) > > > >-- > >Os > >os@millennium.co.uk > >http://webworlds.net/os/ > > > > > > -- Os os@millennium.co.uk http://webworlds.net/os/ From ???@??? Thu Feb 12 09:34:00 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 12 07:39:35 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y30jc-00031r-00; Thu, 12 Feb 1998 07:39:32 -0800 Sender: camao@camsg001.camb.scee.sony.co.uk Message-ID: <34E316D9.F82A273A@scee.sony.co.uk> Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 15:35:53 +0000 From: Os X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (X11; I; IRIX 6.2 IP22) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com" Subject: Re: What does a Echo-plex cost? References: <98Feb12.083201cst.26886@gateway.gibson.com> <34E309F5.6509FA3C@scee.sony.co.uk> <34E2CEC3.229F@nyfac.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"k4kW3B.A.ogC.Fcx40"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3197 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 07:39:32 -0800 X-UIDL: b894761718fd8af89b74094262ab0133 tbajus wrote: > I don't know... Not that cost is an indicator of worth, but my main > guitar is worth (now) about $1200, my main amp I bought for $1000, not > to mention the 8000 odds and ends that I use. If you are getting to use > as a delay, you are, shall we say, not really getting you money's > worth. There are a wide variety delay pedals out there that I could > aquire for between $30-$300. Some will sound good. Funny how some things appreciate, others don't - I bought my Korg Prophecy for 945 pounds, now it's worth about 400... I wasn't really proposing to use the EDP just as a delay. I wonder how the EDP prices up against a second-hand PowerMac with eg. the LiSa software? -- Os os@millennium.co.uk http://webworlds.net/os/ From ???@??? Thu Feb 12 09:34:02 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 12 07:44:31 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y30oO-0003go-00; Thu, 12 Feb 1998 07:44:28 -0800 Sender: camao@camsg001.camb.scee.sony.co.uk Message-ID: <34E317B5.D8B5CB01@scee.sony.co.uk> Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 15:39:33 +0000 From: Os X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (X11; I; IRIX 6.2 IP22) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: What does a Echo-plex cost? References: <34E309F5.6509FA3C@scee.sony.co.uk> <98Feb12.083201cst.26886@gateway.gibson.com> <3.0.1.16.19980212170212.285f69f2@rank-serv.elec.gla.ac.uk> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"umy8HC.A.m9C.jfx40"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3198 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 07:44:28 -0800 X-UIDL: 4424fd96882f242d42bf96bc5c067141 Michael P. Hughes, Ph.D. wrote: > It's sad to say, but I really can't see a lot of these shipping in the UK. > There hasn't been any innovation in UK guitar (OK, at least not much) since > Andy Summers arrived in the early 80s. People will pay for gear in Britain > - just not much that's been invented less than 30 years ago. You don't > need an EDP to play Oasis/Blur/etc/etc/etc..... Curious that you assume that guitar players will determine the fate of the EDP. I for one would use it with synths; a friend of mine loops with piano (cf. Harold Budd); and any number of new-age types like to go 'oooh' into loopers as part of a performance (eg. Alquimia). Trumpet/sax/clarinet also loop pleasingly. -- Os os@millennium.co.uk http://webworlds.net/os/ From ???@??? Thu Feb 12 09:34:03 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 12 07:56:45 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y310E-0004lY-00; Thu, 12 Feb 1998 07:56:42 -0800 Sender: jfm3@ix.netcom.com Message-ID: <34E31B50.157E18A3@grim-determination.com> Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 10:54:57 -0500 From: Joe Miklojcik Organization: Rutgers University ACS X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.0.30 i686) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: stereo References: <2.2.32.19980212063654.00d8cd24@pop.chromatic.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"X4Dm-D.A.GJE.Jsx40"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3199 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 07:56:43 -0800 X-UIDL: ede3bec9fb148cb9346475bf7706f3f5 Dear Engineers of Looping Devices, STEREO! STEREO! STEREO! I'm not going to buy 2 plexen. I'm just not. Thanks for your attention. ('jfm3) From ???@??? Thu Feb 12 09:34:06 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 12 08:15:25 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y31II-0006Vm-00; Thu, 12 Feb 1998 08:15:22 -0800 From: KILLINFO@aol.com Message-ID: <7c91c88a.34e31f2f@aol.com> Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 11:11:24 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Re: screaming guitar Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 59 Resent-Message-ID: <"JmFh0B.A.-pF.18x40"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3200 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 08:15:22 -0800 X-UIDL: b380814433da10b458dd7f33b8ba3586 In a message dated 2/11/98 11:46:14 PM, you wrote: >This may be old hat for you guys but I discovered I could get a sound on >my Chapman Stick by blowing on the pickups. Now it's kind of awkward to >try to play my Stick while blowing on a pickup; it puts me in weird >positions and I'm sure anyone who sees me would think I'm performing >a perverted oral activity on my Stick. Something that works better sound-wise for me but with perhaps a little less theatrical appeal are those compressed air cans that you can readily buy at radio shack (and elsewhere) to blow the dust from sensitive electronic parts. They usually come with a thin plastic tube that inserts into the nozzle--very handy for precise aiming at whatever portion of the strings you care to blow on. Somewhere around the 12th fret usually works better for me. Ted From ???@??? Thu Feb 12 09:34:08 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 12 08:22:35 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y31PC-0007LN-00; Thu, 12 Feb 1998 08:22:30 -0800 From: MIvanBerk@aol.com Message-ID: <52efae8a.34e320d9@aol.com> Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 11:18:28 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: screaming guitar Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 57 Resent-Message-ID: <"A9XWyD.A.TcG.hDy40"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3201 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 08:22:30 -0800 X-UIDL: 8f42cc65ebaaab17a1d06dc0a8c2170c In a message dated 98-02-12 11:14:17 EST, Ted wrote: << Something that works better sound-wise for me but with perhaps a little less theatrical appeal are those compressed air cans that you can readily buy at radio shack (and elsewhere) to blow the dust from sensitive electronic parts. They usually come with a thin plastic tube that inserts into the nozzle--very handy for precise aiming at whatever portion of the strings you care to blow on. Somewhere around the 12th fret usually works better for me. >> If you want the same effect, with a bit more theatrical appeal, you can use a trick Gary Davis (of San Diego's Custom Floor) showed me. Blow up a brightly colored balloon (the performance element), and use that for your compressed- air exciter source. Cheaper than compressed air too... -Mike From ???@??? Thu Feb 12 10:00:18 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 12 09:43:26 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y32fN-0000hA-00; Thu, 12 Feb 1998 09:43:17 -0800 Message-ID: From: David Kirkdorffer To: "'Michael P. Hughes, Ph.D.'" , Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: cost of UK outboard gear` Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 11:35:21 -0500 X-Priority: 3 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) Content-Type: text/plain Resent-Message-ID: <"KQh8EB.A.aGH.sMz40"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3204 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 09:43:17 -0800 X-UIDL: f4f7e17d2cfaafd28a8a899699208449 Question: Is the UK price of this outboard gear (Lex, TC etc.,) in the same price league as the modern synthesizers and computer oriented music technology? If so, there may lie the answer - in many ways outboard gear is less versatile that synths and computer music technology - and folks are going for the bigger bang for money spent. David -----Original Message----- From: Michael P. Hughes, Ph.D. [SMTP:pycraft@elec.gla.ac.uk] Sent: Thursday, February 12, 1998 12:02 PM To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: What does a Echo-plex cost? Tom: >Well, umm, yeah actually they buy them a lot. We're still backordered and >dealers are ordering a dozen at a time. I agree it's not a delay...it's a >198 seconds (max) undoable real-time digital multitrack in a single rack >space with foot controls, reverse function that holds upto nine loops that >you can recall at any time. Plus a whole lot more...Considering you could >buy a vintage tube tape Echoplex for between $500-600, I think it's a >tremendous deal. It's sad to say, but I really can't see a lot of these shipping in the UK. There hasn't been any innovation in UK guitar (OK, at least not much) since Andy Summers arrived in the early 80s. People will pay for gear in Britain - just not much that's been invented less than 30 years ago. You don't need an EDP to play Oasis/Blur/etc/etc/etc..... os: >My point was mainly that in the UK we suffer from the 1 UKP == 1 dollar >problem, which makes things much more expensive. If the EDP comes out at >a properly exchange-rate-converted price (750 dollars == 450 pounds >approx) then that would be reasonable (though I'd still like a bit more >than 12s for that money). For point of comparrison everyone, the TC G-force goes for $1800 over here, ditto the Lex MP1. And that _is_ "street price", pretty much. About the only fiscal advantage for UK musicians is that Marshall are cheaper..! Michael From ???@??? Thu Feb 12 10:00:19 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 12 09:48:26 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y32kI-0001Lz-00; Thu, 12 Feb 1998 09:48:22 -0800 Message-ID: From: David Kirkdorffer To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: EDP in NYC Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 11:38:25 -0500 X-Priority: 1 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) Content-Type: text/plain Resent-Message-ID: <"L3-JHD.A.IO.4Pz40"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3205 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 09:48:22 -0800 X-UIDL: 4b856e2e74328c22b1f5c0848e0feb26 To the man in NYC selling his EDP. I experienced e-mail melt-down. Lost all e-mail in last week including you phone numbers. Please reply privately. Still interested. David Kirkdorffer -----Original Message----- From: Jeff Duke [SMTP:jmar@bellsouth.net] Sent: Wednesday, February 11, 1998 5:52 PM To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: (Yet)Another Request for Input/Output Tom Spaulding wrote: > House of Loops- > > What are some of the non-obvious applications you are having your Echoplex (or JamMan or whatever) do? > > Thanks in advance!!!! Really!!! > > Tom "Got my tix to see Fripp/Belew/Gunn on the 20th" Spaulding Gee Tom I kinda wanted to see the vibrator thread keep on a bit more ... but I digress.A recent use that I have had for my Jamman is as a party favor! I hook a mic up and put it in the middle of the room,jm on echo with a high repeat and 100% wet.It then goes in to the TBL sound system,anyway suddenly every 30secs the whole party starts repeating,pretty intense.If I have music on the stereo also ... Jeff "I wish I had tix and time too!" Duke From ???@??? Thu Feb 12 09:34:17 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 12 09:25:48 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y32OK-0006Ig-00; Thu, 12 Feb 1998 09:25:40 -0800 Date: 12 Feb 1998 17:18:45 -0000 Message-ID: <19980212171845.9713.qmail@omni1.voicenet.com> From: floyd@voicenet.com To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: those pesky trademarks Resent-Message-ID: <"CkvJwB.A.SFF.A8y40"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3203 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 09:25:40 -0800 X-UIDL: f9eb57bd66ad4a52866d95086fa8d5b4 At Thu Feb 12 15:10:45 1998 David Myers wrote: > > Eventide has had this trademark for a long time. I can remember such > letters appearing in the magazines at least 10 or 15 years ago. Give 'em a > break--they really were harmonizing before anyone else, no? > > David Myers > For that matter, groupt like the Drifters were harmonizing way back in the '50s. From ???@??? Thu Feb 12 20:02:59 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 12 10:14:01 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y338w-0004Zm-00; Thu, 12 Feb 1998 10:13:50 -0800 X-Sender: kflint@pop.slip.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <3.0.1.16.19980212183404.0c4f71ec@rank-serv.elec.gla.ac.uk> References: <34E317B5.D8B5CB01@scee.sony.co.uk> <34E309F5.6509FA3C@scee.sony.co.uk> <98Feb12.083201cst.26886@gateway.gibson.com> <3.0.1.16.19980212170212.285f69f2@rank-serv.elec.gla.ac.uk> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 09:51:02 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Kim Flint Subject: Re: What does a Echo-plex cost? Resent-Message-ID: <"qHon_D.A.DnC.jiz40"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3206 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 10:13:50 -0800 X-UIDL: 56f6f7346e7fd03f18eff6f878c34baf At 6:34 PM -0800 2/12/98, Michael P. Hughes, Ph.D. wrote: >I'll admit a longing for the early days of the 80s when experimentation was >cool - the Police the Art of Noise, King Crimson. Nowadays most popular >music seems so ... old. And as regards guitar players, I find it sad that >most of my guitar "heroes" form two distinct sets - British from pre-1980 >(Summers, Fripp, Holdsworth, Mike Oldfield etc) and US post-1980 (Torn, >Frizell etc)... > >Michael > >Old beyond his 27 years. I think this is why I stopped listening to guitar oriented music. Everything I hear, no matter what the style and who the player, leaves me with a feeling of "haven't I heard this already?" even older than my 28 years, kim ______________________________________________________________________ Kim Flint | Looper's Delight kflint@annihilist.com | http://www.annihilist.com/loop/loop.html http://www.annihilist.com/ | Loopers-Delight-request@annihilist.com From ???@??? Thu Feb 12 20:03:01 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 12 10:14:17 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y3399-0004bN-00; Thu, 12 Feb 1998 10:14:03 -0800 X-Sender: kflint@pop.slip.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <34E317B5.D8B5CB01@scee.sony.co.uk> References: <34E309F5.6509FA3C@scee.sony.co.uk> <98Feb12.083201cst.26886@gateway.gibson.com> <3.0.1.16.19980212170212.285f69f2@rank-serv.elec.gla.ac.uk> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 09:54:00 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Kim Flint Subject: Re: What does a Echo-plex cost? Resent-Message-ID: <"tjq_UD.A.4nC.piz40"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3207 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 10:14:03 -0800 X-UIDL: 17ce4f821b24d8706beeed275e706ccc At 3:39 PM +0000 2/12/98, Os wrote: >Michael P. Hughes, Ph.D. wrote: > >> It's sad to say, but I really can't see a lot of these shipping in the UK. >> There hasn't been any innovation in UK guitar (OK, at least not much) since >> Andy Summers arrived in the early 80s. People will pay for gear in Britain >> - just not much that's been invented less than 30 years ago. You don't >> need an EDP to play Oasis/Blur/etc/etc/etc..... > >Curious that you assume that guitar players will determine the fate of >the EDP. I for one would use it with synths; a friend of mine loops with >piano (cf. Harold Budd); and any number of new-age types like to go >'oooh' into loopers as part of a performance (eg. Alquimia). >Trumpet/sax/clarinet also loop pleasingly. you know, it just baffles me how looping gets so associated with guitar. (at least in some circles...) The sound going into the loop can be anything, where do people get the idea that its just a guitar effect? mystery..... kim ______________________________________________________________________ Kim Flint | Looper's Delight kflint@annihilist.com | http://www.annihilist.com/loop/loop.html http://www.annihilist.com/ | Loopers-Delight-request@annihilist.com From ???@??? Thu Feb 12 20:02:56 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 12 10:13:43 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y338j-0004Xq-00; Thu, 12 Feb 1998 10:13:37 -0800 X-Sender: kflint@pop.slip.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <34E31B50.157E18A3@grim-determination.com> References: <2.2.32.19980212063654.00d8cd24@pop.chromatic.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 09:56:13 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Kim Flint Subject: Re: stereo Resent-Message-ID: <"RqbgI.A.doC.tiz40"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3208 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 10:13:37 -0800 X-UIDL: 4c53791763ccce76539c5409ddee73f0 yeah, yeah, we hear you! of course, people complain a lot about how much the mono versions cost... a stereo version at the time any of these were created would have cost a lot more and generated a lot more whining. kim At 10:54 AM -0500 2/12/98, Joe Miklojcik wrote: >Dear Engineers of Looping Devices, > >STEREO! >STEREO! >STEREO! > >I'm not going to buy 2 plexen. I'm just not. > >Thanks for your attention. > >('jfm3) ______________________________________________________________________ Kim Flint | Looper's Delight kflint@annihilist.com | http://www.annihilist.com/loop/loop.html http://www.annihilist.com/ | Loopers-Delight-request@annihilist.com From ???@??? Thu Feb 12 09:58:44 1998 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Kim Flint Subject: Re: What does a Echo-plex cost? Cc: Bcc: X-Attachments: Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <34E310BA.C35F5335@scee.sony.co.uk> References: <98Feb12.083201cst.26886@gateway.gibson.com> <98Feb12.085421cst.26887@gateway.gibson.com> At 3:09 PM +0000 2/12/98, Os wrote: >My point was mainly that in the UK we suffer from the 1 UKP == 1 dollar >problem, which makes things much more expensive. If the EDP comes out at >a properly exchange-rate-converted price (750 dollars == 450 pounds >approx) then that would be reasonable (though I'd still like a bit more >than 12s for that money). considering how cheap memory is, going from the 12s to 200s is not that much! And you'd still pay a lot less than a TC2290....which really is "just a delay". kim From ???@??? Thu Feb 12 20:03:00 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 12 10:14:10 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y3392-0004ae-00; Thu, 12 Feb 1998 10:13:56 -0800 X-Sender: kflint@pop.slip.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <34E310BA.C35F5335@scee.sony.co.uk> References: <98Feb12.083201cst.26886@gateway.gibson.com> <98Feb12.085421cst.26887@gateway.gibson.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 09:58:44 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Kim Flint Subject: Re: What does a Echo-plex cost? Resent-Message-ID: <"IEWkjB.A.TpC.xiz40"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3209 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 10:13:56 -0800 X-UIDL: 0cca50b89e115969a5f4ec0228f9f46c At 3:09 PM +0000 2/12/98, Os wrote: >My point was mainly that in the UK we suffer from the 1 UKP == 1 dollar >problem, which makes things much more expensive. If the EDP comes out at >a properly exchange-rate-converted price (750 dollars == 450 pounds >approx) then that would be reasonable (though I'd still like a bit more >than 12s for that money). considering how cheap memory is, going from the 12s to 200s is not that much! And you'd still pay a lot less than a TC2290....which really is "just a delay". kim ______________________________________________________________________ Kim Flint | Looper's Delight kflint@annihilist.com | http://www.annihilist.com/loop/loop.html http://www.annihilist.com/ | Loopers-Delight-request@annihilist.com From ???@??? Thu Feb 12 20:03:05 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 12 11:03:33 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y33v0-00035A-00; Thu, 12 Feb 1998 11:03:30 -0800 Message-Id: <199802121854.NAA23593@shell.monmouth.com> Reply-To: From: "andre" To: Subject: Re: Throwing it into reverse Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 13:54:26 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1162 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"i_7kAC.A.D3B.IW040"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3210 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 11:03:30 -0800 X-UIDL: 6c174d0954a6a38d2cf9075caaa6aa44 > From: Tom Spaulding > > >Is it me, or do backward distorted guitar chords sound like an accordian? > >Reverse neo-ambient polkas, anyone? > > > >Marshall > > > It's you and all them brat-eatin', beer-swillin', Packer-lovin', > cow-tippin', cheese-headed squeezebox types in Wisconsin...my homies!! ....but for REAL backwards weirdness (and some cool nuggets to sample/loop) check out http://www.reversespeech.com ---this is some amazing shit, i've done some reading on it, and it's somehow linked to our right brain activity, that which we're not even aware of. And the difficulties dyslexics face - may be a key to why this phenomenon exist. check it out. some wild shit that makes you wonder....... if you're into psychology, linguistics or any brainwave research, this is for u. andre' (ps - listening to the fine, fine performance from last night - DT with DJ Sppoky and Sakamoto and friends... it's awesome. Did some of you 'perform' or listen via the net????) From ???@??? Thu Feb 12 20:03:57 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 12 19:03:56 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y3BPv-0001ni-00; Thu, 12 Feb 1998 19:03:55 -0800 Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 21:23:22 +0200 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: patrick@his.com (Patrick Smith) Subject: Re: a suggestion for all Resent-Message-ID: <"BH8xpD.A.GIB.yb740"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3227 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 19:03:55 -0800 X-UIDL: f96401d3a927223137f2467cf5608c6b Amen... Use better descriptive headings.... Patrick (wish I had tixs for Fripp et al, watch out there goes that "F" word again) Smith *** *** ** Fingerpaint http://www.his.com/~patrick/FNGP.html *** ** From ???@??? Thu Feb 12 20:03:12 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 12 11:46:54 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y34aw-0000Gu-00; Thu, 12 Feb 1998 11:46:50 -0800 Message-Id: <199802121937.OAA10346@shell.monmouth.com> Reply-To: From: "andre" To: Subject: Re: Question about the Boomerang Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 14:37:23 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1162 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"KUGLHB.A.3fG.c-040"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3211 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 11:46:50 -0800 X-UIDL: 39a68e525c5ac8fdcbc8b97ea49efafc > > > > Mike said : > . This sounds very choppy, not at > all like the typical reverse leads created by Jimi Hendrix, George > Harrison, or Adrian Belew. > > Anyone familiar with the Hendrix album 'Concerts' ? They play 'Are You Experienced' > live, and Jimi plays the backwards solo bit, and it's practically the same ! Probably better > due to the massive feedback he's getting - one of the all time HUGE guitar sounds > ever achieved I reckon... > regards > Andrew -- that performance (..experienced) is one of the sickest things this so-called planet earth has seen. along with the middle of 'machine gun' from Band o'gypsies and Zappa's black napkins, it's just one of the most mind-altering bits of music ever heard, in my humble opinion.... whew. How did he do it, in 1969 or 70 or whatever. it's uncanny. > > From ???@??? Thu Feb 12 20:03:13 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 12 11:53:38 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y34hT-00017D-00; Thu, 12 Feb 1998 11:53:35 -0800 Message-Id: <199802121946.OAA13787@shell.monmouth.com> Reply-To: From: "andre" To: Subject: Re: screaming guitar Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 14:45:55 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1162 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"4DDeAC.A.GO.bG140"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3212 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 11:53:35 -0800 X-UIDL: 6c2461620d44c34819dd63e36418ad4e > theatrical appeal are those compressed air cans that you can readily buy at > radio shack (and elsewhere) to blow the dust from sensitive electronic parts. > They usually come with a thin plastic tube that inserts into the nozzle--very > handy for precise aiming at whatever portion of the strings you care to blow > on. Somewhere around the 12th fret usually works better for me. > >> > > If you want the same effect, with a bit more theatrical appeal, you can use a > trick Gary Davis (of San Diego's Custom Floor) showed me. Blow up a brightly > colored balloon (the performance element), and use that for your compressed- > air exciter source. Cheaper than compressed air too... > > -Mike ...not to mention a bit better for the ol' environs...... though it is nice that most of that stuff is now CFC - free. > From ???@??? Thu Feb 12 20:03:19 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 12 14:14:23 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y36td-0000uK-00; Thu, 12 Feb 1998 14:14:17 -0800 From: Paolo Valladolid Message-Id: <199802122207.OAA25529@waynesworld.ucsd.edu> Subject: Re: Re: screaming guitar To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 14:07:39 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: <7c91c88a.34e31f2f@aol.com> from "KILLINFO@aol.com" at Feb 12, 98 11:11:24 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"ni51E.A.dG.6K340"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3216 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 14:14:17 -0800 X-UIDL: ce7f49dad9f7c6e66bfe25569ad1a0e1 > In a message dated 2/11/98 11:46:14 PM, you wrote: > > >This may be old hat for you guys but I discovered I could get a sound on > >my Chapman Stick by blowing on the pickups. Now it's kind of awkward to > >try to play my Stick while blowing on a pickup; it puts me in weird > >positions and I'm sure anyone who sees me would think I'm performing > >a perverted oral activity on my Stick. > > Something that works better sound-wise for me but with perhaps a little less > theatrical appeal are those compressed air cans that you can readily buy at > radio shack (and elsewhere) to blow the dust from sensitive electronic parts. > They usually come with a thin plastic tube that inserts into the nozzle--very > handy for precise aiming at whatever portion of the strings you care to blow > on. Somewhere around the 12th fret usually works better for me. > > Ted That sounds good, but I'm more interested in a rig that will still allow me to play Stick with both hands. Probably some kind of setup where I'd have a breath controller or tube from my mouth control the amount of pressure coming from the air compressor to the pickup. Perhaps an entirely new instrument would have to be designed, as Kim hinted at, though it would be cool to have this weird rig available to any fretted instrument player. cheers, Paolo Valladolid --------------------------------------------------------------- |Moderator of Digital Guitar Digest, an Internet mailing list |\ |for Music Technology and Stringed Instruments | \ ---------------------------------------------------------------- | \ finger pvallado@waynesworld.ucsd.edu for more info \ | \ http://waynesworld.ucsd.edu/DigitalGuitar/home.html \| ----------------------------------------------------------------- From ???@??? Thu Feb 12 20:03:42 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 12 16:56:00 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y39Q1-0003F6-00; Thu, 12 Feb 1998 16:55:53 -0800 From: Edward_Chang@mail.amsinc.com Date: Thu, 12 Feb 98 17:09:00 EST Encoding: 30 Text Message-Id: <9801128873.AA887335399@mail.amsinc.com> To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: audience expectations Resent-Message-ID: <"M2PFGD.A.ocC.kj540"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3220 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 16:55:53 -0800 X-UIDL: 13ff8b157c595200bc588f583137f6ee >Some musicians _do_ play experimental music to receptive audiences (I'm thinking here of the >mythical NY loft scene) - but if that's what the audences are getting, they should be warned. YOu don't >go to a play expecting to be told that the company are about to make it up as they go along Being in NYC and having been an audience member and a performer in such a scene, I feel that most attendees of these shows know that it's going to be an evening of improvised music. Experimental music (especially in the improv underground) is far different from the Grateful Dead or what Fripp, etc.. does I think. Alot of shows ARE about hit-and-miss in public - that's where the excitement comes from. Hell, that's why I do improv shows. I remember Evan Parker saying something like he prefers improvised music over notated because if it's notated, there's no reason to play it - it already exists in the readers' minds in it's purest form. Now I know that's a bit on the extreme side, but I agree with the gist of it. Another reason that I attend these shows is to see unusual pairings to see how 2 completely different musicians (who are both great in their own right) can create music together. For example the Cecil Taylor/Thurston Moore show last month. Hypocritically I couldn't make that show, and worse yet I heard it wasn't that great, but knowing that, I'd still attend just to see 2 musicians striving for a common ground. It's the struggle that's exciting to me, not the guaranteed enjoyment of it. sorry for the long post... ed chang From ???@??? Thu Feb 12 20:03:22 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 12 14:58:45 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y37aZ-0005el-00; Thu, 12 Feb 1998 14:58:39 -0800 Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 14:52:35 -0800 (PST) From: Neal X-Sender: ntrembat@apocalypse To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Re: screaming guitar In-Reply-To: <199802122207.OAA25529@waynesworld.ucsd.edu> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Resent-Message-ID: <"GzHZs.A.TnE.80340"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3217 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 14:58:39 -0800 X-UIDL: d4f872673cc30984a4fe2fe289290eba On Thu, 12 Feb 1998, Paolo Valladolid wrote: > > >my Chapman Stick by blowing on the pickups. Now it's kind of awkward to > > >try to play my Stick while blowing on a pickup; it puts me in weird > > >positions and I'm sure anyone who sees me would think I'm performing > > >a perverted oral activity on my Stick. > > That sounds good, but I'm more interested in a rig that will still allow > me to play Stick with both hands. Probably some kind of setup where I'd You could have someone else blow your stick... :( Or get a foot-pumped bike pump, and mount the nozzle over the pickup. Or redesign, with a bagpipe/accordian armpump. OK, I give up. I'm starting to drone. Neal From ???@??? Thu Feb 12 20:03:41 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 12 16:39:38 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y39A3-0001BB-00; Thu, 12 Feb 1998 16:39:23 -0800 From: Paolo Valladolid Message-Id: <199802122343.PAA26298@waynesworld.ucsd.edu> Subject: Re: Re: screaming guitar To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 15:43:17 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: from "Neal" at Feb 12, 98 02:52:35 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"slNBqC.A.-D.kQ540"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3219 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 16:39:23 -0800 X-UIDL: 80d7f30ed664d580c0bb6f56f3fbdb9a This all reminds me... I just saw some video clips of the Gravikords, Whirlies, And Pyrophones event in New York (yes it is connected to the book/CD of the same name) in a local news program. I saw glimpses of the Gravikord (an African kora built out of metal parts and other stuff), the Pyrophone, and the bike that plays horns when you pedal it. Any idea if a video is available of this event? Paolo Valladolid --------------------------------------------------------------- |Moderator of Digital Guitar Digest, an Internet mailing list |\ |for Music Technology and Stringed Instruments | \ ---------------------------------------------------------------- | \ finger pvallado@waynesworld.ucsd.edu for more info \ | \ http://waynesworld.ucsd.edu/DigitalGuitar/home.html \| ----------------------------------------------------------------- From ???@??? Thu Feb 12 20:03:30 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 12 15:47:54 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y38M7-00037O-00; Thu, 12 Feb 1998 15:47:47 -0800 Message-ID: <01BD37E6.228502B0@TD-300> From: jprice@intcpi.com (John Price) To: "'Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com'" Subject: RE: What does a Echo-plex cost? Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 18:43:32 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="---- =_NextPart_000_01BD37E6.2292BE50" Resent-Message-ID: <"2p6OmC.A.NGC.4h440"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3218 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 15:47:47 -0800 X-UIDL: 9a08d6dd907a15df50082f52ccbe65e9 Doesn't it seem like musically we are somewhere between 1978 and 1980 all over again ? The 90's have been overly derriviative - at least on the surface... god only knows what lurks underneath the core of this decades musical perspectives. Im optimistic and confident we are at the beginning of a new musical era and deeply interested in making phat traks to move every butt on the planet :) Tom Tom Club, Talking Heads, GMF, Run DMC and The Police, and even New Order were at least to me what Dylan and Joni Mitchell were and still are to the 60's era hippified joint - like when it was comin up and out in real time. Kids today have no sense of an aesthetic vision that is uniquely theirs alone. Kids of the 90's are a complete blank pages. That's both a good and Bad thang. Now in fairness, I would also venture to bet ya 1 Million G'ees that someone in their late 20's lookin out at all that was happenin say between 80-84 would probably have the same sentiments that I'm expressin today in 98. As a culture (IMHO) we consume more and expect a lot less of Music today and are mostly numb to it ( cause we put it up in ya face everywhere - almost the point that music's presence is fairly disposable both for convenience and by personal necessity). It's simply a reflection of our comodity driven nature as a society. 28 means you are older but clearly not out of the count. Its also easy to dismiss a lot of interesting music because it smells like what we've seen time and time again. Remember Blank pages can be filled in any way they areneeded and or however they are chosen to be filled. And fortunately ( unfortunately - depending on ya slants ) we are witnessing accelerated cycles of Recycling and integration on many different Musical frontsI also firmly believe that Audience tastes while more disposable these days have become less rigid than what they were 10yrs ago. Now that's a beautiful thing and probably a good place to start chapter 1 of a new story to tell whether its guitar or synth driven. I have a hunch that new tales aint comin from the states - It will be Eastern Europe and Asian Countries (* new Freedoms old repressions and fresh perspectives are are a heady formula for new textures) I'll stop babbling. From ???@??? Thu Feb 12 20:03:44 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 12 17:10:35 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y39e7-000549-00; Thu, 12 Feb 1998 17:10:27 -0800 Message-ID: <41DE695CE6FCCF11AD1000805FCCF8EC56BB40@sf-01-msg.dns.microsoft.com> From: Tom Attix To: "'Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com'" Subject: RE: What does a Echo-plex cost? Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 16:42:48 -0800 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.1960.3) Resent-Message-ID: <"1Rwi-.A.y-D.-v540"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3221 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 17:10:27 -0800 X-UIDL: fac6f09a9c6ecffc6a53f8b6ba0142c6 Y'know whenever I hear someone say anything that starts with "Kid's today.." and then compares something current to something ten plus years old, I hear a cranky old man in 1967 ranting about "these goddam hippie kids" and "their horrible rock music" and "Frank Sinatra was good enough for us, dammit.." etc. If you want to compare any era of pop music to any other you have to remember all the crap, too. I seem to recall plenty of really bad music from all the eras you mention (can you say Dave Clark Five, how 'bout New Kids on the Block, think anybody will be playing Boston in 2098?). If your looking for inventive or just good pop music, how about Beck, Ween or Radiohead? Remember kids, never trust anyone over thirty... Tom the Cranky > -----Original Message----- > From: jprice@intcpi.com [SMTP:jprice@intcpi.com] > Sent: Thursday, February 12, 1998 3:44 PM > To: 'Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com' > Subject: RE: What does a Echo-plex cost? > > Doesn't it seem like musically we are somewhere between 1978 and 1980 all > over again ? > > The 90's have been overly derriviative - at least on the surface... god > only knows what lurks underneath the core of this decades musical > perspectives. > > Im optimistic and confident we are at the beginning of a new musical era > and deeply interested in making phat traks to move every butt on the > planet :-) > > > Tom Tom Club, Talking Heads, GMF, Run DMC and The Police, and even New > Order were at least to me what Dylan and Joni Mitchell were and still are > to the 60's era hippified joint - like when it was comin up and out in > real time. > > Kids today have no sense of an aesthetic vision that is uniquely theirs > alone. Kids of the 90's are a complete blank pages. That's both a good and > Bad thang. > > Now in fairness, I would also venture to bet ya 1 Million G'ees that > someone in their late 20's lookin out at all that was happenin say between > 80-84 would probably have the same sentiments that I'm expressin today in > 98. > > As a culture (IMHO) we consume more and expect a lot less of Music today > and are mostly numb to it ( cause we put it up in ya face everywhere - > almost the point that music's presence is fairly disposable both for > convenience and by personal necessity). It's simply a reflection of our > comodity driven nature as a society. > > 28 means you are older but clearly not out of the count. Its also easy to > dismiss a lot of interesting music because it smells like what we've seen > time and time again. Remember Blank pages can be filled in any way they > areare needed and or however they are chosen to be filled. And fortunately > ( unfortunately - depending on ya slants ) we are witnessing accelerated > cycles of Recycling and integration on many different Musical fronts. > > The days of the classic looper are gone but not forgotten and dead.Classic > Guitar loopists are still esential but more of a like Pat Boone compared > to say Its just that people always seem to want to > > I also firmly believe that Audience tastes while more disposable these > days have become less rigid than what they were 10yrs ago. Now that's a > beautiful thing and probably a good place to start chapter 1 of a new > story to tell whether its guitar or synth driven. > > I have a hunch that new tales aint comin from the states - It will be > Eastern Europe and Asian Countries (* new Freedoms old repressions and > fresh perspectives are are a heady formula for new textures) > > I'll stop babbling. > > From ???@??? Thu Feb 12 09:33:59 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 12 07:28:27 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y30Yo-0001r3-00; Thu, 12 Feb 1998 07:28:22 -0800 Message-Id: <3.0.1.16.19980212170212.285f69f2@rank-serv.elec.gla.ac.uk> X-Sender: pycraft@rank-serv.elec.gla.ac.uk X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.1 (16) Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 17:02:12 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: "Michael P. Hughes, Ph.D." Subject: Re: What does a Echo-plex cost? In-Reply-To: <98Feb12.085421cst.26887@gateway.gibson.com> References: <34E309F5.6509FA3C@scee.sony.co.uk> <98Feb12.083201cst.26886@gateway.gibson.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"vvadAD.A.gGB.UPx40"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3196 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 07:28:22 -0800 X-UIDL: fbf9aa58cb23af5029bc3a02e7f33fd7 Tom: >Well, umm, yeah actually they buy them a lot. We're still backordered and >dealers are ordering a dozen at a time. I agree it's not a delay...it's a >198 seconds (max) undoable real-time digital multitrack in a single rack >space with foot controls, reverse function that holds upto nine loops that >you can recall at any time. Plus a whole lot more...Considering you could >buy a vintage tube tape Echoplex for between $500-600, I think it's a >tremendous deal. It's sad to say, but I really can't see a lot of these shipping in the UK. There hasn't been any innovation in UK guitar (OK, at least not much) since Andy Summers arrived in the early 80s. People will pay for gear in Britain - just not much that's been invented less than 30 years ago. You don't need an EDP to play Oasis/Blur/etc/etc/etc..... os: >My point was mainly that in the UK we suffer from the 1 UKP == 1 dollar >problem, which makes things much more expensive. If the EDP comes out at >a properly exchange-rate-converted price (750 dollars == 450 pounds >approx) then that would be reasonable (though I'd still like a bit more >than 12s for that money). For point of comparrison everyone, the TC G-force goes for $1800 over here, ditto the Lex MP1. And that _is_ "street price", pretty much. About the only fiscal advantage for UK musicians is that Marshall are cheaper..! Michael From ???@??? Thu Feb 12 20:03:45 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 12 17:25:05 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y39s4-0006t3-00; Thu, 12 Feb 1998 17:24:52 -0800 From: Marzzz@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 20:14:59 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: stereo Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 82 Resent-Message-ID: <"Ue1xe.A.1fF.w7540"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3222 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 17:24:52 -0800 X-UIDL: bbe5784b0fa46303121e54477bdccdfb In a message dated 2/12/98 12:10:37 PM, Kim wrote: >of course, people complain a lot about how much the mono versions cost... a >stereo version at the time any of these were created would have cost a lot >more and generated a lot more whining. Yes, but considering that many effects devices sum a stereo signal or take a mono input, and then convert it to stereo, is a mono 'Plex really so terrible? If I had a stereo 'Plex I would want the ability to feed two mono signals into it and output two separate loops at the same time..... Marshall From ???@??? Thu Feb 12 20:03:46 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 12 17:30:38 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y39xc-0007bC-00; Thu, 12 Feb 1998 17:30:36 -0800 Message-ID: <19980213012040.1546.qmail@hotmail.com> X-Originating-IP: [204.74.108.99] From: "Joseph Buck" To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: RE: What does a Echo-plex cost? Content-Type: text/plain Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 17:20:40 PST Resent-Message-ID: <"bEg2KD.A.wFG.sA640"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3223 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 17:30:36 -0800 X-UIDL: aa8c76f371c9e50c1d3fdf9a75da253e Tom, Gibson Person- You trade um wompum for echo makey tool? Young Buck ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From ???@??? Thu Feb 12 20:03:47 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 12 17:47:26 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y3ADm-0001n6-00; Thu, 12 Feb 1998 17:47:18 -0800 Message-ID: <2148EC143F29D1118BE000805FC13CD01E1F7F@migarexch01.maritz.com> From: "Liebig, Steuart A." To: "'Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com'" Subject: RE: What does a Echo-plex cost? Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 19:38:58 -0600 X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) Resent-Message-ID: <"SkeGiD.A.My.mR640"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3224 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 17:47:18 -0800 X-UIDL: 257d65f115144e3fcf00b0c82d38610b Yeah, there's plenty o' crap in any given era of Pop music, and plenty of great stuff too. (same for what passes as Jazz, or Classical-who are some of Beethoven's contemporaies?) Sometimes by the same artists within a few years of different projects; or people who become solo artists after being in great bands. I think that the "problem" is that the REALLY big (and they keep getting bigger-look at the conglomerates that own record companys now) money interests have figured a way to coopt as much (youth) culture as possible, and as fast as possible, and use it for their commerical needs (yeah it happened in the '60s, but not so quickly). It seems that the half-life before something gets coopted becomes smaller and smaller. Such is the way of the world. If this works for you, that's cool. At this point in my life (being the old man on this rant so far -42), I opt for other experiences in addition to Pop (or what I consider Pop) music-like I said there's still some pretty great stuff out there. Mostly, for me, it's noise rock, avant jazz, raw blues and classical music-or music that somehow strives to combine facets of all of these things. I guess to me that it's looking outside of the usual places-and learning where to look. It's the excitement of discovery, and the cross-pollination with other people, when it comes to new stuff/experience. There are little pockets of interesting stuff everywhere (even here in LA). To borrow a Frippism (first and last time for me), "intelligent mobile units." Fight the Power indeed. Maybe it's a cultural guerilla war that need to be waged????? Keep your edge. Sign me: Out of the Loop (cultural), Younger than my 42 and more edgy than when I was 18. > ---------- > From: Tom Attix > Reply To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com > Sent: Thursday, February 12, 1998 5:10 PM > To: LiebigSA@maritz.com > Subject: RE: What does a Echo-plex cost? > > Y'know whenever I hear someone say anything that starts with "Kid's > today.." > and then compares something current to something ten plus years old, I > hear > a cranky old man in 1967 ranting about "these goddam hippie kids" and > "their > horrible rock music" and "Frank Sinatra was good enough for us, > dammit.." > etc. > If you want to compare any era of pop music to any other you have to > remember all the crap, too. I seem to recall plenty of really bad > music from > all the eras you mention (can you say Dave Clark Five, how 'bout New > Kids on > the Block, think anybody will be playing Boston in 2098?). If your > looking > for inventive or just good pop music, how about Beck, Ween or > Radiohead? > > Remember kids, never trust anyone over thirty... > > Tom the Cranky > > -----Original Message----- > > From: jprice@intcpi.com [SMTP:jprice@intcpi.com] > > Sent: Thursday, February 12, 1998 3:44 PM > > To: 'Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com' > > Subject: RE: What does a Echo-plex cost? > > > > Doesn't it seem like musically we are somewhere between 1978 and > 1980 all > > over again ? > > > > The 90's have been overly derriviative - at least on the surface... > god > > only knows what lurks underneath the core of this decades musical > > perspectives. > > > > Im optimistic and confident we are at the beginning of a new musical > era > > and deeply interested in making phat traks to move every butt on the > > planet :-) > > > > > > Tom Tom Club, Talking Heads, GMF, Run DMC and The Police, and even > New > > Order were at least to me what Dylan and Joni Mitchell were and > still are > > to the 60's era hippified joint - like when it was comin up and out > in > > real time. > > > > Kids today have no sense of an aesthetic vision that is uniquely > theirs > > alone. Kids of the 90's are a complete blank pages. That's both a > good and > > Bad thang. > > > > Now in fairness, I would also venture to bet ya 1 Million G'ees that > > someone in their late 20's lookin out at all that was happenin say > between > > 80-84 would probably have the same sentiments that I'm expressin > today in > > 98. > > > > As a culture (IMHO) we consume more and expect a lot less of Music > today > > and are mostly numb to it ( cause we put it up in ya face everywhere > - > > almost the point that music's presence is fairly disposable both > for > > convenience and by personal necessity). It's simply a reflection of > our > > comodity driven nature as a society. > > > > 28 means you are older but clearly not out of the count. Its also > easy to > > dismiss a lot of interesting music because it smells like what we've > seen > > time and time again. Remember Blank pages can be filled in any way > they > > areare needed and or however they are chosen to be filled. And > fortunately > > ( unfortunately - depending on ya slants ) we are witnessing > accelerated > > cycles of Recycling and integration on many different Musical > fronts. > > > > The days of the classic looper are gone but not forgotten and > dead.Classic > > Guitar loopists are still esential but more of a like Pat Boone > compared > > to say Its just that people always seem to want to > > > > I also firmly believe that Audience tastes while more disposable > these > > days have become less rigid than what they were 10yrs ago. Now > that's a > > beautiful thing and probably a good place to start chapter 1 of a > new > > story to tell whether its guitar or synth driven. > > > > I have a hunch that new tales aint comin from the states - It will > be > > Eastern Europe and Asian Countries (* new Freedoms old repressions > and > > fresh perspectives are are a heady formula for new textures) > > > > I'll stop babbling. > > > > At 6:34 PM -0800 2/12/98, Michael P. Hughes, Ph.D. wrote: > > >I'll admit a longing for the early days of the 80s when > experimentation was > >cool - the Police the Art of Noise, King Crimson. Nowadays most > popular > >music seems so ... old. And as regards guitar players, I find it sad > that > >most of my guitar "heroes" form two distinct sets - British from > pre-1980 > >(Summers, Fripp, Holdsworth, Mike Oldfield etc) and US post-1980 > (Torn, > >Frizell etc)... > > > >Michael > > > >Old beyond his 27 years. > > I think this is why I stopped listening to guitar oriented music. > Everything I hear, no matter what the style and who the player, leaves > me > with a feeling of "haven't I heard this already?" > > even older than my 28 years, > > kim > > From ???@??? Thu Feb 12 20:03:55 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 12 18:58:16 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y3BKP-00016q-00; Thu, 12 Feb 1998 18:58:13 -0800 Message-ID: <34E3B08E.3E3B@philerb.com> Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 18:31:42 -0800 From: Phil Erb X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: a suggestion for all References: <980212214526_1652642041@mrin52> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"oyo_l.A.vi.AX740"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3226 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 18:58:13 -0800 X-UIDL: 81121a9ae957b6aac2146fbbbebf871c I agree. From ???@??? Thu Feb 12 09:34:15 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 12 09:02:14 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y321a-0003Tm-00; Thu, 12 Feb 1998 09:02:10 -0800 Message-Id: <3.0.1.16.19980212183404.0c4f71ec@rank-serv.elec.gla.ac.uk> X-Sender: pycraft@rank-serv.elec.gla.ac.uk X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.1 (16) Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 18:34:04 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: "Michael P. Hughes, Ph.D." Subject: Re: What does a Echo-plex cost? In-Reply-To: <34E317B5.D8B5CB01@scee.sony.co.uk> References: <34E309F5.6509FA3C@scee.sony.co.uk> <98Feb12.083201cst.26886@gateway.gibson.com> <3.0.1.16.19980212170212.285f69f2@rank-serv.elec.gla.ac.uk> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"ZIOqTC.A.oVC.Qly40"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3202 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 09:02:10 -0800 X-UIDL: 398015dc0a557b5d916134695f1a49d4 >> It's sad to say, but I really can't see a lot of these shipping in the UK. >> There hasn't been any innovation in UK guitar (OK, at least not much) since >> Andy Summers arrived in the early 80s. People will pay for gear in Britain >> - just not much that's been invented less than 30 years ago. You don't >> need an EDP to play Oasis/Blur/etc/etc/etc..... >Curious that you assume that guitar players will determine the fate of >the EDP. Yes, quite wrong of me. I'm just guitar-centric since, uh, I play one. >I for one would use it with synths; a friend of mine loops with >piano (cf. Harold Budd); and any number of new-age types like to go >'oooh' into loopers as part of a performance (eg. Alquimia). >Trumpet/sax/clarinet also loop pleasingly. I'm sure they do; I'll admit I'm something of an old crusty when it comes to music. I'm sure that there is probably a mass market in the underground rave market (is that word passe yet?), but I'll admit not knowing a great deal about it - these bones weren't built for dancin'. I'll admit a longing for the early days of the 80s when experimentation was cool - the Police the Art of Noise, King Crimson. Nowadays most popular music seems so ... old. And as regards guitar players, I find it sad that most of my guitar "heroes" form two distinct sets - British from pre-1980 (Summers, Fripp, Holdsworth, Mike Oldfield etc) and US post-1980 (Torn, Frizell etc)... Michael Old beyond his 27 years. From ???@??? Thu Feb 12 20:03:54 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 12 18:51:10 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y3BDT-0000F6-00; Thu, 12 Feb 1998 18:51:03 -0800 Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 21:45:27 -0500 (EST) From: Monkici@aol.com Message-ID: <980212214526_1652642041@mrin52> To: loopers-delight@annihilist.com Subject: a suggestion for all Resent-Message-ID: <"anRr1D.A.eAH.HQ740"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3225 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 18:51:03 -0800 X-UIDL: 491eb7c0ec40db336ce6a50ab3c5dbe1 greetings all, first let me say how enjoyable and informative this list has been. thanks to Kim, Tom, Greg et al for keeping us on track and informed. however, could i please make a suggestion or two to the entire list? let's all be creative enough to think of subject title for these posts. i know it's easier to just reply, but i've read dozens of posts that have absolutely nothing to do with the subject heading on this list. when i open my box to see fifteen "RE: looping as sin" messages my inclination is to delete them all w/out reading them... i know that there may be things contained therein that may be interesting or relevant to me, but without a subject heading...who's to know? while i'm ranting, let's also not keep regurgitating old messages in our replies unless it's really relevant. am i the sole person who spends a great deal of time scrolling through stuff i've read half a dozen times? really it will save us all a lot of time and it seems just plain curteous... am i all wet? rich From ???@??? Thu Feb 12 20:04:00 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 12 19:42:17 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y3C0u-0005Jn-00; Thu, 12 Feb 1998 19:42:08 -0800 Message-ID: <34E3BFD1.75CE5B7E@mail.clt.bellsouth.net> Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 22:36:49 -0500 From: "Samuel D. Burns" Reply-To: usonian@bellsouth.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.02 [en]C-DIAL (Win95; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com" Subject: Carl Stone's Shing Kee Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"rJJGXD.A.xdE.NA840"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3228 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 19:42:08 -0800 X-UIDL: 2795898cb93d62b2d4afc7123c7a4a05 I just discovered this wonderful looping piece, and it probably old news to many of you (it was composed in 1986). I enjoy "composition"-long looping creations such as Lucier's I am Sitting in a Room, and Bryars' Jesus' Blood Never Failed Me Yet. I believe that Carl Stone's Shing Kee is in the same class as these masterworks in working with a single loop. Check it out...it is on a New Albion Records CD titled Mom's. Like many minimalist pieces, listen without judgment for the first two-thirds of the piece, then listen in amazement. Can anybody out there point me to released recordings of similar lengthy pieces (other than Reich's It's Going to Rain), or perhaps shed light on how Shing Kee was processed/composed? Samuel D. Burns usonian@bellsouth.net From ???@??? Thu Feb 12 20:04:01 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 12 19:49:51 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y3C8E-0006FG-00; Thu, 12 Feb 1998 19:49:42 -0800 Message-ID: <01BD3807.873E8570.douglas-lawrence@home.com> From: Douglas Lawrence Reply-To: "douglas-lawrence@home.com" To: "'Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com'" Subject: What instrument can you loop? Bass?!?! Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 22:42:40 -0500 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet E-mail/MAPI - 8.0.0.4211 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"LVQT5C.A.-3E.jD840"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3229 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 19:49:42 -0800 X-UIDL: 54813fcc2e354fe8d8fc2453008dfb48 >>kim wrote: >>you know, it just baffles me how looping gets so associated with guitar. >>(at least in some circles...) The sound going into the loop can be >>anything, where do people get the idea that its just a guitar effect? >>mystery..... Well, I'm a bass player not a guitar player. If you ever want to see a JamMan get a workout, go see Victor Wooten at one of his solo gigs. He and J.D. lay it down. It's definitely not based on "softly spinning layered textures of sound". It's more about groove, good ole funk, and incredible chops, which is not easy to tie together with a stomp box for timing the whole thing. I mostly use my Echoplex with a drum machine or with a live drummer. Its great live or just for practicing, especially with a six-string. Any other bass players out there? Doug. From ???@??? Thu Feb 12 21:12:59 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 12 20:42:21 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y3Cx4-0002tT-00; Thu, 12 Feb 1998 20:42:14 -0800 Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19980212223717.007cdb50@mail.nash.gibson.com> X-Sender: tspauldi@mail.nash.gibson.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 22:37:17 -0600 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: tspauldi@mail.nash.gibson.com Subject: RE: What does a Echo-plex cost? In-Reply-To: <19980213012040.1546.qmail@hotmail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"eXaVG.A.XBC.C3840"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3230 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 20:42:14 -0800 X-UIDL: e69e8f15d5c5789f2b27de0ae93f71b6 Wish I could, but I gots dealahs to think about... They are the nice chaps who ultimately take the biggest gamble...if you don't like something, you can always take it back to them, but once they buy it, it's theirs. I will try to get an up-to-date list of authorized stocking dealers to everyone soon. Thanks!! Tom "Kim and Matthias make strong Medicine" Spaulding At 07:20 PM 2/12/98 -0600, you wrote: > >Tom, Gibson Person- > >You trade um wompum for echo makey tool? > > >Young Buck > >______________________________________________________ >Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com > > > From ???@??? Thu Feb 12 21:13:13 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 12 20:57:01 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y3DBI-0004U8-00; Thu, 12 Feb 1998 20:56:56 -0800 Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19980212225351.007c12a0@mail.nash.gibson.com> X-Sender: tspauldi@mail.nash.gibson.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 22:53:51 -0600 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: tspauldi@mail.nash.gibson.com Subject: Re: another suggestion for all In-Reply-To: <980212214526_1652642041@mrin52> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/enriched; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"0lGcsD.A.ytD.PG940"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3231 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 20:56:56 -0800 X-UIDL: 4b4e61331526dfd03bade5cacf426197 Having been fortunate enough to hear Rich's album "Quiver", I suggest everyone on this list demand to be sold a copy. It has been in my CD drive for three days running, and is soothing my gaping soul. Absolutely gorgeous guitar tones, songs, vocals, the real deal. Makes me remember why I got into this whole scene in the first place. If I spent less time reading and listening to the works of others, how much more would my own be my own? Rich has his own. Ah,if only everything I do listen to was this good... Tom "Jus' settin' here testifyin'" Spaulding From ???@??? Thu Feb 12 20:03:14 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 12 12:28:51 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y35FS-0004im-00; Thu, 12 Feb 1998 12:28:42 -0800 Message-Id: <3.0.1.16.19980212215621.1a378b3c@rank-serv.elec.gla.ac.uk> X-Sender: pycraft@rank-serv.elec.gla.ac.uk X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.1 (16) Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 21:56:21 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: "Michael P. Hughes, Ph.D." Subject: Guitarists, looping, sneak Spice Girls reference! In-Reply-To: References: <34E317B5.D8B5CB01@scee.sony.co.uk> <34E309F5.6509FA3C@scee.sony.co.uk> <98Feb12.083201cst.26886@gateway.gibson.com> <3.0.1.16.19980212170212.285f69f2@rank-serv.elec.gla.ac.uk> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"tIODzB.A.mjD._m140"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3213 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 12:28:42 -0800 X-UIDL: 0c7839f70b74028b0013695e6597b53b Me: >>> It's sad to say, but I really can't see a lot of these shipping in the UK. >>> There hasn't been any innovation in UK guitar (OK, at least not much) since >>> Andy Summers arrived in the early 80s. People will pay for gear in Britain >>> - just not much that's been invented less than 30 years ago. You don't >>> need an EDP to play Oasis/Blur/etc/etc/etc..... Kim: >you know, it just baffles me how looping gets so associated with guitar. >(at least in some circles...) The sound going into the loop can be >anything, where do people get the idea that its just a guitar effect? >mystery..... As I say, I tend to listen to gtr-music, and associate the gtr with looping, because I'm a guitarist and that's the "mindset" I'm in. I used to listen to a lot more synth stuff before I took up ye olde plank. And UK "mainsteam" _is_ a lot more gtr-centric - I've found far more fellow guitarists in my travels than fellow synthists (yes, I had a Casio VZ1 for about 5 years). I do try to keep up with hte scene - if reading Sound on Sound counts as such - but sadly I will always belong to some strings on wood. I do listen to a lot of music form c1500-1600, but still think of the lute as a "guitar"... I have learnt some of that stuff in loop format btw. It's ideal. However, my wife is trying to persuade me to sell my Blade (owned 10 years - my baby!) and buy a Stick - "less competition"..... >I think this is why I stopped listening to guitar oriented music. >Everything I hear, no matter what the style and who the player, leaves me >with a feeling of "haven't I heard this already?" I'd say the new stuff is trailing off, but there are always players who inspire me - both Bill Frizell and David Torn (Yay dave!) are doing _new_ stuff that still has atmosphere and melody (ah, whither melody?). Some "old dinos" do produce great stuff - eg Fripp's (can I say that? :) League of Crafty's (hands up, participants!). Show of hands is one of my most prized CD's, and it's all on acoustics!!! And finally, a big word to the guys on this list - hearing Matthias' music, or California Andre, (and others! ond on other instruments too!) shows me just how much more there is to do on guitar. Bravo!! >even older than my 28 years, Surely "younger?" Been there, done that? The music for Generation Next? :) Michael PS An idea - innovation on the guitar usually follow as a reaction to the unpopularity of the instrument - eg. the early 80's, when we were advised to give up out strings and take to keys. At hte moment the guitar is in resurgence and everyone sounds like the Stones/Beatles/Kinks/Beach Boys. Perhaps with so much simple stuff going on, experimenters (BF, DT, Charle Hunter, Phil Degruy) get drowned out..... PPS Please forgive mis-spellings. I have a cold. ;) From ???@??? Thu Feb 12 20:03:15 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 12 12:30:01 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y35Gc-0004sN-00; Thu, 12 Feb 1998 12:29:54 -0800 Message-Id: <3.0.1.16.19980212220129.1a377a2a@rank-serv.elec.gla.ac.uk> X-Sender: pycraft@rank-serv.elec.gla.ac.uk X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.1 (16) Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 22:01:29 To: David Kirkdorffer From: "Michael P. Hughes, Ph.D." Subject: Re: cost of UK outboard gear` Cc: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"lO_FT.A.LsD.Co140"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3214 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 12:29:54 -0800 X-UIDL: 8ca2f994a577dac81316cdceee9809c8 DAvid K: >Question: >Is the UK price of this outboard gear (Lex, TC etc.,) in the same price >league as the modern synthesizers and computer oriented music >technology? Answer: I couldn't say - I don't have my SoS to hand and haven't bought a synth in years :( I'll try and bring in a copy and post tomorrow. If it's any help, the MC303 was about $6-700 'till quite recently (I THINK). >If so, there may lie the answer - in many ways outboard gear is less >versatile that synths and computer music technology - and folks are >going for the bigger bang for money spent. We could look at guitars - probably the biggest mass-market instrument. What's the "street price" of a Gibson LP or Fender Strat? Over here you're looking at maybe $1800/$1000. How does that compare? Michael From ???@??? Thu Feb 12 20:03:16 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 12 13:01:16 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y35ku-0000MN-00; Thu, 12 Feb 1998 13:01:12 -0800 Message-Id: <3.0.1.16.19980212223410.1a3710c6@rank-serv.elec.gla.ac.uk> X-Sender: pycraft@rank-serv.elec.gla.ac.uk X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.1 (16) Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 22:34:10 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: "Michael P. Hughes, Ph.D." Subject: RE: looping as sin In-Reply-To: <1.5.4.32.19980211034539.006825d8@tiac.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"uquYJ.A.W4G.NG240"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3215 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 13:01:12 -0800 X-UIDL: 2703deb179000b7e7ba6a53cb60dfa18 At 10:45 PM 2/10/98 -0500, you wrote: > >Reg > >>Sure; looped noodles can be inspiring (as well as the name of a tasty >>Chinese meal...?), but I feel that often we loopers are all too willing to >>do our trial-and-error compositions in public. >Artists of many mediums fall prey to that temptation. Unfortunately, >observing a great experimenter can give the false sense that it is from the >nature of experimentation that the greatness comes. I seem to remember a quote from one of the Grateful Dead: "We made it up as we went along; some nights it was great, some nights it sucked" (I'm paraphrasing). Problem is, some people paid to see them suck. Perhaps musicians have a responsibility to prepare "just in case" - so that even if you're not hitting a high (so to speak) the audience are at least garuanteed a good night out, which is what they've paid for. Some musicians _do_ play experimental music to receptive audiences (I'm thinking here of the mythical NY loft scene) - but if that's what the audences are getting, they should be warned. YOu don't go to a play expecting to be told that the company are about to make it up as they go along, but if you're forwarned (isn't there a bamous Boston/Chicago comedic improv theatre), it can be wonderful. Michael (Ranting away - sorry!) From ???@??? Fri Feb 13 11:15:03 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 13 11:03:41 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y3QOZ-0006Kv-00; Fri, 13 Feb 1998 11:03:31 -0800 Mime-Version: 1.0 Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 09:43:10 +0300 Message-ID: <0000AFA0.4007@poyry.com.br> From: miguel.barella@poyry.com.br (MAT) Subject: Re: Guitarists, looping, sneak Spice Girls reference! To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com, "Michael P. Hughes; Ph.D." Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Description: cc:Mail note part Resent-Message-ID: <"cr0JNB.A.LuE.AaJ50"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3247 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 11:03:31 -0800 X-UIDL: 1bebf0daf77cdaf7d3a6aac87fc0466f >you know, it just baffles me how looping gets so associated with guitar. >(at least in some circles...) I think this is because of the fact that you can make a guitar sound very different using only a delay, distortion and volume padal. I remember in the early 80's during sound checks I used to make "sound carpets" with this limited gear and everybody was amazed. Today with JamMan, Plex, Vortex, MIDI etc. its possible to really extrapolate and the audience will still be watching a "guitar player" and asking "how does he sound like this with just a guitar?". If you use a keyboard synth peolple will not notice you are looping because "a synth is expected to do funny sounds". Miguel From ???@??? Fri Feb 13 01:13:14 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 12 23:56:50 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y3FzL-0000q2-00; Thu, 12 Feb 1998 23:56:47 -0800 Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 01:58:52 -0600 From: John Pollock Subject: Re: those pesky trademarks To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Message-id: <34E3FD3C.5C92@delphi.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win95; I) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit References: <19980212171845.9713.qmail@omni1.voicenet.com> Resent-Message-ID: <"EekKJ.A.Gh.fw_40"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3232 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 23:56:47 -0800 X-UIDL: cb6d5454cc0ea89296951967dac2773e floyd@voicenet.com wrote: > For that matter, groupt like the Drifters were harmonizing way back > in the '50s. Monteverdi, Palestrina, Bull... From ???@??? Fri Feb 13 01:13:24 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 13 01:00:10 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y3Gyd-0004K4-00; Fri, 13 Feb 1998 01:00:07 -0800 From: ENAT21213@aol.com Message-ID: <5ea2c29.34e40ac4@aol.com> Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 03:56:34 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: a suggestion for all Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 16-bit for Windows sub 58 Resent-Message-ID: <"HbBtlC.A.G2D.MsA50"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3233 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 01:00:07 -0800 X-UIDL: d5051923e86e783889c544f65e6fb041 trees are green From ???@??? Fri Feb 13 10:47:32 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 13 07:42:25 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y3NFs-0000Av-00; Fri, 13 Feb 1998 07:42:20 -0800 Message-ID: <34E42415.3D3A@nyfac.com> Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 10:44:37 +0000 From: tbajus Reply-To: nyfac2@nyfac.com X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (WinNT; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: What does a Echo-plex cost? References: <19980213012040.1546.qmail@hotmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"vNDQYB.A.pAH._jG50"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3236 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 07:42:20 -0800 X-UIDL: dc934a021e70eec79b9be155ea0864c8 Joseph Buck wrote: > > Tom, Gibson Person- > > You trade um wompum for echo makey tool? > > Young Buck > > ______________________________________________________ > Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com This made me laugh out loud for at least five minutes. Thank you. Trev From ???@??? Fri Feb 13 10:47:34 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 13 07:47:40 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y3NKy-0000qL-00; Fri, 13 Feb 1998 07:47:36 -0800 Message-ID: <34E424BA.D1F@nyfac.com> Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 10:47:22 +0000 From: tbajus Reply-To: nyfac2@nyfac.com X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (WinNT; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: a suggestion for all References: <980212214526_1652642041@mrin52> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"1gu8EC.A.SD.omG50"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3237 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 07:47:36 -0800 X-UIDL: edd69bae7b3dfa70fd81a0e7b07b5994 > while i'm ranting, let's also not keep regurgitating old messages in our > replies unless it's really relevant. am i the sole person who spends a great > deal of time scrolling through stuff i've read half a dozen times? really it > will save us all a lot of time and it seems just plain curteous... > > am i all wet? > > rich No, I don't think so. I don't think it necesary to include quotes from th last ten messages, but it is nice to see what you are referencing. So keep the important bits. Trev From ???@??? Fri Feb 13 10:47:39 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 13 08:03:28 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y3NaB-0002SY-00; Fri, 13 Feb 1998 08:03:19 -0800 Message-ID: <34E42903.4A68@nyfac.com> Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 11:05:39 +0000 From: tbajus Reply-To: nyfac2@nyfac.com X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (WinNT; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: DON'T GO SEE A LIVE BAND -- YOU'LL BE BORED!!! References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"Uw9kZC.A.95B.r3G50"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3239 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 08:03:19 -0800 X-UIDL: e9585cb18ff49c2ef90d518d162edc05 David Kirkdorffer wrote: > > I know SO MANY PEOPLE who feel this way. I think it's part of > why - at least in Boston - live music venues are shrinking or closing. > Less people are going out to see bands - I think they feel they're not > going to see anything new. They're mostly right. > Throw your cellos away, ladies, classical music is long dead. And forget singing! Why people have been doing that since the dawm of time. Sweet Jesu! I hear even Fripp is sick of it. :) I think that as far as performances go, what keeps a lot of people from coming out is that they are not (imagine italics) hearing something new. This is one of the reasons I fled Philadelphia screaming for New York. I watched club after club after club close down, going from something like seven clubs and an auditorium on South Street, to just an auditorium. Meanwhile, the grotesqueness they call Delaware Ave sprouted one MacDanceclub after another, featuring, guess what, cover bands! I have a theory about why there seems to be such a disproportionately large chunk of Philly Loopers: They have to be self-sufficient. Good God, I think I have broken out into a sweat. No offence to the Philly crew- I am a Philly boy to the end. I am somewhat scarred by the five years of constantly auditioning for bands and watching the other people scratch their heads, look at me, and say 'Well, that sure is interesting, but it's not really what we are after. Can you turn off all your pedals and play a few Rolling Stones licks?' Trev From ???@??? Fri Feb 13 10:47:41 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 13 08:13:38 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y3Nk7-0003k3-00; Fri, 13 Feb 1998 08:13:35 -0800 Message-ID: <34E42AA5.58E7@nyfac.com> Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 11:12:37 +0000 From: tbajus Reply-To: nyfac2@nyfac.com X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (WinNT; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Promoting my band References: <009701bd3893$5f31f760$c2b854ce@mark.asisoftware.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"t8BjvD.A.atC.W-G50"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3241 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 08:13:35 -0800 X-UIDL: 78c9a59083851c5da36477870d3e3efb Here is a shameless plug- One of my bands, Hayseed, a completely loop-free band, is playing at Brownies this month on the 25th @ $9:30. There is no loopage, it is true, but you listen to my impersonation of Marc Ribot as the second guitar player in Crazy Horse as led by the bastard love child of Kristen Hersh and Jay Ferrar. To make matters worse, I have a B- & G- bender on my telecaster, so I can sound just like a pedal steel being played by somebody who is drinking to much to get over their stroke. If that doesn't pique your interest, many people say our bass player looks astonishingly sexy on stage. She's single, boys! Trev From ???@??? Fri Feb 13 22:27:38 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 13 16:18:25 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y3VJD-00023b-00; Fri, 13 Feb 1998 16:18:19 -0800 Message-Id: <199802140010.SAA23071@mail.tds.net> From: "Bruce Gerow" To: Subject: Electro Harmonix Stuff FS Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 06:31:47 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1161 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"rZz8M.A._AB.nDO50"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3265 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 16:18:19 -0800 X-UIDL: d1e79d12d05d74f42109da424c8f551c I hope this isn't too off topic but I thought some of the guitarists here might want to know about these: My friend has the following Electro Harmonix stomp boxes for sale: Bass Balls Small Clone Small Stone Digital Rhythm Matrix You can call him at 315-363-7470 Ask for Tony.This # is in Oneida NY.If this is hard then Email me and I'll try to get info for you. Todays date 2/13/98 "Be Careful,It's a city out there" From ???@??? Fri Feb 13 10:47:47 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 13 08:52:35 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y3OLn-0007af-00; Fri, 13 Feb 1998 08:52:31 -0800 Message-ID: <34E4347C.1B36@nyfac.com> Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 11:54:36 +0000 From: tbajus Reply-To: nyfac2@nyfac.com X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (WinNT; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Why Looping is so popular with Guitarists?? References: <199802131642.JAA01410@hyper.dimensional.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"ksMGbB.A.rrG.llH50"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3243 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 08:52:31 -0800 X-UIDL: 228637110aa73591056ceae147ce0a38 Because we don't have sequencers. At least, that is why I have mine. Trevor From ???@??? Fri Feb 13 10:47:48 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 13 09:00:23 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y3OTM-0000mI-00; Fri, 13 Feb 1998 09:00:20 -0800 Message-ID: <34E4360B.7523@nyfac.com> Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 12:01:15 +0000 From: tbajus Reply-To: nyfac2@nyfac.com X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (WinNT; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Promoting my own damned band References: <009701bd3893$5f31f760$c2b854ce@mark.asisoftware.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"OCCy0.A.hJ.7rH50"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3244 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 09:00:20 -0800 X-UIDL: a8cf38231654dcf346f17b8732a66237 Here is a shameless plug- One of my bands, Hayseed, is playing at Brownies (NYC most beloved live music venue) this month on the 25th@ $9:30. There is a cover, it is true, but you listen to my impersonation of the bastard love child of Kristin Hersh and Marc Ribot as the second guitar player in Crazy Horse as led by the bastard love child of Kristin Hersh and Jay Ferrar (which would make the bastard love children half brothers, would it?). To make matters worse, I have a B- & G- bender on my telecaster, so I can sound just like a pedal steel being played by somebody who is drinking to much to get over their stroke. If that doesn't pique your interest, many people say our bass player looks astonishingly sexy on stage. (Not to mention, of course, yours truely's catlike grace, prowling about on stage.) Trev From ???@??? Fri Feb 13 22:26:51 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 13 11:17:23 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y3Qbi-0000EO-00; Fri, 13 Feb 1998 11:17:06 -0800 Message-ID: <34E4549D.1F9@nyfac.com> Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 14:11:41 +0000 From: tbajus Reply-To: nyfac2@nyfac.com X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (WinNT; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Don't go see..... Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"nsDvyC.A.nNG.NmJ50"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3249 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 11:17:06 -0800 X-UIDL: 577c6ba6b102746d4a8df84a36b73dd8 Some of you may be thinking, this doesn't make any sense. An you would be right: "I think that as far as performances go, what keeps a lot of people from coming out is that they are not (imagine italics) hearing something new." should read: "I think that as far as performances go, what brings a lot of people out to see a show is that they will (imagine italics) not (imagine italics) hearing something new. They want to see the same crap recycled, or better still, a cover band." Sorry about that. I was trying to type that out quickly before my boss caught me goofing off again. Trev From ???@??? Fri Feb 13 10:47:24 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 13 07:05:52 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y3MgY-0004qc-00; Fri, 13 Feb 1998 07:05:50 -0800 Message-ID: From: David Kirkdorffer To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: DON'T GO SEE A LIVE BAND -- YOU'LL BE BORED!!! Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 10:01:15 -0500 X-Priority: 3 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) Content-Type: text/plain Resent-Message-ID: <"vjowUC.A.3PE.jCG50"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3234 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 07:05:50 -0800 X-UIDL: 69f9390d8af3831ec65e2f3078020eba I know SO MANY PEOPLE who feel this way. I think it's part of why - at least in Boston - live music venues are shrinking or closing. Less people are going out to see bands - I think they feel they're not going to see anything new. They're mostly right. And yet - at least in Boston - seems club-booking personnel are a little fearful of bring in stuff that seems too esoteric. Music "Scenes" are so fractured and sub-fractured - it's hard to know what will appeal to a wide enough scope of tastes. Also, I think it's true that there are other things people can do with there time now. Anyway, this is getting off-topic. To reel it back in, how about a question: *What can we Loopers do to help promote our live and recorded performances??* David - I Like asking questions - Kirkdorffer Kim mentions... I think this is why I stopped listening to guitar oriented music. Everything I hear, no matter what the style and who the player, leaves me with a feeling of "haven't I heard this already?" even older than my 28 years, kim ______________________________________________________________________ Kim Flint | Looper's Delight kflint@annihilist.com | http://www.annihilist.com/loop/loop.html http://www.annihilist.com/ | Loopers-Delight-request@annihilist.com From ???@??? Fri Feb 13 22:27:51 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 13 16:49:29 1998 Received: from kiwi.slip.net (kiwi) [207.171.193.11] by ferret.slip.net with smtp (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y3Vms-0005PO-00; Fri, 13 Feb 1998 16:48:58 -0800 Received: from jpccmail.poyry.com.br [200.246.136.18] by kiwi with smtp (Exim 1.70 #1) id 0y3Vmk-000312-00; Fri, 13 Feb 1998 16:48:55 -0800 Received: from ccMail by jpccmail.poyry.com.br (IMA Internet Exchange 2.12 Enterprise) id 0000B02C; Fri, 13 Feb 1998 18:29:05 +0300 Mime-Version: 1.0 Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 18:22:23 +0300 Message-ID: <0000B02C.4007@poyry.com.br> From: miguel.barella@poyry.com.br (MAT) Subject: Re[2]: why do people think looping is just for guitar? To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com, Kim Flint Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Description: cc:Mail note part X-UIDL: 8d95fe3532393949c1d5877b03b12d40 To me, using real-time loops for percussion or cello or radio transmissions or whatever seems just as valid. Why don't other people see it that way? What do we do to change that perception? kim ============================ Although I am a guitar player I recorded many loop pieces in the 80's with percussion, noises etc. No guitars. I fell guitarrists are more gear oriented because they/we have an historical need to change the sound produced by guitar+amp. This does not happen with a synth player as the instrument has more sound possibilities (so they don't spend time with extra gear and tend not to "look outside"). For purely acoustic instruments there are more complicated things involved (and more money): they need a mic, mixer, loop device etc. Maybe it is properly resumed in tradition: - guitarrists are involved with pedals/racks etc. as soon as they buy the first instrument. For them the second purchase is an effect; if they are curious enough they will meet the long delay/loop gear very soon. - keyboard player normally have enough with the keyboard itself and the second purchase will be a MIDI software, board etc. - for the acoustic players, well you can imagine how complicated it gets and the ammount of money involved. Miguel From ???@??? Fri Feb 13 22:28:04 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 13 17:03:26 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y3W0g-00079L-00; Fri, 13 Feb 1998 17:03:14 -0800 Mime-Version: 1.0 Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 18:22:23 +0300 Message-ID: <0000B02C.4007@poyry.com.br> From: miguel.barella@poyry.com.br (MAT) Subject: Re[2]: why do people think looping is just for guitar? To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com, Kim Flint Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Description: cc:Mail note part Resent-Message-ID: <"yDs_7.A.KIF.ToO50"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3270 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 17:03:14 -0800 X-UIDL: 764ae1b51551d5ad315700f4b4d40479 To me, using real-time loops for percussion or cello or radio transmissions or whatever seems just as valid. Why don't other people see it that way? What do we do to change that perception? kim ============================ Although I am a guitar player I recorded many loop pieces in the 80's with percussion, noises etc. No guitars. I fell guitarrists are more gear oriented because they/we have an historical need to change the sound produced by guitar+amp. This does not happen with a synth player as the instrument has more sound possibilities (so they don't spend time with extra gear and tend not to "look outside"). For purely acoustic instruments there are more complicated things involved (and more money): they need a mic, mixer, loop device etc. Maybe it is properly resumed in tradition: - guitarrists are involved with pedals/racks etc. as soon as they buy the first instrument. For them the second purchase is an effect; if they are curious enough they will meet the long delay/loop gear very soon. - keyboard player normally have enough with the keyboard itself and the second purchase will be a MIDI software, board etc. - for the acoustic players, well you can imagine how complicated it gets and the ammount of money involved. Miguel From ???@??? Fri Feb 13 10:47:27 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 13 07:25:38 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y3Mzg-0006U7-00; Fri, 13 Feb 1998 07:25:36 -0800 Message-ID: <009701bd3893$5f31f760$c2b854ce@mark.asisoftware.com> From: Mark@asisoftware.com (Mark Kata) To: "Loopers Delight" Subject: Promoting Looping Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 10:23:44 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0094_01BD3869.762994C0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Resent-Message-ID: <"_g37UB.A.QwF.5UG50"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3235 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 07:25:36 -0800 X-UIDL: 3231ef8332e5d1675c04b4f640de12db

David,
 
There are lots of books on how to promote music, but it occured to me that Yahoo doesn't have a "Looping" category.  Maybe this would help.  At least we'd have a centralized place on the web.
 
Mark Kata
From ???@??? Fri Feb 13 10:47:35 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 13 07:50:47 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y3NNx-0001ER-00; Fri, 13 Feb 1998 07:50:41 -0800 Message-ID: From: David Kirkdorffer To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Why Looping is so popular with Guitarists?? Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 10:42:44 -0500 X-Priority: 3 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) Content-Type: text/plain Resent-Message-ID: <"NXJUcD.A.ha.bpG50"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3238 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 07:50:41 -0800 X-UIDL: c9953a892de7ab6a900d7bb5d79d355f I think the reason you see so many guitarists associated with Looping is simple - there are so many guitarists. I mean, look at an average band. They'll have TWO guitarists, one singer, one bassist and one drummer. One in 6 bands may have a keyboard player. To make the point another way, I think there must be a 5:1 ratio of guitar magazines to compared to other publications focusing on other instruments. Also, maybe there's a stronger tradition of guitarists buying effects to do stuff to their sound than keyboard players (who get more choices in a single synth than a guitarist can dream of with a wall of rack-mount gear). It may not be anything more than a numbers game. d -----Original Message----- From: Kim Flint [SMTP:kflint@annihilist.com] Sent: Thursday, February 12, 1998 12:54 PM To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: What does a Echo-plex cost? At 3:39 PM +0000 2/12/98, Os wrote: >Michael P. Hughes, Ph.D. wrote: > >> It's sad to say, but I really can't see a lot of these shipping in the UK. >> There hasn't been any innovation in UK guitar (OK, at least not much) since >> Andy Summers arrived in the early 80s. People will pay for gear in Britain >> - just not much that's been invented less than 30 years ago. You don't >> need an EDP to play Oasis/Blur/etc/etc/etc..... > >Curious that you assume that guitar players will determine the fate of >the EDP. I for one would use it with synths; a friend of mine loops with >piano (cf. Harold Budd); and any number of new-age types like to go >'oooh' into loopers as part of a performance (eg. Alquimia). >Trumpet/sax/clarinet also loop pleasingly. you know, it just baffles me how looping gets so associated with guitar. (at least in some circles...) The sound going into the loop can be anything, where do people get the idea that its just a guitar effect? mystery..... kim ______________________________________________________________________ Kim Flint | Looper's Delight kflint@annihilist.com | http://www.annihilist.com/loop/loop.html http://www.annihilist.com/ | Loopers-Delight-request@annihilist.com From ???@??? Fri Feb 13 10:47:40 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 13 08:09:11 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y3Nfj-0003BT-00; Fri, 13 Feb 1998 08:09:03 -0800 Sender: jfm3@ix.netcom.com Message-ID: <34E46EED.66E863A1@rci.rutgers.edu> Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 11:03:57 -0500 From: Joe Miklojcik Organization: Rutgers University ACS X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.0.30 i686) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Why Looping is so popular with Guitarists?? References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"Kmh-qD.A.oQC.w6G50"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3240 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 08:09:03 -0800 X-UIDL: 4925b981e8dd7a3d097c4e9dad968e06 > Also, maybe there's a stronger tradition of guitarists buying effects to > do stuff to their sound than keyboard players (who get more choices in a > single synth than a guitarist can dream of with a wall of rack-mount > gear). As a synthesist, I look at an electric Guitar as a good, inexpensive, six-voice (give or take) analog synthesizer... (jfm3) [P.S. That doesn't let you off the hook! STEREO dammit!] From ???@??? Fri Feb 13 10:47:46 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 13 08:43:16 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y3OCk-0006YH-00; Fri, 13 Feb 1998 08:43:10 -0800 Message-Id: <199802131642.JAA01410@hyper.dimensional.com> From: "Scott Bullerwell" To: Subject: Re: Why Looping is so popular with Guitarists?? Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 09:36:24 -0700 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"anmdUB.A.apF.pcH50"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3242 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 08:43:10 -0800 X-UIDL: 068e28bf6e2deb7d95d5a21a49c4103f David Kirkdorffer notes: > I think the reason you see so many guitarists associated with Looping is > simple - there are so many guitarists. Y'know, the first two actual loopers I ever met were a 'cellist and a guy who plays the sackbut or somesuch in an early music ensemble. I wonder how much one's instrument influences one's approach to looping. [If all you have is a Hamer, everything looks like a nail? geddit? oof, sorry!] And I wonder how much looping technology influences one's approach to looping. There's some weird compartmentalization going on too: I have noticed that some people who wouldn't be able to function (compositionally or performance-wise) in a traditional ensemble can SHINE with a looper, while people who otherwise can compose interesting songs and improvise compelling solos that take your consciousness on The Big Journey, and who can dish out evocative textures and moods and not leave a dry seat in the house--aren't necessarily gonna pull it off with a looper. Is the technology limiting in itself? Or do these expensive little boxes just ooze menace like parochial school nuns and make your brain and hands freeze up? (I'm inclined to think that any technology is simultaneously liberating and limiting--it frees us up to want more than we have.) Is there a bizarro world Scott whose muse isn't afraid of the big bad loop? Will an "UNDO" function make me free? Or am I doomed to go back to the UNDO button again and again like some poor sinner who just can't give up the Seven Deadlies (out of tune, ahead of cue, behind cue, missed a note, wrong note, too fast, too slow). Scott Bullerwell tanelorn@dimensional.com Boulder, Colorado USA From ???@??? Fri Feb 13 10:47:55 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 13 09:46:25 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y3PBr-0005V4-00; Fri, 13 Feb 1998 09:46:19 -0800 Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 12:40:38 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <199802131740.MAA12030@user1.channel1.com> X-Sender: seahorse@user1.channel1.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Frank Gerace Subject: Re: DON'T GO SEE A LIVE BAND -- YOU'LL BE BORED!!! Resent-Message-ID: <"sjO7p.A.rjE.kWI50"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3245 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 09:46:19 -0800 X-UIDL: f30312cff1ba0335e058efe23809b1fb Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 12:29:30 To: nyfac2@nyfac.com From: Frank Gerace Subject: Re: DON'T GO SEE A LIVE BAND -- YOU'LL BE BORED!!! At 11:05 AM 2/13/98 +0000, you wrote: >David Kirkdorffer wrote: >> >> I know SO MANY PEOPLE who feel this way. I think it's part of >> why - at least in Boston - live music venues are shrinking or closing. >> Less people are going out to see bands - I think they feel they're not >> going to see anything new. They're mostly right. >> Another reason clubs are closing is that a lot of people don't feel like going to smoke-filled bars to hear their music. 'The sound live isn't as nice as the CD on their stereo, blah-blah-blah'. This also ties into the drinking age argument and musicians as liqour salespeople arguments. Many people I know, as they get older, (most of my friends get older) are trying to quit smoking, stop drinking etc. Aside from that. on the artistic side.... I think a lot of bands/musicians aren't "entertaining". The music may be great, but more people talk about going to "see" a band than going to "hear" a band. Many non-musicians are looking to be entertained, not enlightened. Please note, this is not a value judgement on my part, just an observation. If I like the music, performer or whatever, I make an efoort to go (despite my asthmatic lungs' aversion to smoke filled bars). > >I think that as far as performances go, what keeps a lot of people from >>coming out is that they are not (imagine italics) hearing something >>new. I agree in part. However, some people like to hear the same old stuff over and over again and go out to get their fill. Frustrating for artists trying something new, but a fact of life none the less. And, a lot of people like to go out to dance, both in dance clubs with DJs and clubs with more dance oriented bands. The demographics seem to imply that going out to dance is a bigger trend than going out to hear some 'new' music. That doesn't mean no one goes to hear music, just not as many folks do. Why all these options can't co-exist (there are loopers in all different genres) and make money for the respective artists/performers and venues is a mystery to me. Most clubs here (Boston) have around a $5.00 cover. That's cheaper than a movie ticket (although more than a video rental)! I agree that club owners/bookers are notorious for booking "safe" acts for their clubs and musicians are aware of that. The downside of all this "treat your band as a business because it is" ideology is that bands start to view the audience in the same narrow framework the club management does. Having a scene to be part of and a club that's the focal point for it has its advantages to both fan and performer. A built-in sympathetic audience, place to play, etc. The problem seems to be the scenes are all too narrow in their focus. It's time to infiltrate the scenes and subvert the genres by expanding them. Open things out instead of staying within the boundaries. Frank Dreamchild > > From ???@??? Fri Feb 13 10:47:57 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 13 09:55:37 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y3PKo-0006ab-00; Fri, 13 Feb 1998 09:55:34 -0800 Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 12:51:29 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <199802131751.MAA13353@user1.channel1.com> X-Sender: seahorse@user1.channel1.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Frank Gerace Subject: Re: Why Looping is so popular with Guitarists?? Resent-Message-ID: <"ZVIdHB.A.LyF.6gI50"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3246 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 09:55:34 -0800 X-UIDL: 7e710b1b83f1cbd2b2c98d0c2137e432 At 09:36 AM 2/13/98 -0700, you wrote: > >David Kirkdorffer notes: > >> I think the reason you see so many guitarists associated with Looping is >> simple - there are so many guitarists. > agreed >I wonder how much one's instrument influences one's approach to looping. >[If all you have is a Hamer, everything looks like a nail? geddit? oof, >sorry!] And I wonder how much looping technology influences one's approach >to looping. A great deal of truth in this for me. I started looping with a JamMan and find as I use /explore my EDP,I'm using it as a second JamMan. I'm only slowly coming to terms with the real differences (other than REVERSE and UNDO). The music is starting to change as I grow into the Echoplex. I find its great having both to work with, and running one loop to the left and one to the right of the mix wihile soloing in the middle with a stereo ping-ponging delay keeps me delerious for hours. Frank Dreamchild From ???@??? Fri Feb 13 11:15:04 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 13 11:03:55 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y3QOq-0006N7-00; Fri, 13 Feb 1998 11:03:48 -0800 Message-Id: <98Feb13.134744est.18818@thicket.arbortext.com> Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 13:44:47 -0500 From: David White Reply-To: dwhite@arbortext.com Organization: Arbortext Inc. X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (WinNT; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: DON'T GO SEE A LIVE BAND -- YOU'LL BE BORED!!! References: <199802131740.MAA12030@user1.channel1.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"V--q8.A.mwE.SaJ50"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3248 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 11:03:48 -0800 X-UIDL: e8e1f89ccb231ae1ce0b861f4dc6fdcd The following is a rant. The basic premise is: Respect your audience, do your best to make them happy. If you're playing out live for your own bad self, then you deserve an audience of 1. I (and all, I repeat ALL of my music loving friends) are in the category of folks who rarely go see live music anymore (compared to my younger days of 2-3 nights a week). I'll happily listen to one or two mediocre bands if I don't have to put up with the BS. My reasons for not going to see music has little to do with how good or bad the music is. My complaints with live music have not changed since my very first show: Clubs start bands too late: 11:00 - 11:30 is too late to start bands. London starts early and closes early and the bars still make money and probably a good deal more money then a comparable bar in the U.S. Local/small acts (or large well known acts for that matter) take too dang long to set up and get started: tune before you go on, and start when you're set up. I absolutely hate (and always have) waiting around for a band to start for no good reason. No one, I REPEAT, NO ONE likes to wait. When your set is done, tear down and get off the stage. Do not get a beer, chat with your friends for a half hour, nip out for a j, pass go or collect two hundred dollars (at least not of my money). If your band is next, then get set up and start playing. You are not God. I've never heard of you before (like most people in the audience), and you have not earned the right to waste my time. I'm not interested in how cool you are. Play your songs and impress me, otherwise I'm leaving. The Sound sucks (is too loud, bassy, tinny, etc.) Hire the best soundperson you can afford. Don't let your brother run sound just because he's got a four track. A lot of college clubs have decent sound systems and it's not that tough to get an acceptable sound. If your running sound and someone in the crowd makes a suggestion, at least consider it. They may be dumber then you, but they are the paying customer (they spoke up which means they care about it)- and sometimes they might be a whole lot smarter then you. I know paying the soundman more then the band makes - sucks. I've been there. But if the point is to make money then your best bet is to let people hear the music you want them to enjoy so they'll tell two friends .... Then you'll have a big enough audience to pay the band better then the sound person Smokers suck. They do, it's just a fact of life. You have to suck to enjoy a cigarette. I'll put up with a little smoke if the person smoking the cigarette doesn't hold the thing in my face when they're not toking. Hey, it's your cigarette, if you don't want the smoldering hunk of stench in your face what makes you think I want it in mine? If you got this far, thanks for listening. I don't expect this will have any impact on a single performer, but I feel better. d/-\\/e Frank Gerace wrote: > At 11:05 AM 2/13/98 +0000, you wrote: > >David Kirkdorffer wrote: > >> > >> I know SO MANY PEOPLE who feel this way. I think it's part of > >> why - at least in Boston - live music venues are shrinking or closing. > >> Less people are going out to see bands - I think they feel they're not > >> going to see anything new. They're mostly right. > >> > Another reason clubs are closing is that a lot of people don't feel > like going to smoke-filled bars to hear their music. 'The sound live isn't > as nice as the CD on their stereo, blah-blah-blah'. This also ties into the > drinking age argument and musicians as liqour salespeople arguments. Many > people I know, as they get older, (most of my friends get older) are trying > to quit smoking, stop drinking etc. > From ???@??? Fri Feb 13 22:27:01 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 13 12:11:01 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y3RRm-0006ce-00; Fri, 13 Feb 1998 12:10:54 -0800 Message-ID: <19980213190305.7934.qmail@hotmail.com> X-Originating-IP: [204.74.108.99] From: "Joseph Buck" To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: the spirits of my ancestors Content-Type: text/plain Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 11:03:04 PST Resent-Message-ID: <"XBbAa.A.5cF.5cK50"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3252 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 12:10:54 -0800 X-UIDL: 68c5f244f9f6085faf594ec8ff97045e Tom, Gibson Person- Your refusal to barter with me for echo makey tool break treaty of 1852. Your echo makey tool has stolen the voices of the spirits of the ancestors. They do not ring through our canyons and hills longer. (What your people call echo my people call maize.) Do not infuriate my people anymore! Give me echo makey tool! One tear coming out of eye, Tatanka ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From ???@??? Fri Feb 13 22:26:53 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 13 11:19:55 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y3QeM-0000Yn-00; Fri, 13 Feb 1998 11:19:50 -0800 X-Sender: kflint@pop.slip.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <009701bd3893$5f31f760$c2b854ce@mark.asisoftware.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 11:08:38 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Kim Flint Subject: Re: Promoting Looping Resent-Message-ID: <"FrvQwD.A.ImG.PpJ50"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3250 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 11:19:50 -0800 X-UIDL: 95b0a26b00a92a9e7f4eedc3f91e9463 At 10:23 AM -0500 2/13/98, Mark Kata wrote: > David, There are lots of books on how to promote music, but it >occured to me that Yahoo doesn't have a "Looping" category. Maybe this >would help. At least we'd have a centralized place on the web. > But we do have a Looping category on the Musi-cal concert info site, conveniently linked right from the Looper's Delight site! They put it in there just for us, actually. If you want it to be worth anything, you need to use it! Post your gigs there! Tell your friends.... kim ______________________________________________________________________ Kim Flint | Looper's Delight kflint@annihilist.com | http://www.annihilist.com/loop/loop.html http://www.annihilist.com/ | Loopers-Delight-request@annihilist.com From ???@??? Fri Feb 13 22:26:54 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 13 11:33:49 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y3Qrm-0002CY-00; Fri, 13 Feb 1998 11:33:42 -0800 X-Sender: kflint@pop.slip.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <0000AFA0.4007@poyry.com.br> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 11:27:35 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Kim Flint Subject: Re: why do people think looping is just for guitar? Resent-Message-ID: <"gJu_G.A.XaB.46J50"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3251 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 11:33:42 -0800 X-UIDL: ae930e10514e9b3654c1f009a52109c0 At 9:43 AM +0300 2/13/98, MAT wrote: > > > >>you know, it just baffles me how looping gets so associated with guitar. >>(at least in some circles...) > > > I think this is because of the fact that you can make a guitar sound > very different using only a delay, distortion and volume padal. I I guess my lament was actually a little different. That guitar players find looping interesting does not surprise me. There is a long history of guitarists mucking with their sound, and if a new type of toy comes out they want to try that one too. It's more the perception of looping by others. I regularly see it being depicted as something for guitar players, whether it's by salesmen or media or other musicians. *That's* what mysifies me! Is this just because lots of guitar players do it? Or because it's been guitar oriented people involved in manufacturing them and therefore that's where they place it? To me, using real-time loops for percussion or cello or radio transmissions or whatever seems just as valid. Why don't other people see it that way? What do we do to change that perception? kim ______________________________________________________________________ Kim Flint | Looper's Delight kflint@annihilist.com | http://www.annihilist.com/loop/loop.html http://www.annihilist.com/ | Loopers-Delight-request@annihilist.com From ???@??? Fri Feb 13 22:27:03 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 13 12:21:05 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y3RbY-00003x-00; Fri, 13 Feb 1998 12:21:00 -0800 Message-Id: <199802132008.MAA10894@sonic.sonic.com> Subject: Re: Why guitarists loop Date: Fri, 13 Feb 98 12:15:46 -0800 x-sender: andy_wolpert@pop.sonic.com x-mailer: Claris Emailer 2.0, March 15, 1997 From: Andy Wolpert To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Resent-Message-ID: <"K3NoYD.A.JcG.DlK50"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3253 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 12:21:00 -0800 X-UIDL: 1b5fb401bc42978f108daa7708e2b14e >looping gets so associated with guitar One reason I think looping and guitar go so well is than Guitar generally lacks the ability to sustaion indefintely, so you have to do something to keep it going. (LIke feedback which is a form of looping). Similarly backwards guitar is great because a guitar generally has a sharp attack, gradual decay etc... __ _/\_ / \___/ \______ \ Andy Wolpert \__ | Sonic Solutions \ / awolpert@sonic.com / | (415) 893-8043 / \___ __ ___/ \__/ \_____/ From ???@??? Fri Feb 13 22:27:03 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 13 12:26:29 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y3Rgn-0000jH-00; Fri, 13 Feb 1998 12:26:25 -0800 Message-ID: From: David Kirkdorffer To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: RE: why do people think looping is just for guitar? Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 15:16:18 -0500 X-Priority: 3 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) Content-Type: text/plain Resent-Message-ID: <"4x94J.A.VAH.spK50"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3254 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 12:26:25 -0800 X-UIDL: 5b9066170d73dbcf81600713b8beb97b If rock music is the dominant or most visible/listened to/played form of music around today, then it's true the Guitar is the dominant or most visible/listened to/played instrument in the rock genre. Thus, it represents the largest market for "aftermarket" products - like effects etc. IMHO, David -----Original Message----- From: Kim Flint [SMTP:kflint@annihilist.com] Subject: Re: why do people think looping is just for guitar? 9:43 AM +0300 2/13/98, MAT wrote: >>you know, it just baffles me how looping gets so associated with guitar. >>(at least in some circles...) It's more the perception of looping by others. I regularly see it being depicted as something for guitar players, whether it's by salesmen or media or other musicians. *That's* what mysifies me! Is this just because lots of guitar players do it? Or because it's been guitar oriented people involved in manufacturing them and therefore that's where they place it? ___________________________________________________________________ Kim Flint | Looper's Delight kflint@annihilist.com | http://www.annihilist.com/loop/loop.html http://www.annihilist.com/ | Loopers-Delight-request@annihilist.com From ???@??? Fri Feb 13 22:27:04 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 13 12:42:29 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y3RwI-0002cM-00; Fri, 13 Feb 1998 12:42:26 -0800 Message-Id: <98Feb13.143249cst.26889@gateway.gibson.com> X-Sender: tspauldi@mail.nash.gibson.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 14:36:20 -0600 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Tom Spaulding Subject: Re: the spirits of my incestors In-Reply-To: <19980213190305.7934.qmail@hotmail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"ezU2mD.A.xlB.55K50"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3255 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 12:42:26 -0800 X-UIDL: fbb5282fb7e0d61e7a4ca5a038c2a9e6 The Great White Father in Nashville hears his children in the wilderness. He has reservations about giving any Echos away, however. Dry your eyes...even one tear will make your massacre run. Tom "Jus' Going Down the List o' People to Offend" Spaulding At 01:03 PM 2/13/98 -0600, you wrote: >Tom, Gibson Person- > >Your refusal to barter with me for echo makey tool break treaty of 1852. >Your echo makey tool has stolen the voices of the spirits of the >ancestors. >They do not ring through our canyons and hills longer. >(What your people call echo my people call maize.) > >Do not infuriate my people anymore! > >Give me echo makey tool! > > >One tear coming out of eye, > >Tatanka > >______________________________________________________ >Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com > > > From ???@??? Fri Feb 13 22:27:13 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 13 13:42:18 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y3Ss2-0000ce-00; Fri, 13 Feb 1998 13:42:06 -0800 Message-Id: <199802132135.OAA02103@hyper.dimensional.com> From: "Scott Bullerwell" To: Subject: Guitar-o-centrism Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 14:30:13 -0700 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"AM1mdD.A.-yG.2vL50"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3256 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 13:42:06 -0800 X-UIDL: 6862a9f3c1ef29e823313008cfe4a261 David Kirkdorffer writes: > If rock music is the dominant or most visible/listened to/played form of > music around today, then it's true the Guitar is the dominant or most > visible/listened to/played instrument in the rock genre. > > Thus, it represents the largest market for "aftermarket" products - like > effects etc. A fair statement--guitar is highly visible, it's popular, it's sexy, it's expressive, it's versatile, it symbolizes, uh... freedom, and it's relatively easy to play popular music on. I think there might be something synergistic behind this. Lotta guitar players means a lotta bands means a lotta music means a lotta kids who want to be guitar players. Why guitar, though? Apart from the fact that most kids dig rock music (and aren't exposed to much else), I think it's because the guitar is CHEAP (youse with the $20,000 rack and $8000 custom-shop guitar, stop snickering) compared to drums, 'cello, piano, or for that matter most orchestral instruments--or even a decent rack o' synths. Yo-Yo Ma (and other prominent classical soloists who commonly lease their million-dollar-plus heirloom instruments from musea or private collections) wouldn't wince at the sticker price of the latest Eventide and a McInturff Zodiac. Hell, the cat playing ninth-chair butt-trumpet in the Teaneck Philharmonia has more than that rolled into his scruffy-looking horn. And we live in the days of the $189 Stratocaster and $50 digital effects. And the $750 Echoplex Digital Pro. (Plus, you can give your kid a guitar and a headphone amp and not have to hear her sawing through etudes or plonking through major scales or pounding out endless measures of "Wipeout" on a cheap floor tom.) Scott Bullerwell tanelorn@dimensional.com Boulder, Colorado, USA From ???@??? Fri Feb 13 22:27:14 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 13 13:42:40 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y3SsQ-0000fm-00; Fri, 13 Feb 1998 13:42:30 -0800 Message-Id: <3.0.1.32.19980213163304.006ae7cc@popmail.voicenet.com> X-Sender: ngc1275@popmail.voicenet.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.1 (32) Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 16:33:04 -0500 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Theatre of the Mind Subject: Re: DON'T GO SEE A LIVE BAND -- YOU'LL BE BORED!!! In-Reply-To: <199802131740.MAA12030@user1.channel1.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"wC0p5D.A.G1G.DwL50"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3257 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 13:42:30 -0800 X-UIDL: da74f864004a157826ec5399ea707c4e At 12:40 PM 2/13/98 -0500, you wrote: >Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 12:29:30 >To: nyfac2@nyfac.com >From: Frank Gerace >Subject: Re: DON'T GO SEE A LIVE BAND -- YOU'LL BE BORED!!! > >At 11:05 AM 2/13/98 +0000, you wrote: >............................. The problem seems to be the scenes are all >too narrow in their focus. It's time to infiltrate the scenes and subvert >the genres by expanding them. Open things out instead of staying within the >boundaries. > >Frank >Dreamchild >> > I totally agree. About a year or so ago I placed myself smak in the middle of a rock 'n roll club. I had a weekly series going which included loop type music along with special guests. It took about three weeks to catch on. But people started to come out......if for nothing more than curiousity. As artists it's our responsablity to step out and incourage these evolutions. It's up to us to educate these club owners (some how) that will make them realize that by widening there view will inhance there bottom line. Besides, I want to go out and be entertained with more variety too. I get bored too. The only other thing for the artist to do is produce his or her own events. This is something I've been doing for about six years now. Sometimes maybe only one event per year, sometimes a few. It depends on how much money and/or support I can muster up. Sometimes they're great and sometimes they don't quite meet my expectations. The point is, if everyone did at least one per year, there would be that much more energy in the community. It would also cut a lot of the clubs out of the loop. (As they have done us.) This way we have a little more control over our careers. Wow, this stream sure did take me out of lurk mode. I'll go back into my box now. Mark b. Theatre of the Mind From ???@??? Fri Feb 13 22:27:39 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 13 16:23:36 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y3VOH-0002gu-00; Fri, 13 Feb 1998 16:23:33 -0800 Message-ID: <2148EC143F29D1118BE000805FC13CD01E1F83@migarexch01.maritz.com> From: "Liebig, Steuart A." To: "'Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com'" Subject: RE: why do people think looping is just for guitar? Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 15:37:31 -0600 X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) Resent-Message-ID: <"JAf3-C.A.2fB.lHO50"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3266 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 16:23:33 -0800 X-UIDL: 4a2af0551fdb021d459e2ab62e38780f > To me, using real-time loops for percussion or cello or radio > transmissions > or whatever seems just as valid. Why don't other people see it that > way? > What do we do to change that perception? > > kim > Well, actually the people that I play with and/or know do. In addition to guitarists I know, there are a violinist; a 6-string electric bassist (me); an acoustic bassist; a vocalist/bass clarinetist/electric bassist; an acoustic bassist; another electric bassist; a vocalist percussionist; and another vocalist /percusionist who sometimes loops whatever it is the band is playing (lo-tech whatever comes through the mic) and flies it right back in our faces. As far as changing perceptions? I don't know, maybe you need to meet sdome different people (not being snide/facetious). > ______________________________________________________________________ > Kim Flint | Looper's Delight > kflint@annihilist.com | http://www.annihilist.com/loop/loop.html > http://www.annihilist.com/ | Loopers-Delight-request@annihilist.com > > > From ???@??? Fri Feb 13 22:27:15 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 13 13:54:18 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y3T3n-00027e-00; Fri, 13 Feb 1998 13:54:15 -0800 From: "Bailey, Jim" To: 'looppost' Subject: Non-guitar looping Date:Fri, 13 Feb 1998 16:50:00 -0500 Message-ID: <34E4BFAD@199.71.37.25> Encoding: 21 TEXT X-Mailer: Microsoft Mail V3.0 Resent-Message-ID: <"LrWwhD.A.WgB.CAM50"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3258 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 13:54:15 -0800 X-UIDL: 0a0f1da1095ea841510156a373e9d3aa To me, using real-time loops for percussion or cello or radio transmissions or whatever seems just as valid. Why don't other people see it that way? What do we do to change that perception? kim I guess I'm one of those who do. As I've probably mentioned here before, one of the first things I looped - using two tape decks, the playback one being a cheap old Sears portable - was of a poem/story by D. M. Thomas. I've also done two of the three listed above (don't have a 'cello, although I have done one with a similar sound on my Roland JX-3P). Here's a suggestion: Support the innovative looper! Don't buy Fripp's albums, buy MINE! ;-) (trades are welcome). Let's start using the loopers list for doing trades, perhaps on an item-for-item basis. Jim Bailey From ???@??? Fri Feb 13 22:27:16 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 13 14:03:58 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y3TD7-0003J9-00; Fri, 13 Feb 1998 14:03:53 -0800 From: lwordsman@pirnie.com Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 16:58:05 -0500 Message-Id: <199802132158.QAA00182@mailnet.malcolmpirnie.com> To: Loopers-Delight@Annihilist.com Subject: Rich who? X-Mailer: MailNet 4.10 Resent-Message-ID: <"JBY9RD.A.3SC.fGM50"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3259 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 14:03:53 -0800 X-UIDL: 88b8b7834a49eee8985968565adb177f Tom Spaulding wrote: Having been fortunate enough to hear Rich's album "Quiver". I'm not familiar with Rich. Is that the name of a band or first name of a member of this list? Please fill me in as your recommendation makes it sound worth listening to. THANXXX Lee From ???@??? Fri Feb 13 22:27:18 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 13 14:25:02 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y3TXK-0005Z2-00; Fri, 13 Feb 1998 14:24:46 -0800 From: RA336@aol.com Message-ID: <8d78f901.34e4c5ff@aol.com> Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 17:15:23 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: tatanka Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 84 Resent-Message-ID: <"UmkrfD.A.5ZE.HaM50"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3260 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 14:24:46 -0800 X-UIDL: 7a3c1b17c1fb85693ef64982df9dc586 Oh tearful one, the "Buck" stops here! ... you something funny man! best, RA (the currently in eclipse God of Sun) From ???@??? Fri Feb 13 22:27:23 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 13 14:44:45 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y3Ti9-0006uZ-00; Fri, 13 Feb 1998 14:35:57 -0800 Message-Id: <98Feb13.161950cst.26894@gateway.gibson.com> X-Sender: tspauldi@mail.nash.gibson.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 16:23:24 -0600 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Tom Spaulding Subject: Re: Rich who? Hodinski, that's who... In-Reply-To: <199802132158.QAA00182@mailnet.malcolmpirnie.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/enriched; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"IPi-Y.A.EBF.IfM50"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3261 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 14:35:57 -0800 X-UIDL: 1582954ce36ff31c2de57b802fb0d8c6 >I'm not familiar with Rich.Please fill me in as your recommendation makes it sound worth listening to. >Lee Lee- That would be Ric Hodinski, aka Monkici@aol.com, aka member of Monk, aka ex-member of Over The Rhine, aka producer of David Wilcox' "Turning Point" CD. Go on, order that product (according to the liner notes)at: Monk P.O. Box 6352 Cincinnati, OH 45206 Or maybe Ric will poke his head out and let y'all know what to do. I know he's here somewhere... And no, I don't know the guy, nor am I a paid spokesmodel, just a happy listener... Tom "Better Listening Through E-mail" Spaulding > > > > > > > > From ???@??? Fri Feb 13 22:27:19 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 13 14:37:23 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y3TjK-00073o-00; Fri, 13 Feb 1998 14:37:10 -0800 From: lwordsman@pirnie.com Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 17:25:11 -0500 Message-Id: <199802132225.RAA00196@mailnet.malcolmpirnie.com> To: Loopers-Delight@Annihilist.com Subject: Yesterday's loops continue to feed back. X-Mailer: MailNet 4.10 Resent-Message-ID: <"Eq8AEC.A.lJF.GgM50"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3262 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 14:37:10 -0800 X-UIDL: 9c1d756e993a89e337d6773cf278c3ae ---------- From: Wordsman, Lee To: Wordsman, Lee Subject: RE: Kim Flint : Re: What does a Echo-plex cost? Date: Friday, February 13, 1998 1:57PM I misposted this yesterday. It may not be as topical as it seemed yesterday but anyway - - - Having just come in from the car where I was listening to some early Police while drooling over my newly purchased RDS 4000 (unfortunately, I couldn't swing the cash for the 8000 recently posted), I find these two posts an interesting jumping in point. I haven't listened to that much loop oriented material although recent postings have led me to listen to Praxis, Laswell, Chemical Brothers, Digable Planets and Fripp's "A Blessing of Tears". I find most of the material interesting, however, I'm still drawn back to Crimson, Police, Bowie and Fripp recordings of the late 70's and early 80's. There seems to be an interesting interplay between the looper and the loop ( from a guitar perspective) that I haven't found in more recent material. My interest in listening to this older music (which I grew up with) is renewed as I try to understand what role looping (or at least recurring delayed samples) played in the overall recording. I don't know of anyone playing like that now. ! If there is please enlighten me as I'm always looking to hear new and interesting sounds. My interest in looping begain when I started listening to music by the police and crimson that wasn't necessarily loop oriented but presented a guitarist playing against a delayed section of music. That led to listening to early solo Fripp and Eno where you could hear the loop evolve and devolve over time. I realize that this is all subjective but I'm more interested and moved by what No Pussyfooting, or League of Gentlemen albums than "A Blessing of Tears". A Blessing of Tears is a fine work of art but from a looping standpoint I can't tell if it is a loop or not. Partly because he's using so much treatment on his sounds but partly because I miss the feeling of the loop building over time. I'm rambling now. I'm frustrated that I'm not really adding anything more to this thread than to say "Damn but the early guitar oriented loopers really made some intensely interesting music that I enjoy even to this day." sometimes you just got to say what you feel. Finally, I can't recall who recently mentioned that we haven't even scratched the surface of looping but I'm inclined to second that. Kim, Sorry for the mispost. Lee From ???@??? Fri Feb 13 22:27:20 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 13 14:38:47 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y3Tkh-0007EY-00; Fri, 13 Feb 1998 14:38:35 -0800 Message-ID: <01BD38A4.B8D80A00@TD-300> From: jprice@intcpi.com (John Price) To: "'Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com'" Subject: RE: Guitar-o-centrism Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 17:27:45 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="---- =_NextPart_000_01BD38A4.B8F9C2D0" Resent-Message-ID: <"4xHehB.A.uWF.yhM50"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3263 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 14:38:35 -0800 X-UIDL: c6631a4720512036f8ca6b825f812b63 I'm bothered by the statement that rock is the dominant form of music prevalent today. The guitar is and will always be somewhat prevalent throughout a number of musical perspectives but I highly doubt that rock dominates things say from a universal springboard of ideas and origin of musical experience/exposure. I think it is more of a Western and overly Euro-American perspective that thinks Rock moves in ways nothing else does or can. I think if there is one instrument that actually dominates anything in any particular music's origins it is the Piano (IMHO) - not a synth, not a sampler or even a violin, just a plain old piano. From ???@??? Fri Feb 13 22:27:33 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 13 15:12:21 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y3UHG-00037l-00; Fri, 13 Feb 1998 15:12:14 -0800 Message-Id: <199802132307.QAA02291@hyper.dimensional.com> From: "Scott Bullerwell" To: Subject: Re: Guitar-o-centrism Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 16:02:12 -0700 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"zosXOD.A.wDC._FN50"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3264 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 15:12:14 -0800 X-UIDL: 576c32559e8aa46b3f762b86f431c9a8 John Price writes: > I'm bothered by the statement that rock is the dominant form of music prevalent today. If we use what's on the radio and on television and in the stores and glossy magazines as a gauge, I'm afraid it is--along with rap and country. I'm not thrilled with the prospect myself. And it's pervasive. Go to Ougadougou and turn on the radio. Might as well be in Moline. In fact, go anywhere that the government doesn't dictate what shall and shall not be played on the radio and you'll hear Western pop-culture. > I think it is more of a Western and overly Euro-American perspective that thinks Rock moves in ways nothing else > does or can. Very experiential, I think. My parents get all teary-eyed over music I consider rather banal. They, in turn, aren't particularly impressed with the live version of "Cat Scratch Fever" I played incessantly in grade school. The country fan who gets all teary-eyed over Bocephus may very well think I'm crazy for getting all misty over Djam Karet. And there's plenty of classical music afficionadoes who find nothing compelling whatsoever in either Elvis or Javanese court Gamelan. (Or Bartok, for that matter.) With dilligence and an open mind, one can acquire a taste for anything, and that may be the saving grace of experimental musicians--they don't respect any notion of a "cultural patent on knowledge" (to borrow a phrase from Dinesh D'souza.) > I think if there is one instrument that actually dominates anything in any particular music's origins it is the > Piano (IMHO) - not a synth, not a sampler or even a violin, just a plain old piano. A Chinese musician might make the very same statement about the yang ch'in. But before that there were drums and voice, and they pervade music all over the world. Long before there were pianos and Stratocasters and Da Plex there was rhythm, melody, and harmony, and there were even rules for same. And it moved people on some visceral level. Funny ole thing, music. Scott Bullerwell tanelorn@dimensional.com Boulder, Colorado, USA From ???@??? Fri Feb 13 22:28:01 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 13 16:56:39 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y3Vu6-0006Jp-00; Fri, 13 Feb 1998 16:56:26 -0800 Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 19:44:54 -0500 From: R & T Cummings Subject: Modulations Sender: R & T Cummings To: Loopers Delight Message-ID: <199802131945_MC2-3338-FF28@compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Disposition: inline Resent-Message-ID: <"b-6Vq.A.y1E.DmO50"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3267 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 16:56:26 -0800 X-UIDL: 26a23c279702ed5505f86c28c27a333a I just saw a new film at the Berlin Film Festival yesterday called "Modulations" by Iara Lee. It's a documentary which deals with how techno, d'n'b, jungle, ambient music etc. developed and how the technology which made it possible. It also retraces some of the roots of electronic music. I think all of you who found any of the last threads (looping as sin, limits of an instrument, expression through "sound shaping") interesting will definitely enjoy the film. If any of you dug "Step Across the Border" with Fred Frith, you'll probably get into this too (although the latter has much cooler cinematography). One of the funniest scenes is with Squarepusher (T. Jenkins) in his tiny bedroom talking "gear". He pulls some ancient mini- sampler thing (sorry, forgot what it was) from amongst his dirty laundry with which he claims to have made most of the sounds on his last CD. Basically EVERYONE from Coldcut to Roni Size (he seemed to be rather, uh, "baked") to LJT Bukem to DJ Spooky to Oval to Orbital to Alec Empire to Can to Stockhausen (great) to Pierre Schaefer to the Moog guy to Teo Macero (Miles Columbia sessions) to Bill Laswell to David Toop to Alvin Toffler (remember "Future Shock"?) is featured in the film. The latter said something funny to the effect of "We in the western civilization are great at solving problems by breaking them into tiny little pieces. We just aren't very good at putting them back together". OK, Alvin you're an eternal pessimist. Oh Oh, better stop - I noticed the scroll bar moving ... Rob From ???@??? Fri Feb 13 22:28:02 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 13 17:02:06 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y3VzS-0006zg-00; Fri, 13 Feb 1998 17:01:58 -0800 Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 19:46:33 -0500 From: R & T Cummings Subject: Buckethead/ Brain album Sender: R & T Cummings To: Loopers Delight Message-ID: <199802131946_MC2-3343-487F@compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Disposition: inline Resent-Message-ID: <"Nh_KM.A.kBF.inO50"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3268 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 17:01:58 -0800 X-UIDL: 7c0ab005fe4c74bdaa25e25c107e9c21 I heard that there's a new CD out by Buckethead and Brain (whatsitcalled?) where they supposedly do some d'n'b stuff and where Brain plays loops. Anybody heard it yet? Related to the looper as guitarrist thread: Maybe stuff like this and the Vinx/ Calhoun project can introduce the whole concept of looping to the broad masses of drummers/ percussionists. I know that other drummers in my area (Berlin) are hot on the idea of getting into looping - but unfortunately there aren't any products currently available over here (Jamman is gone and EDP unavailable). Which is not to say that I don't cherish my role as probably the only drummer in town to own a looper ;-) Rob From ???@??? Fri Feb 13 22:28:03 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 13 17:02:56 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y3W0B-00075R-00; Fri, 13 Feb 1998 17:02:43 -0800 Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 19:47:08 -0500 From: R & T Cummings Subject: Re: plastic tubes (was screaming guitar) Sender: R & T Cummings To: "INTERNET:Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com" Message-ID: <199802131947_MC2-3339-5E19@compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Disposition: inline Resent-Message-ID: <"TvYhTC.A.HFF.7nO50"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3269 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 17:02:44 -0800 X-UIDL: 633d6bde8c4d6c083d6cf5f2c959c43b Paolo wrote: >So I thought it would be cool to have a plastic or rubber tube rigged so I could play Stick in the normal position yet be able to blow some air onto my Stick pickups at the same time.< As a related aside (unusual playing techniques), I recently saw Gerry Hemingway (drummer with Anthony Braxton, Bob Ostertag's Say No More) making timpani-like pitch swells on his floor tom. As I looked closer to see how he was doing this, I saw that he was blowing air through a plastic tube into the "breathing" hole on the side of the tom. Thus, he was able to change the internal air pressure in the tome. Pretty cool idea, I though maybe might find interestiing. Anyways, ... Bye, Rob From ???@??? Fri Feb 13 22:28:16 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 13 18:05:54 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y3WzD-0005Oh-00; Fri, 13 Feb 1998 18:05:47 -0800 Message-Id: <1.5.4.32.19980214015848.0067ff00@tiac.net> X-Sender: rphunt@tiac.net (Unverified) X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 20:58:48 -0500 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Reginald Hunt Subject: Re: What does a Echo-plex cost? Resent-Message-ID: <"1Ge57C.A.RYE.ZqP50"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3271 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 18:05:47 -0800 X-UIDL: 95bbd7d6bf76fa8419dea43ce74f218b I do have to interject that Robin Guthrie leads me down new paths from time to time. Reg > >I think this is why I stopped listening to guitar oriented music. >Everything I hear, no matter what the style and who the player, leaves me >with a feeling of "haven't I heard this already?" > >even older than my 28 years, > >kim > >______________________________________________________________________ >Kim Flint | Looper's Delight >kflint@annihilist.com | http://www.annihilist.com/loop/loop.html >http://www.annihilist.com/ | Loopers-Delight-request@annihilist.com > > > > > From ???@??? Fri Feb 13 22:28:16 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 13 18:08:51 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y3X25-0005kn-00; Fri, 13 Feb 1998 18:08:45 -0800 Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 20:59:46 -0500 (EST) From: JJavid@aol.com Message-ID: <980213205945_471366756@mrin54> To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Unsubcribe Resent-Message-ID: <"o2o9VD.A.YgE.arP50"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3272 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 18:08:45 -0800 X-UIDL: a1205278f37165e4649299c1644ed28e Unsubcribe From ???@??? Fri Feb 13 22:28:17 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 13 18:12:54 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y3X5y-0006Gt-00; Fri, 13 Feb 1998 18:12:46 -0800 Message-Id: <1.5.4.32.19980214020203.0067b824@tiac.net> X-Sender: rphunt@tiac.net (Unverified) X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 21:02:03 -0500 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Reginald Hunt Subject: Re: What does a Echo-plex cost? Resent-Message-ID: <"vfHHt.A.vwE.gtP50"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3273 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 18:12:46 -0800 X-UIDL: f3fdee9ee2709c62822a2b88d5f67a33 Because guitarists work with effects the most. And, unfortunately, the Echoplex will be viewed as an effect. Will there be a marketing effort by Oberheim to battle this? Reg > >you know, it just baffles me how looping gets so associated with guitar. >(at least in some circles...) The sound going into the loop can be >anything, where do people get the idea that its just a guitar effect? >mystery..... > >kim > >______________________________________________________________________ >Kim Flint | Looper's Delight >kflint@annihilist.com | http://www.annihilist.com/loop/loop.html >http://www.annihilist.com/ | Loopers-Delight-request@annihilist.com > > > > > From ???@??? Fri Feb 13 22:28:18 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 13 18:19:48 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y3XCd-00077g-00; Fri, 13 Feb 1998 18:19:39 -0800 Message-Id: <1.5.4.32.19980214020824.006805d4@tiac.net> X-Sender: rphunt@tiac.net (Unverified) X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 21:08:24 -0500 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Reginald Hunt Subject: RE: looping as sin Resent-Message-ID: <"48YDR.A.fgF.izP50"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3274 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 18:19:39 -0800 X-UIDL: be5c7cc8373cabcdd844c8b8bbf6837b For a time, I was writing out all solos for my pieces, in the hope that they quality of the performance wouldn't be so dependant on my ability to come up with something effective on a particular night. Also, it allowed more concentration on execution rather than composition. Reg >I seem to remember a quote from one of the Grateful Dead: "We made it up >as we went along; some nights it was great, some nights it sucked" (I'm >paraphrasing). Problem is, some people paid to see them suck. Perhaps >musicians have a responsibility to prepare "just in case" - so that even if >you're not hitting a high (so to speak) the audience are at least >garuanteed a good night out, which is what they've paid for. > >Some musicians _do_ play experimental music to receptive audiences (I'm >thinking here of the mythical NY loft scene) - but if that's what the >audences are getting, they should be warned. YOu don't go to a play >expecting to be told that the company are about to make it up as they go >along, but if you're forwarned (isn't there a bamous Boston/Chicago comedic >improv theatre), it can be wonderful. > >Michael > >(Ranting away - sorry!) > > > > From ???@??? Fri Feb 13 22:28:19 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 13 18:22:32 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y3XFJ-0007Sk-00; Fri, 13 Feb 1998 18:22:25 -0800 Message-Id: <1.5.4.32.19980214021157.0067bbdc@tiac.net> X-Sender: rphunt@tiac.net (Unverified) X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 21:11:57 -0500 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Reginald Hunt Subject: Re: Re: screaming guitar Resent-Message-ID: <"b7r0TD.A.v7F.22P50"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3275 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 18:22:25 -0800 X-UIDL: 8568bff27282b021139fa5886c997ff2 Are you referring to the Garvikord made by Bob Grawi? I actually bought a cassette of his stuff when I saw him in Grand Central Station! Reg At 03:43 PM 2/12/98 -0800, you wrote: >This all reminds me... > >I just saw some video clips of the Gravikords, Whirlies, And Pyrophones >event in New York (yes it is connected to the book/CD of the same name) >in a local news program. I saw glimpses of the Gravikord (an African >kora built out of metal parts and other stuff), the Pyrophone, and the >bike that plays horns when you pedal it. > >Any idea if a video is available of this event? > > >Paolo Valladolid > --------------------------------------------------------------- >|Moderator of Digital Guitar Digest, an Internet mailing list |\ >|for Music Technology and Stringed Instruments | \ > ---------------------------------------------------------------- | >\ finger pvallado@waynesworld.ucsd.edu for more info \ | > \ http://waynesworld.ucsd.edu/DigitalGuitar/home.html \| > ----------------------------------------------------------------- > > > From ???@??? Fri Feb 13 22:28:20 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 13 18:25:59 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y3XId-00006o-00; Fri, 13 Feb 1998 18:25:51 -0800 Message-Id: <1.5.4.32.19980214021530.0067627c@tiac.net> X-Sender: rphunt@tiac.net (Unverified) X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 21:15:30 -0500 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Reginald Hunt Subject: RE: What does a Echo-plex cost? Resent-Message-ID: <"cDqr1D.A.TVG.F6P50"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3276 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 18:25:51 -0800 X-UIDL: caee5f77abb209c7de1f6539342a17d9 Fripp (and Sinatra) will be remembered long after Snoop Doggy Dogg, Puff Daddy, Bruce Springsteen (who?), or Whitney Houston are forgotten (I give it a hundred years). Reg At 04:42 PM 2/12/98 -0800, you wrote: >Y'know whenever I hear someone say anything that starts with "Kid's today.." >and then compares something current to something ten plus years old, I hear >a cranky old man in 1967 ranting about "these goddam hippie kids" and "their >horrible rock music" and "Frank Sinatra was good enough for us, dammit.." >etc. >If you want to compare any era of pop music to any other you have to >remember all the crap, too. I seem to recall plenty of really bad music from >all the eras you mention (can you say Dave Clark Five, how 'bout New Kids on >the Block, think anybody will be playing Boston in 2098?). If your looking >for inventive or just good pop music, how about Beck, Ween or Radiohead? > >Remember kids, never trust anyone over thirty... From ???@??? Fri Feb 13 22:28:21 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 13 18:34:35 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y3XQx-0001BA-00; Fri, 13 Feb 1998 18:34:27 -0800 Message-Id: <1.5.4.32.19980214022308.0068c898@tiac.net> X-Sender: rphunt@tiac.net (Unverified) X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 21:23:08 -0500 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Reginald Hunt Subject: RE: What does a Echo-plex cost? Resent-Message-ID: <"pGU4V.A.XQH.hBQ50"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3277 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 18:34:27 -0800 X-UIDL: bef25746247955d1510fbc3c247ddcc9 Tom "need to help Reggie" Spaulding, Drop everything and send two Echoplexes ASAP to Manny's in NYC. Reg At 10:37 PM 2/12/98 -0600, you wrote: >Wish I could, but I gots dealahs to think about... They are the nice chaps >who ultimately take the biggest gamble...if you don't like something, you >can always take it back to them, but once they buy it, it's theirs. I will >try to get an up-to-date list of authorized stocking dealers to everyone >soon. Thanks!! > >Tom "Kim and Matthias make strong Medicine" Spaulding From ???@??? Fri Feb 13 22:28:22 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 13 18:35:19 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y3XRi-0001HB-00; Fri, 13 Feb 1998 18:35:14 -0800 Message-Id: <1.5.4.32.19980214022444.0068c384@tiac.net> X-Sender: rphunt@tiac.net (Unverified) X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 21:24:44 -0500 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Reginald Hunt Subject: Re: a suggestion for all Resent-Message-ID: <"k2j0-C.A.2G.wCQ50"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3278 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 18:35:14 -0800 X-UIDL: 8907eb7ac6d1b4f61f0a39202a4c097f trees are green, some are tall. At 03:56 AM 2/13/98 EST, you wrote: >trees are green > > > From ???@??? Fri Feb 13 22:28:23 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 13 18:44:36 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y3Xac-0002Pk-00; Fri, 13 Feb 1998 18:44:26 -0800 Message-Id: <1.5.4.32.19980214023643.006801ac@tiac.net> X-Sender: rphunt@tiac.net (Unverified) X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 21:36:43 -0500 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Reginald Hunt Subject: Re: Why Looping is so popular with Guitarists?? Resent-Message-ID: <"1u_eoB.A.IhB.WOQ50"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3279 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 18:44:26 -0800 X-UIDL: d50669766420270ccd2716ef4b9353e0 One of the first Loopers I've met other than myself was Ira Bloom, a saxophonists. I do think it takes a certain type of mind or mindset (read Non-Linear) to explore Looping technique (whatever that may mean) and appreciate the potential of it. Reg > >Y'know, the first two actual loopers I ever met were a 'cellist and a guy >who plays the sackbut or somesuch in an early music ensemble. > >I wonder how much one's instrument influences one's approach to looping. >[If all you have is a Hamer, everything looks like a nail? geddit? oof, >sorry!] And I wonder how much looping technology influences one's approach >to looping. From ???@??? Fri Feb 13 22:28:24 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 13 18:54:07 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y3Xjv-0003aU-00; Fri, 13 Feb 1998 18:54:03 -0800 Message-Id: <1.5.4.32.19980214024830.00693420@tiac.net> X-Sender: rphunt@tiac.net (Unverified) X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 21:48:30 -0500 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Reginald Hunt Subject: Re: Non-guitar looping Resent-Message-ID: <"EW-aMD.A.33C.BZQ50"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3280 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 18:54:03 -0800 X-UIDL: e8d7e8743628c6f278fcfb2f52d3511f Can't we have invalid loops? Let's fart into our $1500 echoplex stereo set ups and $2000 Neumanns and all digital Yamaha mixers w/ AES/EBU gozins & gozouts. Reg At 04:50 PM 2/13/98 -0500, you wrote: > > >To me, using real-time loops for percussion or cello or radio >transmissions >or whatever seems just as valid. Why don't other people see it that way? >What do we do to change that perception? From ???@??? Fri Feb 13 22:28:25 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 13 19:00:31 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y3Xq7-0004LJ-00; Fri, 13 Feb 1998 19:00:27 -0800 Message-Id: <1.5.4.32.19980214025549.0069ba74@tiac.net> X-Sender: rphunt@tiac.net (Unverified) X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 21:55:49 -0500 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Reginald Hunt Subject: RE: Guitar-o-centrism Resent-Message-ID: <"oNULaB.A.1rD.zfQ50"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3281 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 19:00:27 -0800 X-UIDL: 0b92c6cab4e644555c7c9b6165828306 This is where things go awry. A piano is not plain or old. Guitar or an ancestor thereof may go back to the bow and arrow, depending on the music history version you subscribe to. It's a primal and fundamental way to make a pleasant noise, back there with the drum (maybe that's why they both symbolize Rock Music). Piano is a horrendously complex contraption that helped introduce the Industrial Age. Try to make a piano with a stick and rubber band and get back to me. Reg At 05:27 PM 2/13/98 -0500, you wrote: >I'm bothered by the statement that rock is the dominant form of music prevalent today. > >The guitar is and will always be somewhat prevalent throughout a number of musical perspectives but I highly doubt that rock dominates things say from a universal springboard of ideas and origin of musical experience/exposure. > >I think it is more of a Western and overly Euro-American perspective that thinks Rock moves in ways nothing else does or can. > >I think if there is one instrument that actually dominates anything in any particular music's origins it is the Piano (IMHO) - not a synth, not a sampler or even a violin, just a plain old piano. > >Attachment Converted: c:\eudora\attach\RE Guitar-o-centrism > From ???@??? Fri Feb 13 22:28:26 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 13 19:06:11 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y3Xvd-00052Q-00; Fri, 13 Feb 1998 19:06:09 -0800 Message-Id: <1.5.4.32.19980214025832.00685114@tiac.net> X-Sender: rphunt@tiac.net (Unverified) X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 21:58:32 -0500 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Reginald Hunt Subject: RE: why do people think looping is just for guitar? Resent-Message-ID: <"HoPFpB.A.x9D.ViQ50"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3282 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 19:06:09 -0800 X-UIDL: 5ca05b4455e3116b4b7328114b9fb843 Thank you. At 03:37 PM 2/13/98 -0600, you wrote: >Well, actually the people that I play with and/or know do. > >In addition to guitarists I know, there are a violinist; a 6-string >electric bassist (me); an acoustic bassist; a vocalist/bass >clarinetist/electric bassist; an acoustic bassist; another electric >bassist; a vocalist percussionist; and another vocalist /percusionist >who sometimes loops whatever it is the band is playing (lo-tech whatever >comes through the mic) and flies it right back in our faces. > >As far as changing perceptions? I don't know, maybe you need to meet >sdome different people (not being snide/facetious). > > > >> ______________________________________________________________________ >> Kim Flint | Looper's Delight >> kflint@annihilist.com | http://www.annihilist.com/loop/loop.html >> http://www.annihilist.com/ | Loopers-Delight-request@annihilist.com >> >> >> > > > From ???@??? Fri Feb 13 22:28:30 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 13 20:42:35 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y3ZQv-00039N-00; Fri, 13 Feb 1998 20:42:33 -0800 Message-Id: <2.2.32.19980214043851.00d0cc58@pop.chromatic.com> X-Sender: kflint@pop.chromatic.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 2.2 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 20:38:51 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Kim Flint Subject: RE: why do people think looping is just for guitar? Resent-Message-ID: <"S1UDi.A.9nC.BAS50"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3283 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 20:42:33 -0800 X-UIDL: 95a90940716f6186dc9589260beb2111 At 03:37 PM 2/13/98 -0600, Liebig, Steuart A. wrote: > >> To me, using real-time loops for percussion or cello or radio >> transmissions >> or whatever seems just as valid. Why don't other people see it that >> way? >> What do we do to change that perception? >> >> kim >> >Well, actually the people that I play with and/or know do. > >In addition to guitarists I know, there are a violinist; a 6-string >electric bassist (me); an acoustic bassist; a vocalist/bass >clarinetist/electric bassist; an acoustic bassist; another electric >bassist; a vocalist percussionist; and another vocalist /percusionist >who sometimes loops whatever it is the band is playing (lo-tech whatever >comes through the mic) and flies it right back in our faces. > >As far as changing perceptions? I don't know, maybe you need to meet >sdome different people (not being snide/facetious). Well, seems like the point of my question was missed for the second time, so let's give it a third try: Further expanding upon today's question for thought provocation: The "people" I'm referencing are not people currently involved in looping. It's quite evident to me, having been involved in the nuts n' bolts of this stuff for quite a long time now, that a wide variety of people are using looping techniques. That was a primary purpose in creating Looper's Delight, in fact. Bring all these different people together so that they can see what they have in common with looping, and share new ideas, and learn from all the differences. But, those aren't the people that I'm talking about. My recurring experience is that the average, non-looper musician sees this as "just a thing for guitarists". (a statement I heard from some dance music producers when I asked them about the idea.) I find it curious that this is so. I've seen several store displays of loopers where the store placed it in the guitar section, between a guitar and a guitar amp. Now that's certainly useful, since lots of guitar players will interested. But other people who also might be interested probably won't see it there. So I wonder why the store managers perceived it that way, why they chose to put it there. Why is that choice made over the home studio section, or the electronic instrument section, or anywhere else in the store? Same with mail order catalogs. Loopers usually turn up in the guitar effects section. Why? Is it really just savvy marketing, thinking that guitar players will buy the most, let's stick it right under their nose, or is it because they really think it's just a guitar effect? Having done many trade show looper demos, I'd suspect the later... Manufacturers ad campaigns, same story. They talk about how you can record the rhythm guitar part in the looper and play the guitar solo along with it. They mention various interesting guitarists into looping. No doubt that's appealing to guitar players, but a somewhat different presentation would make it appealing to a much wider audience. Why does one get chosen over the other? and on and on..... As many of you noted while missing my point and apparently trying to argue with my characteristically vague and leading question, loopers do come in many flavors other than guitarists. Yet the widespread perception doesn't appear to include them, which hardly seems fair or correct. It also creates a rather uninviting circumstance to some non-guitarists who might find looping interesting, if only it were presented in a way they could identify with. If it seems like "just a thing for guitarists" and you're not one, well.... I guess that's where the question of "how do we change this perception?" comes in. We all know this is a fun and interesting way to create music, and that that's true whether you are playing accordian or triangle or guitar. How do we show the musical general public that it's fun and interesting for anyone? If we want the idea to grow and spread about, what do we show the world about ourselves, and how do we do it? wondering how much effort it will take to explain myself the fourth time, kim ________________________________________________________ Kim Flint 408-752-9284 Mpact System Engineering kflint@chromatic.com Chromatic Research http://www.chromatic.com From ???@??? Fri Feb 13 22:28:31 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 13 21:09:44 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y3ZrB-00050S-00; Fri, 13 Feb 1998 21:09:41 -0800 From: ENAT21213@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Sat, 14 Feb 1998 00:01:08 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: a suggestion for all Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 16-bit for Windows sub 58 Resent-Message-ID: <"eiHPoB.A.tdE._ZS50"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3284 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 21:09:41 -0800 X-UIDL: 209cd3fcc4595a6e1a6a68e77f12dbe6 trees are green,some are tall,let's loop them all. In a message dated 98-02-13 21:32:33 EST, you write: << trees are green, some are tall. >> From ???@??? Fri Feb 13 22:28:32 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 13 21:15:26 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y3Zwg-0005aa-00; Fri, 13 Feb 1998 21:15:22 -0800 Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19980213231345.007cc100@mail.nash.gibson.com> X-Sender: tspauldi@mail.nash.gibson.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 23:13:45 -0600 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: tspauldi@mail.nash.gibson.com Subject: Loop Ads Pondering Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"r6-MvD.A.d8E.5eS50"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3285 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 21:15:22 -0800 X-UIDL: 6b939e3edc6f38b9b79ddb84e9394fd2 Hmmm. I have been writing and re-writing a proposal to treat the EDP as a "real-time interactive personal multi-track" (to paraphrase a few people) for over a week now. What will the ad look like? What will the copy say? Who is the right endorsee to feature first? Torn, for his groundbreaking vision? Billy Cobham using the EDP for soundtrack work? Steve Tavaglione for his EWI soundtrack stuff on the Horse Whisperer soundtrack? Tom Roady using it in percussion clinics for Zendrum? Ronnie Montrose? Neal Schon? Trey Gunn? Fripp? Belew? Pete Anderson? Ric Hordinski? You? I've got X amount of dollars to spend on a campaign to promote a product that is the only one I have deep backorders on, and by definition, is least worthy of promotion. And yet, I know something must be done. The rest of the world is totally ignorant of this Looping thing, as far as I am concerned. I think some kind of televised event, like David Torn meets Les Paul in NY, Adrian Belew meets Chet Atkins in Nashville, etc. What is going to make everyone want a Looping device? Not everybody who wants it now can even find or afford the EDP. I'm not sure I have the answers yet, but if everyone on the list can continue to spread the word about what they have discovered, whether EDP or not, it will surely help. As usual, comments and ideas appreciated. I'll shut up for awhile now, he said to Cyber sighs world wide... Tom "Cyberian Khatru" Spaulding From ???@??? Fri Feb 13 23:29:45 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 13 22:58:20 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y3bYI-0003Ph-00; Fri, 13 Feb 1998 22:58:18 -0800 Message-ID: <34E54129.521D@earthlink.net> Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 23:00:57 -0800 From: Andre LaFosse Reply-To: altruist@earthlink.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01-C-MACOS8 (Macintosh; I; 68K) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: why do people think looping is just for guitar? References: <2.2.32.19980214043851.00d0cc58@pop.chromatic.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"uZZ4tB.A.M2C.7-T50"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3286 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 22:58:18 -0800 X-UIDL: f3fe3e652495d2003526a2ab53aa4647 I won't quote Kim's third attempt at explaining himself, since I think I got the point a while ago (as did we all by now, hopefully). I'll try to address the points raised by him and Tom Spaulding. At the risk of being criticized for trying to ostracize other musicians or draw lines in the proverbial sand (neither of which is in any way my interest or intent), I do think there's a difference between real-time and step-time looping in terms of how it lends itself to being used. I thnk most of us, both here and in the general world outside this list, associate the term "looper" -- if we even have an association with it at all -- with a real-time device a la the JamMan, Echoplex, Boomerang, etc. The people doing dance and hip-hop music generally make very loop-oriented music, but it doesn't get done on gear that's thought of as "a looper" per so. I mean, of course, that's *exactly* what they're doing. But they're almost always doing it in step-time, with a sampler, sequencer, computer, and multitrack studio setup. And in a way, the very cross-stylistic nature of looping that Kim so rightly brings up on occasion may actually be something of a hindrance in terms of people coming to terms with a "looper," because if someone makes hip-hop, or techno, or house, I'd dare say a significant number of them take the looping aspect for granted, to the point where they don't even think of it as being a distinct or defining handle for the music, any more that a jazz saxophonist would think of what he does as "reed music" or an Indian percussionist would identify his niche as "drum music." I can see the skeptical comments now: "Oh, a looper? What do I need *that* for? I already do that!" No, of course not everyone is going to respond this way. But I think it's reasonable to think that at least some of them might. So a "looper" is, at least at this point in time, going to be thought of in a different sort of light, because when you make that sort of distinction distinction of terminology, there's a different set of associations that shows up. And who tends to come to mind when the idea of a looper comes up? People like Robert Fripp and David Torn. Why? Because they've got the most high profile of any "loopists" I can think of. Kim, this helps to answer your question from a week or so ago with regards to what it was exectly that Fripp did with looping that made him such an icon in the field. I would say it has less to do with the actual musical content of his looping, and more to do with the circumstantial element: He's one of the few people I can think of (maybe the *only* one at his level of visibility) who's consistently gone out there in front of people and looped live, in a manner that makes very clear and obvious display of the tools and methodology he's using. Most of the people, musicians or otherwise, who are familiar with real-time looping as a performance concept probably associate Fripp with it first and foremost, because of his high profile in general and his high looping profile in particular. When you look at the scarcity of live real-time loopists in the world, and then consider that Fripp's been looping live for about 20 years, you start to understand why it has this sort of guitaristic association. You also have to keep in mind that the sorts of synchronization and multiple loop features that would make current-generation loopers like the EDP or JamMan so well-suited to other musical areas are still very new ideas that not a lot of people are hip to. Previous to the advent of these kinds of devices, you were basically looking at electronic glorifications of a tape-loop-type of system. Not quite the same thing as what we have access to now. Even most of the people who *already own* these newer units tend to not delve into them all that heavilly, if the traffic I've read on this list is much of an indication. I attribute this largely to the fact that we tend to be creatures who follow example, and there aren't any readilly visible people out there who are exploiting the unique features endemic to current loopers in a way that we can easilly latch on to and emulate. I'd love to hear what Matthias Grob is doing, but I don't live in Brazil and I haven't yet tried to get a trans-continental mail order placed with him, so my options are limited. If you want to change this, you've got to target artists in non-guitaristic circles and find ways of publicising their use of the tools: for example, DJ/remix artist Junior Vazquez talking about how he uses a JamMan live, and running ads and testimonials in DJ and dance magazines. In order to follow through on this, and in order to make sure that your average uninformed consumer can get some real-world idea of how this can work for them, you've got to get clinicians to stage demonstrations and live performances via store tours or conventions like NAMM: people who know the tools, who know what they're doing, who can demonstrate and communicate the depth and breadth of these tools for the uninitiated. (It would help if at least some of them weren't guitarists.) Offer the unit to high-profile artists in non-guitaristic fields who have an inclination towards an experimental or real-time approach (Laurie Anderson comes to mind immediately, as does Ani DiFranco, who's actually been doing some primitive real time looping by sampling her voice in concert and then having the sound man play it back in order to generate virtual vocial harmonies) and have them endorse the products. Make up an Oberheim-produced demo CD featuring music made exclusively on the Echoplex, and offer it at a marginal price by mail or in stores to pique people's curiosity. Gear specific musical examples to specific features on the unit, which are obvious enough to demonstrate the technical process that's going on and musical enough to make people want to tap into it. Last, though certainly not least, organize the instruction manual in a way that encourages a guided tour approach so that people are led through the increasing levels of depth in a unit, rather than being plopped down in the middle of nowehere with a Thomas Guide. To add a quick aside to the recent debate regarding pricing, you should also consider exactly what you can afford to sell the unit for, and how much you're willing to trade a lower per-unit profit margin for a more enticing price point. Part of the reason I picked up my Echoplex at the end of 1995 was because I was able to get the unit plus the footswitch (both new) for about $540, from a dealer anxious to sell the thing. That's a very different story from the current $999 list price someone here quoted recently for the unit alone. Then you've got to hope that non-guitarists are able to make the translation. Keep in mind that the electric guitar is a fundamentally electronic instrument, so putting it through an electronic processor like a looper works very much in harmony with the fundamental nature of the instrument, and doesn't take anything away from it in a significant sense (audiophile debates regarding minutae such as gain stages and converters notwithstanding). An instrument like a saxophone, a human voice, a drumset, or any other purely acoustic instrument, on the other hand, has to take the rather serious and often compromising plunge into the electronic realm, which is a tradeoff many people will need a compelling reason to make. And finally, you've got to hope that these potential non-guitaristic loopists will *want* to make the translation. Real-time looping requires just that: real-time thought. Yes, I realize that most of the current crop of loopers that we have can work very effectively in a step-time/studio environment. But if somebody simply wants to do studio-based cut-and-paste looping in a standard step-time sense, why should they delve into a dedicated looper when a cheap sampler and sequencer can do the same thing (including some features very fundamental to sample-and-loop music that units like the JamMan and Echoplex can't do)? Tom Spaulding's idea about promoting the EDP as a sort of "real-time interactive personal multitrack" isn't a bad idea at all, but my main concern in taking that tactic is that it would slant the unit as a studio-based thing, which for the reasons I've already mentioned doesn't really embrace the unit's utmost potential. If I read a description of a unit like that, I'd associate it with some sort of actual recording system like a Roland VS-880 or a MiniDisc system, which could be an extremely misleading slant, not least of all because the EDP isn't really a "recorder" in the sense of storing something for reference later in the future (unless you consider MIDI data dump as exclusive storage medium to be a viable recording option). I personally usually describe the EDP as a very specialized form of sampler designed to work and operate spontaneoulsy, in real time. Tom gave a mammoth list of EDP users, and was wondering who should be the first main representative. Why choose? List them all, if only to demonstrate how wide-ranging the thing is and how many serious people use it. I would play up the real-time aspect, the multiple loop aspect, the MIDI sync features, the cut-and-paste methodology, and the pedalboard. These are things that set the unit apart. I'd take advantage of the hype over electronic music that's currently gripping the industry, and try to slant the EDP as a way to use the electronic side of things in a very organic, spontaneous, natural, real-time setting, but also underscore the applicability of these in a step-time context. (And I'd definitely include a URL for Looper's Delight in any print ad which was run, preferably linking it to a special page written and constructed with the specific intent of introducing people to what the unit has to offer.) And therein may lie the biggest challenge: real-time looping requires that you can (and *want to*) embrace the spontaneous, in-the-moment, improvisational aspect of music making that it lends itself to. And I just don't know how many people want to take that plunge. Look at the Yamaha VL-1: It was a breakthrough technological development, in that it required a real investment of skill and performance practice in order to harness some new sounds. But I'm not sure that a generation of music makers weaned on MIDI sequencing and sound modules and samples know how to use a live, spontaneous approach when they can get their music out much more easilly by pushing the start key on a sequencer. It's a different way of thinking and operating. So you've got to present an aspect of real-time looping that offers possibilities that wouldn't exist in the step-time realm. Otherwise, a lot of them aren't going to see a good reason to go for it. This isn't a criticism, or a ghettoization, or a manifesto of division. It's simply an observation and speculation on differences that I feel are already present. I apologize if anyone takes offense at my assumptions or conclusions, and welcome any alternative points of view. --Andre From ???@??? Sat Feb 14 02:06:07 1998 >From kflint Sat Feb 14 01:50:34 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y3eEu-0002Qs-00; Sat, 14 Feb 1998 01:50:28 -0800 Date: Sat, 14 Feb 1998 04:45:24 -0500 From: Michael Peters Subject: AW: Promoting Looping Sender: Michael Peters To: "'INTERNET:Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com'" Message-ID: <199802140445_MC2-3343-EA4A@compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Disposition: inline Resent-Message-ID: <"ZigEiC.A.Q7B.VgW50"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3288 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sat, 14 Feb 1998 01:50:28 -0800 X-UIDL: f65d36fb0adbbdd84d03e9601ecb438c Mark wrote, >it occured to me that Yahoo doesn't have a 'Looping' category. >Maybe this would help. At least we'd have a centralized >place on the web. very good idea. Kim, how about announcing your site (and the need for a new category) to Yahoo? Michael Peters http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/mpeters.htm From ???@??? Sat Feb 14 02:06:07 1998 >From kflint Sat Feb 14 01:50:16 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y3eEd-0002OK-00; Sat, 14 Feb 1998 01:50:11 -0800 Date: Sat, 14 Feb 1998 04:45:27 -0500 From: Michael Peters Subject: AW: Unsubcribe Sender: Michael Peters To: "'INTERNET:Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com'" Message-ID: <199802140445_MC2-3343-EA4B@compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Disposition: inline Resent-Message-ID: <"jqCTSC.A.y5B.MgW50"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3287 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sat, 14 Feb 1998 01:50:11 -0800 X-UIDL: 69a50233c4e5bd7153b068c4791b4ee9 > Unsubcribe ROFL! Michael Peters http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/mpeters.htm From ???@??? Sat Feb 14 02:16:50 1998 >From kflint Sat Feb 14 02:08:14 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y3eW5-0003Fe-00; Sat, 14 Feb 1998 02:08:13 -0800 X-Sender: kflint@pop.slip.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <34E54129.521D@earthlink.net> References: <2.2.32.19980214043851.00d0cc58@pop.chromatic.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sat, 14 Feb 1998 02:04:40 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Kim Flint Subject: Re: why do people think looping is just for guitar? Resent-Message-ID: <"RhYCl.A.R3C.EyW50"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3289 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sat, 14 Feb 1998 02:08:13 -0800 X-UIDL: 8998c6c28ff511d2ad1a3d96b9f8ed2e hey Andre, lots of good points. I think maybe I overemphasized the marketing of looping tools in my last pathetic attempt to make a point, and neglected the more musician/audience level of perception, acceptance, and expectation. That I think is important too, probably more so. If people are exploring this real-time looping thing in different musics or evolving it to another level or even pushing it in dramatically new directions, they will be greatly aided by a broader conception of "looping" in the minds of the mainstream music world. If people so readily associate looping as a "guitar thing" it limits the audience and sets expectations that may be wrong. The virtuostic loopers, if such beings are possible, should be appreciated for their conception, usage, and artistry of looping in its own right. At 11:00 PM -0800 2/13/98, Andre LaFosse wrote: >The people doing dance and hip-hop music generally make very >loop-oriented music, but it doesn't get done on gear that's thought of >as "a looper" per so. I mean, of course, that's *exactly* what they're >doing. But they're almost always doing it in step-time, with a sampler, >sequencer, computer, and multitrack studio setup. interestingly, in a totally unrelated situation, I was seeking opinions on sequencer programs to figure out if I should update my copy of studio vision or get something else. A lot of people kept hyping cubase, which seems to be used by nearly every dance producer. One of the things people seem to like about it are it's easy interface for looping and the real-time nature of it. It allows you to set up loops easily and to easily add things and experiment while the track keeps looping. One person went so far as to claim that feature this feature had a lot to do with the many innovations in dance music that have happened in recent years. hmmmmm.... And of course, everybody's nuts over rebirth, which is mostly a real time program, and is very loop oriented in its operation! This is part of a huge trend, with tons of very real-time programs and devices pointed at dance music creators. A lot of these devices turn out to have many similarities to devices like jamman and echoplex, just coming from a different direction. The step time depiction of electronic dance music is hardly so simple! I think people create with loops in a wide variety of ways in any genre. The real-time, largely improvisational approach that we mostly discuss here is indeed used by some people in the more dance type styles you mention, in a variety of interesting ways. And amongst the more droney ambient loopers there are many who carefully compose everything and use sequencers to accurately control the functions of their looping devices. And in all cases I think there are people using combinations of both approaches. (Like David Torn or Neal Schon or many others, who often improvise loops and record them so that they can compose a piece around it later, where the loop will be controlled by computers in a very step-time fashion.) In my experience, the separations you are trying to draw are very cloudy and indistinct. In reality, people use whichever approach makes sense to them in a given situation, whether real-time or step-time or some combination. When we talk about loop techniques, many of them work in either temporal context. Compositional elements of looping, for instance, can easily transcend the time related aspects of the creation. >And in a way, the very cross-stylistic nature of looping that Kim so >rightly brings up on occasion may actually be something of a hindrance >in terms of people coming to terms with a "looper," because if someone >makes hip-hop, or techno, or house, I'd dare say a significant number of >them take the looping aspect for granted, to the point where they don't >even think of it as being a distinct or defining handle for the music, I almost never use the word "looper" or "looping" to describe these things to people who are new to it, especially if they are coming from an electronic music background. "Real-Time Sampling" works much better in that case. (another example: for people really into sampling, looping is what you do to make the sample sustain! People who do a lot of sound design never understand looping in the way we mean here.) So perhaps there is a confusion of terminology? When I discuss the concept of "real-time sampling" with people interested in dance music, they have no problem grasping the idea or understanding how they would use it. >And who tends to come to mind when the idea of a looper comes up? >People like Robert Fripp and David Torn. Why? Because they've got the >most high profile of any "loopists" I can think of. *For You!* For a lot of people, it's totally different! That's the whole point of this discussion. Looping is a varied, fragmented thing, with numerous lines of development. I don't think any one of them has some right to claim itself as the true looping lineage and deny all the others. Its absurd! My interest, and again the reason why this forum even exists, is to bring these different camps together in the interest of sharing ideas and learning from each other. For that to work, we have to remain open and accepting of ideas and musics and approaches that may be very different from our own. As long as that fails to happen I will continue to make this point, which will presumably be forever. >Kim, this helps to answer your question from a week or so ago with >regards to what it was exectly that Fripp did with looping that made him >such an icon in the field. Well, that sounds like I had a bit more attitude about it than I did! Actually I was just hoping to get people away from endlessly discussing Robert Fripp's performance behaviors and back to something more related to the list topic. I figured if they could still talk about Fripp, it might ease them into it. I was sort of disappointed that the only person who had anything to say about it was Reg. His post was great and interesting, but considering the quantity of interest in the guy, I sort of expected a little more from the rest of you. For instance, Fripp sets his different delay lines to specific mathematical ratios with the intent of creating evolving textures that repeat in a long, yet specific amount of time. I don't know what the numerical significance is to him (if any) but it seems like he often uses prime number ratios, like 31:7 or something. Now how is it that I know that and none of you Fripp fans ever brought it up? jeez. >You also have to keep in mind that the sorts of synchronization and >multiple loop features that would make current-generation loopers like >the EDP or JamMan so well-suited to other musical areas are still very >new ideas that not a lot of people are hip to. as someone once said, we're only in the very beginning of all this..... >This isn't a criticism, or a ghettoization, or a manifesto of division. >It's simply an observation and speculation on differences that I feel >are already present. I apologize if anyone takes offense at my >assumptions or conclusions, and welcome any alternative points of view. none taken! kim ______________________________________________________________________ Kim Flint | Looper's Delight kflint@annihilist.com | http://www.annihilist.com/loop/loop.html http://www.annihilist.com/ | Loopers-Delight-request@annihilist.com From ???@??? Sat Feb 14 02:16:55 1998 >From kflint Sat Feb 14 02:12:44 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y3eaQ-0003cY-00; Sat, 14 Feb 1998 02:12:42 -0800 X-Sender: kflint@pop.slip.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <199802140445_MC2-3343-EA4A@compuserve.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sat, 14 Feb 1998 02:10:27 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Kim Flint Subject: Re: AW: Promoting Looping Resent-Message-ID: <"oKGPcB.A.EOD.X2W50"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3290 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sat, 14 Feb 1998 02:12:42 -0800 X-UIDL: 5d9528270e3db2d1779195dbe270f2ce >Mark wrote, > >>it occured to me that Yahoo doesn't have a 'Looping' category. >>Maybe this would help. At least we'd have a centralized >>place on the web. > >very good idea. Kim, how about announcing your site (and the need for a new >category) to Yahoo? LD is in Yahoo somewhere. I think it's under "sampling" or something. Another category would be handy I guess. Would people have their sites filed in that category? kim ______________________________________________________________________ Kim Flint | Looper's Delight kflint@annihilist.com | http://www.annihilist.com/loop/loop.html http://www.annihilist.com/ | Loopers-Delight-request@annihilist.com From ???@??? Sat Feb 14 15:10:53 1998 >From kflint Sat Feb 14 07:39:56 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y3jh4-0006wB-00; Sat, 14 Feb 1998 07:39:54 -0800 Date: Sat, 14 Feb 1998 10:37:15 GMT Message-Id: <199802141037.KAA21520@phyleus.interlinx.qc.ca> X-Sender: erich@interlinx.qc.ca X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: erich kory Subject: Re: why do people think looping is just for guitar? Resent-Message-ID: <"s4JfKB.A.5PG.vob50"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3298 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sat, 14 Feb 1998 07:39:54 -0800 X-UIDL: f8cb700cda074070e8b66846a1cf1f70 I feel i've been all alone useing these effects and loopers with cello. It's true that all these machines are constructed with guitar in mind, but they all work well withjust about any input you want to give. My problem is in the perception of people about cello. They think it will just be another classical or neo-classical type concert and are always suprised to here the cello sound like Jimi or a keyboard or like more than one at a time. I get my best responces when the audiance is taken completely by suprise, in a club or rock concert setting. My cd has the biggest problems because it's not in any catagorie whatsoever, yet many people are absolutly in love with it! So, perception is something we all must look at. We can't expect it to change any faster than it is i suppose. erich kory >It's more the perception of looping by others. I regularly see it being >depicted as something for guitar players, whether it's by salesmen or media >or other musicians. *That's* what mysifies me! Is this just because lots of >guitar players do it? Or because it's been guitar oriented people involved >in manufacturing them and therefore that's where they place it? > >To me, using real-time loops for percussion or cello or radio transmissions >or whatever seems just as valid. Why don't other people see it that way? >What do we do to change that perception? > >kim > >______________________________________________________________________ >Kim Flint | Looper's Delight >kflint@annihilist.com | http://www.annihilist.com/loop/loop.html >http://www.annihilist.com/ | Loopers-Delight-request@annihilist.com > > > > From ???@??? Sat Feb 14 15:11:01 1998 >From kflint Sat Feb 14 07:52:45 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y3jtT-0000F3-00; Sat, 14 Feb 1998 07:52:43 -0800 Date: Sat, 14 Feb 1998 10:50:24 GMT Message-Id: <199802141050.KAA22174@phyleus.interlinx.qc.ca> X-Sender: erich@interlinx.qc.ca X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: erich kory Subject: Ground Control Resent-Message-ID: <"3Xml7D.A.aB.E1b50"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3300 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sat, 14 Feb 1998 07:52:43 -0800 X-UIDL: 869e44967334515bd41bf1ba49269c92 Kim, Now that i have installed the new upgrade and checked to see that i could not activate loops 1-9 seperately with my Ground Control, i know i must buy a new MIDI foot controller. Can you tell me what exactly i should look for. Is it correct to get one that sends MIDI note messages? Is it sure that will work? It's too bad that i can't keep the ground Control, it has worked well for me for over 5 years, but maybe i have more to learn about MIDI. Thanks, erich kory > > From ???@??? Sat Feb 14 15:10:44 1998 >From kflint Sat Feb 14 03:30:27 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y3fnd-0005vk-00; Sat, 14 Feb 1998 03:30:25 -0800 Date: Sat, 14 Feb 1998 06:28:12 -0500 From: buzzard@world.std.com (Sean T Barrett) Message-Id: <199802141128.AA01788@world.std.com> To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: why do people think looping is just for guitar? References: <2.2.32.19980214043851.00d0cc58@pop.chromatic.com> Resent-Message-ID: <"w0XIlB.A.DYF.P_X50"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3291 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sat, 14 Feb 1998 03:30:25 -0800 X-UIDL: a82c99182c7de2a73cf5ace530a5b667 >For instance, Fripp sets his different delay lines to specific >mathematical ratios with the intent of creating evolving textures >that repeat in a long, yet specific amount of time. I >don't know what the numerical significance is to him (if any) but it seems >like he often uses prime number ratios, like 31:7 or something. Now how is >it that I know that and none of you Fripp fans ever brought it up? Umm, well, where would we go to learn about stuff like technical looping tricks like that other than Looper's digest? I for one _listen_ to Fripp. How the heck could I know anything like the above? So, for me, the answer is "because you knew it and I didn't". Maybe it's common knowledge amongst some community, but I'm not sure who that would be. As to the "significance" of such numbers, surely it's not numerology. The two numbers must be "relatively prime" (share no factors) for consistency: 4:6 is the same as 2:3, so you say 2:3. Allowing the two numbers to be close together (e.g. 30:31) obviously makes the loops slowly shift off from one another, and presumably he wants something more dramatic. Why can't he use 8:31? Good question. For any ratio (I'll use numbers here so I won't scare anyone away, but you could substitute any relatively prime ratio) say 31:7, the 31 will repeat 7 times in the same time the 7 repeats 31 times. Assuming these are in seconds, the length before they repeat is 7*31, or about 3.5 minutes; enough that no repitition will be obvious. However, you can have "almost" repetitions. If you use 31:8, after the 8 repeats 4 times, it's 5th will start at 32 seconds, one second into the 31's second repeat. (8*4+1 = 32). Thus, it might be audibly "almost repeating". 7, however, doesn't come "close" to repeating the first 31... it starts at 28 and at 35, so it's halfway through the 7 loop when the 31 loops, instead of (as in the 8), being close to the loop boundary. However, after _two_ times around the 31, you get an "almost" repeat. This is hard to avoid unless you make both delay times long, which he presumably wants to avoid. Personally, I don't have the luxury of using multiple delays in parallel. Ah, if only the mythical polyphonic jamman upgrade had happened! Sean Barrett From ???@??? Sat Feb 14 15:10:49 1998 >From kflint Sat Feb 14 05:22:34 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y3hY6-0001Vn-00; Sat, 14 Feb 1998 05:22:30 -0800 Date: Sat, 14 Feb 1998 08:15:15 -0500 From: R & T Cummings Subject: RE: Good ole days Sender: R & T Cummings To: "INTERNET:Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com" Message-ID: <199802140816_MC2-3343-935C@compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Disposition: inline Resent-Message-ID: <"whHx1C.A.T3.klZ50"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3294 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sat, 14 Feb 1998 05:22:30 -0800 X-UIDL: 8154042f46df8225fdb4e1957b6b693f Frank who? Robert who? ;-) You Frippians are a relentless bunch ... Reg wrote: >Fripp (and Sinatra) will be remembered long after Snoop Doggy Dogg, Puff Daddy, Bruce Springsteen (who?), or Whitney Houston are forgotten (I give it a hundred years).< From ???@??? Sat Feb 14 15:10:47 1998 >From kflint Sat Feb 14 05:21:55 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y3hXU-0001R5-00; Sat, 14 Feb 1998 05:21:52 -0800 Date: Sat, 14 Feb 1998 08:15:19 -0500 From: R & T Cummings Subject: RE: Guitar-o-centrism Sender: R & T Cummings To: "INTERNET:Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com" Cc: "[unbekannt]" <101723.1301@compuserve.com> Message-ID: <199802140815_MC2-3343-935E@compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Disposition: inline Resent-Message-ID: <"QE3h1D.A.8y.ClZ50"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3293 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sat, 14 Feb 1998 05:21:52 -0800 X-UIDL: 1b43e9dee87a448f386e6fd228019ae5 You mean want of those rubber bands that've been discovered at excavations of ancient looping sites (i.e. stone tablets)? Sorry, couldn't resist. :-) ;-) Reg wrote: >Try to make a piano with a stick and rubber band and get back to me.< From ???@??? Sat Feb 14 15:10:46 1998 >From kflint Sat Feb 14 05:21:38 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y3hXE-0001PH-00; Sat, 14 Feb 1998 05:21:36 -0800 Date: Sat, 14 Feb 1998 08:15:22 -0500 From: R & T Cummings Subject: Re: why do people think looping is just for guitar? Sender: R & T Cummings To: "INTERNET:Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com" Message-ID: <199802140815_MC2-3343-9360@compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Disposition: inline Resent-Message-ID: <"bZCOID.A.Qx.4kZ50"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3292 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sat, 14 Feb 1998 05:21:36 -0800 X-UIDL: 9aba4a79d396bd07e7bfc8afd6b90e7f Just what ratios are possible with the EDP? The JamMan only offers me MIDI 1/4-note snyc ratios of 3, 4, 6, 8, 12, 16 and 24. Kim wrote: >For instance, Fripp sets his different delay lines to specific mathematical ratios with the intent of creating evolving textures that repeat in a long, yet specific amount of time. I don't know what the numerical significance is to him (if any) but it seems like he often uses prime number ratios, like 31:7 or something. Now how is it that I know that and none of you Fripp fans ever brought it up?< From ???@??? Sat Feb 14 15:10:50 1998 >From kflint Sat Feb 14 07:10:51 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y3jEv-00057Y-00; Sat, 14 Feb 1998 07:10:49 -0800 From: Marzzz@aol.com Message-ID: <384a53e1.34e5b350@aol.com> Date: Sat, 14 Feb 1998 10:07:57 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: What does a Echo-plex cost? Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 84 Resent-Message-ID: <"eQoHJC.A.qkE.jNb50"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3295 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sat, 14 Feb 1998 07:10:49 -0800 X-UIDL: 6b70eed977ff34de14b5772b6ba263e3 In a message dated 2/12/98 9:27:09 AM, you wrote: <> Allan Holdsworth. But then again, he loaded up the truck and moved to San Diego....... From ???@??? Sat Feb 14 15:10:51 1998 >From kflint Sat Feb 14 07:14:32 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y3jIU-0005Vu-00; Sat, 14 Feb 1998 07:14:30 -0800 Date: Sat, 14 Feb 1998 10:11:44 -0500 (EST) X-Sender: zenart@future.dreamscape.com Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: loopers-delight@annihilist.com From: zenart@dreamscape.com (gregory f yates) Subject: eh pedals Resent-Message-ID: <"BubmUC.A._6E.6Qb50"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3296 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sat, 14 Feb 1998 07:14:30 -0800 X-UIDL: d23991cdc9809dd824eac084fa76a523 Im interested in the eh pedals post but need the phone # again cant find it thanks zenartist From ???@??? Sat Feb 14 15:10:52 1998 >From kflint Sat Feb 14 07:17:58 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y3jLp-0005sR-00; Sat, 14 Feb 1998 07:17:57 -0800 From: Marzzz@aol.com Message-ID: <54850163.34e5b4b8@aol.com> Date: Sat, 14 Feb 1998 10:13:58 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: What does a Echo-plex cost? Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 84 Resent-Message-ID: <"CIFT0D.A.EOF.vTb50"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3297 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sat, 14 Feb 1998 07:17:57 -0800 X-UIDL: eb00a98902383a181863d33df3ea4c2e In a message dated 2/12/98 12:10:45 PM, you wrote: <> Yeah, very curious, because I recently saw Fripp and he had FOUR TC2290's in his rack. I couldn't help but wonder why he wasn't using EDP's or Jam Men....... Marshall btw- I still have those four 1 Meg SIMMS for the EDP....does anyone need them? From ???@??? Sat Feb 14 15:11:00 1998 >From kflint Sat Feb 14 07:44:48 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y3jll-0007Uj-00; Sat, 14 Feb 1998 07:44:45 -0800 From: Marzzz@aol.com Message-ID: <2c478687.34e5bae3@aol.com> Date: Sat, 14 Feb 1998 10:40:17 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com, nyfac2@nyfac.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Don't go see..... Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 84 Resent-Message-ID: <"OrJxC.A.uuG.zsb50"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3299 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sat, 14 Feb 1998 07:44:45 -0800 X-UIDL: 6eac5f922cba6f2e0d7047777094152b In a message dated 2/13/98 1:14:56 PM, Trev wrote: <> Case in point: I saw U2 at a stadium this past summer, the (classic rock born and bred) crowd went wild during their older hits, and became mysteriously quiet and distracted when U2 tried to play a couple of songs from their new album.....same thing with the Stones later that fall..... Marshall From ???@??? Sat Feb 14 15:11:02 1998 >From kflint Sat Feb 14 07:57:10 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y3jxk-0000fn-00; Sat, 14 Feb 1998 07:57:08 -0800 Message-Id: <199802141554.KAA28343@shell.monmouth.com> Reply-To: From: "andre" To: , "'Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com'" Subject: Looping other instruments Date: Sat, 14 Feb 1998 10:54:12 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1162 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"dJOdKD.A.8Z.E5b50"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3301 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sat, 14 Feb 1998 07:57:08 -0800 X-UIDL: a607c315157f413a742b86cb1cfafcde re: looping non- guitar. if you ever get a chance, see will calhoun's excellent trio/quartet called AZA.. or duo HEADFAKE. .. both feature bassist Doug Wimbush (ex living colour as well) and they both have jammen - Will's is used on a Korg wavedrum, kind of a VG8 of drums, it can model pretty much any imaginable surface, from tablas, snares, toms, cymbals, to martian log drums, and analog percussive synth noises anyway - will usually does some crazy looping, putting this thing thru a whammy pedal then the jam man..... he's insane. andre' From ???@??? Sat Feb 14 15:11:03 1998 >From kflint Sat Feb 14 08:05:02 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y3k5M-0001IH-00; Sat, 14 Feb 1998 08:05:00 -0800 From: Marzzz@aol.com Message-ID: <5cdf4939.34e5be6d@aol.com> Date: Sat, 14 Feb 1998 10:55:23 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: RE: why do people think looping is just for guitar? Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 84 Resent-Message-ID: <"dyt4GB.A.P9.PAc50"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3302 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sat, 14 Feb 1998 08:05:00 -0800 X-UIDL: 33bbb4362a74787ef8d73b027e34a36b In a message dated 2/13/98 10:41:56 PM, you wrote: <> Give an EDP to Bjork. Seriously..... Marshall From ???@??? Sat Feb 14 15:11:03 1998 >From kflint Sat Feb 14 08:09:09 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y3k9J-0001lv-00; Sat, 14 Feb 1998 08:09:05 -0800 From: Marzzz@aol.com Message-ID: <837a3b4c.34e5c0c7@aol.com> Date: Sat, 14 Feb 1998 11:05:22 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: What does a Echo-plex cost? Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 84 Resent-Message-ID: <"juJKo.A.-UB.mDc50"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3303 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sat, 14 Feb 1998 08:09:05 -0800 X-UIDL: 8397a72c483bda8e36d887d3b95341ac In a message dated 2/14/98 9:17:32 AM, I wrote: <> Sorry people, after reading the posts regarding the mythical Frippian prime number looping numerology, I have the answer to my own question..... From ???@??? Sat Feb 14 15:11:13 1998 >From kflint Sat Feb 14 09:22:54 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y3lIi-0005Ed-00; Sat, 14 Feb 1998 09:22:52 -0800 Message-ID: <34E5D1A6.52FC@engin.umich.edu> Date: Sat, 14 Feb 1998 12:17:26 -0500 From: Darcy Clark Reply-To: darcyc@engin.umich.edu Organization: University of Michigan X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Acid - "loop-based music production tool " Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"C3fGM.A.vqE.SJd50"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3304 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sat, 14 Feb 1998 09:22:52 -0800 X-UIDL: d6f59959be700610966ba680fe44f13d http://www.sonicfoundry.com/Acid/default.html thought some of you may be interested in a new "loop-based music production tool" - looks vaguely cool, but a little expensive for me From ???@??? Sat Feb 14 15:11:16 1998 >From kflint Sat Feb 14 10:23:09 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y3mF0-0000IC-00; Sat, 14 Feb 1998 10:23:06 -0800 Date: Sat, 14 Feb 1998 13:19:23 -0500 (EST) From: Nick Ring X-Sender: nick@plato Reply-To: Nick Ring cc: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Looping cellos... In-Reply-To: <34E5D1A6.52FC@engin.umich.edu> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Resent-Message-ID: <"h3HKTC.A.NC.zBe50"@ferret> To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3305 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sat, 14 Feb 1998 10:23:06 -0800 X-UIDL: 804ace6a6ca17a811ea784c28eba622b Can't talk long, but I want to throw this out. Looping cello can be absolutely amazing. There's a fellow from Amherst, MA, Gideon Freudmann who does amazing solo cello shows involving much loopage (and he has a terrific sense of humor). When I first saw him, maybe 7 or 8 years ago he was using a digitech 20/20 and that carried him on through until a couple years back when he bought a jamman. Sadly, I haven't seen him play much since then. He performs many original songs, a few covers (Taj Mahal, the Holy Modal Rounders, &c), and live he does a number of looping crazies. He's put out maybe 4 tapes and I think 5 CDs now. I was just looking 'round for his email address. Can't find it offhand. A web search'll probably pull up some good results. try "cellobop" and/or "Gideon Freudmann". -nick From ???@??? Sat Feb 14 15:11:17 1998 >From kflint Sat Feb 14 10:30:18 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y3mLw-0000tR-00; Sat, 14 Feb 1998 10:30:16 -0800 Date: Sat, 14 Feb 1998 13:26:46 -0500 (EST) From: Nick Ring X-Sender: nick@plato To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Looping cellos... In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Resent-Message-ID: <"9_oCqB.A.Ym.gIe50"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3306 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sat, 14 Feb 1998 10:30:16 -0800 X-UIDL: 4692524bc4389bf72ca8b6301c2eea8a A quick addendum. His page is at www.cellobop.com it figures. -nick From ???@??? Sat Feb 14 15:11:17 1998 >From kflint Sat Feb 14 10:45:36 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y3mak-0001sg-00; Sat, 14 Feb 1998 10:45:34 -0800 From: PMimlitsch@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Sat, 14 Feb 1998 13:39:37 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Torn in Phila Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 85 Resent-Message-ID: <"nugnN.A.ogB.qWe50"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3307 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sat, 14 Feb 1998 10:45:34 -0800 X-UIDL: 3e06d12fa367cb5db16cf8b1724724fd The following is a forward of a message sent out to wxpn radio listeners by Chuck VanZyle host of the Star's End Radio Show: <> From ???@??? Sat Feb 14 15:11:19 1998 >From kflint Sat Feb 14 12:16:01 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y3o0F-0006L9-00; Sat, 14 Feb 1998 12:15:59 -0800 Message-ID: <34E5FC71.672B@earthlink.net> Date: Sat, 14 Feb 1998 12:20:01 -0800 From: Andre LaFosse Reply-To: altruist@earthlink.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01-C-MACOS8 (Macintosh; I; 68K) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: why do people think looping is just for guitar? References: <2.2.32.19980214043851.00d0cc58@pop.chromatic.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"W1-KgC.A.HtF.irf50"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3308 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sat, 14 Feb 1998 12:15:59 -0800 X-UIDL: 9f44153a570cd6fab3d87739915601af Kim Flint wrote: > >And who tends to come to mind when the idea of a looper comes up? > >People like Robert Fripp and David Torn. Why? Because they've got the > >most high profile of any "loopists" I can think of. > > *For You!* For a lot of people, it's totally different! That's the whole > point of this discussion. Looping is a varied, fragmented thing, with > numerous lines of development. I don't think any one of them has some right > to claim itself as the true looping lineage and deny all the others. Its > absurd! Looks like it's my turn to not be getting my point across! Rest assured, Kim, I'm not some hardcore Frippophile who wakes up in the morning and listens to his Soundscapes CD collection in sequential order whilst accessing the aphorism generator at the DGM website before practicing angular odd-metered picking exercises in the New Standard Tuning. I'm *not* saying that Fripp is the True Looping Lineage. I'm talking about public perception of a very particular type of looping that not a lot of people are associated with. If somebody walks on stage in public and starts doing real-time looping with some sort of dedicated looper or delay line (or reel-to-reel tape loop, for that matter), using some instrument as a source sound, I would dare say that for those people who have some prior reference point for what's going on, that Fripp is going to be one of the first people to come to mind, because of the methodology of that particular approach. I'm not talking about ReBirth-style "real-time" data entry, I'm talking about recording and looping a sound right then and there. I remember loaning an old Alesis Quadraverb to a cellist, who stumbled across a very ordinary delay patch which compelled him to remark that he'd love to experiment with my "Frippertronics" patch. The Electro-Harmonix 16-second delay used to be advertised as a "Fripp-in-a-box." And there's actually a patch on at least one model of the Eventide Harmonizer called (you guessed it) "Frippertronics." It's a fairly long mono delay line with high feedback. Let me ask you this: How many non-guitarists can you think of who have a visible public profile in live, real-time looping, in the sort of way that involves an EDP or Boomarang or JamMan or some such similar device? (Again, I'm not talking about a ReBirth type of live programming/electronic synthesis or sample playback device, which is a completely different breed altogether). How many of them have been doing it as long as Fripp, in as many different sorts of live situations as he has? I've got to underscore this: I'm *not* talking about the actual musical content or value of what he does. I'm talking about what leads people to make this connection between real-time looping and guitar playing. These aren't my own, personal value judgements. They're my observations on what sorts of things tend to foster certain public perceptions. > For instance, Fripp sets his different > delay lines to specific mathematical ratios with the intent of creating > evolving textures that repeat in a long, yet specific amount of time. I > don't know what the numerical significance is to him (if any) but it seems > like he often uses prime number ratios, like 31:7 or something. Now how is > it that I know that and none of you Fripp fans ever brought it up? jeez. Maybe it's because this sort of info is far from common knowledge. I've read many, many interviews with Fripp, including several where he talks about his looping approach. He tends to go on in depth about various intellectual and philosophical postulations, but very rarely, if ever, delves into concrete technical information. If this is information you got from him when you met him during your G-WIZ tenure, then take some satisfaction in having been privy to some pretty rare information, and please try not to get irate with us ordinary folk over the fact that not all of us are granted the chance to talk to famous loopists on that sort of in-depth basis. If it's info you gleaned somewhere else, then you either stumbled into a very obscure source of information, or else the rest of us are even more dense and clueless than we'd thought. Let's hope it's not that last one... -Andre From ???@??? Sat Feb 14 15:11:25 1998 >From kflint Sat Feb 14 14:39:07 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y3qEh-0005f7-00; Sat, 14 Feb 1998 14:39:03 -0800 Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sat, 14 Feb 1998 14:36:46 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: improv@peak.org (Dave Trenkel) Subject: Re: DON'T GO SEE A LIVE BAND -- YOU'LL BE BORED!!! Resent-Message-ID: <"EqS3mD.A.DDF.kxh50"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3309 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sat, 14 Feb 1998 14:39:03 -0800 X-UIDL: 7a847c367baa5614daafea104d838a65 At 10:01 AM 2/13/98, David Kirkdorffer wrote: > I know SO MANY PEOPLE who feel this way. I think it's part of >why - at least in Boston - live music venues are shrinking or closing. >Less people are going out to see bands - I think they feel they're not >going to see anything new. They're mostly right. > > And yet - at least in Boston - seems club-booking personnel are >a little fearful of bring in stuff that seems too esoteric. Music >"Scenes" are so fractured and sub-fractured - it's hard to know what >will appeal to a wide enough scope of tastes. > > Also, I think it's true that there are other things people can >do with there time now. > > Anyway, this is getting off-topic. > > To reel it back in, how about a question: > *What can we Loopers do to help promote our live and recorded >performances??* > > David - I Like asking questions - Kirkdorffer > Hi David, No answers, at least none I can put down in words in the time I have now, but... I'm going to be near Boston (Reading) next Thursday and Friday, on business. Any cool shows? Cool record, music equipment stores? I don't have a lot of free time, unfortunately, but I'd like to make it out for at least one evening. ________________________________________________________ Dave Trenkel : improv@peak.org : www.peak.org/~improv/ "...there will come a day when you won't have to use gasoline. You'd simply take a cassette and put it in your car, let it run. You'd have to have the proper type of music. Like you take two sticks, put 'em together, make fire. You take some notes and rub 'em together - dum, dum, dum, dum - fire, cosmic fire." -Sun Ra ________________________________________________________ From ???@??? Sun Feb 15 00:49:19 1998 >From kflint Sat Feb 14 18:46:23 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y3u62-0000sD-00; Sat, 14 Feb 1998 18:46:22 -0800 Message-Id: <199802150243.VAA18043@shell.monmouth.com> Reply-To: From: "andre" To: , Subject: RE; advice for bands Date: Sat, 14 Feb 1998 21:42:48 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1162 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"2vtHWD.A.An.0Zl50"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3310 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sat, 14 Feb 1998 18:46:22 -0800 X-UIDL: 7c211d8947035f8fa8ecdc3bcab978b5 > Local/small acts (or large well known acts for that matter) take too dang long > to set up and get started: tune before you go on, and start when you're set up. > I absolutely hate (and always have) waiting around for a band to start for no > good reason. No one, I REPEAT, NO ONE likes to wait. >When your set is done, tear down and get off the stage. > If your running sound and someone in the crowd makes a suggestion, at least > consider it. > > Smokers suck. They do, it's just a fact of life. You have to suck to enjoy a > cigarette. I'll put up with a little smoke if the person smoking the cigarette doesn't hold the thing in my face when they're not toking. Hey, it's your cigarette, if you don't want the smoldering hunk of stench in your face what makes you think I want it in mine? great points, d, some of the stuff i've forgotten along the way. we need to respect the audiences a LOT more - i am guilty of being in projects that wait and wait for the 'crowd to fill in' - but we're just punishing those who've arrived at the advertized time!! All good points, and hats off to the bravery it takes to slag smokers - as much as they complain - it's very simple - they're doing something that transcends their own experience, and it becomes your experience against your will !! but as a musician i've learned to deal with it - i take 3000-5000mg vitamin C before a show, maybe some echinacea, drink lots of water, and hope for the best. From ???@??? Sun Feb 15 00:49:23 1998 >From kflint Sat Feb 14 21:44:11 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y3ws5-0000jj-00; Sat, 14 Feb 1998 21:44:09 -0800 Message-ID: <19980215054051.18936.rocketmail@send1a.yahoomail.com> Date: Sat, 14 Feb 1998 21:40:51 -0800 (PST) From: Bret Subject: Re: plastic tubes creating lightning To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Resent-Message-ID: <"uzpqIC.A.yb.GAo50"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3311 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sat, 14 Feb 1998 21:44:09 -0800 X-UIDL: fcd81e728f9aeb00510a5c9970c33fb8 Paolo wrote: >So I thought it would be cool to have a plastic or rubber tube rigged so I could play Stick in the normal position yet be able to blow some air onto my Stick pickups at the same time.< Rob wrote: making timpani-like pitch swells on his floor tom. As I looked closer to see how he was doing this, I saw that he was blowing air through a plastic tube into the "breathing" hole on the side of the tom. Last night I saw a documentary about launching model rockets into storm clouds. These rockets carried a trailing thin wire that unreeled as the rocket went higher. The wire was grounded in order to cause controlled lightning strikes, that were recorded visually and electrically. The launch of the rockets was controlled at a distance, by forcing air (breath) through a clear plastic tube, for safety reasons. This provided insulation from the control site to the launch (and lightning) site. bret _________________________________________________________ DO YOU YAHOO!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com From ???@??? Mon Feb 16 02:36:55 1998 >From kflint Sun Feb 15 13:32:45 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y4Bg4-0003S6-00; Sun, 15 Feb 1998 13:32:44 -0800 Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sun, 15 Feb 1998 15:55:12 +0200 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: patrick@his.com (Patrick Smith) Subject: Re: looping, schmooping. Resent-Message-ID: <"iy7DQC.A.1AD.y5150"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3318 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sun, 15 Feb 1998 13:32:44 -0800 X-UIDL: 1aa946fb67638f66a0f5add3f73e6a2a On 2/15/98 RA said: >Hey loopers. I went to hear the Assad Brothers play last night... > >now; here am I, an electric guitarist very much into looping and these boys >got me to thinking along the lines of: >"... wow. little wooden guitars; much big music..." > >Do yourselves a favor and go hear them if you get the chance. might be a good >reality check while you are puzzling out that fancy new signal-routing scheme. > >cheers! >RA I'll second that. I saw these brothers about 9 years ago. Truly amazing! Patrick *** *** ** Fingerpaint http://www.his.com/~patrick/FNGP.html *** ** From ???@??? Sun Feb 15 11:10:03 1998 >From kflint Sun Feb 15 09:09:38 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y47ZQ-0006Kt-00; Sun, 15 Feb 1998 09:09:36 -0800 Message-ID: <01BD3A0A.762879D0.douglas-lawrence@home.com> From: Douglas Lawrence Reply-To: "douglas-lawrence@home.com" To: "'Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com'" Subject: Any Lexicon Inside Information? Date: Sun, 15 Feb 1998 12:08:42 -0500 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet E-mail/MAPI - 8.0.0.4211 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"lbe05B.A.itF.EDy50"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3312 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sun, 15 Feb 1998 09:09:36 -0800 X-UIDL: 7fa8f9f647a373fa123b98a2998d53f2 >From what I heard, Lexicon was upset that the Jam Man was still in high demand even though they discontinued it. Someone in Looper's Delight was saying that a rep at NAMM claimed that they wanted to get back into the market with a successor to the Jam Man. Anybody know what's cookin' in the Lexicon hallways? From ???@??? Sun Feb 15 11:10:04 1998 >From kflint Sun Feb 15 09:58:53 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y48L6-0000eQ-00; Sun, 15 Feb 1998 09:58:52 -0800 Date: Sun, 15 Feb 1998 12:55:32 -0500 (EST) From: Monkici@aol.com Message-ID: <980215125531_1110546979@mrin52> To: loopers-delight@annihilist.com Subject: 4 meg simms? Resent-Message-ID: <"ex3Uh.A.UY.Txy50"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3313 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sun, 15 Feb 1998 09:58:52 -0800 X-UIDL: a7600976e2f1f3f1dfd5650144098660 could someone e-mail me individually and share a source or two for 4 meg simms for 'plex? thanks. r. From ???@??? Mon Feb 16 02:36:46 1998 >From kflint Sun Feb 15 11:37:04 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y49s7-00053C-00; Sun, 15 Feb 1998 11:37:03 -0800 X-Sender: tomroady@mail.telalink.net Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sun, 15 Feb 1998 13:33:47 -0600 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: tomroady@telalink.net (THOMAS W ROADY) Subject: Drum and Percussion Looping Resent-Message-ID: <"pY-sJB.A.5hE.XN050"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3314 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sun, 15 Feb 1998 11:37:03 -0800 X-UIDL: 81c31c1da52d63be1ca4358e2437716a R_T_Cummings wrote: >Related to the looper as guitarrist thread: >Maybe stuff like this and the Vinx/ Calhoun project can introduce = > >the whole concept of looping to the broad masses of drummers/ = > >percussionists. I know that other drummers in my area (Berlin) are = > >hot on the idea of getting into looping - but unfortunately there = > >aren't any products currently available over here (Jamman is gone = > >and EDP unavailable). Which is not to say that I don't cherish my = > >role as probably the only drummer in town to own a looper ;-) > >Rob Rob, Tell me more about the VINX/Calhoun Project. I assume you are talking Will Calhoun. I just saw him at NAMM playing a small kit with 2 wavedrums. He was playing in a small alcove with a guitar player at some booth. I was there demoing Zendrums. I am really getting into this EDP. It is too KOOL! I have been mostly using it(as at NAMM) with the ZENDRUM but I just aquired a Wavedrum and I am going to be getting some microphines for acoustic percussion..Djembe congas etc.. Any hints on getting the acoustics into the loop at the correct input levels?. Tom From ???@??? Mon Feb 16 02:37:23 1998 >From kflint Sun Feb 15 20:06:43 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y4HpJ-0001GA-00; Sun, 15 Feb 1998 20:06:41 -0800 Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sun, 15 Feb 1998 22:28:57 +0200 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: patrick@his.com (Patrick Smith) Subject: Re: question: mackie&jamman-vortex set Resent-Message-ID: <"7Tp2sB.A.x6.4q750"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3325 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sun, 15 Feb 1998 20:06:41 -0800 X-UIDL: 21b002cf0623ee3e349409251a333f61 >Hello, Jesus >I hate to tell you how much my routing life improved when I sold my beloved >little 1202 and got a 1604vlz! >dpc > > I'll second that. I still have my 1202, BUT the 1604 opens up many many doors. I have my three jam men and a RDS 8000 on the sub out with the outputs coming back into the mixer so that I can send them anywhere. Then I have the Vortex, LXP-5, Sherman Filterbank, Korg A-3, on the effects sends. Throw in the guitar tone( heaven forbid!!!) and the outputs form my GR-1, Matrix 6, and a Yahmaha TX 81z, Korg Poly 6 and you have one heck of a racket potential. Patrick *** *** ** Fingerpaint http://www.his.com/~patrick/FNGP.html *** ** From ???@??? Mon Feb 16 02:36:49 1998 >From kflint Sun Feb 15 12:53:34 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y4B48-0000xV-00; Sun, 15 Feb 1998 12:53:32 -0800 X-Sender: tomroady@mail.telalink.net Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sun, 15 Feb 1998 14:50:10 -0600 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: tomroady@telalink.net (THOMAS W ROADY) Subject: Tom "doin' standup on the side" Spaulding Resent-Message-ID: <"QW0oOB.A.Zr.-U150"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3315 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sun, 15 Feb 1998 12:53:32 -0800 X-UIDL: 87d6bce3eb99d9cb54bed480a736228f Tom Spaulding wrote: >Hmmm. I have been writing and re-writing a proposal to treat the EDP as a >"real-time interactive personal multi-track" (to paraphrase a few people) >for over a week now. What will the ad look like? What will the copy say? >Who is the right endorsee to feature first? Torn, for his groundbreaking >vision? Billy Cobham using the EDP for soundtrack work? Steve Tavaglione >for his EWI soundtrack stuff on the Horse Whisperer soundtrack? Tom Roady >using it in percussion clinics for Zendrum? Ronnie Montrose? Neal Schon? >Trey Gunn? Fripp? Belew? Pete Anderson? Ric Hordinski? You? > >I've got X amount of dollars to spend on a campaign to promote a product >that is the only one I have deep backorders on, and by definition, is least >worthy of promotion. And yet, I know something must be done. The rest of >the world is totally ignorant of this Looping thing, as far as I am >concerned. I think some kind of televised event, like David Torn meets Les >Paul in NY, Adrian Belew meets Chet Atkins in Nashville, etc. > >What is going to make everyone want a Looping device? Not everybody who >wants it now can even find or afford the EDP. I'm not sure I have the >answers yet, but if everyone on the list can continue to spread the word >about what they have discovered, whether EDP or not, it will surely help. >As usual, comments and ideas appreciated. I'll shut up for awhile now, he >said to Cyber sighs world wide... > >Tom "Cyberian Khatru" Spaulding > Tom, first of all...YOU MAKE ME LAUGH! Keep it up! TOO-OO_OO many people take themselves or their subject of ranting way TOO-OO-OO serious. You always have a cool way of chillin' the masses. You have to swing that big corporate stick, it's your job, but you know that we also aren't talking life or death or brainsurgery or even tree surgery. I feel that the retail instrument manufacturing industry needs more people with your outlook and sensibilities. CLONING Perhaps???? can you say Bah-h-h-h-! or Moo-oo-oo! Second I am personally thrilled to be mentioned in one of your E's to the Loopers. Especially with the company you threw me into. I'm just a babe in the woods with this looping thing, but boy do I dig it! Being a drummer and Percussionist and exploring the possibilities of the EDP is DEEEPP!. I had a JAMMAN for a couple of years but I was always bummed about losing things that I had created after I shut it off. This to me is the MAJOR KOOL factor between the JM and EDP. Seeing how I'm still learning the EDP, I know there will be many more things that I won't believe I had lived without. Thanks for everything( including the Chuckles). I just got a Wavedrum . I can only imagine what I will be coming up with in the future.....The UNKNOWN??? NOW that is exciting! TOM "I'm not worthy" Roady P.S. I'm on the Emmylou track on the"Horse Whisperer"too.I'm anxious to hear it. From ???@??? Mon Feb 16 02:36:50 1998 >From kflint Sun Feb 15 12:57:02 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y4B7V-0001Nq-00; Sun, 15 Feb 1998 12:57:01 -0800 From: RA336@aol.com Message-ID: <6eaf8e40.34e7558b@aol.com> Date: Sun, 15 Feb 1998 15:52:25 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: looping, schmooping. Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 84 Resent-Message-ID: <"7gObS.A.z5.NX150"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3316 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sun, 15 Feb 1998 12:57:01 -0800 X-UIDL: ff53b4affc585bdfa919858f48a08b5a Hey loopers. I went to hear the Assad Brothers play last night... now; here am I, an electric guitarist very much into looping and these boys got me to thinking along the lines of: "... wow. little wooden guitars; much big music..." Do yourselves a favor and go hear them if you get the chance. might be a good reality check while you are puzzling out that fancy new signal-routing scheme. cheers! RA From ???@??? Mon Feb 16 02:36:51 1998 >From kflint Sun Feb 15 13:08:47 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y4BIr-0002CO-00; Sun, 15 Feb 1998 13:08:45 -0800 Message-Id: <2.2.32.19980215210449.02562884@artist-shop.com> X-Sender: artshop@artist-shop.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 2.2 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sun, 15 Feb 1998 16:04:49 -0500 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Gary Davis Subject: CMP Resent-Message-ID: <"qzePx.A.f0B.Mj150"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3317 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sun, 15 Feb 1998 13:08:45 -0800 X-UIDL: b3eb2ee69c245570310457b1cdd2bdd2 Hello, folks: I hope you don't mind me dropping you a friendly note to let you know that The Artist Shop recently made arrangements with Silva Screen, the new owners of the CMP label, to make the entire CMP catalog available through our website. I know that many of you have experienced endless frustration trying to find David Torn's last two albums, Tripping Over God and What Means 'Solid', Traveller?, since the collapse of CMP's US distribution. Our CMP page is at . While visiting us, you might also want to check out Jon Durant at and Robert Fripp at . I also highly recommend Bon Lozaga's Sonic Abandon CD on our LoLo Records page at . And I dare say there are some other things here and there using loop technology that might get your attention. that might get your attention. I hope you'll stop by for a visit. Gary ************************************************************** Gary Davis The Artist Shop The Other Road http://www.artist-shop.com artshop@artist-shop.com phone: 330-929-2056 fax:330-945-4923 SUPPORT THE INDEPENDENT ARTIST!!! ************************************************************** Check out the latest Artist Shop newsletter at http://www.artist-shop.com/news.htm From ???@??? Mon Feb 16 02:36:59 1998 >From kflint Sun Feb 15 13:46:06 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y4Bsy-0004JR-00; Sun, 15 Feb 1998 13:46:04 -0800 Date: Sun, 15 Feb 1998 15:35:44 -0600 From: John Pollock Subject: Re: looping, schmooping. To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Message-id: <34E75FB0.6EDD@delphi.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win95; I) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit References: <6eaf8e40.34e7558b@aol.com> Resent-Message-ID: <"M16k-D.A.a1D.VG250"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3319 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sun, 15 Feb 1998 13:46:04 -0800 X-UIDL: 24a00bce8dcd7c64456768e675132fc3 RA336@aol.com wrote: > > Hey loopers. I went to hear the Assad Brothers play last night... > > now; here am I, an electric guitarist very much into looping and these boys > got me to thinking along the lines of: > "... wow. little wooden guitars; much big music..." > > Do yourselves a favor and go hear them if you get the chance. might be a good > reality check while you are puzzling out that fancy new signal-routing scheme. And for a real lesson in humility, check out their little sister, too. As a longtime solo performer, I was devastated by Badi Assad's "Rhythms"-- to the point that I bought a nylon string guitar, then practically quit playing guitar completely. John "noodling on a lap steel, envying Badi's technique and Tom's taglines" Pollock From ???@??? Mon Feb 16 02:37:02 1998 >From kflint Sun Feb 15 14:12:31 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y4CIX-0005j3-00; Sun, 15 Feb 1998 14:12:29 -0800 Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19980215161119.007c6a80@mail.nash.gibson.com> X-Sender: tspauldi@mail.nash.gibson.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Sun, 15 Feb 1998 16:11:19 -0600 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: tspauldi@mail.nash.gibson.com Subject: Re: Mo' Assad (Mossad?) In-Reply-To: <6eaf8e40.34e7558b@aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"tmyssC.A.aHF.2e250"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3320 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sun, 15 Feb 1998 14:12:29 -0800 X-UIDL: a2830c31095a7c8db9c0936c9e2de1cd While yer at it, check out their sister... At 02:52 PM 2/15/98 -0600, you wrote: >Hey loopers. I went to hear the Assad Brothers play last night... > >now; here am I, an electric guitarist very much into looping and these boys >got me to thinking along the lines of: >"... wow. little wooden guitars; much big music..." > >Do yourselves a favor and go hear them if you get the chance. might be a good >reality check while you are puzzling out that fancy new signal-routing scheme. > >cheers! >RA > > > From ???@??? Mon Feb 16 02:37:11 1998 >From kflint Sun Feb 15 16:10:20 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y4E8Y-0003qx-00; Sun, 15 Feb 1998 16:10:18 -0800 Message-Id: <1.5.4.32.19980216000649.0067b600@tiac.net> X-Sender: rphunt@tiac.net X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sun, 15 Feb 1998 19:06:49 -0500 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Reginald Hunt Subject: zoom 8080 Resent-Message-ID: <"oIrkPC.A.8XD.ZN450"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3321 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sun, 15 Feb 1998 16:10:18 -0800 X-UIDL: 82a5fc392150ec469372af619294392d FAYI, After shopping for a new pedalboard, I bought the Zoom 8080. Part of the reason I selected it was the Delay of 4 seconds (nice for a pedalboard). After reading the manual, I found it also does a neat trick. The 8080 has a mode that allows reverb or delay in a patch to continue and die out normally when a new patch is selected, as opposed to just cutting off (which it can do if desired). This feature also allows that when one uses the Delay to create a loop of sound, then sets it to HOLD (via footswitch), one can then CHANGE TO ANOTHER PATCH and continue to play over the loop! So clearly to some degree, ZOOM is "loop aware". Reg From ???@??? Mon Feb 16 02:37:12 1998 >From kflint Sun Feb 15 16:14:36 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y4ECg-0004Kl-00; Sun, 15 Feb 1998 16:14:34 -0800 From: Marzzz@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Sun, 15 Feb 1998 19:11:52 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: 4 meg simms? Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 84 Resent-Message-ID: <"qOM2bB.A.AzD.OR450"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3322 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sun, 15 Feb 1998 16:14:34 -0800 X-UIDL: 2e6b18bdcc7dd60279c6b1ff259ba5b3 In a message dated 2/15/98 11:58:24 AM, you wrote: <> The Chip Merchant in San Diego. I'll get the number for you later..... From ???@??? Mon Feb 16 02:37:20 1998 >From kflint Sun Feb 15 16:43:08 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y4EeI-00064n-00; Sun, 15 Feb 1998 16:43:06 -0800 Message-Id: <199802160039.TAA05959@shell.monmouth.com> Reply-To: From: "andre" To: Subject: getting acoustics into da LOOP Date: Sun, 15 Feb 1998 19:39:17 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1162 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"mYyBs.A.MVF.Zr450"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3323 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sun, 15 Feb 1998 16:43:06 -0800 X-UIDL: 245834e9a04591e568315eb5edb62789 > Rob, Tell me more about the VINX/Calhoun Project. I assume you are > > talking Will Calhoun. I just saw him at NAMM playing a small kit with 2 they've done some shows in europe, maybe a CD later this year... > Wavedrum and I am going to be getting some microphines for acoustic > > percussion..Djembe congas etc.. Any hints on getting the acoustics into the > loop > > at the correct input levels?. > Tom i've been toying with using a A/B switch, with the normal line signals (guitar,bass,sax,cello,synth,etc) on, say A, and a mic , maybe thru a little preamp on B, then you can switch at will. as long as the mic is placed out of the range of monitors/spkrs, shouldn't be a feedback problem...or how about one of those (i think morley) switches that are A/B or A and B.... piece, andre' From ???@??? Mon Feb 16 02:37:21 1998 >From kflint Sun Feb 15 17:01:28 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y4Ew2-000785-00; Sun, 15 Feb 1998 17:01:26 -0800 Message-ID: <01BD3A4C.585394C0.douglas-lawrence@home.com> From: Douglas Lawrence Reply-To: "douglas-lawrence@home.com" To: "'Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com'" Subject: RE: 4 meg simms? Date: Sun, 15 Feb 1998 20:00:20 -0500 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet E-mail/MAPI - 8.0.0.4211 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"uSyd5D.A.lbG.L9450"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3324 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sun, 15 Feb 1998 17:01:26 -0800 X-UIDL: 10287bb68e8aba2682ad627c6c8d325d I just ordered mine from Mohawk memory at (978) 897-1500 in Maynard, MA. Full upgrade ran about $70. Good Luck- Doug >>could someone e-mail me individually and share a source or two for 4 meg >>simms for 'plex? thanks. r. From ???@??? Mon Feb 16 02:37:31 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 16 00:18:30 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y4Lky-0004ou-00; Mon, 16 Feb 1998 00:18:28 -0800 Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19980216001809.009abdb0@pop.nwlink.com> X-Sender: jt@pop.nwlink.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 00:18:09 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: JT Subject: Re: 4 meg simms? In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"YwooPC.A.yVE.ZX_50"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3327 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 00:18:28 -0800 X-UIDL: 7fd083ac937a190fe2c7226013094828 ><simms for 'plex?>> >The Chip Merchant in San Diego. I'll get the number for you later..... The Chip Merchant is pretty good. Watch out for www.chipmerchant.com. They are NOT the same company. They're just stealing business by using that web address. From ???@??? Mon Feb 16 10:18:06 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 16 09:46:41 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y4Ucn-0007aP-00; Mon, 16 Feb 1998 09:46:37 -0800 Message-Id: <199802161732.JAA27744@scv4.apple.com> Subject: Re: DOD 8 second delay Date: Mon, 16 Feb 98 11:32:52 -0000 x-sender: hartne.t@mail.apple.com x-mailer: Claris Emailer 1.1 From: "T.W. Hartnett" To: "Looper's Delight" Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Resent-Message-ID: <"EC6kx.A.kuG.wqH60"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3341 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 09:46:37 -0800 X-UIDL: 3f11486ed0f6943e78d1eb1165dbd455 > >I talked to a salesman at Guitar Center the other day who called DOD to >ask them about it. He (the DOD rep) said it should be out in April, to which >the salesman said, "Which means May." And he said it should be >retail-priced $120-150. Sadly, the new Digitech press release quotes a $179 list... Travis Hartnett From ???@??? Mon Feb 16 10:17:47 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 16 08:59:38 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y4TtH-0002PG-00; Mon, 16 Feb 1998 08:59:35 -0800 Message-ID: <34E82AE8.3F46@nyfac.com> Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 12:02:48 +0000 From: tbajus Reply-To: nyfac2@nyfac.com X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (WinNT; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Good ole days References: <199802140816_MC2-3343-935C@compuserve.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"JYWl_C.A.t7B.I_G60"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3333 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 08:59:35 -0800 X-UIDL: 9b24570d29baa68ce4761b112772d20a > Reg wrote: > >Fripp (and Sinatra) will be remembered long after Snoop Doggy Dogg, Puff > Daddy, Bruce Springsteen (who?), or Whitney Houston are forgotten (I give > it > a hundred years).< At great risk of revealing my lameness, both Springsteen's "Nebraska" and "Ghost of Tom Joad" are great records. Trevor "Born to Run" Bajus From ???@??? Mon Feb 16 10:17:53 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 16 09:08:12 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y4U1Z-0003Ir-00; Mon, 16 Feb 1998 09:08:09 -0800 Message-ID: <34E82CA7.5641@nyfac.com> Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 12:10:15 +0000 From: tbajus Reply-To: nyfac2@nyfac.com X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (WinNT; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Unsubcribe References: <980213205945_471366756@mrin54> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"1DAY2D.A.WoC.GGH60"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3334 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 09:08:09 -0800 X-UIDL: eeb7b6e6c21a562c3739305d3c4f8a88 JJavid@aol.com wrote: > > Unsubcribe Is this a joke? AOL users.... Trev From ???@??? Mon Feb 16 10:17:54 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 16 09:10:10 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y4U3T-0003XN-00; Mon, 16 Feb 1998 09:10:07 -0800 Message-ID: <34E82CF3.1D3D@nyfac.com> Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 12:11:31 +0000 From: tbajus Reply-To: nyfac2@nyfac.com X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (WinNT; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: What does a Echo-plex cost? References: <1.5.4.32.19980214015848.0067ff00@tiac.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"nsyLqD.A.DyC.THH60"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3335 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 09:10:07 -0800 X-UIDL: 968f1d7362fe3371b70e7691a08538be Reginald Hunt wrote: > > I do have to interject that Robin Guthrie leads me down new paths from time > to time. > > Reg That is because he is the cat's ass. 'Tho is miss his Big Muff days... Get the 808 out again as well. Trev From ???@??? Mon Feb 16 10:17:57 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 16 09:22:50 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y4UFi-00052T-00; Mon, 16 Feb 1998 09:22:46 -0800 Message-ID: <34E82F47.EA0@nyfac.com> Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 12:21:27 +0000 From: tbajus Reply-To: nyfac2@nyfac.com X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (WinNT; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: DON'T GO SEE A LIVE BAND -- YOU'LL SLEEP!!! References: <199802131740.MAA12030@user1.channel1.com> <3.0.1.16.19980216182829.0fdf4ccc@rank-serv.elec.gla.ac.uk> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"uoj3CB.A.80D.nQH60"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3337 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 09:22:46 -0800 X-UIDL: 59e6ddefcdbb9eaddc38895bbbba233f > Dave White: > >Clubs start bands too late: 11:00 - 11:30 is too late to start bands. London > >starts early and closes early and the bars still make money and probably > a good > >deal more money then a comparable bar in the U.S. I had a show a few weeks ago were our start time was 11:00pm but they wanted us to get there at 3:00 to soundcheck. It was a friday, so no big deal, but I did have to take the afternoon off from work (that is not a complaint). A friend of mine just wrote to complain of our show being at 9:30 on wednesday! Trev From ???@??? Mon Feb 16 10:17:34 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 16 05:36:06 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y4QiK-0006pj-00; Mon, 16 Feb 1998 05:36:04 -0800 Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 08:33:37 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <199802161333.IAA25798@marconi.concentric.net> X-Sender: hideo@pop3.concentric.net X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Tom Lambrecht Subject: Re: question: mackie&jamman-vortex set Resent-Message-ID: <"RG9LAC.A.8MG.5AE60"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3329 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 05:36:04 -0800 X-UIDL: 9122cd3eca2818a279931bb54a3dc7d9 At 10:28 PM 2/15/98 +0200, you wrote: >>Hello, Jesus >>I hate to tell you how much my routing life improved when I sold my beloved >>little 1202 and got a 1604vlz! >>dpc >> >> > I'll second that. I still have my 1202, BUT the 1604 opens up many many >doors. I have my three jam men and a RDS 8000 on the sub out with the >outputs coming back into the mixer so that I can send them anywhere. Then I >have the Vortex, LXP-5, Sherman Filterbank, Korg A-3, on the effects sends. >Throw in the guitar tone( heaven forbid!!!) and the outputs form my GR-1, >Matrix 6, and a Yahmaha TX 81z, Korg Poly 6 and you have one heck of a >racket potential. > COR BLIMEY!!!!! bet the damn rig plays itself--specially that dirty, leeetle PolySix . . .. I jsut got a MonoPoly (it's illustrious, knob-encrusted sibling) and it HOWLS at the Vortex AIIIIIIIEEEEEEEEEE . . . oops, not the Synth newsgroup . . . .sorry (maybe I need a 1604--but then I'd need more equipment (crafty :) drone on~~~~Tom > >Patrick > > > > *** *** ** Fingerpaint http://www.his.com/~patrick/FNGP.html *** ** > > > > > > > Tom Lambrecht hideo@concentric.net From ???@??? Mon Feb 16 10:17:42 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 16 08:21:38 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y4TIV-0006yo-00; Mon, 16 Feb 1998 08:21:35 -0800 Message-Id: <98Feb16.101658cst.26886@gateway.gibson.com> X-Sender: tspauldi@mail.nash.gibson.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 10:20:23 -0600 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Tom Spaulding Subject: Loop time vs. Delay time Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/enriched; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"-S5Xz.A.9PG.qbG60"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3330 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 08:21:35 -0800 X-UIDL: 4388fb59a548af0f518db46b5c4f7ed0 Loopateers- Please help with these two consumer questions: 1)"Once you create a loop (with overdubs), is there a way to have it fade out like a delay, or will it always be strictly on/off?" 2)"If I'm in delay mode and have created a multi-layer part, can I turn it into a loop, or will it eventually fade out?" Seems the brother has no computer access handy, and needs (y)our help. Tom "Sloughing off my responsibilites to the List" Spaulding FREE t-shirt (as worn by Kim Flint)to first respondee! Tom "Bribe 'em if ya gotta, baby" Spaulding From ???@??? Mon Feb 16 10:17:44 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 16 08:47:04 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y4Th7-00012n-00; Mon, 16 Feb 1998 08:47:01 -0800 Message-ID: <01BD3AD0.8BCDA280@TD-300> From: jprice@intcpi.com (John Price) To: "'loopers-delight@annihilist.com'" Subject: RE: Guitar-o-centrism Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 11:46:38 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"B7zU9D.A.vq.bzG60"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3331 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 08:47:01 -0800 X-UIDL: 6faf3384b64dcf0c3b6ebf85c297c4ae Too often music appreciation is seen as a sport that people use to justify their personal biases and need for recognition of some sort or other for proving incessantly how really in tune with something they feel everyone else should be in tune with...puuuhleease. The energy I take exception with and what I had originally responded to is often times the assuming and presumptuous tone that most ( but clearly not all ) Fripp Headed Enthusiasts or classic Prog Types seem to transfer when they instinctively make blanket statements that are either laughable or dismissable in a circle that seems way too often to originate either in contempt and/or cultural myopia. It's the musical extension of a Mega ( negative sided ) European American centered perspective ( Im also not trashing Euro-Americans, there are many positive and wonderful and essential sides to their perspectives ) that always assumes its superiority or the inferiority of something or someone else that is not shared, experienced or valued at a level deemed significant by that culture. The very dismissiveness of those comments whether they were directly or indirectly meant to be that way seem to be a way of thought I'd characterize as a sad but common in way too many guitar oriented circles. Even though Im a synth and Sampler Dude, I was and still am for the most part a Rock Gtr player who is interested in speaking in say...hmmmmm how to put htis....speaking more than just one language- that's it. IMHO thoughts that are circulated such as "guitar o centrisms" are dangerous and deleterious ( pretentious word - I know ) to the sake of all music that has been and is yet to be. Like and dislike are perspectives that's all & nothing more or less than that and clearly neither good or bad in and of themselves. They're just subjective feelings that always get taken to a level of unholy relevance. All music including the good and bad needs to exist for any music to exist. Now this business about a string and rock and history threw me. Perhaps you read too much into my "plain old", cybertext. Lately, just about any cism seems to get my ire. :) Thanks for responding. I value your thoughts and everyone elses :) BTW, Im looking into getting one of those SP202's from boss. Anybody here got 1 ??? If so, whats your experience been with it and have you used it out live ???? JP This is where things go awry. A piano is not plain or old. Guitar or an ancestor thereof may go back to the bow and arrow, depending on the music history version you subscribe to. It's a primal and fundamental way to make a pleasant noise, back there with the drum (maybe that's why they both symbolize Rock Music). Piano is a horrendously complex contraption that helped introduce the Industrial Age. Try to make a piano with a stick and rubber band and get back to me. From ???@??? Mon Feb 16 19:56:16 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 16 14:59:29 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y4ZVV-0002nq-00; Mon, 16 Feb 1998 14:59:25 -0800 Message-Id: <199802162247.OAA28650@scv3.apple.com> Subject: Re: What does a Echo-plex cost? Date: Mon, 16 Feb 98 16:48:06 -0000 x-sender: hartne.t@mail.apple.com x-mailer: Claris Emailer 1.1 From: "T.W. Hartnett" To: "Looper's Delight" Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Resent-Message-ID: <"2KuxW.A.jKC.UPM60"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3353 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 14:59:25 -0800 X-UIDL: add3fc58b32c587a8ca269bcd2b00f5d >Fripp came from the same era that produced disco. Wow. Did they have disco in the late '60's? Travis Hartnett From ???@??? Mon Feb 16 19:56:21 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 16 15:38:17 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y4a73-0007Tc-00; Mon, 16 Feb 1998 15:38:13 -0800 Message-Id: <199802162325.PAA10268@scv4.apple.com> Subject: Re: why do people think looping is just for guitar? Date: Mon, 16 Feb 98 17:26:36 -0000 x-sender: hartne.t@mail.apple.com x-mailer: Claris Emailer 1.1 From: "T.W. Hartnett" To: "Looper's Delight" Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Resent-Message-ID: <"A9wb8C.A.TeG.fzM60"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3359 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 15:38:13 -0800 X-UIDL: 1d0f0c4dd403ad4893ac284a5175112b >It's more the perception of looping by others. I regularly see it being >depicted as something for guitar players, whether it's by salesmen or media >or other musicians. *That's* what mysifies me! Is this just because lots of >guitar players do it? Or because it's been guitar oriented people involved >in manufacturing them and therefore that's where they place it? > >To me, using real-time loops for percussion or cello or radio transmissions >or whatever seems just as valid. Why don't other people see it that way? >What do we do to change that perception? Perhaps its because its more obvious when a guitarist loops. People are used to synthesizers being able to create a wide variety of sounds, and some knowledge of sequencing has filtered down to most audiences. If a keyboard player takes his hands off his instrument, and music continues to emanate, everyone says "Oh, a computer or something..." People sit up and take notice a bit more if you're holding an electric guitar and it doesn't sound like Jimmy Page. On the other hand, if you're looping guitarist, you can spend a lot of time fielding questions like "So, you're playing guitar synth right? Or is that a backing tape?" Travis Hartnett From ???@??? Mon Feb 16 19:56:24 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 16 15:42:15 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y4aAs-0000GS-00; Mon, 16 Feb 1998 15:42:10 -0800 Message-Id: <199802162327.PAA09588@scv4.apple.com> Subject: Re: Promoting Looping Date: Mon, 16 Feb 98 17:28:38 -0000 x-sender: hartne.t@mail.apple.com x-mailer: Claris Emailer 1.1 From: "T.W. Hartnett" To: "Looper's Delight" Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Resent-Message-ID: <"dYziT.A.IqG.40M60"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3360 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 15:42:10 -0800 X-UIDL: c7f6974a340bf8e08a97d2131c65f143 >But we do have a Looping category on the Musi-cal concert info site, >conveniently linked right from the Looper's Delight site! They put it in >there just for us, actually. If you want it to be worth anything, you need >to use it! Post your gigs there! Tell your friends.... But if people don't already *know* what looping is, they won't look there. Cripes, this GROUP has trouble agreeing what looping "is"... Travis From ???@??? Mon Feb 16 19:56:38 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 16 17:00:54 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y4bP1-00076h-00; Mon, 16 Feb 1998 17:00:51 -0800 Message-Id: <199802162355.PAA29004@scv3.apple.com> Subject: Secrets of Fripp Date: Mon, 16 Feb 98 17:56:05 -0000 x-sender: hartne.t@mail.apple.com x-mailer: Claris Emailer 1.1 From: "T.W. Hartnett" To: "Looper's Delight" Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Resent-Message-ID: <"GoTScB.A.STG.DCO60"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3364 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 17:00:51 -0800 X-UIDL: 8e9049ca420052e1bc1a7aa63ecac9e0 >> For instance, Fripp sets his different >> delay lines to specific mathematical ratios with the intent of creating >> evolving textures that repeat in a long, yet specific amount of time. I >> don't know what the numerical significance is to him (if any) but it seems >> like he often uses prime number ratios, like 31:7 or something. Now how is >> it that I know that and none of you Fripp fans ever brought it up? jeez. Because there's this guy on the list who gets sort of twitchy if we talk a lot about Fripp or gear. Travis Hartnett From ???@??? Mon Feb 16 19:56:29 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 16 16:07:51 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y4aZh-0002vk-00; Mon, 16 Feb 1998 16:07:49 -0800 Message-Id: <199802162359.PAA13724@scv1.apple.com> Subject: Third highest looping profile...? Date: Mon, 16 Feb 98 18:00:17 -0000 x-sender: hartne.t@mail.apple.com x-mailer: Claris Emailer 1.1 From: "T.W. Hartnett" To: "Looper's Delight" Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Resent-Message-ID: <"9MLuhD.A.4GC.QON60"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3363 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 16:07:49 -0800 X-UIDL: d48580a6bc3e3c5dc8181785167a16c1 >> >And who tends to come to mind when the idea of a looper comes up? >> >People like Robert Fripp and David Torn. Why? Because they've got the >> >most high profile of any "loopists" I can think of. >> >> *For You!* For a lot of people, it's totally different! Yeah, that's why we spend so much time talking about those other loopists. Because they have such a high profile. Particularly that guy, DJ...I forget his last name. I love all his stuff. Travis Hartnett From ???@??? Mon Feb 16 10:18:13 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 16 10:12:32 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y4V1l-0001zZ-00; Mon, 16 Feb 1998 10:12:25 -0800 From: Fmplautus@aol.com Message-ID: <8eb7b4fe.34e87fa0@aol.com> Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 13:04:14 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Loop time vs. Delay time Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 78 Resent-Message-ID: <"hiQI0D.A.xRB.hBI60"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3343 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 10:12:25 -0800 X-UIDL: 4024daa941a711ccc501446175cc38b3 Hi Tom: If the LoOpDoctOrs understand question number one, you should be able to "fade" said loop via the Echoplex feedback knob. We don't know about question number two. Best, the LoOpDoctOrs From ???@??? Mon Feb 16 10:18:11 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 16 10:10:48 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y4V06-0001lP-00; Mon, 16 Feb 1998 10:10:42 -0800 Message-ID: <34E880B5.651EFA73@bellsouth.net> Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 13:08:53 -0500 From: Jeff Duke Reply-To: jmar@bellsouth.net Organization: Tec Bab Labs X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com" Subject: cv control Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"8rnRF.A.PKB.nAI60"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3342 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 10:10:42 -0800 X-UIDL: 2941ba61a75f180262c7a9d4ffd56d1b Hey gang, I finally got around to putting up a page from the Digital Delay Handbook. I got permission to use excerpts from Mr.Anderton himself! I hope he will be joining in in convers.Anyway the page is only visible if you have this url ; http://members.tripod.com/~dukesr/index-4.html Any other requests can be sent to me privately.There is a bunch of cool ideas in this book and you may be able to get a copy by calling Music Sales at 212/254-2100 Loopingly yours, Jeff From ???@??? Mon Feb 16 19:56:08 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 16 13:21:32 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y4Xyh-00028H-00; Mon, 16 Feb 1998 13:21:27 -0800 Message-ID: <2148EC143F29D1118BE000805FC13CD01E1F87@migarexch01.maritz.com> From: "Liebig, Steuart A." To: "'Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com'" Subject: RE: What does a Echo-plex cost? Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 12:33:30 -0600 X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) Resent-Message-ID: <"CDabCD.A.dnB._zK60"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3349 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 13:21:27 -0800 X-UIDL: 3f35a019e7b99465d93729d51759a406 Well Andy Summers lives in Venice, CA right? > ---------- > From: Marzzz@aol.com > Reply To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com > Sent: Saturday, February 14, 1998 7:10 AM > To: LiebigSA@maritz.com > Subject: Re: What does a Echo-plex cost? > > > In a message dated 2/12/98 9:27:09 AM, you wrote: > > < much) since > Andy Summers arrived in the early 80s. >> > > Allan Holdsworth. > > > But then again, he loaded up the truck and moved to San Diego....... > > > From ???@??? Mon Feb 16 10:59:21 1998 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Kim Flint Subject: Re: Loop time vs. Delay time Cc: Bcc: X-Attachments: Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <98Feb16.101658cst.26886@gateway.gibson.com> >>>> Loopateers- Please help with these two consumer questions: 1)"Once you create a loop (with overdubs), is there a way to have it fade out like a delay, or will it always be strictly on/off?" <<<< turn the feedback knob down..... >>>> 2)"If I'm in delay mode and have created a multi-layer part, can I turn it into a loop, or will it eventually fade out?" <<<< The basic answer is yes, but there is some confusion to clear up: On the Echoplex (which is presumably what you're talking about...) there's not really much difference between delay mode and loop mode, except for the way Overdub works. In Delay mode the Overdub switch acts like a traditional "delay hold" button, where turning it on stops the feedback decays and doesn't allow new stuff added to the loop. When "hold" is off, any sound at the input is added to the delay and feedback is active (unless it's turned all the way up). The only other difference with delay mode is minor, where the "feedback" jack in back becomes an input volume to the delay line, which is kind of fun and useful. In every other respect, loop mode and delay mode are the same. The idea of converting a "delay" into a "loop" is not really meaningful, they are both essentially the same. So if the person has created their loop in delay mode, and wants to "turn it into a loop" they would either a)turn the feedback up b) press hold c) switch back to loop mode, and still turn the feedback up, or d) never bother to be in delay mode in the first place and just control feedback and Overdub actively. I think that most people never use delay mode, because you can pretty much get the same "delay" effect by just leaving overdub on and adjusting feedback. It's mostly only there to help out people very used to using traditional delays and unable to adjust the old habits to the new way.... >>>> Tom "Sloughing off my responsibilites to the List" Spaulding FREE t-shirt (as worn by Kim Flint)to first respondee! <<<< I don't think you want to use me as a model..... kim From ???@??? Mon Feb 16 12:19:11 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 16 11:03:05 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y4Vol-00061G-00; Mon, 16 Feb 1998 11:03:03 -0800 X-Sender: kflint@pop.slip.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <98Feb16.101658cst.26886@gateway.gibson.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 10:59:18 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Kim Flint Subject: Re: Loop time vs. Delay time Resent-Message-ID: <"eG_V2C.A.WPF.OyI60"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3344 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 11:03:03 -0800 X-UIDL: f4b03d27d82f580d721cab53643eee2d >>>> Loopateers- Please help with these two consumer questions: 1)"Once you create a loop (with overdubs), is there a way to have it fade out like a delay, or will it always be strictly on/off?" <<<< turn the feedback knob down..... >>>> 2)"If I'm in delay mode and have created a multi-layer part, can I turn it into a loop, or will it eventually fade out?" <<<< The basic answer is yes, but there is some confusion to clear up: On the Echoplex (which is presumably what you're talking about...) there's not really much difference between delay mode and loop mode, except for the way Overdub works. In Delay mode the Overdub switch acts like a traditional "delay hold" button, where turning it on stops the feedback decays and doesn't allow new stuff added to the loop. When "hold" is off, any sound at the input is added to the delay and feedback is active (unless it's turned all the way up). The only other difference with delay mode is minor, where the "feedback" jack in back becomes an input volume to the delay line, which is kind of fun and useful. In every other respect, loop mode and delay mode are the same. The idea of converting a "delay" into a "loop" is not really meaningful, they are both essentially the same. So if the person has created their loop in delay mode, and wants to "turn it into a loop" they would either a)turn the feedback up b) press hold c) switch back to loop mode, and still turn the feedback up, or d) never bother to be in delay mode in the first place and just control feedback and Overdub actively. I think that most people never use delay mode, because you can pretty much get the same "delay" effect by just leaving overdub on and adjusting feedback. It's mostly only there to help out people very used to using traditional delays and unable to adjust the old habits to the new way.... >>>> Tom "Sloughing off my responsibilites to the List" Spaulding FREE t-shirt (as worn by Kim Flint)to first respondee! <<<< I don't think you want to use me as a model..... kim ______________________________________________________________________ Kim Flint | Looper's Delight kflint@annihilist.com | http://www.annihilist.com/loop/loop.html http://www.annihilist.com/ | Loopers-Delight-request@annihilist.com From ???@??? Mon Feb 16 12:19:14 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 16 11:19:13 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y4W4M-0007TA-00; Mon, 16 Feb 1998 11:19:10 -0800 Message-ID: <34E890EF.216F0CF7@bellsouth.net> Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 14:18:08 -0500 From: Jeff Duke Reply-To: jmar@bellsouth.net Organization: Tec Bab Labs X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: cv control Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"kMN7z.A.DmG.ZBJ60"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3345 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 11:19:10 -0800 X-UIDL: 927105bf68481cde30df7594ec0a2c26 if this is double posted,please forgive me. Hey gang, I finally got around to putting up a page from the Digital Delay Handbook. I got permission to use excerpts from Mr.Anderton himself! I hope he will be joining in in convers.Anyway the page is only visible if you have this url ; http://members.tripod.com/~dukesr/index-4.html Any other requests can be sent to me privately.There is a bunch of cool ideas in this book and you may be able to get a copy by calling Music Sales at 212/254-2100 Loopingly yours, Jeff From ???@??? Mon Feb 16 12:19:15 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 16 11:44:18 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y4WSe-0001nv-00; Mon, 16 Feb 1998 11:44:16 -0800 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <98Feb16.101658cst.26886@gateway.gibson.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/enriched; charset="us-ascii" To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: klaw@iglou.com Subject: Undo vs Loop time vs. Delay time Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 14:39:48 -0500 Resent-Message-ID: <"GIp_6B.A.SMB.QYJ60"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3346 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 11:44:16 -0800 X-UIDL: 4e0facf3c0d208b422b661c105f7f95f Im curious Anyone else out there use the awesome effect of rapidly pushing the undo button to make material fade back in once its disapeared ( like in a situation using the pedal to scale the feedback) Hopefully this wont break my machine Its one of my fave things about the EDP and one I know is unique to this looper. Also using a sequencer to do this is cool . Hey how about a thread of your own tricks on your respective loopers I think this might generate some positive ideas for everybdy. K LAW >>>> Loopateers- Please help with these two consumer questions: 1)"Once you create a loop (with overdubs), is there a way to have it fade out like a delay, or will it always be strictly on/off?" 2)"If I'm in delay mode and have created a multi-layer part, can I turn it into a loop, or will it eventually fade out?" Seems the brother has no computer access handy, and needs (y)our help. Tom "Sloughing off my responsibilites to the List" Spaulding FREE t-shirt (as worn by Kim Flint)to first respondee! Tom "Bribe 'em if ya gotta, baby" Spaulding <<<<<<<< From ???@??? Mon Feb 16 19:56:01 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 16 12:27:09 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y4X84-0005NH-00; Mon, 16 Feb 1998 12:27:04 -0800 Message-ID: <34E89FBB.6FA5@raven.cybercomm.net> Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 15:21:15 -0500 From: Apple-O Reply-To: appleo@raven.cybercomm.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: musicians wtd nyc References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"Fze9IC.A.9dE.p_J60"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3347 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 12:27:04 -0800 X-UIDL: 94a49701c5b38456ab6603424235c27c musicians wanted available manhattan/hoboken area WTD: drummer, keyboardist (will jam with other instruments as well) wtd for musical laboratory (ok, band) playing instrumental somewhat in vein of sonic youth, tortoise, june 44, gastr del sol, trans am / golden, polvo, poem rocket, early Television, spacemen 3 / dead kennedys / spiritualized, magnetic fields, ladybug transistor, silver apples, tamperpon, happyshell, marlin brando, barking zulu, van halen Multi - instruments a plus. contact: appleo@raven.cybercomm.net see some old ads at: http://www.cybercomm.net/~appleo/sti/musicians_old.html From ???@??? Mon Feb 16 19:56:52 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 16 18:44:49 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y4d1b-0000MG-00; Mon, 16 Feb 1998 18:44:47 -0800 Message-Id: <199802170234.SAA13424@scv4.apple.com> Subject: Re: Secrets of Fripp Date: Mon, 16 Feb 98 20:35:31 -0000 x-sender: hartne.t@mail.apple.com x-mailer: Claris Emailer 1.1 From: "T.W. Hartnett" To: "Looper's Delight" Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Resent-Message-ID: <"nEVEpB.A.yBH.ohP60"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3367 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 18:44:47 -0800 X-UIDL: ec913a256b73a395c29a133999584a87 >The point was that many of you are clearly influenced by Robert Fripp and >admire him. Many others here never even heard of him before, as shocking as >that may sound. Some people are in between and have heard him a bit and >might want to learn more about what he is doing with looping and why some >people think so highly of him in that regard. Since this list is about >looping, it would be really great if some of you RF experts could teach the >rest of us about his looping techniques, looping conceptions, loop >approaches, etc. It's difficult, because Fripp has never (to my knowledge, and I think I've read almost all the English language interviews/articles about him of any substance) explicitly detailed how Frippertronics or Soundscapes work. There have been vague overviews, but I've never seen a hardcore breakdown of his signal path or flow control. It's not enough to say "two Revox's feeding each other with a four-second delay between the record and playback heads, blah, blah, blah..." Or maybe just not enough for me--I've tried to listen to "Let The Power Fall" (for instance) to get some sense of how the equipment was working, and I still can't duplicate it with a four-second delay. And I don't try to--that's not the point. About two minutes or so into one of the pieces, suddenly all this new stuff comes in, and I scratch my head. I defy anyone to precisely replicate what's going on during a Soundscapes piece. They're seriously dense (except for the parts which are, uh, seriously minimal...)The "mistakes" you'll make attempting to do so (for all the people with four 2290's....) will probably lead you into all sorts of new, more *personally* interesting realms. I think it was Adrian Legg who said that when he was teenager, he tried to copy records, and got it wrong, then he tried to copy local "hot" guitarists--and got it wrong, and after years of getting it "wrong", he had his style. I suspect that part of this is to give the curious enough to go on, but not enough to precisely duplicate what Fripp is doing. Eno has said that he never writes down any of his settings for effects, synthesizers, etc, in order to prevent him from becoming reliant on the same stock sounds/approachs, and also to preserve the possibility of a Wonderful Mistake when trying to replicate a past approach. This "telling, but not telling" approach has probably led to thousands of people trying to imitate Fripp and ending up with something of their own. Or maybe just thousands of mediocre Fripp-wannabes. It was only recently that I saw a passing mention in some article that Fripp continued to use the 2290's because of their ability to sync to each other in odd ratios--5:7, 31:8 or what have you. That was it, just one line in the middle of an article. I've never seen him detail the differences (mixers? realtime control?) in his Revox Frippertronics setup versus the dual EH-16 setup, or the evolution of the Soundscapes rig (which now, apparently, has the ability to operate in, uh, quad...), but the music he produced with these setups is very different. I have read that he believes that every nine months, there's a jump forward in processing capibilities, and its difficult for him to keep up. Maybe he doesn't try to do so anymore. As far as his looping conceptions, I think the "best way to make a lot of noise with one guitar" says a lot. There's a brief outline of how he views Soundscapes on the DGM site (I don't have the address handy--search for "Elephant Talk" and follow that link, if you're interested). Travis Hartnett Mindless Fripp Follower From ???@??? Mon Feb 16 19:56:03 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 16 12:56:51 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y4Xaq-00004O-00; Mon, 16 Feb 1998 12:56:48 -0800 Message-Id: <2.2.32.19980216205219.00a6f144@pop.chromatic.com> X-Sender: kflint@pop.chromatic.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 2.2 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 12:52:19 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com, Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Kim Flint Subject: Re: Undo vs Loop time vs. Delay time Resent-Message-ID: <"VHlWLB.A.zFH.ndK60"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3348 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 12:56:48 -0800 X-UIDL: 3219d10a62b13c98f0b17b2bceb327f5 At 02:39 PM 2/16/98 -0500, klaw@iglou.com wrote: >Im curious Anyone else out there use the awesome effect of rapidly >pushing the undo button to make material fade back in once its >disapeared ( like in a situation using the pedal to scale the feedback) >Hopefully this wont break my machine Its one of my fave things about >the EDP and one I know is unique to this looper. Also using a sequencer >to do this is cool . Hey how about a thread of your own tricks on your >respective loopers I think this might generate some positive ideas for >everybdy. > > K LAW That undo/feedback trick certainly won't break anything! It's definitely a great effect. I also like building some complex loop by overdubbing on a simple base, undoing it back to a more simple point and building it up again in a different way. Rinse, and repeat as necessary. kim _______________________________________________________ Kim Flint 408-752-9284 Mpact Systems Engineering kflint@chromatic.com Chromatic Research http://www.chromatic.com From ???@??? Mon Feb 16 19:56:10 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 16 13:42:02 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y4YIQ-0003vO-00; Mon, 16 Feb 1998 13:41:50 -0800 From: Paolo Valladolid Message-Id: <199802162138.NAA17928@waynesworld.ucsd.edu> Subject: Re: What does a Echo-plex cost? To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 13:38:04 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: <1.5.4.32.19980214021530.0067627c@tiac.net> from "Reginald Hunt" at Feb 13, 98 09:15:30 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"mUtYfD.A.cPD.FHL60"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3350 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 13:41:50 -0800 X-UIDL: ef658101de7bec0f7e71a9c0f9dc8946 > Fripp (and Sinatra) will be remembered long after Snoop Doggy Dogg, Puff Fripp came from the same era that produced disco. Sinatra came from an era that produced a lot of forgettable music as well. Cheers, Paolo Valladolid --------------------------------------------------------------- |Moderator of Digital Guitar Digest, an Internet mailing list |\ |for Music Technology and Stringed Instruments | \ ---------------------------------------------------------------- | \ finger pvallado@waynesworld.ucsd.edu for more info \ | \ http://waynesworld.ucsd.edu/DigitalGuitar/home.html \| ----------------------------------------------------------------- From ???@??? Mon Feb 16 10:17:29 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 16 04:29:48 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y4PgA-0004U8-00; Mon, 16 Feb 1998 04:29:46 -0800 Message-Id: <3.0.1.16.19980216140540.2db763b2@rank-serv.elec.gla.ac.uk> X-Sender: pycraft@rank-serv.elec.gla.ac.uk X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.1 (16) Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 14:05:40 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: "Michael P. Hughes, Ph.D." Subject: Re: What does a Echo-plex cost? In-Reply-To: <384a53e1.34e5b350@aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"VGUt4D.A.ICE._CD60"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3328 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 04:29:46 -0800 X-UIDL: 83f2b344eec3272d3d83c65da80dd49a Our man from Marz: >>There hasn't been any innovation in UK guitar (OK, at least not much) since >>Andy Summers arrived in the early 80s. >Allan Holdsworth. >But then again, he loaded up the truck and moved to San Diego....... Yes, but AH first came to prominence in 1973 (in Tempest), and had pretty much defined his style through the late 70's with Soft Machine, Bruford, Tony Williams and UK. Michael From ???@??? Mon Feb 16 19:56:14 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 16 14:43:29 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y4ZG1-00013M-00; Mon, 16 Feb 1998 14:43:25 -0800 Message-Id: <98Feb16.163710cst.26884@gateway.gibson.com> X-Sender: tspauldi@mail.nash.gibson.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 16:40:41 -0600 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Tom Spaulding Subject: Re: Loop time vs. Delay time In-Reply-To: <8eb7b4fe.34e87fa0@aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"XGzh1B.A._b.BAM60"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3351 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 14:43:25 -0800 X-UIDL: 4779a3158beb23fed204f83c77e1e54e Dox- Well, that's good enough for half a shirt from our our Denny Terrio collection. Please e-mail me directly with an address and size. (Kim already has a shirt, so y'all win). Thanks for your help...I hipped the guy to the List, so we should have a new member soon... Tom " Rag Trade is my Life" Spaulding At 12:04 PM 2/16/98 -0600, you wrote: >Hi Tom: > >If the LoOpDoctOrs understand question number one, you should be able to >"fade" said loop via the Echoplex feedback knob. > >We don't know about question number two. > >Best, >the LoOpDoctOrs > > > From ???@??? Mon Feb 16 19:56:15 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 16 14:49:17 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y4ZLf-0001k9-00; Mon, 16 Feb 1998 14:49:15 -0800 Message-Id: <1.5.4.32.19980216224426.006840e4@tiac.net> X-Sender: rphunt@tiac.net X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 17:44:26 -0500 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Reginald Hunt Subject: RE: Guitar-o-centrism Resent-Message-ID: <"LtqZJB.A.uPB.QGM60"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3352 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 14:49:15 -0800 X-UIDL: ca5d010eee80060b3cb2ff2cd8f6554c My response was to this particular remark: "I think if there is one instrument that actually dominates anything in any particular music's origins it is the Piano (IMHO) - not a synth, not a sampler or even a violin, just a plain old piano." Actually this reflects MAJOR Euro-centrism. The piano has existed for a short time, and in a small region of the world for most of that time. To consider it as having a dominant effect to any musical origin other than certain musics from the European Classical period and forward, is EXTREMELY provincial. The PC idea of ignoring historical data for the sake of sparing a belief system doesn't help anyone in the long term. I keep having to say this here: I'm not referring to good guys and bad guys. But if a fundamental musical force, in terms of instrumentation, is sought, then there are many more valid choices than the example you offered. When pointing that out is considered dangerous..... Looping devices basically fall into (maybe) 3 camps: Delays, Samplers, Sequencers. The concern with Guitarcentricity, I believe, revolves mostly around Delays. Delays are still mainly considered Effects. Effects are mainly considered to be the guitarist's dominion. It doesn't HAVE to be this way, it just is, for now. Although it is heartening if DJs view delays and other effects as useful for their work. Effects: Since the late 60's, other instrumentalists have been experimenting with effects as well, but the practice never became common (I mean as common as a guitar player with a distortion pedal). Maybe that will change. Maybe not. Maybe it should. Maybe it shouldn't. Delays specifically: Dedicated delays are viewed as a narrowly focused function. Since the group that is interested in effects is mostly guitarists, the small sub-group interested in Long-Delays, is also going to be mostly guitarists. But, at the same time, other musicians who are open-minded enough to experiment with effects anyway, are likely to be drawn to looping more readily. I think Oberheim has its work cut out in terms of defining and developing a market for a device such as the Echoplex. If nurturing the dance market helps expand the user base, god bless 'em. But the guitar contingent is still VERY important. Devices aimed at guitarists have proven beneficial to many other musicians. Reg >It's the musical extension of a Mega ( negative sided ) European American centered perspective ( Im also not trashing Euro-Americans, there are many positive and wonderful and essential sides to their perspectives ) that always assumes its superiority or the inferiority of something or someone else that is not shared, experienced or valued at a level deemed significant by that culture. > >The very dismissiveness of those comments whether they were directly or indirectly meant to be that way seem to be a way of thought I'd characterize as a sad but common in way too many guitar oriented circles. Even though Im a synth and Sampler Dude, I was and still am for the most part a Rock Gtr player who is interested in speaking in say...hmmmmm how to put htis....speaking more than just one language- that's it. > >IMHO thoughts that are circulated such as "guitar o centrisms" are dangerous and deleterious ( pretentious word - I know ) to the sake of all music that has been and is yet to be. > >Like and dislike are perspectives that's all & nothing more or less than that and clearly neither good or bad in and of themselves. They're just subjective feelings that always get taken to a level of unholy relevance. > >All music including the good and bad needs to exist for any music to exist. From ???@??? Mon Feb 16 19:56:17 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 16 15:05:30 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y4ZbM-0003YA-00; Mon, 16 Feb 1998 15:05:28 -0800 Message-Id: <1.5.4.32.19980216225844.006784d0@tiac.net> X-Sender: rphunt@tiac.net X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 17:58:44 -0500 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Reginald Hunt Subject: immortals Resent-Message-ID: <"CZli5C.A.gqC.jTM60"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3354 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 15:05:28 -0800 X-UIDL: 37eaa478a79bcd38d5188ae4605baaa6 At 01:38 PM 2/16/98 -0800, you wrote: >> Fripp (and Sinatra) will be remembered long after Snoop Doggy Dogg, Puff > >Fripp came from the same era that produced disco. > >Sinatra came from an era that produced a lot of forgettable music as well. > >Cheers, > >Paolo Valladolid Ditto for Hendrix and James Brown. Or the first Elvis. Who do we have in the Nineties like that? Not Beck. Reg From ???@??? Mon Feb 16 19:56:18 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 16 15:22:02 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y4ZrE-0005Iw-00; Mon, 16 Feb 1998 15:21:52 -0800 Message-ID: <01BD3B06.10EAAE60@jbrainin@interactive.net> From: Jonathan Brainin To: "'Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com'" Subject: RE: What does a Echo-plex cost? Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 18:09:44 -0500 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet E-mail/MAPI - 8.0.0.4008 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"uT_eQ.A.8EE.fhM60"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3355 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 15:21:52 -0800 X-UIDL: 591bd5c8b3691dfcbb43e5ab54a88dc4 Well, they certainly had discotheques then. What DID they play in those places anyway? (I dunno, I was only 7 or 8). Jonathan Brainin jbrainin@interactive.net On Monday, February 16, 1998 11:48 AM, T.W. Hartnett [SMTP:hartnett.t@apple.com] wrote: > >Fripp came from the same era that produced disco. > > Wow. Did they have disco in the late '60's? > > Travis Hartnett From ???@??? Mon Feb 16 19:56:19 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 16 15:25:18 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y4ZuU-0005mL-00; Mon, 16 Feb 1998 15:25:15 -0800 From: Paolo Valladolid Message-Id: <199802162315.PAA18655@waynesworld.ucsd.edu> Subject: Re: immortals To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 15:15:40 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: <1.5.4.32.19980216225844.006784d0@tiac.net> from "Reginald Hunt" at Feb 16, 98 05:58:44 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"L1J-.A._NE.oiM60"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3356 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 15:25:15 -0800 X-UIDL: 37a85095c4ff4c0407673e7477869bc9 > At 01:38 PM 2/16/98 -0800, you wrote: > >> Fripp (and Sinatra) will be remembered long after Snoop Doggy Dogg, Puff > > > >Fripp came from the same era that produced disco. > > > >Sinatra came from an era that produced a lot of forgettable music as well. > > > >Cheers, > > > >Paolo Valladolid > > Ditto for Hendrix and James Brown. Or the first Elvis. Who do we have in the > Nineties like that? Not Beck. No offense, but I really don't care if the Nineties produces someone like that or not. Somebody somewhere on this thread tried to make the point that wholesale evaluations of musical eras (the 90s, the 80s, the 70s, the 60s, etc. was great/not great) doesn't work because all of them produced a lot of bad music to go with the good. It is that point I agree with. Why do I not care? Because thanks to the Internal and mailorder it is easier for me than ever before to reach out and get some great music. I don't have to depend on commercial radio in the hope something good might come along. :) Cheers, Paolo Valladolid --------------------------------------------------------------- |Moderator of Digital Guitar Digest, an Internet mailing list |\ |for Music Technology and Stringed Instruments | \ ---------------------------------------------------------------- | \ finger pvallado@waynesworld.ucsd.edu for more info \ | \ http://waynesworld.ucsd.edu/DigitalGuitar/home.html \| ----------------------------------------------------------------- From ???@??? Mon Feb 16 19:56:20 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 16 15:25:44 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y4Zus-0005pd-00; Mon, 16 Feb 1998 15:25:39 -0800 From: Paolo Valladolid Message-Id: <199802162316.PAA18669@waynesworld.ucsd.edu> Subject: Re: immortals To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 15:16:09 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: <1.5.4.32.19980216225844.006784d0@tiac.net> from "Reginald Hunt" at Feb 16, 98 05:58:44 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"qg5y_D.A.pTE.QjM60"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3357 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 15:25:39 -0800 X-UIDL: fae5530abe86538926558b84415fc308 Whoops... I meant "Internet" not "Internal". Damn typing fingers... Paolo Valladolid --------------------------------------------------------------- |Moderator of Digital Guitar Digest, an Internet mailing list |\ |for Music Technology and Stringed Instruments | \ ---------------------------------------------------------------- | \ finger pvallado@waynesworld.ucsd.edu for more info \ | \ http://waynesworld.ucsd.edu/DigitalGuitar/home.html \| ----------------------------------------------------------------- From ???@??? Mon Feb 16 19:56:21 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 16 15:29:33 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y4Zyc-0006NW-00; Mon, 16 Feb 1998 15:29:30 -0800 From: Paolo Valladolid Message-Id: <199802162319.PAA18701@waynesworld.ucsd.edu> Subject: Re: What does a Echo-plex cost? To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 15:19:44 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: <199802162247.OAA28650@scv3.apple.com> from "T.W. Hartnett" at Feb 16, 98 04:48:06 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"gIG_-B.A.YwE.qmM60"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3358 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 15:29:30 -0800 X-UIDL: a1fbf984c51da990273c27d7fc8bce94 > >Fripp came from the same era that produced disco. > > Wow. Did they have disco in the late '60's? > > Travis Hartnett That's why the decade comparisons break down. Fripp burst onto the scene in 1969. Of course, the point I was trying to support got lost. Cheers, Paolo Valladolid --------------------------------------------------------------- |Moderator of Digital Guitar Digest, an Internet mailing list |\ |for Music Technology and Stringed Instruments | \ ---------------------------------------------------------------- | \ finger pvallado@waynesworld.ucsd.edu for more info \ | \ http://waynesworld.ucsd.edu/DigitalGuitar/home.html \| ----------------------------------------------------------------- From ???@??? Mon Feb 16 19:56:25 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 16 15:45:45 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y4aEH-0000jN-00; Mon, 16 Feb 1998 15:45:41 -0800 Message-Id: <2.2.32.19980216233653.009b1f4c@pop.chromatic.com> X-Sender: kflint@pop.chromatic.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 2.2 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 15:36:53 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Kim Flint Subject: Re: immortals Resent-Message-ID: <"3NPTV.A.AEH.53M60"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3361 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 15:45:41 -0800 X-UIDL: 5bca95ed5e986786b7664cfd149416ab imagine creaky voice: "Those kids today, they're not makin' music! It's just noise! Nuttin' like the things we did when I was a lad! Now, THAT was music, I tell ya!" Seems to me my gradparent's parents said that about Sinatra and Bing Crosby and Duke Ellington, my grandparent's generation said the same thing about the 50's rock icons my parent's listened to, my parent's generation said that about the late 60's/early 70's, my parents, grandparents and all the baby boomers say it about the music I grew up listening to in the 80's and 90's. Boy, I can't wait until I get old enough to act like my parents. I'm gonna start practicing the wagging index finger now. Gotta get me a rocking chair! I'll be sittin out on the porch with a bottle of scotch, wagging my finger at the youngsters, sayin with my ol' creaky voice: "You kids today don' KNOW from music. When I was your age, now we made some music! Nuthin' like this junk today!" With any luck, the kids will do the same thing kids have always done. Tell me to go to hell, do it their own way, and crank it up! kim At 05:58 PM 2/16/98 -0500, Reginald Hunt wrote: >At 01:38 PM 2/16/98 -0800, you wrote: >>> Fripp (and Sinatra) will be remembered long after Snoop Doggy Dogg, Puff >> >>Fripp came from the same era that produced disco. >> >>Sinatra came from an era that produced a lot of forgettable music as well. >> >>Cheers, >> >>Paolo Valladolid > >Ditto for Hendrix and James Brown. Or the first Elvis. Who do we have in the >Nineties like that? Not Beck. > >Reg > > > > > > > _______________________________________________________ Kim Flint 408-752-9284 Mpact Systems Engineering kflint@chromatic.com Chromatic Research http://www.chromatic.com From ???@??? Mon Feb 16 19:56:28 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 16 16:07:03 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y4aYt-0002p0-00; Mon, 16 Feb 1998 16:06:59 -0800 Message-ID: <000801bd3b37$3666f8c0$ea22dacf@stepheng> Reply-To: "Stephen P. Goodman" From: "Stephen P. Goodman" To: Subject: Re: Promoting Looping and the Dubious Art of It Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 16:01:29 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Resent-Message-ID: <"O26vl.A.pCC.yNN60"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3362 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 16:06:59 -0800 X-UIDL: c4f14f0ce8a39a668b51e2430cab7620 >Cripes, this GROUP has trouble agreeing what looping "is"... I'm not sure about everyone here of course, but given the quasi-organic nature of the varied methods of Loop Processes we use, it may become us less to discuss what it 'is' than to investigate and our methods of using it. I suspect that since there are so many ways and uses of looping represented here, most of us hesitate to broadly define the Process, lest we enforce some potentially unsuitable standard upon someone with no use for it whatsoever. Some recent evidences of this consideration for each other's "thing", would include the spirited discussion on "looping vs. techno-slavery" we all seemed to survive. :) Generally I find that, in the organic nature of looping process, there are enough elements of true or apparent chaos to make things interesting, but this in itself does not mean that all my work must follow this paradigm. Sometimes I like a good raga-like drone that goes on for hours and hours. I think that, with the exception of repeated performance of works some might be coming just to see/hear, the piece takes on an I-Ching type of quality, that reflects something in me at the time of execution. This opens a can of even more interesting worms in terms of the nature of performance that should best be left for a less-complex discussion, but I find that, the more I become transparent - that is, without preconception - to the piece, and whatever it is of myself that goes into it, the more interesting it seems to others. So it's a multi-faceted appeal for me, and apparently for others, who for some reason I've not investigated, enjoy watching the pieces being created live. :) And, in many ways, a frigging Gift Horse of monumental proporttons, whose dental work I'm not sure I care to observe too closely. Stephen EarthLight Studios * http://www.earthlight.net/Studios From ???@??? Mon Feb 16 19:56:43 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 16 18:05:13 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y4cPF-0004dm-00; Mon, 16 Feb 1998 18:05:09 -0800 Message-Id: <2.2.32.19980217020034.009acee0@pop.chromatic.com> X-Sender: kflint@pop.chromatic.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 2.2 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 18:00:34 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Kim Flint Subject: Re: Secrets of Fripp Resent-Message-ID: <"s0WgWB.A.TCE.e-O60"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3365 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 18:05:09 -0800 X-UIDL: a599720dfef8509a126a4a49eca24cdd At 05:56 PM 2/16/98 -0000, T.W. Hartnett wrote: >>> For instance, Fripp sets his different >>> delay lines to specific mathematical ratios with the intent of creating >>> evolving textures that repeat in a long, yet specific amount of time. I >>> don't know what the numerical significance is to him (if any) but it seems >>> like he often uses prime number ratios, like 31:7 or something. Now how is >>> it that I know that and none of you Fripp fans ever brought it up? jeez. > >Because there's this guy on the list who gets sort of twitchy if we talk >a lot about Fripp or gear. > Ah!! So that's where all these facial ticks came from. :-) Admittedly I phrased that statement in a lame way, sorry. Looks especially bad when removed of surrounding context, but that's life on the internet, and I'll take it. Eventually the new twitch in my left leg will subside, and children will stop laughing at me on the street. The point was that many of you are clearly influenced by Robert Fripp and admire him. Many others here never even heard of him before, as shocking as that may sound. Some people are in between and have heard him a bit and might want to learn more about what he is doing with looping and why some people think so highly of him in that regard. Since this list is about looping, it would be really great if some of you RF experts could teach the rest of us about his looping techniques, looping conceptions, loop approaches, etc. Try your best not to go off on tangents about his personality quirks, and try to avoid talking down to your audience. Those are the sorts of things that cause folks in some circles to have strong nervous system reactions to fans of Mr. Fripp. Instead, just teach us something in a friendly, positive way, and the rest of us would be happy to return the favor. twitching, kim _______________________________________________________ Kim Flint 408-752-9284 Mpact Systems Engineering kflint@chromatic.com Chromatic Research http://www.chromatic.com From ???@??? Mon Feb 16 19:56:45 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 16 18:21:09 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y4ceh-0005yq-00; Mon, 16 Feb 1998 18:21:07 -0800 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <2.2.32.19980217020034.009acee0@pop.chromatic.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 21:18:35 -0500 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: David Myers Subject: Alesis Resent-Message-ID: <"5N_q0C.A.nUF.2NP60"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3366 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 18:21:07 -0800 X-UIDL: 68b3a6e38a07e58aa365b51de6f5968d I hope you guys (and couple of esteemed ladies) won't mind this crass off-topic intervention; but heck--I love you loop people, and lotta times, this IS a gear sorta place: For Sale: Alesis MidiVerb 4, great sound & condition, $240 plus COD ship. That said, I finally got my hands on DT's "What Means Solid, Traveller?" and am in serious awe; hope everyone here has their own copy! Now I'm going over to pick up my cheezy MexStrat and carry it down to the dumpster.... David Myers From ???@??? Mon Feb 16 10:17:45 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 16 08:52:54 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y4Tmm-0001iX-00; Mon, 16 Feb 1998 08:52:52 -0800 Message-Id: <3.0.1.16.19980216182829.0fdf4ccc@rank-serv.elec.gla.ac.uk> X-Sender: pycraft@rank-serv.elec.gla.ac.uk X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.1 (16) Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 18:28:29 To: dwhite@arbortext.com From: "Michael P. Hughes, Ph.D." Subject: Re: DON'T GO SEE A LIVE BAND -- YOU'LL SLEEP!!! Cc: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com In-Reply-To: <98Feb13.134744est.18818@thicket.arbortext.com> References: <199802131740.MAA12030@user1.channel1.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"0GN1u.A.pUB.B5G60"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3332 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 08:52:52 -0800 X-UIDL: d371fb972d6fbeea929650ba976ff005 Dave White: >Clubs start bands too late: 11:00 - 11:30 is too late to start bands. London >starts early and closes early and the bars still make money and probably a good >deal more money then a comparable bar in the U.S. 11:30 is a crazy time to start. Do the audience not have jobs? Are they not expected to sleep??? Over here, the main band starts maybe 8, 9pm. Michael From ???@??? Mon Feb 16 10:17:55 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 16 09:19:56 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y4UCq-0004eg-00; Mon, 16 Feb 1998 09:19:48 -0800 Message-Id: <3.0.1.16.19980216185331.0fdfe2da@rank-serv.elec.gla.ac.uk> X-Sender: pycraft@rank-serv.elec.gla.ac.uk X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.1 (16) Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 18:53:31 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: "Michael P. Hughes, Ph.D." Subject: RE: why do people think looping is just for guitar? In-Reply-To: <2.2.32.19980214043851.00d0cc58@pop.chromatic.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"fSQ_-B.A.SsD.fPH60"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3336 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 09:19:48 -0800 X-UIDL: 61a28641ca493dbff4735fa6cc470165 Kim: >My recurring experience is that the average, non-looper musician sees this >as "just a thing for guitarists". (a statement I heard from some dance music >producers when I asked them about the idea.) I find it curious that this is so. Well, guitarists don't have samplers (and have our hands too tied up to use them). >I've seen several store displays of loopers where the store placed it in the >guitar section, between a guitar and a guitar amp. Now that's certainly >useful, since lots of guitar players will interested. But other people who >also might be interested probably won't see it there. ... >Same with mail order catalogs. Loopers usually turn up in the guitar effects >section. Why? Is it really just savvy marketing, thinking that guitar >players will buy the most, let's stick it right under their nose, or is it >because they really think it's just a guitar effect? ... >Manufacturers ad campaigns, same story. They talk about how you can record >the rhythm guitar part in the looper and play the guitar solo along with it. >They mention various interesting guitarists into looping. No doubt that's >appealing to guitar players, but a somewhat different presentation would >make it appealing to a much wider audience. Why does one get chosen over the >other? ... >I guess that's where the question of "how do we change this perception?" >comes in. We all know this is a fun and interesting way to create music, and >that that's true whether you are playing accordian or triangle or guitar. >How do we show the musical general public that it's fun and interesting for >anyone? If we want the idea to grow and spread about, what do we show the >world about ourselves, and how do we do it? I actually think most (certainly many) more imaginative musicians look out for cool stuff like this. Example: many electric violinists will look at Guitar FX for their violins. They know that Zoom have no plans for a 50X: Violin. Most electric musicians know that the guitar section is where the performance FX end up. Ditto the electric harpists etc etc etc. The smaller interests know where to get information on products which are applicable to _them_, and are quite able to interpret the results. Perhaps the "guitar effects" section should be re-labelled the "performance effects" section; but then, the guitarists would never buy anything... ;) >So I wonder why the >store managers perceived it that way, why they chose to put it there. Why is >that choice made over the home studio section, or the electronic instrument >section, or anywhere else in the store? Maybe this is just me, but the EDP/JM/Rang are far more performance than studio processors. Probably the BIG loss is that the Electronic Instrument guys don't see the ad. Michael From ???@??? Mon Feb 16 10:17:57 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 16 09:23:01 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y4UFs-00053q-00; Mon, 16 Feb 1998 09:22:56 -0800 Message-Id: <3.0.1.16.19980216185354.0fdfe618@rank-serv.elec.gla.ac.uk> X-Sender: pycraft@rank-serv.elec.gla.ac.uk X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.1 (16) Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 18:53:54 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: "Michael P. Hughes, Ph.D." Subject: Re: why do people think looping is just for guitar? In-Reply-To: References: <0000AFA0.4007@poyry.com.br> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"LeqHtD.A.S2D.vQH60"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3338 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 09:22:57 -0800 X-UIDL: 9c83c2435170e8c5a80f1fac5170082e Kim: >To me, using real-time loops for percussion or cello or radio transmissions >or whatever seems just as valid. Why don't other people see it that way? >What do we do to change that perception? Perhaps : 1. The world just doesn't know enough electric cellists or radio-musicians; 2. The people at the Big Music Store aren't aware of the wider musical scene; 3. The people at the Big Music Store say "Oo. Effects box. Put it with the guitars, willya?" Point 3 ties in very well with Jon D's attempts at explaining what the JM/Tex do to Guitar Center (or whomever it was)... michael From ???@??? Mon Feb 16 10:17:59 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 16 09:32:09 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y4UOk-00062T-00; Mon, 16 Feb 1998 09:32:06 -0800 Message-Id: <3.0.1.16.19980216190821.10af97d4@rank-serv.elec.gla.ac.uk> X-Sender: pycraft@rank-serv.elec.gla.ac.uk X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.1 (16) Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 19:08:21 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: "Michael P. Hughes, Ph.D." Subject: Re: why do people think looping is just for guitar? In-Reply-To: References: <34E54129.521D@earthlink.net> <2.2.32.19980214043851.00d0cc58@pop.chromatic.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"ufgeRB.A.gTF.WdH60"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3339 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 09:32:06 -0800 X-UIDL: d47c04667ec05f1ea142802f71141378 Kim: >I think maybe I overemphasized the marketing of looping tools in my last >pathetic attempt to make a point, and neglected the more musician/audience >level of perception, acceptance, and expectation. That I think is important >too, probably more so. If people are exploring this real-time looping thing >in different musics or evolving it to another level or even pushing it in >dramatically new directions, they will be greatly aided by a broader >conception of "looping" in the minds of the mainstream music world. If >people so readily associate looping as a "guitar thing" it limits the >audience and sets expectations that may be wrong. The virtuostic loopers, >if such beings are possible, should be appreciated for their conception, >usage, and artistry of looping in its own right. I'm sure they are - we all know who the best loopers are - but then we're loopers. Non-loopers are unlikely to care, and the vast majority of the public don't care how or what you're playing your instrument through, as long as they like the music. Most don't know what guitar effects are.... >>And who tends to come to mind when the idea of a looper comes up? >>People like Robert Fripp and David Torn. Why? Because they've got the >>most high profile of any "loopists" I can think of. >*For You!* For a lot of people, it's totally different! Woah! Calm down, there, son! :) >That's the whole >point of this discussion. Looping is a varied, fragmented thing, with >numerous lines of development. I don't think any one of them has some right >to claim itself as the true looping lineage and deny all the others. Its >absurd! I'm sorry, but I have to agree with Andre here. Fripp/Torn (isn't he an actor) have done huge amounts for looping by expounding at length about the technique. Chet Atkins has a JM and it forms the core of one of his songs (like, Chet needs _more_ playing???), but hasn't written a single article in GP extolling the virtues of looping. If you want associations with a broad variety of palyers, the only way this will come about is to have Yo-Yo Ma on the cover of Classics magazine saying "At last! Tocata and Fuge in Dmin on Cello!" or something of similar stature, maybe Kenny G using it extensively on his latest album and getting it on the cover of Jazziz. That's the kind of profile it needs, and only in the guitar domain does that happen. >Actually I was just hoping to get people away from endlessly discussing >Robert Fripp's performance behaviors and back to something more related to >the list topic. Makes a change from demanding playlists, kim... ;) Michael From ???@??? Mon Feb 16 10:18:03 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 16 09:36:41 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y4UT9-0006YY-00; Mon, 16 Feb 1998 09:36:39 -0800 Message-Id: <3.0.1.16.19980216191039.10afc65c@rank-serv.elec.gla.ac.uk> X-Sender: pycraft@rank-serv.elec.gla.ac.uk X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.1 (16) Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 19:10:39 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: "Michael P. Hughes, Ph.D." Subject: Re: Why Looping is so popular with Guitarists?? In-Reply-To: <199802131642.JAA01410@hyper.dimensional.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"EEpewB.A.8uF.8gH60"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3340 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 09:36:39 -0800 X-UIDL: 211d0cf9bc7060d0166ad4bc8125d3ec >> I think the reason you see so many guitarists associated with Looping is >> simple - there are so many guitarists. >Y'know, the first two actual loopers I ever met were a 'cellist and a guy >who plays the sackbut or somesuch in an early music ensemble. My alltime fave looper is Ed Alleyne-johnson, who plays solo electric violin. Michael From ???@??? Mon Feb 16 23:37:13 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 16 20:07:19 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y4eJR-0007FM-00; Mon, 16 Feb 1998 20:07:17 -0800 Message-Id: <1.5.4.32.19980217040148.0069e300@pop.mindspring.com> X-Sender: gls@pop.mindspring.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 22:01:48 -0600 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Grover Sheffield Subject: Re: Undo vs Loop time vs. Delay time Resent-Message-ID: <"sDnXDB.A.JdG.BxQ60"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3368 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 20:07:17 -0800 X-UIDL: 24ea6173bdf64617c6aec3ba7d8fe631 As a looping (solo acoustic guitar/vocal) newbie, thanks for some neat suggestions, especially about sharing looping tricks (see below). I'm trying to figure out how to set up a signal to the EDP that will, at my demented command, capture either/or/and vocals and guitar and MIDI with that one input in a live setting (I may have to pay other people to stomp the pedals so I concentrate on what I'm supposed to play). I know I can get an and/or A-B box to manage 2 of the incoming signals; can I also add a y-cord into the EDP input to capture the 3rd signal, or does this upset the voltage digestion of the EDP? OR- can I send the MIDI signal into the EDP MIDI input? How do OTHER people handle this situation??? TIA!! Grover At 12:52 PM 2/16/98 -0800, you wrote: Anyone else out there use the awesome effect of rapidly >>pushing the undo button to make material fade back in once its >>disapeared. Also using a sequencer >>to do this is cool . Hey how about a thread of your own tricks on your >>respective loopers I think this might generate some positive ideas for >>everybdy. >> > >I also like building some complex loop by overdubbing on a simple base, >undoing it back to a more simple point and building it up again in a >different way. Rinse, and repeat as necessary. > >kim From ???@??? Mon Feb 16 23:37:43 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 16 20:52:35 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y4f1F-0003ED-00; Mon, 16 Feb 1998 20:52:33 -0800 From: Marzzz@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 23:46:21 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: immortals Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 82 Resent-Message-ID: <"o1iPzD.A.AmC.4aR60"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3369 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 20:52:33 -0800 X-UIDL: 64cde6c5a10ab3622b993394bd217497 In a message dated 2/16/98 5:04:37 PM, you wrote: >>Fripp came from the same era that produced disco. Didn't Fripp once have a variation of Frippertronics known as "Discotronics?" Marshall (life-long member of D.R.E.A.D.- Detroit Rockers Engaged in the Abolition of Disco) From ???@??? Mon Feb 16 23:37:44 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 16 21:01:56 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y4fAI-0004H2-00; Mon, 16 Feb 1998 21:01:54 -0800 From: Marzzz@aol.com Message-ID: <96b5eece.34e918b2@aol.com> Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 23:57:20 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: EDP Undo Question Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 82 Resent-Message-ID: <"tJ4k6B.A.woD.4jR60"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3370 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 21:01:54 -0800 X-UIDL: 863c65e22a038bcb35b4e804062e6285 I have a new EDP with 16 Megs RAM- I am just really scratching the surface here, but I have a question regarding the UNDO function- I find that the UNDO function seems to work fine in my unit, but I can never seem to UNDO the first/original loop that was recorded, no matter how many or how few or how long or how short the additional overdubs were. Is this normal operation? Am I doing something wrong? What sort of undocumented vagarities of the UNDO function should I be concerned about? Thanks- Marshall From ???@??? Tue Feb 17 00:21:31 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 17 00:10:55 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y4i7B-0001Hq-00; Tue, 17 Feb 1998 00:10:53 -0800 X-Sender: kflint@pop.slip.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <96b5eece.34e918b2@aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 00:08:27 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Kim Flint Subject: Re: EDP Undo Question Resent-Message-ID: <"lQKQHC.A.J_._VU60"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3371 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 00:10:53 -0800 X-UIDL: 793370430bff29a985a7155a7be10c26 Undo just undoes the overdubs. (also accidental function presses, but that's different.) So the thing recorded during the initial recording of the loop is not available for undoing. If you really want to be able to undo the first thing, start off by recording a loop of silence. Add everything as Overdubs. Then you can undo back to nothing. Sort of the nihilistic approach to looping.... kim At 11:57 PM -0500 2/16/98, Marzzz@aol.com wrote: >I have a new EDP with 16 Megs RAM- I am just really scratching the surface >here, but I have a question regarding the UNDO function- > >I find that the UNDO function seems to work fine in my unit, but I can never >seem to UNDO the first/original loop that was recorded, no matter how many or >how few or how long or how short the additional overdubs were. > >Is this normal operation? Am I doing something wrong? What sort of >undocumented vagarities of the UNDO function should I be concerned about? > > >Thanks- > >Marshall ______________________________________________________________________ Kim Flint | Looper's Delight kflint@annihilist.com | http://www.annihilist.com/loop/loop.html http://www.annihilist.com/ | Loopers-Delight-request@annihilist.com From ???@??? Tue Feb 17 09:34:02 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 17 04:17:25 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y4lxi-0003tU-00; Tue, 17 Feb 1998 04:17:22 -0800 Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 07:15:06 -0500 From: buzzard@world.std.com (Sean T Barrett) Message-Id: <199802171215.AA03802@world.std.com> To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: EDP Undo Question Resent-Message-ID: <"Ibl5C.A.IdD.O9X60"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3372 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 04:17:22 -0800 X-UIDL: da03da30ea81234a11b9f685c1990f96 >Undo just undoes the overdubs. (also accidental function presses, but >that's different.) So the thing recorded during the initial recording of >the loop is not available for undoing. If you allow a loop to fade out without overdubbing any material, does it still consume memory--i.e. are you constrained in how far back you can undo a fadeout? Or does the EDP fade out "non-destructively"? Sean Barrett From ???@??? Tue Feb 17 09:34:07 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 17 04:31:02 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y4mAu-0004Zd-00; Tue, 17 Feb 1998 04:31:00 -0800 Message-Id: <3.0.1.32.19980217132849.00cc6aa8@pop.stud.ntnu.no> X-Sender: eriklj@pop.stud.ntnu.no X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (32) Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 13:28:49 +0100 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: eriklj@stud.ntnu.no Subject: Oscillators In-Reply-To: <199710241516.LAA22933@mail.colba.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"iUBCoD.A.wGE.GKY60"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3373 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 04:31:00 -0800 X-UIDL: c0a942851e3479121248b51042716e42 Dear list, About half a year ago I wrote to the list asking for info on oscillators, as I needed one for my ring mod. I've been saving a very informative reply by D4V1D KR1ST14N, suggesting that I should get a good solid state oscillator from a surplus dealer. My question is: Does anyone know of such a dealer? If you do, please let me know. Your help is appreciated, Erik Ljones (Norway) From ???@??? Tue Feb 17 09:34:18 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 17 06:36:18 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y4o88-0002ha-00; Tue, 17 Feb 1998 06:36:16 -0800 Message-Id: <199802171430.JAA06967@mail.colba.net> From: "Julia & Dave" To: Subject: Re: Oscillators Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 09:33:22 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1161 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"wu8ci.A.KQC.B_Z60"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3374 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 06:36:16 -0800 X-UIDL: f26838c4275e171562fc270005d8d40e Have you looked in electronics publications? There are ads at the back which feature surplus dealers stocks of reconditioned Hewlett-Packard Oscillator. I do not have anything at present time, but perhaps someone else out there on the list may have some addresses. D 4 V 1 D K R 1 5 T 1 4 N --------------------------------------------- jndk@colba.net http://www.alien8recordings.com ---------- > From: eriklj@stud.ntnu.no > To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com > Subject: Oscillators > Date: Tuesday, February 17, 1998 7:28 AM > > Dear list, > > About half a year ago I wrote to the list asking for info on oscillators, > as I needed one for my ring mod. I've been saving a very informative reply > by D4V1D KR1ST14N, suggesting that I should get a good solid state > oscillator from a surplus dealer. > My question is: Does anyone know of such a dealer? If you do, please let me > know. Your help is appreciated, > > Erik Ljones (Norway) > > > > > From ???@??? Tue Feb 17 09:34:38 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 17 08:44:01 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y4q7j-0004MG-00; Tue, 17 Feb 1998 08:43:59 -0800 Message-Id: <199802171635.IAA21967@sonic.sonic.com> Subject: Re: broad masses of drummers and Loops Date: Tue, 17 Feb 98 08:42:57 -0800 x-sender: andy_wolpert@pop.sonic.com x-mailer: Claris Emailer 2.0, March 15, 1997 From: Andy Wolpert To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Resent-Message-ID: <"-4vbpC.A.BjD.Z1b60"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3375 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 08:43:59 -0800 X-UIDL: 27ead8f302ea2dd49293be634a53e710 I have found that looping works better for guitar and voice rather than bass and drums because tiny mistakes in loop lengths are less forgivable for bass and a real drag for drums. Any ideas on ways to get extremely precise loop lengths in conjunction with a tap in the length situaltion? Like generationg MIDI from drum triggers? __ _/\_ / \___/ \______ \ Andy Wolpert \__ | Sonic Solutions \ / awolpert@sonic.com / | (415) 893-8043 / \___ __ ___/ \__/ \_____/ From ???@??? Tue Feb 17 11:30:29 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 17 11:20:37 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y4sZG-0003oy-00; Tue, 17 Feb 1998 11:20:34 -0800 From: Fmplautus@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 14:15:20 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Cool Looper Alert Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 78 Resent-Message-ID: <"7CeoiD.A.sAD.mHe60"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3376 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 11:20:34 -0800 X-UIDL: 56b2366a0bcb7d2946320ab19a191ffe Anybody check out the new Bill Frissell album, GONE LIKE A TRAIN? Interesting, spare, sinewy, ice skater- like loops at the end of track 6, LOOKOUT FOR HOPE, and track 16 -- no title and officially not a "tune" but at the end of the CD in a kind of sneaky Beatlesque White Album way. We think tracks six looping is especially musical -- again at the end of the piece. It's interesting to see Friessell tip-toeing into looping. We really like the way he used the loops to enhance his style of playing jazz guitar. (The way he plays reminds us of turn of the century "parlor" guitar that's been warped by Thelonius Monk.) Frissell has absored "play the spaces" from Monk, and from what we hear his looping forays are about that. It's also an alternative looping universe to the dense "texture" looping that we all know and love, just as his guitar playing is a healthy antidote to the "velocity" single voice playing that has denominated electric guitar in the last decade. But will Frissell only continue to flirt with looping, or will he flat out make a commitment and bring her home to mama? He seems to be becoming more popular. Best, the LoOpdOctOrs From ???@??? Tue Feb 17 14:24:32 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 17 12:02:44 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y4tE2-0000UT-00; Tue, 17 Feb 1998 12:02:42 -0800 Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 11:56:42 -0800 (PST) From: Andre LaFosse To: matthias@bahianet.com.br cc: loopers-delight@annihilist.com Subject: Fwd: Call for electroacoustic music (fwd) Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Resent-Message-ID: <"TzfPK.A.sDH.Mue60"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3377 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 12:02:42 -0800 X-UIDL: 16d5a0d4baf5bccf6eb0088fe9cd9368 This comes via the webmaster at my alma mater's music department.. ---------------- Begin Forwarded Message ---------------- Date: 02/16 11:51 AM Received: 02/16 6:20 PM From: Guto, guto@sercomtel.com.br To: MN, guto@sercomtel.com.br Call for electroacoustic music: The Musica Nova radio programme, which has been on air weekly since November 1991, is dedicated to the diffusion of contemporary music. Musica Nova goes on air every Monday at 21:00, on the Radio Universidade FM, 107.9 MHz, which is organised by the University of Londrina, Brazil. This year, two series of Electroacoustic Music programmes are being planned for broadcast. We are therefore inviting composers to send us their work. The two series (consisting of two to four programmes each) are scheduled to go on air in September/October 1998. The works received will be integrated into the NMC (Nucleo de Musica Contemporanea) music library at the University Arts Deparment. They will be made available for research and teaching activities. Send recordings (DAT,CD, MD or LP), together with programme notes and related information to: Janete El Haouli / Nucleo de Musica Contemporanea Universidade Estadual de Londrina Campus Universitario - CECA - Arte Cx. P. 6001 CEP: 86051-970 Londrina - Parana BRASIL Information: janete@sercomtel.com.br Thank you, Musica Nova / Nucleo de Musica Contemporanea Segundas, 21:00, Radio Universidade FM 107.9MHz http://www.uel.br/Web/home/uel/ceca/dart/web/ ----------------- End Forwarded Message ----------------- From ???@??? Tue Feb 17 14:24:35 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 17 13:05:12 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y4uCT-0006uQ-00; Tue, 17 Feb 1998 13:05:09 -0800 Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 13:59:51 -0700 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: dtapia@unoco.edu (Douglas Tapia) Subject: Re: Frisell's Looping techniques Resent-Message-ID: <"vHUJkC.A.a1F.Zpf60"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3378 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 13:05:09 -0800 X-UIDL: 9e2a5ab05b697cb428c8eea140f3b95d >Anybody check out the new Bill Frissell album, GONE LIKE A TRAIN? Isn't he just bad? I've always loved Frisell, and I'm not a guitarist. >It's interesting to see Friessell tip-toeing into looping. Well, if you can call having used looping for the last decade "tip-toeing," then yes. No, Bill won't beat you over the head with his looping prowess, which makes it all the cooler, and really fits with his playing style, as you noted. Bill makes excellent use of space, and less is generally more for him. It's amazing to see Bill play live, especially with his old Quartet. The last time I saw this group perform, my friends and I noted that the rest of the group (violin, trumpet, and trombone) had embraced the concept of arhythmic looping as one of the over-arching concepts around which the group was built. They had no looping processors, but would play repetitive motives which sounded like Frisell's looped materials. Thus, Ron Miles (tpt), and Curtis Fowlkes (tbn) provided and interesting polyrhythmic texture for Bill to play over. Hum. . . Looping as a legitimate composition tool. . . who would have guessed. By the way all you gear heads, What IS Bill using to do all his looping? I had a friend tell me that it was some propriatary somthing. Anybody know for sure? Oh, and in anwser to the "Why is it that only guitarists loop" thread: I've been looping and twisting my Rhodes, Clav, and Organ for sometime. (That just sounds wrong somehow) Doug Tapia From ???@??? Tue Feb 17 14:24:52 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 17 13:35:50 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y4ug4-0002GB-00; Tue, 17 Feb 1998 13:35:44 -0800 Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 15:31:50 -0600 (CST) From: Dave Stagner To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Frisell's Looping techniques In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Resent-Message-ID: <"2W2V3.A.FsB.PHg60"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3379 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 13:35:44 -0800 X-UIDL: 219aeba0758ad39e0ca336cfce743e6b I don't know what Frissell uses for looping these days. For his early work, he used a classic EH16, but quit using it because he was afraid it would break. I think he may have switched to a modified Lexicon delay like Torn used. He also used a little Boss digital delay, but i think of that as more tone shaping than looping. My favorite looping Frissell is the album "Strange Meeting" by Power Tools. -dave Practice beautiful randomness and act kind of senseless. From ???@??? Tue Feb 17 14:24:54 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 17 14:09:28 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y4vCd-0006Cs-00; Tue, 17 Feb 1998 14:09:23 -0800 Message-ID: <2148EC143F29D1118BE000805FC13CD01E1F8F@migarexch01.maritz.com> From: "Liebig, Steuart A." To: "'Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com'" Subject: RE: Cool Looper Alert Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 16:01:16 -0600 X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) Resent-Message-ID: <"_Gb1oC.A._TF.bmg60"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3381 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 14:09:23 -0800 X-UIDL: 0061fcb4f802d9c542cf4c5378cabdc2 Just so you all know . . . Bill was using a EH-16 back in 1986 (and probably before) to do looping-at least live, I can't remember any of his recordings with looping on 'em, maybe some of the things that he did with Tim Berne . . . He was the first guy I ever heard using an EH-16 to do this and it inspired a friend of mine to go search one out. So I don't exactly think that he's tip-toeing into looping at this point. steuart p.s. last heard Bill's EH-16 finally broke and he was looking for one . . . anyone feeling generous? > ---------- > From: Fmplautus@aol.com > Reply To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com > Sent: Tuesday, February 17, 1998 11:20 AM > To: LiebigSA@maritz.com > Subject: Cool Looper Alert > > Anybody check out the new Bill Frissell album, GONE LIKE A TRAIN? > > Interesting, spare, sinewy, ice skater- like loops at the end of > track 6, > LOOKOUT FOR HOPE, and track 16 -- no title and officially not a "tune" > but at > the end of the CD in a kind of sneaky Beatlesque White Album way. We > think > tracks six looping is especially musical -- again at the end of the > piece. > > It's interesting to see Friessell tip-toeing into looping. We really > like the > way he used the loops to enhance his style of playing jazz guitar. > (The way > he plays reminds us of turn of the century "parlor" guitar that's been > warped > by Thelonius Monk.) Frissell has absored "play the spaces" from > Monk, and > from what we hear his looping forays are about that. > > It's also an alternative looping universe to the dense "texture" > looping that > we all know and love, just as his guitar playing is a healthy antidote > to the > "velocity" single voice playing that has denominated electric guitar > in the > last decade. > > But will Frissell only continue to flirt with looping, or will he flat > out > make a commitment and bring her home to mama? He seems to be becoming > more > popular. > > Best, > the LoOpdOctOrs > From ???@??? Tue Feb 17 14:24:53 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 17 13:54:22 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y4uy3-0004XV-00; Tue, 17 Feb 1998 13:54:20 -0800 Message-Id: <3.0.32.19980217140331.006b8618@svars1.simi-valley.ate.slb.com> X-Sender: cavaleri@svars1.simi-valley.ate.slb.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0 (32) Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 14:03:35 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Joe Cavaleri Subject: Re: Frisell's Looping techniques Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"leu9jB.A.8sD.6Xg60"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3380 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 13:54:20 -0800 X-UIDL: cfb753ebb0cb291ac60d3a1dc32ef47e Had a chance to see mr. frisell at mc'cabes a few weeks back. His signal flow was as follows; (best that I could tell). Klein Guitar > Boss Delay pedal > Boss Tremolo > Dan Electro Fuzz > Digi-tech PDS 8000(?) > Lexicon LXP 1 > Stereo out > pair of Fender amps. (miked). From ???@??? Tue Feb 17 14:24:57 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 17 14:21:45 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y4vOZ-0007g4-00; Tue, 17 Feb 1998 14:21:43 -0800 From: Edward_Chang@mail.amsinc.com Date: Tue, 17 Feb 98 17:18:00 EST Encoding: 11 Text Message-Id: <9801178877.AA887764591@mail.amsinc.com> To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Frisell Thread Resent-Message-ID: <"NJ4rID.A.rlG.Rxg60"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3382 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 14:21:43 -0800 X-UIDL: 0a02a4b603301f9e9567e24ef071c501 Yeah, the PDS8000 Echo+ strikes again with Bill Frisell. He inspired a friend of mine who inspired me to get one. Also Elliot Sharp and Zeena Parkins (modified electric harp) uses one. A few more, but I can't remember. Wasn't there some article a while back where Bill said he was getting rid of all his effects and playing just an acoustic guitar? I knew he'd come back to the electro-fold! Call me a rock-dude, but Frisell's work on the Zorn Naked City stuff is still my favorite. He "does" the Melvins on the Leng T'che album. Who'd a thunk? ed chang From ???@??? Tue Feb 17 19:31:02 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 17 14:35:48 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y4vc7-0001mn-00; Tue, 17 Feb 1998 14:35:43 -0800 Mime-Version: 1.0 Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 14:21:38 -0800 Message-ID: <00090B25.----@wj.com> From: Mike.Biffle@wj.com (Mike Biffle) Subject: Re[2]: Frisell's Looping techniques To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com, dtapia@unoco.edu (Douglas Tapia) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Description: cc:Mail note part Resent-Message-ID: <"NQO6DD.A.Xk.v6g60"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3384 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 14:35:43 -0800 X-UIDL: f7f8a814e05fd6bb732bbd59b5713c48 >>Anybody check out the new Bill Frissell album, GONE LIKE A TRAIN? Someone also mentioned Power Tools! That release affected me strongly too. I'd say my favorite Frissell is "Where in the World?" The first track "Unsung Heroes" is amazing. Awesome Cello work! >Bill makes excellent use of space, and less is generally more for him. >It's amazing to see Bill play live, especially with his old Quartet... would >play repetitive motives which sounded like Frisell's looped materials. Thus, >Ron Miles (tpt), and Curtis Fowlkes (tbn) provided and interesting polyrhythmic >texture for Bill to play over. >By the way all you gear heads, What IS Bill using to do all his looping? I >had a friend tell me that it was some propriatary somthing. Anybody know >for sure? Doug Tapia The last time I saw him about 3 years ago, he actually had a JamMan with a LXP-1 and his Digitech floor box (the 8 second one) strapped to a bar stool. He did a lot of fiddling with the mix knob on the JamMan. He would input silently and then at some airy moment or pause in the music crank it up and see what was in there. Great fun! On the floor he had his TC Sustainor, Rat Fuzz-Box, Boss DD-3 and volume pedal. It actually looked like he had the Boss delay between his guitar and the fuzz which makes for an unusual tone config. (I could be wrong on this due to the cable pile on the floor). I've seen him a few times and he always had the Digitech box on a stool... He didn't tap anything with his foot. He would take (seemingly) wild stabs at the pedal with his hand to put the delay on hold. Then he would twiddle with the delay time knob to transpose the sound up or down for some pretty cool sounds. (With varying results). (He did have the JamMan dual foot control.) The thing I enjoyed the most about his looping was that it seemed like Bill was just as eager to find out what would come out of his boxes as the audience. When it was funny or compelling, you could see his immediate surprise or satisfaction with the result. He also has an attractive childlike attitude about the act of improvisation in general. Very open regardless of the results, which is very engaging. I felt like I was exploring with him while he played. I know there have been recent criticisms of discussing performer's attitudes or personality traits, but for me the music is an extension of the performer. My -perception- of the person adds or detracts from the music in various ways. While this may be thought of as a limitation, I find philosophy and attitude to be very important parts of the artist / music relationship. I hope this doesn't offend anyone. -Miko From ???@??? Tue Feb 17 19:31:01 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 17 14:33:08 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y4vZa-0001QT-00; Tue, 17 Feb 1998 14:33:06 -0800 From: Fmplautus@aol.com Message-ID: <778c970.34ea0e1e@aol.com> Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 17:24:28 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: RE: Cool Looper Alert Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 78 Resent-Message-ID: <"465IcD.A.9T.94g60"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3383 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 14:33:06 -0800 X-UIDL: 627a48501f4b80cc8106caef1387e3d8 We apologize. We know Frissell has been looping for quite a while...by the "tip-toe" comment we don't mean he's just discovered looping. We saw him do it live on stage a few years ago. We mean that he's very subtle with it and uses it sparingly, shyly ...like Clark Kent on a date. Opinions? Is he a looper/equivocater. Looper/dissembler. Looper/imposter. Or Looper/eigth-grader? Whatever, we think his loops on this album are very musical. We are charmed by Bill, but apologize for our hamfisted use of the English language. The LoOpDoctOrs From ???@??? Tue Feb 17 19:31:04 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 17 14:44:39 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y4vki-000345-00; Tue, 17 Feb 1998 14:44:36 -0800 Message-ID: <2148EC143F29D1118BE000805FC13CD01E1F90@migarexch01.maritz.com> From: "Liebig, Steuart A." To: "'Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com'" Subject: RE: Frisell Thread Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 16:37:22 -0600 X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) Resent-Message-ID: <"1akp.A.a-B.QFh60"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3385 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 14:44:36 -0800 X-UIDL: 1fd55bcc1d8793e9f01e3034c14c9661 great band > ---------- > From: Edward_Chang@mail.amsinc.com > Reply To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com > Sent: Tuesday, February 17, 1998 2:21 PM > To: LiebigSA@maritz.com > Subject: Frisell Thread > > > Yeah, the PDS8000 Echo+ strikes again with Bill Frisell. He > inspired a > friend of mine who inspired me to get one. Also Elliot Sharp and > Zeena > Parkins (modified electric harp) uses one. A few more, but I can't > remember. Wasn't there some article a while back where Bill said he > was > getting rid of all his effects and playing just an acoustic guitar? > I > knew he'd come back to the electro-fold! Call me a rock-dude, but > Frisell's work on the Zorn Naked City stuff is still my favorite. > He > "does" the Melvins on the Leng T'che album. Who'd a thunk? > > ed chang > > From ???@??? Tue Feb 17 19:31:05 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 17 14:57:46 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y4vxP-0004bL-00; Tue, 17 Feb 1998 14:57:43 -0800 From: PJBMHB@aol.com Message-ID: <5f42960d.34ea149e@aol.com> Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 17:52:12 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Frisell's Looping techniques Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 16-bit for Windows sub 41 Resent-Message-ID: <"0S7K3C.A._wD.fTh60"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3386 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 14:57:43 -0800 X-UIDL: a85c34519c65d1241a536fa567a647fb bill uses one of those digitech 8 sec. stompboxes in his video, The Guitar Artistry of Bill Frisell. he no longer uses his compressor or vol. pedal. when i saw him a few yrs ago with paul motian he was using a jamman and having kind of a hard time with it. i think he might have just gotten it at that point and wasn't really sure what he was doing with it. =-) PJ From ???@??? Tue Feb 17 19:31:14 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 17 16:10:09 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y4x5Q-0004NR-00; Tue, 17 Feb 1998 16:10:04 -0800 From: "Randy Jones" To: Subject: Re: Frisell's Looping techniques Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 18:03:45 -0600 Message-ID: <01bd3c00$ae841440$1c3163d1@user.texas.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Resent-Message-ID: <"IiyfOD.A.2mD.lXi60"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3387 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 16:10:04 -0800 X-UIDL: a4e43dd887613e221f30aa70d71b1c67 Hi, What creates that pedal steel effect? Is it just the trans trem on the Klein? Thanks Randy Jones -----Original Message----- From: PJBMHB@aol.com To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Date: Tuesday, February 17, 1998 4:59 PM Subject: Re: Frisell's Looping techniques >bill uses one of those digitech 8 sec. stompboxes in his video, The Guitar >Artistry of Bill Frisell. he no longer uses his compressor or vol. pedal. when >i saw him a few yrs ago with paul motian he was using a jamman and having kind >of a hard time with it. i think he might have just gotten it at that point and >wasn't really sure what he was doing with it. =-) PJ > > From ???@??? Tue Feb 17 19:31:24 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 17 16:17:28 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y4xCX-0005Od-00; Tue, 17 Feb 1998 16:17:25 -0800 Message-ID: <2148EC143F29D1118BE000805FC13CD01E1F91@migarexch01.maritz.com> From: "Liebig, Steuart A." To: "'Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com'" Subject: RE: RE: Cool Looper Alert Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 18:09:18 -0600 X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) Resent-Message-ID: <"4mOO-D.A.yHE.ibi60"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3388 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 16:17:25 -0800 X-UIDL: 87b35d73fd61ba003fd287bff228bd29 Opinion: I'd say that Bill is billiant musician who happens to use looping as one of the many tools/devices at his disposal for composing or improvising. By the way, the shy and Clark Kent discriptors are pretty apt. I had the honor of playing on a tour with Bill and he was a truly sweet guy . . . not an ego case at all. > ---------- > From: Fmplautus@aol.com > > We apologize. We know Frissell has been looping for quite a > while...by the > "tip-toe" comment we don't mean he's just discovered looping. We saw > him do > it live on stage a few years ago. > > We mean that he's very subtle with it and uses it sparingly, shyly > ...like > Clark Kent on a date. > > Opinions? Is he a looper/equivocater. Looper/dissembler. > Looper/imposter. > Or Looper/eigth-grader? > > Whatever, we think his loops on this album are very musical. We are > charmed > by Bill, but apologize for our hamfisted use of the English language. > > > The LoOpDoctOrs > From ???@??? Tue Feb 17 19:31:26 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 17 16:45:26 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y4xdY-0000ks-00; Tue, 17 Feb 1998 16:45:20 -0800 From: PJBMHB@aol.com Message-ID: <1c28a8ce.34ea2dc6@aol.com> Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 19:39:32 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Frisell's Looping techniques Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 16-bit for Windows sub 41 Resent-Message-ID: <"DRAAP.A.hJ.P4i60"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3389 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 16:45:20 -0800 X-UIDL: 544bc6da3ace8358c238c2345f9968a2 bill doesn't use a whammy. he just bends the string a little bit with his finger and the delay does the rest. try this with a volume pedal. you too can do the steel gtr thang! =-) PJ From ???@??? Tue Feb 17 19:31:33 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 17 18:13:23 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y4z0g-0001dx-00; Tue, 17 Feb 1998 18:13:18 -0800 From: Marzzz@aol.com Message-ID: <52fe606b.34ea41b6@aol.com> Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 21:04:36 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: EDP Undo Question Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 82 Resent-Message-ID: <"6fkmAB.A.PT.8Gk60"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3390 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 18:13:18 -0800 X-UIDL: 6ae9f862754494f3e83e243f10645f8c In a message dated 2/17/98 2:10:26 AM, Kim-san wrote: >Undo just undoes the overdubs. (also accidental function presses, but >that's different.) So the thing recorded during the initial recording of >the loop is not available for undoing. > >If you really want to be able to undo the first thing, start off by >recording a loop of silence. Add everything as Overdubs. Then you can undo >back to nothing. Sort of the nihilistic approach to looping.... Ah, so desu!!! Wakarimas! Domo arigato! Marshall (watching too much Olympics right now....) From ???@??? Tue Feb 17 19:31:36 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 17 18:31:24 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y4zI7-0004Pr-00; Tue, 17 Feb 1998 18:31:19 -0800 From: Marzzz@aol.com Message-ID: <74b1fa73.34ea448f@aol.com> Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 21:16:45 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: RE: Frisell Thread Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 82 Resent-Message-ID: <"pW506.A.9iC.lVk60"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3391 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 18:31:20 -0800 X-UIDL: e76ee14ddb275ce5cb32a2565f7c09a2 In a message dated 2/17/98 4:43:34 PM, someone wrote: >Call me a rock-dude, but >> Frisell's work on the Zorn Naked City stuff is still my favorite. >> He "does" the Melvins on the Leng T'che album. Who'd a thunk? "Zorn Naked City stuff?" Can you be more specific, I am a bit of a Frisell fan, and I'm not familiar with this..... intrigued, Marshall From ???@??? Tue Feb 17 19:31:37 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 17 18:34:42 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y4zLI-0004uP-00; Tue, 17 Feb 1998 18:34:36 -0800 Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 21:20:42 -0500 From: R & T Cummings Subject: Re: broad masses of drummers and Loops Sender: R & T Cummings To: "INTERNET:Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com" Message-ID: <199802172120_MC2-33B5-9809@compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Disposition: inline Resent-Message-ID: <"ppDgq.A.42C.kXk60"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3392 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 18:34:36 -0800 X-UIDL: 5c7554a2f216c5d647da6283346aa43f Andy Wolpert wrote: >Any ideas on ways to get extremely precise loop lengths in conjunction with a tap in the length situaltion? Like generationg MIDI from drum triggers?< Yes, one could use a drum trigger to tap in the start & stop of a loop. That's something that I would also like to do once I get a MIDI controller (more gear ... sigh). Sometimes it just seems more practical to hit something with a stick rather than fumbling with your foot for the right button. One thing that I'd be worried about though is whether the actual trigger "source" (i.e. sound) is also to be included in the loop. Percussion sounds at the boundary can be obnoxious due to the cut-off sound transient (popping, etc.). What I'm currently doing is playing with a MIDI sync (drum machine) for my rhythmically "precise" (this is, uh, relative) loops. I must admit that I needed a lot of convincing from my bandmate (he's a remix guy)! But after a while, I started to get into the idea of playing with a beatbox - I now see it as a second drummer or percussionist. The machine that we're currently using is a JoMoX - an analog drum machine with a very non-realistic drum sound. This seems to make it cool to me - it no longer tries to emulate "real" (more relativity) drums - it has its own identity. This is the same sort of aesthetic that I also like in ambient techno, some d'n'b etc. but this is drifting ... Talk to ya later, everyone tell me some of your ideas! Rob From ???@??? Tue Feb 17 19:31:44 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 17 18:57:02 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y4zgw-00007t-00; Tue, 17 Feb 1998 18:56:58 -0800 Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 21:20:45 -0500 From: R & T Cummings Subject: Re: Cool Looper Alert Sender: R & T Cummings To: "INTERNET:Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com" Message-ID: <199802172121_MC2-33B5-980E@compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Disposition: inline Resent-Message-ID: <"gwZVo.A.5oG.Eyk60"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3395 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 18:56:58 -0800 X-UIDL: 4c5b6fbaeddb7080da07441e98cd0d1a Ze LoOpdOctOrs haf bin riting: >But will Frissell only continue to flirt with looping, or will he flat out make a commitment and bring her home to mama? He seems to be becoming more popular.< I tink, he's bin to mama und he is now long gone. He makes se loops now since long time wit hiss EH-16. Recommend zu yu: "In Line" "Power Tools" "Before We Were Born" "Quartet" and many others (you're sure to hear from other listees) OK, let me drop my "deutsch" accent, I admit to being a big Frisell fan for a few years now. In fact, he's the one who got me into looping after seeing him with the Paul Motian Trio and I wondered, "what the heck has he got in that in that little box?". As far as I know, he's dabbled with the Jamman but he usually only uses the EH-16 live. I agree with you Doc's in that he uses the looper in an interesting non-blubbery texture sort of way. As far as my ears can tell, he also does a fair amount of 2x and 1/2x switching - that is doubling / halving the return rate - which is a cool lo-fi dub effect. P.S. Any of U loopers know how he got his sounds on "The Beach" >from "In Line"? This track has always spooked me out ... P.P.S. To all EH-16 users: Is it possible with this machine to make a loop with sounds recorded at both sampling rates? Thanks, Rob (spending a night with the Looper's list while my girlfriend wonders what's taking so long ;-) ) Cummings (no relation to Bob) From ???@??? Tue Feb 17 19:31:37 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 17 18:35:20 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y4zLw-00050R-00; Tue, 17 Feb 1998 18:35:16 -0800 Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 21:20:49 -0500 From: R & T Cummings Subject: Re: Drum and Percussion Looping Sender: R & T Cummings To: "INTERNET:Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com" Message-ID: <199802172121_MC2-33B5-9812@compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Disposition: inline Resent-Message-ID: <"JeoRdC.A.08C.HYk60"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3393 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 18:35:16 -0800 X-UIDL: be921d99d19147c080e82b3c04788125 Tom Roady wrote: >Rob, Tell me more about the VINX/Calhoun Project. I assume you are talking Will Calhoun.< Sorry bout the delay, I've been busy in the last while ... I actually didn't get to check this band out when they were here for one of the jazz fests last summer, so all I have is second hand info. They had Doug Wimbish in the band, too, so I guess they were pretty funky. Does anyone else know about this project/band (Andre'?)? Didn't they record something together? Tom also asked: >I have been mostly using it (as at NAMM) with the ZENDRUM but I just aquired a Wavedrum and I am going to be getting some microphones for acoustic congas etc... Any hints on getting the acoustics into the loop at the correct input levels?< That's one of my ongoing challenges... :-( I don't currently have a very elaborate microphone setup (a single condenser overhead). I'm using headphones to monitor my sound to eliminate getting the the two other guys on my loops. I'm not totally satisfied with this approach, though. It tends to cut me off from the "liveness" of a gig and I don't hear my kit acoustically the way I'd like to. I s'pose mic'ing each source and sending it to a mixer would be ideal. I'm about to buy a Mackie 1402 mixer, so that should improve my situation, well not until I buy meself some microphones! I'm also using an expander/compressor (Behringer Composer - thanks to those on the list who sent their advice!) to even out the peaks and troughs. PS: Wow - Wave drums, Zendrums ... envy ... me want some too! What are some of the differences between the two? Later, Rob From ???@??? Tue Feb 17 19:31:43 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 17 18:54:47 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y4zek-0007d6-00; Tue, 17 Feb 1998 18:54:42 -0800 Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19980217184806.0096bd90@global.california.com> X-Sender: sechevar@global.california.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 18:48:06 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Sean Echevarria Subject: Re: RE: Frisell Thread In-Reply-To: <74b1fa73.34ea448f@aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"e3KwzD.A.SbG.jwk60"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3394 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 18:54:42 -0800 X-UIDL: c46a1ea1459126bc086ce64ef8be7f18 John Zorn's Naked City - excellent stuff. You have to look under Zorn and/or Naked City in the rock and/or jazz sections of your local store. Or head to the web - where searches are a lot easier. I have 2 or 3 of their releases and like the self-titled Naked City the best. oh yeah - I was lucky enough to catch them at a place called the Barns a couple years ago - these two barns that were taken apart from who knows where and put pack together inside out for music, plays, etc. At 09:16 PM 2/17/98 EST, Marshall wrote: >"Zorn Naked City stuff?" Can you be more specific, I am a bit of a Frisell >fan, and I'm not familiar with this..... > >intrigued, > >Marshall > > > From ???@??? Tue Feb 17 23:54:00 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 17 19:48:14 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y50UW-0004dm-00; Tue, 17 Feb 1998 19:48:12 -0800 Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 21:45:18 -0600 (CST) From: Dave Stagner To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Frisell's Looping techniques In-Reply-To: <01bd3c00$ae841440$1c3163d1@user.texas.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Resent-Message-ID: <"d9lxu.A.HEE.Yll60"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3396 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 19:48:12 -0800 X-UIDL: 3d6c50f7ad90c5168ea146b879818448 On Tue, 17 Feb 1998, Randy Jones wrote: > What creates that pedal steel effect? Is it just the trans trem on the > Klein? He was getting that effect 15 years ago with a Gibson SG with no whammy. Just bending the neck... easy with an SG (i had a roommate who was constantly popping his SG neck off the guitar that way). I kinda doubt he's bending the neck on a Klein, though, considering that it's carbon fiber. Oh, and don't forget the volume pedal and delay! I used to actually practice what Frissell does... bring a chord fragment in with the volume and delay, and then add a couple of picked notes as an arpeggio. Those last couple of notes just glisten in the bed of the chord. It's a beautiful effect. Yeah, it's tacky to comment on player's personalities, but i've never heard anything but praise for Frissell as an artist. He appears genuinely humble about his own skill. He's also an amazingly *tasteful* player... all the more so by how far outside he can go. He's the only musician alive i'd compare to Thelonius Monk. -dave Practice beautiful randomness and act kind of senseless. From ???@??? Tue Feb 17 23:54:04 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 17 20:00:06 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y50g0-0005qP-00; Tue, 17 Feb 1998 20:00:04 -0800 Message-Id: <2.2.32.19980218035440.00a25908@pop.chromatic.com> X-Sender: kflint@pop.chromatic.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 2.2 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 19:54:40 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Kim Flint Subject: Re: Frisell's Looping techniques Resent-Message-ID: <"Kv_VR.A.kFF.zvl60"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3397 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 20:00:04 -0800 X-UIDL: 805079a222824a17989a2ce6e05978e4 At 09:45 PM 2/17/98 -0600, you wrote: >On Tue, 17 Feb 1998, Randy Jones wrote: > >> What creates that pedal steel effect? Is it just the trans trem on the >> Klein? > >He was getting that effect 15 years ago with a Gibson SG with no whammy. >Just bending the neck... easy with an SG (i had a roommate who was >constantly popping his SG neck off the guitar that way). I kinda doubt >he's bending the neck on a Klein, though, considering that it's carbon >fiber. Oh, and don't forget the volume pedal and delay! that's funny, the neck on my klein looks like guatemalan rosewood. although, I don't expect I'll be bending many chords that way....not a guitar I want to be breaking any time soon....:-) Klein only uses the carbon fiber necks if you ask, and I don't think anybody does. kim _______________________________________________________ Kim Flint 408-752-9284 Mpact Systems Engineering kflint@chromatic.com Chromatic Research http://www.chromatic.com From ???@??? Tue Feb 17 23:54:05 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 17 20:13:25 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y50sq-0007Il-00; Tue, 17 Feb 1998 20:13:20 -0800 From: Fmplautus@aol.com Message-ID: <9460b3bc.34ea5ea3@aol.com> Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 23:08:00 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Re: Frisell's Looping techniques Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 78 Resent-Message-ID: <"SnfFNC.A.qVG.k7l60"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3398 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 20:13:20 -0800 X-UIDL: 6ddea28ea71f4e39bee7976a6b0ccd6c Frissell doesn't use a transtrem either...but David Torn sure does! From ???@??? Tue Feb 17 23:54:06 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 17 20:27:34 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y516a-0000sW-00; Tue, 17 Feb 1998 20:27:32 -0800 Message-ID: <34EA6265.9C625E67@necom.com> Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 23:24:08 -0500 From: "Ed A." X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 (Macintosh; I; PPC) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com" Subject: "Echoplex" plugin for MOTU system Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; x-mac-type="54455854"; x-mac-creator="4D4F5353" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"QqodLD.A.2h.OKm60"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3399 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 20:27:32 -0800 X-UIDL: d3d50bd037b199e01785ee4e0c245660 I am trying to get MOTU interested in creating a plugin for their MOTU system for Digital Perform that would, in effect, be a stereo "Echoplex" with delay times of 32 seconds or greater per channel(dependent on the Mac's memory). I think this would be an excellent alternative to hardware boxes like the Jamman or Echoplex. Something like this can even be used in real-time performance on a Powerbook. MOTU unfortunately won't let on as to their progress or future intention for this. Are there any programmers out there who can do this and make the plugin available as shareware or a commercial product? MOTU has a kit for programmers who wish to write plugins for Digital Performer. They also have a current audio plugin that does stereo multitap delay of up to 1000ms. Can this be easily modified to produce a delay of 32000ms, for example? On the hardware side, I contacted Lexicon and suggested that they create a "Jamman II" that would be true stereo with a higher bit resolution and sample rate at a price point of a Lexicon MPX-1. The guy who developed the Jamman is interested,I am told, but convincing Lexicon management to do this is another story. If people on this mailing list or website bother MOTU and Lexicon enough, maybe they'll release something sooner. Ed A. From ???@??? Tue Feb 17 23:54:16 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 17 23:05:13 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y53ZA-0004qY-00; Tue, 17 Feb 1998 23:05:12 -0800 Message-ID: <000801bd3c3b$19524140$8622dacf@stepheng> Reply-To: "Stephen P. Goodman" From: "Stephen P. Goodman" To: Subject: Call for Electro-acoustic music... Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 23:01:53 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Resent-Message-ID: <"XW5hCC.A.PPE.4do60"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3400 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 23:05:12 -0800 X-UIDL: c653dc990ed0a3c2ef2ba29c08e5e706 I'm not trying to start a firefight again folks, really! But I'm curious as to the proper definition of 'electro-acoustic'.... Is it acoustic instruments/music electrically enhanced or recorded? Is it a blend of electronic and acoustic instruments/music? Is it electronically-recorded sound combined with a super-acoustic or ambient aesthetic in mind with respect to the overall 'sound'? Thanks folks, and keep em flying! Stephen Goodman * It's... The Loop Of The Week! EarthLight Studios * http://www.earthlight.net/Studios From ???@??? Wed Feb 18 09:48:14 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 18 05:49:29 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y59sO-0007Vo-00; Wed, 18 Feb 1998 05:49:28 -0800 Message-ID: <34EA9B3A.7E47@nyfac.com> Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 08:26:34 +0000 From: tbajus Reply-To: nyfac2@nyfac.com X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (WinNT; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: immortals References: <199802162315.PAA18655@waynesworld.ucsd.edu> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"1DaTNB.A.X0G.aZu60"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3404 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 05:49:28 -0800 X-UIDL: dd484e010598f5c4fa3fab71da3d1fc3 > No offense, but I really don't care if the Nineties produces someone like that > or not. Don't know about most of you guys (but judging from the artists of whom you speak, I suspect that you are with me here), but the bulk of the CDs I have in heavy rotation were produced in the nineties. For all the pissing and moaning I hear about what dreck was produced in decade X, I'm sure that we can all think of scores of bands that we love from all previously maligned decades. If we can't, I would suspect that it is from out own ignorance, rather than the zeitgiest of the decade. Trev From ???@??? Wed Feb 18 02:16:07 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 18 01:41:18 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y560B-0005Ir-00; Wed, 18 Feb 1998 01:41:15 -0800 X-Sender: kflint@pop.slip.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <34EA6265.9C625E67@necom.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 01:38:33 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Kim Flint Subject: Re: "Echoplex" plugin for MOTU system Resent-Message-ID: <"BnDts.A.SrE.hwq60"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3402 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 01:41:15 -0800 X-UIDL: 555ae91abb61b2b89d4638a7aed2fdd7 At 11:24 PM -0500 2/17/98, Ed A. wrote: >I am trying to get MOTU interested in creating a plugin for their MOTU >system for Digital Perform that would, in effect, be a stereo "Echoplex" >with delay times of 32 seconds or greater per channel(dependent on the >Mac's memory). I think this would be an excellent alternative to >hardware boxes like the Jamman or Echoplex. Something like this can even >be used in real-time performance on a Powerbook. >MOTU unfortunately won't let on as to their progress or future intention >for this. >Are there any programmers out there who can do this and make the plugin >available as shareware or a commercial product? MOTU has a kit for >programmers who wish to write plugins for Digital Performer. I think there's a few developers around here with some experience creating loop products. Ya never know what they might be up to.....once someone gives up on such silly extravagances as free time and positive net incomes, and loses an appropriate number of otherwise useful marbles, anything is possible. But I can imagine that one of these marble-impaired developers might be wondering right now, of all the possibilities, why a MOTU plug-in? One might imagine that said developer would have to possess an active hatred for positive cash flows to consider such a thing.... >On the hardware side, I contacted Lexicon and suggested that they create >a "Jamman II" that would be true stereo with a higher bit resolution and >sample rate at a price point of a Lexicon MPX-1. The guy who developed >the Jamman is interested,I am told, but convincing Lexicon management to >do this is another story. Bob's not only interested, he's already done most of the development.....I got the full scoop at NAMM. He probably doesn't want to discuss it publicly, but it's a full-on tragedy. >If people on this mailing list or website bother MOTU and Lexicon >enough, maybe they'll release something sooner. Considering how much money Lex lost on the Jamman, it'll take some convincing. Apparently you have to get them to stop laughing at you first, which I understand to be a little unpleasant. People here have certainly tried to talk them into it, and Lexicon has now responded by producing guitar amps. After they lose lots of money on that, they might be willing to try loopers again, you never know...... Lexicon (and an assortment of other loopy manufacturers) are on the list, BTW. You can just complain to them directly, right here! Of course they're probably tired of hearing it by now, but they're always quite friendly anyway. kim ______________________________________________________________________ Kim Flint | Looper's Delight kflint@annihilist.com | http://www.annihilist.com/loop/loop.html http://www.annihilist.com/ | Loopers-Delight-request@annihilist.com From ???@??? Wed Feb 18 09:48:47 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 18 08:06:05 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y5C0W-0001rk-00; Wed, 18 Feb 1998 08:06:00 -0800 Message-ID: <34EAC110.737E@nyfac.com> Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 11:08:00 +0000 From: tbajus Reply-To: nyfac2@nyfac.com X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (WinNT; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: bending necks, or, want to feel my muscle, ladies? References: <6a9c1d3c.34eadb74@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"Ju3AIC.A.vPB.sXw60"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3407 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 08:06:00 -0800 X-UIDL: d74a7d058858810c5097b6689edeeeee > < Just bending the neck... easy with an SG (i had a roommate who was > constantly popping his SG neck off the guitar that way). > > Frisell's Klein has a solid rosewood neck, not the Steinberger composite. It > is possible to bend the neck, but I certainly would hesitate to do that to > mine! I strongly advise that you avoid doing that with a PRS bolt-on. I had mine about two months before a tore the neck out of its joint, reducing me to tears practically (having just spent a fortune that I only barely had on it) but forever impressing the hell out of my friends. They never let me borrow one of their guitars again. Trev PS: I have to say- the folks at the PRS factory were super-cool about the whole thing. Much cooler than 95% of the dickheads in the store I bought it from. My salesperson and his friedn stood around, looking at the guitar and shaking their heads. Finally, one of the guys in the shop took pity on me and called PRS. They made me a new guitar about twice as nice as the one I had before fairly quickly. Finally, after two or three thousend pickup/wiring schemes later, I sold it. It was the most comfortable and well designed guitar I ever had, but gave me the tone of an LA studio musician. Wonder what one would sound like with those P-94 pickups in it.... From ???@??? Wed Feb 18 09:49:06 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 18 08:41:27 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y5CYl-0006Bs-00; Wed, 18 Feb 1998 08:41:23 -0800 Message-ID: <34EAC90E.536C@nyfac.com> Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 11:42:06 +0000 From: tbajus Reply-To: nyfac2@nyfac.com X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (WinNT; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Pedal Steel Licks References: <2.2.32.19980218035440.00a25908@pop.chromatic.com> <98Feb18.100642cst.26882@gateway.gibson.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"Mam4HD.A.YHF.p3w60"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3411 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 08:41:23 -0800 X-UIDL: ecf3bfefbba1c428b4316a4bc6484f88 Or you could get a B-bender. More fun than you can shake a stick at! Trev From ???@??? Wed Feb 18 09:48:13 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 18 05:03:16 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y599e-00054c-00; Wed, 18 Feb 1998 05:03:14 -0800 From: Marzzz@aol.com Message-ID: <6a9c1d3c.34eadb74@aol.com> Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 08:00:34 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Frisell's Looping techniques Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 84 Resent-Message-ID: <"a64dOC.A.JhE.Eut60"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3403 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 05:03:14 -0800 X-UIDL: dcc003def78115a4221a938839ef1bc4 In a message dated 2/17/98 9:47:43 PM, dave wrote: <> Frisell's Klein has a solid rosewood neck, not the Steinberger composite. It is possible to bend the neck, but I certainly would hesitate to do that to mine! Marshall From ???@??? Thu Feb 19 00:19:13 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 18 14:11:43 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y5HiO-0003As-00; Wed, 18 Feb 1998 14:11:40 -0800 Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 16:30:38 +0200 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: patrick@his.com (Patrick Smith) Subject: Re: Dark Aether Project on the radio and other news Resent-Message-ID: <"KqJEt.A.cVC.jt160"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3423 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 14:11:40 -0800 X-UIDL: 6df3cda2174d40cdbeddadc280c9b4a4 On 2/18/98 Adam Levin said: > >If you happen to be in the Baltimore area on Feb 28th, please check out >our official album release concert at Orion Studios. The show will also >feature Finneus Gauge and Smokin' Granny. For more details about the >show, see: http://www.ari.net/prog/shows/showcase/ > >The Dark Aether Project Web Site: http://www.ari.net/prog/band Hey Looper's, Anyone close to this area should check this show out. I saw Dark Aether Project at their debut performance in the fall. They had just formed like 6 days previously. I loved them then and can't wait to see where they have gone. Also Orion is a great great place for live music. Patrick *** *** ** Fingerpaint http://www.his.com/~patrick/FNGP.html *** ** From ???@??? Wed Feb 18 09:48:27 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 18 06:38:39 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y5Adx-0002fC-00; Wed, 18 Feb 1998 06:38:37 -0800 From: Emmanuel Angel Message-Id: <199802181435.JAA28468@dolphin.upenn.edu> Subject: Vortex Question To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 09:35:43 -0500 (EST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23-upenn3.1] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"LOp7SD.A.-MC.GHv60"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3405 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 06:38:37 -0800 X-UIDL: ff4348d54a1b69499b57830ce1506768 Wondering if anyone out there might know about this ... Is there a true analog path through the Vortex for the "dry" signal? In other words, when I set the "Mix" parameter to something less than 64 (the max setting), am I actually getting some of my analog tone through the box, or is everything getting digitized prior to the "Mix" parameter. What about when I hit the bypass footswitch (and see "bp" on the face of the unit)? E. Angel From ???@??? Wed Feb 18 09:48:44 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 18 07:57:45 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y5BsS-0000ut-00; Wed, 18 Feb 1998 07:57:40 -0800 X-Sender: kmistove@mail.eclipse.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <34EA6265.9C625E67@necom.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 10:53:33 -0500 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Ken Mistove Subject: Re: "Echoplex" plugin for MOTU system Resent-Message-ID: <"xoITZD.A._W.CQw60"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3406 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 07:57:40 -0800 X-UIDL: c4f72d977b0e1f8003804db2b4708f65 This is a long post, but hopefully useful if you have a Mac and loop. I was keeping this under wraps until I developed it further. Now seems like a good time to get some feedback, being that there may be some interest. I'm working on a real time controlled delay/looping system for Mac. While not a plug-in, it is a stand-alone. It uses MAX with the MSP audio extensions. My intent is to first design a system around my needs and then add the customization needed by others. Because this software has heavy hardware requirements, I am going to make it available for free. The software is inspired (and right now derived) from one of the tutorial patches. That patch had a maximum delay off 1 second per channel. Here is where the system is as of now: 1.) 20 seconds of stereo delay with variable feedback. Right now I've allocated 24 MB of RAM to MAX. I can probably triple the delay time easily. The program is only utilizing just over 1/3 of the RAM heap and is using 35% of the CPU (I uses a 604/e 233 mHz). I have 128 MB of RAM and just haven't seen how long a delay time I can get before the audio breaks up. 2.) I'm starting to add MIDI control of parameters. In my setup I'll be using a Roland EV-5 pedal, Roland DP-2 switch, and an I-Cube system. I haven't decided on the sensors for the I-Cube yet. 3.) Support for soundcards. I use an Audiomedia III. With the supplied drivers, I can use all 4 inputs and outputs. This lets me send a digital signal straight to DAT. Before the question is asked, yes it can support the Korg card. I don't own one (yet) but I could easily add support. Other cards could be supported as well. Some ideas for where it's going: 1.) Multiple loops. Since there would have to be a maximum delay time, I could split the total time between mutiple signal routes. 3 or 4 stereo delays seem likely. 8 to 12 mono delays are a possibility. 2.) I have not even begun to think of a user interface. It should be intuitive and not confusing. 3.) I want the MIDI control to be open ended, since all users do not not have the same equipment. An easy and quick way to customize control is desirable. 4.) Further signal processing beside delay. MSP and MAX are very powerful. 5.) Give me feedback, I'm sure there are features I haven't even thought of. If this is of any interest: 1.) Get the runtime version of MSP at http://www.cycling74.com/products/msp.html. See if it runs on your system. 2.) Comments and feedback could be sent to the list in order to hash out general ideas in public. However, if it's not of value to the list and/or looping please contact me direct so we don't waste bandwidth. 3.) This project is in it's infancy. I also have a day job to contend with. I have put no time limits on development. It's useable to me right now. It may be weeks/months before I could release an alpha version to the public. 4.) There are some Real Audio examples available - follow the links in my sig. My favorite right now is called "C-Scape" and available at ETape. Kim, I didn't have any marbles to begin with... Have fun! Ken Ken Mistove kmistove@eclipse.net My stuff: http://www.eclipse.net/~kmistove/ King Crimson (Elephant Tape) stuff: http://www.geocities.com/~kenzak/etape/ From ???@??? Wed Feb 18 09:48:54 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 18 08:13:48 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y5C7z-0002rN-00; Wed, 18 Feb 1998 08:13:43 -0800 Message-Id: <98Feb18.100642cst.26882@gateway.gibson.com> X-Sender: tspauldi@mail.nash.gibson.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 10:10:07 -0600 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Tom Spaulding Subject: Pedal Steel Licks In-Reply-To: <3.0.5.32.19970725003212.007b2300@pop3.concentric.net> References: <2.2.32.19980218035440.00a25908@pop.chromatic.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"cZPah.A.KBC.Bew60"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3408 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 08:13:43 -0800 X-UIDL: 43229e04b9b14df7e3d6b036abe5f108 > >bar strings 1 and 2 with the second finger (middle finger) of the left hand >and then, > >place the first finger at the third string one fret lower and bend it up. > Or...In the key of C, place your 4th finger on the 8th fret of the E string, your 3rd finger on the 8th fret of the B string and your 2nd finger on the 7th fret of the G string. You bend the G string up a whole step, raising it from a 2nd to the Major 3rd. While that bend is held, bend the B string up a whole step from G to A. Hold both bends (it is hard, at first) and pick the high E string, then the bent B string, then pull off the high C note (on the E string) to a Bb note fretted by your first finger. Now pick and release the B string and then pick and release the G string. It's kinda steelish, kinda Jeff Beckish and is sure to impress the guys down at the music store this Saturday afternoon. Tom "Jes' soakin' up some local color" Spaulding From ???@??? Wed Feb 18 09:48:59 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 18 08:25:52 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y5CJg-0004Bo-00; Wed, 18 Feb 1998 08:25:48 -0800 From: KRosser414@aol.com Message-ID: <2576baf3.34eb0aaa@aol.com> Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 11:21:59 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Frisell Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 18 Resent-Message-ID: <"wDMjI.A.uhD.5qw60"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3409 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 08:25:48 -0800 X-UIDL: 8c3fb84e868ba51d943a79fa31c70422 I think Frisell & looping go way back, I seem to remember an old Paul Motian Quintet record where he did a tune of Paul's just by himself with some heavy looping. Not sure of the name since I just moved and many of the records are still in boxes, but I'll see if I can dig it out & report back. Frisell never 'committed' to looping? With the Baron/Driscoll trio, especially toward the end, he did it pretty extensively but never exclusively. I think he's always been more interested in introducing loops into a real-time band improv situation and reacting to them, sorta like a wild lunatic 'fourth member' on unpredicatble medication. I think that's what mosts interests him because that's what he's always done. I don't think you should hold your breath for the Frisell equivalent of Frippertronics. Closest he came to that was probably "Black Is The Color Of My True Love's Hair" from Bass Desires. I seem to remember him laying down a pretty dark drone for that. Or some of the Tim Berne duets. Another couple to dig out of the boxes... For that matter, ever hear his recording debut, multi-tracked steel-string acoustic guitar on Amarcord Nino Rota, one of those Hal Willner tribute compilations? He does Juliet of The Spirits and I seem to recall even though it's a true multi-tracking rather than real-time looping, the layers are very loop-like in nature. OK, I know, I know I'll go find that one too... I love "Gone, Just Like A Train" but it's probably one of his least loop- oriented records along with "Nashville". Seems he's getting into more of a Ry Cooder vibe, especially now that Keltner's in the fold, but I think he does that stuff beautifully. Ry has long been one of my favorite guitarists, I'd love to see the two of them hook up. Yeah, Power Tools and Naked City rock...Anyone in NYC hear Power Tools after Frisell left and Pete Cosey took his place (kinda curious as to what that sounded like)? Frisell and Torn are without a doubt my favorite loopers active now, mostly for how they use loops in the larger context of real-time playing situations rather than the other way around. I must admit to finding pretty much everything Fripp has done outside of King Crimson unlistenable for that reason (OK, there are others but I won't go into them). I'd much rather listen to a Belew/Levin/Bruford trio record without Fripp than a Fripp record without them. Mastellato & Gunn seem fine but I can't really make out what they've individually brought to the table other than intensifying the density. Ken R From ???@??? Wed Feb 18 09:49:10 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 18 08:53:03 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y5Cjz-0007WL-00; Wed, 18 Feb 1998 08:52:59 -0800 From: Edward_Chang@mail.amsinc.com Date: Wed, 18 Feb 98 11:51:00 EST Encoding: 7 Text Message-Id: <9801188878.AA887831324@mail.amsinc.com> To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: one more Frisell loop Resent-Message-ID: <"Hl8A0C.A.YkG.BEx60"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3412 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 08:52:59 -0800 X-UIDL: 357e36b95017211e69242a1a6922e4f6 Oh I just remembered, the best example of Bill looping that I've ever heard is on "A Confederacy of Dances" from Einstein/Roulette. It's a compilation of downtown performances at Roulette by different people and starts off with an 8 min solo Frisell loop piece (If I remember correctly). Sounds like 3 guitars at once. I think Roulette has a web page, you can order it from there. From ???@??? Wed Feb 18 09:49:17 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 18 09:12:31 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y5D2n-0001uy-00; Wed, 18 Feb 1998 09:12:25 -0800 Message-Id: <215C1D5A0FFDD011B3CC00805FC18C29238B3F@NTSRV2> From: "Hogan, Greg (Exchange)" To: "'Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com'" Subject: RE: Vortex Question Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 11:56:29 -0500 X-Priority: 3 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) Content-Type: text/plain Resent-Message-ID: <"glp2GB.A.CIB.uUx60"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3413 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 09:12:25 -0800 X-UIDL: ab4d9704aa66882a1668f4812e1c9aff Dear Emmanuel, There is no way to get a straight analog path through the machine. You may want to run your signal in parallel if you wish to retain the analog path from your guitar. Please let me know if you have any questions or if there is anything that I can do for you. Best regards, Greg Hogan Lexicon Customer Service Phone +781-280-0372 FAX +781-280-0499 > ---------- > From: Emmanuel Angel[SMTP:angel2@dolphin.upenn.edu] > Reply To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com > Sent: Wednesday, February 18, 1998 9:37 AM > To: GHogan@lexicon.com > Subject: Vortex Question > > Wondering if anyone out there might know about this ... > > Is there a true analog path through the Vortex for the "dry" signal? > In other words, when I set the "Mix" parameter to something less than > 64 (the max setting), am I actually getting some of my analog tone > through the box, or is everything getting digitized prior to the > "Mix" parameter. What about when I hit the bypass footswitch (and > see "bp" on the face of the unit)? > > E. Angel > From ???@??? Thu Feb 19 00:18:44 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 18 13:00:05 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y5Gaw-00033N-00; Wed, 18 Feb 1998 12:59:54 -0800 Message-Id: <3.0.2.16.19980218090911.20d7574c@texas.net> X-Sender: sharkey@texas.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.2 (16) Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 09:09:11 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: james rhodes Subject: Re: Frisell & Naked City In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"H8jYmB.A.CNC.Jq060"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3419 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 12:59:54 -0800 X-UIDL: 95a30040a7dcc7f0e8a544e7a6f59f11 oh yes indeed,,ive always been partial to "Radio" .the music covers alot of musical sub-styles,,,Naked City,,are heavy,,,to say the least,,not for the faint,,,,but i MUST endorse those guys,,,they are hip saw Bill Frisell play on PBS a couple of nights ago (probably old news to most) "Sessions" ,,,very nice james At 11:47 AM 2/18/98 -0700, you wrote: >>"Zorn Naked City stuff?" Can you be more specific, I am a bit of a Frisell >>fan, and I'm not familiar with this..... >> >Ah yes, Naked City. I'd love to tell you more, Marshall: > >John Zorn: Alto Sax >Bill Frisell: Guitar >Wayne Horwitz: Keyboards (Wayne produced some earily Frisell Albums, > most notably, IMHO, _Is That You_) >Fred Firth: Bass (Quite a guitar inovator himself) >Joey (is there anything this man can't do) Barron: Drums >Y. Eye: Vocals > >A good starting place is the first album, aptly named _Naked City_. This >is a good overview of what this band did. Cut and paste, at time >"cartoonish", short improvisitions. Zorn was heavily influnced by >Japaneese S&M films at the time and some of that leaks through. This music >spans a number of styles, from straight-ahead jazz, to punk, country swing, >and film noir music. (Usually in the same tune) > >This is unlike anything you've ever heard Frisell play on. > >Other albums include: > >_Torture Garden_ (very short pieces, very punkish) >_Radio_ >_Absenth_ (nearly ambient, Laswellish sounding) >_Grand Guignol_ (long group improv, 5 classical pieces- Ives, Scriabin, Lassus, > Debussy, Messaien) and most of the material from Torture Garden >_Heretic_ (Music for a French Erotic film, featuring smaller subgroups of the > ensemble) >_Leng T'che_ (A Japan only release; fairly ambient w/ short bursts of madness. > The inspiration for this piece was an old Japaneese form of > execution--(Leng T'che translates to English as "100 pieces")) >_Black Box_ (A recent re-release of _Torture Garden_ and _Leng T'che_ together > in one box, with the original artwork reproduced in the booklet, > not on the cover, so as not to offend record store customers) > >Make no mistake, many people hate this stuff. It took me a few years to >get to were I could really appricaiate it, and I still wouldn't listen to >most of it for pure pleasure, though it is quite stimulating and forces the >audience to explore a different set of very intense emotions with which >most other music can't or won't deal. _Naked City_ (the album) is fairly >easy to find at larger stores like Tower filed under Zorn in the Jazz >section. Do check this one out first. If you like it you will probably >like the others, if not, you WILL hate the others. > >Happy listening, > >Doug Tapia > > > > > From ???@??? Wed Feb 18 09:49:29 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 18 09:32:12 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y5DLr-0003xv-00; Wed, 18 Feb 1998 09:32:07 -0800 Message-ID: <2148EC143F29D1118BE000805FC13CD01E1F92@migarexch01.maritz.com> From: "Liebig, Steuart A." To: "'Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com'" Subject: Mo' Frisell Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 11:27:16 -0600 X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) Resent-Message-ID: <"TVEy7.A.nUD.Fpx60"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3414 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 09:32:07 -0800 X-UIDL: 542b4e510d3a0f9eda27b13f35d418d5 Bill seems to have used both the 1/2 and 2x plus the reverse fairly often. Going back and forth between all of these in creating a loop (at least from what I remember). Another guy who does this is Nels Cline. (Recommend his trio CDs for those who are interested-stay away if heavy noise damage bothers you. Otherwise a really interesting take on the guitar-"jazz" filtered through Sonic Youth, Mahavishnu and Hendriz . . . occasionally played with egg whisks . . . an intense auditory experience) Naked City: Elektra Musician CD of the same name and (I believe) something called "Torture Garden." 4 other on the Japanese Avant label (home to some Buckethead stuff too plus many other great things-expensive, but can scrounge up mail order, etc.): "Grand Guignol," "Radio," "Absinthe" and "Heretic." Almost all of the stuff from the Elektra Musician stuff is covered on GG. The band covers a VERY WIDE amount of territory and is not for everyone-some very free improv and a lot of stuff that is very quick jump cuts, influenced by Zorn's love of cartoon music (Carl Stalling). Also of note on these CDs the amazing drumming of Joey Baron-a guy who came up playing with Carmen McCRae doing speed metal drumming. Awesome. John Zorn's label Tzadik has rereleased "Torture Garden" and "Leng Tshce" (horribly mispelled and my least favorite of all their stuff) as a double CD. Since both CDs come in at around 30 minutes though . . . > ---------- > From: R & T Cummings > Reply To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com > Sent: Tuesday, February 17, 1998 6:57 PM > To: LiebigSA@maritz.com > Subject: Re: Cool Looper Alert > > Ze LoOpdOctOrs haf bin riting: > >But will Frissell only continue to flirt with looping, or will he > flat > out make a commitment and bring her home to mama? He seems > to be becoming more popular.< > > I tink, he's bin to mama und he is now long gone. He makes se > loops now since long time wit hiss EH-16. > > Recommend zu yu: > "In Line" > "Power Tools" > "Before We Were Born" > "Quartet" > and many others (you're sure to hear from other listees) > > OK, let me drop my "deutsch" accent, I admit to being a big Frisell > fan > for a few years now. In fact, he's the one who got me into looping > after > seeing him with the Paul Motian Trio and I wondered, "what the heck > has he got in that in that little box?". As far as I know, he's > dabbled > with > the Jamman but he usually only uses the EH-16 live. I agree with you > Doc's in that he uses the looper in an interesting non-blubbery > texture > sort of way. As far as my ears can tell, he also does a fair amount of > > 2x and 1/2x switching - that is doubling / halving the return rate - > which > is a cool lo-fi dub effect. > > > P.S. Any of U loopers know how he got his sounds on "The Beach" > from "In Line"? This track has always spooked me out ... > > P.P.S. To all EH-16 users: Is it possible with this machine to make a > loop with sounds recorded at both sampling rates? > > Thanks, Rob (spending a night with the Looper's list while my > girlfriend > wonders what's taking so long ;-) ) Cummings (no relation to Bob) > From ???@??? Wed Feb 18 09:49:34 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 18 09:39:56 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y5DTL-0004mo-00; Wed, 18 Feb 1998 09:39:51 -0800 X-From_:KULTBOX@aol.com Wed Feb 18 09:39:42 1998 Received: from weasel.slip.net (falcon.slip.net) [207.171.193.21] by ferret.slip.net with smtp (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y5DT8-0004ko-00; Wed, 18 Feb 1998 09:39:38 -0800 Received: from (imo30.mail.aol.com) [198.81.19.168] by falcon.slip.net with esmtp (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y5DNc-00078M-00; Wed, 18 Feb 1998 09:33:56 -0800 Received: from KULTBOX@aol.com by imo30.mx.aol.com (IMOv12/Dec1997) id HMQAa19885 for ; Wed, 18 Feb 1998 12:38:13 -0500 (EST) From: KULTBOX@aol.com Message-ID: Old-Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 12:38:13 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: need unsubscribe info Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 51 X-Diagnostic: help sent X-Envelope-To: Loopers-Delight Sender: SmartList Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 09:39:51 -0800 X-UIDL: 20b8d550b74d84ae7c955eaa262f7088 can i please get the unscubscribe info i want to get off this list. From ???@??? Wed Feb 18 11:21:20 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 18 10:53:49 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y5Ecm-0004rU-00; Wed, 18 Feb 1998 10:53:40 -0800 Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 11:47:09 -0700 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: dtapia@unoco.edu (Douglas Tapia) Subject: Re: Frisell & Naked City Resent-Message-ID: <"S_M1VD.A.ywD.4yy60"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3415 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 10:53:40 -0800 X-UIDL: 32ee9ffe08f5f5021f7f994cb27a0ccb >"Zorn Naked City stuff?" Can you be more specific, I am a bit of a Frisell >fan, and I'm not familiar with this..... > Ah yes, Naked City. I'd love to tell you more, Marshall: John Zorn: Alto Sax Bill Frisell: Guitar Wayne Horwitz: Keyboards (Wayne produced some earily Frisell Albums, most notably, IMHO, _Is That You_) Fred Firth: Bass (Quite a guitar inovator himself) Joey (is there anything this man can't do) Barron: Drums Y. Eye: Vocals A good starting place is the first album, aptly named _Naked City_. This is a good overview of what this band did. Cut and paste, at time "cartoonish", short improvisitions. Zorn was heavily influnced by Japaneese S&M films at the time and some of that leaks through. This music spans a number of styles, from straight-ahead jazz, to punk, country swing, and film noir music. (Usually in the same tune) This is unlike anything you've ever heard Frisell play on. Other albums include: _Torture Garden_ (very short pieces, very punkish) _Radio_ _Absenth_ (nearly ambient, Laswellish sounding) _Grand Guignol_ (long group improv, 5 classical pieces- Ives, Scriabin, Lassus, Debussy, Messaien) and most of the material from Torture Garden _Heretic_ (Music for a French Erotic film, featuring smaller subgroups of the ensemble) _Leng T'che_ (A Japan only release; fairly ambient w/ short bursts of madness. The inspiration for this piece was an old Japaneese form of execution--(Leng T'che translates to English as "100 pieces")) _Black Box_ (A recent re-release of _Torture Garden_ and _Leng T'che_ together in one box, with the original artwork reproduced in the booklet, not on the cover, so as not to offend record store customers) Make no mistake, many people hate this stuff. It took me a few years to get to were I could really appricaiate it, and I still wouldn't listen to most of it for pure pleasure, though it is quite stimulating and forces the audience to explore a different set of very intense emotions with which most other music can't or won't deal. _Naked City_ (the album) is fairly easy to find at larger stores like Tower filed under Zorn in the Jazz section. Do check this one out first. If you like it you will probably like the others, if not, you WILL hate the others. Happy listening, Doug Tapia From ???@??? Wed Feb 18 11:21:21 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 18 10:57:27 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y5EgN-0005Mp-00; Wed, 18 Feb 1998 10:57:23 -0800 Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 13:48:09 -0500 (EST) From: Adam Levin To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Dark Aether Project on the radio and other news Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Resent-Message-ID: <"zEC-IB.A.KEE.G1y60"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3416 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 10:57:23 -0800 X-UIDL: 500f3c40b36672189031206f1d32dfa8 My band, The Dark Aether Project will be giving a phone interview this Saturday afternoon with Tom Gagliardi, the host of the radio program "The Gagliarchives". Assuming that some coherent bits can be pieced together by air time, it should be aired during Saturday night's program along with tracks from our new CD. The Gagliarchives is on WBZC 88.9 FM and can be heard in the Delaware Valley area (southern NJ/Philly) Saturday nights from 10PM until 2AM. In other news, I'm happy to announce that our CD will soon be carried by The Laser's Edge: http://www.jersey.net/~lasercd/ ...in addition to current availability via Wayside Music: http://members.aol.com/Cuneiform2/cuneiform.html ...and in-person purchasability at: Of Sound Mind (Located in Savage Mill) 8600 Foundry Street Savage MD (301)497-6488 Hours: Wed 12-6/Thu-Sat 12-8 If you happen to be in the Baltimore area on Feb 28th, please check out our official album release concert at Orion Studios. The show will also feature Finneus Gauge and Smokin' Granny. For more details about the show, see: http://www.ari.net/prog/shows/showcase/ The Dark Aether Project Web Site: http://www.ari.net/prog/bands/dap/ -Adam --- "...if one strives at hearing for the sake of constant virtue, out of seeking liberation from cyclic existence, gradually one becomes a Hearer." - Chandrakirti From ???@??? Wed Feb 18 11:21:22 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 18 11:06:40 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y5EpI-0006bI-00; Wed, 18 Feb 1998 11:06:36 -0800 Message-ID: <2148EC143F29D1118BE000805FC13CD01E1F94@migarexch01.maritz.com> From: "Liebig, Steuart A." To: "'Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com'" Subject: Looping/music/audience/commerce Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 12:58:51 -0600 X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) Resent-Message-ID: <"IE-YZB.A.sZF.A_y60"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3417 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 11:06:36 -0800 X-UIDL: c98e124831f1a7c7eba8b4e80d04ea66 Okay here goes . . . There's been a lot of speculation about how to get people aware of other loopers beyond those that are guitar players, how to get people to see gigs, how to get more people interested in the technique of looping for other music, etc. It seems to me that the biggest problem in all of this is that fact that the people who are into this sort of thing are a fairly small minority-even in the musician community. For every musician who wants to carry around a ton of gear and make strange, beautiful and probably unusual music . . . there are probably twenty guys who are the "plug and play, effects are bullshit" kind of guitar player (or insert instrument "X") who think that what we do is CRAP. [By the way another thing about guitar players being the nexus of this stuff, we bass players-and drummers?-are practically taught that effects and anything but the sacrosanct "GROOVE" are verboten.] When extrapolated out into the community at large, you get a really small audience. How many people worldwide (1 million? 2? out of billions?) are into non-mainstream/non-commercial music? Do you see David Torn or Bill Frisell (who are both doing pretty damn well compared to most of us-how many people doing day jobs or people doing music that qualifies as a "day job" on this list?) playing large venues? Mostly it's the small venues like McCabe's Guitars here in LA, etc. Sometimes they're LUCY and get on nationwide TV at 1:00 a.m. . . . Nope, most people listen to music as wallpaper to get through their work day, hits radio, smooth jazz, the quiet storm, etc. (Also, remember that Fripp didn't come "out of the box" looping, he was in a rock band and had an audience-some of whom followed him.) Anybody out there play at a party with a DJ also being used recently? People want to hear records that they already know, that way they can dance to Earth, Wind and Fire (who I love-not a put down), etc. This is not to mention that many people stop being adventurous (if they ever were) in terms of their listening around the time that they get out of college. Hence the "Sinatra, Beatles, etc. were better than this crap" parental thang. I guess that what I'm saying is that the "how to get to people" question is not going to be easily answered being, as I see it, a societal awareness issue. WE ARE ANOMALIES. Most people don't want to know anything other than what they know, they're pretty much happy with what they have . . . and if they aren't, they search something else out-they're already looking and may have found the EDP, insane music, etc. How do we nurture these people? I think by creating "hubs" of activity (see below). In terms of live music, people expect to like what they go out to hear. I agree with the guy who wrote about (I think) the Knitting Factory scene in NY: He goes out to hear stuff and doesn't always expect to like what he hears, in fact sometimes that's the point! (I often learn more from stuff that I don't like, or that isn't IMHO always "successful.") But even people who I know who play that sort of music will often ask "Is it something that I'll like?" Let's face it, it costs money to go out and hear people play music, and it can become something of an investment. People want return on their "entertainment dollar," they may not want to "learn" anything! In terms of gear, you can get into the same kind of quandry. Most people who play want to sound like someone else (at least when they first start out) or will help them make money playing. (Isn't a lot of the guitar market based on people who used to play in high school/ college that can now afford the Les Paul they always wanted so that they can play Stones covers once a week? Not a put-down, just a reality.) That box that someone wants to buy is something that their hero is probably using, or that will help them get that "marketable sound." If the populace at large doesn't want to hear "interesting" stuff (for the most part), how can it make money for the player (or for the company making the gear)? Most of the people on this list (I assume) have far surpassed that mentality . . . we're looking for the "ineffable other " (or something like that). Can you change the market place by personal action???? So where does this leave us? It leaves us with the hardy few who, "like us," are into expanded experience. So we have to search them out. . . and get what we do across. In my view, the only way to do this is for the musicians who play this kind of stuff to support each other: Go to gigs, tell friends/aquaintances about other people's gigs as well as your own. In short, creat a "scene" (a hub if you will). If you can create enough of a buzz, maybe you'll get 15 minutes of notice by the press in your area and humans besides the people who are playing the music will come and check out the music. Maybe if you're lucky, they'll like it and tell someone else . . . Basically it's a long-term and grinding task, with a lot of commitment to doing something else besides playing, composing, etc. and that's a hard bit of time to let go for most of us . . . Support Creative Music where you can. Sorry if this is a downer or boring (long-winded), or what-have-you. I'm just trying to get across some ideas that have been sitting around in my head for a while and have now been spurred on by a couple of the last threads. stig P.S. For those in the LA area: for the last 4-plus years there's been a scene called New Music Monday, first at the Alligator Lounge, then the Gig (both Santa Monica), and soon to be at Luna Park (in West Hollywood-restarts 16 March '98) that does a lot of interesting music . . . some looping, a lot isn't. It encompasses anything from total distortion/fuzz-tone rockish free improv, to chamber music, to DJ-assisted mayhem improv, to prog-punk noise, to avant jazz. It's been pretty cool, check it out. From ???@??? Wed Feb 18 09:49:03 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 18 08:34:05 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y5CRf-0005D2-00; Wed, 18 Feb 1998 08:34:03 -0800 Message-Id: <3.0.2.16.19980218113007.09c756f6@postoffice.mail.cornell.edu> X-Sender: km15@postoffice.mail.cornell.edu X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.2 (16) -- [Cornell Modified] Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 11:30:07 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Kevin Miller Subject: Re: bending necks, or, want to feel my muscle, ladies? In-Reply-To: <34EAC110.737E@nyfac.com> References: <6a9c1d3c.34eadb74@aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"EBnotD.A.DbE.Nyw60"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3410 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 08:34:03 -0800 X-UIDL: 9672c4889820b8dc3ffc4e561f912788 >> Frisell's Klein has a solid rosewood neck, not the Steinberger composite. It >> is possible to bend the neck, but I certainly would hesitate to do that to >> mine! On the PBS Sessions show, Frisell was bending the neck. It was subtle-he certainly wasn't pulling a Belew, but you could see what he was doing to get that warpy sound. > >I strongly advise that you avoid doing that with a PRS bolt-on. I had >mine about two months before a tore the neck out of its joint, reducing >me to tears practically (having just spent a fortune Good Lord! Thanks for the warning, as I'm quite fond of my CE. >the guitar and shaking their heads. Finally, one of the guys in the >shop took pity on me and called PRS. > >They made me a new guitar about twice as nice as the one I had before >fairly quickly. Really? Hmmm... :) Kevin From ???@??? Thu Feb 19 00:18:27 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 18 11:43:17 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y5FOi-0002x7-00; Wed, 18 Feb 1998 11:43:12 -0800 Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 11:35:50 -0800 Message-Id: <199802181935.LAA11313@fracture.lizard.net> From: Ray Peck To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Loopers' CD One Update In-Reply-To: References: X-Mailer: VM 6.32 under Emacs 19.34.1 Resent-Message-ID: <"NteslC.A.sHC.kiz60"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3418 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 11:43:12 -0800 X-UIDL: 1025091a96dbf74923eb0aa47931a1a2 Here's an update on the long-lost Loopers' Delight CD One: All the material is on CD-R and ready to go, save one track. A replacement version of that track was apparently winging its way to me from overseas, but has vanished from the mail system. I expect to have the replacement of the replacement in a week. At that point, I will make CD-Rs for all the contributors and send them out. I have not yet done a cover. Way back when, there was some discussion about the cover, which as I remember it went unresolved. If anyone has some sweet cover art, please contact me. Failing that, I'm going to use something from a royalty-free stock-photo CD-ROM that we have here. Perhaps a satellite view of a spinning hurricane, perhaps something else loopy. I plan to put the cover art on the CD as a PDF (Acrobat) file, so that people who get clones of the disk can print their own first-generation cover art. I am not sure what to do about distribution. I don't really have the time to run off a hundred copies or whatever. If other folks on the list are able to clone CDs, perhaps we can have multiple distribution points. Alternatively, someone else can take on the task of commercial duplication. Thoughts? If so, please CC: me, since I am not keeping up with the list. ---------- Note: my email address is hacked as an anti-spam measure. Please remove the 'no-spam-' to reply to me. Sorry for the inconvenience. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- "Events look inevitable in retrospect." - rpeck From ???@??? Thu Feb 19 00:18:45 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 18 13:03:37 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y5GeT-0003WI-00; Wed, 18 Feb 1998 13:03:33 -0800 Message-ID: <34EB4AC9.1416673C@necom.com> Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 15:55:38 -0500 From: "Ed A." X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 (Macintosh; I; PPC) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com" Subject: Imagery CD Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; x-mac-type="54455854"; x-mac-creator="4D4F5353" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"SBFTVC.A.LbC.2r060"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3420 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 13:03:33 -0800 X-UIDL: a25bb9c8c1e5ca00c77cbe6f68f40503 A CD created using two maxed out Lexicon Jamman units and two synths in real-time with no tape or harddisk multitracking. Very ethereal. http://www.necom.com/music/ From ???@??? Thu Feb 19 00:19:02 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 18 13:46:15 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y5HJi-00006b-00; Wed, 18 Feb 1998 13:46:10 -0800 Message-ID: <34EB55E3.F71B88A8@bellsouth.net> Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 16:42:59 -0500 From: Jeff Duke Reply-To: jmar@bellsouth.net Organization: Tec Bab Labs X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com" Subject: Bucket and Brain Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"N2tPNC.A.iqG.AV160"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3421 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 13:46:10 -0800 X-UIDL: 891fd172503f43f1c322dfb2162ac8fd The new album from them is previewed at ; http://www.bucketheadland.com/colma/index.html Jeff From ???@??? Thu Feb 19 00:19:09 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 18 13:59:28 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y5HWV-0001h4-00; Wed, 18 Feb 1998 13:59:23 -0800 From: Edward_Chang@mail.amsinc.com Date: Wed, 18 Feb 98 16:57:00 EST Encoding: 9 Text Message-Id: <9801188878.AA887849609@mail.amsinc.com> To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: electro-acoustic announcement lost Resent-Message-ID: <"0CVowB.A.83.kh160"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3422 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 13:59:23 -0800 X-UIDL: 0c287e3c6a56f150a3a57996b425f466 Hi Somehow my email got screwed up and I accidentally deleted that announcement about a call for electro-acoustic work. Whoever sent that, could you send it agin (kind of a loop, actually). You can send it to my personal address if possible. Thanks alot. edward_chang@mail.amsinc.com From ???@??? Thu Feb 19 00:19:46 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 18 15:16:38 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y5Ij8-0002Lm-00; Wed, 18 Feb 1998 15:16:30 -0800 From: PMimlitsch@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 18:07:33 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Torn in Phila. Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 85 Resent-Message-ID: <"kb8yuD.A.dQB.Bo260"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3424 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 15:16:30 -0800 X-UIDL: 9f821cc4a253bb67fe8ca85b227ebaf9 Repost of WXPN radio's Star's End radio show coming attractions post to 'xpn members by Chuck VanZyle: <<. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . Notes About The Next Star's End Broadcast 02.22.98 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . The name David Torn is well known among jazz enthusiasts and you may have heard his guitar work on recordings by well knowns such as Jan Garbarek, David Sylvian and Mark Isham, but there is an experimental/ethereal side to his playing as well and that's what we'll be hearing this weekend on Star's End. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . Concert Preview: The February 22nd and 28th broadcasts of Star's End will feature a recent interview with David Torn, recorded in New York City at the American premier of Ryuichi Sakamoto's "Dischord:Untitled01". In addition, rare live recordings of David Torn's "Echoes Living Room Concert" from 1989 will round out the first hour of this week's show. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . A M B I E N T E V E N T : David Torn appears at The Star's End Gathering Saturday, March 7th, 1998 at 8:00PM in Houston Hall Auditorium, 3417 Spruce Street, Philadelphia, PA Tickets (at the door) $15.00; $10.00 w/WXPN MemberCard Visit http://www.starsend.org for more info. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . Sincere Thanks to Len and Debbi of Nothin' But Net, providers of The Star's End Web Site. http://www.nothinbut.net . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . "Star's End" broadcasts every Saturday night/Sunday morning from 1am-6am on: 88.5fm WXPN Philadelphia, PA 88.1fm WXPH Harrisburg, PA 90.5fm Worton/Baltimore, MD 104.9fm Allentown, PA . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . Chuck van Zyl Host: Star's End, WXPN Philiadelphia http://www.starsend.org chuckv@starsend.org>> --------------------- From ???@??? Thu Feb 19 00:19:55 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 18 16:04:43 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y5JTk-0007eO-00; Wed, 18 Feb 1998 16:04:40 -0800 Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 15:59:03 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: lowfrqcy@west.net (Ryan Blum) Subject: Re: Frisell on PBS Resent-Message-ID: <"KMXAmB.A.CkG.fX360"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3425 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 16:04:40 -0800 X-UIDL: a93c7598c7a6fbcdb3b3b7ca93e61c39 >saw Bill Frisell play on PBS a couple of nights ago >(probably old news to most) "Sessions" ,,,very nice any chance you or anyone else on the list taped it?? I've never had a chance to see the man live...i'm sure it would be quite thrilling.... Thanks, Ryan -- "Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds." -Albert Einstein From ???@??? Thu Feb 19 00:20:04 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 18 17:21:23 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y5Kfx-0007IB-00; Wed, 18 Feb 1998 17:21:21 -0800 Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 17:16:19 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: lowfrqcy@west.net (Ryan Blum) Subject: On DJ's and Looping.... Resent-Message-ID: <"XdmJEB.A.lWG.4f460"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3426 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 17:21:21 -0800 X-UIDL: fe1dac275344d732de05ccd84dbcccdb hey there everyone... I've been getting into the old school DJ scratchin' kind of thing lately, probably inspired by the likes of DJ's Shadow, Krush and Spooky. I've had marginal results using the DJ techniques by themseleves like those guys do, but when adding some live guitar and bass, it's been quite cool...Anyway, I'm wondering if any other folks on the list have experimented with turntable techniques, especially with sampling, matching beats, phasing, and the old school stuff (ie nothing my jamman can do). Equipment-wise, I have nothing spectacular outside my regular looping rig besides an old radio shack turntable, but I've been looking over this DJ-type catalog I recieved....it's got some really cool stuff that might be of interest to loopers of all types. I don't believe I've ever heard of a guitarist or other non-DJ using the DJ mixers, even though they seem really hip. Some of the Mixers by Gemini and Numark seems really neat -- full blown mixers with digital samplers/loopers built in. I'm looking at a Gemini 1 rack space Sampler that lists for under $200 that has 5 seperate memory banks (a 12 second, 2 4's, 2 2's), battery back-up, reverse play and pitchshifting (maybe along the lines of a PDS 8000?) The one major drawback is no MIDI control or footpedals whatsoever..it's all for the hands. The same sampler is integrated in a cool-looking DJ mixer for a couple hundered more. Anyone ever heard/tried any of this stuff? It seems like it would be a good, solid looping instrument. Maybe Lexicon should consult Puff Daddy about the next round of loopers....=) Ryan -- "Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds." -Albert Einstein From ???@??? Thu Feb 19 00:20:17 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 18 19:55:19 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y5N4u-0004Yx-00; Wed, 18 Feb 1998 19:55:16 -0800 Message-ID: <34EBA07D.3CF5@earthlink.net> Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 20:01:17 -0700 From: Scott Archambault Reply-To: metaphor@earthlink.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.0 (Macintosh; U; 68K) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: loopers-delight@annihilist.com Subject: Boss Bass Synthesizer SYB-3? Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"SyAfh.A.B8D.nx660"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3428 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 19:55:16 -0800 X-UIDL: 9a98ff0ef236130e0746abb27662a240 Has anybody else tried using this "bass" pedal with their guitar? I've discovered some very interesting sounds with it. From Gary Numan analog bass sounds, to wild string pad swells... It tracks surprisingly well, too. It's just the thing if you're looking for something different to loop. Scott. From ???@??? Thu Feb 19 00:20:15 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 18 19:28:08 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y5Mec-0002Ea-00; Wed, 18 Feb 1998 19:28:06 -0800 Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 22:23:45 -0500 (EST) From: Merseybeet@aol.com Message-ID: <980218222345_-1953637371@mrin51.mx> To: loopers-delight@annihilist.com Subject: vance? Resent-Message-ID: <"-P2VkC.A.puB.BY660"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3427 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 19:28:06 -0800 X-UIDL: 0d3675910c764404018c688d6d9b2c1b i'm looking for someone who advertised on this named vance (who sold me a jamman...) if he's on this list, please call 513 861 1687. r. From ???@??? Thu Feb 19 00:20:27 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 18 23:06:35 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y5Q41-0003cA-00; Wed, 18 Feb 1998 23:06:33 -0800 Message-Id: <1.5.4.32.19980219070104.0075f1a8@pop.mindspring.com> X-Sender: gls@pop.mindspring.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 19 Feb 1998 01:01:04 -0600 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Grover Sheffield Subject: Re: looping and "normal music" Resent-Message-ID: <"EIPEL.A.EFD.El960"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3432 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 23:06:33 -0800 X-UIDL: 453d9f49d7ffa4ee71104e8427515c62 At 09:29 PM 7/25/97 -0700, you wrote: A heart beat is a loop... Nice... From ???@??? Thu Feb 19 09:41:33 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 19 06:38:27 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y5X7E-0007Lu-00; Thu, 19 Feb 1998 06:38:20 -0800 Message-Id: <3.0.2.16.19980219012742.2fe79282@texas.net> X-Sender: sharkey@texas.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.2 (16) Date: Thu, 19 Feb 1998 01:27:42 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: james rhodes Subject: San Antonio looping show -7:30pm In-Reply-To: <5f42960d.34ea149e@aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"my3c-B.A.QNG.WKE70"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3435 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 19 Feb 1998 06:38:21 -0800 X-UIDL: 26953302061a3f097008af1af56a25c9 hi, just a reminder that i will be playing at the Clipper Ship Bookstore tomorrow (fri, feb 20, 98) my start-time will actually be between 7:00 and 8:00pm...its a free show,,,i' will be playing with another looping quartet,,"Dreamland" they are great,,,so those in the area please support independent music...the Clipper Ship Bookstore is at 722 Balcones Heights Rd. (at Babcock) (210) 734-5409... > >thanks, james > From ???@??? Thu Feb 19 20:41:51 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 19 11:08:24 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y5bKT-00035x-00; Thu, 19 Feb 1998 11:08:17 -0800 Message-ID: <34EC2B7E.3D4A@nyfac.com> Date: Thu, 19 Feb 1998 12:54:23 +0000 From: tbajus Reply-To: nyfac2@nyfac.com X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (WinNT; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: looping and "normal music" References: <199802191542.IAA17600@hyper.dimensional.com> <98Feb19.114117cst.26884@gateway.gibson.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"b5FbLC.A.6SC.wHI70"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3447 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 19 Feb 1998 11:08:17 -0800 X-UIDL: 7ef6e2d1a8763120460982388d249ffe Pat Murphy wrote: > > I hope that you loopers realize that this is an attempt at humor........ (robotic voice) Humor? Define humor, human. Brzzt! Bing! Trev From ???@??? Thu Feb 19 09:41:25 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 19 05:53:39 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y5WPy-0003t1-00; Thu, 19 Feb 1998 05:53:38 -0800 Message-Id: <98Feb19.074907cst.26884@gateway.gibson.com> X-Sender: pmurphy@mail.nash.gibson.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (32) Date: Thu, 19 Feb 1998 07:52:30 -0600 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Pat Murphy Subject: Re: looping and "normal music" In-Reply-To: <1.5.4.32.19980219070104.0075f1a8@pop.mindspring.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"P4KtmC.A.2UD.1iD70"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3433 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 19 Feb 1998 05:53:38 -0800 X-UIDL: 7268a7a55c6dcefc57c90cd0237e95ca >A heart beat is a loop... Not really.... It has a starting point and ending point and when everything is said and done, there will be a finite number of beats... Oh well,as poetic as it is, I'm sorry to be the one that has to pop the bubble ;) From ???@??? Thu Feb 19 09:41:32 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 19 06:37:19 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y5X67-0007Bg-00; Thu, 19 Feb 1998 06:37:11 -0800 Message-Id: <98Feb19.083045cst.26884@gateway.gibson.com> X-Sender: tspauldi@mail.nash.gibson.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Thu, 19 Feb 1998 08:34:06 -0600 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Tom Spaulding Subject: Re: looping and "normal music" In-Reply-To: <98Feb19.074907cst.26884@gateway.gibson.com> References: <1.5.4.32.19980219070104.0075f1a8@pop.mindspring.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"YkOaq.A.oIG.3JE70"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3434 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 19 Feb 1998 06:37:11 -0800 X-UIDL: 43b5df2a8baf4b32276b20d3f4db063d At 07:52 AM 2/19/98 -0600, you wrote: >>A heart beat is a loop... > > >Not really.... >It has a starting point and ending point and when everything is said and >done, there will be a finite number of beats... > >Oh well,as poetic as it is, I'm sorry to be the one that has to pop the >bubble ;) > Perhaps, but oh, that Multiply button...! Tom "Humming a Salacious Samba" Spaulding From ???@??? Thu Feb 19 09:41:42 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 19 07:41:38 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y5Y6S-0004Sn-00; Thu, 19 Feb 1998 07:41:36 -0800 Message-Id: <199802191542.IAA17600@hyper.dimensional.com> From: "Scott Bullerwell" To: Subject: Re: looping and "normal music" Date: Thu, 19 Feb 1998 08:35:14 -0700 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"6hr1j.A.NzD.xHF70"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3436 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 19 Feb 1998 07:41:36 -0800 X-UIDL: 4e5d58bd2c23737feb25d473192e2d20 Yo Pat, Come round to my place and I'll hook you up to a 12-lead EKG... You can see for yourself just how much a heartbeat resembles a loop. It is a little ostinato comprised of five segments that repeat over and over and over, yet are dynamic. It even mirrors your emotional state--it builds up when you're excited, slows down when you're at peace, changes shape when you're sick. And yeah, there is a finite number of beats. Every story--be it a life, or a loop--has a beginning and an ending. If I could make loops like that, I'd be God. A heartbeat, indeed, is a loop. :-) Scott ---------- > From: Pat Murphy > To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com > Subject: Re: looping and "normal music" > Date: Thursday, February 19, 1998 06:52 > > >A heart beat is a loop... > > > Not really.... > It has a starting point and ending point and when everything is said and > done, there will be a finite number of beats... > > Oh well,as poetic as it is, I'm sorry to be the one that has to pop the > bubble ;) From ???@??? Thu Feb 19 09:41:44 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 19 07:55:19 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y5YJh-0005mu-00; Thu, 19 Feb 1998 07:55:17 -0800 Message-Id: <98Feb19.095040cst.26886@gateway.gibson.com> X-Sender: tspauldi@mail.nash.gibson.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Thu, 19 Feb 1998 09:54:00 -0600 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Tom Spaulding Subject: Re: looping and "normal music" In-Reply-To: <199802191542.IAA17600@hyper.dimensional.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/enriched; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"wFr4PD.A.pGF.zUF70"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3437 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 19 Feb 1998 07:55:17 -0800 X-UIDL: 52c1aea8286582044210bc39793c3ed4 Cool. Of course,now,... Fripp's heartbeat... ;-) Tom "Be Loopfull and Multiply" Spaulding >Yo Pat, > >Come round to my place and I'll hook you up to a 12-lead EKG... You can see >for yourself just how much a heartbeat resembles a loop. It is a little >ostinato comprised of five segments that repeat over and over and over, yet >are dynamic. It even mirrors your emotional state--it builds up when >you're excited, slows down when you're at peace, changes shape when you're >sick. > >And yeah, there is a finite number of beats. Every story--be it a life, or >a loop--has a beginning and an ending. > >If I could make loops like that, I'd be God. A heartbeat, indeed, is a >loop. :-) > >Scott >> >> >A heart beat is a loop... >> >> >> Not really.... >> It has a starting point and ending point and when everything is said and >> done, there will be a finite number of beats... >> >> Oh well,as poetic as it is, I'm sorry to be the one that has to pop the >> bubble ;) > > > From ???@??? Thu Feb 19 09:41:46 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 19 08:00:24 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y5YOa-0006QG-00; Thu, 19 Feb 1998 08:00:20 -0800 Message-Id: <98Feb19.095451cst.26886@gateway.gibson.com> X-Sender: pmurphy@mail.nash.gibson.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (32) Date: Thu, 19 Feb 1998 09:58:13 -0600 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Pat Murphy Subject: Re: looping and "normal music" In-Reply-To: <199802191542.IAA17600@hyper.dimensional.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"kZlLLD.A.tlF.2YF70"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3438 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 19 Feb 1998 08:00:20 -0800 X-UIDL: 696ccadc95bbd27233113527dd41a4aa Come to think of it, not everything that is called a loop is in fact a loop. Just a linear string of events, whether they are notes, heartbeats, or whatever. If it has a beginning and an end then it isn't a loop..... Pseudo Loopers Delight? Linear Events Delight? Just popping more bubbles. >Yo Pat, > >Come round to my place and I'll hook you up to a 12-lead EKG... You can see >for yourself just how much a heartbeat resembles a loop. It is a little >ostinato comprised of five segments that repeat over and over and over, yet >are dynamic. It even mirrors your emotional state--it builds up when >you're excited, slows down when you're at peace, changes shape when you're >sick. > >And yeah, there is a finite number of beats. Every story--be it a life, or >a loop--has a beginning and an ending. > >If I could make loops like that, I'd be God. A heartbeat, indeed, is a >loop. :-) > >Scott >---------- >> From: Pat Murphy >> To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com >> Subject: Re: looping and "normal music" >> Date: Thursday, February 19, 1998 06:52 >> >> >A heart beat is a loop... >> >> >> Not really.... >> It has a starting point and ending point and when everything is said and >> done, there will be a finite number of beats... >> >> Oh well,as poetic as it is, I'm sorry to be the one that has to pop the >> bubble ;) > > > From ???@??? Thu Feb 19 09:41:51 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 19 08:52:00 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y5ZCW-0002ds-00; Thu, 19 Feb 1998 08:51:56 -0800 Message-ID: From: "Schreier, Steven (Steven)" To: "'Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com'" Subject: RE: vance? Date: Thu, 19 Feb 1998 09:31:29 -0700 X-Mailer: Microsoft Exchange Server Internet Mail Connector Version 4.0.995.52 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"Blp5qB.A.q-B.1IG70"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3439 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 19 Feb 1998 08:51:56 -0800 X-UIDL: 9ab5a82cb4cfefd7846daae65828e1ff Just out of curiousity, how much did you pay for your Jamman? And is the signal clean through the unit? Steven j >---------- >From: Merseybeet@aol.com[SMTP:Merseybeet@aol.com] >Reply To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com >Sent: Wednesday, February 18, 1998 7:23 PM >To: Schreier, Steven (Steven) >Subject: vance? > >i'm looking for someone who advertised on this named vance (who sold me a >jamman...) if he's on this list, please call 513 861 1687. > >r. > > > From ???@??? Thu Feb 19 20:42:20 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 19 13:57:26 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y5dy9-0005RR-00; Thu, 19 Feb 1998 13:57:25 -0800 Message-ID: <34EC64D2.5655@nyfac.com> Date: Thu, 19 Feb 1998 16:58:58 +0000 From: tbajus Reply-To: nyfac2@nyfac.com X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (WinNT; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: So Long Loopers References: <98Feb19.150233cst.26881@gateway.gibson.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"l-JN-C.A.nlE.5mK70"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3454 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 19 Feb 1998 13:57:25 -0800 X-UIDL: 3ed9fabf4fad880e037162872b3e6861 Tom Spaulding wrote: > > It appears my tenure with the Oberheim division has come to an end. What's the story Tom? Spent too much time talking to you clients? Spill the beans, man! In any case, good luck. Trevor "Ah, Tom, we hardly knew ye" Bajus From ???@??? Thu Feb 19 09:41:55 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 19 09:16:20 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y5Za2-0005Ks-00; Thu, 19 Feb 1998 09:16:14 -0800 Message-ID: <01BD3D2F.410ED410@ROGER_NTWKS40> From: Roger Dunn To: "'Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com'" Subject: Top of the yardstick? Date: Thu, 19 Feb 1998 12:09:33 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Resent-Message-ID: <"J8IcB.A.vPE.xdG70"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3440 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 19 Feb 1998 09:16:14 -0800 X-UIDL: ee070b1c781a7a7690741a16238f05f9 I've been watching from the wings for a bunch of months now, with immense appreciation for the breadth and depth of looping expertise out there. But I've gotten lost in some of the gear descriptions that have gone on... It seems that the various gear choices for looping are measured against some kind of yardstick - Jammans, EDPs, a couple of Revoxes strung together with tape, a rack full of TS2290s - but as a newcomer I'm really confused about how these alternatives measure up. Seems like gear is real important to looping, that the "looping instrument" = the looping device + conventional instrument (guitar, synth, whatever). Gear may be more important than the more compositional, less improvisational ways of making music. Which begs my question: Is there some sort of unspoken, ideal, money-no-object looping system that defines the top of the yardstick, the ultimate system against which all others are measured? What would be included/omitted in an ideal system? Also, is some kind of price/performance breakdown performed on these things before springing for one or the other (i.e. can EDPs, Jammans and the like be quantitatively gauged against any yardstick)? Or does the appeal come from qualitative individual aesthetics (knobs versus buttons), and not so much how feature-packed and pricey a given alternative might be? Roger From ???@??? Thu Feb 19 09:41:56 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 19 09:22:02 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y5ZfR-00063b-00; Thu, 19 Feb 1998 09:21:49 -0800 Message-Id: <1.5.4.32.19980219171410.0066960c@interactive.net> X-Sender: jbrainin@interactive.net X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 19 Feb 1998 12:14:10 -0500 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Jonathan Brainin Subject: Re: bending necks, or, want to feel my muscle, ladies? Resent-Message-ID: <"9TtwhB.A.qlE.WgG70"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3441 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 19 Feb 1998 09:21:49 -0800 X-UIDL: a6c8850cb5a2c13046aac0319ad816d6 At 08:57 PM 7/25/97 -0700, you wrote: > Though I mentioned the possibility of bending a Steinberger neck or some >such composite, This is not something which I do or suggest doing whether >on a composite neck or any other... I personally perfer other ways of >achieving the same or a simular effect and not risking the well-being of >the instrument or the player... > >smiles, > >Corynne I just realized that this must be absolutely the only list where one can find people debating the merits of bending a Steinberger or Klein neck. Not that I've any idea of the significance of such debate... Personally, I would never bend the neck on my Klein. It's got no truss rod and just a few screws keeping it in place. Jonathan Brainin jbrainin@interactive.net From ???@??? Thu Feb 19 09:41:57 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 19 09:38:49 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y5Zvq-0000Op-00; Thu, 19 Feb 1998 09:38:46 -0800 Message-Id: <199802191715.JAA01003@gw1.bi-tech.com> From: "Matt McCabe" To: Subject: Re: bending necks, or, want to feel my muscle, ladies? Date: Thu, 19 Feb 1998 09:37:34 -0800 X-Msmail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1161 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"YfA_MB.A.IwG.jxG70"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3442 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 19 Feb 1998 09:38:46 -0800 X-UIDL: 1c18ec682cfd6fddb34f9296c2037802 > From: Jonathan Brainin > I just realized that this must be absolutely the only list where > one can find people debating the merits of bending a Steinberger > or Klein neck. Not that I've any idea of the significance of such > debate... Significance aside...you must admit that it looks pretty dang cool when Adrian Belew is cranking on his Strat's neck. And the SOUND!!! Matt From ???@??? Thu Feb 19 20:41:34 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 19 09:53:09 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y5a9f-0002Jb-00; Thu, 19 Feb 1998 09:53:03 -0800 Message-Id: <98Feb19.114117cst.26884@gateway.gibson.com> X-Sender: pmurphy@mail.nash.gibson.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (32) Date: Thu, 19 Feb 1998 11:44:38 -0600 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Pat Murphy Subject: Re: looping and "normal music" In-Reply-To: <98Feb19.095451cst.26886@gateway.gibson.com> References: <199802191542.IAA17600@hyper.dimensional.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"v97xpB.A.v7.k8G70"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3443 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 19 Feb 1998 09:53:03 -0800 X-UIDL: 064c37f56f892363925c50b4cd85a333 I hope that you loopers realize that this is an attempt at humor........ >Come to think of it, not everything that is called a loop is in fact a >loop. Just a linear string of events, whether they are notes, heartbeats, >or whatever. If it has a beginning and an end then it isn't a loop..... >Pseudo Loopers Delight? >Linear Events Delight? >Just popping more bubbles. > > > > >>Yo Pat, >> >>Come round to my place and I'll hook you up to a 12-lead EKG... You can see >>for yourself just how much a heartbeat resembles a loop. It is a little >>ostinato comprised of five segments that repeat over and over and over, yet >>are dynamic. It even mirrors your emotional state--it builds up when >>you're excited, slows down when you're at peace, changes shape when you're >>sick. >> >>And yeah, there is a finite number of beats. Every story--be it a life, or >>a loop--has a beginning and an ending. >> >>If I could make loops like that, I'd be God. A heartbeat, indeed, is a >>loop. :-) >> >>Scott >>---------- >>> From: Pat Murphy >>> To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com >>> Subject: Re: looping and "normal music" >>> Date: Thursday, February 19, 1998 06:52 >>> >>> >A heart beat is a loop... >>> >>> >>> Not really.... >>> It has a starting point and ending point and when everything is said and >>> done, there will be a finite number of beats... >>> >>> Oh well,as poetic as it is, I'm sorry to be the one that has to pop the >>> bubble ;) >> >> >> > > > From ???@??? Thu Feb 19 20:41:37 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 19 09:55:09 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y5aBa-0002a2-00; Thu, 19 Feb 1998 09:55:02 -0800 Message-ID: <01BD3D34.82CC6930@TD-300> From: jprice@intcpi.com (John Price) To: "'Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com'" Subject: RE: Looping/music/audience/commerce Date: Thu, 19 Feb 1998 12:47:10 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="---- =_NextPart_000_01BD3D34.830B1FE0" Resent-Message-ID: <"1FMZOB.A.SHB.19G70"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3444 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 19 Feb 1998 09:55:02 -0800 X-UIDL: 39884e81fe4045fa36248476c0d2c954 This is where I start to sound contradictory and slightly out of step with artistic values and ideal musical inclinations. Please try to understand my perspective and not see this as an attempt to disparage others. These are just my thoughts & opinions that are in more of a commercial and market oriented perspective Ive always been something of a salesman of sorts - a marketing major in school. I'm also assuming a manfacturer. Wants to expand its client base to the largest realms possible. It seems that the rule of a larger audience often times means bringing in just a little bit o cheese for the sake of higher returns and greater recognition but hopefully not sacrificing the seriousness of a product line or user base. Id imagine a manufacturer would need to decide the following basic Questions: Who is the target market you're going after ??? where is this mkt - Europe, & or Specific parts of Euro - UK, Belgium, Germany, or Africa, France, Italy or The States ??? Do you really want a Niche or a broad based appeal for your product ?? How much R&D ru willing to invest ??? How solid is the market and what type of product will appeal to the broadest market possible ?? What Pricing and distrubutions structures are the most favorable ??? Some Answers. Dance-Hip-Hop, ... Solid and always growing. Simplicity and sync. Cheaper and Cheaper pricing and Honest and fair ( virtually impossible IMHO ) asian and or mexican manufacturing facilities. Statement: Looping doesn't have a larger audience because its simply tied to artists that don't move a lot of "product" to a large and mass audiences. Don't sacrifice the current giants - they have a place and an important one which is to keep you credible with your constant and existing niche customer base. A lot of times I get the impression that whenever I see a post saying "how come no one else is hip to this "?? I get the feeling of LD preaching to the converted or soon to be converted. Now, obviously, any products success is all about an issue of timing, perception and shrewed marketing manueveers ...ahemmm... ( theres that dirty word again! ) You have to have a need ( a market ) or actively create a need around something or someone who is visable and viable beyond just the conceptual phase of expanding a concept amongst an already sold audience. Looping needs to be presented as simple, straightforward, Non-Esoteric/Non-Cerebreal and rewarding for anyone who may want to explore its potential. This approach automatically but not necessarily leads you toward 1st., the non-musicians, dj's or intermediate level musicians along with the sight reading or technique oriented types you will always have as sort of a captive consumer. Looping also needs to be presented in a similar approach to that which is used on a casio keyboard(IMH-Marketing Opinion) and hawked the way Nike and Addidas sneakers are sold. Label - Streetwise and cool. Just slant it toward 3 levels of involvement Heres a Brainstorm with a lot of certain holes in it: Get rid of the term looping and come up with a catchier simpler phrase. Too many uninitiated people when u mention the term looping go, Huh ??? and you usually end up taking more than 30 seconds explaining it ( obviously because there are many answers and variation on it ) Try to accurately redefine a varied and wide ranging technique that's built around an attractive name and product line. 1.) Standalone portable Device with huge LEDs for the everyday user from ages 4 and up who wants instant and immediate gratification - give them loopable presets and some type of idiot proof interface where they can feel like they have a lot more control over what they actually have been given. Market it as "Jamout or Zone Out in a Box" or something along that line. Give it built in speakers, give it flashing strobe lights too. Price it no higher than $200.00 2.) An Intermediate Level (Portable) Unit SCSI (optionable) , MIDI ports included. Have Preset loops that are loadable and changeable ie. - rock, Hip-Hop - Techno, House, Country, Metal, New age Jazz, etc, grooves, sounds that are layerable but limitable to the loops you can stack and even make em savable on a PC. ... like have it w/a built in overdrive, chorus or flanger and analog type pedal 1sec. Delay effect. Allow it to record up to 8 seconds or more of sound and play back in reverse. Put a multiply mode in it too. Encourage 3rd party SW developers to support you with various add-on devices. Price it no higher than $499.00 It'll be like a drm machine and quasi sampler/sound canvas all in one. 3.)Get together Somethin akin to a jamman or say an echoplex or the BOSS sp202 with all the sophistication and wizardry a pro would expect. Give em lots o knobs and the ability to digitally save and store edit parameters along with full midi functionality Multiply, reverse and ring mod. and random playback or random morphing that would be adjusted & real-time synced to any bpm ya want. Also, remember Its gotta be pitched >from a Fun and ease of use perspective ie. " You'd be amazed at how fast you'd be making music. " Plus from a manufacturers and marketing perspective the upgrades and product life extentions will be endless with tons of cool variations and offshoots until another larger manufacturer copies what youre doing to the tee. Make all your product like samsonite luggaage ! 3.) oops, I don't know how to make my page numbering function stop !!! 4.) Someone earlier mentioned Bjork as a spokeperson - it doesn't necessarily need to be Bjork (though it wouldn't hurt) - it can be people associated w/her or people affiliated with her camp and others of mass note or production noteworthy types. 5.) Remember Hip-Hop Sells and sells Big - Puff Daddy would do wonders for a loop based product line and feed into a market that would only want more and more and more. 6.) 7.) Paul Schaefer would be another good mainstream endorser along with kevin eubanks of leno fame to have your product displayed front and center - all those options would up your public name recognition along w/ key mind value in the public perception. It wouldn't hurt to have someone Mix it up with big or widely recognized people in key mags like musician, Gtr player, or just about anyone of those DnB mags you can get >from a local book or record chain. Matthew Sweet endorses Roland products in their local user mag. Maybe a bi monthly or quarterly periodical which is either paper and or web based devoted to looping would help ( from a manufacturers perspective ) Of this much, Im certain- Word of mouth won't bring looping any further than where it currently stands today. Web Posting and Web Broadcasting in RA wont do it either unless its tied to or part of a focused artist and manufacturer's thrust. I'm just waiting for the all in one box or interface that can can work like a regular music instrument giving ya real time grooves sync, MIDI and expressive/active control over 100% of ya sound. Maybe I should just start manufacturing my own products...nahhhh... too techie :) JP From ???@??? Thu Feb 19 20:41:45 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 19 10:07:25 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y5aNS-00048t-00; Thu, 19 Feb 1998 10:07:18 -0800 Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 19 Feb 1998 11:02:00 -0700 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: dtapia@unoco.edu (Douglas Tapia) Subject: Re: Looping/music/audience/commerce Resent-Message-ID: <"JE52ED.A.aRD.jOH70"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3445 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 19 Feb 1998 10:07:18 -0800 X-UIDL: ea9a6ff3b7bcd99710a30da9047a936d >For every musician who wants to >carry around a ton of gear and make strange, beautiful and probably >unusual music . . . there are probably twenty guys who are the "plug and >play, effects are bullshit" kind of guitar player (or insert >instrument "X") who think that what we do is CRAP. But do we really _need_ a ton of gear, or is this just kind of a techno security blanket? Seems to me, all that's really _needed_ to loop sucessfully is a couple of pieces of gear, at least in my world. Much of looped music IS crap, as is much of music in general. I've long been considered an "out" player, however I feel that one MUST take into acount the musicality and purpose behind everything we do on stage or in the studio. People's tastes will vary, but at no time should we use a piece of technology simply because it exists. (ANY technology: eg. If a Piano is going to muddy up the texture in an undesirable or unmusical way, WHY USE IT?) >[By the way another >thing about guitar players being the nexus of this stuff, we bass >players-and drummers?-are practically taught that effects and anything >but the sacrosanct "GROOVE" are verboten.] Don't mean to let my jazz roots show too much, but have you ever heard of Gerry Hemmingway or Jaco? Both these guys have _LOOPED_ and I've never heard anything that these guys have done that hasn't grooved _HARD_. >How many people worldwide (1 million? 2? out of >billions?) are into non-mainstream/non-commercial music? Do you see >David Torn or Bill Frisell (who are both doing pretty damn well compared to most of us-how many people doing day jobs or people doing music that qualifies as a "day job" on this list?) playing large venues? Nope, most >people listen to music as wallpaper to get through their work day, hits >radio, smooth jazz, the quiet storm, etc. Can't argue here. Personally, I love the small venues and being able to do what I do without corporate types breathing down my neck to play a certain way. (Lived that, and, well, no thank you.) To me, musical wallpaper sucks, but we are entertainers. We can sit here and verbally masturbate about how we are creating high art and all that all day long, but if there's not at least one person sitting in the audience tonight, I'm not performing, I'm practicing. I'm happy playing to that one person if they're really into it, and if I can pay my bills, and have a dental plan, then my "day job" has served it's purpose. It comes down to this, we ought not to worry that Frisell will never pack Madison Square Garden, that David Torn will never sell out the Hollywood Bowl, etc. To me, by and large, the "hit makers" of music are in this for a much different reason than your average looper, and most people on this list have as much in common with the superstars of pop as we do with a trial lawyer. (My appologies to any looping lawyers out there.) >Anybody out there play at a party with a DJ also being used recently? >People want to hear records that they already know. Yes, they do, so I say, "Don't do it man!" Most people naturally seek out their comfort zone. When people are in hit listening zone, there's no reaching them, unless the new tune sounds enough like what came before so as not to upset musical wallpaper. (I hate it when I put on a disk for a student and the immediatly want me to go to the one track that they already know.) >I guess that what I'm saying is that the "how to get to people" question >is not going to be easily answered being, as I see it, a societal >awareness issue. WE ARE ANOMALIES. Most people don't want to know >anything other than what they know, they're pretty much happy with what >they have . . . and if they aren't, they search something else >out-they're already looking and may have found the EDP, insane music, >etc. How do we nurture these people? I think by creating "hubs" of >activity (see below). Yes, yes, and YES! (Preach brother) >In terms of live music, people expect to like what they go out to hear. In my experience, given the right circumstance people can tollerate a lot more live than they can on record. (Took a girlfriend once to a percussion ensemble concert that featured Ives, Reich, etc, and she really enjoyed it, though she hated it on disk) I think this has something to do with the total sensory involvment thing. This IS how we get people to turn on: Get 'em to come out to gigs ("free gigs?" you say. Build an audience) Agree with your analysis of gear too. Do you sell one looper, one E-bow, or do you sell half a million Les Pauls and Marshall stacks? If I had a store, I'd be dressed in pink spandex with frizzy hair down to my waist if it helped me sell to all the cones out there. Go to >gigs, tell friends/aquaintances about other people's gigs as well as >your own. In short, creat a "scene" (a hub if you will) Seems to have worked for our friend John Zorn and the downtown/Knitting Factory scene musicians. What? Zorn owns two lables now and is commited to getting the unusual noticed. No, no Zorn record will ever go gold or make the charts, but the "small" audience is pretty large and is global. What's more, this audience is commited to supporting creative music and is passing this love on to another generation. >Support Creative Music where you can. Amen. Doug Tapia General Manager, MTP UNC Music Tech Press University of Northern Colorado Fraiser 108 Greeley, CO 80639 Voice: 970-351-2614 Fax: 970-351-2444 Email: mtp@unoco.edu www.arts.unco.edu/mtp From ???@??? Thu Feb 19 20:41:51 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 19 11:15:03 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y5bQu-0003xR-00; Thu, 19 Feb 1998 11:14:56 -0800 Message-ID: <004a01bd3d69$e38ef820$22f0ffd0@default> From: "future perfect" To: Subject: Re: looping and "normal music" Date: Thu, 19 Feb 1998 14:08:40 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Resent-Message-ID: <"HGBMT.A.20C._LI70"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3448 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 19 Feb 1998 11:14:56 -0800 X-UIDL: 534e4594aa590a0e5a7b497e5c95d8bd Ah, but at some point, ya gotta turn the Plex or Jam Man OFF- does that mean that the music created isn't a loop??? Theres not much that goes on forever, althogh said heartbeat can go on for 75 years and more, a lot longer than any loop created with any music device. So there!!! :) Dave Eichenberger ********************************************************************* 'Future Perfect' - progressive art music - visit our website at: http://www.geocities.com/SoHo/Lofts/8082 >>A heart beat is a loop... > > >Not really.... >It has a starting point and ending point and when everything is said and >done, there will be a finite number of beats... > >Oh well,as poetic as it is, I'm sorry to be the one that has to pop the >bubble ;) > From ???@??? Thu Feb 19 20:41:46 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 19 10:23:50 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y5adL-0006CT-00; Thu, 19 Feb 1998 10:23:43 -0800 Message-ID: Date: 19 Feb 1998 12:09:35 -0800 From: "Hartnett, Travis" Subject: FS: Vortex $200 To: "Loopers Delight postings" X-Mailer: Mail*Link SMTP for Quarterdeck Mail; Version 4.1.0 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; Name="Message Body" Resent-Message-ID: <"mzlUsD.A.nNF._dH70"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3446 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 19 Feb 1998 10:23:43 -0800 X-UIDL: c42b191603785332a7af844ef3b742f2 The Great Vortex Shakeout continues, from Harmony Central: FS: Lexicon Vortex Asking Price: US$200 Condition: Mint Age: N/A Description: You know it, you love it. Great Condition Lexicon Vortrex with Manual, original box, and footswitch. Audio Morphing, true stereo FX independant Left and Right processing, Ring Modulation, etc... Don't want to sell it but must to finance an Akai S2000. E-mail me for any more info. Buyer pays shipping. Thanks, enjoy. Seller: Jon Stevens, 514-489-5861 E-mail: jstevens@centennial.qc.ca Post Date: 2/18/98 From ???@??? Thu Feb 19 20:41:57 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 19 12:05:22 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y5cDe-0001YX-00; Thu, 19 Feb 1998 12:05:18 -0800 Date: Thu, 19 Feb 1998 14:10:02 -0600 From: John Pollock Subject: Re: looping and "normal music" To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Message-id: <34EC919A.66FD@delphi.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win95; I) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit References: <98Feb19.095451cst.26886@gateway.gibson.com> Resent-Message-ID: <"_UKMXB.A.P2.J9I70"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3450 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 19 Feb 1998 12:05:18 -0800 X-UIDL: 95656d180da500298da468416f546cda Pat Murphy wrote: > If it has a beginning and an end then it isn't a loop..... > Pseudo Loopers Delight? If it has no beginning or end, how can it be a loop? John From ???@??? Thu Feb 19 20:41:58 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 19 12:30:51 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y5ccK-00046S-00; Thu, 19 Feb 1998 12:30:48 -0800 From: Texture444@aol.com Message-ID: <105a3125.34ec9517@aol.com> Date: Thu, 19 Feb 1998 15:24:53 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: FS: Klein Electric 12-string guitar Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 84 Resent-Message-ID: <"ThL7VB.A.1TD.iVJ70"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3451 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 19 Feb 1998 12:30:48 -0800 X-UIDL: 1dc244751de6ea586c3860fa621583df hey, y'all. i'm selling my: Klein Electric 12-string guitar excellent-mint condition, w/hard case serial #007 carbon fiber neck, Steinberger "12" bridge 3 EMG pickups: S/S/splittable Hum., 5-way switch deep emerald green, w/dark rose mutha-of-toiletseat pickguard the first 1 of only 4 made previously owned by matt henderson, myself & david lindley (when it was white) $2750., plus overnite shipping serious inquiries? e-mail, or fax @ 914-679-5957 thanks, dt From ???@??? Thu Feb 19 20:42:09 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 19 13:11:14 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y5dFR-0000YH-00; Thu, 19 Feb 1998 13:11:13 -0800 Message-Id: <98Feb19.150233cst.26881@gateway.gibson.com> X-Sender: tspauldi@mail.nash.gibson.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Thu, 19 Feb 1998 15:05:54 -0600 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Tom Spaulding Subject: So Long Loopers In-Reply-To: <105a3125.34ec9517@aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"N4VPFC.A.nBH.O5J70"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3452 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 19 Feb 1998 13:11:13 -0800 X-UIDL: 5ade0d723e02738998194b5e3f5206c5 Hey Y'all- It appears my tenure with the Oberheim division has come to an end. I will be leaving the division effective noon Friday. Just wanted to give my sincere thanks to everyone on the list that I have met and communicated with, as well as those patient lurkers who put up with my feeble attempts at humor. It's been fun,and I am glad to have met all of you...we may meet again someday, you never can tell. Tom "Where you goin' with that UB40 in your hand" Spaulding p.s. Kim, please Unscribe ;) From ???@??? Thu Feb 19 20:42:15 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 19 13:37:05 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y5deQ-0003Bo-00; Thu, 19 Feb 1998 13:37:02 -0800 Message-ID: <34ECA503.647597A3@mediaone.net> Date: Thu, 19 Feb 1998 16:32:51 -0500 From: innerspace@mediaone.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.03 [en]C-MOEMW (Win95; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: So Long Loopers References: <98Feb19.150233cst.26881@gateway.gibson.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=x-user-defined Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Resent-Message-ID: <"_8zPN.A.ZiC.JUK70"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3453 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 19 Feb 1998 13:37:02 -0800 X-UIDL: 22566d94399765419a62ba79e5c0348d   Tom Spaulding wrote: > Hey Y'all- > > It appears my tenure with the Oberheim division has come to an end. I will > be leaving the division effective noon Friday. Just wanted to give my > sincere thanks to everyone on the list that I have met and communicated > with, as well as those patient lurkers who put up with my feeble attempts > at humor. It's been fun,and I am glad to have met all of you...we may meet > again someday, you never can tell. > > Tom "Where you goin' with that UB40 in your hand" Spaulding > > p.s. Kim, please Unscribe ;)   well tom, that's a bi**h, such is the way of the corporate logo... I can say as a member of the human race that has no idea what you techs are talking about, you deserve better treatment... Thanks for having a mind and sharing it... loop away From ???@??? Fri Feb 20 09:43:37 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 20 08:23:45 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y5vEc-0006hd-00; Fri, 20 Feb 1998 08:23:34 -0800 Date: Thu, 19 Feb 98 16:41:10 EST From: nm@mail.amsinc.com (ccMail SMTPLINK) Message-Id: <9801198879.AA887935270@mail.amsinc.com> To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: ccMail SMTPLINK Undeliverable Message Resent-Message-ID: <"bCN9nB.A.HwF.5za70"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3484 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 08:23:34 -0800 X-UIDL: 2b6487ee7c5d87076403df707ac5f8e1 Message undeliverable at this time Original text follows ---------------------------------------------- Received: from falcon.slip.net by mail.amsinc.com (SMTPLINK V2.11.01) ; Thu, 19 Feb 98 12:11:49 EST Return-Path: Received: from ferret.slip.net [207.171.193.6] (mail) by falcon.slip.net with smtp (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y5ZQ8-0000sV-00; Thu, 19 Feb 1998 09:06:00 -0800 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y5ZVV-0004iP-00; Thu, 19 Feb 1998 09:11:33 -0800 Message-ID: <01BD3D2F.410ED410@ROGER_NTWKS40> From: Roger Dunn To: "'Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com'" Subject: Top of the yardstick? Date: Thu, 19 Feb 1998 12:09:33 -0500 Resent-Message-ID: <"J8IcB.A.vPE.xdG70"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3440 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: Edward_Chang@mail.amsinc.com Resent-Date: Thu, 19 Feb 1998 09:11:33 -0800 Attachment converted: shards o' data:noname (????/----) (00000E0D) From ???@??? Thu Feb 19 20:42:23 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 19 14:05:03 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y5e5S-0006Ou-00; Thu, 19 Feb 1998 14:04:58 -0800 Message-ID: <2148EC143F29D1118BE000805FC13CD01E1F9A@migarexch01.maritz.com> From: "Liebig, Steuart A." To: "'Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com'" Subject: RE: Looping/music/audience/commerce Date: Thu, 19 Feb 1998 15:59:40 -0600 X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) Resent-Message-ID: <"FZy62C.A.rRF.csK70"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3455 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 19 Feb 1998 14:04:58 -0800 X-UIDL: 22c0de4db26a36093165aba6b645fd08 RE this: > ---------- > From: jprice@intcpi.com > Reply To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com > Sent: Thursday, February 19, 1998 9:47 AM > To: 'Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com' > Subject: RE: Looping/music/audience/commerce > > > > 1.) Standalone portable Device with huge LEDs for the everyday user > from ages 4 and up who wants instant and immediate gratification - > give them loopable presets and some type of idiot proof interface > where they can feel like they have a lot more control over what they > actually have been given. Market it as "Jamout or Zone Out in a Box" > or something along that line. Give it built in speakers, give it > flashing strobe lights too. Price it no higher than $200.00 > 2.) An Intermediate Level (Portable) Unit SCSI (optionable) , MIDI > ports included. Have Preset loops that are loadable and changeable > ie. - rock, Hip-Hop - Techno, House, Country, Metal, New age Jazz, > etc, grooves, sounds that are layerable but limitable to the loops you > can stack and even make em savable on a PC. ... like have it w/a built > in overdrive, chorus or flanger and analog type pedal 1sec. Delay > effect. Allow it to record up to 8 seconds or more of sound and play > back in reverse. Put a multiply mode in it too. Encourage 3rd party SW > developers to support you with various add-on devices. Price it no > higher than $499.00 > > It'll be like a drm machine and quasi sampler/sound canvas all in one. > > > 3.)Get together Somethin akin to a jamman or say an echoplex or the > BOSS sp202 with all the sophistication and wizardry a pro would > expect. Give em lots o knobs and the ability to digitally save and > store edit parameters along with full midi functionality Multiply, > reverse and ring mod. and random playback or random morphing that > would be adjusted & real-time synced to any bpm ya want. Also, > remember Its gotta be pitched from a Fun and ease of use perspective > ie. " You'd be amazed at how fast you'd be making music. " > Plus from a manufacturers and marketing perspective the upgrades and > product life extentions will be endless with tons of cool variations > and offshoots until another larger manufacturer copies what youre > doing to the tee. > Make all your product like samsonite luggaage ! > > The above makes a lot of sense to me . . . it parallels ideas that I've had recently. Though, for me, I'd like to see something that is sort of median point of these . . . sort of the best of 1, 2 and 3, though suspect that I'd be willing to pay more than your price point. I was going to post something along these lines in terms of Kim's and Tom Spaulding's queries, though it looks like the later will be out of the loop (pun intended-sorry!). As an addendum: It seems to me that if you're trying to court the DJ/hip hop market, you need to give them an interface that will be familiar. Maybe something like that Akai on the Looper's Delight page???? This is also for someone like me who would rather not have a rack (sick of 'em) and would like to have something that would be the size of a medium-size drum machine with an opitional footpedal. Maybe just a variation on the EDP with big ole LED displays-cause I AM a bonehead-and some more knobs. stig From ???@??? Thu Feb 19 20:42:26 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 19 14:29:28 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y5eT0-0001Lf-00; Thu, 19 Feb 1998 14:29:18 -0800 From: "Randy Jones" To: Subject: Re: Klein Electric 12-string guitar Date: Thu, 19 Feb 1998 16:15:03 -0600 Message-ID: <01bd3d83$d37c7100$ac3163d1@user.texas.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Resent-Message-ID: <"KxUDJB.A.Ha.WCL70"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3457 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 19 Feb 1998 14:29:18 -0800 X-UIDL: c49c4cd179f40ffcfead5caec8ab1c45 Uh, Me Serious Inqueery? How much extra for the brain and fingers? Randy Jones -----Original Message----- From: Texture444@aol.com To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Date: Thursday, February 19, 1998 2:32 PM Subject: FS: Klein Electric 12-string guitar >hey, y'all. >i'm selling my: > >Klein Electric 12-string guitar >excellent-mint condition, w/hard case >serial #007 >carbon fiber neck, Steinberger "12" bridge >3 EMG pickups: S/S/splittable Hum., 5-way switch >deep emerald green, w/dark rose mutha-of-toiletseat pickguard >the first 1 of only 4 made >previously owned by matt henderson, myself & david lindley (when it was white) >$2750., plus overnite shipping >serious inquiries? >e-mail, or >fax @ 914-679-5957 > >thanks, >dt > > From ???@??? Thu Feb 19 20:42:25 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 19 14:21:29 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y5eLO-0000Kk-00; Thu, 19 Feb 1998 14:21:26 -0800 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <01BD3D2F.410ED410@ROGER_NTWKS40> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 19 Feb 1998 17:16:55 -0500 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: David Myers Subject: Re: Top of the yardstick? Resent-Message-ID: <"m4NALB.A.LLH.59K70"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3456 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 19 Feb 1998 14:21:26 -0800 X-UIDL: ae9ed497c3e233805546206a5ecba1a4 Roger: As far as an "ideal looping system", certainly the EDP must take the honors--no other device can offer such a range of directly loop-related manipulations with such power. I figger you get yerself two EDP's, one foot control, max out the memory at 198 sec each, brother sync em together and yer in hog heaven for about $1500. For what you get, it's a steal. A pair of Revoxes used to be about $4000.... David Myers >Is there some sort of unspoken, ideal, money-no-object looping system that >defines the top of the yardstick, the ultimate system against which all >others are measured? What would be included/omitted in an ideal system? >Roger From ???@??? Thu Feb 19 20:42:27 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 19 14:31:37 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y5eV8-0001d0-00; Thu, 19 Feb 1998 14:31:30 -0800 Message-ID: <2148EC143F29D1118BE000805FC13CD01E1F9B@migarexch01.maritz.com> From: "Liebig, Steuart A." To: "'Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com'" Subject: RE: Looping/music/audience/commerce Date: Thu, 19 Feb 1998 16:24:42 -0600 X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) Resent-Message-ID: <"NWd1wC.A.lq.TEL70"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3458 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 19 Feb 1998 14:31:30 -0800 X-UIDL: 0e9278772ca906c2c34c1f0ef360add4 > ---------- > From: dtapia@unoco.edu > Reply To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com > Sent: Thursday, February 19, 1998 10:07 AM > To: LiebigSA@maritz.com > Subject: Re: Looping/music/audience/commerce > > >For every musician who wants to > >carry around a ton of gear and make strange, beautiful and probably > >unusual music . . . > > But do we really _need_ a ton of gear, or is this just kind of a > techno > security blanket? Seems to me, all that's really _needed_ to loop > sucessfully is a couple of pieces of gear, at least in my world. Much > of > looped music IS crap, as is much of music in general. I've long been > considered an "out" player, however I feel that one MUST take into > acount > the musicality and purpose behind everything we do on stage or in the > studio. People's tastes will vary, but at no time should we use a > piece of > technology simply because it exists. (ANY technology: eg. If a Piano > is > going to muddy up the texture in an undesirable or unmusical way, WHY > USE > IT?) > Right just pointing out the extremes. I'm with you on the usage of tools (caught some flack for that earlier on). Personally I dumped a stereo processor/looping rig, for a Walter Woods and an EH-16 plus a couple of pedals so that I could be MOBILE and play small plcaes with a minimun of set-up time involved. > >[By the way another > >thing about guitar players being the nexus of this stuff, we bass > >players-and drummers?-are practically taught that effects and > anything > >but the sacrosanct "GROOVE" are verboten.] > > Don't mean to let my jazz roots show too much, but have you ever heard > of > Gerry Hemmingway or Jaco? Both these guys have _LOOPED_ and I've > never > heard anything that these guys have done that hasn't grooved _HARD_. > Yeah I've heard of 'em . . . am I supposed to feel put down? Still they are the anomolies. I have tons of Gerry Hemingway stuff, and Jaco . . . well I am a bass player after all. By the way, Les McCann's bass player in the early '70s, Jimmy Rowser, used to do an Echoplex/loop solo that both grooved (and he could) and had cool be-bop melodic and harmonic shit going on . . . (also are you all hip to the fact that Les used to have a FOUR-channel Echoplex that he did looping solos with?) Just talking about the perceptions that one has to fight against. I'm a bass player, I loop and don't always play "groove" music . . . whatever the moment requires. > Can't argue here. Personally, I love the small venues and being able > to do > what I do without corporate types breathing down my neck to play a > certain > way. (Lived that, and, well, no thank you.) To me, musical wallpaper > sucks, but we are entertainers. We can sit here and verbally > masturbate > about how we are creating high art and all that all day long, but if > there's not at least one person sitting in the audience tonight, I'm > not > performing, I'm practicing. I'm happy playing to that one person if > they're really into it, and if I can pay my bills, and have a dental > plan, > then my "day job" has served it's purpose. > Just pointing out that there's a price to pay for the daily bread that doesn't always have to do with being creative. I've been through the corporate meat grinder too, hence some of my opinions. I have a day job PRECISELY beacuse I don't want o ruin an important part of my life. I wonder if a painter feels the same about an audience. I feel that "art " has its place. I don't know if Im "creating high art" all I can do is do what makes me happy, and "keep fighting the good fight." > most people on this > list have as much in common with the superstars of pop as we do with a > trial lawyer. (My appologies to any looping lawyers out there.) > My point exactly. > >I guess that what I'm saying is that the "how to get to people" > question > >is not going to be easily answered being, as I see it, a societal > >awareness issue. WE ARE ANOMALIES. Most people don't want to know > >anything other than what they know, they're pretty much happy with > what > >they have . . . and if they aren't, they search something else > >out-they're already looking and may have found the EDP, insane music, > >etc. How do we nurture these people? I think by creating "hubs" of > >activity (see below). > > Yes, yes, and YES! (Preach brother) > Um, . . . okay (?) > Seems to have worked for our friend John Zorn and the > downtown/Knitting > Factory scene musicians. What? Zorn owns two lables now and is > commited > to getting the unusual noticed. No, no Zorn record will ever go gold > or > make the charts, but the "small" audience is pretty large and is > global. > What's more, this audience is commited to supporting creative music > and is > passing this love on to another generation. > Right, that's a good case in point. I played at the Knit in January (travelled from LA to make 50 bucks, what a dweeb . . . seriously it was great fun). I was impressed by the fact that they basically have three bands a night in the alterKnit, a "lounge," and a main stage where they have more high-prfile artists. TIm Berne has his own label now too, likewise Vinny Golia in LA (there's a decent scene here too, likewise in SF). You're in CO? How are things out there? Ron Mles is from Denver, right? > >Support Creative Music where you can. > > Amen. > > Amen stig From ???@??? Thu Feb 19 20:42:31 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 19 15:00:16 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y5ews-0004uB-00; Thu, 19 Feb 1998 15:00:10 -0800 From: Fmplautus@aol.com Message-ID: <4d57c9fa.34ecb7e0@aol.com> Date: Thu, 19 Feb 1998 17:53:18 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: LoopDoctor prize winner Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 78 Resent-Message-ID: <"285Qr.A.p6D.hgL70"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3459 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 19 Feb 1998 15:00:10 -0800 X-UIDL: 5c2a8e4f6f1700c7cb48e4db3e4a6f58 Hey Tom: Thanks for clothing the LoOpdOctOrs...lovely alternative to the open backed hospital gowns we've been wearing, although the other guys in the band will go into a jealous rage when they see I got one and they didn't. Best, Kevin From ???@??? Thu Feb 19 20:42:32 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 19 15:15:38 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y5fBi-0006ow-00; Thu, 19 Feb 1998 15:15:30 -0800 From: Fmplautus@aol.com Message-ID: <5d31220c.34ecbb2d@aol.com> Date: Thu, 19 Feb 1998 18:07:22 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Re: So Long Loopers Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 78 Resent-Message-ID: <"dPb9QD.A.OmF.8tL70"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3460 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 19 Feb 1998 15:15:30 -0800 X-UIDL: 41c3464c58b1349a9a5f3164dbc773a5 Tom... You will be missed...say it ain't so! The LoOpdOctOrs From ???@??? Thu Feb 19 20:42:33 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 19 15:17:24 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y5fDT-000733-00; Thu, 19 Feb 1998 15:17:19 -0800 From: "Randy Jones" To: Subject: Re: San Antonio looping show -7:30pm Date: Thu, 19 Feb 1998 17:07:35 -0600 Message-ID: <01bd3d8b$2a768200$d03163d1@user.texas.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Resent-Message-ID: <"uG3dGC.A.fvF.CvL70"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3461 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 19 Feb 1998 15:17:19 -0800 X-UIDL: 48a780d6abf89d793c38ee9aaf7f0b87 My fellow TexanLoopers, I'm there! If anyone else is near San Antonio, go hear this man! He plays a jamman, an echoplex, guitars, stick, synth, etc. Great improvisational original music. Randy Jones -----Original Message----- From: james rhodes To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Date: Thursday, February 19, 1998 8:40 AM Subject: San Antonio looping show -7:30pm >hi, >just a reminder that i will be playing at the Clipper Ship Bookstore >tomorrow (fri, feb 20, 98) my start-time will actually be between 7:00 and >8:00pm...its a free show,,,i' will be playing with another looping >quartet,,"Dreamland" they are great,,,so those in the area please support >independent music...the Clipper Ship Bookstore is at 722 Balcones Heights >Rd. (at Babcock) (210) 734-5409... >> >>thanks, >james >> > > > From ???@??? Thu Feb 19 20:42:33 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 19 15:28:22 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y5fO7-0000ZI-00; Thu, 19 Feb 1998 15:28:19 -0800 From: "Randy Jones" To: Subject: Re: Call for Electro-acoustic music... Date: Thu, 19 Feb 1998 17:21:26 -0600 Message-ID: <01bd3d8d$19656380$d03163d1@user.texas.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Resent-Message-ID: <"RI50oD.A.xTH.47L70"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3462 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 19 Feb 1998 15:28:19 -0800 X-UIDL: 411d1d45bd5a4ddd26391fc4a6d29be2 Hey Doc Michael, If you have an electronic student with a high IQ, a strong Id, a lack of experimental development ideas, and most of all a sense of humor have him/her email me. I'm looking for a prototype builder for a top secret , audio driven personal de vice. Randy (inventing the Butt Looper) Jones *********** Oh yeah. Bye Tom, Thanks for the refreshing input and my middle name idea. I'm going... I'm going...Don't push me... -----Original Message----- From: Michael P. Hughes, Ph.D. To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Date: Thursday, February 19, 1998 1:24 PM Subject: Re: Call for Electro-acoustic music... >>I'm not trying to start a firefight again folks, really! But I'm curious as >>to the proper definition of 'electro-acoustic'.... >>Is it acoustic instruments/music electrically enhanced or recorded? >>Is it a blend of electronic and acoustic instruments/music? >>Is it electronically-recorded sound combined with a super-acoustic or >>ambient aesthetic in mind with respect to the overall 'sound'? > >We have a strong electro-acoustic music group within this university, and >students on the Electronics with Music degree (which I'm involved in the >organising of) get an opportunity to have a go on their own in their final >year. My experience is that it's very musique-concrete-esque, largely >sampled sounds prerecorded in 8-track. This is played to the audience (the >correct phrase is "diffused") by the player sitting at the centre of an >8-way high-quality sound system , and the audience. By manipulating levels >(one finger per fader on a soundcraft desk) to the speakers, the diffuser >is able to throw the sound around the room. If done well, this can be VERY >impressive (A whoosh as the steam engine passes THROUGH your head! Ahhh! >Aural rollercoaster!!). Mostly though, it's a lot of silly noises coming >from a lot of expensive PA. > >Michael > > > From ???@??? Thu Feb 19 20:42:34 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 19 15:37:18 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y5fWj-0001ct-00; Thu, 19 Feb 1998 15:37:13 -0800 From: Texture444@aol.com Message-ID: <98c59615.34ecc0c4@aol.com> Date: Thu, 19 Feb 1998 18:31:14 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: So Long Loopers Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 84 Resent-Message-ID: <"J7GnhC.A.E_.KEM70"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3463 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 19 Feb 1998 15:37:13 -0800 X-UIDL: 4da630abf5b58650d4e6759836b02a4b tom: no! where ya goin'? best, dt From ???@??? Thu Feb 19 20:42:52 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 19 17:39:15 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y5hQm-0006rs-00; Thu, 19 Feb 1998 17:39:12 -0800 Message-Id: <1.5.4.32.19980220013045.0096b0e0@pop.mindspring.com> X-Sender: gls@pop.mindspring.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 19 Feb 1998 19:30:45 -0600 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Grover Sheffield Subject: Re: So Long Loopers Resent-Message-ID: <"1moprB.A.3wF.q1N70"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3464 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 19 Feb 1998 17:39:12 -0800 X-UIDL: be2135541c539620e786551d006b0270 Tom, Thanks for letting us know. As one of the people who has received an EPD recently, I credit your work. I'm pretty stunned... At 03:05 PM 2/19/98 -0600, you wrote: >It appears my tenure with the Oberheim division has come to an end. I will >be leaving the division effective noon Friday. > >Tom "Where you goin' with that UB40 in your hand" Spaulding > >p.s. Kim, please Unscribe ;) > > From ???@??? Thu Feb 19 20:41:53 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 19 11:23:28 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y5bZ7-00053F-00; Thu, 19 Feb 1998 11:23:25 -0800 Message-Id: <3.0.1.16.19980219205945.2f6fcf7a@rank-serv.elec.gla.ac.uk> X-Sender: pycraft@rank-serv.elec.gla.ac.uk X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.1 (16) Date: Thu, 19 Feb 1998 20:59:45 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: "Michael P. Hughes, Ph.D." Subject: Re: Call for Electro-acoustic music... In-Reply-To: <000801bd3c3b$19524140$8622dacf@stepheng> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"GUDB_C.A._DE.aVI70"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3449 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 19 Feb 1998 11:23:25 -0800 X-UIDL: ba2b6f1a3ba8dfc9a243a9c82ddd5db6 >I'm not trying to start a firefight again folks, really! But I'm curious as >to the proper definition of 'electro-acoustic'.... >Is it acoustic instruments/music electrically enhanced or recorded? >Is it a blend of electronic and acoustic instruments/music? >Is it electronically-recorded sound combined with a super-acoustic or >ambient aesthetic in mind with respect to the overall 'sound'? We have a strong electro-acoustic music group within this university, and students on the Electronics with Music degree (which I'm involved in the organising of) get an opportunity to have a go on their own in their final year. My experience is that it's very musique-concrete-esque, largely sampled sounds prerecorded in 8-track. This is played to the audience (the correct phrase is "diffused") by the player sitting at the centre of an 8-way high-quality sound system , and the audience. By manipulating levels (one finger per fader on a soundcraft desk) to the speakers, the diffuser is able to throw the sound around the room. If done well, this can be VERY impressive (A whoosh as the steam engine passes THROUGH your head! Ahhh! Aural rollercoaster!!). Mostly though, it's a lot of silly noises coming from a lot of expensive PA. Michael From ???@??? Fri Feb 20 01:45:42 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 19 23:39:14 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y5n37-0007Ah-00; Thu, 19 Feb 1998 23:39:09 -0800 Message-ID: <34ED333D.B61DFB6B@deviant.org> Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 01:40:56 -0600 From: DC Shown Reply-To: dizzy@deviant.org Organization: Deviant X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.01 (Macintosh; U; PPC) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: FS: Vortex $200 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"wDpBTC.A.SbG.2JT70"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3470 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 19 Feb 1998 23:39:09 -0800 X-UIDL: c3d431773642345fb71f4eb76de4b946 would you be willing to wait for payment? I'm currently buying a removably HD, but If you're willing to wait a few weeks then I'd love to get It! Lemme know, Thanks DZ From ???@??? Fri Feb 20 01:45:43 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 19 23:49:00 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y5nCc-0000JO-00; Thu, 19 Feb 1998 23:48:58 -0800 Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 01:59:23 -0600 From: John Pollock Subject: Re: So Long Loopers To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Message-id: <34ED37DB.6D60@delphi.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win95; I) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit References: <98Feb19.150233cst.26881@gateway.gibson.com> Resent-Message-ID: <"xJQ1L.A.QB.QTT70"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3471 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 19 Feb 1998 23:48:58 -0800 X-UIDL: 99bf9c7ed582eb9e064b898be6e50378 Tom, It appears from your wording that your departure is involuntary (hope I'm wrong). If so, I take it as a personal affront. In fact, I'm just plain mad. I've really appreciated your humor, but I've also appreciated your candor with respect to the status of EDP and upgrade delivery. It would be a shame if your wit and wisdom were not available somewhere on the Internet, if it can't be on this list. Please stay in touch... John johnpollock@delphi.com http://people.delphi.com/johnpollock/ (Troubador Tech) From ???@??? Fri Feb 20 02:44:08 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 20 02:43:10 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y5pvA-00029l-00; Fri, 20 Feb 1998 02:43:08 -0800 Message-ID: <009c01bd3deb$840b8bc0$e723d3c2@Studio.KPNET.FI> From: "Antti RintamŠki" To: Subject: New looping equipment Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 12:37:17 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8BIT X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Resent-Message-ID: <"k_EIvC.A.BwB.p2V70"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3473 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 02:43:08 -0800 X-UIDL: 47c9dd5ea478de228fa50ec91cebeb89 I've heard there is coming new looping-FX soon with lots of memory. From Lexicon maybe... Anybody heard such rumours or have any further information ???? Antti Rintamaki Studio Soiva Kivi Folk Arts Centre Kaustinen - Finland ajr@kaustinen.kpnet.fi From ???@??? Fri Feb 20 09:43:15 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 20 05:00:46 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y5s4L-0007UY-00; Fri, 20 Feb 1998 05:00:45 -0800 Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 07:57:22 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <199802201257.HAA23147@mcfeely.concentric.net> X-Sender: hideo@pop3.concentric.net X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Tom Lambrecht Subject: Re: So Long Loopers Resent-Message-ID: <"LyV3l.A.mqG.22X70"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3474 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 05:00:45 -0800 X-UIDL: a5a8545b7c3953f274e95a25f3b9bc1f Tom: tho' I'm a Jammie owner, I still enjoyed your heavily modulated (wwarped) posts this group and your obvious commitment to the product . . . and your obvious professionalism about moving on . . . I hope for the sake of my Plexicaled brethren that this is not a demonstration of Gibson's commitment to the "new" Plex .. . . All the best drone on~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~Tom At 03:05 PM 2/19/98 -0600, you wrote: >Hey Y'all- > >It appears my tenure with the Oberheim division has come to an end. I will >be leaving the division effective noon Friday. Just wanted to give my >sincere thanks to everyone on the list that I have met and communicated >with, as well as those patient lurkers who put up with my feeble attempts >at humor. It's been fun,and I am glad to have met all of you...we may meet >again someday, you never can tell. > >Tom "Where you goin' with that UB40 in your hand" Spaulding > >p.s. Kim, please Unscribe ;) > > > Tom Lambrecht hideo@concentric.net From ???@??? Fri Feb 20 09:43:17 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 20 05:36:13 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y5sce-0001jP-00; Fri, 20 Feb 1998 05:36:12 -0800 Message-ID: <34ED817B.FED62D8D@vtx.ch> Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 14:13:31 +0100 From: "c.voit" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight Subject: Whats happening with bananas ? Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"afA97B.A.ZZB.EZY70"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3476 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 05:36:12 -0800 X-UIDL: 25bc87df8638a5f7b1d405cd394b1089 Salut Has anybody had some contact with Bananas at large those last two weeks ? I was ready to order 2 plexes never got an answer to my last mails I want my E-cho-plex-x Claude From ???@??? Fri Feb 20 09:43:17 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 20 05:28:53 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y5sVX-00017s-00; Fri, 20 Feb 1998 05:28:51 -0800 From: Marzzz@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 08:26:23 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com, tspauldi@gibson.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: So Long Loopers Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 84 Resent-Message-ID: <"pKe-MC.A.u1.OSY70"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3475 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 05:28:51 -0800 X-UIDL: 2527235f9ad4b1d79317b5737338fd9b In a message dated 2/19/98 4:05:28 PM, you wrote: <> Sorry to see you go, Tom! I hope this is opening the doors to even greater opportunities for you. Thank you (again!) for all your help here! Marshall From ???@??? Fri Feb 20 09:43:20 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 20 06:14:25 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y5tDb-0003ya-00; Fri, 20 Feb 1998 06:14:23 -0800 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 09:11:19 -0500 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: David Myers Subject: Re: So Long Loopers Resent-Message-ID: <"AnVzwD.A.FeD.q8Y70"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3477 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 06:14:23 -0800 X-UIDL: 5135c52374d857f55f34178958a48b57 Tom "King of the Tag Lines" Spaulding: You'll be missed--thanks for the wit, wisdom, and assistance. From ???@??? Fri Feb 20 09:43:23 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 20 06:52:39 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y5tob-0006SR-00; Fri, 20 Feb 1998 06:52:37 -0800 Message-Id: <199802201449.JAA14123@shell.monmouth.com> Reply-To: From: "andre" To: Subject: Re: So Long Loopers Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 09:48:59 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1162 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"8xbzhB.A.AwF.OgZ70"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3478 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 06:52:37 -0800 X-UIDL: c778292ddb5708bc752cc52c7e6ac2ec tOM, WAIT!! WHAT AM I MISSING?? can't you particpate as a 'private citizen' on this list??? i apologize if this was explained before..?? i muast have missed, it, though i think i saw every post since you announced..a few daze back..? what gives? andre east > From ???@??? Fri Feb 20 09:43:45 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 20 09:08:39 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y5vwE-00049h-00; Fri, 20 Feb 1998 09:08:38 -0800 Message-Id: <215C1D5A0FFDD011B3CC00805FC18C29238B54@NTSRV2> From: "Hogan, Greg (Exchange)" To: "'Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com'" Subject: RE: New looping equipment Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 10:06:20 -0500 X-Priority: 3 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) Content-Type: text/plain Resent-Message-ID: <"GKS5W.A.-JD.gcb70"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3487 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 09:08:38 -0800 X-UIDL: 523174fadd184e6cd361b211969689c3 Dear Antti, I am not aware of any dedicated looper being developed here. Our MPX G2 will allow you to create 1 loop of up to 20 seconds in mono or up to 10 seconds in stereo audio. Please let me know if you have any questions or if there is anything that I can do for you. Best regards, Greg Hogan Lexicon Customer Service Phone +781-280-0372 FAX +781-280-0499 > ---------- > From: Antti RintamŠki[SMTP:antti.rintamaki@pp.inet.fi] > Reply To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com > Sent: Friday, February 20, 1998 5:42 AM > To: GHogan@lexicon.com > Subject: New looping equipment > > I've heard there is coming new looping-FX soon with lots of memory. > From Lexicon maybe... > > Anybody heard such rumours or have any further information ???? > > > Antti Rintamaki > Studio Soiva Kivi > Folk Arts Centre > Kaustinen - Finland > ajr@kaustinen.kpnet.fi > > From ???@??? Fri Feb 20 09:43:28 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 20 07:16:07 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y5uBJ-0000Iz-00; Fri, 20 Feb 1998 07:16:05 -0800 From: Fmplautus@aol.com Message-ID: <2d55d23f.34ed9d39@aol.com> Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 10:11:50 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Tom's departure Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 78 Resent-Message-ID: <"DfEgzD.A.TRH.71Z70"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3479 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 07:16:05 -0800 X-UIDL: bd351e0b145d16b90eac7afe7a5bc330 Would just like to underscore that Tom did a great job keeping lines open with looper community and also backing up an excellent product (that just got a lot better with the upgrade). Given this has not always been the case with Oberheim and Gibson, we are concerned about the future. Has anyone put a call into Oberheim? Best, The LoOpdOctOrs From ???@??? Fri Feb 20 09:43:30 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 20 07:23:45 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y5uIh-00013T-00; Fri, 20 Feb 1998 07:23:43 -0800 X-Sender: tomroady@mail.telalink.net Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 09:20:07 -0600 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: tomroady@telalink.net (THOMAS W ROADY) Subject: So Long Loopers Resent-Message-ID: <"Y3gwlB.A.dr.W9Z70"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3480 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 07:23:43 -0800 X-UIDL: 7ce63fd620a68ed6aea02db5e3038746 Tom Spaulding wrote: > Hey Y'all- > > It appears my tenure with the Oberheim division has come to an end. I will > be leaving the division effective noon Friday. Just wanted to give my > sincere thanks to everyone on the list that I have met and communicated > with, as well as those patient lurkers who put up with my feeble attempts > at humor. It's been fun,and I am glad to have met all of you...we may meet > again someday, you never can tell. > > Tom "Where you goin' with that UB40 in your hand" Spaulding > > p.s. Kim, please Unscribe ;) I for one am going to miss Mr. Spaulding's witty reparte'! Good ideas, good humor, good man!. Best of luck to you in your future endeavors! And thanks on a personal level for everything you have done for me. It is greatly appreciated. Tom "Technology is rampant. We live in a world where the same technology that allows men to walk on the moon is being used to make plastic dogshit" Leland Sklar...Bass Player March 92' Hey! don't forget to check out my CD, ZENDRUM : ONE TRIBE featured in Dec. 97 ELECTRONIC MUSICIAN Pro File and March 98 KEYBOARD Discoveries column...To hear excerpts dial the Museline at 617-497-5786 ext.# 9363......VISIT MY HOMEPAGE AT: http://www.nashville.net/~tomroady From ???@??? Fri Feb 20 09:43:33 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 20 08:02:09 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y5utp-0004CH-00; Fri, 20 Feb 1998 08:02:05 -0800 Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 10:57:26 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <199802201557.KAA21789@user1.channel1.com> X-Sender: seahorse@user1.channel1.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Frank Gerace Subject: Re: So Long Loopers Resent-Message-ID: <"NcnZtD.A.mZD.sfa70"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3481 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 08:02:05 -0800 X-UIDL: 7fa6a202c07f84fc124b2026ee487f4a At 09:11 AM 2/20/98 -0500, you wrote: >Tom "King of the Tag Lines" Spaulding: You'll be missed--thanks for the >wit, wisdom, and assistance. > Long Live The King. Thanks for all the above, Tom, too bad you have to move along. I, too, hope it doesn't bode ill for the Plex and its owners/users, and I'm sure you'll do well where ever you wind up. Best of luck. Frank Gerace > > > > From ???@??? Fri Feb 20 09:43:33 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 20 08:06:19 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y5uxr-0004ix-00; Fri, 20 Feb 1998 08:06:15 -0800 From: ANET@aol.com Message-ID: <294b0d9d.34eda816@aol.com> Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 10:58:11 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: MINNESOTA LOOPING DATE Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 18 Resent-Message-ID: <"7viGbD.A.vnD.gha70"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3482 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 08:06:15 -0800 X-UIDL: 9672a346f618eb13a13fb135f7999c03 FYI JOHN PETERS (Acoustic guitar looping) will appear at the Broadstreet Cafe, Redwood Room, Rochester, Minnesota tonight, tommorrow and Sunday. 7-10pm. Hope to see you there!!!!!! Adios Amigos. From ???@??? Sat Feb 21 00:54:05 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 20 13:02:36 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y5zab-0000Jr-00; Fri, 20 Feb 1998 13:02:33 -0800 Message-ID: <34EDA853.79C2@nyfac.com> Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 15:59:15 +0000 From: tbajus Reply-To: nyfac2@nyfac.com X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (WinNT; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: jammies for sale References: <980220145403_-2021728322@mrin51.mx> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"Ry2deD.A.HhG.D1e70"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3497 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 13:02:33 -0800 X-UIDL: 8acdbcd43cd0150d7e363e68de0e806b > two for sale: > one with xtra mem, one without... both for $750 OBO. I hope he means for both units together..... Trevor From ???@??? Fri Feb 20 09:43:36 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 20 08:11:21 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y5v2m-0005Mi-00; Fri, 20 Feb 1998 08:11:20 -0800 Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 08:07:09 -0800 (PST) From: Rik Elswit Message-Id: <199802201607.IAA19921@well.com> To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Whats happening with bananas ? Resent-Message-ID: <"tqTVmB.A.AkE.2oa70"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3483 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 08:11:20 -0800 X-UIDL: dce9a2bcdd82b1a1561cea534347cfe7 Claude, I'm the guy that's been handling bananas's internet stuff, and came down seriously ill a couple of months ago. Unfortunatley, nobosy picked up th slack, and we just got swamped with email. i'm just digging out from under it now. My apologies. In the case of Bananas, our web page is informational only. We're not set up to sell on the web, and it requires a phone call to do business anyway. Please give us a call, and I can give you the current availablility. Rik Elswit Bananas Audio/MIDI 415-457-7600 From ???@??? Fri Feb 20 09:43:39 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 20 08:28:59 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y5vJn-0007Ot-00; Fri, 20 Feb 1998 08:28:55 -0800 Message-Id: <98Feb20.102034cst.26881@gateway.gibson.com> X-Sender: tspauldi@mail.nash.gibson.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 10:23:52 -0600 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Tom Spaulding Subject: Re: Bananas bel Grande In-Reply-To: <199802201607.IAA19921@well.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"orSjgC.A.aIG.22a70"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3485 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 08:28:55 -0800 X-UIDL: b2e5a3d133ee6a292666b30262d2f9e6 Rik- Glad to hear you're feeling better. Thanks for all of the support from Bananas for the EDP. Keep on buying them, we'll keep refering folks to you... Tom "Keep Them Cards and Letters Comin'" Spaulding At 10:07 AM 2/20/98 -0600, you wrote: >Claude, > >I'm the guy that's been handling bananas's internet stuff, and came down >seriously ill a couple of months ago. Unfortunatley, nobosy picked up th >slack, and we just got swamped with email. i'm just digging out from under >it now. My apologies. > >In the case of Bananas, our web page is informational only. We're not set >up to sell on the web, and it requires a phone call to do business anyway. >Please give us a call, and I can give you the current availablility. > >Rik Elswit >Bananas Audio/MIDI >415-457-7600 > > > From ???@??? Fri Feb 20 09:43:40 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 20 08:43:24 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y5vXi-0001Hq-00; Fri, 20 Feb 1998 08:43:18 -0800 Message-Id: <3.0.32.19980220085053.006bc5b8@svars1.simi-valley.ate.slb.com> X-Sender: cavaleri@svars1.simi-valley.ate.slb.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0 (32) Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 08:50:54 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Joe Cavaleri Subject: Re: So Long Loopers Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"Xz4kzB.A.Yb.rEb70"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3486 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 08:43:18 -0800 X-UIDL: f1704e8efc8726ed1321f507fd67e8e4 Hey Tom, Sorry to hear the news.. I want to thank you for sharing your expertise, your insider knowledge, and your humor with the list. Hope to hear for you soon. joe p.s .... thanks for the tee!!! From ???@??? Fri Feb 20 09:43:47 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 20 09:33:06 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y5wJt-00078w-00; Fri, 20 Feb 1998 09:33:05 -0800 Message-ID: <34EDB48E.3D5BEB74@vtx.ch> Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 17:51:26 +0100 From: "c.voit" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Whats happening with bananas ? References: <199802201607.IAA19921@well.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"wrofHC.A.8DG.F0b70"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3489 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 09:33:05 -0800 X-UIDL: 54437c2275638b6533951f855f94d63d Rik Elswit wrote: > > Claude, > > I'm the guy that's been handling bananas's internet stuff, and came down > seriously ill a couple of months ago. Unfortunatley, nobosy picked up th > slack, and we just got swamped with email. i'm just digging out from under > it now. My apologies. > welcome back our looping chat You'll hear my floating english accent very soon Claude From ???@??? Sat Feb 21 00:53:33 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 20 10:28:55 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y5xBo-0006GM-00; Fri, 20 Feb 1998 10:28:48 -0800 X-Sender: landman@mail.wco.com Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 09:55:16 -0700 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: landman@wco.com (Mark Landman) Subject: RE: New looping equipment Cc: ghogan@lexicon.com Resent-Message-ID: <"-_nMpC.A.57E.Bmc70"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3492 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 10:28:48 -0800 X-UIDL: 43ff4a6f18aa076f4c3229958bb5ab61 Greg- Is there an algorithm (or interface) set up specifically for loop capture and such? Any of the Jamman design make it into this version of the MPX? With 20 seconds of memory it seems a shame if it's just configured as a straight delay lineÉ Mark >Dear Antti, > >I am not aware of any dedicated looper being developed here. Our MPX G2 >will allow you to create 1 loop of up to 20 seconds in mono or up to 10 >seconds in stereo audio. > >Please let me know if you have any questions or if there is anything >that I can do for you. > >Best regards, > >Greg Hogan >Lexicon Customer Service >Phone +781-280-0372 >FAX +781-280-0499 > From ???@??? Fri Feb 20 09:43:46 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 20 09:17:42 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y5w4x-0005IV-00; Fri, 20 Feb 1998 09:17:39 -0800 From: Fmplautus@aol.com Message-ID: <27712835.34edb866@aol.com> Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 12:07:48 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: RE: New looping equipment Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 78 Resent-Message-ID: <"6SdR-.A.58D.xib70"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3488 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 09:17:39 -0800 X-UIDL: f674e4fa0657967a913b4727389782ad Hi Greg: How much loop time would the old MPX-1 do? Best, The LoOpdOctOrs From ???@??? Fri Feb 20 09:59:46 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 20 09:52:17 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y5wcI-0001h4-00; Fri, 20 Feb 1998 09:52:06 -0800 Message-ID: <005501bd3e26$3800d560$e723d3c2@Studio.KPNET.FI> From: "Antti RintamŠki" To: Subject: RE: New looping equipment Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 19:37:24 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8BIT X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Resent-Message-ID: <"U75Xv.A.SS.0Ac70"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3491 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 09:52:06 -0800 X-UIDL: 6e49b36c3406f521c609c6a789f67239 Thanks Greg for your answer. So it wasn't from Lexicon. My friend knew musician who has already ordered new looping FX from USA, it's brand new model appearing at this spring and it has over 1 min of looping time as basic setup. I couldn't check out who's the manufacturer and thought some looper knows it. I have no attempt to spread any false rumours to confuse people, just curious... Antti Rintamaki Studio Soiva Kivi Folk Arts Centre Kaustinen - Finland ajr@kaustinen.kpnet.fi From ???@??? Fri Feb 20 09:59:45 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 20 09:50:44 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y5wam-0001UT-00; Fri, 20 Feb 1998 09:50:32 -0800 Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 10:39:53 -0700 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: dtapia@unoco.edu (Douglas Tapia) Subject: RE: Looping/music/audience/commerce Resent-Message-ID: <"iW5h_B.A.TI.s_b70"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3490 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 09:50:32 -0800 X-UIDL: d15182c99e652bf5b766f33d5565df64 You're in CO? How are things out there? Ron Mles is from Denver, >right? > Yeah, Ron's from Denver, great cat too. Always willing to share his knowledge and just hang out. He's not been around too much though, since getting the gig with Frisell. Now that the Quartet isn't doing too much, and since Ron's record label has kinda disolved, he's looking into other stuff. Rumor from his Denver drumer has it that he MAY be doing something with one of Henery Thredgill's guitarists or possibly Anthony Coleman. (Wouldn't that be COOL?!?) Anyway, we still have Fred Hess and the Boulder Creative Music Orchestra, and of course, there's always the opprutunity to see Art Lande (one of the most underestimated pianists since Myra Melford, IMHO) doing gigs to audiences of like 40 people a night in the basement of a little tavern. (Talk about not selling out. . .) Of course, ECM is the lable of the stars. . . (huh?) Oh yeah, that's in my own little universe, where no one has ever heard of the Spice Girls. See ya, Doug Tapia From ???@??? Sat Feb 21 00:53:46 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 20 11:04:12 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y5xjx-0002gv-00; Fri, 20 Feb 1998 11:04:05 -0800 From: ANET@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 13:51:10 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: 3rd CD PROJECT WEB PAGE Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 18 Resent-Message-ID: <"GFBD8C.A.gVB.HFd70"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3493 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 11:04:05 -0800 X-UIDL: 2f5634d8f4f1075429be8a9bfe568fc8 Been real busy lately, sorry for the delay. Okay, here it is, the WEB PAGE for the 3rd project. http://members.aol.com/anet/3rdcd.html Will be working on the site in the next few weeks 1)Adding audio 2)Status reports 3)Possible forum organized by topic. See ya!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Loopers Unite, we are the true artists!!!!!!!!! 78>) From ???@??? Fri Feb 20 02:41:05 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 20 02:13:37 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y5pSa-0000gO-00; Fri, 20 Feb 1998 02:13:36 -0800 Message-Id: <3.0.1.16.19980220115319.2327cb32@rank-serv.elec.gla.ac.uk> X-Sender: pycraft@rank-serv.elec.gla.ac.uk X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.1 (16) Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 11:53:19 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: "Michael P. Hughes, Ph.D." Subject: Re: Call for Electro-acoustic music... In-Reply-To: <01bd3d8d$19656380$d03163d1@user.texas.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"gtFAeC.A.Ec.KbV70"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3472 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 02:13:36 -0800 X-UIDL: 5d43b953b23ea58c1ef1035ae038a8b6 >If you have an electronic student with a high IQ, a strong Id, a lack of >experimental development ideas, and most of all a sense of humor have >him/her email me. I'm looking for a prototype builder for a top secret , >audio driven personal de vice. Like, are you planning on employing this student, or just get them to assemble some circuits? Is a lack of experimental development ideas a good thing??? >Oh yeah. Bye Tom, Yeah Tom, it's a real blow you're going. Keep in touch. Michael From ???@??? Sat Feb 21 00:54:00 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 20 12:00:06 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y5yc8-0001Ap-00; Fri, 20 Feb 1998 12:00:04 -0800 Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 14:54:04 -0500 (EST) From: Monkici@aol.com Message-ID: <980220145403_-2021728322@mrin51.mx> To: loopers-delight@annihilist.com Subject: jammies for sale Resent-Message-ID: <"63BdvC.A.Wh.a-d70"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3494 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 12:00:04 -0800 X-UIDL: ef923ff6542fcb4cd5a30d20b873e2f0 apparently the person interested in these jammans isn't really interested after all. so.... two for sale: one with xtra mem, one without... both for $750 OBO. rich 513 861 1687 From ???@??? Sat Feb 21 00:54:03 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 20 12:42:18 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y5zGw-0005Vc-00; Fri, 20 Feb 1998 12:42:14 -0800 From: TritoneDW@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 15:32:47 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: jammies for sale Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 49 Resent-Message-ID: <"Y7powD.A.xOE.Kje70"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3495 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 12:42:14 -0800 X-UIDL: 23a3290df5d862d54661c42a75c42edc <> $750???(!!) Is that what these things are going for these days? Maybe I should sell mine and get an EDP. Drew From ???@??? Sat Feb 21 00:54:04 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 20 12:55:26 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y5zTW-0007Bj-00; Fri, 20 Feb 1998 12:55:14 -0800 From: PJBMHB@aol.com Message-ID: <755d5302.34edeb00@aol.com> Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 15:43:42 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: jammies for sale Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 16-bit for Windows sub 41 Resent-Message-ID: <"_U7RCC.A.djF.ate70"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3496 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 12:55:14 -0800 X-UIDL: 14c81c27d2464e3c29ecbe57cc10aeec maybe i will sell my jamman and put a down payment on a house!! =-) PJ From ???@??? Sat Feb 21 00:54:23 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 20 14:08:15 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y60c4-000771-00; Fri, 20 Feb 1998 14:08:08 -0800 From: Paolo Valladolid Message-Id: <199802202202.OAA13842@waynesworld.ucsd.edu> Subject: Torn (fwd) To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 14:02:42 -0800 (PST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"asNnkC.A.WFG.S2f70"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3498 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 14:08:08 -0800 X-UIDL: eb4e40779b74ee4452a37378df38448c Can someone (dt? :)) confirm the following info below? It was posted to the Sylvian list. Will there be looping involved? :) Thanks, Paolo Valladolid --------------------------------------------------------------- |Moderator of Digital Guitar Digest, an Internet mailing list |\ |for Music Technology and Stringed Instruments | \ ---------------------------------------------------------------- | \ finger pvallado@waynesworld.ucsd.edu for more info \ | \ http://waynesworld.ucsd.edu/DigitalGuitar/home.html \| ----------------------------------------------------------------- Forwarded message: >David Torn is playing at McCabe's soon...I guess I should go after all the >raving of the list (I'm not really familiar with him). McCabe's is one of >the coolest places in the WORLD to see a show...a guitar store in Santa >Monica with a small stage in the back room that only seats about 150 people >tops... From ???@??? Sat Feb 21 00:54:30 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 20 15:47:29 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y62A3-0002qK-00; Fri, 20 Feb 1998 15:47:19 -0800 Message-Id: <3.0.32.19980220144442.006b5c20@svars1.simi-valley.ate.slb.com> X-Sender: cavaleri@svars1.simi-valley.ate.slb.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0 (32) Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 14:44:43 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Joe Cavaleri Subject: Re: Torn (fwd) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"RQxrsD.A.8OB.uMh70"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3504 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 15:47:20 -0800 X-UIDL: 249eb9b4aa5b7701a354ec8a05363478 David will be playing McCabe's on Sunday, March 1'st. Sorry, I don't have a phone number handy. joe At 02:02 PM 2/20/98 -0800, you wrote: >Can someone (dt? :)) confirm the following info below? It was posted >to the Sylvian list. Will there be looping involved? :) > >Thanks, >Paolo Valladolid > --------------------------------------------------------------- >|Moderator of Digital Guitar Digest, an Internet mailing list |\ >|for Music Technology and Stringed Instruments | \ > ---------------------------------------------------------------- | >\ finger pvallado@waynesworld.ucsd.edu for more info \ | > \ http://waynesworld.ucsd.edu/DigitalGuitar/home.html \| > ----------------------------------------------------------------- > >Forwarded message: >>David Torn is playing at McCabe's soon...I guess I should go after all the >>raving of the list (I'm not really familiar with him). McCabe's is one of >>the coolest places in the WORLD to see a show...a guitar store in Santa >>Monica with a small stage in the back room that only seats about 150 people >>tops... > > > From ???@??? Sat Feb 21 00:54:26 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 20 15:00:53 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y61R4-0004xW-00; Fri, 20 Feb 1998 15:00:50 -0800 Message-ID: <2148EC143F29D1118BE000805FC13CD01E1FA4@migarexch01.maritz.com> From: "Liebig, Steuart A." To: "'Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com'" Subject: RE: Torn (fwd) Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 16:50:42 -0600 X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) Resent-Message-ID: <"JS-SID.A.08D.6mg70"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3499 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 15:00:50 -0800 X-UIDL: 0dbf80571ee1ecead3ee22083f799f51 I've seen ads for it, I think thatit's in early March . . . the first? > ---------- > From: Paolo Valladolid > Reply To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com > Sent: Friday, February 20, 1998 2:08 PM > To: LiebigSA@maritz.com > Subject: Torn (fwd) > > Can someone (dt? :)) confirm the following info below? It was posted > to the Sylvian list. Will there be looping involved? :) > > Thanks, > Paolo Valladolid > --------------------------------------------------------------- > |Moderator of Digital Guitar Digest, an Internet mailing list |\ > |for Music Technology and Stringed Instruments > | \ > ---------------------------------------------------------------- | > \ finger pvallado@waynesworld.ucsd.edu for more info \ | > \ http://waynesworld.ucsd.edu/DigitalGuitar/home.html > \| > ----------------------------------------------------------------- > > Forwarded message: > >David Torn is playing at McCabe's soon...I guess I should go after > all the > >raving of the list (I'm not really familiar with him). McCabe's is > one of > >the coolest places in the WORLD to see a show...a guitar store in > Santa > >Monica with a small stage in the back room that only seats about 150 > people > >tops... > From ???@??? Sat Feb 21 00:54:27 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 20 15:18:38 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y61iE-000752-00; Fri, 20 Feb 1998 15:18:34 -0800 From: Texture444@aol.com Message-ID: <7d55acd4.34ee0d24@aol.com> Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 18:09:22 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: torn concerts Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 84 Resent-Message-ID: <"xeDflB.A.CAG.43g70"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3500 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 15:18:34 -0800 X-UIDL: 062f579e8b1af4c100a8593339c35029 yeah: true: some concerts, like this: 3/1/98- solo, @ McCabe's, santa monica cal 3/7/98- solo, @ ???? (i forgotted the venue name!, via stars' end/WXPN), philadelphia pa 3/13/98- guitar oblique trio (w/vernon reid, elliott sharp & me), @ the knitting factory nyc also: 4/98, i'll be playing 5 concerts in japan & 5 concerts on the usa's eastern seaboard w/B.L.U.E. (bill bruford, tony levin, chris botti et moi). maybe seeya! best, dt From ???@??? Sat Feb 21 00:54:28 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 20 15:28:14 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y61rY-0000Tl-00; Fri, 20 Feb 1998 15:28:12 -0800 Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 15:21:31 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: lowfrqcy@west.net (Ryan Blum) Subject: RE: Torn (fwd) Resent-Message-ID: <"C27fBB.A.yDH.ZAh70"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3501 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 15:28:12 -0800 X-UIDL: 5dacaefdc221ef59b6bfb4a38cd320dc woah there...could someone please post some more info, or email me directions to the place? this is amazing...this concert is within my reach! Ryan (who is very excited that mr torn and fripp/belew/gunn are playing near my town in the next month....) -- "Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds." -Albert Einstein From ???@??? Sat Feb 21 00:54:29 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 20 15:38:55 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y621k-0001kw-00; Fri, 20 Feb 1998 15:38:44 -0800 Message-Id: <2.2.32.19980220232756.00945db4@pop.chromatic.com> X-Sender: kflint@pop.chromatic.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 2.2 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 15:27:56 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Kim Flint Subject: Re: torn concerts Cc: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Resent-Message-ID: <"qOwKnC.A.hg.pGh70"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3502 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 15:38:44 -0800 X-UIDL: 7ed455fdff11f45c1581108259c23b1e Hey David, when are you coming back to San Francisco? People actually like adventurous music here.... kim At 06:09 PM 2/20/98 EST, Texture444@aol.com wrote: >yeah: true: some concerts, like this: > >3/1/98- solo, @ McCabe's, santa monica cal >3/7/98- solo, @ ???? (i forgotted the venue name!, via stars' end/WXPN), >philadelphia pa >3/13/98- guitar oblique trio (w/vernon reid, elliott sharp & me), @ the >knitting factory nyc > >also: >4/98, i'll be playing 5 concerts in japan & 5 concerts on the usa's eastern >seaboard w/B.L.U.E. (bill bruford, tony levin, chris botti et moi). > >maybe seeya! >best, >dt > > > ________________________________________________________ Kim Flint 408-752-9284 Mpact System Engineering kflint@chromatic.com Chromatic Research http://www.chromatic.com From ???@??? Sat Feb 21 00:54:29 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 20 15:47:08 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y629l-0002oA-00; Fri, 20 Feb 1998 15:47:01 -0800 Message-ID: <2148EC143F29D1118BE000805FC13CD01E1FA7@migarexch01.maritz.com> From: "Liebig, Steuart A." To: "'Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com'" Subject: RE: Torn (fwd) Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 17:35:04 -0600 X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) Resent-Message-ID: <"o0eQ1C.A.cKB.OMh70"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3503 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 15:47:01 -0800 X-UIDL: 6eaff708e058433ea5200fa421d34ca2 Sure Interstate 10 West, past the Interstate 405 interchange, to the Centinela off ramp. Make a right at the bottom of the ramp, go to Pico Blvd., make a right. McCabe's will be on your right about 1 mile or so down the road. I think that it's across the street from a Der Wienerschitzel. So there you go, fine cuisine just across the street as well as good music. > ---------- > From: lowfrqcy@west.net > Reply To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com > Sent: Friday, February 20, 1998 3:28 PM > To: LiebigSA@maritz.com > Subject: RE: Torn (fwd) > > woah there...could someone please post some more info, or email me > directions to the place? this is amazing...this concert is within my > reach! > > Ryan (who is very excited that mr torn and fripp/belew/gunn are > playing > near my town in the next month....) > > -- > "Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition > from mediocre minds." -Albert Einstein > > > From ???@??? Sat Feb 21 00:54:37 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 20 15:57:10 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y62JX-000459-00; Fri, 20 Feb 1998 15:57:07 -0800 Date: Sat, 21 Feb 1998 08:44:23 +0900 (JST) Message-Id: X-Mailer: Macintosh Eudora Pro Version 2.1.3-J Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-2022-JP" To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: cave@pop1.osk.3web.ne.jp (Sunao Inami) Subject: Re: torn concerts Resent-Message-ID: <"S4TUzD.A.KaC.GWh70"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3505 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 15:57:07 -0800 X-UIDL: de01a0672942eee1e80c0b7b3fb4d4b4 Hi, I got a Osaka show's ticket!! I can not waiting April!! Regards Sunao Inami E-mail cave@osk.3web.ne.jp URL"cave home" http://www.threeweb.ad.jp/~cave/ tel&fax "CAVE Studio" +81 6 370 8562 Osaka,Japan At 18:09 98.2.20, Texture444@aol.com wrote: > yeah: true: some concerts, like this: > > 3/1/98- solo, @ McCabe's, santa monica cal > 3/7/98- solo, @ ???? (i forgotted the venue name!, via stars' end/WXPN), > philadelphia pa > 3/13/98- guitar oblique trio (w/vernon reid, elliott sharp & me), @ the > knitting factory nyc > > also: > 4/98, i'll be playing 5 concerts in japan & 5 concerts on the usa's eastern > seaboard w/B.L.U.E. (bill bruford, tony levin, chris botti et moi). > > maybe seeya! > best, > dt From ???@??? Sat Feb 21 00:54:39 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 20 16:14:07 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y62Zl-00062m-00; Fri, 20 Feb 1998 16:13:53 -0800 Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19980220160459.00acd7c0@global.california.com> X-Sender: sechevar@global.california.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 16:04:59 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Sean Echevarria Subject: Re: torn concerts In-Reply-To: <2.2.32.19980220232756.00945db4@pop.chromatic.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"HOw-_C.A.x7E.5qh70"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3506 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 16:13:53 -0800 X-UIDL: 68c065bf92a5c83ff6bee90ee24d4a2c coming back? when (was he)/(were you) last here? At 03:27 PM 2/20/98 -0800, Kim wrote: >Hey David, > >when are you coming back to San Francisco? People actually like adventurous >music here.... > >kim > From ???@??? Sat Feb 21 00:54:56 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 20 16:40:32 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y62zT-0001Bv-00; Fri, 20 Feb 1998 16:40:27 -0800 Message-Id: <2.2.32.19980221003206.00967b08@pop.chromatic.com> X-Sender: kflint@pop.chromatic.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 2.2 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 16:32:06 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Kim Flint Subject: Re: torn concerts Cc: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Resent-Message-ID: <"b5ekUD.A.HP.xCi70"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3507 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 16:40:27 -0800 X-UIDL: f961095dbc5ae8ed2a0c179a1f657600 Maybe 3 years ago? opening for Trilok Gurtu. (who has also expressed interest in looping, although I don't know that he's taken the plunge. He was actively manipulating effects on his percussion stuff during that show. Loopin' the subcontinent, I'm ready....) Pretty good show as I recall, although I remember thinking that a multiply button would have made it better....;-) kim At 04:04 PM 2/20/98 -0800, Sean Echevarria wrote: >coming back? when (was he)/(were you) last here? > > >At 03:27 PM 2/20/98 -0800, Kim wrote: >>Hey David, >> >>when are you coming back to San Francisco? People actually like adventurous >>music here.... >> >>kim >> > > > > ________________________________________________________ Kim Flint 408-752-9284 Mpact System Engineering kflint@chromatic.com Chromatic Research http://www.chromatic.com From ???@??? Sat Feb 21 00:54:58 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 20 16:56:55 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y63FI-0003FY-00; Fri, 20 Feb 1998 16:56:48 -0800 From: PMimlitsch@aol.com Message-ID: <6695ccfe.34ee20f4@aol.com> Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 19:33:51 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: torn concerts Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 85 Resent-Message-ID: <"gR9NJC.A.FGC.jRi70"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3510 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 16:56:48 -0800 X-UIDL: 35b1d4efae159046b1ff9ca7f46721f3 In a message dated 2/20/98 6:17:38 PM, dt wrote: <<3/7/98- solo, @ ???? (i forgotted the venue name!, via stars' end/WXPN), philadelphia pa>> Houston Hall, University of Pa. Check out <> for complete details. - Paul From ???@??? Sat Feb 21 00:54:57 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 20 16:44:27 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y633H-0001gn-00; Fri, 20 Feb 1998 16:44:23 -0800 From: Paolo Valladolid Message-Id: <199802210033.QAA14848@waynesworld.ucsd.edu> Subject: Re: torn concerts To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 16:33:57 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: <2.2.32.19980220232756.00945db4@pop.chromatic.com> from "Kim Flint" at Feb 20, 98 03:27:56 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"BaE6RB.A.Bc.bEi70"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3508 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 16:44:23 -0800 X-UIDL: e823579ab0c9dcadec0ad13e40f61e42 Thanks DT for the response! Any idea what time the performance will begin for the 3/1 show at McCabe's? I've been wanting to meet LDers (DT, Ryan, Stuart, Andre, etc.) so I'm looking forward to it! Cheers, Paolo Valladolid --------------------------------------------------------------- |Moderator of Digital Guitar Digest, an Internet mailing list |\ |for Music Technology and Stringed Instruments | \ ---------------------------------------------------------------- | \ finger pvallado@waynesworld.ucsd.edu for more info \ | \ http://waynesworld.ucsd.edu/DigitalGuitar/home.html \| ----------------------------------------------------------------- From ???@??? Sat Feb 21 00:54:57 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 20 16:56:15 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y63Ei-0003B0-00; Fri, 20 Feb 1998 16:56:12 -0800 Message-Id: <199802210042.QAA16833@sonic.sonic.com> Subject: Re:Trilok Gurtu and additive loops Date: Fri, 20 Feb 98 16:50:09 -0800 x-sender: andy_wolpert@pop.sonic.com x-mailer: Claris Emailer 2.0, March 15, 1997 From: Andy Wolpert To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Resent-Message-ID: <"ktBbjD.A.N7B.SQi70"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3509 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 16:56:12 -0800 X-UIDL: 1fd85f36896370183bb5956de05b1365 Speaking Trilok Gurtu, of it seems that most of the looping technology is gear towards multiplicative rhythms, like 3 against 4 for while Gurtu and others often do additive rhythms like 3+4. I suppose this could be done using succesive loops of different (but metrically related lengths) Has any one tried this? Would the version EDP version 5.0 loop copy help? __ _/\_ / \___/ \______ \ Andy Wolpert \__ | Sonic Solutions \ / awolpert@sonic.com / | (415) 893-8043 / \___ __ ___/ \__/ \_____/ From ???@??? Sat Feb 21 00:55:08 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 20 17:52:01 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y646a-00016P-00; Fri, 20 Feb 1998 17:51:52 -0800 From: PMimlitsch@aol.com Message-ID: <62992cf3.34ee3210@aol.com> Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 20:46:54 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: torn concerts Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 85 Resent-Message-ID: <"P06pp.A.im.UJj70"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3511 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 17:51:52 -0800 X-UIDL: 654ca54b33545cb5388704caaebb33da In a message dated 2/20/98 6:17:38 PM, dt wrote: <<3/7/98- solo, @ ???? (i forgotted the venue name!, via stars' end/WXPN), philadelphia pa>> Houston Hall, University of Pa. Check out <> for complete details. - Paul From ???@??? Sat Feb 21 00:55:11 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 20 18:46:24 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y64xL-0005sS-00; Fri, 20 Feb 1998 18:46:23 -0800 Message-ID: <34EE334A.6FC4@earthlink.net> Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 18:52:10 -0700 From: Scott Archambault Reply-To: metaphor@earthlink.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.0 (Macintosh; U; 68K) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: New looping equipment References: <27712835.34edb866@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"J3y-HC.A.JKF.x8j70"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3514 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 18:46:23 -0800 X-UIDL: ff1e33e48096b1df80d1d81f61a7969f Fmplautus@aol.com wrote: > > Hi Greg: > > How much loop time would the old MPX-1 do? > > Best, > The LoOpdOctOrs The mpx-1 has two seconds of looping time. Greg: Will there will be an upgrade path from the mpx-1 to the mpx-g2...? mpx-1 owners want to know.... Thanks, Scott From ???@??? Sat Feb 21 00:55:12 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 20 19:05:47 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y65G4-0007Rs-00; Fri, 20 Feb 1998 19:05:44 -0800 Message-ID: <34EE37FF.509F@earthlink.net> Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 19:12:15 -0700 From: Scott Archambault Reply-To: metaphor@earthlink.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.0 (Macintosh; U; 68K) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Lexicon MPX-G2? References: <215C1D5A0FFDD011B3CC00805FC18C29238B54@NTSRV2> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"D59gg.A.jtG.lPk70"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3515 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 19:05:44 -0800 X-UIDL: 13f5c29941657e28b974d36829f7aabd Hogan, Greg (Exchange) wrote: > > I am not aware of any dedicated looper being developed here. Our MPX G2 will allow you to create 1 loop of up to 20 seconds in mono or up to 10 seconds in stereo audio. Greg, Will there be an upgrade path from the MPX-1 to the MPX-G2? Thanks, Scott From ???@??? Sat Feb 21 00:55:09 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 20 18:25:03 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y64ca-0003tl-00; Fri, 20 Feb 1998 18:24:56 -0800 Message-Id: <2.2.32.19980221022131.006f574c@pop.chromatic.com> X-Sender: kflint@pop.chromatic.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 2.2 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 18:21:31 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Kim Flint Subject: RE: New looping equipment Resent-Message-ID: <"apxw3D.A.nYD.Rpj70"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3512 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 18:24:56 -0800 X-UIDL: 6bd3a72f1674ff493202ba6b3f553bdc Somebody at the NAMM Lexicon booth was "leaking rumors" about new looping devices from Lexicon. Quite a few people mentioned that to me while I was at the show. I think it must have been some over-zealous sales rep, because when I talked with other Lex folks about it I basically heard what Greg says here. As I understood from Bob and from fiddling with the unit in the booth, the loop thing in the MPX isn't related to the JamMan and is just a very simple loop implementation. kim At 09:55 AM 2/20/98 -0700, Mark Landman wrote: >Greg- > >Is there an algorithm (or interface) set up specifically for loop capture >and such? Any of the Jamman design make it into this version of the MPX? >With 20 seconds of memory it seems a shame if it's just configured as a >straight delay lineÉ > >Mark > >>Dear Antti, >> >>I am not aware of any dedicated looper being developed here. Our MPX G2 >>will allow you to create 1 loop of up to 20 seconds in mono or up to 10 >>seconds in stereo audio. >> >>Please let me know if you have any questions or if there is anything >>that I can do for you. >> >>Best regards, >> >>Greg Hogan >>Lexicon Customer Service >>Phone +781-280-0372 >>FAX +781-280-0499 >> > > > > > > ________________________________________________________ Kim Flint 408-752-9284 Mpact System Engineering kflint@chromatic.com Chromatic Research http://www.chromatic.com From ???@??? Sat Feb 21 00:55:10 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 20 18:36:50 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y64o3-0004ym-00; Fri, 20 Feb 1998 18:36:47 -0800 Message-ID: <34EE3E92.14B4@earthlink.net> Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 18:40:18 -0800 From: Andre LaFosse Reply-To: altruist@earthlink.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01-C-MACOS8 (Macintosh; I; 68K) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: loopers-delight@annihilist.com Subject: Torn and Tom Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Resent-Message-ID: <"bvsG1C.A.VUE.5zj70"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3513 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 18:36:47 -0800 X-UIDL: ba38e6fc270562fefcc53288a849408d Hi -- Re: David Torn concert in Santa Monica on Sunday, March 1 -- I just got off the phone with McCabe's. The number to call there for ticket ordering is (310) 828-4497. My ticket was $18.00 (which included a $3.00 phone handling fee). The show starts at 7:00 PM; doors open at 6:30. SeatingÊis first-come, first-served. I'd be happy to meet with anybody from the list at the show (look for a diminutive guy with a goatee and a pseudo-afro hairdo;) and for those interested, I can say with about 99.999% certainty that Torn's fellow CMP expatriate and frequent collaborator Miroslav Tadic will be in attendance there. Re: Tom's departure from Oberheim -- Tom, you've left some mighty big shoes to fill. I've got to thank you for having been so helpful to myself and others during your tenure, and for having gotten Oberheim onto an infinitely better track than it had been on before your time there. I deeply regret that we got off to a shaky start (for which I assume the vast majority of the blame) at the outset of your time there, and I can definitely say that all of your efforts have given me an extremely high level of confidence in the company. I just hope that Oberheim is able to stay theÊcourse you've set for it. Do drop in from time to time, and let us know what's up. Best, --Andre From ???@??? Sat Feb 21 00:55:16 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 20 21:06:18 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y678i-0006u0-00; Fri, 20 Feb 1998 21:06:16 -0800 From: Marzzz@aol.com Message-ID: <6f064cc.34ee5feb@aol.com> Date: Sat, 21 Feb 1998 00:02:33 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: bending necks Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 82 Resent-Message-ID: <"-XGvFC.A.OOG.vAm70"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3516 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 21:06:16 -0800 X-UIDL: dd2fda9d6d3f9b5eefd42f59816d380c In a message dated 2/19/98 11:18:55 AM, Jonathon wrote: >I just realized that this must be absolutely the only list where >one can find people debating the merits of bending a Steinberger >or Klein neck. Not that I've any idea of the significance of such >debate... > >Personally, I would never bend the neck on my Klein. It's got no >truss rod and just a few screws keeping it in place. Not to mention that this list seems to be the single greatest aggregation of Klein Electric Guitar owners in the universe! What is it with Kleins and Looping anyway? Is it all DT's fault? Should we all go out and buy Rivera Amps next (BIG GRIN!)? Has anyone tried jacking up their car with their Steinberger GL? Marshall (who doesn't play a Marshall, just a Mesa Boogie....) From ???@??? Sat Feb 21 00:55:20 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 20 21:54:44 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y67tb-0001qS-00; Fri, 20 Feb 1998 21:54:43 -0800 Message-Id: <2.2.32.19980221055152.00d7cf4c@pop.chromatic.com> X-Sender: kflint@pop.chromatic.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 2.2 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 21:51:52 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Kim Flint Subject: Re: bending necks Cc: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Resent-Message-ID: <"ae_iKD.A.VhB.dum70"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3517 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 21:54:43 -0800 X-UIDL: d5ba7bf2f63845ef6ea27860496e65b2 At 12:02 AM 2/21/98 EST, Marzzz@aol.com wrote: > >In a message dated 2/19/98 11:18:55 AM, Jonathon wrote: > >>I just realized that this must be absolutely the only list where >>one can find people debating the merits of bending a Steinberger >>or Klein neck. Not that I've any idea of the significance of such >>debate... >> >>Personally, I would never bend the neck on my Klein. It's got no >>truss rod and just a few screws keeping it in place. > >Not to mention that this list seems to be the single greatest aggregation of >Klein Electric Guitar owners in the universe! What is it with Kleins and >Looping anyway? Is it all DT's fault? nah, probably has a lot more to do with musicians who aren't too tied down by traditions and willing to try new things. Seems that with Kleins the funny look of it scares a lot of folks off. ("ah, wat da hell is that there, ma? Don' look nuttin' lahk my tele.") If you can get past that and actually play one, it takes about 3 seconds to decide you need to own one....In fact, I don't even think the decision is conscious. Your body gets so happy that it can finally play an instrument that isn't causing injuries that it just orders it for you. I'm still not sure what happened. The guitar was in my hands, I played a minor9 chord, my mouth said something like "gotta have it," Lorenzo held up an order form and a pen, my hands grabbed it and filled it out. I was merely a witness, with no control over my limbs. I was then filled with an overwhelming feeling, no an order really, that I must come up with several thousand dollars. It was somehow implicit that resisting that order would have very grave consequences....very weird actually.... >Has anyone tried jacking up their car with their Steinberger GL? No, but old peavey amp heads make good jack stands. Better than cinder blocks! Real cinder blocks get better tone, though. kim ________________________________________________________ Kim Flint 408-752-9284 Mpact System Engineering kflint@chromatic.com Chromatic Research http://www.chromatic.com From ???@??? Sat Feb 21 15:45:35 1998 >From kflint Sat Feb 21 09:55:14 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y6J8r-0002zU-00; Sat, 21 Feb 1998 09:55:13 -0800 Message-Id: <3.0.2.16.19980221060719.2fcfc5c4@texas.net> X-Sender: sharkey@texas.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.2 (16) Date: Sat, 21 Feb 1998 06:07:19 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: james rhodes Subject: Re: 3rd CD PROJECT (Still Accepting Submissions) In-Reply-To: <4ce945dd.34ef089c@aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"2wgFc.A.vjC.qRx70"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3522 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sat, 21 Feb 1998 09:55:13 -0800 X-UIDL: 0af31f163a1bc92d046526d10b285f3e sorry if i missed it,,,but could you repost a snail mail to send submissions thanks, james(a day late,dollar short) rhodes At 12:02 PM 2/21/98 EST, you wrote: >The 3rd CD project WEB page is up now. > >The project is open first to tape sumissions. >>From there, DAT and other media will be accepted. > > >Loopers Delight 3rd CD Project > > >Thanks and happy looping. > > > From ???@??? Sat Feb 21 15:45:25 1998 >From kflint Sat Feb 21 07:40:19 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y6H2F-00044A-00; Sat, 21 Feb 1998 07:40:15 -0800 From: Texture444@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Sat, 21 Feb 1998 10:36:56 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Re: torn concerts Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 84 Resent-Message-ID: <"9NZJfB.A.LoD.hTv70"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3518 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sat, 21 Feb 1998 07:40:15 -0800 X-UIDL: eb06668ae34977147052a553b1c8f41e oh yeah, well: i haven't been in san francisco for about a year: home of Peet's: & kim! dt From ???@??? Sat Feb 21 15:45:26 1998 >From kflint Sat Feb 21 07:43:52 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y6H5j-0004UA-00; Sat, 21 Feb 1998 07:43:51 -0800 From: Texture444@aol.com Message-ID: <8b95cf7e.34eef562@aol.com> Date: Sat, 21 Feb 1998 10:40:16 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Re: torn concerts Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 84 Resent-Message-ID: <"Uw9szB.A.A_D.pWv70"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3519 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sat, 21 Feb 1998 07:43:51 -0800 X-UIDL: 699b040bdbe130780a124500c9cc94ce >Any idea what time the performance will >begin for the 3/1 show at McCabe's? um, uh..... i don't know! (early, i hope!) dumbly, dt From ???@??? Sat Feb 21 15:45:30 1998 >From kflint Sat Feb 21 08:27:04 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y6HlW-0006KS-00; Sat, 21 Feb 1998 08:27:02 -0800 Message-ID: <009501bd3ee5$741c8160$63f0ffd0@default> From: "future perfect" To: Subject: Re: So Long Loopers Date: Sat, 21 Feb 1998 11:26:23 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Resent-Message-ID: <"OykdPB.A.WtF.H_v70"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3520 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sat, 21 Feb 1998 08:27:02 -0800 X-UIDL: db418faa6fff028f0e0e3c60924ab1d2 Tom is a huge reason why I deceided on the 'Plex. If company reps were only as attentive as he...ah, the possibilities.... Good luck, my friend.. Dave Eichenberger ********************************************************************* 'Future Perfect' - progressive art music - visit our website at: http://www.geocities.com/SoHo/Lofts/8082 From ???@??? Sat Feb 21 15:45:32 1998 >From kflint Sat Feb 21 09:06:04 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y6INF-0000Us-00; Sat, 21 Feb 1998 09:06:01 -0800 From: ANET@aol.com Message-ID: <4ce945dd.34ef089c@aol.com> Date: Sat, 21 Feb 1998 12:02:18 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: 3rd CD PROJECT (Still Accepting Submissions) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 18 Resent-Message-ID: <"OxZfqC.A.7M.ejw70"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3521 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sat, 21 Feb 1998 09:06:01 -0800 X-UIDL: fdb2ce297d97e90ecbbb6ef832dd5935 The 3rd CD project WEB page is up now. The project is open first to tape sumissions. >From there, DAT and other media will be accepted. Loopers Delight 3rd CD Project Thanks and happy looping. From ???@??? Sat Feb 21 15:45:34 1998 >From kflint Sat Feb 21 09:16:41 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y6IXZ-00015o-00; Sat, 21 Feb 1998 09:16:41 -0800 X-From_:ANET@aol.com Sat Feb 21 09:16:39 1998 Received: from weasel.slip.net (falcon.slip.net) [207.171.193.21] by ferret.slip.net with smtp (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y6IXW-00015U-00; Sat, 21 Feb 1998 09:16:38 -0800 Received: from (imo15.mx.aol.com) [198.81.17.37] by falcon.slip.net with esmtp (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y6IS2-0006e4-00; Sat, 21 Feb 1998 09:10:58 -0800 Received: from ANET@aol.com by imo15.mx.aol.com (IMOv12/Dec1997) id HKKIa05740 for ; Sat, 21 Feb 1998 12:15:35 -0500 (EST) From: ANET@aol.com Message-ID: <5020a958.34ef0bb9@aol.com> Old-Date: Sat, 21 Feb 1998 12:15:35 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: 3rd CD PROJECT (The correct link) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 18 X-Diagnostic: undecipherable, help sent X-Envelope-To: Loopers-Delight Sender: SmartList Date: Sat, 21 Feb 1998 09:16:41 -0800 X-UIDL: 917799a94a13cdf9fd56f4acd843c986 Loopers Delight 3rd CD Project From ???@??? Sat Feb 21 16:26:38 1998 >From kflint Sat Feb 21 15:58:36 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y6OoT-00014O-00; Sat, 21 Feb 1998 15:58:33 -0800 Message-ID: <34EF2488.210B@nyfac.com> Date: Sat, 21 Feb 1998 19:01:28 +0000 From: tbajus Reply-To: nyfac2@nyfac.com X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (WinNT; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Kleins and Riveras References: <6f064cc.34ee5feb@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"AVXdYD.A.At.sl270"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3528 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sat, 21 Feb 1998 15:58:33 -0800 X-UIDL: d4c02489bbc0b5a0773c6fbceaff11e2 Marzzz@aol.com wrote: > > Not to mention that this list seems to be the single greatest aggregation of > Klein Electric Guitar owners in the universe! What is it with Kleins and > Looping anyway? Is it all DT's fault? Should we all go out and buy Rivera Amps > next (BIG GRIN!)? Funny you should mention it- when I bought a new amp last year, it was a fight betweem a Mesa Maverick and a Rivera 1x12 combo. I wound up getting the Mesa, which, mind you, I love, but as I drag that 75lb monster 2x12, I think of the R112, one speaker, small housing, weighs like, five ounces. Perfect for the old cab ride. Sigh. I hear that MESA is offering a hot air balloon as an option on the new line... You know, it is odd, but I have noticed, IMHO, that there is certainly a law of diminishing returns on guitars. While I can lust (and I do, believe me) over a $2000.00 amp, I just don't get that excited over really well made guitars. I'm the redneck that Kim was makin' fun of- I like that durn tele-machine of mine. I guess the case in point for me is the aforementioned PRS, so nicely replaced by Bonnie and the good folks over at PRS. My CE-b was the best feeling, intellegently designed, comfortable guitar I have ever played. It stayed in tune, the string sound and volume were really well balanced (hate those g-strings that jump out at you when you play 'em). You could hear every note in every chord, purple, distorted, whatever. The thing had no life, what-so-ever. I got rid of it because it was sitting around lonely, because I was playing this piece of crap '63ish beltsanded jaguar that won't stay in tune, has an action four inches off the fretboard to avoid fretting out when you bend. The strings pop out of the saddles when you play too hard (which for me is always). Damn thing's got more voodoo than you can shake a stick at. Oh well. My tele's not so bad either. I have no problem dropping a coupla G's on a Matchless or a couple of old deluxes though. Trev From ???@??? Sat Feb 21 15:45:41 1998 >From kflint Sat Feb 21 11:39:37 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y6Klr-0000Pm-00; Sat, 21 Feb 1998 11:39:35 -0800 From: Dpcoffin@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Sat, 21 Feb 1998 14:35:54 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Looping?...Wha...?? Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 84 Resent-Message-ID: <"XozS7.A.6J.izy70"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3523 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sat, 21 Feb 1998 11:39:35 -0800 X-UIDL: 894a03605442781eb4e7ba0d183c4ccd Say, fellows...I just realized, with this intermittent talk of "WHAT IS LOOPING?", that I'm hardly ever looping phrases these days (which is my not- thinking-much-about-it personal definition of looping, I suppose). Instead, I'm layering mega-processed guitar and VG-8 with high-feedback, modulated delays, controlling levels and fx parameters with pedals and by switching outputs on and off. Certainly there's repeated elements, but it's mostly an evolving/decaying wall-of-sound textural thing. Of course it matters not one jot, but is there any amongst us that would quibble that this IS NOT LOOPING? I mostly ask because of looper's delight compilation efforts, but 'tis a modestly intriguing query on its own, I suggest...? dpc From ???@??? Sat Feb 21 15:45:42 1998 >From kflint Sat Feb 21 12:03:38 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y6L95-0001rl-00; Sat, 21 Feb 1998 12:03:35 -0800 From: ANET@aol.com Message-ID: <8d90c5cf.34ef3236@aol.com> Date: Sat, 21 Feb 1998 14:59:48 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: 3rd CD PROJECT (Submission address) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 18 Resent-Message-ID: <"Ntpr8C.A.FfB.2Jz70"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3524 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sat, 21 Feb 1998 12:03:35 -0800 X-UIDL: 15650dcae99567d43f5bcc2683dc7051 Send submissions to: JOHN PETERS 15 9th AVE. NW. Kasson, Minnesota 55944 From ???@??? Sat Feb 21 15:45:43 1998 >From kflint Sat Feb 21 12:12:25 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y6LHZ-0002Xl-00; Sat, 21 Feb 1998 12:12:21 -0800 From: ANET@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Sat, 21 Feb 1998 15:08:06 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Try again, the correct link Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 18 Resent-Message-ID: <"d4lvoC.A.iIC.GSz70"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3525 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sat, 21 Feb 1998 12:12:21 -0800 X-UIDL: 6b821059a8677c2c5139f72e3963d37d The correct link to the 3rd CD project is: Loopers Delight 3rd CD Project From ???@??? Sat Feb 21 15:45:49 1998 >From kflint Sat Feb 21 14:15:35 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y6NCn-0002yT-00; Sat, 21 Feb 1998 14:15:33 -0800 From: PMimlitsch@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Sat, 21 Feb 1998 17:11:52 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Looping?...Wha...?? Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 85 Resent-Message-ID: <"E1vjU.A.ijC.tF170"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3526 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sat, 21 Feb 1998 14:15:33 -0800 X-UIDL: 06677058e16ba8ee7cabdb4c10958dbc In a message dated 2/21/98 2:38:46 PM, you wrote: << Of course it matters not one jot, but is there any amongst us that would quibble that this IS NOT LOOPING?>> Sounds like a form of looping to me. I first got interested in the concept of looping back in the sixties listening to Hendrix playing/manipulating sustained feedback. Obviously no "looper" machine involved but still ... - Paul From ???@??? Sat Feb 21 15:45:50 1998 >From kflint Sat Feb 21 14:24:21 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y6NLH-0003Z3-00; Sat, 21 Feb 1998 14:24:19 -0800 From: TritoneDW@aol.com Message-ID: <337b1a78.34ef533f@aol.com> Date: Sat, 21 Feb 1998 17:20:45 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Guitars for sale Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 49 Resent-Message-ID: <"fRvVpB.A.3ID.-N170"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3527 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sat, 21 Feb 1998 14:24:19 -0800 X-UIDL: a1d56f04eace473c66ccfa746eb284c0 I figure this is legit, since we've established that only guitarists are interested in looping :-) For Sale: 1: Tom Anderson American Classic, a strat-style electric, swamp ash body, translucent emerald green (looks kinda like malachite), solid maple neck, two stacked 'buckers and one side-by-side. "Switcheroo" switching system (3 3way toggles [single/parallel, off, series], 1 "blower switch" [turns on bridge pickup in series]). Traditional whammy bar, Grover locking tuners. This is a great guitar, extremely flexible tone options. Perfect for the musical schizophrenic. Asking $1100. Comes with hard shell case. 2: Taylor 410 acoustic, grand concert style. EMG saddle transducer. Nice, balanced tone, great for fingerstyle playing. Asking $600. I hate to sell these, but I just bought a Parker Fly, and now I have to pay for it. If you're interested, please contact Drew Wheeler at TritoneDW@aol.com. If I've offended anyone with my crass commercialism, please accept my deepest, most groveling apologies. Still trying to come up with clever taglines, Drew From ???@??? Sat Feb 21 16:26:43 1998 >From kflint Sat Feb 21 16:04:13 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y6Ott-0001lN-00; Sat, 21 Feb 1998 16:04:09 -0800 Date: Sat, 21 Feb 1998 18:57:28 -0500 From: R & T Cummings Subject: Guitars for sale Sender: R & T Cummings To: "INTERNET:Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com" Message-ID: <199802211857_MC2-342D-1C7C@compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Disposition: inline Resent-Message-ID: <"KhY9iB.A.iBB.2o270"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3529 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sat, 21 Feb 1998 16:04:09 -0800 X-UIDL: b69c17aa7e58d9150811e198df0d9c21 Drew wrote: >I figure this is legit, since we've established that only guitarists are interested in looping :-)< I hope you're wearing a fire-proof outfit ... ;-) Rob From ???@??? Sat Feb 21 16:26:46 1998 >From kflint Sat Feb 21 16:09:40 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y6OzB-0002Rz-00; Sat, 21 Feb 1998 16:09:37 -0800 X-Sender: kflint@pop.slip.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sat, 21 Feb 1998 16:03:54 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Kim Flint Subject: Re: Re: torn concerts Resent-Message-ID: <"uabBAC.A.AqB.5t270"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3530 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sat, 21 Feb 1998 16:09:37 -0800 X-UIDL: f0e018e74207b3384c5709398bdb4581 >oh yeah, well: >i haven't been in san francisco for about a year: >home of Peet's: >& kim! >dt I personally think that Peets is the single most important reason to be in the SF Bay Area. i'm pretty sure that I rank pretty far down the list, but heck, happy to place..... Now to be precise, Berkeley is the home of Peets, and kim's is in Oaktown, baby....and both of those places top SF in my personal estimation..... kim ______________________________________________________________________ Kim Flint | Looper's Delight kflint@annihilist.com | http://www.annihilist.com/loop/loop.html http://www.annihilist.com/ | Loopers-Delight-request@annihilist.com From ???@??? Sat Feb 21 17:18:29 1998 >From kflint Sat Feb 21 17:04:59 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y6Pqh-0001de-00; Sat, 21 Feb 1998 17:04:55 -0800 From: Texture444@aol.com Message-ID: <26bb243.34ef7849@aol.com> Date: Sat, 21 Feb 1998 19:58:47 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Re: Re: torn concerts Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 84 Resent-Message-ID: <"iGFjGB.A.Y9.Ki370"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3531 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sat, 21 Feb 1998 17:04:55 -0800 X-UIDL: 63bace19b117048927be25bb0b4c5e2a kf, >I personally think that Peets is the single most important reason to be in >the SF Bay Area. please forgive my soon-to-be-obvious-obsession: peet's has been overnight-mailing wholebean major dickason's blend to me, for more years than i care to remember: deep stuff. right up! best, dt From ???@??? Sun Feb 22 12:33:26 1998 >From kflint Sat Feb 21 17:28:50 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y6QDj-0004be-00; Sat, 21 Feb 1998 17:28:43 -0800 X-Sender: kflint@pop.slip.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <26bb243.34ef7849@aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sat, 21 Feb 1998 17:23:25 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Kim Flint Subject: Re: Re: Re: torn concerts Resent-Message-ID: <"J6DbzD.A.atD.X4370"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3532 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sat, 21 Feb 1998 17:28:43 -0800 X-UIDL: 5346ccba57a9d48fd6b7a39f729f2345 >kf, > >>I personally think that Peets is the single most important reason to be in >>the SF Bay Area. > >please forgive my soon-to-be-obvious-obsession: >peet's has been overnight-mailing wholebean major dickason's blend to me, for >more years than i care to remember: deep stuff. >right up! >best, >dt ya gotta give the aged sumatra a go. smashing stuff....done up in the ol' push pot each morning...keeps the addiction well satisfied.....and uh, great for looping! kim ______________________________________________________________________ Kim Flint | Looper's Delight kflint@annihilist.com | http://www.annihilist.com/loop/loop.html http://www.annihilist.com/ | Loopers-Delight-request@annihilist.com From ???@??? Sun Feb 22 12:33:28 1998 >From kflint Sat Feb 21 17:33:10 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y6QHu-00058D-00; Sat, 21 Feb 1998 17:33:02 -0800 Date: Sat, 21 Feb 1998 17:26:18 -0800 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <8b95cf7e.34eef562@aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Chris Chovit Subject: Re: Re: torn concerts Resent-Message-ID: <"lXI6wC.A.dBE.z6370"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3533 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sat, 21 Feb 1998 17:33:02 -0800 X-UIDL: 6fc9d19d62e2e1099e97e4b400ac5e71 >>Any idea what time the performance will >>begin for the 3/1 show at McCabe's? According to the guy at McCabe's, the show starts at 7 PM, will last 1 hour & 30-40 minutes, and costs $15. You can order tickets via credit card directly from McCabe's @ 310-828-4497 (or go there in person). Just got my tickets! Strangely, I've never heard any of his work, so am looking forward to being introduced to the live version! Any other local "loop gatherings" coming up in the LA area? Cheers, chris From ???@??? Sun Feb 22 12:33:36 1998 >From kflint Sat Feb 21 19:42:19 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y6SIx-0005Jv-00; Sat, 21 Feb 1998 19:42:15 -0800 Message-ID: Priority: Normal X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 To: "Loopers-Delight" MIME-Version: 1.0 From: "Chris Darrow" Subject: A "Save the Spaulding" movement Date: Sat, 21 Feb 98 21:36:48 PST Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252"; X-MAPIextension=".TXT" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"uJ9qK.A.UiE.p2570"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3534 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sat, 21 Feb 1998 19:42:15 -0800 X-UIDL: 6c5b91230172220480989947f7a65bc0 Woah, get too buisy to check you mail and... Anyway, my first thought is this: Given the sheir volume of mail I get, if even half of the folkes on this list e-mailed Gibson directly with our professionaly stated regrets that Mr. "Now that I saw Oberheim through the mystical pit of darkness, foolishness, and timelessness 'my tenior is up'" Spaulding has left the building, it would have SOME reprocussion. I for one will surf the net for the appropriate address as soon as I'm done with this post. (I just hope that the timelessness and foolishness was not his doing, otherwise, I'll feel like an idiot. But I'm definatly giving him the benifit of the doubt. Tom, if you out there, we'd love to here the whole story... if now would be imprudent, suprize us in a month or so. Good luck. Thanks.) ___________________________________ chris sound@inav.net "He who dies with the most toys wins!" From ???@??? Sun Feb 22 12:33:42 1998 >From kflint Sat Feb 21 22:34:31 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y6Uza-0001xi-00; Sat, 21 Feb 1998 22:34:26 -0800 Message-ID: <34EFC7B4.376F@earthlink.net> Date: Sat, 21 Feb 1998 22:37:41 -0800 From: Andre LaFosse Reply-To: altruist@earthlink.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01-C-MACOS8 (Macintosh; I; 68K) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: loopers-delight@annihilist.com Subject: You people are gonna LOVE this... Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"8Ub3N.A.8cB.bY870"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3535 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sat, 21 Feb 1998 22:34:26 -0800 X-UIDL: 9bfbe79cb66328ca7e5f2a70e8e0a7c1 Just saw the following quote in the current _Guitar_ magazine cover story with Joe Satriani, regarding Fripp's presence on the G3 tour: ****************************************************************** "When you sit down and you really let yourself in and you open your heart to Robert's performance, I guarantee it puts your spirit through a cathartic experience. It's a music that draws things out of you that would never come out listening to any other kind of music... What he is doing on his guitar and with his gear is something that needs to be covered in detail because it's something that nobody else is doing." ****************************************************************** Some post-script to our latest Fripp-a-thon from last week, huh? --Andre From ???@??? Sun Feb 22 12:33:55 1998 >From kflint Sat Feb 21 23:30:15 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y6VrX-0000bJ-00; Sat, 21 Feb 1998 23:30:11 -0800 Message-Id: <2.2.32.19980222072437.009e24e4@artist-shop.com> X-Sender: artshop@artist-shop.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 2.2 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sun, 22 Feb 1998 02:24:37 -0500 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Gary Davis Subject: IRC Chat Resent-Message-ID: <"1MoznD.A.KUH.IM970"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3536 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sat, 21 Feb 1998 23:30:11 -0800 X-UIDL: c8c2522820d94c2a6b8e2e2857987cef Hello Friends: The Artist Shop is hosting an IRC chat today, Sunday February 22, at 4pm EST with Mark Griffin, author of the biography, Vangelis - The Unknown Man. Some of you may think it odd that I bring this up in this loopers forum. However, for the last 10 years Vangelis has made use of a very unique piece of electronic equipment called the Direct Box for looping, sequencing and who knows what else. I say it is unique because, in fact, there are only two like it in the whole world - one owned by Vangelis and the other by the inventor who created it to Vangelis' specifications. And it seems Vangelis paid quite a bit for it to stay exclusive to him. Anyway, Griffin is quite familiar with this piece of technology as he has interviewed the inventor at length and is also doing some work for the inventors own CD soon to be out and heavily featuring the Direct Box. So if any of you are curious about this bit of technology, you might stop by the chat. Details can be found at . Gary ************************************************************** Gary Davis The Artist Shop The Other Road http://www.artist-shop.com artshop@artist-shop.com phone: 330-929-2056 fax:330-945-4923 SUPPORT THE INDEPENDENT ARTIST!!! ************************************************************** Check out the latest Artist Shop newsletter at http://www.artist-shop.com/news.htm From ???@??? Sun Feb 22 12:33:57 1998 >From kflint Sat Feb 21 23:36:20 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y6VxS-0001YE-00; Sat, 21 Feb 1998 23:36:18 -0800 From: KJohn79484@aol.com Message-ID: <554a372e.34efd43e@aol.com> Date: Sun, 22 Feb 1998 02:31:08 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: FS: vortex Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 84 Resent-Message-ID: <"lcJtDC.A.q4.ES970"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3537 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sat, 21 Feb 1998 23:36:18 -0800 X-UIDL: 8d801f242f4f771e4f0528a846377e81 i'm selling my vortex and the roland footpedal i used with it. i am asking 250 for both. its all in great condition and includes all that came with it. thanks, kelly. From ???@??? Sun Feb 22 12:34:32 1998 >From kflint Sun Feb 22 11:30:16 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y6h6M-0004Yf-00; Sun, 22 Feb 1998 11:30:14 -0800 X-From_:dcarter@whidbey.com Sun Feb 22 11:30:12 1998 Received: from falcon (falcon.slip.net) [207.171.193.27] by ferret.slip.net with smtp (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y6h6J-0004Xu-00; Sun, 22 Feb 1998 11:30:11 -0800 Received: from (whidbey.whidbey.com) [204.94.52.2] by falcon.slip.net with esmtp (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y6h0k-0001Ue-00; Sun, 22 Feb 1998 11:24:26 -0800 Received: from carter (asn207.whidbey.com [204.94.52.207]) by whidbey.whidbey.com (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id LAA22321 for ; Sun, 22 Feb 1998 11:29:26 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <3.0.32.19980222113030.006be04c@whidbey.com> X-Sender: dcarter@whidbey.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0 (32) Old-Date: Sun, 22 Feb 1998 11:30:31 -0800 To: loopers-delight@annihilist.com From: The Carters Subject: DONT SEND ANY MORE E-MAIL Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-Diagnostic: undecipherable, help sent X-Envelope-To: Loopers-Delight Sender: SmartList Date: Sun, 22 Feb 1998 11:30:14 -0800 X-UIDL: cebb827624a9b737c8f8db3a8171c5e2 PLEASE UNSUBSCRIBE US FROM YOUR E-MAIL LIST THANK YOU VERY MUCH From ???@??? Sun Feb 22 16:46:04 1998 >From kflint Sun Feb 22 16:00:12 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y6lJZ-0006k7-00; Sun, 22 Feb 1998 16:00:09 -0800 Message-Id: <199802230001.RAA08728@hyper.dimensional.com> From: "Scott Bullerwell" To: Subject: Re: Origins... Date: Sun, 22 Feb 1998 16:53:57 -0700 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"Z2RCSD.A.H5F.7sL80"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3541 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sun, 22 Feb 1998 16:00:09 -0800 X-UIDL: 1a9e508f250b3a0f780572aa6ec4d639 Corynne writes: > I was fortunate enough to have had the opportunity to have met one other of > us on this list. During the time we talked, this person asked me a > question which I'd like to present to the rest of the list... I was asked: > > How do you begin your loop pieces? Since I didn't ask you this Corynne I've gotta assume two things: A. you've met at least two people on this list, and B. that you aren't particularly fortunate to have met me. Anyhow... here's how I begin my loop pieces: 1. Deep breath and hold it. 2. Stomp "Record" button. 3. Realize I haven't thought out what I want to play. 3a. Get a bit wild-eyed. 4. Fumble a few noises out of the instrument. 5. Swear. 6. Hit "End" button. Then I spend a few minutes pulling my head out of you-know-where and decide if I'm going to loop a little phrase like an ostinato, or if I'm gonna just start smearing freaky noises all over the place, layering it up like some demented gamelan, and make myself a loop (3 layers or more = "sludgescape." 2 layers or less = "soundpaper.") Having decided that, I start playing the ostinato or start making freaky noises and when the timing and phrasing and such is as good as it's gonna get, I click the "record" button and the "end" button at the appropriate places. Then I make a quality control decision: if I think I can work with it I start noodling over the top until I've got something I can live with, at which point I layer it on. If I can't work with it, I'll try one or all of the following loop-salvaging maneuvers: Slow the loop to half speed. Reverse the loop. Run the loop through the intelligent harmonizer and a few gallons of audio syrup via the Digitech Studio 400. Bury the loop in several layers of innocuous, abstract sound overdubs. Resample a short (2.8 sec) segment of the loop via the Studio 400 and use that for the loop while I fix the first one. If none of that works, I just kill the loop and start over. Sometimes I have grand designs for a loop: for example, I want to play something scalar with very specific phrasing during the loop, and then I want to develop a counterpoint and layer it on there such that the notes or chords in the second layer fall between the notes or chords in the first. In theory, I would get something that sounds like it was impossible (or at least heroic) to play. Ordinarily, however, it sounds like a couple of teenage boys on LSD with cheap electric guitars. And sometimes I get lucky. Didn't someone once suggest that musicians "trust the inexpressible benevolence of the creative impulse?" I forget who. Hmph. I think it was a guitar player, though. Probably nobody connected to looping. ;-) Scott Bullerwell tanelorn@dimensional.com Boulder, Colorado, USA From ???@??? Sun Feb 22 16:46:12 1998 >From kflint Sun Feb 22 16:23:35 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y6lgD-000153-00; Sun, 22 Feb 1998 16:23:33 -0800 Date: Sun, 22 Feb 1998 19:18:02 -0500 From: R & T Cummings Subject: Re:Trilok Gurtu and additive loops Sender: R & T Cummings To: "INTERNET:Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com" Message-ID: <199802221918_MC2-3448-1FF@compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Disposition: inline Resent-Message-ID: <"LFhT3D.A._n.GDM80"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3542 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sun, 22 Feb 1998 16:23:33 -0800 X-UIDL: 147dbb12865e75edc0cd4426673c36ec Andy Wolpert wrote: > Speaking Trilok Gurtu, of it seems that most of the looping technology is gear towards multiplicative rhythms, like 3 against 4 for while Gurtu and others often do additive rhythms like 3+4. I suppose this could be done using succesive loops of different (but metrically related lengths) Has any one tried this? Would the version EDP version 5.0 loop copy help?< I guess your question is referring to MIDI sync problems, isn't it? I'm a Jamman user, so the MIDI features I deal with are much more limited than the EDP, but I have made "additive rhythm" loops without MIDI sync for practicing Balkan/ Armenian grooves (7/8, 9/8, 10/8 11/8, 15/8 etc). But in these cases, nothing remarkable was involved, it was simply a matter of making a loop alone. Return questions: (1) What sorts of MIDI sync features are possible on the EDP when one wants to sync, for example, a 7/8 groove (3-2-2) created using the Multiply feature to a drum machine or another looper? I ask this because a friend of mine will be travelling to Austin for the SXSW and he's goning to buy an EDP there (I live in Germany and they aren't available here). (2) Which leads me to my second question: does the EDP have a power supply switch for European voltage/ frequency or is an additional trafo necessary? From ???@??? Sun Feb 22 16:46:14 1998 >From kflint Sun Feb 22 16:44:06 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y6m04-0002up-00; Sun, 22 Feb 1998 16:44:04 -0800 From: PMimlitsch@aol.com Message-ID: <5f50bfa4.34f0c521@aol.com> Date: Sun, 22 Feb 1998 19:38:51 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com, stickwire-l@netcom.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Torn in Phila. Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 85 Resent-Message-ID: <"YMjMF.A.fRC.JWM80"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3543 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sun, 22 Feb 1998 16:44:04 -0800 X-UIDL: 2f6293b743e9e98fdcada2d0b8598c64 Forward of post from Chuck VanZyle to WXPN members re: March 7th David Torn "Stars End Gathering" appearence: <> From ???@??? Sun Feb 22 17:49:18 1998 >From kflint Sun Feb 22 16:57:17 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y6mCn-00046U-00; Sun, 22 Feb 1998 16:57:13 -0800 From: PMimlitsch@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Sun, 22 Feb 1998 19:52:52 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com, stickwire-l@netcom.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: gig Content-type: text/plain X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 85 Resent-Message-ID: <"1euKCD.A.4hD.CjM80"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3544 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sun, 22 Feb 1998 16:57:13 -0800 X-UIDL: edfef21a23335bc03f991cac95cb1207 Thurs. Feb. 26th. 8:00pm Cafe Seattle, 140 Haddon Ave. (corner of Redman/Haddon), Haddonfield, N.J. (609)354-2220. "Explorations in Time and Space" - An evening of Soundscapes and Improvisations. Paul Mimlitsch (Chapman Stick¨/Loops) and J.Jody Janetta (Fretless Bass/Treated voice). From ???@??? Mon Feb 23 00:04:17 1998 >From kflint Sun Feb 22 22:07:44 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y6r3H-0007GB-00; Sun, 22 Feb 1998 22:07:43 -0800 From: Texture444@aol.com Message-ID: <51a1565b.34f11156@aol.com> Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 01:04:03 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Fwd: David Torn Concert Content-type: multipart/mixed; boundary="part0_888213844_boundary" X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 84 Resent-Message-ID: <"smVebC.A.7jG.ZGR80"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3546 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sun, 22 Feb 1998 22:07:43 -0800 X-UIDL: a8b8883c4f5b4d444de8a214e1617c25 Content-ID: <0_888213844@inet_out.mail.aol.com.1> Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII In a message dated 2/22/98 5:51:05 PM, chuckv@p3.net wrote: >MUSIC....CONCERT .... CALENDAR LISTING > >DAVID TORN TO PERFORM LIVE CONCERT AT STAR'S END GATHERING > >(Philadelphia, PA) Acclaimed Guitarist David Torn will perform a solo >concert of >"Aggressive Space Music" at the Star's End Gathering on Saturday, March >7th, 1998. > >Much in demand as a sideman, Torn has lent his snakey lead lines and >complex textures to recordings as diverse as K.D.Lang's "Smoke", Ryuichi >Sakamoto's new orchestral work "Dischord:Untitled 01", David Sylvian's >"Secrets of the Beehive", Jan Garbarek's "It's OK to Listen to the Gray >Voice" and the Grammy Award winning "Mark Isham". Isham, along with film >composers Carter Burwell, Graeme Revell, and Patrick O'Hearn have employed >Torn's unique soundscapes in many movie soundtracks, including "The Big >Lebowski", "Romeo is Bleeding", "Short Cuts" and "Reversal of Fortune". > >David Torn has recorded five solo albums: Best Laid Plans (ECM), Cloud >About Mercury (ECM), Door X (Windham Hill), Tripping Over God (CMP) and >What Means Solid Traveler? (CMP), which explore the terrain between rock, >jazz and mutated world music. In both 1994 and 1997 he was voted "Best >Experimental Guitarist" in Guitar Player magazine's Reader's Poll. The >Star's End Gathering performance will be his first in Philadelphia in over >ten years and will explore textures, soundscapes and atmospheres. He calls >it "aggressive space music...something you might expect to hear at an >illbient rave, rather than a guitar concert, although I will be playing >guitar." > >Part of WXPN's member month, and sponsored by Star's End, the station's >22-year-old radio program of space music, the concert will be held from >8:00pm-10:30pm in the University of Pennsylvania's Houston Hall Auditorium >at 3417 Spruce Street. Tickets at the door are $15 or $10 with a WXPN >MemberCard. For information, call 1-800-565-WXPN or (215) 573-3340. > >Concert Preview: The March 1st broadcast of Star's End will feature David >Torn's music and an interview recorded in New York City at the American >premier of Ryuichi Sakamoto's "Dischord:Untitled 01". > >Star's End can be heard every Saturday night/Sunday morning from >1:00am-6:00am on: 88.5fm WXPN Philadelphia; 88.1fm WXPH Harrisburg; 90.5fm >Worton/Baltimore; >and 104.9fm Allentown. > >Star's End Gatherings are live concerts featuring musicians from the >ambient, electronic and space music worlds. For more info: >http://www.starsend.org Return-Path: Received: from relay21.mail.aol.com (relay21.mail.aol.com [172.31.106.67]) by air08.mail.aol.com (v39.9) with SMTP; Sun, 22 Feb 1998 12:51:04 -0500 Received: from falcon.slip.net ([207.171.193.27]) by relay21.mail.aol.com (8.8.5/8.8.5/AOL-4.0.0) with SMTP id MAA01245 for ; Sun, 22 Feb 1998 12:51:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from ferret.slip.net [207.171.193.6] (mail) by falcon.slip.net with smtp (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y6fSn-0007Qo-00; Sun, 22 Feb 1998 09:45:17 -0800 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y6fYF-0007bH-00; Sun, 22 Feb 1998 09:50:55 -0800 X-Sender: chuckv@pop.p3.net (Unverified) Message-Id: Date: Sun, 22 Feb 1998 13:03:28 -0500 To: (Recipient list suppressed) From: chuckv@p3.net (Chuck van Zyl) Subject: David Torn Concert Resent-Message-ID: <"q3MN_B.A.fAH.3UG80"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3538 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: Texture444@aol.com Resent-Date: Sun, 22 Feb 1998 09:50:55 -0800 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit MUSIC....CONCERT .... CALENDAR LISTING DAVID TORN TO PERFORM LIVE CONCERT AT STAR'S END GATHERING (Philadelphia, PA) Acclaimed Guitarist David Torn will perform a solo concert of "Aggressive Space Music" at the Star's End Gathering on Saturday, March 7th, 1998. Much in demand as a sideman, Torn has lent his snakey lead lines and complex textures to recordings as diverse as K.D.Lang's "Smoke", Ryuichi Sakamoto's new orchestral work "Dischord:Untitled 01", David Sylvian's "Secrets of the Beehive", Jan Garbarek's "It's OK to Listen to the Gray Voice" and the Grammy Award winning "Mark Isham". Isham, along with film composers Carter Burwell, Graeme Revell, and Patrick O'Hearn have employed Torn's unique soundscapes in many movie soundtracks, including "The Big Lebowski", "Romeo is Bleeding", "Short Cuts" and "Reversal of Fortune". David Torn has recorded five solo albums: Best Laid Plans (ECM), Cloud About Mercury (ECM), Door X (Windham Hill), Tripping Over God (CMP) and What Means Solid Traveler? (CMP), which explore the terrain between rock, jazz and mutated world music. In both 1994 and 1997 he was voted "Best Experimental Guitarist" in Guitar Player magazine's Reader's Poll. The Star's End Gathering performance will be his first in Philadelphia in over ten years and will explore textures, soundscapes and atmospheres. He calls it "aggressive space music...something you might expect to hear at an illbient rave, rather than a guitar concert, although I will be playing guitar." Part of WXPN's member month, and sponsored by Star's End, the station's 22-year-old radio program of space music, the concert will be held from 8:00pm-10:30pm in the University of Pennsylvania's Houston Hall Auditorium at 3417 Spruce Street. Tickets at the door are $15 or $10 with a WXPN MemberCard. For information, call 1-800-565-WXPN or (215) 573-3340. Concert Preview: The March 1st broadcast of Star's End will feature David Torn's music and an interview recorded in New York City at the American premier of Ryuichi Sakamoto's "Dischord:Untitled 01". Star's End can be heard every Saturday night/Sunday morning from 1:00am-6:00am on: 88.5fm WXPN Philadelphia; 88.1fm WXPH Harrisburg; 90.5fm Worton/Baltimore; and 104.9fm Allentown. Star's End Gatherings are live concerts featuring musicians from the ambient, electronic and space music worlds. For more info: http://www.starsend.org From ???@??? Mon Feb 23 08:13:40 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 23 00:51:07 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y6tbN-00005r-00; Mon, 23 Feb 1998 00:51:05 -0800 Sender: camao@camsg001.camb.scee.sony.co.uk Message-ID: <34F137B1.51D0E9A4@scee.sony.co.uk> Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 08:47:45 +0000 From: Os X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (X11; I; IRIX 6.2 IP22) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com" Subject: New CD from Collective Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"_uEjMB.A.3KH.sfT80"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3547 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 00:51:05 -0800 X-UIDL: 7cfc8e260aafb92911ff16735460ad3a Hi. Excuse the self-promotion, but the JamMan involvement should justify it - We've just released a CD (8 tracks, 74 minutes) under the name Collective. Frippy guitar, improvised vocals, and eletronic beat weirdness. RealAudio, mpeg3 and ordering info at http://webworlds.net/os/collective/ cheers, -- Os os@millennium.co.uk http://webworlds.net/os/ From ???@??? Mon Feb 23 08:14:29 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 23 07:18:14 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y6ze1-0001gp-00; Mon, 23 Feb 1998 07:18:13 -0800 Message-Id: <98Feb23.101250est.18826@thicket.arbortext.com> Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 10:07:35 -0500 From: David White Reply-To: dwhite@arbortext.com Organization: Arbortext Inc. X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (WinNT; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Kleins and Riveras References: <6f064cc.34ee5feb@aol.com> <34EF2488.210B@nyfac.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"WFm6h.A.KLB.kJZ80"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3548 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 07:18:13 -0800 X-UIDL: 3d8aca88d2450de4619efb8944176475 I also have a PRS CE which is an excellent guitar. I regularly weird out on the thing pretty heavily and it stays in tune/balance. I've had it for 3+years i think and after the initial honeymoon, I've always kinda felt emptyness. It's never really inspired much in me. A lot of the time I select it over my powder blue resoncast Ibanez Talman because "I should." Glad to hear others have had the same experience. Maybe I'll stop thinking about it and just go for the love (and the talman.) d/-\\/e "no tag line, but I can spell my name with some non-letters as if carved in stone...wait... this is tag line isn't it." tbajus wrote: > Marzzz@aol.com wrote: > > > > Not to mention that this list seems to be the single greatest aggregation of > > Klein Electric Guitar owners in the universe! What is it with Kleins and > > Looping anyway? Is it all DT's fault? Should we all go out and buy Rivera Amps > > next (BIG GRIN!)? > > Funny you should mention it- when I bought a new amp last year, it was > a fight betweem a Mesa Maverick and a Rivera 1x12 combo. I wound up > getting the Mesa, which, mind you, I love, but as I drag that 75lb > monster 2x12, I think of the R112, one speaker, small housing, weighs > like, five ounces. Perfect for the old cab ride. Sigh. > > I hear that MESA is offering a hot air balloon as an option on the new > line... > > You know, it is odd, but I have noticed, IMHO, that there is certainly a > law of diminishing returns on guitars. While I can lust (and I do, > believe me) over a $2000.00 amp, I just don't get that excited over > really well made guitars. > > I'm the redneck that Kim was makin' fun of- I like that durn > tele-machine of mine. > > I guess the case in point for me is the aforementioned PRS, so nicely > replaced by Bonnie and the good folks over at PRS. My CE-b was the best > feeling, intellegently designed, comfortable guitar I have ever played. > It stayed in tune, the string sound and volume were really well balanced > (hate those g-strings that jump out at you when you play 'em). You > could hear every note in every chord, purple, distorted, whatever. > > The thing had no life, what-so-ever. I got rid of it because it was > sitting around lonely, because I was playing this piece of crap '63ish > beltsanded jaguar that won't stay in tune, has an action four inches off > the fretboard to avoid fretting out when you bend. The strings pop out > of the saddles when you play too hard (which for me is always). > > Damn thing's got more voodoo than you can shake a stick at. Oh well. > My tele's not so bad either. > > I have no problem dropping a coupla G's on a Matchless or a couple of > old deluxes though. > > Trev From ???@??? Mon Feb 23 08:14:30 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 23 07:24:02 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y6zjd-0002LO-00; Mon, 23 Feb 1998 07:24:01 -0800 From: Dpcoffin@aol.com Message-ID: <3a660fbb.34f19202@aol.com> Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 10:13:04 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Re: Origins... Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 84 Resent-Message-ID: <"mFpY4D.A.53B.oPZ80"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3549 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 07:24:01 -0800 X-UIDL: 813e198c1a902adc42ef96653c78da8c In a message dated 2/22/98 6:59:12 PM, Scott wrote: >...Ordinarily, however, it sounds like a couple of >teenage boys on LSD with cheap electric guitars. .... Somehow, this remark reminds me that Picasso reportedly once said that he spent a lifetime time trying to forget how to draw... i kn dig it! dpc From ???@??? Mon Feb 23 10:16:40 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 23 08:20:36 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y70cM-0007mu-00; Mon, 23 Feb 1998 08:20:34 -0800 Message-Id: <215C1D5A0FFDD011B3CC00805FC18C29238B65@NTSRV2> From: "Hogan, Greg (Exchange)" To: "'Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com'" Subject: RE: RE: New looping equipment Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 10:31:29 -0500 X-Priority: 3 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) Content-Type: text/plain Resent-Message-ID: <"NS0zlC.A.O3G.9Da80"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3551 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 08:20:34 -0800 X-UIDL: 6383478213faa01b93499abf131b33f7 > The LoOpdOctOrs asked:"How much loop time would the old MPX-1 do? > Survey says: 1 mono loop of up to 2 seconds or 1 stereo loop of up to 1 second or 2 1 second mono loops(1 on each side.). Please let me know if you have any questions or if there is anything that I can do for you. Best regards, Greg Hogan Lexicon Customer Service Phone +781-280-0372 FAX +781-280-0499 From ???@??? Mon Feb 23 14:41:08 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 23 12:35:32 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y74b1-0007Xu-00; Mon, 23 Feb 1998 12:35:27 -0800 Message-ID: <34F18E32.421A@nyfac.com> Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 15:37:13 +0000 From: tbajus Reply-To: nyfac2@nyfac.com X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (WinNT; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Jamman footpedals References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"1stgHD.A.ZoG.uyd80"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3567 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 12:35:27 -0800 X-UIDL: 7d819fb31a1393f31f9002a184de3ab9 I have a Ground Control footswitch I use on mine and it works fine. Can't say I have taken it out a whole lot. Trevor From ???@??? Mon Feb 23 08:14:37 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 23 08:02:26 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y70Km-0005zt-00; Mon, 23 Feb 1998 08:02:24 -0800 Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 07:58:09 -0800 (PST) From: Rik Elswit Message-Id: <199802231558.HAA15988@well.com> To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Re: Re: torn concerts Resent-Message-ID: <"0lOkl.A.mHF.eyZ80"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3550 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 08:02:24 -0800 X-UIDL: 9fef9bb60a445cb027dcdcea6ccc4ec9 I prefer Peet's Ethiopian Fancy. From ???@??? Mon Feb 23 14:41:45 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 23 13:28:56 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y75Qh-0006Qh-00; Mon, 23 Feb 1998 13:28:51 -0800 Message-Id: <215C1D5A0FFDD011B3CC00805FC18C29238B6C@NTSRV2> From: "Hogan, Greg (Exchange)" To: "'Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com'" Subject: RE: New looping equipment Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 11:29:12 -0500 X-Priority: 3 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) Content-Type: text/plain Resent-Message-ID: <"yOXkVB.A.WZF.fje80"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3571 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 13:28:51 -0800 X-UIDL: 8e1831c0a869882b951bd8dc4fa08a10 Dear Mark, Other than a program that will allow you to create a loop on the fly there are no plans for such features. Please let me know if you have any questions or if there is anything that I can do for you. Best regards, Greg > ---------- > From: landman@wco.com[SMTP:landman@wco.com] > Reply To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com > Sent: Friday, February 20, 1998 1:26 PM > To: GHogan@lexicon.com > Cc: ghogan@lexicon.com > Subject: RE: New looping equipment > > Greg- > > Is there an algorithm (or interface) set up specifically for loop > capture > and such? Any of the Jamman design make it into this version of the > MPX? > With 20 seconds of memory it seems a shame if it's just configured as > a > straight delay line? > > Mark > > >Dear Antti, > > > >I am not aware of any dedicated looper being developed here. Our MPX > G2 > >will allow you to create 1 loop of up to 20 seconds in mono or up to > 10 > >seconds in stereo audio. > > > >Please let me know if you have any questions or if there is anything > >that I can do for you. > > > >Best regards, > > > >Greg Hogan > >Lexicon Customer Service > >Phone +781-280-0372 > >FAX +781-280-0499 > > > > > > From ???@??? Mon Feb 23 10:16:43 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 23 08:45:19 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y7109-0002yi-00; Mon, 23 Feb 1998 08:45:09 -0800 From: Texture444@aol.com Message-ID: <131f89e7.34f1a531@aol.com> Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 11:34:55 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Re: Re: Re: torn concerts Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 84 Resent-Message-ID: <"CBb3kC.A.1CC.OZa80"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3552 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 08:45:09 -0800 X-UIDL: 8ea2f91a0701833df88a87f7c9dbcde7 >I prefer Peet's Ethiopian Fancy. i do understand! (and: talk to kim!) but: it's peet's unique *roasting* method that gives all of their coffees that especially addictive thang! best, dt From ???@??? Mon Feb 23 14:41:08 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 23 12:28:40 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y74UQ-0006fL-00; Mon, 23 Feb 1998 12:28:38 -0800 Message-Id: <3.0.2.16.19980223083848.20cf9c54@texas.net> X-Sender: sharkey@texas.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.2 (16) Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 08:38:48 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: james rhodes Subject: Jamman goes down...maybe slack memory chips? In-Reply-To: <4ae4eddf.34f1bcd1@aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"oh8OLB.A.xuF.2rd80"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3566 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 12:28:38 -0800 X-UIDL: 821359965b5b5039a0accc0e8786998d well no doubt these things only happen during ones best moments,,,my jamman did the stopping thing,,,after a memory upgrade,,,so i swapped out the memory,,,and so far so good (few months)...my problem SEEMS to have been MEMORY related...just speculation... i guess? james rhodes At 01:15 PM 2/23/98 EST, you wrote: >The LoOpDoctOrs are sad to report that they too have experienced frequent >footpedal weirdness interactions with said Jamman quarter inch. Ours grokked >just last Friday. > >What gives? > >Best, >the LoOpDoctOrs > > > From ???@??? Mon Feb 23 10:16:45 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 23 09:00:57 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y71FN-0004uj-00; Mon, 23 Feb 1998 09:00:53 -0800 From: ANET@aol.com Message-ID: <27054d2.34f1a9fc@aol.com> Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 11:55:22 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Cc: ghogan@lexicon.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Jamman goes down during live performance. Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 18 Resent-Message-ID: <"XynEKD.A.CME.5pa80"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3553 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 09:00:53 -0800 X-UIDL: bf824895921053091c43b54e2164905d Was playing live this weekend when during a beautiful loop, it stopped. Couldn't believe it so, I tried it again. Boom, just died during another interesting loop. Audience was cordial, acted as if nothing happened, meanwhile, I'm in a panic, trying to determine if it's the pedal, cord or jamman. Powered down the unit, checked all connections, reseated all plugs, powered up, same thing. Lesson 1) Potential disaster for anyone performing that relies too much on the unit for performance 2) Lexicon's foot pedal is bogus (period). I took it apart this summer after moisture (from the air) seem to affect it. This pedal is not rocket science, but to look at the design, one would think someone received a prize for the most complicated switch ever created to turn two signals on or off. Don't buy a Lexicon stereo foot switch. 3) Lexicon should be publically flogged for dropping the Jamman from it's product line. Maybe the support is still there, but to abandon a product in the way they did ensures that someone like me will never buy another product of theirs. Beware of buying Lexicon gear (they drop their product lines) 4) Echoplex, take note. For people that rely on a product, please continue the line. In this day and age of software there is no excuse for dead end product any longer. (Lexicon, what's up? Can't you come up with something?) 5) And finally, I recorded the complete show and will post the embassing parts so you all can get a good listen. Don't mean to get on a soapbox, but I do take good care of my gear and feel there is no excuse for a product that is a little over 2 years old. I am looking for two good stereo footswitches any suggestions? Regards; John Peters (Looper's Delight 3rd CD Project) From ???@??? Mon Feb 23 10:16:50 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 23 09:27:52 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y71fP-0007gk-00; Mon, 23 Feb 1998 09:27:47 -0800 From: ANET@aol.com Message-ID: <3383e7b2.34f1b04a@aol.com> Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 12:22:16 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: 3rd CD PROJECT PAGE UPDATE Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 18 Resent-Message-ID: <"zDPSTB.A.4tG.lCb80"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3554 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 09:27:47 -0800 X-UIDL: e1a15e88f8f4651eab7e4b08e429ac40 HREF="http://members.aol.com/anet/3rdcd.html"> 3rd CD Project has been updated! Regards; John Peters From ???@??? Mon Feb 23 10:16:50 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 23 09:34:58 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y71mJ-0000rx-00; Mon, 23 Feb 1998 09:34:55 -0800 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <27054d2.34f1a9fc@aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 12:28:07 -0500 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: David Myers Subject: Re: Jamman goes down during live performance. Resent-Message-ID: <"07bdpC.A.X.IHb80"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3555 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 09:34:55 -0800 X-UIDL: db04998e1028796d86263ab6c6e72fa6 I have also had this experience, but with the Echoplex. Fortunately it was not onstage, but I WAS twenty minutes into a pretty good recording. I didn't do anything strange to produce this, was just in the middle of an overdub when pow! the EDP simply reset on me. Anyone else see this? Only one such instance so far, but a bummer! >Was playing live this weekend when during a beautiful loop, it stopped. >Couldn't believe it so, I tried it again. Boom, just died during another >interesting loop. Audience was cordial, acted as if nothing happened, >meanwhile, I'm in a panic, trying to determine if it's the pedal, cord or >jamman. >John Peters >(Looper's Delight 3rd CD Project) From ???@??? Mon Feb 23 14:40:26 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 23 10:22:07 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y72Vx-0006Tv-00; Mon, 23 Feb 1998 10:22:05 -0800 From: Fmplautus@aol.com Message-ID: <3f5e60d1.34f1bc4c@aol.com> Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 13:13:30 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Music for aiports...redux Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 78 Resent-Message-ID: <"i9bpoB.A.AZF.P0b80"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3557 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 10:22:05 -0800 X-UIDL: 17f1c2d528ca8f6672a88448a8305a0f Hi Loopers: Did anybody hear the interview last week on National Public Radio with the musicians from Bang a Can -- we think that's there name. Anyway they have transcribed and are now performing Eno's 1978 MUSIC FROM AIRPORTS in real time with real humans. This was an absolutely fascinating interview replete with tracks from the Eno album and the new tracks with the "human loopers." Some of you will go flambonic when you here the transcribers describe Eno's looping and synthisizers as "inhuman" and "cold," but others, like the LoOpDoctOrs will go ecstatic when you hear the incredible and different (we won't say better) beauty of Eno's loops put inside the frail oral cavities of human beings and 18th and 19th century instruments. Also, it's just amazing how much passionate work these transcribers did to get this morphed into pure, homo-sapanic analogue! What a quirky, heart-felt, and cool thing. Also, there is a part there the transcriber talked about what ENO did to get a "climax" in one particular piece. We won't spoil the fun, but it's a fascinating trick and we would love to know from those hip to Eno's techniques what they think of the transcribers analysis of this piece. We bet you can get a download or tape of this interview from the NPR website. Check it out. If you can't, for the purely mad, the LoOpDoctOrs mite forward a copy of the interview (we taped it) if you send us a blank tape. But if we get forty thousand blank cassettes suddenly in the mail, we are renting a local warehouse and holding a vintage analogue/lovefest firesale. Best, the LoOpDoctOrs From ???@??? Mon Feb 23 14:40:30 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 23 10:26:18 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y72a0-00072H-00; Mon, 23 Feb 1998 10:26:16 -0800 From: Fmplautus@aol.com Message-ID: <4ae4eddf.34f1bcd1@aol.com> Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 13:15:43 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Jamman goes down during live performance. Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 78 Resent-Message-ID: <"IeFY1D.A.W2F.j3b80"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3558 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 10:26:16 -0800 X-UIDL: 5ab2eff59b001ba3427ae2e7e1a58aff The LoOpDoctOrs are sad to report that they too have experienced frequent footpedal weirdness interactions with said Jamman quarter inch. Ours grokked just last Friday. What gives? Best, the LoOpDoctOrs From ???@??? Mon Feb 23 14:40:37 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 23 10:38:46 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y72m2-0000pE-00; Mon, 23 Feb 1998 10:38:42 -0800 Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 13:32:14 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <199802231832.NAA00615@user1.channel1.com> X-Sender: seahorse@user1.channel1.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Frank Gerace Subject: San Francisco looping Resent-Message-ID: <"u6uId.A.wSH.7Cc80"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3559 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 10:38:42 -0800 X-UIDL: afdb8ea494ab1c7c463658b4f46fc1ae To all San Francisco loopers, Given all the talk of San Francisco (amonst the Torn concert sightings), I find my girlfriend and I will be in San Francisco this weekend, Feb 27-March 2. We're wondering if any loopworthy shows are going on in the bay area we could attend. Or for that matter, any other music of interest. Thanks in advance. Frank Gerace Dreamchild From ???@??? Mon Feb 23 14:40:43 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 23 10:58:30 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y735A-0003Fj-00; Mon, 23 Feb 1998 10:58:28 -0800 Message-Id: <199802231838.KAA11296@gw1.bi-tech.com> From: "Matt McCabe" To: Subject: Re: Music for aiports...redux Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 10:54:14 -0800 X-Msmail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1161 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"jF8KzB.A.tlC.uXc80"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3560 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 10:58:28 -0800 X-UIDL: 8f932e7808749841c4da56565342f554 > From: Fmplautus@aol.com > Did anybody hear the interview last week on National Public Radio with the > musicians from Bang a Can -- we think that's there name. Anyway they have > transcribed and are now performing Eno's 1978 MUSIC FROM AIRPORTS in real time > with real humans. Yes! I found it very interesting as well...particularly how he manipulated the loops in order to achieve a sort of climax. I've always respected Eno's work...but now that respect is ten-fold. It would have been a nice touch if they would have interviewed Eno and gotten his take on the human-makeover of his machine-based work. Alas! Matt From ???@??? Mon Feb 23 14:40:49 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 23 11:28:09 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y73Xp-0006XV-00; Mon, 23 Feb 1998 11:28:05 -0800 X-Sender: ejmd@pop.erols.com Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 14:30:43 -0500 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Ed Drake Subject: Fwd: jamman chips Resent-Message-ID: <"OWHSPD.A.eaF.txc80"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3561 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 11:28:05 -0800 X-UIDL: 40f7cf22b628fde84efbce68bf27736b I'm forwarding this email that I got the other day to the list. Ed >PEDALMAN at ANATOMY GUITARS >EMAIL = pedalman@pedalman.com >WEBSITE = http://www.pedalman.com >PHONE = (212) 802-7279 > >Hi Ed, maybe loopers would be happy to know through the jamman memory >upgrade section that we now >carry NEW jamman upgrade sets for $79 SHIPPED (in the US)! > >Thanks! > >http://www.pedalman.com >pedalman@pedalman.com > From ???@??? Mon Feb 23 14:41:04 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 23 12:02:31 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y7452-0003Rp-00; Mon, 23 Feb 1998 12:02:24 -0800 Message-Id: <3.0.2.32.19980223143431.006e50e4@dharma.mitre.org> X-Sender: seligman@dharma.mitre.org X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.2 (32) Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 14:34:31 -0500 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Len Seligman Subject: Re: Music for aiports...redux In-Reply-To: <3f5e60d1.34f1bc4c@aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"Reb2_.A.wFC.HPd80"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3564 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 12:02:24 -0800 X-UIDL: d176e9ba2f6c35f92f2d201ec0acde7f Yes!!! Great story on this new rendition of Music for Airports! It was on Feb. 19th's "All Things Considered." Unfortunately here's all that I could pull off www.npr.org: 'Music for Airports' -- All Things Considered host Linda Wertheimer talks with David Lang, Julia Wolfe and Michael Gordon, members of the New York music ensemble called Bang on a Can. The group takes important but not very well-known 20th century compositions and tours the nation performing them. They have chosen to recreate Brian Eno's 1978 landmark, proto-ambient recording called "Music for Airports." This item is unavailable due to copyright issues. I too laughed at an image of academic types listening to Eno with stopwatches and figuring how to notate it. Turns out I was all wrong. I listened to brief excerpts from the new rendition, complete with gorgeous acoustic sounds and a 12 person choir and loved what I heard. I'm gonna buy this CD. Here's some info I found on Bang on a Can from http://www.stagebill.com/Classical/features/featuresarchive/bang.html. They mention a concert that sounds very cool at Alice Tully Hall in New York City on May 19. -Len At 01:13 PM 2/23/98 EST, you wrote: >Hi Loopers: > >Did anybody hear the interview last week on National Public Radio with the >musicians from Bang a Can -- we think that's there name. Anyway they have >transcribed and are now performing Eno's 1978 MUSIC FROM AIRPORTS in real time >with real humans. > >This was an absolutely fascinating interview replete with tracks from the Eno >album and the new tracks with the "human loopers." > >Some of you will go flambonic when you here the transcribers describe Eno's >looping and synthisizers as "inhuman" and "cold," but others, like the >LoOpDoctOrs will go ecstatic when you hear the incredible and different (we >won't say better) beauty of Eno's loops put inside the frail oral cavities of >human beings and 18th and 19th century instruments. > >Also, it's just amazing how much passionate work these transcribers did to get >this morphed into pure, homo-sapanic analogue! What a quirky, heart-felt, and >cool thing. Also, there is a part there the transcriber talked about what ENO >did to get a "climax" in one particular piece. We won't spoil the fun, but >it's a fascinating trick and we would love to know from those hip to Eno's >techniques what they think of the transcribers analysis of this piece. > >We bet you can get a download or tape of this interview from the NPR website. >Check it out. If you can't, for the purely mad, the LoOpDoctOrs mite forward >a copy of the interview (we taped it) if you send us a blank tape. But if we >get forty thousand blank cassettes suddenly in the mail, we are renting a >local warehouse and holding a vintage analogue/lovefest firesale. > >Best, >the LoOpDoctOrs > > > From ???@??? Mon Feb 23 14:40:57 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 23 11:41:41 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y73kp-0000Wj-00; Mon, 23 Feb 1998 11:41:31 -0800 Message-ID: From: "Ott, John" To: "'Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com'" Subject: RE: Jamman goes down during live performance. Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 13:34:45 -0600 X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) Resent-Message-ID: <"3cOSEC.A.V9G.n9c80"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3562 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 11:41:31 -0800 X-UIDL: 1e2b9f93ec043876ecdab7faf6b1dbb7 I don't use the lexicon footswitch, (use a midi pedal) so I've not experienced that weirdness, but after a memory upgrade, I left a loop running and after a while it crashed. The display went to +18 and the music stopped. This happened several times immediately after the upgrade, but has since stopped. I'm wondering if it will be back ( at the least opportune time for sure) or was the problem just burn in of the new zips? > ---------- > From: Fmplautus@aol.com[SMTP:Fmplautus@aol.com] > Sent: Monday, February 23, 1998 1:23 PM > To: John_Ott@ATK.COM > Subject: Re: Jamman goes down during live performance. > > The LoOpDoctOrs are sad to report that they too have experienced > frequent > footpedal weirdness interactions with said Jamman quarter inch. Ours > grokked > just last Friday. > > What gives? > > Best, > the LoOpDoctOrs > From ???@??? Mon Feb 23 14:41:03 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 23 11:57:00 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y73zk-0002gJ-00; Mon, 23 Feb 1998 11:56:56 -0800 Message-Id: <199802231945.LAA24289@sonic.sonic.com> Subject: Re:EDP Questions, Additive rhythms Date: Mon, 23 Feb 98 11:52:42 -0800 x-sender: andy_wolpert@pop.sonic.com x-mailer: Claris Emailer 2.0, March 15, 1997 From: Andy Wolpert To: , Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Resent-Message-ID: <"IsEoRB.A.wiB.RLd80"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3563 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 11:56:56 -0800 X-UIDL: fe4856d462d2e2ac696bfde920ae61ac > (1) What sorts of MIDI sync features are possible on the EDP I will look into this, it should be possible to make a loop which is an unusual multiple of 8th notes. >(2) Wdoes the EDP have a power supply switch for European voltage Yes there is a switch on the back for that >> My question about additive is not as simple as a MIDI sync problem, although perhaps I >> could use an external clock as you question suggested. It migh also me solved using >> multiply by starting with a 1/8th loop and multiplying it 7 times for (3+4) __ _/\_ / \___/ \______ \ Andy Wolpert \__ | Sonic Solutions \ / awolpert@sonic.com / | (415) 893-8043 / \___ __ ___/ \__/ \_____/ From ???@??? Mon Feb 23 14:41:07 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 23 12:21:43 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y74Nf-0005jp-00; Mon, 23 Feb 1998 12:21:39 -0800 Mime-Version: 1.0 Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 12:06:55 -0800 Message-ID: <000952DF.----@wj.com> From: Mike.Biffle@wj.com (Mike Biffle) Subject: Re[2]: Jamman goes down during live performance. To: "'Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com'" , Mike.Biffle@wj.com, "Ott; John" Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Description: cc:Mail note part Resent-Message-ID: <"_jPgn.A.YiE.Jjd80"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3565 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 12:21:39 -0800 X-UIDL: f4911c81235d57ee32f3aa72f11f46f8 I've had problems with the polarity setting on the Roland 5SU (maybe not the right number, but it's their nice switch which dovetails together with other's of it's ilk to for a nice switch row. There are two types: Latched and Unlatched). If the polarity is in the wrong position the footswitch and controls don't function at all. The display acts strange and the unit definitely acts sick. This is also a problem with my Boss GX-700. (I'm going to mark my footswitches soon.) It hasn't been a big problem though. A reboot of the unit and a polarity reversal cures the problem. Hopefully your problem is as simple as that. Good Luck, -Miko >I don't use the lexicon footswitch, (use a midi pedal) so I've not >experienced that weirdness, but after a memory upgrade, I left a loop running >and after a while it crashed. The display went to +18 and the music >stopped. This happened several times immediately after the upgrade, but has >since stopped. I'm wondering if it will be back ( at the least opportune time >for sure) or was the problem just burn in of the new zips? >> ---------- >> From: Fmplautus@aol.com[SMTP:Fmplautus@aol.com] >> Sent: Monday, February 23, 1998 1:23 PM >> To: John_Ott@ATK.COM >> Subject: Re: Jamman goes down during live performance. >> >> The LoOpDoctOrs are sad to report that they too have experienced >> frequent footpedal weirdness interactions with said Jamman quarter inch. >>Ours grokked just last Friday. What gives? >> >> Best, >> the LoOpDoctOrs From ???@??? Mon Feb 23 14:41:38 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 23 12:52:06 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y74r2-0001x3-00; Mon, 23 Feb 1998 12:52:00 -0800 Message-Id: <2.2.32.19980223204223.00a7e56c@pop.chromatic.com> X-Sender: kflint@pop.chromatic.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 2.2 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 12:42:23 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Kim Flint Subject: Re:EDP Questions, Additive rhythms Resent-Message-ID: <"FtHIJB.A.vz.c-d80"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3568 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 12:52:00 -0800 X-UIDL: b79f220911e7ddecc885be8397615996 hey, sorry. meant to answer some of these questions but I've been much too busy....so hey, now that I'm at work, what better time? At 11:52 AM 2/23/98 -0800, Andy Wolpert wrote: > >> (1) What sorts of MIDI sync features are possible on the EDP > I will look into this, it should be possible to make a loop which is >an unusual multiple of 8th notes. Yes, you can get a wide variety of time signatures while syncing to midi clock. There is a parameter called "8ths/beat" (should have been called 8ths/cycle, but oh well...) which lets you set the number of eighth notes that the echoplex will use for midi sync purposes. So if you want 7/8, you would set this parameter to 7. Then when midi clock is coming in and you have the plex set to sync to external clocks, you will see the little sync LED flash every seven eighth notes. When you hit record, it waits for the next sync point and then starts recording. You can leave it recording as long as you like. When you press record again to end the recording, it will wait for the next sync point and stop recording automatically for you. So you will end up with some number of exact 7/8 measures, with the number of measures being up to you. The 8ths/beat param currently goes to 20, which should cover most time signatures. We'll probably increase this range someday, since a variety of weirdos think it's really important to be able to loop in 41/8 or whatever. :-) We left it at 20 since we figured that the vast majority would just find it irritating to scroll so far to get to 8. >>(2) Wdoes the EDP have a power supply switch for European voltage > Yes there is a switch on the back for that yep, internal supply, designed to handle all the worlds power systems. No evil WALL WARTS!!!! A switch in the back changes from 115V to 230v. The supply tolerates wide changes in voltage, so in the 115 setting it will work anywhere from about 90V to 140V. (x2 for the 220V case). So it's fine in the US, fine in Japan, fine in Europe, fine on screwed up stage power of your local looping dive. (if we all Just Say No to wall warts, we may someday end this horrible scourge. We must stand firm in this valiant fight against evil, otherwise we've only our own collective complicity to blame for our inevitable slide in a dark nightmare of powerstrips and frayed power connectors.....) >>> My question about additive is not as simple as a MIDI sync problem, >although perhaps I >>> could use an external clock as you question suggested. It migh also me >solved using >>> multiply by starting with a 1/8th loop and multiplying it 7 times for (3+4) That's a pretty good way to do this. Practice using the Record-Multiply combination, where you end record and go directly to multiply. That way you have a cycle length directly linked to the beat, and it is very easy to use multiply further to change time signatures again without falling out of tempo. So if you start with 7 multiplies to give you 7/8, you can hit multiply again and end sooner, say after five cycles to give 5/8. Or let it go longer to 18/8, or whatever suits you. This is very handy since the tempo is maintained by the original cycle time, but the time signature can be shifted fluidly with minimal effort. Similarly, you can use the loop copy functions to set up other loops related to the basic eighth note tempo defined in the first. So you might have 7/8 in loop 1, with 8th note cycle lengths, and do a "time copy" to loop two but let it run longer and get you to 11/8, or whatever. Hopefully that'll let you raga to your heart's content..... kim _______________________________________________________ Kim Flint 408-752-9284 Mpact Systems Engineering kflint@chromatic.com Chromatic Research http://www.chromatic.com From ???@??? Mon Feb 23 14:41:41 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 23 12:56:30 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y74vM-0002Xr-00; Mon, 23 Feb 1998 12:56:28 -0800 Mime-Version: 1.0 Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 12:45:51 -0800 Message-ID: <00095379.----@wj.com> From: Mike.Biffle@wj.com (Mike Biffle) Subject: Re: Jamman footpedals To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com, tbajus Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Description: cc:Mail note part Resent-Message-ID: <"vJdE9C.A.tqB.iEe80"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3569 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 12:56:28 -0800 X-UIDL: 99dc73af99d7a970a67145929e591395 I have a PMC-10 midi floor controller, but for real time tapping, it doesn't cut it. There is a slight lag. I've heard others describe tapping slightly early to compensate, but I'm not able to consistently do that. I use the Roland 5Su's. More stable than the Lexicon stereo foot switches, but more expensive as well. You need two for each stereo input on the JamMan. I use a stereo channel insert cable to attach each pair. -Miko >I have a Ground Control footswitch I use on mine and it works fine. >Can't say I have taken it out a whole lot. >Trevor From ???@??? Mon Feb 23 14:41:44 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 23 13:14:18 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y75Ca-0004dy-00; Mon, 23 Feb 1998 13:14:16 -0800 Message-Id: <2.2.32.19980223210739.00a16824@pop.chromatic.com> X-Sender: kflint@pop.chromatic.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 2.2 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 13:07:39 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Kim Flint Subject: Re: Jamman footpedals Resent-Message-ID: <"HZbgy.A.NvD.GWe80"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3570 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 13:14:16 -0800 X-UIDL: 9f86f94adca3be6054f2095b6a582bf7 Is that caused by midi delay in the jamman, or the footpedal? I've used the PMC-10 for my echoplex a bit, as well as other typical rack switching, and never had a delay problem. It's possible I didn't notice, since I mostly use the dedicated pedal for the plex, but if the PMC-10 caused a delay it must have been pretty small. And preset switches are very quick. Are you sure it's not misjudgement of the throw distance to the contact point of the pedal? That can throw you sometimes if you're not used to the pedal. kim At 12:45 PM 2/23/98 -0800, Mike Biffle wrote: >I have a PMC-10 midi floor controller, but for real time tapping, it doesn't cut >it. There is a slight lag. I've heard others describe tapping slightly early to >compensate, but I'm not able to consistently do that. > >I use the Roland 5Su's. More stable than the Lexicon stereo foot switches, but >more expensive as well. You need two for each stereo input on the JamMan. I use >a stereo channel insert cable to attach each pair. > >-Miko > >>I have a Ground Control footswitch I use on mine and it works fine. >>Can't say I have taken it out a whole lot. >>Trevor > > > > _______________________________________________________ Kim Flint 408-752-9284 Mpact Systems Engineering kflint@chromatic.com Chromatic Research http://www.chromatic.com From ???@??? Tue Feb 24 00:42:04 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 23 14:44:16 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y76ba-0007PM-00; Mon, 23 Feb 1998 14:44:10 -0800 Mime-Version: 1.0 Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 14:32:36 -0800 Message-ID: <00095500.----@wj.com> From: Mike.Biffle@wj.com (Mike Biffle) Subject: Re[2]: Jamman footpedals To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com, Mike.Biffle@wj.com, Kim Flint Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Description: cc:Mail note part Resent-Message-ID: <"yZXjYD.A.BhG.jrf80"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3572 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 14:44:10 -0800 X-UIDL: d3fa707343f1198ea201000c934c6f40 Kim Flint wrote... Is that caused by midi delay in the jamman, or the footpedal? I've used the PMC-10 for my echoplex a bit, as well as other typical rack switching, and never had a delay problem. It's possible I didn't notice, since I mostly use the dedicated pedal for the plex, but if the PMC-10 caused a delay it must have been pretty small. And preset switches are very quick. Are you sure it's not misjudgement of the throw distance to the contact point of the pedal? That can throw you sometimes if you're not used to the pedal. kim Well, I'm a little hesitant to take a hard poke at the ol' PMC-10 due to my concern that it might croak on me! That is possibly my main problem with the lag situation. I'm waaaay into my dedicated FS5U's though. (ah, finally I remember the correct number!) I can really mash those babies! I tried using the tap function for a good while though and it really felt different to me. At 12:45 PM 2/23/98 -0800, Mike Biffle wrote: >I have a PMC-10 midi floor controller, but for real time tapping, it doesn't cut >it. There is a slight lag. I've heard others describe tapping slightly early to >compensate, but I'm not able to consistently do that. > >I use the Roland 5Su's. More stable than the Lexicon stereo foot switches, but >more expensive as well. You need two for each stereo input on the JamMan. I use >a stereo channel insert cable to attach each pair. > >-Miko > >>I have a Ground Control footswitch I use on mine and it works fine. >>Can't say I have taken it out a whole lot. >>Trevor > > > > _______________________________________________________ Kim Flint 408-752-9284 Mpact Systems Engineering kflint@chromatic.com Chromatic Research http://www.chromatic.com From ???@??? Tue Feb 24 00:42:11 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 23 15:02:57 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y76te-0001hO-00; Mon, 23 Feb 1998 15:02:50 -0800 From: RA336@aol.com Message-ID: <775f9a85.34f1fd9f@aol.com> Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 17:51:18 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: looping in "pop" music Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 84 Resent-Message-ID: <"HCdPo.A.8HB.t8f80"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3573 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 15:02:50 -0800 X-UIDL: 3aefc62ef9e9b6614fde30c781a82b1c Hey loopers... did a buncha looping as well as more "normal" guitar stuff on the newly released self-titled cd by Noella Hutton on RadioActive Records. Produced by the Talking Head's Jerry Harrison, it also features performances by drummer Prairie Prince and the ubiquitous Joe Gore on his cool vintage- gone-mad guitar stuff. Nice, nice record by this amazing young singer from Ireland... worth checking out... cheers all! Robby Aceto From ???@??? Tue Feb 24 00:42:12 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 23 15:13:15 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y773d-00035g-00; Mon, 23 Feb 1998 15:13:09 -0800 From: PMimlitsch@aol.com Message-ID: <8d963640.34f20065@aol.com> Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 18:04:00 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Jamman goes down during live performance. Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 85 Resent-Message-ID: <"kAc09B.A.i-B.LDg80"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3574 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 15:13:09 -0800 X-UIDL: b5331aa7ecce38c5e075640b5507d281 In a message dated 2/23/98 11:59:49 AM, John Peters wrote: <> I had a similar problem once until I removed the Digitech 2101 tube preamp/processor from the rack. Turned out that the tube preamp was overheating the Jman causing it to shut down until it cooled down. No problems since and I know many people who gig on a regular basis w/Jmen in their racks that haven't had any problems. Also, I don't know why everybody whines about the Jman/Vortex pedals - I haven't had any problem with their application (maybe I've got wierd feet? :-) )or durability. - Paul From ???@??? Tue Feb 24 00:42:13 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 23 15:15:22 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y775j-0003O2-00; Mon, 23 Feb 1998 15:15:19 -0800 Message-ID: From: David Kirkdorffer To: "'loopers-delight@annihilist.com'" Subject: RE: You people are gonna LOVE this... The Horsemen of the Apocal ypse Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 18:06:20 -0500 X-Priority: 3 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) Content-Type: text/plain Resent-Message-ID: <"igEsaB.A.DLC.oEg80"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3575 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 15:15:19 -0800 X-UIDL: 012674e28dc42cfa88cff091b9b1093e Not to refute Joe Satriani's praise, but maybe some of us ambient loopers should contact Mr. Satriani and let him know how many of us folks are also "doing something nobody else is doing." Reminds me of some writing by Leacock. "I saw a solitary horseman coming over a hill in the distance. Then another solitary horseman, and then... another solitary horseman. Pretty soon I was surrounded by hundreds of solitary horsemen..." David Kirkdorffer -----Original Message----- From: Andre LaFosse [SMTP:altruist@earthlink.net] Sent: Sunday, February 22, 1998 1:38 AM To: loopers-delight@annihilist.com Subject: You people are gonna LOVE this... Just saw the following quote in the current _Guitar_ magazine cover story with Joe Satriani, regarding Fripp's presence on the G3 tour: ****************************************************************** "When you sit down and you really let yourself in and you open your heart to Robert's performance, I guarantee it puts your spirit through a cathartic experience. It's a music that draws things out of you that would never come out listening to any other kind of music... What he is doing on his guitar and with his gear is something that needs to be covered in detail because it's something that nobody else is doing." ****************************************************************** Some post-script to our latest Fripp-a-thon from last week, huh? --Andre From ???@??? Tue Feb 24 00:42:14 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 23 15:42:37 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y77W7-0006cv-00; Mon, 23 Feb 1998 15:42:35 -0800 Message-ID: From: David Kirkdorffer To: "'Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com'" Subject: RE: EDP goes down during live performance -- is this still happen ing w/ V.5 software? Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 18:18:04 -0500 X-Priority: 3 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) Content-Type: text/plain Resent-Message-ID: <"ELYzxB.A.dWF.Ufg80"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3577 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 15:42:35 -0800 X-UIDL: e512de9ba0c71b2ec298a0d5098f062d With the older version of the EDP software, the "much reported on these pages `thermal problem`" plagued the EDP with sudden silence if you used the undo button. Should I still worry about this if I have the new Upgrade software, but have not "cut the pin"? David Kirkdorffer -----Original Message----- From: David Myers [SMTP:dmgraph@bway.net] Sent: Monday, February 23, 1998 12:28 PM To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Jamman goes down during live performance. I have also had this experience, but with the Echoplex. Fortunately it was not onstage, but I WAS twenty minutes into a pretty good recording. I didn't do anything strange to produce this, was just in the middle of an overdub when pow! the EDP simply reset on me. Anyone else see this? Only one such instance so far, but a bummer! From ???@??? Tue Feb 24 00:42:14 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 23 15:37:06 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y77Qh-0005rx-00; Mon, 23 Feb 1998 15:36:59 -0800 From: Marzzz@aol.com Message-ID: <674b1712.34f205d3@aol.com> Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 18:26:52 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com, Texture444@aol.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: torn concerts Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 82 Resent-Message-ID: <"2GdHW.A.-3E.mbg80"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3576 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 15:36:59 -0800 X-UIDL: 7fcae25029c29f9606439e481aacc1c7 In a message dated 2/23/98 10:42:41 AM, dt wrote: >i do understand! (and: talk to kim!) >but: >it's peet's unique *roasting* method that gives all of their coffees that >especially addictive thang! Isn't your neighbor, Mr. Levin, also a coffee (espresso?) fanatic, and doesn't he get HIS closer to home? Surely you have traded notes on this subject (pun intended)? decaf, Marshall From ???@??? Tue Feb 24 00:42:16 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 23 15:55:20 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y77iM-0000Q5-00; Mon, 23 Feb 1998 15:55:14 -0800 From: PMimlitsch@aol.com Message-ID: <839dbe94.34f20a27@aol.com> Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 18:45:20 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Music for aiports...redux Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 85 Resent-Message-ID: <"dS-MqC.A.tIH.Gtg80"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3578 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 15:55:14 -0800 X-UIDL: 286b5dc0349f0b03fec626eb679a5b30 In a message dated 2/23/98 1:20:40 PM, you wrote: <> Well I didn't exactly "go flambonic", maybe just a tad hyper-tensioned, but it was a bit irritating everytime the host inferred that Eno's work was music made by machines. From ???@??? Tue Feb 24 00:42:34 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 23 17:03:45 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y78mb-0000cO-00; Mon, 23 Feb 1998 17:03:41 -0800 Message-ID: <34F20CFC.2D3B@earthling.net> Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 16:57:49 -0700 From: Art Simon X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.04 (Macintosh; U; PPC) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Where to buy echoplex foot control unit? Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"7ZAJWB.A.PTH.Oth80"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3582 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 17:03:41 -0800 X-UIDL: a2d16660bde11f63a71952f6edc0e560 Hi, Anybody know where I can buy an Oberheim Echoplex foot control unit? I purchased the echoplex from Manny's, but they don't seem to be able to get them anymore (see quote below). BTW, my compliments and kudos to the designers of such a wonderful instrument! -- -Art Simon http://home.earthlink.net/~simart/ > > > > Hi, > > > > I bought an Oberheim Echoplex from Manny's a couple of years ago. Is > > the Foot control unit (cat#OBEFC7 from Fall 1996 catalog) still > > available? Let me know the details and price. Thanks, > > -- > > -Art Simon http://home.earthlink.net/~simart/ > > > Art, > > Unfortunately, no is the answer to your question. I believe Gibson > guitars was in line to purchase the company when it filed for > Bankruptcy, but it seems we haven't heard of they have or not. I can > tell that we no longer sell the products. > Sorry we couldn't be of more help dude! > > Have a great day! > Ron@Manny's > From ???@??? Tue Feb 24 00:42:20 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 23 16:07:43 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y77uO-0001rD-00; Mon, 23 Feb 1998 16:07:40 -0800 Message-Id: <1.5.4.16.19980224001337.332f7fee@pop.usaor.net> X-Sender: gingkoba@pop.usaor.net X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (16) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 19:13:37 -0500 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: michael tamburo Subject: boomerang phrase sampler Resent-Message-ID: <"mxU2E.A.QTB.u5g80"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3579 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 16:07:40 -0800 X-UIDL: 3bc901a826b43da77cf2335d8e480207 hello everyone, i am new to the list so i am sorry if this has already been discussed. i have been thinking about purchasing a boomerang for sometime now. i have heard only good things about them. i was wondering if there is anything that i should be warned about before making my purchase. thank you, michael From ???@??? Tue Feb 24 00:42:26 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 23 16:21:42 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y787w-0003V6-00; Mon, 23 Feb 1998 16:21:40 -0800 Message-Id: <2.2.32.19980224001525.009e946c@pop.chromatic.com> X-Sender: kflint@pop.chromatic.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 2.2 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 16:15:25 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Kim Flint Subject: RE: EDP goes down during live performance -- is this still happening w/ V.5 software? Resent-Message-ID: <"g96owB.A.CwC.LGh80"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3580 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 16:21:40 -0800 X-UIDL: 649b7af8df95bea88a960d45ba793dd5 At 06:18 PM 2/23/98 -0500, David Kirkdorffer wrote: >With the older version of the EDP software, the "much reported on these >pages `thermal problem`" plagued the EDP with sudden silence if you used >the undo button. > >Should I still worry about this if I have the new Upgrade software, but >have not "cut the pin"? that has nothing to do with the software. Pure hardware issue....I'd highly advise the ol' pin cut manuever if you have an older unit and this hasn't been done yet. kim _______________________________________________________ Kim Flint 408-752-9284 Mpact Systems Engineering kflint@chromatic.com Chromatic Research http://www.chromatic.com From ???@??? Tue Feb 24 00:42:36 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 23 17:33:10 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y79F6-00049y-00; Mon, 23 Feb 1998 17:33:08 -0800 Message-ID: <34F21409.4095@earthling.net> Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 17:27:57 -0700 From: Art Simon X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.04 (Macintosh; U; PPC) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Where to buy echoplex foot control unit? References: <199802240105.RAA25917@well.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"4S7BeC.A.WbD.eJi80"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3585 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 17:33:08 -0800 X-UIDL: 71ffe6beef6fc6fc25747c0f4d1e7a29 Cool! I'm in SF--I can drive over this weekend. What are you asking for them, if I may ask? Rik Elswit wrote: > > I have Echoplex foot controllers for sale. Give me a call at Bananas at > Large. 415-457-7600 and ask for Rik. -- -Art Simon http://home.earthlink.net/~simart/ From ???@??? Tue Feb 24 00:42:28 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 23 16:55:27 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y78eX-0007Lb-00; Mon, 23 Feb 1998 16:55:21 -0800 Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 16:50:03 -0800 (PST) From: Rik Elswit Message-Id: <199802240050.QAA19348@well.com> To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: boomerang phrase sampler Resent-Message-ID: <"svh9fC.A.nPG.Glh80"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3581 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 16:55:21 -0800 X-UIDL: b931abd0afba81a51be045a7ca92f093 Michael Tamburo asks re the Boomerang< "i have heard only good things about them. i was wondering if there is anything that i should be warned about before making my purchase." It is easy to use, compact, well made, and sounds pretty good. It does NOT sample at the CD spec, so the tone is a bit dull, and it will only handle one loop at a time. It's a great electric guitar device, but if you play acoustic/electric, as I do, only an Echoplex will do. Rik From ???@??? Tue Feb 24 00:42:34 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 23 17:11:02 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y78tW-0001Zl-00; Mon, 23 Feb 1998 17:10:50 -0800 Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 17:05:49 -0800 (PST) From: Rik Elswit Message-Id: <199802240105.RAA25917@well.com> To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Where to buy echoplex foot control unit? Resent-Message-ID: <"Qgh8-D.A.V4.6zh80"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3583 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 17:10:50 -0800 X-UIDL: a4be3ce5d5a5c0bf6e0fa40f7b584f4d I have Echoplex foot controllers for sale. Give me a call at Bananas at Large. 415-457-7600 and ask for Rik. From ???@??? Tue Feb 24 00:42:36 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 23 17:27:14 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y799F-0003PO-00; Mon, 23 Feb 1998 17:27:05 -0800 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <2.2.32.19980224001525.009e946c@pop.chromatic.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 20:21:22 -0500 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: David Myers Subject: RE: EDP goes down during live performance -- is this still happening w/ V.5 software? Resent-Message-ID: <"6Vjf.A.pdC.PCi80"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3584 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 17:27:05 -0800 X-UIDL: 23084a08d230cd9de37dc3cc2be4a29f >At 06:18 PM 2/23/98 -0500, David Kirkdorffer wrote: >>With the older version of the EDP software, the "much reported on these >>pages `thermal problem`" plagued the EDP with sudden silence if you used >>the undo button. >> >>Should I still worry about this if I have the new Upgrade software, but >>have not "cut the pin"? > >that has nothing to do with the software. Pure hardware issue....I'd highly >advise the ol' pin cut manuever if you have an older unit and this hasn't >been done yet. > >kim Kim--what exactly is an "older unit", anyway? Do you have serial numbers or something? David Myers From ???@??? Tue Feb 24 00:42:38 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 23 17:45:29 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y79Qx-0005a0-00; Mon, 23 Feb 1998 17:45:23 -0800 Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 17:40:38 -0800 (PST) From: Rik Elswit Message-Id: <199802240140.RAA11833@well.com> To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Where to buy echoplex foot control unit? Resent-Message-ID: <"mYpQJB.A.ypE.fUi80"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3586 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 17:45:23 -0800 X-UIDL: 6a367da9c8a6f0061217ea09352ad3a1 Art, we're currently selling Foot Controllers for $119. From ???@??? Tue Feb 24 00:42:55 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 23 19:53:47 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y7BR9-0002up-00; Mon, 23 Feb 1998 19:53:43 -0800 Message-ID: <34F227FD.70DD@fredmarshall.com> Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 19:53:02 -0600 From: Fred Marshall Reply-To: fred@fredmarshall.com X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (Macintosh; I; PPC) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: bottled water & batteries ? Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"hSsvcB.A.QJC.INk80"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3593 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 19:53:43 -0800 X-UIDL: b329123a078afa46db847777998df09b - yo ! www.syzygyjob.com - rain, mud, and rock n roll ? m From ???@??? Tue Feb 24 00:42:39 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 23 18:00:50 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y79fs-0007Ox-00; Mon, 23 Feb 1998 18:00:48 -0800 Message-Id: <2.2.32.19980224015523.00a15134@pop.chromatic.com> X-Sender: kflint@pop.chromatic.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 2.2 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 17:55:23 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Kim Flint Subject: RE: EDP goes down during live performance -- is this still happening w/ V.5 software? Resent-Message-ID: <"YgurZD.A.uhG.5ji80"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3587 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 18:00:48 -0800 X-UIDL: 61236c3af82fe1ed050477e9d52613a5 At 08:21 PM 2/23/98 -0500, David Myers wrote: >>At 06:18 PM 2/23/98 -0500, David Kirkdorffer wrote: >>>With the older version of the EDP software, the "much reported on these >>>pages `thermal problem`" plagued the EDP with sudden silence if you used >>>the undo button. >>> >>>Should I still worry about this if I have the new Upgrade software, but >>>have not "cut the pin"? >> >>that has nothing to do with the software. Pure hardware issue....I'd highly >>advise the ol' pin cut manuever if you have an older unit and this hasn't >>been done yet. >> >>kim > >Kim--what exactly is an "older unit", anyway? Do you have serial numbers >or something? I do my best not to keep track of such things. If you really want to be certain if your's has been properly modified or not, pop the top off and take a look at the chip in question. There's a nice diagram on the Looper's Delight site on one of the echoplex pages that shows exactly where to look. (pin 5 of U12, an ADC0804) You can do the mod yourself, assuming you are reasonably able with electronics. You just need a decent tool to get in there and cut the pin off. (judging by your past electrical gear butchery, i'm sure you can manage! :-) ) Oh, that's a void the warranty do it at your own risk sorta thing, so if anything bad happens, don't look at me! I'm sure you can get Oberheim or some authorized service place to do it too, if that makes ya happy. As far as I know, this has been taken care of on new units at the factory for the past year and a half at least. But I really don't have any way to know about things like that for sure. kim _______________________________________________________ Kim Flint 408-752-9284 Mpact Systems Engineering kflint@chromatic.com Chromatic Research http://www.chromatic.com From ???@??? Tue Feb 24 00:42:40 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 23 18:15:14 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y79tl-0001LE-00; Mon, 23 Feb 1998 18:15:09 -0800 Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19980223200208.007dc690@wavefront.com> X-Sender: chuck.zwicky@wavefront.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 20:02:08 -0600 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Chuck Zwicky Subject: Re: Jamman footpedals In-Reply-To: <2.2.32.19980223210739.00a16824@pop.chromatic.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"OHhzs.A.rP.Mti80"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3588 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 18:15:09 -0800 X-UIDL: e50f40e80270021b2f6fe6e3df9501bf I use a Rolls 'MIDI Wizard' with my Jam-Man setup, which in it's default state does send 8 channels of controller data with each program change. This does cause some lag, but was easily corrected by de-assigning the controllers. I've experienced no oddness or switching delays since. Perhaps this is something to look for. -Chuck Zwicky At 01:07 PM 2/23/98 -0800, you wrote: >Is that caused by midi delay in the jamman, or the footpedal? I've used the >PMC-10 for my echoplex a bit, as well as other typical rack switching, and >never had a delay problem. It's possible I didn't notice, since I mostly use >the dedicated pedal for the plex, but if the PMC-10 caused a delay it must >have been pretty small. And preset switches are very quick. Are you sure >it's not misjudgement of the throw distance to the contact point of the >pedal? That can throw you sometimes if you're not used to the pedal. > >kim > > >At 12:45 PM 2/23/98 -0800, Mike Biffle wrote: >>I have a PMC-10 midi floor controller, but for real time tapping, it >doesn't cut >>it. There is a slight lag. I've heard others describe tapping slightly >early to >>compensate, but I'm not able to consistently do that. >> >>I use the Roland 5Su's. More stable than the Lexicon stereo foot switches, but >>more expensive as well. You need two for each stereo input on the JamMan. I >use >>a stereo channel insert cable to attach each pair. >> >>-Miko >> >>>I have a Ground Control footswitch I use on mine and it works fine. >>>Can't say I have taken it out a whole lot. >>>Trevor >> >> >> >> >_______________________________________________________ >Kim Flint 408-752-9284 >Mpact Systems Engineering kflint@chromatic.com >Chromatic Research http://www.chromatic.com > > > > From ???@??? Tue Feb 24 00:42:41 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 23 18:15:22 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y79tv-0001MZ-00; Mon, 23 Feb 1998 18:15:19 -0800 Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 18:07:23 -0800 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <199802240140.RAA11833@well.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Chris Chovit Subject: Re: Where to buy echoplex foot control unit? Resent-Message-ID: <"eYMz5D.A.AR.Uti80"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3589 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 18:15:19 -0800 X-UIDL: 786eb451c5d7e872e6756d4c3a8f4d2f >Art, we're currently selling Foot Controllers for $119. Wow! That's a lot for a metal chassis, 7 switches, 6 resistors, 1 jack, and a little paint. With all due respect to retailers: Consider "DIY" --> http://www.annihilist.com/loop/tools/echoplex/echopedals.html#custom -chris From ???@??? Tue Feb 24 00:42:43 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 23 18:25:12 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y7A3S-0002UO-00; Mon, 23 Feb 1998 18:25:10 -0800 Message-Id: <2.2.32.19980224021105.009e3f60@pop.chromatic.com> X-Sender: kflint@pop.chromatic.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 2.2 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 18:11:05 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com, Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Kim Flint Subject: Re: Where to buy echoplex foot control unit? Resent-Message-ID: <"kWQno.A.c8B.76i80"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3590 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 18:25:10 -0800 X-UIDL: 9e2a4926a3f8690950d4122fe8dd9196 At 04:57 PM 2/23/98 -0700, Art Simon wrote: >Hi, > >Anybody know where I can buy an Oberheim Echoplex foot control unit? I >purchased the echoplex from Manny's, but they don't seem to be able to >get them anymore (see quote below). BTW, my compliments and kudos to >the designers of such a wonderful instrument! thanks from all of us! Now, this is just too much: >> Art, >> >> Unfortunately, no is the answer to your question. I believe Gibson >> guitars was in line to purchase the company when it filed for >> Bankruptcy, but it seems we haven't heard of they have or not. I can >> tell that we no longer sell the products. >> Sorry we couldn't be of more help dude! >> >> Have a great day! >> Ron@Manny's Like, dude, do you totally think I could be any more outta touch with the industry I work in? Dude, like, it's so wild, that bad acid trip I took in like 1985 made all time stand still for me. It's like my world totally remains frozen in amber. It's gnarly man! rock on! sorry, kim (oberheim was bought out of bankruptcy by gibson about 10 years ago, for those without any particular reason to keep track of such things.....) _______________________________________________________ Kim Flint 408-752-9284 Mpact Systems Engineering kflint@chromatic.com Chromatic Research http://www.chromatic.com From ???@??? Tue Feb 24 00:42:51 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 23 18:59:56 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y7Ab4-0005KY-00; Mon, 23 Feb 1998 18:59:54 -0800 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: References: <199802240140.RAA11833@well.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 21:56:07 -0500 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: David Myers Subject: Re: Where to buy echoplex foot control unit? Resent-Message-ID: <"cf_M5.A.wjE.Bbj80"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3591 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 18:59:54 -0800 X-UIDL: 233e288b3430a23afa22292f10bd07f4 Absolutely! DIY forever! I've built several different controller layouts for myself--you can do it easy for about 20 bucks, which is mostly for switches. Check the Looper's web site for the details.... >>Art, we're currently selling Foot Controllers for $119. > >Wow! That's a lot for a metal chassis, 7 switches, 6 resistors, 1 jack, and >a little paint. > >With all due respect to retailers: Consider "DIY" --> > >http://www.annihilist.com/loop/tools/echoplex/echopedals.html#custom > > -chris From ???@??? Tue Feb 24 00:42:51 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 23 19:33:11 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y7B7F-0000Dc-00; Mon, 23 Feb 1998 19:33:09 -0800 Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 19:28:26 -0800 (PST) From: Rik Elswit Message-Id: <199802240328.TAA22318@well.com> To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Where to buy echoplex foot control unit? Resent-Message-ID: <"tTLuaC.A.z_G.p5j80"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3592 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 19:33:09 -0800 X-UIDL: d9130067e9090361822cd5c8fe31d616 ">Art, we're currently selling Foot Controllers for $119. Wow! That's a lot for a metal chassis, 7 switches, 6 resistors, 1 jack, and a little paint. With all due respect to retailers: Consider "DIY" --> Terrific, chris. Sounds to me like you could make some money building foot pedals. I'd love to see that happen, because I think Gibson could use some competition. Go fo it. Rik From ???@??? Mon Feb 23 10:16:54 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 23 10:10:37 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y72Ko-0004xc-00; Mon, 23 Feb 1998 10:10:34 -0800 Message-Id: <3.0.1.16.19980223194745.1d2f7db0@rank-serv.elec.gla.ac.uk> X-Sender: pycraft@rank-serv.elec.gla.ac.uk X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.1 (16) Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 19:47:45 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: "Michael P. Hughes, Ph.D." Subject: Re: Secrets of Fripp Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"xfiWWD.A.IEE.Jqb80"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3556 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 10:10:34 -0800 X-UIDL: e15c16fc4684f5a6d7bf031c68619f5e >>The point was that many of you are clearly influenced by Robert Fripp and >>admire him. Many others here never even heard of him before, as shocking as >>that may sound. Some people are in between and have heard him a bit and >>might want to learn more about what he is doing with looping and why some >>people think so highly of him in that regard. Since this list is about >>looping, it would be really great if some of you RF experts could teach the >>rest of us about his looping techniques, looping conceptions, loop >>approaches, etc. You asked fer it.... I'm going to quote bits from my collection of Fripp interviews, going back to 1969... well obviously the loop bits don't go that far back, but you get the idea. Here are a couple of nuggets; there's also a box in his 1986 GP interview, but someone else can type that one in!!! Beat instrumental, June 1979 "'Would you like to pick a note?' asks Fripp. The gent seated opposite asks for E. Fripp begins to pluck Es. In a matter of seconds his first note has been through the tape system and sets up a swelling, repetitive rhythm. Fripp throws in other notes, vaviations, snatches of melody. Within minutes there's a symphonic swell filling the room." ..... " Towards the end Fripp leans over to the line of recording tape poised between the two recorders and gently taps it with his index finger. The tune distorts slightly and the distortion part is repeated on tape." ... "The atmosphere remains relaxed. Fripp talks to anyone who wants conversation. The three kids from the Cure rush up and pelt him with questions. Fripp answers, carefully and patiently." .... "Is Frippatronics necessarily a solo performance art? 'Because it's often so dense that the range covered is akin to a small chamber ensemble. By the time you've had the thirtieth generation coming in, there's quite a thick layer. Which doesn't always provide room for other instruments. In the field of applied Frippertronics, it's not something that can exist outside of a recording studio. Pure frippertronics can, but applied - on "Here comes the Flood" where there's twenty-nine separate loops I did at home, edited, spliced, notated and transferred onto the song in the studio. That takes a lot of work and is specifically designed to allow for other instruments. But it's not a spontaneous situation.'" Guitarist (UK) August 1986, interview with Tony Arnold, Fripp's tech: "The term Frippertronics is the name Robert gave to a tape loop system he adopted from Brian Eno. Essentially it's an echo-delay tape system which Robert uses both for live work and in recording to slowly build up miniomalistic chords and notes on tape. It's basically just a Robis rack. There's a foot box which controls all the separate units at the moment and Robert will touch these button on each effects panel, then earthing them down will actually put them into the computer which, if he hits the button, will be stored in that order and will be recalled by footswitch one which he pressed to save te effects. I'm modifying it all the time and am working at the moment to give Robert five minutes of Frippertronics without having to take two Revoxes. What I'm doing is putting a playback head after the tape's gone all the way through, so you get an erase head, then a record head, then it goes all the way around and is five minutes long. It crops up for him again and I've got another head that sequences." Does that help any? ;) Michael From ???@??? Tue Feb 24 00:42:58 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 23 21:10:47 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y7Cdh-0001KM-00; Mon, 23 Feb 1998 21:10:45 -0800 Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 23:18:50 -0500 (EST) From: Adam Levin Reply-To: Adam Levin To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Baltimore loop-related gigs (updated) Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Resent-Message-ID: <"AyP3w.A.40.9Vl80"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3594 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 21:10:45 -0800 X-UIDL: 938acb35ec063e4bd719c40fff1ed90a As I mentioned last week, my band, The Dark Aether Project featuring myself (Stick/Loops/a wee bit of Guitar when nobody's looking), Yaman Aksu (Fretted and Fretless Guitars/Guitar Synth) and Brian Griffin (Drums) will be celebrating the release of our new CD along with some special guests at Orion Studios in Baltimore, MD this Saturday night. I've also booked two shows at Orion on Friday April 17th for Bruford Levin Upper Extremities featuring Bill Bruford, Tony Levin, David Torn and Chris Botti. Ticket details to be posted soon. For the full Orion schedule, directions and other show details see: http://www.ari.net/prog/shows/showcase/ For The Dark Aether Project info and sound samples see: http://www.ari.net/prog/bands/dap/ For Tony Levin info see: http://www.papabear.com/ -Adam --- "...if one strives at hearing for the sake of constant virtue, out of seeking liberation from cyclic existence, gradually one becomes a Hearer." - Chandrakirti From ???@??? Tue Feb 24 00:42:58 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 23 21:16:34 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y7CjF-000207-00; Mon, 23 Feb 1998 21:16:29 -0800 Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19980223230546.007dd450@wavefront.com> X-Sender: chuck.zwicky@wavefront.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 23:05:46 -0600 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Chuck Zwicky Subject: Re: boomerang phrase sampler In-Reply-To: <199802240050.QAA19348@well.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"0omTFD.A.yeB.gbl80"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3595 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 21:16:29 -0800 X-UIDL: 1e7ffa502722b8e115526457d8416c64 The boomerang makes a loud popping sound whenever you engage the layer/overdub function. At 04:50 PM 2/23/98 -0800, you wrote: >Michael Tamburo asks re the Boomerang< > >"i have >heard only good things about them. i was wondering if there is anything >that i should be warned about before making my purchase." > > >It is easy to use, compact, well made, and sounds pretty good. It does NOT >sample at the CD spec, so the tone is a bit dull, and it will only handle >one loop at a time. It's a great electric guitar device, but if you play >acoustic/electric, as I do, only an Echoplex will do. > > >Rik > > > From ???@??? Tue Feb 24 00:42:59 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 23 21:42:52 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y7D8k-00040P-00; Mon, 23 Feb 1998 21:42:50 -0800 Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 21:39:41 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: lowfrqcy@west.net (Ryan Blum) Subject: slightly out-of-print CDs Resent-Message-ID: <"BvytI.A.BcD.90l80"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3596 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 21:42:50 -0800 X-UIDL: 970f1cd2da6211ed4395e78bdcd835f2 hello folks, sorry that it's a bit off topic, but I'm searching high and low for a couple bill laswell cd's (Praxis-Sacrifist, Arcana-The Last Wave) that just recently went out of print. I emailed Axiom for the best source and tried ordering from all major chains and online stores, but to no avail....anyone had any luck anywhere? maybe a little hole in the wall shop somewhere with an abnormally large stock? loop content: our good friend buckethead is on the Praxis disc...woohoo! Thanks for any help, Ryan -- "Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds." -Albert Einstein From ???@??? Tue Feb 24 00:43:01 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 23 22:24:23 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y7Dmv-0007Rz-00; Mon, 23 Feb 1998 22:24:21 -0800 From: "Jesse Kudler" To: Subject: Effects Loop Question Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 01:25:48 -0500 Message-ID: <01bd40ed$0c0dcde0$714c8581@jkudler.stu.wesleyan.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Resent-Message-ID: <"eO9oE.A.kvG.Acm80"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3597 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 22:24:21 -0800 X-UIDL: 487c01c7e7ba246e30290a3ab1cc3173 This is probably a naive question, but here goes: I've never used my amp's effects loop, but I want to try running my Vortex through it. The manual says the nominal output is -2dBu, but my amp only has settings for +2dBv, -11dBv, and -24dBv. Do I just use the closest? Will this be okay? Are "u" and "v" the same here? Also, is there a significant difference between going from guitar to effect to amp and using the amp's effect loop? Thanks in advance for your help. -Jesse From ???@??? Tue Feb 24 00:43:04 1998 >From kflint Mon Feb 23 23:07:42 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y7ESr-0002Dt-00; Mon, 23 Feb 1998 23:07:41 -0800 Message-ID: <002101bd40f2$94fcca20$5d23dacf@stepheng> Reply-To: "Stephen P. Goodman" From: "Stephen P. Goodman" To: Subject: Re: Where to buy echoplex foot control unit? Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 23:05:24 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Resent-Message-ID: <"uzDWCD.A.A2B.uEn80"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3598 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 23:07:41 -0800 X-UIDL: 5a6f8d1385b08fda8d87551031c1f049 >">Art, we're currently selling Foot Controllers for $119. > >Wow! That's a lot for a metal chassis, 7 switches, 6 resistors, 1 jack, and >a little paint. > >With all due respect to retailers: Consider "DIY" --> Ok, what about it? Where's the schematic online? :) Hmmm? Stephen Goodman * It's... The Loop Of The Week! EarthLight Studios * http://www.earthlight.net/Studios From ???@??? Tue Feb 24 02:18:53 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 24 00:55:48 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y7G9S-0000HZ-00; Tue, 24 Feb 1998 00:55:46 -0800 X-Sender: kflint@pop.slip.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <002101bd40f2$94fcca20$5d23dacf@stepheng> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 00:53:04 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Kim Flint Subject: Re: Where to buy echoplex foot control unit? Resent-Message-ID: <"zbrI8B.A.uUH.7po80"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3600 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 00:55:46 -0800 X-UIDL: b61fee125aa9fad7f0d12856bcd077a4 At 11:05 PM -0800 2/23/98, Stephen P. Goodman wrote: >>">Art, we're currently selling Foot Controllers for $119. >> >>Wow! That's a lot for a metal chassis, 7 switches, 6 resistors, 1 jack, and >>a little paint. >> >>With all due respect to retailers: Consider "DIY" --> > > >Ok, what about it? Where's the schematic online? :) Hmmm? uh, I think chris had the url in his post: http://www.annihilist.com/loop/tools/echoplex/echopedals.html#custom not exactly a schematic, but explains everything you have to do. Somebody on the list had said they were going to do custom pedals, but I'm not sure how far they got with that. There are certainly people who have asked for pedals in different shapes and sizes, with different switches, etc. Certainly room for someone to have a little side business. go nuts.... kim ______________________________________________________________________ Kim Flint | Looper's Delight kflint@annihilist.com | http://www.annihilist.com/loop/loop.html http://www.annihilist.com/ | Loopers-Delight-request@annihilist.com From ???@??? Tue Feb 24 02:26:57 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 24 02:21:42 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y7HUa-0004m2-00; Tue, 24 Feb 1998 02:21:40 -0800 X-Sender: kflint@pop.slip.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <3.0.1.16.19980223194745.1d2f7db0@rank-serv.elec.gla.ac.uk> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 01:50:56 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Kim Flint Subject: Re: Secrets of Fripp Resent-Message-ID: <"qQmSWC.A.-QE.n6p80"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3602 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 02:21:40 -0800 X-UIDL: ee7f5d7d127315d8ad4ddad3ee569a5a At 7:47 PM -0800 2/23/98, Michael P. Hughes, Ph.D. wrote: >>>The point was that many of you are clearly influenced by Robert Fripp and >>>admire him. Many others here never even heard of him before, as shocking as >>>that may sound. Some people are in between and have heard him a bit and >>>might want to learn more about what he is doing with looping and why some >>>people think so highly of him in that regard. Since this list is about >>>looping, it would be really great if some of you RF experts could teach the >>>rest of us about his looping techniques, looping conceptions, loop >>>approaches, etc. > >You asked fer it.... I did, and I think I'll ask some more since we're almost getting somewhere here.... [snip a bunch of interesting fripp quotes] >Does that help any? ;) Well, a bit. But let's push this a little further. How about analyzing, critqueing, and explaining, in your own words, Fripp's looping technique? In other words, not repeating what he has to say about it, and not just pointing to a recording and saying "I like that," not just saying that he uses four 2290's. I mean, you actually dig into the looping aspects and techniques, analyze and understand them, and teach us what you learn. Think of the looping as an instrument in it's own right, and analyze the way he uses it. Not the guitar playing, not the processing, not the timbres, but the looping. Just like a good jazz instructor might teach about Monk's piano playing. You would learn about the unique rhythm and harmonic styles, the melodic choices, the logic underlying it all, what he was trying to covey and how his particular style did that. Now, do something like that with Fripp and his looping. This is a competition, and you will be graded. Grades will be posted publicly for the purposes of adoration and/or humiliation. The grading standard will most likely be arbitrary and totally incomprehensible, just like college. And to maintain strict anarchy, anybody may feel free to grade anybody else. The best answer will win some dorky prize that I haven't thought of yet. You have until Monday, so get crackin'! kim ______________________________________________________________________ Kim Flint | Looper's Delight kflint@annihilist.com | http://www.annihilist.com/loop/loop.html http://www.annihilist.com/ | Loopers-Delight-request@annihilist.com From ???@??? Tue Feb 24 02:19:03 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 24 02:01:41 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y7HBD-0003ZX-00; Tue, 24 Feb 1998 02:01:39 -0800 Message-ID: Comments: Authenticated sender is From: "Raul Bonell Tomas" Organization: Atzucac To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 10:37:21 +0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: FC-7 (Roland?) Reply-to: rauboto@eui.upv.es Priority: normal X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v2.23) Resent-Message-ID: <"zpngE.A.bHD.unp80"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3601 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 02:01:39 -0800 X-UIDL: 24db4e5e30e6c44c9d83c8019ad1dbcc Hi all! FC-7 (Roland?) Does anybody knows if this footcontroller works o.k. for the Echoplex? How much it costs? Thanks in advance. Love.Peace.Bye.Raul. From ???@??? Tue Feb 24 10:23:34 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 24 04:12:06 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y7JDQ-0001PJ-00; Tue, 24 Feb 1998 04:12:04 -0800 Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 04:09:28 -0800 (PST) From: Stew Benedict Subject: Re: Where to buy echoplex foot control unit? To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Resent-Message-ID: <"cFbNl.A.4GB.8hr80"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3603 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 04:12:04 -0800 X-UIDL: fd4bdb89bce333ae99d1f493f2a8ba7b Hey Kim, That would be me. That project got stalled while I waited 14 months for my 'plex. Got it now -yippee! Quite a deep box. I still intend to get back into that controller project, the initial concept work looked promising, I think a PIC would probably have enough horsepower for the job, and they're cheap too. Kim, Matthias congrats on an amazing piece of gear. Stew Benedict On Tue, 24 Feb 1998, Kim Flint wrote: > At 11:05 PM -0800 2/23/98, Stephen P. Goodman wrote: > >>">Art, we're currently selling Foot Controllers for $119. > >> > >>Wow! That's a lot for a metal chassis, 7 switches, 6 resistors, 1 jack, and > >>a little paint. > >> > >>With all due respect to retailers: Consider "DIY" --> > > > > > >Ok, what about it? Where's the schematic online? :) Hmmm? > > uh, I think chris had the url in his post: > > http://www.annihilist.com/loop/tools/echoplex/echopedals.html#custom > > not exactly a schematic, but explains everything you have to do. Somebody > on the list had said they were going to do custom pedals, but I'm not sure > how far they got with that. There are certainly people who have asked for > pedals in different shapes and sizes, with different switches, etc. > Certainly room for someone to have a little side business. go nuts.... > > kim > > ______________________________________________________________________ > Kim Flint | Looper's Delight > kflint@annihilist.com | http://www.annihilist.com/loop/loop.html > http://www.annihilist.com/ | Loopers-Delight-request@annihilist.com > > > > From ???@??? Tue Feb 24 10:23:43 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 24 04:50:14 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y7JoJ-0003AL-00; Tue, 24 Feb 1998 04:50:11 -0800 From: Texture444@aol.com Message-ID: <3b82a926.34f2c142@aol.com> Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 07:46:55 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Re: Jamman goes down during live performance. Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 84 Resent-Message-ID: <"vLZ-uB.A.LwC.AGs80"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3604 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 04:50:11 -0800 X-UIDL: 117310335041e6411831e4fb2c64fddc to add to it: in my experience, the echoplex will do a complete reset whenst the fusspedal receives any static dis-charge..... dt From ???@??? Tue Feb 24 10:23:48 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 24 05:02:52 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y7K0Y-00042D-00; Tue, 24 Feb 1998 05:02:50 -0800 From: Texture444@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 07:59:30 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: ol' pin cut manuever? Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 84 Resent-Message-ID: <"pkVu_B.A.vjD.0Rs80"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3605 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 05:02:50 -0800 X-UIDL: 72236a467de347896535f5e3c276216e kim, >that has nothing to do with the software. Pure hardware issue....I'd highly >advise the ol' pin cut manuever if you have an older unit and this hasn't >been done yet. hello? is this one of the many issues that i've missed? what's it do, or: is it documented, somewheres? best, dt From ???@??? Tue Feb 24 10:24:36 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 24 09:29:36 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y7OAe-0002q0-00; Tue, 24 Feb 1998 09:29:32 -0800 Message-Id: <3.0.2.16.19980224054015.302fd0f4@texas.net> X-Sender: sharkey@texas.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.2 (16) Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 05:40:15 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: james rhodes Subject: jamman/echoplex rack mounting In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"G19E_D.A.dOC.kKw80"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3619 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 09:29:32 -0800 X-UIDL: b232a4e0f701f519480a616883b0d3be hi, although pretty obvious,,,mounting you gear in your rack with a gap between the units,,cuts down on thermal stress,,,and prevents one unit from becoming a heat sink for another...i never liked my echoplex mounted next to my power amp... james From ???@??? Tue Feb 24 22:36:11 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 24 12:13:54 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y7Qjf-0006RC-00; Tue, 24 Feb 1998 12:13:51 -0800 Message-Id: <199802242002.MAA13560@scv4.apple.com> Subject: Re: RE: Jamman goes down during live performance. Date: Tue, 24 Feb 98 14:03:53 -0000 x-sender: hartne.t@mail.apple.com x-mailer: Claris Emailer 1.1 From: "T.W. Hartnett" To: "Looper's Delight" Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Resent-Message-ID: <"Uo8JDC.A.0iF.Qky80"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3627 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 12:13:51 -0800 X-UIDL: 9bc7524d497b92781174a9d7a659ae48 >Thanks for your input. We thought that "grokked" was a universal term that >described with complete accuracy any piece of computer based musical >equipment >that suddenly does a "flip-out." I believe "grok" is a verb which means "to understand fully". Travis Hartnett From ???@??? Tue Feb 24 10:24:00 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 24 06:24:16 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y7LHL-0000OH-00; Tue, 24 Feb 1998 06:24:15 -0800 Message-Id: <199802241421.JAA23624@shell.monmouth.com> Reply-To: From: "andre" To: , Subject: Satch, er, on Fripp Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 09:20:54 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1162 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"cmQ4Z.A.EI._dt80"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3606 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 06:24:15 -0800 X-UIDL: a353d71ae68a5e2eb88141f403664ec0 > > Just saw the following quote in the current _Guitar_ magazine cover > story with Joe Satriani, regarding Fripp's presence on the G3 tour: > > "When you sit down and you really let yourself in and you open your > heart to Robert's performance, I guarantee it puts your spirit through a > cathartic experience. It's a music that draws things out of you that > would never come out listening to any other kind of music... What he is doing on his guitar and with his gear is something that needs to be > covered in detail because it's something that nobody else is doing." hmmm. how can one comment on that - without starting up the fripp bash/protection frenzy..?? satch is fantastic, i'm a weirdo who enjoyed ALL the acts on BOTH G3 tours, yes, even fripp, but.... Satch, you need to maybe hear a whole bunch more stuff, eclectic listener as you may be... andre E From ???@??? Tue Feb 24 10:24:00 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 24 06:29:24 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y7LMJ-0000x4-00; Tue, 24 Feb 1998 06:29:23 -0800 Message-ID: From: David Kirkdorffer To: "'Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com'" Cc: 'Pat Murphy' Subject: FW: EDP goes down during live performance -- is this still happ ening w/ V.5 software? Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 09:25:59 -0500 X-Priority: 1 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) Content-Type: text/plain Resent-Message-ID: <"vRWKPD.A.Pn.qit80"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3607 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 06:29:23 -0800 X-UIDL: 1233a2146d43fe5ec1d16b40209232bb Pat - I hope you're still manning the Oberheim information help desk. Here's question you may be able to help answer for us EDP people. The question is if / when a fix was instituted to the EDP hardware to fix what has been known as The Thermal Problem. The fix had to do with cutting a pin -- pin 5 of U12, an ADC0804 David -----Original Message----- From: Kim Flint [SMTP:kflint@chromatic.com] Sent: Monday, February 23, 1998 8:55 PM To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: RE: EDP goes down during live performance-is this still happening w/ V.5 software? At 08:21 PM 2/23/98 -0500, David Myers wrote: >>At 06:18 PM 2/23/98 -0500, David Kirkdorffer wrote: >>>With the older version of the EDP software, the "much reported on these >>>pages 'thermal problem'" plagued the EDP with sudden silence if you used >>>the undo button. >>> >>>Should I still worry about this if I have the new Upgrade software, but >>>have not "cut the pin"? >> >>that has nothing to do with the software. Pure hardware issue....I'd highly >>advise the ol' pin cut manuever if you have an older unit and this hasn't >>been done yet. >> >>kim > >Kim-what exactly is an "older unit", anyway? Do you have serial numbers >or something? I do my best not to keep track of such things. If you really want to be certain if your's has been properly modified or not, pop the top off and take a look at the chip in question. There's a nice diagram on the Looper's Delight site on one of the echoplex pages that shows exactly where to look. (pin 5 of U12, an ADC0804) You can do the mod yourself, assuming you are reasonably able with electronics. You just need a decent tool to get in there and cut the pin off. (judging by your past electrical gear butchery, i'm sure you can manage! :-) ) Oh, that's a void the warranty do it at your own risk sorta thing, so if anything bad happens, don't look at me! I'm sure you can get Oberheim or some authorized service place to do it too, if that makes ya happy. As far as I know, this has been taken care of on new units at the factory for the past year and a half at least. But I really don't have any way to know about things like that for sure. kim _______________________________________________________ Kim Flint 408-752-9284 Mpact Systems Engineering kflint@chromatic.com Chromatic Research http://www.chromatic.com From ???@??? Tue Feb 24 10:24:07 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 24 07:18:20 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y7M7a-0004IM-00; Tue, 24 Feb 1998 07:18:14 -0800 From: Edward_Chang@mail.amsinc.com Date: Tue, 24 Feb 98 10:08:00 EST Encoding: 17 Text Message-Id: <9801248883.AA888343554@mail.amsinc.com> To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Music for Airports Resent-Message-ID: <"_GSU9C.A.zoD.1Pu80"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3608 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 07:18:14 -0800 X-UIDL: d70e383afcbc4b48b786eb4a6f7233fc >Yes!!! Great story on this new rendition of Music for Airports! >It was on Feb. 19th's "All Things Considered." Unfortunately here's all that I could pull off >www.npr.org: My girlfriend and musical co-conspiratorMotoko Shimizu (not necessarily in that order) happens to be one of the current vocalists in the Music for Airports chorus and is performing at the Alice Tully show. She showed me the score and the main thing that struck me was the dynamics markings. Alot of held notes, pp to f to ppp (italicized). That's definitely "ambient", alright ;). The other thing is that there's a sampler playing through out one of them, which also plays samples of alto voices ("with metallic, reverb, etc..") , so it's not totally acoustic. I don't know, maybe I can get her to write some comments from a performance perspective... ed chang From ???@??? Tue Feb 24 10:24:08 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 24 07:22:32 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y7MBi-0004ty-00; Tue, 24 Feb 1998 07:22:30 -0800 Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19980224091321.007b5d90@wavefront.com> X-Sender: chuck.zwicky@wavefront.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 09:13:21 -0600 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Chuck Zwicky Subject: Re: Effects Loop Question In-Reply-To: <01bd40ed$0c0dcde0$714c8581@jkudler.stu.wesleyan.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"wpLVcD.A.J6D.-Ru80"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3609 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 07:22:30 -0800 X-UIDL: e4909d7382ebfe004b16ca0124f0e8df Jesse, Yes, the dBu and dBm scales are the same, while the dBm scale is offset from those by 11.23dB. You should use the setting on the amp which allows you to set the vortex input level for sufficient headroom while providing unity gain while switching the effect loop in and out of the signal path. I would guess that the +2 or the -11 would both work, and the -11 will provide more headroom through the vortex, at the expense of the signal to noise ratio. -Chuck Zwicky At 01:25 AM 2/24/98 -0500, you wrote: >This is probably a naive question, but here goes: > >I've never used my amp's effects loop, but I want to try running my Vortex >through it. The manual says the nominal output is -2dBu, but my amp only >has settings for +2dBv, -11dBv, and -24dBv. Do I just use the closest? >Will this be okay? Are "u" and "v" the same here? > >Also, is there a significant difference between going from guitar to effect >to amp and using the amp's effect loop? > >Thanks in advance for your help. > >-Jesse > > > > From ???@??? Tue Feb 24 10:24:09 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 24 07:25:52 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y7MEw-0005L6-00; Tue, 24 Feb 1998 07:25:50 -0800 Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 10:20:11 -0500 (EST) From: Dpcoffin@aol.com Message-ID: <980224102010_-1192465660@mrin39.mx> To: loopers-delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Satch, er, on Fripp Resent-Message-ID: <"Q5KaPD.A.HcE.yVu80"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3610 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 07:25:50 -0800 X-UIDL: 3b4908eb02857362a0faf4ac97dede30 <<....nobody else is doing.>> To paraphrase George Orwell: "All musicians are nobodies, but some musicians are bigger nobodies than others." dpc From ???@??? Tue Feb 24 10:24:11 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 24 07:39:36 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y7MSE-0006dV-00; Tue, 24 Feb 1998 07:39:34 -0800 Message-Id: <215C1D5A0FFDD011B3CC00805FC18C29238B79@NTSRV2> From: "Hogan, Greg (Exchange)" To: "'Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com'" Subject: RE: Jamman goes down during live performance. Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 10:33:54 -0500 X-Priority: 3 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) Content-Type: text/plain Resent-Message-ID: <"X0wVG.A.k7F.Uku80"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3611 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 07:39:34 -0800 X-UIDL: ceb2d1b072d11f269462edde3b3a90f2 > The LoOpDoctOrs were sad to report:"that they too have xperienced > frequent footpedal weirdness interactions with said Jamman quarter > inch. Ours grokked just last Friday." > And then asked:"What gives?" Depending on what you mean by "grokked out" there could be several answers to the universal question of "What gives?":If you mean that the switch refuses to work I would suspect that the switch itself has failed. You can easily determine this by trying the same switch at the other footswitch jack and seeing if it works. If you are saying that the switch added some form of noise I would suspect either a loop closure problem(something I am sure that you folks at the loop clinic would be familiar with) or a bigger problem within the JAMMAN. Whatever the problem is I would be happy to help you with it. Please let me know if you have any questions or if there is anything that I can do for you. Best regards, Greg Hogan Lexicon Customer Service Phone +781-280-0372 FAX +781-280-0499 From ???@??? Tue Feb 24 10:24:12 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 24 07:43:59 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y7MWP-0007Ee-00; Tue, 24 Feb 1998 07:43:53 -0800 From: lwordsman@pirnie.com Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 10:42:55 -0500 Message-Id: <199802241542.KAA00087@mailnet.malcolmpirnie.com> To: Loopers-Delight@Annihilist.com Subject: Ampex Mic X-Mailer: MailNet 4.10 Resent-Message-ID: <"8qnyQ.A.lVG.rnu80"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3612 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 07:43:53 -0800 X-UIDL: 1b25383fa4954da6772c01bec998ff4b Totally off topic but I just came across a beautiful Ampex H1390 Microphone. It looks old and solid. I'd love to find out if this mic is appropriate for recording vocals. Anyone know anything about mics. I did check the DAT Heads Microphone FAQ but it seems more focussed on taping than anything else. From ???@??? Tue Feb 24 10:24:15 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 24 07:56:46 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y7Miq-0000nF-00; Tue, 24 Feb 1998 07:56:44 -0800 Message-Id: <215C1D5A0FFDD011B3CC00805FC18C29238B7A@NTSRV2> From: "Hogan, Greg (Exchange)" To: "'Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com'" Subject: RE: Jamman goes down during live performance. Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 10:49:33 -0500 X-Priority: 3 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) Content-Type: text/plain Resent-Message-ID: <"LrKSHD.A.eU.wzu80"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3613 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 07:56:44 -0800 X-UIDL: 6b98b586c82abe790a1e6008f43d3b0b From John Ott: "I don't use the lexicon footswitch, (use a midi pedal) so I've not > experienced that weirdness, but after a memory upgrade, I left a loop > running and after a while it crashed. The display went to +18 and the > music stopped. > This happened several times immediately after the upgrade, but has > since > stopped. I'm wondering if it will be back ( at the least opportune > time > for sure) or was the problem just burn in of the new zips?" > Dear John, You can run a DRAM test as follows:Start with the power off. Hold down the "RESET/Bypass" and "Function" buttons and turn the machine on. You should get a "d" in the display. Release the buttons. Press and release the "RESET/BYPASS" button. You should know have a number between 0 and 15 which corresponds with the position of the Mode encoder. Turn the mode encoder to "PUNCH IN LOOP 4." You should now have a "6" in the display. Press and release the "RESET/BYPASS" button to run the test. If the test fails you will have a hexidecimal number between 1 and F flashing in the display which will indicate which DRAM is failing as follows:1=U20, 2=U21, 3=U20 & U21, 4=U22, 5=U20 & U22, 6=U21 & U22, 7=U20, U21 & U22, 8=U23, 9=U20 & U23, A=U21 & U23, B =U20, U21 & U23, C=U22 & U23, D=U20, U22 & U23, E=U21, U22 & U23, F= U20, U21, U22, & U23. I hope this helps. Please let me know if you have any questions or if there is anything that I can do for you. Best regards, Greg Hogan Lexicon Customer Service Phone +781-280-0372 FAX +781-280-0499 From ???@??? Tue Feb 24 10:24:18 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 24 08:43:14 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y7NRn-0004rb-00; Tue, 24 Feb 1998 08:43:11 -0800 Message-Id: <215C1D5A0FFDD011B3CC00805FC18C29238B7B@NTSRV2> From: "Hogan, Greg (Exchange)" To: "'Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com'" Subject: RE: Jamman footpedals Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 11:36:06 -0500 X-Priority: 3 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) Content-Type: text/plain Resent-Message-ID: <"z70LdC.A.-7D.Sev80"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3614 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 08:43:11 -0800 X-UIDL: a71ae33ed7531d685ee8af41cc43f626 In response to Mike Biffle writing: ">I have a PMC-10 midi floor controller, but for real time tapping, it > doesn't cut > >it. There is a slight lag. I've heard others describe tapping > slightly > early to > >compensate, but I'm not able to consistently do that." > Kim Flinn wrote:"Is that caused by midi delay in the jamman, or the footpedal? I've used the PMC-10 for my echoplex a bit, as well as other typical rack switching, and never had a delay problem. It's possible I didn't notice, since I mostly use the dedicated pedal for the plex, but if the PMC-10 caused a delay it must have been pretty small. And preset switches are very quick. Are you sure it's not misjudgement of the throw distance to the contact point of the pedal? That can throw you sometimes if you're not used to the pedal." To which Mike responded with:"Well, I'm a little hesitant to take a hard poke at the ol' PMC-10 due to my concern that it might croak on me! That is possibly my main problem with the lag situation. I'm waaaay into my dedicated FS5U's though. (ah, finally I remember the correct number!) I can really mash those babies! > I tried using the tap function for a good while though and it really > felt > different to me." > And then Chuck Zewicky chimed in with:"I use a Rolls 'MIDI Wizard' with my Jam-Man setup, which in it's default state does send 8 channels of controller data with each program change. This does cause some lag, but was easily corrected by de-assigning the controllers. I've experienced no oddness or switching delays since. Perhaps this is something to look for." Dear Mike, As I am not aware of there being a lag in response when using MIDI commands and the JAMMAN and since Kim has good experiences with his PMC-10 I would suspect one of three things:1.) as Chuck has suggested the PMC-10 may be trying to do to many things at once thus slowing it down. 2.) there is a problem with the PMC-10. 3.) there is a problem with JAMMAN. I would suggest that you try another MIDI controller with the JAMMAN or another device that uses MIDI program change messages with the footpedal and see in which direction the problem follows. Since you are enjoying the use of the JAMMAN with your FS5Us this may not be necessary. Please let me know if you have any questions or if there is anything that I can do for you. Best regards, Greg Hogan Lexicon Customer Service Phone +781-280-0372 FAX +781-280-0499 From ???@??? Tue Feb 24 10:24:27 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 24 08:52:40 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y7Naq-0006CQ-00; Tue, 24 Feb 1998 08:52:32 -0800 From: KRosser414@aol.com Message-ID: <796762f4.34f2f8a0@aol.com> Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 11:43:09 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Time Machine 7.6 for sale Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 18 Resent-Message-ID: <"JaLcXB.A.xtE.ljv80"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3615 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 08:52:32 -0800 X-UIDL: bcf8d9c9c1e27fb955c2d282a06c1282 Loopers - So I finally scored a Jam Man on its way via UPS as we speak. Unfortunately this means I gotta sell my recently acquired Digitech 7.6 Time Machine to help pay for it (believe me, I'd love to have both). It's in absolute perfect working condition and excellent physical shape. We've talked about it here before, you know, single rack space, etc, etc. I even sent away to Digitech for a manual that's on it's way I'd be happy to throw in as well. Before I start trying to sell this at large I thought I'd post it here first and 'keep it in the community'. Asking $150 + shipping Contact me privately (krosser414@aol.com) as I'm on the digest and only read these every couple days, or call me at (626) 791-2618 west coast time. Thanks, Ken From ???@??? Tue Feb 24 10:24:28 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 24 08:55:58 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y7Ne6-0006fq-00; Tue, 24 Feb 1998 08:55:54 -0800 Message-Id: <215C1D5A0FFDD011B3CC00805FC18C29238B7D@NTSRV2> From: "Hogan, Greg (Exchange)" To: "'Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com'" Subject: RE: Jamman goes down during live performance. Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 11:44:54 -0500 X-Priority: 3 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) Content-Type: text/plain Resent-Message-ID: <"orzQG.A.NMF.7mv80"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3616 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 08:55:54 -0800 X-UIDL: dcbbde6fe20ea3d81a0f5085b521a246 > In response to John Peters writing: > "<>" Paul wrote"I had a similar problem once until I removed the Digitech 2101 tube preamp/processor from the rack. Turned out that the tube preamp was overheating the Jman causing it to shut down until it cooled down. No > problems since and I know many people who gig on a regular basis > w/Jmen in their racks that haven't had any problems. Also, I don't > know why everybody whines about the Jman/Vortex pedals - I haven't > had any problem with their application (maybe I've got wierd feet? :-) > )or durability." > Thanks Paul! JAMMAN should operate up to 104degreesF(40degreesC). After that you may get lucky or you could have problems. Please let me know if you have any questions or if there is anything that I can do for you. Best regards, Greg Hogan Lexicon Customer Service Phone +781-280-0372 FAX +781-280-0499 From ???@??? Tue Feb 24 10:24:32 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 24 09:16:31 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y7Nxz-0001C4-00; Tue, 24 Feb 1998 09:16:27 -0800 Message-ID: <2148EC143F29D1118BE000805FC13CD01E1FB2@migarexch01.maritz.com> From: "Liebig, Steuart A." To: "'Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com'" Subject: RE: slightly out-of-print CDs Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 11:09:54 -0600 X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) Resent-Message-ID: <"H_g37C.A.SW.F8v80"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3617 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 09:16:27 -0800 X-UIDL: eceac3f16fa8be823109f32787c29e03 Hey, Try Rhino records in Westwood. It'll be close to your McCabes date with the D. Torn experience. They're on Westwood Blvd., call info. > ---------- > From: lowfrqcy@west.net > Reply To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com > Sent: Monday, February 23, 1998 9:42 PM > To: LiebigSA@maritz.com > Subject: slightly out-of-print CDs > > hello folks, > > sorry that it's a bit off topic, but I'm searching high and low for a > couple bill laswell cd's (Praxis-Sacrifist, Arcana-The Last Wave) that > just > recently went out of print. I emailed Axiom for the best source and > tried > ordering from all major chains and online stores, but to no > avail....anyone > had any luck anywhere? maybe a little hole in the wall shop somewhere > with > an abnormally large stock? > > loop content: our good friend buckethead is on the Praxis > disc...woohoo! > > Thanks for any help, > Ryan > > -- > "Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition > from mediocre minds." -Albert Einstein > > > From ???@??? Tue Feb 24 10:24:45 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 24 09:56:16 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y7OaU-0005fw-00; Tue, 24 Feb 1998 09:56:14 -0800 X-Sender: ejmd@pop.erols.com Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <3.0.2.16.19980224054015.302fd0f4@texas.net> References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 13:00:48 -0500 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Ed Drake Subject: What's going on at Oberheim? Resent-Message-ID: <"WpnKwB.A.myE.0iw80"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3620 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 09:56:14 -0800 X-UIDL: 397592b3910ac17b0473bd64d1fefe6c Hello all, I'm not trying to start any panic or rumors, but I just tried to call the toll free number for Oberheim, which I had used as recently as back in January, and I got a recording saying that the toll free number I tried to call had been disconnected and no more info was available. I noticed that Pat Murphy hasn't answered to the list to respond to David Kirkdorffer's email from earlier and then with Tom Spaulding leaving last week somewhat suddenly, it makes me wonder. I did not try to call Gibson directly. Anybody know what's up? Ed From ???@??? Tue Feb 24 10:24:49 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 24 10:14:24 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y7Os3-00002c-00; Tue, 24 Feb 1998 10:14:23 -0800 Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 10:09:52 -0800 (PST) From: Rik Elswit Message-Id: <199802241809.KAA22577@well.com> To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: What's going on at Oberheim? Resent-Message-ID: <"ydZfRD.A.ezG.6zw80"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3621 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 10:14:23 -0800 X-UIDL: efb6f66ed29cc5e8a7c17fa6d455487e Everybody at Gibson got their pphone numbers changed a while back. Gibson Inc. is 615-871-4500. They'll connect you to Oberheim. From ???@??? Tue Feb 24 10:24:35 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 24 09:20:06 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y7O1R-0001fl-00; Tue, 24 Feb 1998 09:20:01 -0800 Message-ID: <34F30D30.17BD5C67@infobiogen.fr> Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 18:10:58 +0000 From: Malhomme Olivier Reply-To: malhomme@infobiogen.fr Organization: I P L X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.03 [fr] (Macintosh; I; PPC) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: DIMM chips memory question (off topic) References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; x-mac-type="54455854"; x-mac-creator="4D4F5353" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"e5uCbD.A.Dl.v9v80"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3618 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 09:20:01 -0800 X-UIDL: 4b7d8785941b9726fe785a864fcc480d Gentlemen, I would need your help. Due to a sudden increase of price of memory chips in france, I'm considering buying DIMM 64 Mo chips for my Power Computing mac-clone abroad. X-Can any one familiar with these chips (that go on 7XXX/8XXX/9XXX from apple also) could tell me what the best price are nowadays in the States (or elsewhere for that matter). Thanks Olivier Malhomme From ???@??? Tue Feb 24 10:24:50 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 24 10:21:17 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y7Oye-00010Y-00; Tue, 24 Feb 1998 10:21:12 -0800 Message-Id: <199802241810.KAA29324@sonic.sonic.com> Subject: Re: What's going on at Oberheim? (Gibson support) Date: Tue, 24 Feb 98 10:17:38 -0800 x-sender: andy_wolpert@pop.sonic.com x-mailer: Claris Emailer 2.0, March 15, 1997 From: Andy Wolpert To: , Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Resent-Message-ID: <"gYH1sB.A.0D.J4w80"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3622 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 10:21:12 -0800 X-UIDL: 018ed6412817e94eca901f285e1a77c4 I think Oberheim is out, Gibson is in.... After a few phone calls, I ended up getting a email from Pat Murphy pmurphy@gibson.com He we was quite helpful in helping me update the software in my older EDP to version 5.0. __ _/\_ / \___/ \______ \ Andy Wolpert \__ | Sonic Solutions \ / awolpert@sonic.com / | (415) 893-8043 / \___ __ ___/ \__/ \_____/ From ???@??? Tue Feb 24 10:55:10 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 24 10:46:31 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y7PN7-0003wT-00; Tue, 24 Feb 1998 10:46:29 -0800 Message-Id: <98Feb24.123955cst.26891@gateway.gibson.com> X-Sender: pmurphy@mail.nash.gibson.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (32) Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 12:43:11 -0600 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Pat Murphy Subject: Re: What's going on at Oberheim? In-Reply-To: References: <3.0.2.16.19980224054015.302fd0f4@texas.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"coGqz.A.oBD.dRx80"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3623 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 10:46:29 -0800 X-UIDL: 7f666ce0cdb11aab5e8f87af19ed8d14 >Hello all, > >I'm not trying to start any panic or rumors, but I just tried to call the >toll free number for Oberheim, which I had used as recently as back in >January, and I got a recording saying that the toll free number I tried to >call had been disconnected and no more info was available. I noticed that >Pat Murphy hasn't answered to the list to respond to David Kirkdorffer's >email from earlier and then with Tom Spaulding leaving last week somewhat >suddenly, it makes me wonder. I did not try to call Gibson directly. >Anybody know what's up? >Ed Ed I am very much still here. Little has changed since Tom left and we are still on the same page. Since Tom was always so active on the Looper site, I chose to remain silent for the most part. There is no way that I could compete with him in the one liner department. I also spend a lot of time answering the volumes of email that I receive through the Gibson web site as well as phone calls from consumers and dealers. I keep in close touch with our tech in coordinating repairs and staying informed of problems and changes. I am also the guy that ships out your repairs and replacements. I have gained a lot of hands on knowledge about the Echoplex as well as the Oberheim keyboard products. Even though I am a guitar player, I am Midi literate so I ended up being the Oberheim Customer service guy. In addition to handling Oberheim customer service I also handle customer service for Slingerland drums. A full plate indeed. I am a consumer as well. A gear head. A musical toy junkie. From my pawn shop buying sprees, I have owned just about one of everything . I am one of you except that I am a novice looper. I didn't get my hands on an Echoplex until November of last year.I have learned a lot from you folks. Though my postings to this group may be few and far between, please don't take it as a lack of interest or anything like that. I very much believe in the Echoplex and looping in general. If you need individual help, please send me email. thanks Pat "son of Spaulding" Murphy (not to be confused with son of sam) pmurphy@gibson.net 1-800-283-7135 ext 348 From ???@??? Tue Feb 24 10:55:12 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 24 10:54:18 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y7PUe-00052s-00; Tue, 24 Feb 1998 10:54:16 -0800 X-Sender: kflint@pop.slip.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 10:49:49 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Kim Flint Subject: Re: ol' pin cut manuever? Resent-Message-ID: <"rBVRJD.A.IME.bZx80"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3624 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 10:54:16 -0800 X-UIDL: 36083805795c6a59a5c8a6a684eb1d54 At 7:59 AM -0500 2/24/98, Texture444@aol.com wrote: >kim, >>that has nothing to do with the software. Pure hardware issue....I'd highly >>advise the ol' pin cut manuever if you have an older unit and this hasn't >>been done yet. >hello? >is this one of the many issues that i've missed? >what's it do, or: is it documented, somewheres? >best, >dt Hey David- This question and the one about static to the footpedal are both discussed on the echoplex FAQ on the webpage: http://www.annihilist.com/loop/tools/echoplex/FAQ.html It should explain what to do. Let me know if you have a problem with it. kim ______________________________________________________________________ Kim Flint | Looper's Delight kflint@annihilist.com | http://www.annihilist.com/loop/loop.html http://www.annihilist.com/ | Loopers-Delight-request@annihilist.com From ???@??? Tue Feb 24 11:10:00 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 24 11:01:45 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y7Pbo-000667-00; Tue, 24 Feb 1998 11:01:40 -0800 Mime-Version: 1.0 Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 10:50:31 -0800 Message-ID: <000960A1.----@wj.com> From: Mike.Biffle@wj.com (Mike Biffle) Subject: Re[2]: Jamman footpedals To: "'Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com'" , "Hogan; Greg (Exchange)" Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Description: cc:Mail note part Resent-Message-ID: <"PQydH.A.EEF.kfx80"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3625 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 11:01:40 -0800 X-UIDL: 381406a2cf4782d3344b7933297e3c0a Thanks Greg and Kim and Chucj for your detailed responses... I'm going to program the tap pgm chg into my PMC-10 again and give it another try. I'm still probably pretty attached to my dedicated FS5U pedals cause they're so positive, but it will be good to know if I can use the controller as well. Kind regards, -Miko Biffle In response to Mike Biffle writing: I have a PMC-10 midi floor controller, but for real time tapping, it doesn't cut it. There is a slight lag. I've heard others describe tapping slightly early to compensate, but I'm not able to consistently do that." Kim Flint wrote:"Is that caused by midi delay in the jamman, or the footpedal? I've used the PMC-10 for my echoplex a bit, as well as other typical rack switching, and never had a delay problem. It's possible I didn't notice, since I mostly use the dedicated pedal for the plex, but if the PMC-10 caused a delay it must have been pretty small. And preset switches are very quick. Are you sure it's not misjudgement of the throw distance to the contact point of the pedal? That can throw you sometimes if you're not used to the pedal." To which Mike responded with:"Well, I'm a little hesitant to take a hard poke at the ol' PMC-10 due to my concern that it might croak on me! That is possibly my main problem with the lag situation. I'm waaaay into my dedicated FS5U's though. (ah, finally I remember the correct number!) I can really mash those babies! I tried using the tap function for a good while though and it really felt different to me." Chuck Zewicky chimed in with:"I use a Rolls 'MIDI Wizard' with my Jam-Man setup, which in it's default state does send 8 channels of controller data with each program change. This does cause some lag, but was easily corrected by de-assigning the controllers. I've experienced no oddness or switching delays since. Perhaps this is something to look for." Greg Hogan: As I am not aware of there being a lag in response when using MIDI commands and the JAMMAN and since Kim has good experiences with his PMC-10 I would suspect one of three things:1.) as Chuck has suggested the PMC-10 may be trying to do to many things at once thus slowing it down. 2.) there is a problem with the PMC-10. 3.) there is a problem with JAMMAN. I would suggest that you try another MIDI controller with the JAMMAN or another device that uses MIDI program change messages with the footpedal and see in which direction the problem follows. Since you are enjoying the use of the JAMMAN with your FS5Us this may not be necessary. Please let me know if you have any questions or if there is anything that I can do for you. Best regards, Greg Hogan Lexicon Customer Service Phone +781-280-0372 FAX +781-280-0499 From ???@??? Tue Feb 24 22:36:10 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 24 12:04:28 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y7QaX-0005Hi-00; Tue, 24 Feb 1998 12:04:25 -0800 From: Fmplautus@aol.com Message-ID: <274d0d1.34f3264e@aol.com> Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 14:58:03 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: RE: Jamman goes down during live performance. Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 78 Resent-Message-ID: <"GSJo4C.A.ATE.Say80"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3626 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 12:04:26 -0800 X-UIDL: 5b2f7f64fb2cdc8d02d98739c66ea180 Hi Greg: Thanks for your input. We thought that "grokked" was a universal term that described with complete accuracy any piece of computer based musical equipment that suddenly does a "flip-out." Actually, what happened was that the jamman wouldn't respond to switch commands and actually lost it's LED signpost. We had to try three cables before one finally worked. So our guess is that the switch is just fine. But we will check again. Best, the LoOpDoctOrs From ???@??? Tue Feb 24 22:36:13 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 24 12:22:05 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y7Qra-0007cs-00; Tue, 24 Feb 1998 12:22:02 -0800 Message-ID: <2148EC143F29D1118BE000805FC13CD01E1FB7@migarexch01.maritz.com> From: "Liebig, Steuart A." To: "'Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com'" Subject: RE: RE: Jamman goes down during live performance. Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 14:13:19 -0600 X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) Resent-Message-ID: <"kq7qND.A.lDG.Doy80"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3628 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 12:22:03 -0800 X-UIDL: f7c0f46d4f46777220f965092f11ed80 Well, I'm a dinosaur and "grok," to me, refers to "Stranger in a Strange Land" by R. Heinlein . . . and in true '70s speak, means to "get it" in a sort of total experience/gestalt kinda way. Hopelessly dated. > ---------- > From: Fmplautus@aol.com > Reply To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com > Sent: Tuesday, February 24, 1998 12:04 PM > To: LiebigSA@maritz.com > Subject: Re: RE: Jamman goes down during live performance. > > Hi Greg: > > Thanks for your input. We thought that "grokked" was a universal term > that > described with complete accuracy any piece of computer based musical > equipment > that suddenly does a "flip-out." > > Actually, what happened was that the jamman wouldn't respond to switch > commands and actually lost it's LED signpost. We had to try three > cables > before one finally worked. So our guess is that the switch is just > fine. But > we will check again. > > Best, > the LoOpDoctOrs > > From ???@??? Tue Feb 24 22:36:13 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 24 12:26:43 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y7Qw5-0000Tx-00; Tue, 24 Feb 1998 12:26:41 -0800 From: Fmplautus@aol.com Message-ID: <756a6bd9.34f32abb@aol.com> Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 15:16:56 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Re: RE: Jamman goes down during live performance. Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 78 Resent-Message-ID: <"qtEmeB.A.PoG.Jsy80"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3629 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 12:26:41 -0800 X-UIDL: 3444f185008af478c5777e2d1bffefd7 Wasn't "grokked" from the old Robert Heinlein sci fi novel, Stranger in a Strange Land? If so, and "grokked" has come to mean musical meltdown of computer based boxes, then you know why, with all due respect to Hendrix, the sixties aren't the nineties... Best, the LoOpDoctOrs From ???@??? Tue Feb 24 22:36:15 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 24 12:35:46 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y7R4i-0001eg-00; Tue, 24 Feb 1998 12:35:36 -0800 Message-Id: <2.2.32.19980224202819.00a6aea0@pop.chromatic.com> X-Sender: kflint@pop.chromatic.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 2.2 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 12:28:19 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Kim Flint Subject: RE: RE: Jamman goes down during live performance. Resent-Message-ID: <"K7LoX.A.n3.Y3y80"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3630 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 12:35:36 -0800 X-UIDL: 8a5fdbde7e72d155a1800eeae369830f At 02:13 PM 2/24/98 -0600, Liebig, Steuart A. wrote: >Well, > >I'm a dinosaur and "grok," to me, refers to "Stranger in a Strange Land" >by R. Heinlein . . . and in true '70s speak, means to "get it" in a >sort of total experience/gestalt kinda way. > >Hopelessly dated. > I'm not sure if I'm a dinosaur yet, but I read that book as a kid and "grok" has irreversibly had this meaning for me ever since. Interesting how the word moved out of fiction and into common usage. I see it used all the time, in otherwise contemporary media. I'll add it to the official Looper's Delight Dictionary so that we can avoid this confusion in the future. ;-) kim _______________________________________________________ Kim Flint 408-752-9284 Mpact Systems Engineering kflint@chromatic.com Chromatic Research http://www.chromatic.com From ???@??? Tue Feb 24 22:36:29 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 24 14:26:43 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y7SoC-0004XQ-00; Tue, 24 Feb 1998 14:26:40 -0800 From: PJBMHB@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 17:20:40 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Jamman goes down during live performance. Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 16-bit for Windows sub 41 Resent-Message-ID: <"SuaD1D.A.lrD.Cg080"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3631 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 14:26:40 -0800 X-UIDL: 802f5223695f150c2e306f2159b7072d i think that reading about jammer folk has jinxed me because my jampuppy has started acting strange. it completely goes quiet and then will fade back in and out. i take it that the pot is whacked because it has always been kind of noisy. any ideas about replacement or would a squirt or 2 of some cleaner do the trick? i think i remember something about lame pots in the jammen a while back. damning you all for jinxing my jamman! =-( PJ From ???@??? Tue Feb 24 22:36:33 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 24 15:06:27 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y7TQb-0000yJ-00; Tue, 24 Feb 1998 15:06:21 -0800 Message-ID: <34F35131.788806B5@vtx.ch> Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 00:01:05 +0100 From: "c.voit" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight Subject: midi patch bay search Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"K3w2G.A.gO.mE180"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3632 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 15:06:21 -0800 X-UIDL: e78bf66c57f609db3e1ffc246ad9d193 Salut can somebody put me on the track of a midi patch bay here are some notes about my problem midi sources: Gr50 guit synth MMT8 midi seq PMC 10 midi footcontroler midi targets: GR 50 (global ch) G Force (multi fx) Quadvrb (multi fx) 4 pole (filter) 2 plexes (plexes) so what I see is a 4 in 4 out with mutiple merge and thru with heavy filtering possibilities some of the targets need midi clock from the MMT others need low timing delay (wich can be ............ sorry I lost you I'll stop that simpler: a matrix type of patcher with good filtering ehhh for live use "no computer" Anything Merci Claude From ???@??? Tue Feb 24 22:36:35 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 24 15:29:34 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y7Tn1-0003Xw-00; Tue, 24 Feb 1998 15:29:31 -0800 Date: 24 Feb 1998 23:25:25 -0000 Message-ID: <19980224232525.8344.qmail@omni2.voicenet.com> From: floyd@voicenet.com To: c.voit@vtx.ch Subject: Re: midi patchbay Cc: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Resent-Message-ID: <"p4C_pC.A.c4C.Ec180"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3633 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 15:29:31 -0800 X-UIDL: a81e65980e31d208b5b3e31313f719c1 If you do any live playing at all with your rig you should definitely consider a MOTU MidiTimePiece. It may be more than you need in terms of ins and outs (although it's nice to have room to grow, eh?) and it may have some functions you don't need like SMPTE generation and syncing..... but you can program it with many different configuration patches and easily select them from the front panel. And you can program different functions for the knobs like sending muliple patch changes to different ports and channels. It also has two programmable pedal (on off or continuous) inputs. Go for it :) From ???@??? Tue Feb 24 22:36:39 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 24 15:56:52 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y7UDS-0006OQ-00; Tue, 24 Feb 1998 15:56:50 -0800 From: Paolo Valladolid Message-Id: <199802242352.PAA06784@waynesworld.ucsd.edu> Subject: Re: Re: screaming guitar To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 15:52:44 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: <1.5.4.32.19980214021157.0067bbdc@tiac.net> from "Reginald Hunt" at Feb 13, 98 09:11:57 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"5SQ3f.A.kgF.S1180"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3634 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 15:56:50 -0800 X-UIDL: fd5c2bc54620ddcb1399c90ba5d5069c > Are you referring to the Garvikord made by Bob Grawi? I actually bought a > cassette of his stuff when I saw him in Grand Central Station! > > Reg If you're talking about a kora made out of metal instead of wood, probably yes! Cheers, Paolo > >I just saw some video clips of the Gravikords, Whirlies, And Pyrophones > >event in New York (yes it is connected to the book/CD of the same name) > >in a local news program. I saw glimpses of the Gravikord (an African > >kora built out of metal parts and other stuff), the Pyrophone, and the > >bike that plays horns when you pedal it. > > > >Any idea if a video is available of this event? From ???@??? Tue Feb 24 22:36:47 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 24 16:23:01 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y7Uch-0001Ts-00; Tue, 24 Feb 1998 16:22:55 -0800 From: "Jesse Kudler" To: Subject: Re: Effects Loop Question Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 19:22:18 -0500 Message-ID: <01bd4183$6e686ae0$714c8581@jkudler.stu.wesleyan.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Resent-Message-ID: <"AH4-EB.A.kz.GN280"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3635 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 16:22:55 -0800 X-UIDL: 91309ac981e26c1f1d03bc03c44f2389 Thanks a lot for the help. Hopefully, I'll have some time to mess around with it soon. -Jesse -----Original Message----- From: Chuck Zwicky To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Date: Tuesday, February 24, 1998 10:25 AM Subject: Re: Effects Loop Question >Jesse, > Yes, the dBu and dBm scales are the same, while the dBm scale is offset >from those by 11.23dB. > >You should use the setting on the amp which allows you to set the vortex >input level for sufficient headroom while providing unity gain while >switching the effect loop in and out of the signal path. I would guess that >the +2 or the -11 would both work, and the -11 will provide more headroom >through the vortex, at the expense of the signal to noise ratio. > >-Chuck Zwicky > > >At 01:25 AM 2/24/98 -0500, you wrote: >>This is probably a naive question, but here goes: >> >>I've never used my amp's effects loop, but I want to try running my Vortex >>through it. The manual says the nominal output is -2dBu, but my amp only >>has settings for +2dBv, -11dBv, and -24dBv. Do I just use the closest? >>Will this be okay? Are "u" and "v" the same here? >> >>Also, is there a significant difference between going from guitar to effect >>to amp and using the amp's effect loop? >> >>Thanks in advance for your help. >> >>-Jesse >> >> >> >> > > From ???@??? Tue Feb 24 22:36:53 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 24 17:18:08 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y7VU1-0007Cb-00; Tue, 24 Feb 1998 17:18:01 -0800 Message-ID: <19980225011018.6372.rocketmail@send1d.yahoomail.com> Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 17:10:18 -0800 (PST) From: Bret Subject: echoplex and static discharge To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Resent-Message-ID: <"a-mXHD.A.qMG.1A380"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3636 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 17:18:01 -0800 X-UIDL: b8722dbe4cfcc9407b281ff6efdc6a29 dt wrote: to add to it: in my experience, the echoplex will do a complete reset whenst the fusspedal receives any static dis-charge..... ------------ David, I too had this problem with the EDP, here in Boulder (dry air causing high static charges). The problem was frequent, I was most frustrated. Kim suggested I insulate the ground of the footpedal's jack from the metal case of the footpedal. I found that Radio Shack had a pack of flexible, plastic grommets in assorted sizes. One of the larger sizes grommets from this pack perfectly fits around the threaded barrel of the jack, and inside the hole of the case. This change completely resolved the static-reset problem, and returned me to loopful bliss. ground lifted, bret _________________________________________________________ DO YOU YAHOO!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com From ???@??? Tue Feb 24 22:37:02 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 24 19:15:33 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y7XJj-0002dD-00; Tue, 24 Feb 1998 19:15:31 -0800 Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 22:10:20 -0500 (EST) From: JJavid@aol.com Message-ID: <980224221018_456060235@mrin51.mx> To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Unsubscribe Resent-Message-ID: <"LQGbSD.A.W-B.cv480"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3637 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 19:15:31 -0800 X-UIDL: adb75daddccc9d6ad48d48ad265587bc Unsubsribe From ???@??? Tue Feb 24 22:37:06 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 24 20:05:08 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y7Y5h-0007g3-00; Tue, 24 Feb 1998 20:05:05 -0800 Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19980224212857.007e5b10@wavefront.com> X-Sender: chuck.zwicky@wavefront.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 21:28:57 -0600 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Chuck Zwicky Subject: Re: Effects Loop Question In-Reply-To: <3.0.5.32.19980224091321.007b5d90@wavefront.com> References: <01bd40ed$0c0dcde0$714c8581@jkudler.stu.wesleyan.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"rA97-D.A.-2G.7e580"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3641 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 20:05:05 -0800 X-UIDL: bf0be8b596a862596a11a333ef05584d OOps! I meant to say that the dBu and dBv scales are the same... At 09:13 AM 2/24/98 -0600, you wrote: >Jesse, > Yes, the dBu and dBm scales are the same, while the dBm scale is offset >from those by 11.23dB. > >You should use the setting on the amp which allows you to set the vortex >input level for sufficient headroom while providing unity gain while >switching the effect loop in and out of the signal path. I would guess that >the +2 or the -11 would both work, and the -11 will provide more headroom >through the vortex, at the expense of the signal to noise ratio. > >-Chuck Zwicky > > >At 01:25 AM 2/24/98 -0500, you wrote: >>This is probably a naive question, but here goes: >> >>I've never used my amp's effects loop, but I want to try running my Vortex >>through it. The manual says the nominal output is -2dBu, but my amp only >>has settings for +2dBv, -11dBv, and -24dBv. Do I just use the closest? >>Will this be okay? Are "u" and "v" the same here? >> >>Also, is there a significant difference between going from guitar to effect >>to amp and using the amp's effect loop? >> >>Thanks in advance for your help. >> >>-Jesse >> >> >> >> > > > From ???@??? Tue Feb 24 22:37:02 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 24 19:34:51 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y7XcJ-0004Os-00; Tue, 24 Feb 1998 19:34:43 -0800 From: Texture444@aol.com Message-ID: <66a153f1.34f39035@aol.com> Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 22:29:52 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: echoplex and static discharge Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 84 Resent-Message-ID: <"T2QizB.A.tuD.BC580"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3638 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 19:34:43 -0800 X-UIDL: 6f25412e168b397a471ff848556875f4 thanks for that info, bret & kim! best, dt From ???@??? Tue Feb 24 22:37:03 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 24 19:41:25 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y7Xik-0005LF-00; Tue, 24 Feb 1998 19:41:22 -0800 Message-Id: <1.5.4.32.19980225033117.00924f34@pop.mindspring.com> X-Sender: gls@pop.mindspring.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 21:31:17 -0600 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Grover Sheffield Subject: Re: boomerang phrase sampler Resent-Message-ID: <"p53aQ.A.IDE.rE580"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3639 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 19:41:22 -0800 X-UIDL: 35dd05a12e20b86978100a420471927d Michael, Get the dealer to give you a trial period. I purchased one and liked everything about it except the high end fidelity was not quite what I wanted for acoustic guitar. It appears to be a great machine with that caveat. (The EDP has a higher sampling rate). Good luck! Grover At 07:13 PM 2/23/98 -0500, you wrote: >hello everyone, > >i am new to the list so i am sorry if this has already been discussed. i >have been thinking about purchasing a boomerang for sometime now. i have >heard only good things about them. i was wondering if there is anything >that i should be warned about before making my purchase. > >thank you, > >michael > > > From ???@??? Tue Feb 24 22:37:04 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 24 19:43:01 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y7XkH-0005ZD-00; Tue, 24 Feb 1998 19:42:57 -0800 From: Texture444@aol.com Message-ID: <2b85f974.34f39150@aol.com> Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 22:34:32 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Re: ol' pin cut manuever? Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 84 Resent-Message-ID: <"Z9d5OD.A._TE.iG580"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3640 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 19:42:57 -0800 X-UIDL: 05480a7d809caceb82d1dee5c9020b8a kim, me receiveth good'n'helpful infos! kein fangs, aber: mit thanks, dt From ???@??? Tue Feb 24 22:37:18 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 24 20:40:31 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y7Ydx-0002qP-00; Tue, 24 Feb 1998 20:40:29 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 21:20:03 -0700 Subject: Boulder, CO folks (loop content too) Message-ID: <19980224.212106.4422.1.zenchi@juno.com> References: <215C1D5A0FFDD011B3CC00805FC18C29238B79@ntsrv2> X-Mailer: Juno 1.49 X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 0-20 From: zenchi@juno.com (Robert L Williams) Resent-Message-ID: <"dI-sbB.A.uFC.t-580"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3642 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 20:40:29 -0800 X-UIDL: 6e5f0334b86fb88f868121ec116ae627 Either of you Boulderites familiar with a synthist named Derek Van Scoten or a Stick player named Steve Hahn? I'm told they're both based in the Boulder area and have heard nothing but good things about them. I'd love to meet up with both of you (or anyone else in the Denver/Boulder area) in the near future. Because my band and my equipment have limitations, I'm not doing a whole lot of looping in our shows. A general question for everyone is.... If your collaborators are not improv based and you're working with "standard" song structures, how do you integrate loops? Intros and Finales are the most natural places, but I'm interested in blurring the lines. Thanks, Robert dERiSiOn _____________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] From ???@??? Tue Feb 24 22:37:21 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 24 20:47:59 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y7Yl8-0003tJ-00; Tue, 24 Feb 1998 20:47:54 -0800 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <34F35131.788806B5@vtx.ch> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: klaw@iglou.com Subject: Re: midi patch bay search Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 23:43:54 -0500 Resent-Message-ID: <"8dskcC.A.BKD.SG680"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3643 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 20:47:54 -0800 X-UIDL: 5448605a147f0f63e29f6051d8222cb8 I would highly recommend the DMC mx8 . Very cool midi processors ,filters 6 in 8 out usually find em cheap used. Best K LAW >Salut > >can somebody put me on the track of a midi patch bay > >here are some notes about my problem > >midi sources: > >Gr50 guit synth >MMT8 midi seq >PMC 10 midi footcontroler > >midi targets: > >GR 50 (global ch) >G Force (multi fx) >Quadvrb (multi fx) >4 pole (filter) >2 plexes (plexes) > >so what I see is a 4 in 4 out with mutiple merge and thru with heavy >filtering possibilities some of the targets need midi clock from the MMT >others need low timing delay (wich can be ............ sorry I lost >you I'll stop that > >simpler: a matrix type of patcher with good filtering > >ehhh for live use "no computer" > >Anything > >Merci > >Claude From ???@??? Tue Feb 24 22:37:27 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 24 21:23:09 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y7ZJ8-0007Li-00; Tue, 24 Feb 1998 21:23:02 -0800 Message-Id: <3.0.2.32.19980224231624.006c1f28@pop.flash.net> X-Sender: jbstudio@pop.flash.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.2 (32) Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 23:16:24 -0600 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: John Michael Beard Subject: Re: Unsubscribe In-Reply-To: <980224221018_456060235@mrin51.mx> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"qX9zAC.A.gSG.im680"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3644 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 21:23:02 -0800 X-UIDL: c85db5c949b4ea08b782d4effc3972bd At 10:10 PM 2/24/98 -0500, you wrote: >Unsubsribe > > > Is this a joke? From ???@??? Tue Feb 24 22:37:30 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 24 21:39:55 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y7ZZQ-0001Ox-00; Tue, 24 Feb 1998 21:39:52 -0800 From: Marzzz@aol.com Message-ID: <66a1cc46.34f3ad7d@aol.com> Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 00:34:51 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: echoplex and static discharge Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 82 Resent-Message-ID: <"aa06b.A.I3.C3680"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3645 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 21:39:52 -0800 X-UIDL: 7f0caebcd5519ed3420f0bf7d0b223d7 In a message dated 2/24/98 7:16:35 PM, Bret wrote: >dt wrote: >to add to it: >in my experience, the echoplex will do a complete >reset whenst the fusspedal >receives any static dis-charge..... >------------ >David, > >I too had this problem with the EDP, here in Boulder (dry air causing >high static charges). The problem was frequent, I was most >frustrated. Kim suggested I insulate the ground of the footpedal's >jack from the metal case of the footpedal. I found that Radio Shack >had a pack of flexible, plastic grommets in assorted sizes. One of >the larger sizes grommets from this pack perfectly fits around the >threaded barrel of the jack, and inside the hole of the case. This >change completely resolved the static-reset problem, and returned me >to loopful bliss. For what it's worth, I live in an apartment in Chicago, dry forced-air heating with carpet galore, lightening practically shooting out from my hands when touching things. I have had NO PROBLEMS (knocking on wood) with my new EDP nor its footpedal. Cord connecting the footpedal with the EDP is a Spectroflex guitar cable.... Marshall From ???@??? Tue Feb 24 22:37:31 1998 >From kflint Tue Feb 24 22:04:56 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y7Zxe-0003sW-00; Tue, 24 Feb 1998 22:04:54 -0800 Message-ID: <34F3B3F3.865@dmans.com> Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 00:02:27 -0600 From: "Mikell D. Nelson" Reply-To: mnelson@dmans.com Organization: Boomerang Musical Products X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (Win95; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: boomerang phrase sampler References: <3.0.5.32.19980223230546.007dd450@wavefront.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"G4k4aB.A.vUD.bP780"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3646 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 22:04:54 -0800 X-UIDL: 6cc52727febe7f6d04f658eb62276ee5 Chuck Zwicky wrote: > > The boomerang makes a loud popping sound whenever you engage the > layer/overdub function. > I'm making this comment because of the absolute quality of the above statement. It sounds like Chuck is saying "All Rangs make a pop everytime you add a layer". I think a fairer statement is "When connected in certain ways the Rang sometimes makes a pop when adding a layer". The bass player in my band uses a 'Rang on about 80% of our tunes with stacking (overdub) on many tunes. There are no noticeable artifacts. I use my Rang in the effects loop of my tube amp and have no problems with clicks or pops. We've sold about 1200 Rangs and very, very occasionally hear this comment. The worst scenario seems to be instrument->Rang->amp with the treble control set high and the Rang gain structure not optimized. The best situation appears to be with the Rang in an effects loop or AUX send with settings optimized. I performed a solo set at a local club last summer, just me, my guitar, amp, and a Rang. The most complex loop had 4 layers while I played a fifth part. There were no pops or clicks of any kind. Mike Nelson Boomerang Musical Products PO Box 541595 Dallas, TX 75354-1595 Tel 800-530-4699 (outside USA, 214-340-6913) Fax 214-343-1038 email mnelson@dmans.com web page http://www.boomerangmusic.com From ???@??? Wed Feb 25 10:06:52 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 25 07:26:34 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y7ij9-0000fn-00; Wed, 25 Feb 1998 07:26:31 -0800 Message-Id: <215C1D5A0FFDD011B3CC00805FC18C29238B86@NTSRV2> From: "Hogan, Greg (Exchange)" To: "'Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com'" Subject: RE: Jamman goes down during live performance. Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 10:20:05 -0500 X-Priority: 3 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) Content-Type: text/plain Resent-Message-ID: <"2LfLwC.A.bP.MdD90"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3647 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 07:26:31 -0800 X-UIDL: a2a7f8e6032c53fd3cb671271dd40041 Hi PJ, Usually when the pots fail they will be noisy when you turn them. The pots are sealed in such a way that I have never seen cleaning them help with any problem. The symptom that you have described is a new one to me. At what type of a frequency does it occur? Does it show any other symptoms like the display dimming or resetting? Does your only your recorded signal go out or only your input(dry) signal or both? Please contact me and I will do my best to help you. Best regards, Greg Hogan Lexicon Customer Service Phone +781-280-0372 FAX +781-280-0499 > ---------- > From: PJBMHB@aol.com[SMTP:PJBMHB@aol.com] > Reply To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com > Sent: Tuesday, February 24, 1998 5:25 PM > To: GHogan@lexicon.com > Subject: Re: Jamman goes down during live performance. > > i think that reading about jammer folk has jinxed me because my > jampuppy has > started acting strange. it completely goes quiet and then will fade > back in > and out. i take it that the pot is whacked because it has always been > kind of > noisy. any ideas about replacement or would a squirt or 2 of some > cleaner do > the trick? i think i remember something about lame pots in the jammen > a while > back. damning you all for jinxing my jamman! =-( PJ > From ???@??? Wed Feb 25 10:06:52 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 25 07:38:44 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y7iuw-0001tL-00; Wed, 25 Feb 1998 07:38:42 -0800 Message-Id: <199802251540.IAA23777@hyper.dimensional.com> From: "Scott Bullerwell" To: Subject: Re: Boulder, CO folks (loop content too) Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 08:31:45 -0700 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"OMpL9B.A.XWB.2oD90"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3648 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 07:38:42 -0800 X-UIDL: a2d660586bc47ead35701caccf2ca026 Steve Hahn is my very good pal, and in fact is sitting in front of a computer about 30 feet from me right now. Scott Bullerwell tanelorn@dimensional.com Boulder, Colorado, USA ---------- > From: Robert L Williams > To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com > Subject: Boulder, CO folks (loop content too) > Date: Tuesday, February 24, 1998 21:20 > > Either of you Boulderites familiar with a synthist named > Derek Van Scoten or a Stick player named Steve Hahn? > I'm told they're both based in the Boulder area and have > heard nothing but good things about them. > > I'd love to meet up with both of you (or anyone else in > the Denver/Boulder area) in the near future. > > Because my band and my equipment have limitations, I'm > not doing a whole lot of looping in our shows. A general > question for everyone is.... > > If your collaborators are not improv based and you're working > with "standard" song structures, how do you integrate loops? > > Intros and Finales are the most natural places, but I'm interested > in blurring the lines. > > Thanks, > Robert > dERiSiOn > > _____________________________________________________________________ > You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. > Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com > Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] > From ???@??? Wed Feb 25 10:07:01 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 25 08:58:37 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y7kA6-0001aj-00; Wed, 25 Feb 1998 08:58:26 -0800 Message-Id: <199802251635.IAA11954@gw1.bi-tech.com> From: "Matt McCabe" To: Subject: Re: Boulder, CO folks (loop content too) Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 08:51:47 -0800 X-Msmail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1161 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"9_6aRD.A.9n.jwE90"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3649 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 08:58:26 -0800 X-UIDL: 3a9939758ad412ad6eb6b91408e9375e > From: Robert L Williams > If your collaborators are not improv based and you're working > with "standard" song structures, how do you integrate loops? > > Intros and Finales are the most natural places, but I'm interested > in blurring the lines. Although not a true loop per se, I'm been experimenting with setting up my JamMan with a long delay time that corresponds to the tempo of the song (normally 1 or 2 bars) with a feedback setting of 4 to 8 (depending on the sound I'm shooting for). Then I manually loop the guitar part (i.e. I physically play it over and over) into the delay line. This enables me to play off of the delay and produce loop-like textures while following the chord structure of the song. The level of the delay line is set "behind" the live guitar....so that the repeated figure adds atmosphere without conflicting with the live (manually looped) guitar. One advantage to this method is that if the tempo of the song shifts, you are not locked into a fixed loop length that soon becomes out of sync with the rest of the music. It's easy enough to re-tap the tempo and keep going without losing the "feel" or "texture" of the loop. Matt From ???@??? Wed Feb 25 10:07:01 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 25 09:11:41 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y7kMs-0003K2-00; Wed, 25 Feb 1998 09:11:38 -0800 Message-ID: <34F44F19.58327AB8@jps.net> Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 09:04:25 -0800 From: Roland Eberle X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Unsubscribe References: <980224221018_456060235@mrin51.mx> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"NhWCEB.A.3VC.P9E90"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3650 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 09:11:38 -0800 X-UIDL: c4a06a68e6f32a4b73edf97cc3724ec3 JJavid@aol.com wrote: > Unsubsribe here we go again From ???@??? Wed Feb 25 10:07:07 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 25 09:56:36 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y7l4L-0000Wt-00; Wed, 25 Feb 1998 09:56:33 -0800 Mime-Version: 1.0 Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 09:45:13 -0800 Message-ID: <00096ED3.----@wj.com> From: Mike.Biffle@wj.com (Mike Biffle) Subject: Re[2]: Boulder, CO folks (loop content too) To: , Mike.Biffle@wj.com, "Matt McCabe" Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Description: cc:Mail note part Resent-Message-ID: <"Yw9BUC.A.-OH.3oF90"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3651 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 09:56:33 -0800 X-UIDL: 03201a0427dd8e513485027d17905c28 Robert L Williams said: > If your collaborators are not improv based and you're working > with "standard" song structures, how do you integrate loops? > Intros and Finales are the most natural places, but I'm interested > in blurring the lines. Matt McCabe wrote: Although not a true loop per se, I'm been experimenting with setting up my JamMan with a long delay time that corresponds to the tempo of the song (normally 1 or 2 bars) with a feedback setting of 4 to 8 (depending on the sound I'm shooting for). Then I manually loop the guitar part (i.e. I physically play it over and over) into the delay line. This enables me to play off of the delay and produce loop-like textures while following the chord structure of the song. The level of the delay line is set "behind" the live guitar....so that the repeated figure adds atmosphere without conflicting with the live (manually looped) guitar. Snip... I enjoy using around 1.5 second delay with regen on an exp pedal controlling input level and a second controller from somewhere controlling regen. Either another exp pedal or a knob or a cc toggle on my PMC-10. Setting the regen at a appropriate decay time and then swelling echo pads on preferred notes produces nice dense backdrops during solos as well as allows chords to float across bar lines while moving on to other figures. These are short "loops", but with that regen attached to a controller they can become quite long and provide dense segueway material if desired. With a JamMan or Plex you can just tap in a longer length and crank the regen for 'real' looplike happenings. My LXP15 has a couple of algorythyms which when regen hits 100% they lock out wet input, which is pretty useful for quick pad-like atmospheres. I also really enjoyed using the JamMan for triplet delay as well ala Edge from U2. When the band sped up or slowed down... Presto! New tap tempo. -biffoz From ???@??? Wed Feb 25 19:06:01 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 25 11:08:52 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y7mCH-0000rM-00; Wed, 25 Feb 1998 11:08:49 -0800 Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 11:03:11 -0800 (PST) From: Rik Elswit Message-Id: <199802251903.LAA28118@well.com> To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: boomerang phrase sampler Resent-Message-ID: <"fnZ8eB.A.pH.CsG90"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3652 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 11:08:49 -0800 X-UIDL: 6f707d33b1a7e57e6fdadef28a59a4ff Grover Sheffield writes: "Get the dealer to give you a trial period." That's some of the best advice you'll read online. Any reputable store should give you a no-fault trial period to be sure that the device works fro you. If your music dealer won't do that, change dealers. From ???@??? Wed Feb 25 19:06:02 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 25 11:12:06 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y7mFM-0001IK-00; Wed, 25 Feb 1998 11:12:00 -0800 Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 11:04:41 -0800 (PST) From: Rik Elswit Message-Id: <199802251904.LAA28931@well.com> To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Unsubscribe Resent-Message-ID: <"gyjEO.A.WT.ctG90"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3653 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 11:12:00 -0800 X-UIDL: 6167dee6daf7c0c9bc558ea34fca5440 At 10:10 PM 2/24/98 -0500, you wrote: >Unsubsribe > > > Is this a joke? No, just a typo. From ???@??? Wed Feb 25 19:06:26 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 25 13:56:53 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y7oon-0002Vv-00; Wed, 25 Feb 1998 13:56:45 -0800 Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 16:51:31 -0500 (EST) From: Adam Levin To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Bruford Levin Upper Extremities in Baltimore 4/17/98 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Resent-Message-ID: <"TJ4B5.A.a1B.fKJ90"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3654 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 13:56:45 -0800 X-UIDL: 0dbc607c5ebf421116c54cfc9cf0accf The Baltimore Progressive Rock Showcase Series Orion Sound Studios 2903 Whittington Avenue Baltimore, Maryland Friday, April 17th 1998 - 7:30PM and 10:00PM An Evening With Bruford Levin Upper Extremities Bill Bruford -Drums, Percussion and a little Keyboards Tony Levin -Basses, Stick Chris Botti -Trumpet David Torn -Guitars, Loops TICKETS: Tickets will only be available at Orion on concert nights. See http://www.ari.net/prog/shows/showcase/ for the full concert schedule. As of March 4th tickets for both shows will be available for $15 cash pick up/$16 credit card orders at: Of Sound Mind in Savage Mill 8600 Foundry Street Savage, MD (301)497-6488 Hours: Wed 12-6PM/Thu-Sat 12-8PM ======================================================================== Directions: -Take I-95 to exit 50, Caton Ave. (Just inside the south west side of the 695 beltway) -Take Caton Ave south to the third traffic light and turn left onto Washington Blvd (McDonalds on right/Pollock Johnny's on the left) -Go 1/4 mile up the hill to the U-Haul sign and turn right onto Inverness. -At the end of Inverness, turn left onto Whittington Ave. -Go to the end of Whittington and turn right into the parking lot at 2903 Whittington, in the Whittington Business Center. -Orion is on the right. -Adam --- "...if one strives at hearing for the sake of constant virtue, out of seeking liberation from cyclic existence, gradually one becomes a Hearer." - Chandrakirti From ???@??? Wed Feb 25 19:06:58 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 25 17:50:03 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y7sSX-0003RT-00; Wed, 25 Feb 1998 17:50:01 -0800 Message-Id: <3.0.2.16.19980225140019.215f95b4@texas.net> X-Sender: sharkey@texas.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.2 (16) Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 14:00:19 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: james rhodes Subject: Re: boomerang phrase sampler In-Reply-To: <199802260010.QAA12956@waynesworld.ucsd.edu> References: <34F3B3F3.865@dmans.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"sZ8F-.A.YwC.alM90"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3661 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 17:50:01 -0800 X-UIDL: ed971a8041f39faf469bfe8c582be920 well for what its worth,,,a friend of mine tried his Koa Steinberger through a rang TODAY at a music store,,,and said that it was WAY too noisey.. basically he wasnt impressed,,,and decided no looper was better than one that popped and hissed.... this is not my opinion,,, just passing it along james At 04:10 PM 2/25/98 -0800, you wrote: >Victor Wooten, as I understand it, is a 'Rang user. I suspect he >might be using it on a few tracks of Bela Fleck And The Flecktones' >Live Art double CD, but I can't tell. I haven't detected any >excessive noise on Wooten's bass sounds but then I'm not an audiophile >either. :) > >Cheers, > >Paolo Valladolid > --------------------------------------------------------------- >|Moderator of Digital Guitar Digest, an Internet mailing list |\ >|for Music Technology and Stringed Instruments | \ > ---------------------------------------------------------------- | >\ finger pvallado@waynesworld.ucsd.edu for more info \ | > \ http://waynesworld.ucsd.edu/DigitalGuitar/home.html \| > ----------------------------------------------------------------- > > > From ???@??? Wed Feb 25 19:06:37 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 25 15:28:07 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y7qF9-0003jp-00; Wed, 25 Feb 1998 15:28:03 -0800 From: lwordsman@pirnie.com Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 18:26:53 -0500 Message-Id: <199802252326.SAA00040@mailnet.malcolmpirnie.com> To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Novice question X-Mailer: MailNet 4.10 Resent-Message-ID: <"lOgc9B.A.bAD.GgK90"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3655 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 15:28:03 -0800 X-UIDL: eb1dc09a79a10535ae37434e547e14a1 Mike.Biffle wrote that swelling echo pads on preferred notes produces nice dense backdrops during solos as well as allows chords to float across bar lines while moving on to other figures. and also mentioned quick pad-like atmospheres. I'm new to this and not familiar with the term PAD. What does that mean. From ???@??? Wed Feb 25 19:06:39 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 25 15:48:10 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y7qYW-0006AJ-00; Wed, 25 Feb 1998 15:48:04 -0800 Mime-Version: 1.0 Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 15:35:54 -0800 Message-ID: <00097454.----@wj.com> From: Mike.Biffle@wj.com (Mike Biffle) Subject: Re: Novice question To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com, Mike.Biffle@wj.com, lwordsman@pirnie.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Description: cc:Mail note part Resent-Message-ID: <"kxO18D.A.O3E.7vK90"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3657 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 15:48:04 -0800 X-UIDL: 896f0eea4566b8166ade8aa8ad22cebb I call this a pad because it supports more obvious melody. Synth sounds which do this are usually called pads. I'm not sure where the term really originated. I also call them clouds or washes as well. Hope that helps... -mb ************************************************* Mike.Biffle wrote that swelling echo pads on preferred notes produces nice dense backdrops during solos as well as allows chords to float across bar lines while moving on to other figures. and also mentioned quick pad-like atmospheres. I'm new to this and not familiar with the term PAD. What does that mean. From ???@??? Wed Feb 25 19:06:38 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 25 15:44:17 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y7qUk-0005eC-00; Wed, 25 Feb 1998 15:44:10 -0800 Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 18:38:23 -0500 From: buzzard@world.std.com (Sean T Barrett) Message-Id: <199802252338.AA19883@world.std.com> To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Boulder, CO folks (loop content too) References: <215C1D5A0FFDD011B3CC00805FC18C29238B79@ntsrv2> Resent-Message-ID: <"scnvC.A.-mE.AuK90"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3656 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 15:44:10 -0800 X-UIDL: a1883dd3dbd1a4c1fb56180e0d21bc4d >Because my band and my equipment have limitations, I'm >not doing a whole lot of looping in our shows. A general >question for everyone is.... > >If your collaborators are not improv based and you're working >with "standard" song structures, how do you integrate loops? > >Intros and Finales are the most natural places, but I'm interested >in blurring the lines. This is in no way an answer, but I've always enjoyed playing along to CDs and "adding" rhythm and semi-lead guitar parts to them. So recently I've been exploring trying to use my Jamman to do this. A lot of assumptions I would have made about it not working don't seem to be true: - the music can be relatively dense already - the music doesn't have to stick to a single key Now, the latter one is an iffy proposition. Since I'm trying to make really sustained looping textures, those textures _do_ need to fit throughout. So an atonal speed metal monstrosity is not going to cut it. But I've found that a lot of songs may use, say, a I/IV/V and a major II or a major VI or some such in their main chord progression (if they modulate or whatever, that's something different entirely). One obvious approach in this case would be to restrict yourself to notes that come from all of the keys needed to play all of the chords (e.g. the notes in common between C and D to cover C,D,F,G,A). But, I've found I can get away with picking a single key which is "compatible" with the song, and limiting myself to notes from that key (and rarely an accidental or two); the song itself has an "awkward" harmonic structure implying that key yet deviating it, and the textural loop sustaining that key does not end up seeming too dissonant (well, if done right). I haven't really described what I _do_, but there's no real science to that. I've used loop lengths with no time relation, loops that are 4 beats or 2 beats long in a 4/4 song, loops that are 5 or 3 beats for a 4/4 song which shift around out of phase in pleasing ways, etc. Sometimes I turn the mix knob so the performed notes are much louder than the loop, and in the context of a dense song, the loop becomes effectively inaudible. This often makes for an interesting effect when the song ends, and I stop playing, and whatever I've been playing recently has built into a loop I couldn't hear (and wasn't consciously thinking about). Of course, it sometimes sounds like crap, but it's still a pleasant surprise to suddenly hear this thing and realize it was always there... and you can turn it down quickly enough--it just ends up being an oddball outtro. Anyway, I'd say that for me it's an interesting experience and good practice (especially because I'm not actively playing with anyone in the first place); whether it would be for anyone else, I cannot say. My current play-over CD: "King" by Belly. PS: Oh, as to "intros and finales"--a related thing happens to me playing over "Seal My Fate"... It starts very sparse--clean guitar, spare drums, simple major key, nice to put a loop over. Then it's pretty busy, but 2/3 through or so they drop down to the spare arrangement as a little "climax" (hmm, anti-climax? it makes the return to the chorus very "big")--so I get a nice moment when it drops back down and the loop becomes very prominent, but has changed drastically from how it sounded at the start. Sean Barrett (in my younger days when I had no looper I used to solo over Let the Power Fall, so this is a nice reversal) From ???@??? Wed Feb 25 19:06:47 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 25 16:14:16 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y7qxr-0001C9-00; Wed, 25 Feb 1998 16:14:15 -0800 From: Paolo Valladolid Message-Id: <199802260010.QAA12956@waynesworld.ucsd.edu> Subject: Re: boomerang phrase sampler Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 16:10:11 -0800 (PST) Cc: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com In-Reply-To: <34F3B3F3.865@dmans.com> from "Mikell D. Nelson" at Feb 25, 98 00:02:27 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"_8CieC.A.6o.rLL90"@ferret> To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3658 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 16:14:15 -0800 X-UIDL: 4a0eb8d3ed73c1d059ee3baaacefc07b Victor Wooten, as I understand it, is a 'Rang user. I suspect he might be using it on a few tracks of Bela Fleck And The Flecktones' Live Art double CD, but I can't tell. I haven't detected any excessive noise on Wooten's bass sounds but then I'm not an audiophile either. :) Cheers, Paolo Valladolid --------------------------------------------------------------- |Moderator of Digital Guitar Digest, an Internet mailing list |\ |for Music Technology and Stringed Instruments | \ ---------------------------------------------------------------- | \ finger pvallado@waynesworld.ucsd.edu for more info \ | \ http://waynesworld.ucsd.edu/DigitalGuitar/home.html \| ----------------------------------------------------------------- From ???@??? Wed Feb 25 19:06:57 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 25 16:58:42 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y7reo-000670-00; Wed, 25 Feb 1998 16:58:38 -0800 Message-ID: <34F4BD11.474A@mindspring.com> Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 16:53:37 -0800 From: Jim Poppen X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.04 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Bill Frisell... Lopping Maniac Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"fxCc1.A.CQF.K1L90"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3659 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 16:58:38 -0800 X-UIDL: d3299868abcfbd749a1320ee6ad18c62 Hi all, For a great sample of Frisell's use of loops, check out http://www.liveconcerts.com/listening/kcrw/980108/bill_frisell. This link has real-audio from Chris Douridas' "Morning Becomes Eclectic", 1/8/98. About ten minutes into the half hour show, Bill gets mighty loopy. A must listen! Bye all, Jim Poppen From ???@??? Wed Feb 25 19:06:58 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 25 17:40:53 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y7sJe-0002IF-00; Wed, 25 Feb 1998 17:40:50 -0800 Message-ID: <01BD422D.604DB9B0.douglas-lawrence@home.com> From: Douglas Lawrence Reply-To: "douglas-lawrence@home.com" To: "'Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com'" Subject: RE: boomerang phrase sampler Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 20:38:47 -0500 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet E-mail/MAPI - 8.0.0.4211 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"QR9hN.A.xtB.GdM90"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3660 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 17:40:50 -0800 X-UIDL: b8e067bb252f76067916ea7cb696309e Paolo, according to the Bass Player interview last month, he uses a JamMan with a custom footpedal setup. That jives with what I saw when I saw him live last year. He had a simple stompbox on the floor and everything else was in the rack. I'm and EDP user who just upgraded (?) from a JamMan. To me, although the EDP may have a better sampling frequency, I would bet it has a worse signal/noise ratio compared to the JamMan. With the EDP I hear a lot more transient noise in my signal, mostly high pitched frequencies. (Just make sure you turn off those halogen lights at home kids!) Just my .02. >Victor Wooten, as I understand it, is a 'Rang user. I suspect he >might be using it on a few tracks of Bela Fleck And The Flecktones' >Live Art double CD, but I can't tell. I haven't detected any >excessive noise on Wooten's bass sounds but then I'm not an audiophile >either. :) >Cheers, >Paolo Valladolid From ???@??? Wed Feb 25 19:06:59 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 25 18:00:50 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y7scv-0004dh-00; Wed, 25 Feb 1998 18:00:45 -0800 Message-ID: <01BD4230.1C221120.douglas-lawrence@home.com> From: Douglas Lawrence Reply-To: "douglas-lawrence@home.com" To: "'Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com'" Subject: RE: EDP goes down during live performance Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 20:58:22 -0500 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet E-mail/MAPI - 8.0.0.4211 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"hdrtAC.A.Y4D.dvM90"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3662 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 18:00:45 -0800 X-UIDL: f092aa35b23e9bf4a95ef102356c7d34 I've had this happen as well, several times in one night even with Loop 5. The EDP just seems to lock up. I really didn't see this until I upgraded to full 16 Mb memory (4Mb 60ns parity chips). Given the long compatibility list for memory that can work in the EDP, it's hard to believe that could be the problem. Maybe I'll see if someone has a memory tester ... >With the older version of the EDP software, the "much reported on these >pages `thermal problem`" plagued the EDP with sudden silence if you used >the undo button. > >Should I still worry about this if I have the new Upgrade software, but >have not "cut the pin"? > >David Kirkdorffer > >-----Original Message----- >From: David Myers [SMTP:dmgraph@bway.net] >Sent: Monday, February 23, 1998 12:28 PM >To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com >Subject: Re: Jamman goes down during live performance. > >I have also had this experience, but with the Echoplex. >Fortunately it was >not onstage, but I WAS twenty minutes into a pretty good >recording. I >didn't do anything strange to produce this, was just in the >middle of an >overdub when pow! the EDP simply reset on me. Anyone else see >this? Only >one such instance so far, but a bummer! From ???@??? Wed Feb 25 19:07:07 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 25 18:59:15 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y7tXV-0002Aa-00; Wed, 25 Feb 1998 18:59:13 -0800 Message-Id: <1.5.4.32.19980226025216.00920a40@pop.mindspring.com> X-Sender: gls@pop.mindspring.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 20:52:16 -0600 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Grover Sheffield Subject: Re: boomerang phrase sampler Resent-Message-ID: <"nIfHQ.A.KgB.5lN90"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3663 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 18:59:13 -0800 X-UIDL: f0dedf4c942b99dd5bdee0ee251a6bf6 Well, my experience with the 'Rang was that it was fairly quiet. It is a sturdy well made box overall; I particularly liked the foot-controlled volume wheel and the reverse and octave change switches built into the pedal. It sounded pretty good with my electric guitar, but I wanted a higher sampling rate for my acoustic stuff. Definitely try the unit if you get a chance (with a trial period, just in case it doesn't do what you want). I talked to several people who were pleased with it for their applications. Rik at Bananas-at-Large has been very helpful. >well for what its worth,,,a friend of mine tried his Koa Steinberger >through a rang TODAY at a music store,,,and said that it was WAY too noisey.. >basically he wasnt impressed,,,and decided no looper was better than one >that popped and hissed.... > >this is not my opinion,,, >just passing it along > >james > > > > > > > > > > >At 04:10 PM 2/25/98 -0800, you wrote: >>Victor Wooten, as I understand it, is a 'Rang user. I suspect he >>might be using it on a few tracks of Bela Fleck And The Flecktones' >>Live Art double CD, but I can't tell. I haven't detected any >>excessive noise on Wooten's bass sounds but then I'm not an audiophile >>either. :) >> >>Cheers, >> >>Paolo Valladolid >> --------------------------------------------------------------- >>|Moderator of Digital Guitar Digest, an Internet mailing list |\ >>|for Music Technology and Stringed Instruments | \ >> ---------------------------------------------------------------- | >>\ finger pvallado@waynesworld.ucsd.edu for more info \ | >> \ http://waynesworld.ucsd.edu/DigitalGuitar/home.html \| >> ----------------------------------------------------------------- >> >> >> > > > From ???@??? Thu Feb 26 09:32:57 1998 >From kflint Wed Feb 25 21:00:53 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y7vRD-0003ez-00; Wed, 25 Feb 1998 21:00:51 -0800 From: ANET@aol.com Message-ID: <7b5ecaab.34f4f5fb@aol.com> Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 23:55:10 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: LEXICON FOOT PEDALS Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 18 Resent-Message-ID: <"ps2AX.A.IDD._YP90"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3664 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 21:00:51 -0800 X-UIDL: 35c22d8e1222ec48e84e92ac9a448a0c Not to beat a dead horse - does everyone agree the Lexicon foot pedals are a poor design or am I off track? I have seen arguments for midi controllers and was looking around on the internet. Was wondering, how would I program a midi controller for the Jamman? Perhaps I should read the manual hey? I have a Dr. Rhythm drum machine which is Midi capable as well, would I be able to set them both to trigger from the midi? I am a little weak on midi. I understand it to be a protocol similar to other communications protocols. It travels at about 33kbs with 5 or 7 pin connectors. Does this mean that all midi capable units are set up like a LAN (Local area network) with a physical ring which addresses each of the hosts on the network? Anyway, I think I'm interested in the MIDI, but don't want to spend a lot of time learning how to work the thing. Anyone feel the old regular analog switches are better? Oh, by the way Greg Hogan at Lexicon, I am in the market for another pedal, but not from Lexicon. Thanks anyway. Regards; John Peters From ???@??? Thu Feb 26 10:55:47 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 26 10:07:10 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y87i7-0005jD-00; Thu, 26 Feb 1998 10:07:07 -0800 Message-Id: <199802261752.JAA26088@scv1.apple.com> Subject: Re: LEXICON FOOT PEDALS Date: Thu, 26 Feb 98 11:53:04 -0000 x-sender: hartne.t@mail.apple.com x-mailer: Claris Emailer 1.1 From: "T.W. Hartnett" To: "Looper's Delight" Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Resent-Message-ID: <"YvIEeC.A.ewE.Y4a90"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3666 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 10:07:07 -0800 X-UIDL: f27f0afb187923623989f243c38c9434 >Not to beat a dead horse - does everyone agree the Lexicon foot pedals are a >poor design or am I off track? They're included at no charge with JamMan and Vortex, and I feel I got what I paid for. They allow you to access the basic functions, and although they're not the best units available, if they'd put some nicer switches in, then some people would complain about having to pay for something they weren't going to use (opting instead for the switches of their choice). Several people have objected to the $100 price on the Echoplex foot controller (which I personally like), but you don't have to pay for it if you don't want it. People are going to have very different ideas of the ideal, or even acceptable switches, so I think Lex went the right route in including some servicable switches with the units, even if they're not the greatest. Some people seem to get along just fine with them. Travis Hartnett From ???@??? Thu Feb 26 09:33:17 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 26 06:26:32 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y84Gc-0001Qm-00; Thu, 26 Feb 1998 06:26:30 -0800 Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19980226082233.00876bd0@wavefront.com> X-Sender: chuck.zwicky@wavefront.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 08:22:33 -0600 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Chuck Zwicky Subject: Re: LEXICON FOOT PEDALS In-Reply-To: <7b5ecaab.34f4f5fb@aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"ZMNpvD.A.6FB.EsX90"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3665 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 06:26:30 -0800 X-UIDL: 02efb731e2d68984cc523833544f3612 My first impression was that the stock lexicon switches were too imprecise. I constructed a few alternative devices, but never was completely happy with them. Later I experimented with a few different midi controllers, eventually settling on the Rolls Midi Wizard. The switches on this are very positive and light. The Jam-Man's functions are set to respond to MIDI program changes 1 through 20. This makes it very easy to interface with any off the shelf MIDI footswitch controller, and you will find that many functions are only available through MIDI, such as fading a loop. At 11:55 PM 2/25/98 EST, you wrote: >Not to beat a dead horse - does everyone agree the Lexicon foot pedals are a >poor design or am I off track? > >I have seen arguments for midi controllers and was looking around on the >internet. >Was wondering, how would I program a midi controller for the Jamman? Perhaps >I should read the manual hey? I have a Dr. Rhythm drum machine which is Midi >capable as well, would I be able to set them both to trigger from the midi? > >I am a little weak on midi. I understand it to be a protocol similar to other >communications protocols. It travels at about 33kbs with 5 or 7 pin >connectors. >Does this mean that all midi capable units are set up like a LAN (Local area >network) with a physical ring which addresses each of the hosts on the >network? > >Anyway, I think I'm interested in the MIDI, but don't want to spend a lot of >time learning how to work the thing. Anyone feel the old regular analog >switches are better? > >Oh, by the way Greg Hogan at Lexicon, I am in the market for another pedal, >but not from Lexicon. Thanks anyway. > >Regards; >John Peters > > > From ???@??? Thu Feb 26 10:55:49 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 26 10:44:49 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y88IW-00024Y-00; Thu, 26 Feb 1998 10:44:44 -0800 X-Sender: kflint@pop.slip.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <01BD4230.1C221120.douglas-lawrence@home.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 10:39:01 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Kim Flint Subject: RE: EDP goes down during live performance Resent-Message-ID: <"YAjEgD.A.0SB.abb90"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3667 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 10:44:44 -0800 X-UIDL: 8a4bf52c1527a207f0a1859eb776043f At 8:58 PM -0500 2/25/98, Douglas Lawrence wrote: >I've had this happen as well, several times in one night even with >Loop 5. The EDP just seems to lock up. I really didn't see this until >I upgraded to full 16 Mb memory (4Mb 60ns parity chips). Given the >long compatibility list for memory that can work in the EDP, it's hard >to believe that could be the problem. Maybe I'll see if someone has >a memory tester ... "locking up" is not a symptom of the old thermal problem, sounds like there is something else wrong there. It could be related to the simms, if something were wrong with them you could see problems where it will freeze or crash. Something like that wouldn't have anything to do with software, it would most likely mean the hardware is broken somewhere. You tried with different simms and didn't see the problem? That might mean there is something wrong with on of the simms you bought. (not too uncommon, unfortunately. whenever one of my computers dies at work that's one of the first things the sysadmins change....) You might narrow it down by just installing one pair to see if it ever fails, and then try the other pair. good luck, kim ______________________________________________________________________ Kim Flint | Looper's Delight kflint@annihilist.com | http://www.annihilist.com/loop/loop.html http://www.annihilist.com/ | Loopers-Delight-request@annihilist.com From ???@??? Thu Feb 26 19:55:43 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 26 11:07:05 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y88e0-0004r2-00; Thu, 26 Feb 1998 11:06:56 -0800 Message-Id: X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise 4.1 Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 11:58:54 -0700 From: Tom Johnson To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Boomerang Phrase Sampler Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Disposition: inline Resent-Message-ID: <"2WCEdB.A.H1D.evb90"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3668 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 11:06:56 -0800 X-UIDL: 9c09ccf59c6b23d1a09e98b8d83496c5 I just bought one a couple of weeks ago and don't have a ton of experience with it, but I can definitely say that I DON'T get this 'loud pop' everyone else is describing. One key to getting better sound that I found is to run it in the effects loop NOT in-line from the instrument--a huge difference in the amount of sound (it's nearly silent now.) I will agree that the sampling rate (and therefore sound quality) is lower than the JamMan (I have a jammer too.) But I like the lo-fi thang, anyway. It's not that big of a difference, though. It's a fun toy to experiment, and has quickly become a very important part of my looping set-up (as important as the JamMan in most respects, more so in some--the reverse function is wonderful!) Tom Johnson Black Poly Chapman Stick #2604 From ???@??? Thu Feb 26 19:56:05 1998 >From kflint Thu Feb 26 15:37:12 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y8CrQ-0001V6-00; Thu, 26 Feb 1998 15:37:04 -0800 Message-ID: <34F5F8BA.C41E965@earthlink.net> Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 18:20:26 -0500 From: Lori Paladido Reply-To: looperanne@earthlink.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.01 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Headless Guitars and Loopers X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"LGpX9D.A.uw.otf90"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3669 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 15:37:04 -0800 X-UIDL: ba3f19cdfc1f874bf683fa8cdf7b3e44 >>In a message dated 2/19/98 11:18:55 AM, Jonathon wrote: >> >>>I just realized that this must be absolutely the only list where >>>one can find people debating the merits of bending a Steinberger >>>or Klein neck. Does anyone have info on a Bass called a Unicorn by Riverhead. It's got a neck ala Steinberger. and a wacky "V" ish shape. I bought one back in the day, and have never seen another like it. Would give an apendage for another one. Ghost From ???@??? Fri Feb 27 11:35:19 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 27 10:48:38 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y8Upj-0005OJ-00; Fri, 27 Feb 1998 10:48:31 -0800 Message-ID: <34F6C433.2EF3@nyfac.com> Date: Fri, 27 Feb 1998 13:48:35 +0000 From: tbajus Reply-To: nyfac2@nyfac.com X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (WinNT; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Beyond Mono and Stereo References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"NQMNOC.A.0PE.ckw90"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3672 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 27 Feb 1998 10:48:31 -0800 X-UIDL: 87182d6f51e9ec4f3d1a94aed0546cfb I'm glad to see the beginning of the end of the extreme overuse of surroundsound in theaters. Around a year ago it seemed like every movie was being mixed like an old Cream record. Esp. the traffic sounds- the position was so overused that it ruined the realism of the movie- sound design is in most cases at its best when you don't really notice it. Listening to the dramatic panning of a passing car sort takes your attention away from the film, and puts it on how clever the mixer must think he is. I have thought for a while that 3d sound might be more useful in music. I think that surreal sonic stuff in music is a lot more fun than in film. My $.02 Trevor From ???@??? Fri Feb 27 10:14:53 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 27 09:56:07 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y8U0x-00075i-00; Fri, 27 Feb 1998 09:56:03 -0800 Message-ID: <00d301bd43a9$3cc4b3e0$c2b854ce@mark.asisoftware.com> From: Mark@asisoftware.com (Mark Kata) To: "Loopers Delight" Subject: Beyond Mono and Stereo Date: Fri, 27 Feb 1998 12:57:57 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Resent-Message-ID: <"5FUAR.A.OIG.-0v90"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3670 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 27 Feb 1998 09:56:03 -0800 X-UIDL: 3ade6cbe534fd8c265e5ea1789658765 I've looped in mono with a single amplifier, in stereo with two amplifiers. I've also used three amplifiers, two for stereo effects and one without any effects. Are there other interesting combinations? Thanks, Mark Kata Mark@asisoftware.com From ???@??? Fri Feb 27 10:36:09 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 27 10:28:06 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y8UVu-0002uI-00; Fri, 27 Feb 1998 10:28:02 -0800 X-Sender: kflint@pop.slip.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <00d301bd43a9$3cc4b3e0$c2b854ce@mark.asisoftware.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Fri, 27 Feb 1998 10:24:13 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Kim Flint Subject: Re: Beyond Mono and Stereo Resent-Message-ID: <"5sIJpB.A.wRC.XTw90"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3671 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 27 Feb 1998 10:28:02 -0800 X-UIDL: 2678d237e3660ed71c7ca004f90f6911 At 12:57 PM -0500 2/27/98, Mark Kata wrote: >I've looped in mono with a single amplifier, in stereo with two amplifiers. >I've also used three amplifiers, two for stereo effects and one without any >effects. > >Are there other interesting combinations? > >Thanks, >Mark Kata >Mark@asisoftware.com I would say the next frontiers in that direction are using six channel surround sound systems in a musical way, and using the new 3d sound technologies which emulate a 3d audio environment with two speakers. The six channel stuff is becoming quite common and will be a part of DVD audio tracks and digital TV type broadcasting. The 3d sound effects are also becoming common and finding most of their current applications in computer games. (The helicopter flies RIGHT OVER YOUR HEAD!!!!....ooooo...) I think both have a lot of musical possibility, and both are becoming mainstream enough to make distribution of music made for it reasonably easy in the near future. kim ______________________________________________________________________ Kim Flint | Looper's Delight kflint@annihilist.com | http://www.annihilist.com/loop/loop.html http://www.annihilist.com/ | Loopers-Delight-request@annihilist.com From ???@??? Fri Feb 27 11:35:21 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 27 11:03:46 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y8V4S-0007Md-00; Fri, 27 Feb 1998 11:03:44 -0800 Message-Id: <199802271854.KAA17200@sonic.sonic.com> Subject: Re: Beyond Mono and Stereo Date: Fri, 27 Feb 98 11:01:19 -0800 x-sender: andy_wolpert@pop.sonic.com x-mailer: Claris Emailer 2.0, March 15, 1997 From: Andy Wolpert To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Resent-Message-ID: <"nxcdFB.A.NMG.Bzw90"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3673 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 27 Feb 1998 11:03:44 -0800 X-UIDL: 5289aaeb2bf0b942f1f91d29295cbde9 >re there other interesting combinations? Only to note that an amplifier itself is an effect. I have experimented with using a few different amps each of which feeds back in a way related to the tone control settings and speaker size. __ _/\_ / \___/ \______ \ Andy Wolpert \__ | Sonic Solutions \ / awolpert@sonic.com / | (415) 893-8043 / \___ __ ___/ \__/ \_____/ From ???@??? Sat Feb 28 11:01:13 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 27 16:16:21 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y8Zwv-0000oY-00; Fri, 27 Feb 1998 16:16:17 -0800 Message-ID: <34F71163.7D79@nyfac.com> Date: Fri, 27 Feb 1998 19:17:55 +0000 From: tbajus Reply-To: nyfac2@nyfac.com X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (WinNT; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: ring modulators References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"3Fk-YC.A.VN.KZ190"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3679 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 27 Feb 1998 16:16:17 -0800 X-UIDL: 45c39eb3405083834d96b2ad5b4837a8 There is a ring modulator patch in the quadraverb+ that is fairly interesting, as well as a resonator patch. I have a friend of mine who tries to steal my quadraverb whenever possible the abuse these functions for his drum machine programming. Trev From ???@??? Sat Feb 28 11:00:49 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 27 13:11:53 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y8X4R-0004p3-00; Fri, 27 Feb 1998 13:11:51 -0800 Message-ID: From: "Ott, John" To: "'Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com'" Subject: RE: Beyond Mono and Stereo Date: Fri, 27 Feb 1998 15:07:21 -0600 X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) Resent-Message-ID: <"6kvcy.A.NGE.Hty90"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3674 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 27 Feb 1998 13:11:51 -0800 X-UIDL: 565a7f501496ad4a25e3eb209af7d501 > >re there other interesting combinations? > Well, my guitar effects are in stereo and feed into the mixer in stereo. Same for my keyboards. That all goes to the main amp / pa in stereo. (and/or the recording system) But I only have one JamMan so the effect loop for looping is in mono on the mixer aux1 and then feeds both channels on the mixer. I control what gets feed to the JamMan on the mixer. I also send a mono signal from the mixer stereo guitar channel to a fender guitar amp for guitar feedback. (aux 2 send) So I have Stereo guitar (effects) and Stereo Keyboards with mono looping on the PA and Stereo guitar going to a mono amp. I'd need a mixer with more aux sends to get the guitar amps in stereo. (and a second amp) It seems to work OK like it is. later John From ???@??? Sat Feb 28 11:01:35 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 27 20:57:25 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y8eKw-0007UC-00; Fri, 27 Feb 1998 20:57:22 -0800 Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Fri, 27 Feb 1998 23:19:26 +0200 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: patrick@his.com (Patrick Smith) Subject: Siobahn Canty Resent-Message-ID: <"t2M7m.A.vtG.Mi590"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3684 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 27 Feb 1998 20:57:22 -0800 X-UIDL: 8e8536f7b9045479c1ff7d82c90394d7 I hope the rest of the list forgives me, but I need to contact this person ASAP. I'm not sure if he's stll on the list so if anyone has is e-mail address I'd appreciate it. Patrick *** *** ** Fingerpaint http://www.his.com/~patrick/FNGP.html *** ** From ???@??? Sat Feb 28 11:01:36 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 27 21:12:43 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y8eZl-00012i-00; Fri, 27 Feb 1998 21:12:41 -0800 Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Fri, 27 Feb 1998 23:34:48 +0200 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: patrick@his.com (Patrick Smith) Subject: DC LOOP SHOW Resent-Message-ID: <"C3m9ZD.A.Yp.dw590"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3685 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 27 Feb 1998 21:12:41 -0800 X-UIDL: 0be276a2f1f0fe8eab4adee7e43bd175 Hello Siobahn, Patrick from Fingerpaint here. Are you intereted in joining forces in a Loop Show. I have a Line on a place in Mt Rainier, MD just over the district line. Hopefully A saturday in April. I'm inviting two of the acts that I did the Philly Loop Show with last year. Let me know ASAP. Patrick *** *** ** Fingerpaint http://www.his.com/~patrick/FNGP.html *** ** From ???@??? Sat Feb 28 11:01:01 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 27 14:34:03 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y8YLx-00050r-00; Fri, 27 Feb 1998 14:34:01 -0800 Message-Id: <1.5.4.16.19980227223915.34e76136@pop.usaor.net> X-Sender: gingkoba@pop.usaor.net X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (16) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Fri, 27 Feb 1998 17:39:15 -0500 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: michael tamburo Subject: ring modulators Resent-Message-ID: <"8Oo3tC.A.OLE.Y5z90"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3675 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 27 Feb 1998 14:34:01 -0800 X-UIDL: ad440c3bab3e11ca2b0d016a0c94ea13 hello, i was wondering if any of you know where i can obtain a ring modulator. (preferably a stomp box version.) i know that paia have kits, but unfortunately i am not mechanically inclined. hope that some of you can help. thank you, michael From ???@??? Sat Feb 28 11:01:03 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 27 15:00:58 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y8Ylx-0000Ix-00; Fri, 27 Feb 1998 15:00:53 -0800 Message-ID: <2148EC143F29D1118BE000805FC13CD01E1FCB@migarexch01.maritz.com> From: "Liebig, Steuart A." To: "'Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com'" Subject: RE: ring modulators Date: Fri, 27 Feb 1998 16:55:00 -0600 X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) Resent-Message-ID: <"MzZN1D.A.J4G.aR090"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3676 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 27 Feb 1998 15:00:53 -0800 X-UIDL: 7e2d6b59c327b6917553c4738ee03288 Black Cat Productions (or something like that) makes one that is a pedal. I read about it on the Analog Man (Ananlog Mike) website. I ran into a guy who was using one and he thought that it did some sick and wonderful things. His band was doing so much insane stuff I couldn't really comment on how it sounded, but as I say, the guy was totally into it (these guys were super serious about gear, so it could be a good piece). The guy said that it IS pricey . . . but then you could try to find an EH Frequency Analyzer and put out some serious bucks for that too. I also have heard that the DOD Gonkulator is kinda cool, though they're not making it anymore from what I understand. Good luck. > ---------- > From: michael tamburo > Reply To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com > Sent: Friday, February 27, 1998 2:34 PM > To: LiebigSA@maritz.com > Subject: ring modulators > > hello, > > i was wondering if any of you know where i can obtain a ring > modulator. > (preferably a stomp box version.) i know that paia have kits, but > unfortunately i am not mechanically inclined. hope that some of you > can help. > > thank you, > > michael > > > > > > From ???@??? Sat Feb 28 11:01:04 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 27 15:14:38 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y8YzE-00025M-00; Fri, 27 Feb 1998 15:14:36 -0800 Message-Id: <199802272308.RAA10215@dfw-ix8.ix.netcom.com> From: "PEDALMAN" To: Subject: Re: ring modulators Date: Fri, 27 Feb 1998 18:07:40 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"fTADBC.A.OTB.ye090"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3677 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 27 Feb 1998 15:14:36 -0800 X-UIDL: e6ce7bad2d4ba79e20437c4bd3781d66 ---------- > From: Liebig, Steuart A. > To: 'Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com' > Subject: RE: ring modulators > Date: Friday, February 27, 1998 5:55 PM > > Black Cat Productions (or something like that) makes one that is a > pedal. I read about it on the Analog Man (Ananlog Mike) website. I ran > into a guy who was using one and he thought that it did some sick and > wonderful things. His band was doing so much insane stuff I couldn't > really comment on how it sounded, but as I say, the guy was totally into > it (these guys were super serious about gear, so it could be a good > piece). > > The guy said that it IS pricey . . . but then you could try to find an > EH Frequency Analyzer and put out some serious bucks for that too. > > I also have heard that the DOD Gonkulator is kinda cool, though they're > not making it anymore from what I understand. > > Good luck. > the Black Cat product is a blue print COPY of the original MAestro ring modutor, thought some of you guys out there would want to know that :-) pedalman Rare and Vintage EFFECTS pedalman@pedalman.com http://www.pedalman.com From ???@??? Sat Feb 28 11:01:06 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 27 15:52:08 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y8ZZS-00062c-00; Fri, 27 Feb 1998 15:52:02 -0800 Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Fri, 27 Feb 1998 15:46:13 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: improv@peak.org (Dave Trenkel) Subject: Re: ring modulators Resent-Message-ID: <"Kyzdq.A.RNF.7C190"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3678 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 27 Feb 1998 15:52:02 -0800 X-UIDL: 44c8b8d52c814a5e62e2f37e47fed3fd >hello, > >i was wondering if any of you know where i can obtain a ring modulator. >(preferably a stomp box version.) i know that paia have kits, but >unfortunately i am not mechanically inclined. hope that some of you can help. > >thank you, > >michael The DOD Gonkulator is kind of a limited stomp box ring mod, with a preset 500hz modulating signal, and is a nice sounding transistor fuzzbox as well. I've heard that they're discontinued, but I see them in stores all the time still, for about $80. I have one and use it a lot, though it doesn't quite match what the ring mod in my modular can do. ________________________________________________________ Dave Trenkel : improv@peak.org : www.peak.org/~improv/ "...there will come a day when you won't have to use gasoline. You'd simply take a cassette and put it in your car, let it run. You'd have to have the proper type of music. Like you take two sticks, put 'em together, make fire. You take some notes and rub 'em together - dum, dum, dum, dum - fire, cosmic fire." -Sun Ra ________________________________________________________ From ???@??? Sat Feb 28 11:01:25 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 27 17:00:28 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y8adc-00054r-00; Fri, 27 Feb 1998 17:00:24 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Date: Fri, 27 Feb 1998 17:52:36 -0700 Subject: Re: ring modulators Message-ID: <19980227.175237.4422.0.zenchi@juno.com> References: X-Mailer: Juno 1.49 X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 0-14,16,18,20-24,26-36 From: zenchi@juno.com (Robert L Williams) Resent-Message-ID: <"g6Ib9D.A.6UE.ND290"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3680 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 27 Feb 1998 17:00:24 -0800 X-UIDL: 618ccfe3f7f4750103992131fd37380a On Fri, 27 Feb 1998 15:46:13 -0800 improv@peak.org (Dave Trenkel) writes: >>hello, >> >>i was wondering if any of you know where i can obtain a ring >modulator. >>(preferably a stomp box version.) i know that paia have kits, but >>unfortunately i am not mechanically inclined. hope that some of you >can help. >> >>thank you, >> >>michael > >The DOD Gonkulator is kind of a limited stomp box ring mod, with a >preset 500hz modulating signal, and is a nice sounding transistor fuzzbox as >well. I've heard that they're discontinued, but I see them in stores all the >time still, for about $80. I have one and use it a lot, though it doesn't >quite match what the ring mod in my modular can do. > The only problem with this box is that the modulating signal is off and reeming whenever the pedal is engaged. I agree it's a nice ring modulator, but the noise factor killed it for me. I've got a nice version made with the pitch change in my VG-8 now. In a rack box (besides the Q2 and Vortex) I think the new Oberheim and Korg and TC Electronics units have ring mod. The only other pedal I can think of is the new Digitech Space Station. Regards, Robert dERiSiOn _____________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] From ???@??? Sat Feb 28 11:01:27 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 27 17:27:58 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y8b4F-0007gI-00; Fri, 27 Feb 1998 17:27:55 -0800 Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Fri, 27 Feb 1998 17:22:03 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: improv@peak.org (Dave Trenkel) Subject: Re: ring modulators Resent-Message-ID: <"46D_q.A.HvG.vc290"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3681 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 27 Feb 1998 17:27:55 -0800 X-UIDL: 69a81ebc8ee1d06c2c82f0d6669c7e08 At 5:52 PM 2/27/98, Robert L Williams wrote: > >The only problem with this box is that the modulating signal is off and >reeming whenever the pedal is engaged. I agree it's a nice ring >modulator, >but the noise factor killed it for me. I've got a nice version made with >the pitch change in my VG-8 now. > Noise factor, well, of course it's noisy. Actually, I kind of like the annoying 500hz whine it puts out whenever there's no carrier signal present. Through a fuzz and a memory man, sweeping through delay times, it almost sounds like a TB-303. >In a rack box (besides the Q2 and Vortex) I think the new Oberheim and >Korg and TC Electronics units have ring mod. The only other pedal I can >think of is the new Digitech Space Station. > Is the Space Station actually available for sale yet? I've been wanting to demo one, but the music store morons in my area, the ones evolved enough not to just stare blankly when I ask a question, claim it's not out yet. Since it's been advertised for about a year now, I find this kind of hard to believe. Also, a friend of mine just got a rack-mount english-made ring mod that is supposed to be awe-inspiring. Haven't actually played it yet, and can't remember the manufacturor, but he's pretty impressed. ________________________________________________________ Dave Trenkel : improv@peak.org : www.peak.org/~improv/ "...there will come a day when you won't have to use gasoline. You'd simply take a cassette and put it in your car, let it run. You'd have to have the proper type of music. Like you take two sticks, put 'em together, make fire. You take some notes and rub 'em together - dum, dum, dum, dum - fire, cosmic fire." -Sun Ra ________________________________________________________ From ???@??? Sat Feb 28 11:01:29 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 27 17:32:26 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y8b8a-0000Ii-00; Fri, 27 Feb 1998 17:32:24 -0800 X-From_:tomroady@telalink.net Fri Feb 27 17:32:22 1998 Received: from eve.telalink.net [207.152.1.3] by ferret.slip.net with esmtp (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y8b8X-0000IF-00; Fri, 27 Feb 1998 17:32:21 -0800 Received: from babel.telalink.net (babel.telalink.net [207.152.1.9]) by eve.telalink.net (MTA-v3.8/9.00v-fbmx-blkspam) with ESMTP id TAA18276; Fri, 27 Feb 1998 19:32:21 -0600 (CST) Received: from 207.152.4.130 (dial3-dyn4-130.bna.telalink.net [207.152.4.130]) by babel.telalink.net (MTA-v3.7/relaymail-1.0.0) with SMTP id TAA22729; Fri, 27 Feb 1998 19:32:19 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <34F7690D.75FC@telalink.net> Old-Date: Fri, 27 Feb 1998 19:31:57 -0600 From: "Thomas W. Roady" Reply-To: tomroady@telalink.net Organization: ZENDRUM X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Macintosh; I; 68K) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: No digest in 2 days? Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Diagnostic: undecipherable, help sent X-Envelope-To: Loopers-Delight Sender: SmartList Date: Fri, 27 Feb 1998 17:32:24 -0800 X-UIDL: 50e1f8d58400ffb27376c04d2f866d38 I haven't got a digest in a few days. Whas'up? Did I unsuscribe without knowing? Tom Roady From ???@??? Sat Feb 28 11:01:32 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 27 19:08:18 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y8cdM-0000Dv-00; Fri, 27 Feb 1998 19:08:16 -0800 From: Dpcoffin Message-ID: <5803b481.34f77ec6@aol.com> Date: Fri, 27 Feb 1998 22:04:36 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Re: ring modulators Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 84 Resent-Message-ID: <"rLaQG.A.YSH.P8390"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3682 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 27 Feb 1998 19:08:16 -0800 X-UIDL: b68dcf87be0088bb7b3c99f29ac47e47 Charlie Stringer's newer (or soon-t-be) pedals have a RM or two amongst their number, and Rm'ing seems to be Flav'o't'month in the new lo-budget rack things from Zoom and Digitech. I still swear by the RM in my Boss GT-5...two modes, including "intelligent," which preserves the pitch of the original input while still sounding very ringy, plus there's a ton of mod options you can link it to, let along all those other other fx that it can patch into'n'outof. Checked out the BlackCat recently and couldn't detect any reason to add it to what the GT was already doing... dpc From ???@??? Sat Feb 28 11:01:34 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 27 19:47:14 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y8dF3-0002qX-00; Fri, 27 Feb 1998 19:47:13 -0800 Message-ID: <34F78580.F5D0E02D@earthlink.net> Date: Fri, 27 Feb 1998 22:33:21 -0500 From: looperanne@earthlink.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.01 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: TheGhostOfTruthcircle X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"tmYg4.A.cbC.og490"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3683 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 27 Feb 1998 19:47:13 -0800 X-UIDL: de2b85e46e272d1cdafbc166e6d91ae4 LOOPERS GATHER BECOME THE NEW MASS CONFESS TO ME ghost... http://www.angelfire.com/ny/truthcircle/index.html From ???@??? Sat Feb 28 11:01:42 1998 >From kflint Fri Feb 27 23:04:42 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y8gK7-0000Xg-00; Fri, 27 Feb 1998 23:04:39 -0800 Message-ID: <34F7B94C.A86845A5@mailbox.syr.edu> Date: Sat, 28 Feb 1998 02:14:21 -0500 From: mark sottilaro Reply-To: msottila@mailbox.syr.edu Organization: metaliminal X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.01 (Macintosh; I; PPC) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: ring modulators X-Priority: 3 (Normal) References: <1.5.4.16.19980227223915.34e76136@pop.usaor.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; x-mac-type="54455854"; x-mac-creator="4D4F5353" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"u7ixWB.A.WO.lZ790"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3686 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Fri, 27 Feb 1998 23:04:39 -0800 X-UIDL: 7ba8e07f9ad396d04633a0655c41952b Hey, I too searched the world for a ring modulator about 3 years ago and came up almost blank. I ended up building the kit version, as I'm pretty good with electronics componants. Don't waste you time. It was so noisy it was unusable. However, I came across the Korg AX-30. I LOVE IT! It's got a beautiful ring moduator (very quiet), as well as great "fuzz face/big muff" style distortion. It does decent pitch change and the usual digital delay and reverb. The big plus is that it has what they call a pressure pad. It acts as a continuous controller for any perameter, including amout of mod and the carrier freq. Although I use a Digitech 2112 for most of my sound, I still keep the AX-30 around for it's unique qualities. I think it retails fo about $300. Mark. http://web.syr.edu/~msottila From ???@??? Sat Feb 28 11:02:00 1998 >From kflint Sat Feb 28 06:32:16 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y8nJH-0005V3-00; Sat, 28 Feb 1998 06:32:15 -0800 Message-Id: <3.0.2.32.19980228093122.00724fc0@dharma.mitre.org> X-Sender: seligman@dharma.mitre.org X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.2 (32) Date: Sat, 28 Feb 1998 09:31:22 -0500 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Len Seligman Subject: Say hi if you're going to Adam's Baltimore loop gig tonight In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"kG3t4C.A.l2E._8B-0"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3687 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sat, 28 Feb 1998 06:32:15 -0800 X-UIDL: 3a1bafe56dee16cb63f47aea416c44b6 I'd like to meet other DC/Baltimore area improvising musicians and loopers and I'll be there tonight. Anybody else going? If so and we don't otherwise hook up, introduce yourself to Adam (as will I). I'll have a small placard or some other way of identifying myself as a looper. I'm a guitarist/singer/looper who'll be there tonight with my wife Melinda and my musical partner, electric violinst/singer/looper Cheryl Hurwitz. Stop by and say hello. -Len ---------------------------------------------------------- From: Adam Levin Subject: Baltimore loop-related gigs (updated) As I mentioned last week, my band, The Dark Aether Project featuring myself (Stick/Loops/a wee bit of Guitar when nobody's looking), Yaman Aksu (Fretted and Fretless Guitars/Guitar Synth) and Brian Griffin (Drums) will be celebrating the release of our new CD along with some special guests at Orion Studios in Baltimore, MD this Saturday night. I've also booked two shows at Orion on Friday April 17th for Bruford Levin Upper Extremities featuring Bill Bruford, Tony Levin, David Torn and Chris Botti. Ticket details to be posted soon. For the full Orion schedule, directions and other show details see: http://www.ari.net/prog/shows/showcase/ From ???@??? Sat Feb 28 11:02:06 1998 >From kflint Sat Feb 28 09:25:08 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y8q0Y-0004m4-00; Sat, 28 Feb 1998 09:25:06 -0800 From: ANET Message-ID: <30a415f7.34f8479b@aol.com> Date: Sat, 28 Feb 1998 12:21:29 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: 3rd CD project (OPEN FOR SUBMISSIONs) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 18 Resent-Message-ID: <"QuLMvD.A.hOE.efE-0"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3688 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sat, 28 Feb 1998 09:25:06 -0800 X-UIDL: dd3acdea8cdf9d544725313199a01af3 Greetings all; The 3rd CD project is OPEN for submissions. At this point we need about 7 more, if you would like to submit a DAT or CD, feel free to do so. I'll add you name to the project page. 3rd CD project Thanks!!!!!!! From ???@??? Sat Feb 28 23:15:33 1998 >From kflint Sat Feb 28 14:11:51 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y8uU2-00046r-00; Sat, 28 Feb 1998 14:11:50 -0800 From: Dpcoffin Message-ID: <2c6e4f26.34f88ad2@aol.com> Date: Sat, 28 Feb 1998 17:08:16 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: 3rd CD project (OPEN FOR SUBMISSIONs) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 84 Resent-Message-ID: <"WtVeyB.A.4nD.YsI-0"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3689 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sat, 28 Feb 1998 14:11:50 -0800 X-UIDL: 6bf6266a1aa5e47523e590190af43103 Hi, John I'm ready now to ship you a cassette with 2 primo selections from my vast body of work;-), but lemme describe 'em first, in case I should re-think this... The first thing on the tape is my favorite recorded guitar-electronica-improv of the last several months, and it's certainly MY version of looping, but may not be what you (or whoever is deciding these things--if anyone is!) would call looping, since I'm using several long delays with fairly low feedback and long, slow modulation loops to create shifting textures, but not much in the way of obvious recorded loops.... so, I've also included a second selection that does involve playing off a repeating figure, but it's definitely a 2nd choice. If you're willing to check 'em both out, feel free to use whichever one seems to best suit the mix you wind up with, if that's you first concern (as it would be mine, not trying to decide what constitutes "legal looping"!) Also, I can't easily create fadeouts, so I'm hoping that's something you can do without a lot of hassle. The first selection just needs a quick (1+ sec.) fade to smooth the cut, but the 2nd could use a longer (2-5 sec) one... If you don't want to mess with this, lemme know and I'll decide here whether I can live with providing just an abrupt cut-off, or should run the cassette back thru my mixer to create a fade. Also, got anything in mind in the way of documentation options/formats? I can easily describe what gear I'm using, etc...don't need a soap box. Thanks for doing this for us DAT-deprived! David Coffin From ???@??? Sat Feb 28 23:15:48 1998 >From kflint Sat Feb 28 17:11:19 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y8xHi-0004sB-00; Sat, 28 Feb 1998 17:11:18 -0800 From: ANET Message-ID: <9acf00c5.34f8b4ea@aol.com> Date: Sat, 28 Feb 1998 20:07:52 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: 3rd CD project (OPEN FOR SUBMISSIONs) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 18 Resent-Message-ID: <"yZljpC.A.YWE.sUL-0"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3690 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sat, 28 Feb 1998 17:11:18 -0800 X-UIDL: ef502eb1a4d0938fb3ed499ef2d70ef3 Got your note, no problem send them in, we can do some minor engineering. I do want to make the project a good one, so attention to detail will be good for the project. We'll keep in touch, you have the web page and know where to contact me. Hey I am as excited as everyone else, can't wait to hear the final product. See Ya. John Peters From ???@??? Sat Feb 28 23:16:10 1998 >From kflint Sat Feb 28 21:39:46 1998 Received: from lists by ferret.slip.net with local (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0y91TU-0001fK-00; Sat, 28 Feb 1998 21:39:44 -0800 From: Dpcoffin Message-ID: Date: Sun, 1 Mar 1998 00:35:59 EST To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Re: 3rd CD project (OPEN FOR SUBMISSIONs) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Mac sub 84 Resent-Message-ID: <"02yFZD.A.7TB.KQP-0"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3691 Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: kflint@annihilist.com Resent-Date: Sat, 28 Feb 1998 21:39:44 -0800 X-UIDL: 05c3353c4da7370dfd5ef8240fa2f95b Apologies, loopers In a message dated 2/28/98 5:11:03 PM, I wrote: >Hi, John > I'm ready now ...> Sorry! didn't mean to blast this across the known universe! dpc